Why I think Jesus didn't write the bible
Member
Of course Jesus didn't write the Bible. There were something like 40 authors over a period of 3500 years. Jesus was only alive for 33 years and He didn't write anything down at all that's extant. So were the authors of the Bible fallible men? Absolutely they were. But nevertheless was the Bible inspired by God; was it 'God-breathed' (2 Tim 3:16)? Again, absolutely. Every word of the Bible is the inspiration of God, nothing is accidental, no word is misplaced.
Jesus said:
So there is no middle ground according to the Bible - either the whole thing is inspired by God or none of it; this business about 'seeing the love of Jesus through the fallible words of the Bible' has absolutely no ground. You either accept the whole thing or none of it at all. Admittedly some parts we cannot fully understand, but those we take on faith and admit that the fault is with our apprehension, not the Bible.
It takes a real arrogance to assume that you can dictate which parts of the Bible you choose to accept and which you throw away.
Jesus said:
And at the end of the Bible we see this:
So there is no middle ground according to the Bible - either the whole thing is inspired by God or none of it; this business about 'seeing the love of Jesus through the fallible words of the Bible' has absolutely no ground. You either accept the whole thing or none of it at all. Admittedly some parts we cannot fully understand, but those we take on faith and admit that the fault is with our apprehension, not the Bible.
It takes a real arrogance to assume that you can dictate which parts of the Bible you choose to accept and which you throw away.
Member
You have twisted what I said and quite frankly, I don't speak with people who twist my words. If you reread my post you'll see I never said it's unnecessary to study the scripture, it's very necessary, how else will the message attach to your heart?
The Bible isn't there to impose impressions, again, you twisted what I said, the Word of God is a guide and a way to know the character of God, once I know His character, I am automatically in awe of Him, for me at least.
I agree with you brother Cerebus and I don't think that anyone who knows God would judge Him because He didn't write down letters with a pen and paper.
God bless
Member
You are delusional if you imagine that the Bible is a simple book Lost (appropriate name can I add). I've been seriously studying the Bible for about six years now and I don't feel like I've even touched its surface. If you want a superficial candy-floss belief then that's your call, but the minute you begin to get into the depths of the divine revelation you could never imagine that the Bible is a simple book. I honestly believe that man will never exhaust it, until the Lord comes back.
Thanks brother Jako
Thanks brother Jako
Member
Hello all.
I don't wanna be out of place in saying this, and please don't let me cause discord in writing this.
We are all on a journey with God and he is guiding us into truth by the power of the Holy Spirit at work in us. None of us are perfect but we are all perfectly loved by God and he leads us into His ways.
I believe that the Holy Bible is God's word (2 Timothy 3:16). start to finish (Revelation 22:18-19). But it took me some time to be convicted of that. When I was born again and started my relationship with Jesus, I did not know much about anything, except that Jesus loved me. He then guided me into truth (and is still guiding me thankfully). (John 8:31-32)
Chad,
I believe that you have been given lots of wisdom BY GOD to share with us. You have a teaching gift. But it is also important to make sure that preaching is always full of grace (Colossians 4:6) and out of love (1Cor13).
I don't doubt that you live on these principles, but you have to bear with people (myself included) (Colossians 3:13) who don't share your wisdom. Like I said we are all seeking the truth (of Jesus) and when we come across someone who is misguided in that pursuit we have to think carefully about how to rebuke them and encourage them. It likes talking with a younger brother who is immature and unintelligent because they are younger, we need to relate to them and help them grow up.
You said:
"Your not a true believer nor do you even care to learn about Jesus"
I think that is unhelpful. I don't think we are called to judge others but to bring others into a (deeper) relationship with Jesus.
Just a few thoughts that I make full of love that you might like to pray about. I prayed writing this post because I really don't want to upset or offend, but I wanted to voice what was on my heart. I want to build up the church.
I am a fairly new believer and I don't claim to have much wisdom. I do believe that we ALL can help each other in our walks with Jesus. That is all I want to do.
Lost (Jake): my advice:
Pray for God to speak to you and open your mind and heart to him.
Read those articles that Chad gave you links to at the beginning of this thread.
Let us know what you think.
Love to you all, Jack
I don't wanna be out of place in saying this, and please don't let me cause discord in writing this.
We are all on a journey with God and he is guiding us into truth by the power of the Holy Spirit at work in us. None of us are perfect but we are all perfectly loved by God and he leads us into His ways.
