Loyal
A true Jew is not one who has the physical circumcision, but whose heart is circumcised.
We are the Jews of Revelations
The Rapture
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We are the Jews of Revelations
Loyal
There is a lot of confusion. Of this i am certain. The Devil has made his way into all churches. There are no churches now that do not have some form of error.
Much teaching has been altered over the years. An example has to do with "who are the Jews" of Rev.
We are the Jews of Rev. Paul tells us this. "A true Jew is one whose heart is circumcised "
If Jesus dwells in your heart, then your heart has been circumcised.
Loyal
WOW I hope I am misunderstanding this, because we were all once ungodly yet we now read the bible, you just gave up on all unsaved people with this statement, just like you and I were once unsaved. Please tell me I am not understanding you correctly[/QUOTE]
I never give up . Because all are the potential Children of God. I will give up my life to the very end, reaching out to all who can be.
But there are some who with all the evedence before then, who will never believe. They will say, i am my own god.
Loyal
I never give up . Because all are the potential Children of God. I will give up my life to the very end, reaching out to all who can be.
But there are some who with all the evedence before then, who will never believe. They will say, i am my own god.[/QUOTE]
Bill thanks for clearing that up I did not think you were the type to give up on people, Praise be to God
Loyal
I'm a Gentile -- not a Jew. I've accepted Jesus Christ as my personal Savior.
And, speaking of the Jews -- they are God's chosen people. And, yes, there Are two kinds of Jews -- those who chose to follow Old Testament Jewish beliefs and those who are born Jewish. And you are possibly of the belief that the Church is an extension of Israel. Which it is Not. The Church is separate.
Loyal
There will be no escaping plant Earth for Anyone except maybe in sci-fi movies. There Are those who believe that Mars would be a good place to extend 'our' life because This world is getting more and more messed up. And God's Word Does tell us that in the end -- this world Will be destroyed and the New Jerusalem will be brought down from heaven by God, Himself.
Loyal
You're right -- there are No churches that do not have some form of error -- because we are all human. But there is one that I know that stays as close to God's Word as possible. Well -- several that I know about.
And, in the New Testament -- the Jewish world wanted to combine salvation by grace With old testament practice of physical circumcision. The Abrahamic covenant was 'sealed' so to speak by circumcision. And a lot of it was for cleanliness for males. And it was done on the 8th day after birth of the child.
God wants to have relationship with 'us' rather than having 'us' just following rules and regulations.
Member
We CAN know what John has revealed to us.
Member
Sorry, Bill, but this is myth: Paul's rapture is for the Gentile Church. The 70th week is for Daniel's people: Jews and Hebrews from other tribes. Yes, they are living in Israel today. Paul's rapture will take all those that are In Christ out before the 70th week begins. Therefore most of Revelation is for THEM, not the church.
Loyal
The rapture is for All who have trusted Christ as their personal Savior.
The 70th week is for the Jews who are willing to accept Christ as their Promised Messiah.
All Scripture is for all who are willing to read it. For our knowledge of what is to come. What we read, we can share with others and then, hopefully, 'they' will come to saving knowledge of Jesus Christ, also.
The 70th week is for the Jews who are willing to accept Christ as their Promised Messiah.
All Scripture is for all who are willing to read it. For our knowledge of what is to come. What we read, we can share with others and then, hopefully, 'they' will come to saving knowledge of Jesus Christ, also.
Loyal
so who are those standing before the thrown and when did they get there?? Why are they standing before the throne, and not under the alter like the other one in revelations??
Revelation 7:9-17
After this I looked, and behold, a great multitude that no one could number, from every nation, from all tribes and peoples and languages, standing before the throne and before the Lamb, clothed in white robes, with palm branches in their hands, and crying out with a loud voice, “Salvation belongs to our God who sits on the throne, and to the Lamb!”
Revelation 7:14
I said to him, “Sir, you know.” And he said to me, “These are the ones coming out of the great tribulation. They have washed their robes and made them white in the blood of the Lamb.
Revelation 6:9
When he opened the fifth seal, I saw under the altar the souls of those who had been slain for the word of God and for the witness they had borne.
