"The wages of sin is death" - not 'Eternal Death'.

[Merlin]

Let us see a simple and very basic and important verse and meditate in it.
"For God so loved the world that He gave His only begotten Son, that whoever believes in Him should not perish but have everlasting life."
John 3:16
It clearly says that those who believe will have everlasting life. The question is: Does everyone believe? Because here in this verse is given a condition and this is to bbelieve. Ok, someone might say or think that Jesus died to save all. And this is actually God's desire for all to be saved, but we can clearly see from the scripture that not everyone will believe.

"Enter by the narrow gate; for wide is the gate and broad is the way that leads to destruction, and there are many who go in by it. Because narrow is the gate and difficult is the way which leads to life, and there are few who find it."
Matthew 7:13,14
This verse like others show us the reality of the condition of human kind. Christ died and suffered with great sufferings to save us from a great and huge suffering. It clearly says that those who believe will perish, but that's why He came. To give us possibility and warn us.
Not everyone will listen unfortunately. I'm sure that most of the translations of John 3:16, being in modern or antique Greek express the same meaning to this verse.
This is what I think reflecting on the totality of the the word of God.

The greek word for 'Perish' in John 3:16 is the same as "perish" in Mark 4:38, when the disciples were in the boat during the storm and said, "Lord, don't ye care that we perish" - they did not want to die.

Did Billy Graham 'Perish' or have 'Everlasting Life'? - He "perished".
He "sowed to the flesh and reaped corruption" (Gal 6:8).
He was in the "Wide Gate to Death" (Matthew 7:13-15) -
He was a Wolf in Sheep's clothing; "Promising Liberty but a servant of corruption" - II Peter 2: 19.

@Ivan Chamurliev If you want to meditate on the totality of the Word of God, you must understand the Abrahamic Covenant - "That in thy seed shall ALL FAMILIES OF THE EARTH BE BLESSED" - Gen 12:3.

Oh how the church has "seducing spirits and doctrines of devils".

 

[Ivan Chamurliev]

The greek word for 'Perish' in John 3:16 is the same as "perish" in Mark 4:38, when the disciples were in the boat during the storm and said, "Lord, don't ye care that we perish" - they did not want to die.

Did Billy Graham 'Perish' or have 'Everlasting Life'? - He "perished".
He "sowed to the flesh and reaped corruption" (Gal 6:8).
He was in the "Wide Gate to Death" (Matthew 7:13-15) -
He was a Wolf in Sheep's clothing; "Promising Liberty but a servant of corruption" - II Peter 2: 19.

@Ivan Chamurliev If you want to meditate on the totality of the Word of God, you must understand the Abrahamic Covenant - "That in thy seed shall ALL FAMILIES OF THE EARTH BE BLESSED" - Gen 12:3.

Oh how the church has "seducing spirits and doctrines of devils".

So, you agree with me that some people perish? Because this is what I wanted to say looking at what the scriptures are saying.

 

[hopefulson]

Let us see a simple and very basic and important verse and meditate in it.
"For God so loved the world that He gave His only begotten Son, that whoever believes in Him should not perish but have everlasting life."
John 3:16


"Enter by the narrow gate; for wide is the gate and broad is the way that leads to destruction, and there are many who go in by it. Because narrow is the gate and difficult is the way which leads to life, and there are few who find it."
Matthew 7:13,14
This verse like others show us the reality of the condition of human kind. Christ died and suffered with great sufferings to save us from a great and huge suffering. It clearly says that those who believe will perish, but that's why He came. To give us possibility and warn us.
Not everyone will listen unfortunately. I'm sure that most of the translations of John 3:16, being in modern or antique Greek express the same meaning to this verse.
This is what I think reflecting on the totality of the the word of God.