I believe that the Holy Bible is God's word (2 Timothy 3:16). start to finish (Revelation 22:18-19). But it took me some time to be convicted of that. When I was born again and started my relationship with Jesus, I did not know much about anything, except that Jesus loved me. He then guided me into truth (and is still guiding me thankfully). (John 8:31-32)
Chad,
I believe that you have been given lots of wisdom BY GOD to share with us. You have a teaching gift. But it is also important to make sure that preaching is always full of grace (Colossians 4:6) and out of love (1Cor13).
I don't doubt that you live on these principles, but you have to bear with people (myself included) (Colossians 3:13) who don't share your wisdom. Like I said we are all seeking the truth (of Jesus) and when we come across someone who is misguided in that pursuit we have to think carefully about how to rebuke them and encourage them. It likes talking with a younger brother who is immature and unintelligent because they are younger, we need to relate to them and help them grow up.
You said:
"Your not a true believer nor do you even care to learn about Jesus"
I think that is unhelpful. I don't think we are called to judge others but to bring others into a (deeper) relationship with Jesus.
Just a few thoughts that I make full of love that you might like to pray about. I prayed writing this post because I really don't want to upset or offend, but I wanted to voice what was on my heart. I want to build up the church.
I am a fairly new believer and I don't claim to have much wisdom. I do believe that we ALL can help each other in our walks with Jesus. That is all I want to do.
Lost (Jake): my advice:
Pray for God to speak to you and open your mind and heart to him.
Read those articles that Chad gave you links to at the beginning of this thread.
Let us know what you think.
Love to you all, Jack
Member
Redfox, I completely disagree, there is no "relation" between light and darkness, read it up.
As far as rebuking goes, the same applies as above, if Chad did not rebuke him then he would not realize how fatal his error is, that's as plain as day.
God bless
As far as rebuking goes, the same applies as above, if Chad did not rebuke him then he would not realize how fatal his error is, that's as plain as day.
God bless
Member
Hi Lost,
I use to have the same problem you are having now. Then, I realize one thing. In Hebrews 11, Paul speaks that of Faith through that whole chapter, how many had to believe and obey, If you think about God and the World *which I call Satan's kingdom, temporary*, then every thing that is Biblical is done on what word..faith....
Scientist will even tell you they are non believers because of what they find, what they hear, what they see, but in reality, if you think about it, NO man can really say where it came from, that is why man seeks to find, and then they make it like well this must be, because of.... or it's like millions of years old... and many more saying.
Our Father tells us to Believe with your heart, soul, and mine. The Bible tells us in Rev. that This book was inspired by the Holy Ghost. It's like when you think of something, and you know that you know that it is from God. Do you think, well, this is a Man thought or truely a God thought, giving me direction and truth?
As long as I have been told and remember, God, is by Faith, He will revile His Son if you ask, He will give you the truth. This is what I have learned. I know that being a Christian, I have to stand alone in many thoughts and ways, especially where I live, however, knowing that, no matter what, If God said it than it is true. Now I am learning that the bible has been changed in some what form, and I know that again in Rev. that is between God and the person. But, as I read the Bible, I see stories, which reviles truths, and knowledge of God, His ways, His examples, To think many in the bible was not perfect, gives me hope. Lost.... no matter what you see or hear, ask God for discrenment and He will give you the answers and the way. Not by sight, But by my spirit says the lord.. we live in Faith. we walk in Faith, we know that no matter where or how the Bible began, God reviles Himself in it. If you only ask with a willing heart to see it.
I use to have the same problem you are having now. Then, I realize one thing. In Hebrews 11, Paul speaks that of Faith through that whole chapter, how many had to believe and obey, If you think about God and the World *which I call Satan's kingdom, temporary*, then every thing that is Biblical is done on what word..faith....
Scientist will even tell you they are non believers because of what they find, what they hear, what they see, but in reality, if you think about it, NO man can really say where it came from, that is why man seeks to find, and then they make it like well this must be, because of.... or it's like millions of years old... and many more saying.
Our Father tells us to Believe with your heart, soul, and mine. The Bible tells us in Rev. that This book was inspired by the Holy Ghost. It's like when you think of something, and you know that you know that it is from God. Do you think, well, this is a Man thought or truely a God thought, giving me direction and truth?
As long as I have been told and remember, God, is by Faith, He will revile His Son if you ask, He will give you the truth. This is what I have learned. I know that being a Christian, I have to stand alone in many thoughts and ways, especially where I live, however, knowing that, no matter what, If God said it than it is true. Now I am learning that the bible has been changed in some what form, and I know that again in Rev. that is between God and the person. But, as I read the Bible, I see stories, which reviles truths, and knowledge of God, His ways, His examples, To think many in the bible was not perfect, gives me hope. Lost.... no matter what you see or hear, ask God for discrenment and He will give you the answers and the way. Not by sight, But by my spirit says the lord.. we live in Faith. we walk in Faith, we know that no matter where or how the Bible began, God reviles Himself in it. If you only ask with a willing heart to see it.
