Catholicism

[my4everChrist]

Amazing Chad!

Dear Chad,
God bless you so much for this! Wow! Just now I was talking to my daughter and was wondering if due to the fact that I have self esteem issues, (which I trust God will rid me of soon,) when Christ returns,will I be lost?
I didn't know where to go for the answer and yet by Divine Guidance and Leading,I was brought to your article. I know now that there is never anything that I can EVER do or not do to cause my Blessed Saviour to cast me aside! I really needed to hear that.
Thanks again Chad! You are doing a mighty fine job here as usual.


In Christ,
my4everCHRIST

 

[ChildrenOfLight]

Dear Chad,
God bless you so much for this! Wow! Just now I was talking to my daughter and was wondering if due to the fact that I have self esteem issues, (which I trust God will rid me of soon,) when Christ returns,will I be lost?
I didn't know where to go for the answer and yet by Divine Guidance and Leading,I was brought to your article. I know now that there is never anything that I can EVER do or not do to cause my Blessed Saviour to cast me aside! I really needed to hear that.
Thanks again Chad! You are doing a mighty fine job here as usual.


In Christ,
my4everCHRIST

yeah, God has huge mercy like that.

i don't believe catholic or protestant or romancatholic or whatever they want to label themselves are fully righteous or understanding because they are labeled.

i believe in the bible. (believer of the way, the truth, the life)

that is all.
is that what they call christian? if so, then yes, please.

so when yall throw quotes left and right, i look at them, and i see them.

believing will save you.
doing works, repenting, not committing sin, and following the scripture will save you if you believe on the son of God.

i think that was the overall message of meshed godly sayings.

above all else, love one another and avoid these disputings.

peace.

 

[shipwrecksoul]

The most crucial problem with the Roman Catholic Church is its belief that faith alone in Christ is not sufficient for salvation. ...............etc.
How is it that so many Catholics can call Jesus their Lord, yet totally disregard His instructions? Jesus asked that very same question in His Word:

"And why call ye me, Lord, Lord, and do not the things which I say?" Luke 6:46
​

You can ignore this question now, but what will you say when Jesus asks you the same question in person when you die and stand before Him for judgment?

The quote above is so true.
I think the key is to appeal directly with the conscience in its failure to do right, to give it hope through Jesus Christ. Catholicism, or any religion, can never make someone right before God. Imagine all the lost souls who are now in hell pleading for healing of their seared conscience that could have been healed through a personal relationship with God himself through his Son the Lord Jesus Christ.

Eph 2:8-9 For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God:
Not of works, lest any man should boast.

 

[my4everChrist]

God bless you ChildrenOfLight! Thank you for your reply and have a most blessed day!

 

[SpiritLedEd]

i believe that merely believing on Jesus Christ, son of God, raised from the dead, might get me into heaven, but it does in fact require some good works through faith

But, good works do not open heaven's gate. Good works are the evidence of faith empowered by the Holy Spirit. It is Spirit-empowered faith that opens the gate.

"And I will put my Spirit in you and move you to follow my decrees and be careful to keep My laws." (Eze 36:27 NIV)

SLE

 

[Mouse]

It seems that you are bashing the Catholic faith....and the vibe I am feeling is that catholics are not welcome here. I am catholic and what you quoted/posted is not entirely true and it is offensive. It sounds very much like you are judging both catholics and their faith.

I have attended many non-denominational bible studies and we are all there for three reasons...to spend time with Jesus, to read, learn, pray and share about scripture and to fellowship with other christians. I have many friends who belong to protestant faiths and we do not attack one anothers beliefs.

and if I may.....catholics "dont" worship Mary or saints. That statement is untrue. They are intercessories. Jesus provided us with helpers because he couldnt be everywhere. It is clear that you dont understand that concept. Transubstantiation....what is the misunderstanding with that? We are told by Jesus during the last supper to eat of His body and drink his blood...and if we do that, then He will remain in us and we shall remain in Him. The bread and wine is transformed at every mass during communion for that exact purpose.

Hi Summerbreeze,
Catholics are welcome here for sure. I know some wonderful catholics that have strong and devoted love and faith in Jesus Christ.