Everything here is a good example. Let me get right to the crux of the issue which is the approach to The Word. Every Issue raised in scripture has this component incorporated within it and that is the positional aspect of God as opposed to us. ( He alone is loyal He alone is true. ) When Jesus was addressed by the young wealthy man as Good His response was ( why do you call me good there is none good but God ). This is not deception on His part but the acknowledgment of humility in Faith as a prerequisite to the good that is God's prerogative alone, and this Spirit is The Spirit of your creator and mine these are red letters. Any approach other than this character is in error immediately. Therefore anyone who stands or establishes any theorem or doctrine not found in that spirit will fall short of the truth. This in fact a good and useful test for the truth. So this admonishment is present in scripture for the indignant and rebellious ( The love of the truth is not in them.) Therefore the first place we should look is within ourselves and whether we are following The Spirit or putting our boot upon It. No trick of perception will work neither will planting your feet on what you might reason is solid ground. Faith is demanding of your own heart that God fills it before any reason or work of our own will. I will paraphrase - if you don't hate your mother or your father and yes even your own life you can not be His disciple. If you don't enter as a little child you will in no way enter at all. THE WORD OF GOD NEVER DEPARTS FROM THIS THEME. It can not be dismissed or avoided. So when you pray put away every evidence of me first. This is the point of reconciliation with your brother and neighbor so that your prayers will be heard. Without this, we are nowhere and nothing.

 

[Sosthenes]

Phrases like "forever and ever" and "eternal punishment" are horrific translations of the greek, and have nothing to do with the "Restoration of ALL THINGS", which is the fulfillment of the Abrahamic Covenant (Acts 3:19-26, Gal 3:8, etc).

There is NOT ONE verse in the Bible that states a 'non-believer' cannot "Call upon the Lord" after physical death.
Not One.

I'm very concerned about posts like this which is why I joined.

1 Corinthians 3:12 Now if any man build upon this foundation gold, silver, precious stones, wood, hay, stubble;

1 Corinthians 3:13 Every man's work shall be made manifest: for the day shall declare it, because it shall be revealed by fire; and the fire shall try every man's work of what sort it is.

Are you saying that if your work is put in the fire and it comes out as wood, hay or stubble that your works will be restored and that you don't reap what you sow?

 

[Sosthenes]

It's a parable on the election of grace. The rich man clothed in purple represents Judah who had five brothers. Abe called him son, meaning he was of Israel - and "all Israel shall be saved" - Romans 11:26

Romans 9:6 ¶ Not as though the word of God hath taken none effect. For they are not all Israel, which are of Israel:

Romans 9:7 Neither, because they are the seed of Abraham, are they all children: but, In Isaac shall thy seed be called.

Romans 9:8 That is, They which are the children of the flesh, these are not the children of God: but the children of the promise are counted for the seed.

 

[Primordial Light]

Romans 9:6 ¶ Not as though the word of God hath taken none effect. For they are not all Israel, which are of Israel:

Romans 9:7 Neither, because they are the seed of Abraham, are they all children: but, In Isaac shall thy seed be called.

Romans 9:8 That is, They which are the children of the flesh, these are not the children of God: but the children of the promise are counted for the seed.

You might want to factor Romans 11:25-26 into your analysis:

25 For I would not, brethren, that ye should be ignorant of this mystery, lest ye should be wise in your own conceits; that blindness in part is happened to Israel, until the fulness of the Gentiles be come in.


26 And so all Israel shall be saved: as it is written, There shall come out of Sion the Deliverer, and shall turn away ungodliness from Jacob:

 

[hopefulson]

Romans 9:6 ¶ Not as though the word of God hath taken none effect. For they are not all Israel, which are of Israel:

Romans 9:7 Neither, because they are the seed of Abraham, are they all children: but, In Isaac shall thy seed be called.

Romans 9:8 That is, They which are the children of the flesh, these are not the children of God: but the children of the promise are counted for the seed.

This is a slippery slope and I don't like it. Anything not found in Jesus Christ will be found in the fire. It is frightening to depart from that in any way.

 

[Primordial Light]

This is a slippery slope and I don't like it. Anything not found in Jesus Christ will be found in the fire. It is frightening to depart from that in any way.