Member
Hi Faithful Son.
I completely agree: there is indeed no relation between light and darkness. But I think our role as children of God is to joint people towards the light at all times. I don't think we can know where someone stands. only God can know that.
I too think it is very important and Biblical to rebuke when someone makes an error (and by all means rebuke me similarly) but I think that we need to pray and think hard about the manner in which we rebuke someone. Im not saying I know how to do that. But I think it needs careful consideration.
The only reason I write this is because as I was reading the posts although I agreed 100% with what people were saying to Lost re the Holy Bible, something stirred in me because I felt at times it was unfriendly and unloving. "if you think you are standing firm, be careful that you don't fall!" 1 Cor 10:12 we have to be Christlike in all things. I didn't see all of our writing glorifying God.
What d'you think?
jack
I completely agree: there is indeed no relation between light and darkness. But I think our role as children of God is to joint people towards the light at all times. I don't think we can know where someone stands. only God can know that.
I too think it is very important and Biblical to rebuke when someone makes an error (and by all means rebuke me similarly) but I think that we need to pray and think hard about the manner in which we rebuke someone. Im not saying I know how to do that. But I think it needs careful consideration.
The only reason I write this is because as I was reading the posts although I agreed 100% with what people were saying to Lost re the Holy Bible, something stirred in me because I felt at times it was unfriendly and unloving. "if you think you are standing firm, be careful that you don't fall!" 1 Cor 10:12 we have to be Christlike in all things. I didn't see all of our writing glorifying God.
What d'you think?
jack
Member
oh and by the by ive just read:
http://www.talkjesus.com/evidence-prophecy-facts/20042-amazing-book.html
It great. explaining some AMAZING think about the Bible!
Love Jack
http://www.talkjesus.com/evidence-prophecy-facts/20042-amazing-book.html
It great. explaining some AMAZING think about the Bible!
Love Jack
Member
Jack
Luke 17 v 3Take heed to yourselves: If thy brother trespass against thee, rebuke him; and if he repent, forgive him.
2 Thesselonians 3 v 6
Now we command you, brethren, in the name of our Lord Jesus Christ, that ye withdraw yourselves from every brother that walketh disorderly, and not after the tradition which he received of us.
I really only seen agitation, in bro Jake's comments, it was enough to rile anyone in the defense of God.
To speak so boldly, without reverence, no fear of God and not to see how incredible the miracles of Jesus were and are.
I did not see anything wrong in Chad's replies.
He was merely taking his stand for Jesus, as so we must do.
Jake has seemed to have departed now anyway, so he really can't have been interested, ony in sparking of a debate, he said so himself.
sorry bro, no disrespect, but I have much respect for Chad, and the way he runs this forum, we are blessed to have his teaching and wisdom, given unto him by the Holy Spirit, Thank you Jesus.
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Member
I'd like to apologize for not providing scripture as I posted, I have no real excuse for it, it's pure laziness.
As sister Maureen pointed out, we have, it's our duty to rebuke our brothers/sisters in Christ, it's not a maybe, it's a fact.
The "manner" of this is not up to dispute either, here are some examples:
Matthew 16:22-24
22 Then Peter took Him aside and began to rebuke Him, saying, “Far be it from You, Lord; this shall not happen to You!”
23 But He turned and said to Peter, “Get behind Me, Satan! You are an offense to Me, for you are not mindful of the things of God, but the things of men.
Peter tried to rebuke Jesus, note the way in it was done, Peter did not command Jesus, nor did he tell Jesus what to do, but he told Jesus that He will not be crucified, it won't happen to Him, but Jesus rebuked Peter, like only He could, but we must imitate Him, like brother Chad has.
Furthermore:
Matthew 21:12-17
Jesus Cleanses the Temple
12 Then Jesus went into the temple of God and drove out all those who bought and sold in the temple, and overturned the tables of the money changers and the seats of those who sold doves. 13 And He said to them, “It is written, ‘My house shall be called a house of prayer,’ but you have made it a ‘den of thieves.’”
14 Then the blind and the lame came to Him in the temple, and He healed them. 15 But when the chief priests and scribes saw the wonderful things that He did, and the children crying out in the temple and saying, “Hosanna to the Son of David!” they were indignant 16 and said to Him, “Do You hear what these are saying?”
And Jesus said to them, “Yes. Have you never read,
‘ Out of the mouth of babes and nursing infants
You have perfected praise’?”
