Only One God The Father

[DHC]

Hello Squeaky.

Read the following and tell me how you would interpret this information.

When Jesus was betrayed by Judas there was a payment made by the ruling party to Judas.

The amount that Judas was offered for betraying Jesus was thirty pieces of silver.

The Old Testament prophet Zechariah declares a messianic prophecy regarding the thirty pieces of silver.
God tells the prophet Zechariah, that Israel would value God's worth at the princely sum of thirty pieces of silver.

Here is the prophecy below.

Zechariah 11
12 I said to them, “If it is good in your sight, give me my wages; but if not, never mind!”
So they weighed out thirty pieces of silver as my wages.
13 Then the Lord said to me, “Throw it to the potter, that magnificent price at which I was valued by them.”
So I took the thirty pieces of silver and threw them to the potter in the house of the Lord.

There you have it, God was valued at 'thirty pieces of silver' by Israel, and that is what the prophecy states.

Now Matthew refers to this same prophecy and says it was fulfilled by Jesus.

Matthew 26
15 and said, “What are you willing to give me (Judas) to betray Him (Jesus) to you?”
And they weighed out thirty pieces of silver to him (Judas).

Matthew 27
9 Then that which was spoken through Zechariah the prophet was fulfilled:
“And they took the thirty pieces of silver, the price of the one (God) whose
price had been set by the sons of Israel;

We know from Zechariah's prophecy that God knew before hand the price that humanity
would set as His worth. This fulfillment of this prophecy is evidence that Jesus is God,
and that Jesus was the one speaking with Zechariah!

 

[Squeaky]

Hello Squeaky.

Read the following and tell me how you would interpret this information.

When Jesus was betrayed by Judas there was a payment made by the ruling party to Judas.

The amount that Judas was offered for betraying Jesus was thirty pieces of silver.

The Old Testament prophet Zechariah declares a messianic prophecy regarding the thirty pieces of silver.
God tells the prophet Zechariah, that Israel would value God's worth at the princely sum of thirty pieces of silver.

Here is the prophecy below.

Zechariah 11
12 I said to them, “If it is good in your sight, give me my wages; but if not, never mind!”
So they weighed out thirty pieces of silver as my wages.
13 Then the Lord said to me, “Throw it to the potter, that magnificent price at which I was valued by them.”
So I took the thirty pieces of silver and threw them to the potter in the house of the Lord.

There you have it, God was valued at 'thirty pieces of silver' by Israel, and that is what the prophecy states.

Now Matthew refers to this same prophecy and says it was fulfilled by Jesus.

Matthew 26
15 and said, “What are you willing to give me (Judas) to betray Him (Jesus) to you?”
And they weighed out thirty pieces of silver to him (Judas).

Matthew 27
9 Then that which was spoken through Zechariah the prophet was fulfilled:
“And they took the thirty pieces of silver, the price of the one (God) whose
price had been set by the sons of Israel;

We know from Zechariah's prophecy that God knew before hand the price that humanity
would set as His worth. This fulfillment of this prophecy is evidence that Jesus is God,
and that Jesus was the one speaking with Zechariah!

I said
God sent Jesus. Jesus came to declare who God is. Stop Jesus and you have stopped the message about who God is. They didn't kill God because God cant die. And this silliness of thinking that satan can kill God is ridiculous. God wouldn't and didn't allow satan to kill Him. Not my God.

Matt 11:27
27 "All things have been delivered to Me by My Father, and no one knows the Son except the Father. Nor does anyone know the Father except the Son, and the one to whom the Son wills to reveal Him.
(NKJ)

2 Cor 5:18-19
18 Now all things are of God, who has reconciled us to Himself through Jesus Christ, and has given us the ministry of reconciliation,
19 that is, that God was in Christ reconciling the world to Himself, not imputing their trespasses to them, and has committed to us the word of reconciliation.
(NKJ)
John 1:17-18
17 For the law was given through Moses, but grace and truth came through Jesus Christ.
18 No one has seen God at any time. The only begotten Son, who is in the bosom of the Father, He has declared Him.
(NKJ)

 

[TC4JC]