Revelation 7:9-17
After this I looked, and behold, a great multitude that no one could number, from every nation, from all tribes and peoples and languages, standing before the throne and before the Lamb, clothed in white robes, with palm branches in their hands, and crying out with a loud voice, “Salvation belongs to our God who sits on the throne, and to the Lamb!”
Revelation 7:14
I said to him, “Sir, you know.” And he said to me, “These are the ones coming out of the great tribulation. They have washed their robes and made them white in the blood of the Lamb.
Revelation 6:9
When he opened the fifth seal, I saw under the altar the souls of those who had been slain for the word of God and for the witness they had borne.
Member
I agree, the scriptures are for all who will read, but the 70th week is for ISRAEL:
Dan. 9:24 “Seventy weeks are determined For your people and for your holy city, To finish the transgression, To make an end of sins, To make reconciliation for iniquity, To bring in everlasting righteousness, To seal up vision and prophecy, And to anoint the Most Holy.
Member
You can post these two scriptures together, as if they go together, but that would be pulling scripture from its context. That is a no no! They don't go together because they have different contexts. What "great tribulation" are they coming out of? John has not yet started the 70th week in His narrative, MUCH LESS arrived at the second half of the week where Jesus said the days of great tribulation would come.
There is no hint that this great crowed, TOO LARGE TO NUMBER have been slain! The slain during the days of GT will NOT be "too large to number." But the dead in Christ, with those alive in Christ - who are caught up to heaven (John 14 and 1 Thes. 4) will be a HUGE crowd, too large to number. This crowd is the just raptured church. They are very much alive and with their resurrection bodies.
The "great tribulation" they came out of, one by one, is the church age. There have always been martyrs and will be until the new heaven and new earth.
Loyal
There has Always been tribulation for believers -- we're warned of that as believers , we will Always endure hardships because of our faith. However, the ' tribulation' they will be coming out of is referring to the 7 yrs. of tribulation after the Church has been removed. And the Great Tribulation is referring to the last 3 1/2 yrs. of the 7 yr period of tribulation.
Doesn't the context in Revelation 7 suggest that this scene is happening in heaven. vs 13.
My understanding has been that during the 7 yrs tribulation time, the 144,000 Jews from every tribe who have been sealed, will be in the 'field' evangelizing the Jews and anyone else who's willing to listen. But primarily the Jewish population.
Doesn't the context in Revelation 7 suggest that this scene is happening in heaven. vs 13.
My understanding has been that during the 7 yrs tribulation time, the 144,000 Jews from every tribe who have been sealed, will be in the 'field' evangelizing the Jews and anyone else who's willing to listen. But primarily the Jewish population.
Member
Sue, I must disagree. John has not yet started the 70th week in chapter 7. He is still in church age - but at the very end of the church age. The 70th week will begin with the 7th seal opened in chapter 8. John does not get to the last half of the week until chapter 12 and after, and it will be later in the last half when the image is set up and people are forced to worship the image or die - or take the mark or die. Those days will not begin until after chapter 14. Therefore to imagine something in chapter 7 has happened in the last half of the week is just pulling something out of context.
Loyal
so what part of tribulation are the two witnesses in ? when they die there bodies lie in the street for 3.5 days, when they witness they witness for 3.5 years I think, lots of 3.5 stuff going on in tribulation.
when does the beast come out of the water they speak of?? at the end of 3.5 years or the beginning of tribulation?
thanks
when does the beast come out of the water they speak of?? at the end of 3.5 years or the beginning of tribulation?
thanks
Loyal
that was my entire point in posting two scriptures one points to people dying and the other points to people appearing, yet they are both in heaven, my real curiosity is why does it say came they out of the "great" tribulation instead of just the tribulation as my understanding is the "great" tribulation does not occur until after 3.5 years of the regular tribulation, but I agree these people before the throne do not have appeared to be killed like the people under the throne, giving the rapture much more evidence of happening.
Loyal
does this mean at a certain point during the tribulation, no one is saved any longer is there a time period referernce this?? such as people are still getting saved up to the first 3.5 years but not after????
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