17 Then He left them and went out of the city to Bethany, and He lodged there.
You won't get a better example of Jesus rebuking people than that day He was at the temple, if we look to His example, I hope we follow it as well.
God bless
Member
Second Thought, I added next to your questions my thoughts ... hope you can understand them :Theres an enormous amount of hostile criticism of the bible and the obvious differences between some of the things that are stated there and later scientific discovery. Like the creation of earth and the universe. * True, there is Lost, however, they believe in the Big Bang, while Christian's believe in God created the world in 7 days, by his word.* The bible was started 80 years after Jesus died and finished I think a couple of hundred years ago in Europe. *Augustius and the Catholic's put it all together, according to what I have learned, if I am wrong , Chad or someone, please correct me, however, they were started at the time and before Jesus was born, look at the old testament* All those people who contributed were just people and as fallible as we are, that fallability is the source of inacuracy * how do you know that these are fallibles and inacuracies?*. In the bible the love of jesus comes through all that fallibility and forgives it * Jesus is Love, Jesus was the example for all of us, Jesus, is the Son of God, which God sacrifice for you and I and everyone, so we could have ever lasting life*. This is an emotional message that clicks in your mind and you see the bigger picture *By faith and asking, Lost, God will show you the bigger picture and the truth, not by man but by His Spirit*. This is why I think although He could read and write and was surrounded by scribes he never wrote anything, only spoke* God created the world by Word, His Word is His Truth, Gen 1:1, and .... He did not have to write or read, many people did not understand, so it was easier to show or use examples. that is why parables came from , i believe. just like today, many reads and write, but, do they really understand???? So it is and was easier for God to revile himself this way*. and why I think quoting extracts from the bible to people who aren't Christians is pointless, what they want to see is how we express the love of jesus ourselves through the way we live our own lives. I agree to a point. Jesus says, by my fruits, they will know you. Many christians or so call Christian say it but do not walk it. I am at times guilty, sad to say, I am not perfect, I am daily working on being the example and light, or as the bible says the Salt of the earth, I want to be different, to where when some one looks at me, they can say, what is it about her and I can then reply, I love Jesus with all my heart and I follow him, * Good opening for God's message* God gave us scriptures, for those to hear his word. To plant a seed for the unsaved, unbelievers, which ever you want to call them. By using scriptures, You are able to show others Gods love, grace and mercy. Lost, When you have God in your heart *Jesus* as your personal savior, life is totally different. When we say or act in a way that the world does, then how are we any different, We are the example that Jesus showed us first. Remember Jesus loved us first. Please, don't lose your first love, over something that man can or will destroy in you. You must pray, You must have faith, You must honor and love your first Love. He will never leave you. Satan wants you and I and others to get confused. Remember God is Love, and confusion is not of God. He will never confuse you, Satan will, for he does not want you to believe or understand. Remember in the bible when Jesus was removing demons from a man, and the spirit that was in the man said. Paraphasing sorry. Jesus what will you do with us. And they were saying things to tell who He was, and Jesus told the spirits in the man, to be quiet. for it was not HIS time. Well, many people are like that man, they have little satan helpers, surrounding them, who closes their eyes, ears and heart. My prayer daily open the eyes of my heart Lord. I want to see you. Pray Lost, Pray to have your eyes open. I think I need to quit now. I could go on and on. sorry. God bless you.
Administrator
Staff Member
redfox, I understand your concern.
Let me explain something here:
1. When someone comes as "Lost" did claiming a bunch of things about the Bible without proof and backing it up with valid source, that is wrong regardless if your a believer or not. Just common sense you don't go claiming anything you wish without proving it true.
2. When someone comes posting a link (breaking simple forum rules too) of a website which he claimed "just googled..." which quotes some Islamic junk on the bottom, that is wrong. What else is it? It shows the person did NOT come here with the right motives to learn about Jesus *at all*.
3. When a man like me has been running the forums for 5 years, I very well know very easily who is a sheep and who is a wolf in sheep clothings. I sense it by GOD's grace and Spirit granted to me. Not only that, but by experience. Lost did not have the right motives. That is not to say he does not have a chance to be forgiven by GOD for what he said, preached, and had in his heart. However, I know my job here.
Let me explain something here:
1. When someone comes as "Lost" did claiming a bunch of things about the Bible without proof and backing it up with valid source, that is wrong regardless if your a believer or not. Just common sense you don't go claiming anything you wish without proving it true.
2. When someone comes posting a link (breaking simple forum rules too) of a website which he claimed "just googled..." which quotes some Islamic junk on the bottom, that is wrong. What else is it? It shows the person did NOT come here with the right motives to learn about Jesus *at all*.
