The Denominations Speak: The Sabbath

[abigya]

adding the following verses to what have been discussed

Hebrews 8 :5- 13 (Amplified Bible)

5[But these offer] service [merely] as a pattern and as a foreshadowing of [what has its true existence and reality in] the heavenly sanctuary. For when Moses was about to erect the tabernacle, he was warned by God, saying, See to it that you make it all [exactly] according to the copy (the model) which was shown to you on the mountain.(B)

6But as it now is, He [Christ] has acquired a [priestly] ministry which is as much superior and more excellent [than the old] as the covenant (the agreement) of which He is the Mediator (the Arbiter, Agent) is superior and more excellent, [because] it is enacted and rests upon more important (sublimer, higher, and nobler) promises.

7For if that first covenant had been without defect, there would have been no room for another one or an attempt to institute another one.

8However, He finds fault with them [showing its inadequacy] when He says, Behold, the days will come, says the Lord, when I will make and ratify a new covenant or agreement with the house of Israel and with the house of Judah.

9It will not be like the covenant that I made with their forefathers on the day when I grasped them by the hand to help and relieve them and to lead them out from the land of Egypt, for they did not abide in My agreement with them, and so I withdrew My favor and disregarded them, says the Lord.

10For this is the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel after those days, says the Lord: I will imprint My laws upon their minds, even upon their innermost thoughts and understanding, and engrave them upon their hearts; and I will be their God, and they shall be My people.

11And it will nevermore be necessary for each one to teach his neighbor and his fellow citizen or each one his brother, saying, Know (perceive, have knowledge of, and get acquainted by experience with) the Lord, for all will know Me, from the smallest to the greatest of them.

12For I will be merciful and gracious toward their sins and I will remember their deeds of unrighteousness no more.(C)

13When God speaks of a new [covenant or agreement], He makes the first one obsolete (out of use). And what is obsolete (out of use and annulled because of age) is ripe for disappearance and to be dispensed with altogether.


abigya

 

[ushalk]

i think an important point that needs to be made here is what did jesus do on the sabbath and what he said to those that stated against it.

 

[Fellowservant]

Jesus also said i am not sent but to the lost sheep of the house of Israel. And it is not meet (good) to give the children's bread to the dogs. Is he contradicting himself by going to the Gentiles after the Jews rejected him
as their Messiah? Theres more to the scriptures than meets the eye.


Mat 15:24 But he answered and said, I am not sent but unto the lost
sheep of the house of Israel.
Mat 15:25 Then came she and worshipped him, saying, Lord, help me.
Mat 15:26 But he answered and said, It is not meet to take the children's bread, and to cast it to dogs.



Jesus said that if anyone teaches these commands he will be called great in the kingdom of God, and if any don't teach them all, he will be called the least in the kingdom of God. But as you will notice he still gets into the kingdom. The problem comes here with Paul, when he says if we seek to be justified by the law, we are fallen from grace. Id rather be called the least in the kingdom, than fall from grace and not enter at all.

The law is written on our hearts now, all the ordinances were nailed to the cross.


Gal 5:4 Christ is become of no effect unto you, whosoever of you are justified by the law; ye are fallen from grace.



Read Acts 15 and you will see what is required for Gentiles when it comes to the law of Moses. And there are many more scriptures on this. Study it then make your conclusion.


If you stumble once on keeping the sabbath, you are guilty of breaking all of the commandments. Be careful if you seek to be justified by the laws, Christ will have no effect on you. Read the scriptures i am going to post on this, and take them to heart please.



Rom 14:6 He that regardeth the day, regardeth [it] unto the Lord; and he that regardeth not the day, to the Lord he doth not regard [it]. He that eateth, eateth to the Lord, for he giveth God thanks; and he that eateth not, to the Lord he eateth not, and giveth God thanks.