I'd like to add though, that catholics defend themselves in saying they don't worship Mary or the saints, which may be true in some cases. But asking them for intercession is lack of faith in Jesus. If you can't go directly to Jesus, what is wrong there?
John 14:13 "And whatsoever ye shall ask in my name, that will I do, that the Father may be glorified in the Son."

Jesus is in His divine nature, sitting at the right hand of the Father and very much omnipresent. And if Jesus is sitting at the right hand of the Father, where is the Father?

"But if Christ is in you, although your bodies are dead because of sin, your spirits are alive because of righteousness" Romans 8:10

"Do you not realize that Jesus Christ is in you?" 2 Corinthians 13:5

"I have been crucified with Christ; it is no longer I who live, but Christ who lives in me; and the life I now live in the flesh I live by faith in the Son of God, who loved me and gave himself for me" Galatians 2:20

"(I pray) that Christ may dwell in your hearts through faith" Ephesians 3:17

"Christ in you, the hope of glory" Colossians 1:27

 

[RoguePastor]

Ok I made it through 8 full pages before I just had to post. Before I get into the whole catholic situation I would like to address something. Chad, as the admin for this site you need to be careful. Like a Pastor you are in a role which great care is needed as well as great compassion. I would like to direct you to Post 42 when you responded to Logan32.

Bash a faith? Show me the bashing please.

Its one thing to bash a "faith", its another thing to preach the truth which was clearly done here, so please refrain from your opinions when we're trying to discuss the Word, which is truth that requires no man's opinions.

I do not believe your goal is to bash anyone faith. Most of the responses I have seen would tend to agree with that as well. However, Logan32 clearly felt you were bashing the catholic religion. Even if you weren't you still became a stumbling block for Logan32. Remember brother it is not our place to offend. that is God's place through His Word. The bible offends and convicts the lost just fine without us.

If Logan32 feels like you bashed his religion then you did. His hurt will not go away just because you said that you didn't bash it. You will recall that Jesus taught humility. Sadly among Christians and especially among Moderators of Christian forum board humility is in serious lacking all around. You are in a position of leadership. More over you claim a position of leadership in glorifying God. Humility is a major prerequist for leadership in the Faith. If you haven't repented to both Logan32 and God for the hurt you caused you should. If you look deep inside you know its true.

Logan32 got hurt by you. It doesn't matter if your right if you hurt those you want to help. I believe that you truly believe what you have posted about catholicism and you can tell Logan32 that. But you also need to make it clear that your goal is to put the light of truth up high so that all can see its light and be comforted. Then you apologize for the offense he suffered and ask for forgivness for essentially blowing off his hurt feelings. Then make it know that the entire mod staff as well as many members would be happy to go through each docturine/dogma and discuss what is true and what is a tradition of man.

In truth it probably will not make any difference to Logan32 what evidence you and others can give him. I have been debating with catholics for a long time and that is usually the case. That does not however excuse us for offending someone with harsh words and a lack of compassion.

I know this looks like a lecture and to a point it may even be one. I am not a Mod here but I am a preacher of the Word and the Word commands us to be wise as serpents and as gentle as doves. We Christians have a reputaion, well earned, as hypocrites. We tell others to love and be humble then we go and do the opposite. Show Logan32 and others that Jesus matters, That His Word and His commands are true by following them and asking for forgiveness. If he doesn't forgive you thats on him. You still need to ask.

Again sorry for the seeming lecture its really not supposed to be one. What I said is supposed to convict you and ultimately help you adopt an even more Christ-like demeanor.

Be blessed.

 

[RoguePastor]

Ok now onto catholicism. Before the 1500 and the council of Trent the catholics used the same exact bible as the "protestants" use today. The Duetero-cannical books added at that time where in direct response to Martin Luther's 95 Theses. If there is not a Sticky with the 95 Theses, there should be.

Many catholic traditions have the fingerprint of man. Some have been added too but are essentially true. Some are flat out true. Even the JW's and the Moron's have some things that are correct. Just as all the denomination have some things that are false.

Keep in mind that it was not always this way. In the bible the name of the church Christ planted is there. Its not called catholic. Nor is it call baptist or methodist or non-denominational. Its called The Way. There is only one book in the bible which mentions the name of the church. That is the book of Acts a.k.a. The Acts of the Apostles. Written by Luke to a high ranking Roman official. In fact the name is mentioned not once but 6 times. Its called The Way. Below is those scriptures.

