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Why is God going to send a strong delusion in the end times?

No one sins without consequences.

The Only way any person 'knows' they are one of God's elect is when they accept Jesus Christ as their personal Lord and Savior. And That Should be a humbling experience -- way of life.

Read the Scripture -- predestination IS Biblical.

How about being Thankful that God has chosen 'us' -- we Are to be sharing the Gospel unto salvation with all who will listen.
You can know that you are Gods elect contractually....It's written in the covenant.

1 John 5:11-13 King James Version (KJV)
11 And this is the record, that God hath given to us eternal life, and this life is in his Son.

12 He that hath the Son hath life; and he that hath not the Son of God hath not life.

13 These things have I written unto you that believe on the name of the Son of God; that ye may know that ye have eternal life, and that ye may believe on the name of the Son of God.

Now I suggest all of you look up the word "Predestinated" and see what it says in context...Gods elect are predestinated....It does not say some are predestinated to become the elect. Not nowhere!
 
No -- we're all Not predestined to be saved. Sounds like you believe in universalism. Even God has said that He 'would' that All Would come to a saving knowledge of Himself, but He knows that That won't happen.

So -- nope -- that is Not the case at all.
You are right Sue . I am incorrect . We are not predestined to be saved . Even thought God wants all His created children to return home .
It was this i was thinking of , God longs for His created children , and greives thier choices. ( and as i said, the mystery of God ) as He knows already who and when His children will come to Him.
 
No -- we're all Not predestined to be saved. Sounds like you believe in universalism. Even God has said that He 'would' that All Would come to a saving knowledge of Himself, but He knows that That won't happen.

So -- nope -- that is Not the case at all.
No my friend. I believe in the Word
 
I see that nobody looked up those two verses that use the word predestined....
Ephesians 1:1-6 Complete Jewish Bible (CJB)

1 From: Sha’ul, by God’s will an emissary of the Messiah Yeshua

To: God’s people living in Ephesus, that is, those who are trusting in the Messiah Yeshua:


2 Grace to you and shalom from God our Father and the Lord Yeshua the Messiah.


3 Praised be Adonai, Father of our Lord Yeshua the Messiah, who in the Messiah has blessed us with every spiritual blessing in heaven. 4 In the Messiah he chose us in love before the creation of the universe to be holy and without defect in his presence. 5 He determined in advance that through Yeshua the Messiah we would be his sons — in keeping with his pleasure and purpose — 6 so that we would bring him praise commensurate with the glory of the grace he gave us through the Beloved One.



Ephesians 1:3-12 King James Version (KJV)
3 Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, who hath blessed us with all spiritual blessings in heavenly places in Christ:

4 According as he hath chosen us in him before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and without blame before him in love:

5 Having predestinated (determined in advance) us unto the adoption of children by Jesus Christ to himself, according to the good pleasure of his will,

6 To the praise of the glory of his grace, wherein he hath made us accepted in the beloved.

7 In whom we have redemption through his blood, the forgiveness of sins, according to the riches of his grace;

8 Wherein he hath abounded toward us in all wisdom and prudence;

9 Having made known unto us the mystery of his will, according to his good pleasure which he hath purposed in himself:

10 That in the dispensation of the fulness of times he might gather together in one all things in Christ, both which are in heaven, and which are on earth; even in him:

11 In whom also we have obtained an inheritance, being predestinated according to the purpose of him who worketh all things after the counsel of his own will:

12 That we should be to the praise of his glory, who first trusted in Christ
Now where does this say that God only chose some for salvation...not all? This speaks of blessings that God had planned for His kids from the beginning...
The idea that God chose only some to be saved contradicts 1 Timothy 2:1-6 (CJB)
2 First of all, then, I counsel that petitions, prayers, intercessions and thanksgivings be made for all human beings, 2 including kings and all in positions of prominence; so that we may lead quiet and peaceful lives, being godly and upright in everything. 3 This is what God, our Deliverer, regards as good; this is what meets his approval.

4 He wants all humanity to be delivered and come to full knowledge of the truth. 5 For God is one;[a] and there is but one Mediator between God and humanity, Yeshua the Messiah, himself human, 6 who gave himself as a ransom on behalf of all, thus providing testimony to God’s purpose at just the right time.

Look at how the word is used....God determined in advance that those saved would have these blessings....Not to be saved.

Luke 13:22-27
But again you have to be saved though HIM only 22 Yeshua continued traveling through town after town and village after village, teaching and making his way toward Yerushalayim. 23 Someone asked him, “Are only a few people being saved?” 24 He answered, “Struggle to get in through the narrow door, because — I’m telling you! — many will be demanding to get in and won’t be able to, 25 once the owner of the house has gotten up and shut the door. You will stand outside, knocking at the door and saying, ‘Lord! Open up for us!’ But he will answer, ‘I don’t know you or where you come from!’ 26 Then you will say, ‘We ate and drank with you! you taught in our streets!’ 27 and he will tell you, ‘I don’t know where you’re from. Get away from me, all you workers of wickedness!’
 
@Admon Mikhael -- the Ephesians 1 passage Was shared. Why are you using The Complete Jewish Bible?