Read all of Romans


The above to me is just what it says, regard the sabbath all we want, just don't judge people who don't. see below


Col 2:13 And you, being dead in your sins and the uncircumcision of your flesh, hath he quickened together with him, having forgiven you all trespasses;
Col 2:14 Blotting out the handwriting of ordinances that was against us, which was contrary to us, and took it out of the way, nailing it to his cross;
Col 2:15 [And] having spoiled principalities and powers, he made a shew of them openly, triumphing over them in it.
Col 2:16 Let no man therefore judge you in meat, or in drink, or in respect of an holyday, or of the new moon, or of the sabbath [days]:
Col 2:17 Which are a shadow of things to come; but the body [is] of Christ.

Read, study all the above chapter as well.

God bless

 

[ushalk]

fellow servant, i am quite happy that you brought this up and made these points. no jesus was not contradicting himself nor the gospel. the answer to this is found in romans and hebrews. it is for this reason that we can not honestly study the word of god by book and chapter.

it makes sense to me that the word of god is inspired by god therefore it all goes hand in hand. this is why we cant take this verse or this chapter and say that we have complete context of anything in the word of god.

 

[Fellowservant]

fellow servant, i am quite happy that you brought this up and made these points. no jesus was not contradicting himself nor the gospel. the answer to this is found in romans and hebrews. it is for this reason that we can not honestly study the word of god by book and chapter.

it makes sense to me that the word of god is inspired by god therefore it all goes hand in hand. this is why we cant take this verse or this chapter and say that we have complete context of anything in the word of god.

I was just trying to show that all of what Christ said before his rejection by the Jews, was not written in stone. Neither are the ten commandments in the gospel of grace.

Scripture is supposed to be interpreted in its context, so what does the below scriptures mean to you?

Col 2:14 Blotting out the handwriting of ordinances that was against us, which was contrary to us, and took it out of the way, nailing it to his cross;
Col 2:15 [And] having spoiled principalities and powers, he made a shew of them openly, triumphing over them in it.
Col 2:16 Let no man therefore judge you in meat, or in drink, or in respect of an holyday, or of the new moon, or of the sabbath [days]:

God bless

 

[ushalk]

so are you stating that you think we should live against the ten commandments and ignore what is written in the gospels?

 

[Fellowservant]

so are you stating that you think we should live against the ten commandments and ignore what is written in the gospels?

Me first, its simple brother, don't answer a question with a question, what does those scriptures i posted mean to you?

 

[ushalk]

well fellow servant they mean just what they say. that the old law is not what we are living by. but by the grace of god through our faith in christ. however this is not complete context of the matter either. i will post more scripture tomorrow.

 

[cerebus]

The scriptures are very, very clear; grace nullifies the law. The Ten Commandments belong to a covenant which has passed away, through being fulfilled in Christ's person and nailed to the cross. How dare we fall from grace to become enslaved to an empty and fleshly yoke? I would say absolutely we are not upheld to the 10 commandments; their function is totally different for us as Christians than for the Jews.

Hebrews 12:18**For you have not come forward to a mountain which could be touched and which was set on fire, and to darkness and gloom and whirlwind,
12:19**And to the sound of a trumpet and to the voice of words, because of which those who heard entreated that no further word be spoken to them;
12:20**For they could not bear that which was being commanded: "If even a beast touch the mountain, it shall be stoned.''
12:21**And so fearful was the sight, Moses said, "I am full of fear and trembling.''
12:22**But you have come forward to Mount Zion and to the city of the living God, the heavenly Jerusalem; and to myriads of angels, to the universal gathering;

The mountain in V. 18 is clearly Mount Sinai, where the 10 commandments were given. Yet the Word says that we

have not come forward

to this mountain. How do you possibly reconcile this word with your insistence that we should keep the commandments? It's absurd.

 

[bgsda]

Once again points people bring up, you have to distinguish which Law Paul is talking about when you put up his writings(or shall I say the Holy Spirit writtings). He (Paul) plain out and said "The Law is holy, just , and good" in Rom. Which Law?
Then he Paul says do we make VOID the Law thru grace? NO,we establish it ( or do it). Which Law?
How about Rom. 8:3-7 explains it pretty well, that thru our flesh we CANNOT keep the Law but God sending His Son in our likeness of sinfull flesh, condemned sin in the flesh : That the righteousness of the Law might be fullfilled in US, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit. Which Law?
Have to take a moment to say that Paul did just call the Law Spiritual so it cannot be done away with. Then read Rom 8:7 "the carnal mind... is not subject to the law of God". Should be a scary thought to most of you! Which Law?