Hi Squeaky,
It would appear as though folks are ganging up on you regarding trinitarianism. I have to admire your standing on your convictions , however it seems the thread is coming to an impasse. We all know it's the job of the Holy Spirit to teach and convince what is written in God'sWord. Maybe it would do to step back a bit and ponder all the information that's been given thus far. Each of us hunger for the Truth of God'sWord, but the posts are starting to seem to be flowing into insulting remarks or at least condescending.
When I started reading and studying the Bible , my sole mission was to try and discredit God. Find some way to catch Him in a lie. What I found , after reading and studying, is that God doesn't say one thing over in book so and so, and something entirely different in another place when it relates to the same subject. This is important to know this. When we compare Scripture to Scripture and spiritual to spiritual, God is inerrant. It's called analogia scriptura or something like that.
I know we Christians can be passionate in our beliefs, and no one likes to admit we got it wrong when it comes to our belief of doctrines, but I've learned over the years that much of what I once knew was in fact error when it came to understanding the Bible. Some was what was passed on to me and some was just the Bible seemed to be a riddle.
May the Holy Spirit be our guide to a fuller understanding. When the student is ready, The Teacher will appear.

 

[Squeaky]

Hi Squeaky,
It would appear as though folks are ganging up on you regarding trinitarianism. I have to admire your standing on your convictions , however it seems the thread is coming to an impasse. We all know it's the job of the Holy Spirit to teach and convince what is written in God'sWord. Maybe it would do to step back a bit and ponder all the information that's been given thus far. Each of us hunger for the Truth of God'sWord, but the posts are starting to seem to be flowing into insulting remarks or at least condescending.
When I started reading and studying the Bible , my sole mission was to try and discredit God. Find some way to catch Him in a lie. What I found , after reading and studying, is that God doesn't say one thing over in book so and so, and something entirely different in another place when it relates to the same subject. This is important to know this. When we compare Scripture to Scripture and spiritual to spiritual, God is inerrant. It's called analogia scriptura or something like that.
I know we Christians can be passionate in our beliefs, and no one likes to admit we got it wrong when it comes to our belief of doctrines, but I've learned over the years that much of what I once knew was in fact error when it came to understanding the Bible. Some was what was passed on to me and some was just the Bible seemed to be a riddle.
May the Holy Spirit be our guide to a fuller understanding. When the student is ready, The Teacher will appear.

I said
I think the problem is most don't read the rules of believing before they start witnessing.

1 Cor 4:6
6 Now these things, brethren, I have figuratively transferred to myself and Apollos for your sakes, that you may learn in us not to think beyond what is written, that none of you may be puffed up on behalf of one against the other.
(NKJ)
Rev 22:18-19
18 For I testify to everyone who hears the words of the prophecy of this book: If anyone adds to these things, God will add to him the plagues that are written in this book;
19 and if anyone takes away from the words of the book of this prophecy, God shall take away his part from the Book of Life, from the holy city, and from the things which are written in this book.
(NKJ)
To many people are trying to be passive with one another. Rather than sharing the truth.

Matt 5:10-13
10 Blessed are those who are persecuted for righteousness' sake, for theirs is the kingdom of heaven.
11 "Blessed are you when they revile and persecute you, and say all kinds of evil against you falsely for My sake.
12 "Rejoice and be exceedingly glad, for great is your reward in heaven, for so they persecuted the prophets who were before you.
13 "You are the salt of the earth; but if the salt loses its flavor, how shall it be seasoned? It is then good for nothing but to be thrown out and trampled underfoot by men.
(NKJ)

 

[DHC]

Hello Squeaky.

It would appear Squeaky that you may have been misinformed regarding the Christ.

You said the following Squeaky.

God sent Jesus. Jesus came to declare who God is. Stop Jesus and you have stopped the message about who God is.
They didn't kill God because God cant die. And this silliness of thinking that satan can kill God is ridiculous. God wouldn't
and didn't allow satan to kill Him. Not my God.

The whole point of the Bible Squeaky, is the Gospel of Jesus Christ, the scripture is not declaring who God is Squeaky.

Everything else in the scripture is of secondary importance, the death and resurrection of the Christ is the sole revelation
of the entire scripture. Not the declaration of who God is Squeaky.

1 Corinthians 15
For I delivered to you as of first importance what I also received, that Christ died for our sins according to the Scriptures

There you have the testimony of Paul, to that which is of primary importance in the scripture, the revelation of the Christ
and His death and resurrection for us.

You said that God cannot die, and yes Squeaky that is correct. But when God took on human form, then of course God
can then indeed die for us. That is what the Gospel of Jesus Christ is all about.

God did allow Satan to crucify Him but death could not hold Him down Squeaky. The perfect sacrifice committed by the
perfect God in the human form. God requires a perfect sacrifice because God is perfect, and you must be perfect to enter
the kingdom of heaven.

Once again Squeaky.