Acts 9:2 and asked him for letters to the synagogues in Damascus, so that if he found any there who belonged to the Way, whether men or women, he might take them as prisoners to Jerusalem.

Acts 19:9 But some of them became obstinate; they refused to believe and publicly maligned the Way. So Paul left them. He took the disciples with him and had discussions daily in the lecture hall of Tyrannus.

Acts 19:23 About that time there arose a great disturbance about the Way.

Acts 22:4 I persecuted the followers of this Way to their death, arresting both men and women and throwing them into prison

Acts 24:14 However, I admit that I worship the God of our fathers as a follower of the Way, which they call a sect. I believe everything that agrees with the Law and that is written in the Prophets

Acts 24:22 Then Felix, who was well acquainted with the Way, adjourned the proceedings. "When Lysias the commander comes," he said, "I will decide your case."

Cont. on next post.

 

[RoguePastor]

Ok I would like to draw your attention to the last 2 scriptures.

Acts 24:14 However, I admit that I worship the God of our fathers as a follower of the Way, which they call a sect. I believe everything that agrees with the Law and that is written in the Prophets

Paul speaking here doesn't deny the name of the church. The only correction is the Jew's assertion that The Way is a sect.

Acts 24:22 Then Felix, who was well acquainted with the Way, adjourned the proceedings. "When Lysias the commander comes," he said, "I will decide your case."

Here we see a Roman Govenor is well aquainted with The Way. Not Christianity, not the catholic church or any other church. No Felix knows its The Way.

Sadly the catholic church is the evolution of The Way mixed with politics. During the reign of Constintine I power structure was established for the spread of Christianity throughout the Roman Empire. Here is the Roman Catholic Church. More over a clear leader was needed to oversee the church. This brings us the Pope which is more accurately called the Bishop of Rome which is the only title that is in keeping with Scripture.

Cont. next post

 

[RoguePastor]

History shows that the Roman Empire was on the decline by the time the catholic church first showed up. Literacy was on the decline as the power of the catholic church was on the rise. Note that literacy was just beginning to rise by the time Martin Luther posted his 95 theses. So literacy or a lack there of was a mojor component of the rise of the catholic church just as an increase of literacy was the beginning of the end of the absolute power of the catholic church.

Keeping in mind the literacy within the hierarcy of the catholic church was a constant, all could read and write meant that people had no choice but to believe what they were told. More over the bible was a heavy protected book often chained when not in use. Part of this is that they were hand copied and part was to keep it out of the hands of the common man. If people ever learned to read and read the bible the show would be over.

Today the catholic church is still huge. However they have been declining for over 500 years. Most of the catholics today are catholic out of tradition. Mom and dad are catholics and raised their kids to be catholics. As the catholic church does not allow that non-clergy can understand the bible the members are told that the Leadership of the church will tell them what the scriptures mean. These being the councils, pope and the Magistrum.

Cont. next post

 

[RoguePastor]

Ok last post for now.

When trying to inform catholics or the unsaved of the truth in the bible in the presenceof a catholic we have a huge up hill battle. The reformation is only 500 years old. Both the eastern Orthodox and the catholic church have a huge head start in shoring up their defenses againsts counter-claims.

When dealing with a confirmed catholic it is important to discuss each docturine/dogma individually without allowing the topic to be derailed. If you talk about the Assumption of Mary (Jesus taking Mary bodily to heaven) one thing you will point out is there is not scriptural evidence for that. They well likely attack with their position on Sola Scriptura. If you let that happen you will lose. Why? because your no longer on topic. Simple acknowledge that your commenting on the lack of scripture and that the catholic church claimes to have cannonized the bible at the council of Carthage in the late 300's, long after this event was supposed to have taken place.

Next point out what scripture supports Jesus not Assuming Mary Like the fact that Jesus, on the cross, made the Apostle John her son to care for her effectively removing Himself from the role of eldest son and substituting John is His place.

These of course are just ideas and not a formula for combating catholic tradition. Again the key is to keep it on topic and not to try to deal with multiple traditions at once. Also, just like reading your bible will help you understand what God wants from and for us. Knowing the history of the church and researching credible sourses will help combat bad traditions and support those that are in keeping with what the bible teaches.