I can go on and on in Pauls writtings about how he understood the importance of the Law, not Moses Law. Please you have to ask yourself which Law is he talking about. Also the context, if he is talking about the Jews they tried to keep the Law, both of them out of works you know like their way of salvation, which Paul and Christ condemned. So if says one thing that is hard to be understood 2Pet. 3:16,17 dont twist it to try to explain what you were brought up to believe. Search the Scriptures please.

Jiggyfly your answer to He wil not condemn you on which day you worship is the Bible says He will. What is the def. of sin Rom.7:7/1John 3:4. 1John 3:4 which Law is he talking about? And if breaking it is sin and "Remember to keep the SABBATH day Holy(Seventh day of the week)" is in the Law, how can you continually sin each week knowingly and believe you will not be condemned. He sees sin as sin whether its Lying, Stealing, Killing. If I was to Kill one person each week am I not condemned?
But remember sinning out of ignorance is one thing, remember He winks at this(which means He acts like it was never done), but know you and everyone here has been shown and know held accountable. But God is good as long as we confess and repent He forgives us our sins!. Amen God is Awesome.

 

[jiggyfly]

Jiggyfly your answer to He wil not condemn you on which day you worship is the Bible says He will. What is the def. of sin Rom.7:7/1John 3:4. 1John 3:4 which Law is he talking about? And if breaking it is sin and "Remember to keep the SABBATH day Holy(Seventh day of the week)" is in the Law, how can you continually sin each week knowingly and believe you will not be condemned. He sees sin as sin whether its Lying, Stealing, Killing. If I was to Kill one person each week am I not condemned?
But remember sinning out of ignorance is one thing, remember He winks at this(which means He acts like it was never done), but know you and everyone here has been shown and know held accountable. But God is good as long as we confess and repent He forgives us our sins!. Amen God is Awesome.

You said were done and your hands were clean in another thread like you were a delivering a message from God and yet you continue, trying to correct with limited understanding. Well you can give up your mission I have been delivered from religion. So I expect you to keep your word and cease because your "hands are clean" I am really not interested in any list of do's and dont's. I pray we all will learn that all that is important is Christ.

 

[Boanerges]

Just my view:
Jesus preached to Jews and lost people, there was no church until the Book of Acts.
We are sons of God through Christ, and we have a new and better way, Jesus is my Sabbath rest, in Christ I cease form my own works and dedicate myself to worhsipping and seeking Him.

 

[bgsda]

Did everyone read that we will be worshipping the Sabbath in heaven each week in Isaiah 66:22,23. Oh how lovely it is to rest in CHRIST. John saw the Commandments in Rev.11:19. His Commandments are not GRIEVOUS or sad/pitiful 1John 5:3, why many make it grievous?

 

[David777]

The book of Isaiah was written about 600 years
before Christ. Hence, Jewish time was based on
the cycles of the moon rather than a solar cycle
we use today.

If God spoke to the inhabitants of Israel about
solar time cycles, no one would have understood
the time scales. Modern readers of the Old testament
should be well aware of the different time cycles.

In fact, the Hebrew term for "month," chodesh, means
"new [moon]," referring to the new moon that began
the month.

The New Moon festival was often listed along with
Sabbath as an important religious observance.
(2 Kings 4:23, Ezekial 45:17).

Hence, the folk of old testament times in Israel would
have comprehended what God was saying. God is
simply amplifying the type in the Old Testament
in language that all readers would understand.

If there is no sun and moon in the new creation,
then there is no day and night. Nor is there a
weekly cycle as we know, hence no sabbath day
as such.

 

[brakelite]

The book of Isaiah was written about 600 years
before Christ. Hence, Jewish time was based on
the cycles of the moon rather than a solar cycle
we use today.

If God spoke to the inhabitants of Israel about
solar time cycles, no one would have understood
the time scales. Modern readers of the Old testament
should be well aware of the different time cycles.

In fact, the Hebrew term for "month," chodesh, means
"new [moon]," referring to the new moon that began
the month.