3. When a man like me has been running the forums for 5 years, I very well know very easily who is a sheep and who is a wolf in sheep clothings. I sense it by GOD's grace and Spirit granted to me. Not only that, but by experience. Lost did not have the right motives. That is not to say he does not have a chance to be forgiven by GOD for what he said, preached, and had in his heart. However, I know my job here.
Member
Redfox,
I am not Jack, however, I agree with you completely
Dont you feel, he may be just asking? Confusion?
AHHHH, now this makes sense to me, I agree also, sheeps and goats as you call them sheeps in wolves clothing, There are many, who will proclaim and then come in and try to stir up the pot, I am now getting the BIG picture from both of you... thank you very much. God bless and again thanks.
I am not Jack, however, I agree with you completely
Dont you feel, he may be just asking? Confusion?
AHHHH, now this makes sense to me, I agree also, sheeps and goats as you call them sheeps in wolves clothing, There are many, who will proclaim and then come in and try to stir up the pot, I am now getting the BIG picture from both of you... thank you very much. God bless and again thanks.
Member
Hey Maureen and Chad,
Thanks for those scriptures (luke17v3, 2thes3v6). They are truth indeed.
Ok time to humble myself a little. You are of course right. That makes me wrong (much as I hate to write it!). Sorry for any offence caused by my messages. Sorry Chad. I'm still learning so much in my walk with God and I get a lot of things wrong and I hope no one was upset by anything I wrote. I too have so much respect for Chad; this forum is the most beautiful thing with God's blessing all over it!
We are all growing in our understanding and love of God and we helping each other in that growth... Thank you for helping me. I hope that I can help you one day...
I still find it really hard to completely reject someone's belief as being false whilst still loving them and keeping them open to the gospel... Any advice?? (sorry if this is off initial topic I hope that is alright)
Love you all, Jack
Thanks for those scriptures (luke17v3, 2thes3v6). They are truth indeed.
Ok time to humble myself a little. You are of course right. That makes me wrong (much as I hate to write it!). Sorry for any offence caused by my messages. Sorry Chad. I'm still learning so much in my walk with God and I get a lot of things wrong and I hope no one was upset by anything I wrote. I too have so much respect for Chad; this forum is the most beautiful thing with God's blessing all over it!
We are all growing in our understanding and love of God and we helping each other in that growth... Thank you for helping me. I hope that I can help you one day...
I still find it really hard to completely reject someone's belief as being false whilst still loving them and keeping them open to the gospel... Any advice?? (sorry if this is off initial topic I hope that is alright)
Love you all, Jack
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Member
Gail, it would seem you have not read the forum rules or editing rules either? Why do you post a post with no paragraphs or proper sentences and why do you double post? It's unneccessary and not suited for this forum. Before you post there is clearly three options to show you what to do "Forum Rules" "Posting Tips" and "Faq".
Please correct your error.
Please correct your error.
Member
glc2547 I think quoting extracts from the bible to people who aren't Christians is pointless,(to quote you.)
i have to disagree with you here, I do not believe it's pointless, as I have experienced it in my own life with my own family and they are unsaved.
It also lets people know who we serve and bring there attention to that fact.
It's like when you hear someone take the Lord's name in vain, you know they are not speaking of Him so I ask them oh do you know Him, it amazingly brings them into reality and they realize just what they have said, it works everytime.
and there is a little old lady of 92yrs young on UTube, who would also disagree wholeheartedly, as she staved of her attacker, with the spoken word of God, as he sat beside her in her car, she reduced him to tears, or I should correct that, God's word did.
Go take a look.
Teaches us we can use God's word in any situation, for instant assurance and help.
Anyway looks like Jake has long gone, which proves he wasn't genuine or wouldn't he have stayed around?
i have to disagree with you here, I do not believe it's pointless, as I have experienced it in my own life with my own family and they are unsaved.
It also lets people know who we serve and bring there attention to that fact.
It's like when you hear someone take the Lord's name in vain, you know they are not speaking of Him so I ask them oh do you know Him, it amazingly brings them into reality and they realize just what they have said, it works everytime.
and there is a little old lady of 92yrs young on UTube, who would also disagree wholeheartedly, as she staved of her attacker, with the spoken word of God, as he sat beside her in her car, she reduced him to tears, or I should correct that, God's word did.
Go take a look.
Teaches us we can use God's word in any situation, for instant assurance and help.
Anyway looks like Jake has long gone, which proves he wasn't genuine or wouldn't he have stayed around?
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