The NKJV reads Ephesians 1:1-6 "Paul, an apostle of Jesus Christ by the will of God." To the saints who are in Ephesus, and faithful in Christ Jesus." vs 2 "Grace to you and peace from God our Father and the Lord Jesus Christ."
vs 3 "Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, who has blessed us with every spiritual blessing in the heavenly places in Christ. "

vs 4 "Just as He chose us in Him before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and without blame before Him in love.

vs 5 "having predestined us to adoption as sons by Jesus Christ to Himself, according to the good pleasure of His will.

vs 6 " to the praise of the glory of His grace, by which He made us accepted in the Beloved.

And , yes, 1 Timothy 2 -- and, yes -- God Does have blessings for His Children from the very beginning of time. And He Does desire that all men Would come to faith, but in His omniscience He Also knows who will and who Won't come to the saving knowledge of salvation.

As a parent -- I 'would' that all my 4 kids would be strong Christians. I know that One of them is and I think two of them are. But don't know about the other two.

A non-believer won't have those blessings.
 
@Admon Mikhael -- the Ephesians 1 passage Was shared. Why are you using The Complete Jewish Bible?

The NKJV reads Ephesians 1:1-6 "Paul, an apostle of Jesus Christ by the will of God." To the saints who are in Ephesus, and faithful in Christ Jesus." vs 2 "Grace to you and peace from God our Father and the Lord Jesus Christ."
vs 3 "Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, who has blessed us with every spiritual blessing in the heavenly places in Christ. "

vs 4 "Just as He chose us in Him before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and without blame before Him in love.

vs 5 "having predestined us to adoption as sons by Jesus Christ to Himself, according to the good pleasure of His will.

vs 6 " to the praise of the glory of His grace, by which He made us accepted in the Beloved.

And , yes, 1 Timothy 2 -- and, yes -- God Does have blessings for His Children from the very beginning of time. And He Does desire that all men Would come to faith, but in His omniscience He Also knows who will and who Won't come to the saving knowledge of salvation.

As a parent -- I 'would' that all my 4 kids would be strong Christians. I know that One of them is and I think two of them are. But don't know about the other two.

A non-believer won't have those blessings.
I uset the CJB because it's my favorite....I like the feel of it...but I do use others too.
So both verses speak to Christians and the plans that God had for Christians from the start...but they do not lock anybody out from getting saved....So where is this predestination doctrine coming from? It's not biblical...Not at all.
 
@Admon -- look at Romans 8:29 and 30 "For whom He foreknew, He also predestined to be conformed to the image of His Son, that He might be the firstborn among many brethren, vs 30 "Moreover, whom He predestined, these He also called; whom He called, these He also justified; and whomever He justified, these He also glorified."

And at Ephesians 1 -- the entire chapter. The CJB is a bit confusing -- I quote from the NKJV.
 
@Admon -- look at Romans 8:29 and 30 "For whom He foreknew, He also predestined to be conformed to the image of His Son, that He might be the firstborn among many brethren, vs 30 "Moreover, whom He predestined, these He also called; whom He called, these He also justified; and whomever He justified, these He also glorified."

And at Ephesians 1 -- the entire chapter. The CJB is a bit confusing -- I quote from the NKJV.
So keep with the NKJV I have no problems with it. What is your point? Start with the first four words....Those whom He forknew....He knew His own even before they were reborn, and planned before times that we should be in the image of His Son....Again it does not lock anybody our from being saved...These verses speak of what the saved would become.
 
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You are right Sue . I am incorrect . We are not predestined to be saved . Even thought God wants all His created children to return home .
It was this i was thinking of , God longs for His created children , and greives thier choices. ( and as i said, the mystery of God ) as He knows already who and when His children will come to Him.
agree with you. Not all is a child of God .
 
@ Admon -- that which you said back in #113 is that ALL human are predestined to be saved -- which is Not true -- or everyone Would be saved eventually. Which is Not true. And only God knows exactly who will and who won't.
 
@ Admon -- that which you said back in #113 is that ALL human are predestined to be saved -- which is Not true -- or everyone Would be saved eventually. Which is Not true. And only God knows exactly who will and who won't.
The word "predestinated" in the bible means "determined beforehand" Meaning it was Gods will and plan for all of humanity. It does not mean they would be saved by force, or against their will. Every (two) instance of the word in the bible speaks of Gods blessing for those who choose salvation....It has nothing to do with salvation itself.
 
The word "predestinated" in the bible means "determined beforehand" Meaning it was Gods will and plan for all of humanity. It does not mean they would be saved by force, or against their will. Every (two) instance of the word in the bible speaks of Gods blessing for those who choose salvation....It has nothing to do with salvation itself.


No one is ever Forced to be saved or saved Against their will.

And , yes, there Are spiritual blessings for believers. But it's the future eternal life spent either in heaven or hell which is at stake.

And, many times it's the changed life of a non-believer to becoming a born-again believer that will draw others To Himself.

Your last sentence -- "for those who choose salvation... it has nothing to do with salvation itself." But, of Course it Does. Salvation brings / results In.....
 
No one is ever Forced to be saved or saved Against their will.

And , yes, there Are spiritual blessings for believers. But it's the future eternal life spent either in heaven or hell which is at stake.

And, many times it's the changed life of a non-believer to becoming a born-again believer that will draw others To Himself.

Your last sentence -- "for those who choose salvation... it has nothing to do with salvation itself." But, of Course it Does. Salvation brings / results In.....
I think you misunderstood my last sentence there...I meant that "predestined" has nothing to do with getting saved.
 
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