The New Moon festival was often listed along with
Sabbath as an important religious observance.
(2 Kings 4:23, Ezekial 45:17).

Hence, the folk of old testament times in Israel would
have comprehended what God was saying. God is
simply amplifying the type in the Old Testament
in language that all readers would understand.

If there is no sun and moon in the new creation,
then there is no day and night. Nor is there a
weekly cycle as we know, hence no sabbath day
as such.

Re 21:23 And the city (the New Jerusalem which is in heaven) had no need of the sun, neither of the moon, to shine in it: for the glory of God did lighten it, and the Lamb is the light thereof.
arth
Isaiah 66:22 For as the new heavens and the new earth, which I will make, shall remain before me, saith the LORD, so shall your seed and your name remain.
23 And it shall come to pass, that from one new moon to another, and from one sabbath to another, shall all flesh come to worship before me, saith the LORD.

Two quite different locations David.

 

[bgsda]

From one sabbath to another, new heavens and new earth. Thats pretty plain. Have you guys read Hebrews lately chpt 3+4. Im rexently studying the book of Hebrews and came across those two chpt, which clearly states the need for "people to enter into the rest or sabbath". And before anybody comes up with their own interpretation or someone elses, it does specifically states about which "rest" Paul is talking about when he states "on the SEVENTH day" "when God rested on it as well".

Please consider trying the Sabbath out like I told my wife, who is overwhelmed with life period(work, bills, kids, health, etc). See we were both non christians about 7yrs ago. I was in the streets doing what i was gdoing, my wife she had her sins as well. We split up she stayed w/my kids. To make a long story short, visiting my kids ome day she invited me to church, now this was a woman who used to curse God straight uo. Before she invited me, a couple of months before i hit my lowest point in life where i was either going to end up in prison forever or kill myself. So she invites me and i go.

So we become Christians at this non denominational church. God does miracles in my life, shows me how to love my girl(we got married like 6months after that, we got convicted that fornication was wrong), i stop using drugs, alcohol, language got better, we have twins, we get a house, wonderful blessings. I was in that church for about 2yrs going almost every Tues, wed, fri, and sun all day. My friends dropped like flies, you knoe how that is.. Then at my jobI meet a friend, Daniel.

I always carried a Bible in my back pocket, i loved to read it all the time. So i had a passion to talk about God so I became friends with this guy. Longbstory short, everything well talk about he'll show me with my Bible. So i get these lessons from him, everything was Biblical, remember i was deep into this other church, i was very very skeptical about this guy. But one CANNOT refute the Bible especialy when theres more than 20Scriptures on a single topic and I was going back to mu Pastor and my Pastor only had 1or 2, sometimes none and would simply tell me stay away from this guy. How could i, i worked with the guy overnight, graveyard shift and saw him more than 40 hrs a week.

So we get to the Sabbath. Now i have to mention, not to critisize different church but i am a reasonable person. Me and my wife used to take serious notes from our Pastor Wed and Sun for 2yrs straight. We kept those notes and would review them, still got them. About one month before i met Daniel i started noticing that this Pastor was just repeating the same thing over and over. I mean how many times can you be saved? How many times can you talk about wealth and health and wealth again?. I wanted to know about who Jesus is? What i can do for Him, not just ehat He can do for me?

So Sabbath came up and i asked my Pastor. My Pastor says dont talk to this guy again. So i go to work tell this guy im not talking to u about this again, told him wee can talk about Jesus but not about the Sabbath. The guy Daniel gives me something he got from the internet, that goes more in detail of what Harold put up or the guy who started this thread, at the beggining of this thread. About the Catholic Church admitting that they changed the true Sabbath to Sunday and many more quotes of Popes and Bishops admitting this authority that they have, even recent quotes callong "protestants their kids" for accepting this.

So i stop talking to my Pastor and Daniel and I seek the Lord like I never did before through fasting and orayer and searching of Gods Word. I did not know how long it was until my wife told me, she said it was for two weeks and that i stayed away from even her and my kids. I even felt like vomitting at times. It was very hard to think like why did my Pastor try to keep me away from this or like why isnt he keeping the correct Sabbath. What was kiling me more was the fact how is my wife going to react or my new family at church. Well bottom ine is this. I studied this Sabbath issue thoroughly with the help of Christ and could not and would not walk away from TRUTH no matter the cost.