Zechariah 11
13 Then the Lord said to me, “Throw it to the potter, that magnificent price at which I was valued by them.”

God was valued at thirty pieces of silver!

Matthew 26
15 and said, “What are you willing to give me (Judas) to betray Him (Jesus) to you?”
And they weighed out thirty pieces of silver to him (Judas).

Jesus was betrayed for thirty pieces of silver, not God the Father Squeaky.

 

[Squeaky]

Hello Squeaky.

It would appear Squeaky that you may have been misinformed regarding the Christ.

You said the following Squeaky.

The whole point of the Bible Squeaky, is the Gospel of Jesus Christ, the scripture is not declaring who God is Squeaky.

Everything else in the scripture is of secondary importance, the death and resurrection of the Christ is the sole revelation
of the entire scripture. Not the declaration of who God is Squeaky.

1 Corinthians 15
For I delivered to you as of first importance what I also received, that Christ died for our sins according to the Scriptures

There you have the testimony of Paul, to that which is of primary importance in the scripture, the revelation of the Christ
and His death and resurrection for us.

You said that God cannot die, and yes Squeaky that is correct. But when God took on human form, then of course God
can then indeed die for us. That is what the Gospel of Jesus Christ is all about.

God did allow Satan to crucify Him but death could not hold Him down Squeaky. The perfect sacrifice committed by the
perfect God in the human form. God requires a perfect sacrifice because God is perfect, and you must be perfect to enter
the kingdom of heaven.

Once again Squeaky.

Zechariah 11
13 Then the Lord said to me, “Throw it to the potter, that magnificent price at which I was valued by them.”

God was valued at thirty pieces of silver!

Matthew 26
15 and said, “What are you willing to give me (Judas) to betray Him (Jesus) to you?”
And they weighed out thirty pieces of silver to him (Judas).

Jesus was betrayed for thirty pieces of silver, not God the Father Squeaky.

I said

Luke 10:22
22 "All things have been delivered to Me by My Father, and no one knows who the Son is except the Father, and who the Father is except the Son, and the one to whom the Son wills to reveal Him."
(NKJ)

 

[DHC]

I said
Luke 10:22
22 "All things have been delivered to Me by My Father, and no one knows who the Son is except the Father,
and who the Father is except the Son, and the one to whom the Son wills to reveal Him."

Hello Squeaky.

The verse you quoted is a very interesting verse.

May I ask how you read that verse considering the two questions below.

If 'All things' have been handed over to the Son, what does that mean?

If 'All things' have been handed over to the Son, when did this handover occur?

 

[Squeaky]

Hello Squeaky.

The verse you quoted is a very interesting verse.

May I ask how you read that verse considering the two questions below.

If 'All things' have been handed over to the Son, what does that mean?

If 'All things' have been handed over to the Son, when did this handover occur?