 

[Coconut]

Ok I made it through 8 full pages before I just had to post. Before I get into the whole catholic situation I would like to address something. Chad, as the admin for this site you need to be careful. Like a Pastor you are in a role which great care is needed as well as great compassion. I would like to direct you to Post 42 when you responded to Logan32.



I do not believe your goal is to bash anyone faith. Most of the responses I have seen would tend to agree with that as well. However, Logan32 clearly felt you were bashing the catholic religion. Even if you weren't you still became a stumbling block for Logan32. Remember brother it is not our place to offend. that is God's place through His Word. The bible offends and convicts the lost just fine without us.

If Logan32 feels like you bashed his religion then you did. His hurt will not go away just because you said that you didn't bash it. You will recall that Jesus taught humility. Sadly among Christians and especially among Moderators of Christian forum board humility is in serious lacking all around. You are in a position of leadership. More over you claim a position of leadership in glorifying God. Humility is a major prerequist for leadership in the Faith. If you haven't repented to both Logan32 and God for the hurt you caused you should. If you look deep inside you know its true.

Logan32 got hurt by you. It doesn't matter if your right if you hurt those you want to help. I believe that you truly believe what you have posted about catholicism and you can tell Logan32 that. But you also need to make it clear that your goal is to put the light of truth up high so that all can see its light and be comforted. Then you apologize for the offense he suffered and ask for forgivness for essentially blowing off his hurt feelings. Then make it know that the entire mod staff as well as many members would be happy to go through each docturine/dogma and discuss what is true and what is a tradition of man.

In truth it probably will not make any difference to Logan32 what evidence you and others can give him. I have been debating with catholics for a long time and that is usually the case. That does not however excuse us for offending someone with harsh words and a lack of compassion.

I know this looks like a lecture and to a point it may even be one. I am not a Mod here but I am a preacher of the Word and the Word commands us to be wise as serpents and as gentle as doves. We Christians have a reputaion, well earned, as hypocrites. We tell others to love and be humble then we go and do the opposite. Show Logan32 and others that Jesus matters, That His Word and His commands are true by following them and asking for forgiveness. If he doesn't forgive you thats on him. You still need to ask.

Again sorry for the seeming lecture its really not supposed to be one. What I said is supposed to convict you and ultimately help you adopt an even more Christ-like demeanor.

Be blessed.

I know you are new here Rogue, and i`m not sure why you aimed straight for the Catholic thread, and felt the need to drag up an old post, and lecture Chad on humility and offenses but I feel the need to interject here as well.

I have been with this forum since its beginning, and with all the mistakes and blunders we all have made, including Chad, there has certainly been no one here who has made it more clear that "the goal is to put the light of truth up high so that all can see its light"
than he.

At this late date, I think, with your having just joined this fellowship, that you have presumed a little too much, too fast about Chad, and his dealing with those who join this forum, just because you deem some of the responses here offensive.

Speaking of which, this is a direct quote from your profile:

Biography:
I am a hard charging, non-apologetic Follower of Christ. Often this puts me at odds with those wanting a "warm fuzzy God". I firmly believe that the Holy Bible is the Holy Spirit Inspired, inerrant, Infallible Word of God. Just as firmly, I believe that any tradition held by any church claiming Christ that is not supported by Scripture is a tradition of man and should be treated as such. I believe that any church that holds these same traditions as equal or higher than the Scriptures are Wolves

Excuse me preacher, but after having declared such a non-apologetic stance yourself, why would you expect Chad to apologize for being non-apologetic for his stance?

It shows a lack of humility when one walks into a fellowship, and immediately proceeds to tell the leadership of that fellowship how things aught to be done. In the future, if you have must find fault with Chad, or anyone on this forum, please do as the Scripture teaches, and go to them privately.

 

[SpiritLedEd]

It shows a lack of humility when one walks into a fellowship, and immediately proceeds to tell the leadership of that fellowship how things aught to be done. In the future, if you have must find fault with Chad, or anyone on this forum, please do as the Scripture teaches, and go to them privately.

Coconut, I agree with you on this point and I apologize for missing the critical point on humility.

SLE