My wife about one week before i fasted decided for us to invite this Dniel fellow over our house for a Bible Study of the book of Daniel and the prophecies that pinpoint to Christs first advent and my wife and I were blown away with this study. I mean verse after verse to back every point from Gen to Rev. My wife was so pleased that she said we cant wait to next week for another one, you have to come back in two days. He left we prayed and my wife wemt upstairs called one of the ministers form our church then we went to sleep. Woke up the next day, flirst thing out of my wifes mouth was "i dont want you to see this Daniel guy again, i couldnt sleep all night, there was this lion chasing me all night and it was the devil". She said Daniel was the devil in other words, but i could not resist TRUTH! So then I fasted.

Now u see what was going thru my mind and what decision i had to make. But to this day I would not change it and still thank God He chose me to be counted worthy to know this truth that i so dearly would like all of you to partake of. I must admit it was and is very hard for me, my relationship w/my wife, the family disowned me (church), and friends. But i count it all dung for Christ. Im still married hold on as much as i can, the rest of my help i get from my Lord and Savior.

So back to what i was saying i tell my wife who is recently and has been overwhelmed with life, honey you should try to rest one dayout of the week stop everything. I told her you can do it Sunday just try it. I told her youll get a better blessing on Gods true Sabbath day-Saturday in which is the ONLY day He blessed, hollowed, and sanctified Gen.2:1-3/EX 20:8-11. I said try it on her day and youll feel better. Shes trying its not easy, you have to have faith to stop doing everything yoir used to doing for how long yoube been born. Bit try it a day free from worry, not thinking about bills, about work, about debts, etc. A day solely resting on Jesus, fellowshippong, evangelizing, visiting the sick, visiting prisoners in ja

 

[bgsda]

Prisoners in jail. Isa 58 explains it a bit. Or just look at Christ life and what He did on the Sabbath. Jesus went to Church, healed the sick, preach and teach, etc. Life is wonderful, the Sabbath is wondrful. Please do not ,iss out on this opportunity. If you want more explanation on the Sabbath ask us Brakelite or myself. GOD BLESS YOU ALL

 

[SpiritLedEd]

Isaiah 66:22 For as the new heavens and the new earth, which I will make, shall remain before me, saith the LORD, so shall your seed and your name remain.
23 And it shall come to pass, that from one new moon to another, and from one sabbath to another, shall all flesh come to worship before me, saith the LORD.

I believe that Jesus' coming to earth marked the beginning of this process. Note the phrase "from one new moon to another and from one sabbath to another". This looks like a time continuum, not individual ritual observances - a 24/7 eternal resting in God.

SLE

 

[David777]

Prisoners in jail. Isa 58 explains it a bit. Or just look at Christ life and what He did on the Sabbath. Jesus went to Church, healed the sick, preach and teach, etc. Life is wonderful, the Sabbath is wondrful. Please do not ,iss out on this opportunity. If you want more explanation on the Sabbath ask us Brakelite or myself. GOD BLESS YOU ALL

I need an honest answer from you bgsda.

Do you really believe that if a person does
not honor the sabbath, then that person
even though they believe in Jesus will
not be saved?

 

[brakelite]

David, you are asking BGSDA to take the part of God with your challenge. None of us are here to condemn any who believe differently. To your own Master you stand or fall. When we teach of Sabbath, we are merely sharing with you a truth that if accepted and followed, as we have discovered, we are convinced will lead you to a closer relationship with Jesus. As Jesus said, the Sabbath was made for you. To reject it is to reject a gift that was given before the fall, along with marriage. Both institiutions, marriage and the Sabbath, are undefiled by sin. Neither can be shadows of a cure or remedy for sin, because both were established before it. Both therefore are precious, holy, sanctified, and blessed of God.

I have a very similar testimony to bg. I do believe I might add that portion of my life to my testimony here on the forum..... Done.