Mark 9:49 For everyone will be salted with fire.

Isaiah 4:4 When the Lord shall have washed away the filth of the daughters of Zion, and shall have purged the blood of Jerusalem from the midst thereof by the spirit of judgment, and by the spirit of burning.

Only the carnal mind presumes natural fire.

 

[hopefulson]

Mark 9:49 For everyone will be salted with fire.

Isaiah 4:4 When the Lord shall have washed away the filth of the daughters of Zion, and shall have purged the blood of Jerusalem from the midst thereof by the spirit of judgment, and by the spirit of burning.

Only the carnal mind presumes natural fire.

There is no question that the issue you are referencing is spiritual but the consequences are real and actual if you do not overcome. The conclusions you are drawing negate the fire that is never quenched and where the worm dies not. I wish you were right but you are not. The cross is a real payment for real redemption. It would be a terrible thing for anyone to miss the condition that accesses that redemption as the Pharisees did as Jesus Himself testified to.

 

[Primordial Light]

Enough

There is no question that the issue you are referencing is spiritual but the consequences are real and actual if you do not overcome. The conclusions you are drawing negate the fire that is never quenched and where the worm dies not. I wish you were right but you are not. The cross is a real payment for real redemption. It would be a terrible thing for anyone to miss the condition that accesses that redemption as the Pharisees did as Jesus Himself testified to.

Filter your ideology through what Jesus Christ said in Matthew 12:20-21
A bruised reed shall he not break, and smoking flax shall he not quench, till he send forth judgment unto victory.
21 And in his name shall the Gentiles trust.

Time to aquaint yourself with the Abrahamic Covenant.

 

[hopefulson]

Enough

Filter your ideology through what Jesus Christ said in Matthew 12:20-21
A bruised reed shall he not break, and smoking flax shall he not quench, till he send forth judgment unto victory.
21 And in his name shall the Gentiles trust.

Time to aquaint yourself with the Abrahamic Covenant.

That reference is also spiritual having to do with the spark of The Spirit within you. There is nothing incongruous with this statement and final judgment.
It, in fact, infers that judgement in what you have highlighted in red. That eternal death is spoken of in revelation cannot be mistaken without an active prosecutorial assault on the truth. Which in that book is specifically condemned as inheriting a part in that same lake of fire. Stop playing with this. It is wrong. I would love universal mercy to be true but NO SCRIPTURE SUPPORTS IT.

 

[Primordial Light]

That reference is also spiritual having to do with the spark of The Spirit within you. There is nothing incongruous with this statement and final judgment.
It, in fact, infers that judgement in what you have highlighted in red. That eternal death is spoken of in revelation cannot be mistaken without an active prosecutorial assault on the truth. Which in that book is specifically condemned as inheriting a part in that same lake of fire. Stop playing with this. It is wrong. I would love universal mercy to be true but NO SCRIPTURE SUPPORTS IT.

Ooh, NO SCRIPTURE ?
I have over 100 in my book.
I'll share a second one with you, since you already ignored Matthew 12:21

Romans 11:36 “For of him, and through him, and to him, are all things: to whom be glory for ever. Amen.”
Tell me, what does "ALL THINGS" mean to you?

 

[Primordial Light]

That reference is also spiritual having to do with the spark of The Spirit within you. There is nothing incongruous with this statement and final judgment.
It, in fact, infers that judgement in what you have highlighted in red. That eternal death is spoken of in revelation cannot be mistaken without an active prosecutorial assault on the truth. Which in that book is specifically condemned as inheriting a part in that same lake of fire. Stop playing with this. It is wrong. I would love universal mercy to be true but NO SCRIPTURE SUPPORTS IT.

Ooh, NO SCRIPTURE ?
I have over 100 in my book
I'll share a third one with you:
I Timothy 2:3-6
3 For this is good and acceptable in the sight of God our Saviour;
4 Who will have all men to be saved, and to come unto the knowledge of the truth.
5 For there is one God, and one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus;
6 Who gave himself a ransom for all, to be testified in due time.