I said
ALL ALLMOST NEVER MEANS ALL (IN THE CARNAL SENSE)
Matt 5:14-16
14 "You are the light of the world. A city that is set on a hill cannot be hidden.
15 "Nor do they light a lamp and put it under a basket, but on a lampstand, and it gives light to all who are in the house.
16 "Let your light so shine before men, that they may see your good works and glorify your Father in heaven.
Matt 6:33-34
33 "But seek first the kingdom of God and His righteousness, and all these things shall be added to you.
34 "Therefore do not worry about tomorrow, for tomorrow will worry about its own things. Sufficient for the day is its own trouble.
John 5:36
36 "But I have a greater witness than John's; for the works which the Father has given Me to finish-- the very works that I do-- bear witness of Me, that the Father has sent Me.
John 6:39
39 "This is the will of the Father who sent Me, that of all He has given Me I should lose nothing, but should raise it up at the last day.
John 18:11
11 Then Jesus said to Peter, "Put your sword into the sheath. Shall I not drink the cup which My Father has given Me?"
Heb 2:13
13 And again: "I will put My trust in Him." And again: "Here am I and the children whom God has given Me."
John 6:44-48
44 "No one can come to Me unless the Father who sent Me draws him; and I will raise him up at the last day.
45 "It is written in the prophets, 'And they shall all be taught by God.' Therefore everyone who has heard and learned from the Father comes to Me.
46 "Not that anyone has seen the Father, except He who is from God; He has seen the Father.
47 "Most assuredly, I say to you, he who believes in Me has everlasting life.
48 "I am the bread of life.
John 6:65-69
65 And He said, "Therefore I have said to you that no one can come to Me unless it has been granted to him by My Father."
66 From that time many of His disciples went back and walked with Him no more.
67 Then Jesus said to the twelve, "Do you also want to go away?"
68 But Simon Peter answered Him, "Lord, to whom shall we go? You have the words of eternal life.
69 "Also we have come to believe and know that You are the Christ, the Son of the living God."
John 17:1-2
1 Jesus spoke these words, lifted up His eyes to heaven, and said: "Father, the hour has come. Glorify Your Son, that Your Son also may glorify You,
2 "as You have given Him authority over all flesh, that He should give eternal life to as many as You have given Him.
John 17:6-7
6 "I have manifested Your name to the men whom You have given Me out of the world. They were Yours, You gave them to Me, and they have kept Your word.
7 "Now they have known that all things which You have given Me are from You.
John 17:10-12
10 "And all Mine are Yours, and Yours are Mine, and I am glorified in them.
11 "Now I am no longer in the world, but these are in the world, and I come to You. Holy Father, keep through Your name those whom You have given Me, that they may be one as We are.
12 "While I was with them in the world, I kept them in Your name. Those whom You gave Me I have kept; and none of them is lost except the son of perdition, that the Scripture might be fulfilled.
(NKJ)
XXX All is a figure of speech. We can see that to Jesus all was all those that God had given Him. Which is all those who become Christians and are born again. All those that follow Jesus' example.
Mark 10:45
45 "For even the Son of Man did not come to be served, but to serve, and to give His life a ransom for many."
John 17:12
12 "While I was with them in the world, I kept them in Your name. Those whom You gave Me I have kept; and none of them is lost except the son of perdition, that the Scripture might be fulfilled.
John 13:1
1 Now before the feast of the Passover, when Jesus knew that His hour had come that He should depart from this world to the Father, having loved His own who were in the world, He loved them to the end.
1Thes 3:11-13
11 Now may our God and Father Himself, and our Lord Jesus Christ, direct our way to you.
12 And may the Lord make you increase and abound in love to one another and to all, just as we do to you,
13 so that He may establish your hearts blameless in holiness before our God and Father at the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ with all His saints.
Acts 2:39
39 "For the promise is to you and to your children, and to all who are afar off, as many as the Lord our God will call."
John 6:37-40
37 "All that the Father gives Me will come to Me, and the one who comes to Me I will by no means cast out.
38 "For I have come down from heaven, not to do My own will, but the will of Him who sent Me.
39 "This is the will of the Father who sent Me, that of all He has given Me I should lose nothing, but should raise it up at the last day.
40 "And this is the will of Him who sent Me, that everyone who sees the Son and believes in Him may have everlasting life; and I will raise him up at the last day."
(NKJ)

 

[DHC]

I said
ALL ALLMOST NEVER MEANS ALL (IN THE CARNAL SENSE)

Hello Squeaky.

We have been discussing the verse (Luke 10) which I will print again below.

Luke 10
22 All things have been handed over to Me by My Father

You seem to have the impression that 'all things' does not mean what it says.

ALL ALLMOST NEVER MEANS ALL (IN THE CARNAL SENSE)

Here read the following quotation Squeaky.

Luke 8
25 Who can this be? For He commands even the winds and water, and they obey Him!

Jesus controls the physical world Squeaky.

Luke 10
17 Then the seventy returned with joy, saying, “Lord, even the demons are subject to us in Your name.”

Jesus controls the demonic realm Squeaky.

Jesus controls or has authority over the seen and the unseen worlds.

Hebrews 2
8 You have put all things in subjection under his feet. For in subjecting all things to him, He left nothing that
is not subject to him.

There is nothing that is not subject to Jesus Christ!

So your statement, 'ALL ALLMOST NEVER MEANS ALL (IN THE CARNAL SENSE)', is an erroneous statement Squeaky.

FOR IN SUBJECTING ALL THINGS TO HIM HE LEFT NOTHING THAT IS NOT SUBJECT TO HIM

 

[Squeaky]

Hello Squeaky.

We have been discussing the verse (Luke 10) which I will print again below.

Luke 10
22 All things have been handed over to Me by My Father

You seem to have the impression that 'all things' does not mean what it says.

Here read the following quotation Squeaky.

Luke 8
25 Who can this be? For He commands even the winds and water, and they obey Him!

Jesus controls the physical world Squeaky.

Luke 10
17 Then the seventy returned with joy, saying, “Lord, even the demons are subject to us in Your name.”

Jesus controls the demonic realm Squeaky.

Jesus controls or has authority over the seen and the unseen worlds.