Want some more?

 

[Primordial Light]

That reference is also spiritual having to do with the spark of The Spirit within you. There is nothing incongruous with this statement and final judgment.
It, in fact, infers that judgement in what you have highlighted in red. That eternal death is spoken of in revelation cannot be mistaken without an active prosecutorial assault on the truth. Which in that book is specifically condemned as inheriting a part in that same lake of fire. Stop playing with this. It is wrong. I would love universal mercy to be true but NO SCRIPTURE SUPPORTS IT.

Ooh, NO SCRIPTURE ?
I have over 100 in my book
I'll share a fourth one with you:

I Corinthians 15: 22-28

22 For as in Adam all die, even so in Christ shall all be made alive.


23 But every man in his own order: Christ the firstfruits; afterward they that are Christ's at his coming.


24 Then cometh the end, when he shall have delivered up the kingdom to God, even the Father; when he shall have put down all rule and all authority and power.


25 For he must reign, till he hath put all enemies under his feet.


26 The last enemy that shall be destroyed is death.


27 For he hath put all things under his feet. But when he saith all things are put under him, it is manifest that he is excepted, which did put all things under him.


28 And when all things shall be subdued unto him, then shall the Son also himself be subject unto him that put all things under him, that God may be all in all.

 

[Primordial Light]

Romans 5:18 Therefore as by the offence of one judgment came upon all men to condemnation; even so by the righteousness of one the free gift came upon all men unto justification of life.

 

[hopefulson]

Ooh, NO SCRIPTURE ?
I have over 100 in my book.
I'll share a second one with you, since you already ignored Matthew 12:21

Romans 11:36 “For of him, and through him, and to him, are all things: to whom be glory for ever. Amen.”
Tell me, what does "ALL THINGS" mean to you?

It means the condemned and the saved are to His Glory. ALL THINGS.

 

[Primordial Light]

That reference is also spiritual having to do with the spark of The Spirit within you. There is nothing incongruous with this statement and final judgment.
It, in fact, infers that judgement in what you have highlighted in red. That eternal death is spoken of in revelation cannot be mistaken without an active prosecutorial assault on the truth. Which in that book is specifically condemned as inheriting a part in that same lake of fire. Stop playing with this. It is wrong. I would love universal mercy to be true but NO SCRIPTURE SUPPORTS IT.

You stated you "would love universal mercy to be true" -
Ready for the whirl?
Romans 11:32 For God has committed them all to disobedience, that He might have mercy on all.

 

[Primordial Light]

It means the condemned and the saved are to His Glory. ALL THINGS.

Wrong.
It states "OF HIM AND THROUGH HIM AND TO HIM ARE ALL THINGS"

You have many more scriptures on this page to rationalize away -
Let's see it.

 

[Primordial Light]

The phrase 'Eternal Death' is a fabrication of Babylon.
If the wages of sin was eternal death, Jesus has not yet paid the price for our sin.

Once you move beyond the simplicity of it, it gets complicated.

@hopefulson
You might muse upon the original post.
With your belief in 'Eternal Death' you are adding to the prophecy, so take heed:
Rev 22:18
For I testify to everyone who hears the words of the prophecy of this book: If anyone adds to these things, God will add to him the plagues that are written in this book;

 

[hopefulson]

You stated you "would love universal mercy to be true" -
Ready for the whirl?
Romans 11:32 For God has committed them all to disobedience, that He might have mercy on all.

This is in reference to the law and its work. Read the entire chapter. In fact, read the entire book of Romans the relationship of the law to conviction and the need for spiritual restoration is present pretty much through its entirety. The fact that God will give the disobedient over to a reprobate condition is frightening enough but the end result of that is even worse. This is a terrible error you are advocating in spite of clear admonishment in The Word otherwise. I am not sure I want to continue this. You are not open to honest discovery or truthful examination.