Hebrews 2
8 You have put all things in subjection under his feet. For in subjecting all things to him, He left nothing that
is not subject to him.

There is nothing that is not subject to Jesus Christ!

So your statement, 'ALL ALLMOST NEVER MEANS ALL (IN THE CARNAL SENSE)', is an erroneous statement Squeaky.

FOR IN SUBJECTING ALL THINGS TO HIM HE LEFT NOTHING THAT IS NOT SUBJECT TO HIM

I said
You should have read alittle further in Heb 2

Heb 2:8
8 You have put all things in subjection under his feet." For in that He put all in subjection under him, He left nothing that is not put under him. But now we do not yet see all things put under him.
(NKJ)

 

[DHC]

You should have read alittle further in Heb 2

But I have already read that verse Squeaky. All things have been subjected to the Christ,
all things means everything. But we have a little while to wait until absolutely everything
is subjected to the rule and authority of Jesus Christ. This is a divine decree and none shall
escape this subjection to the reign of the eternal King Jesus Christ.

1 Corinthians 15
23 But each in his own order: Christ the first fruits, after that those who are Christ’s at His coming,
24 then comes the end, when He hands over the kingdom to the God and Father, when He has
abolished all rule and all authority and power.
25 For He must REIGN until He has put all His enemies under His feet.
26 The last enemy that will be abolished is death.
27 For He has put all things in subjection under His feet. But when He says,
“All things are put in subjection,” it is evident that He is excepted who put all things in subjection to Him.
28 When all things are subjected to Him, then the Son Himself also will be subjected to the One
who subjected all things to Him, so that God may be all in all.

We know everything is subjected to Jesus, so the important question then becomes, when did the Father
submit the rule and authority of everything to the Son?

 

[Squeaky]

But I have already read that verse Squeaky. All things have been subjected to the Christ,
all things means everything. But we have a little while to wait until absolutely everything
is subjected to the rule and authority of Jesus Christ. This is a divine decree and none shall
escape this subjection to the reign of the eternal King Jesus Christ.

1 Corinthians 15
23 But each in his own order: Christ the first fruits, after that those who are Christ’s at His coming,
24 then comes the end, when He hands over the kingdom to the God and Father, when He has
abolished all rule and all authority and power.
25 For He must REIGN until He has put all His enemies under His feet.
26 The last enemy that will be abolished is death.
27 For He has put all things in subjection under His feet. But when He says,
“All things are put in subjection,” it is evident that He is excepted who put all things in subjection to Him.
28 When all things are subjected to Him, then the Son Himself also will be subjected to the One
who subjected all things to Him, so that God may be all in all.

We know everything is subjected to Jesus, so the important question then becomes, when did the Father
submit the rule and authority of everything to the Son?

I said
Well with this verse . Your question is confusing.If it says it hasn't happened yet, and you ask when did it happen. That is a bit confusing.
Heb 2:8
8 You have put all things in subjection under his feet." For in that He put all in subjection under him, He left nothing that is not put under him. But now we do not yet see all things put under him.
(NKJ)

 

[DHC]

I said
Well with this verse . Your question is confusing.If it says it hasn't happened yet, and you ask when did it happen. That is a bit confusing.
Heb 2:8
8 You have put all things in subjection under his feet." For in that He put all in subjection under him, He left nothing that is not put under him. But now we do not yet see all things put under him.
(NKJ)

Hello Squeaky.

We are discussing the rule and the authority of Jesus Christ, the King of Israel.

Zechariah 9
9 Shout in triumph, O daughter of Jerusalem! Behold, your king is coming to you;
He is just and endowed with salvation, Humble, and mounted on a donkey

We have established that this Christ has dominion over all creation the 'all things'.
Christ reigns over the everything or 'all things', as the one and the only, royal King.
The King of Jerusalem, the King of Israel, the King of Creation ('all things').

Hebrews 2
8 You have put all things in subjection under his feet. For in subjecting all things to him,
He left nothing that is not subject to him.

We know everything is subjected to Jesus, so the important question then becomes,
when did the Father submit the rule and authority of the creation to the King?

Well with this verse . Your question is confusing.If it says it hasn't happened yet,
and you ask when did it happen. That is a bit confusing.

Squeaky, the actual timing of the subjection of the 'all things' to the Christ by the Father,
cannot be defined within a creation time frame. The subjection of creation to the Son
occurred above the creation itself, hence, this subjection event will be eternal in nature.

We need to understand that the Christ is the reigning King, in the past, in the present and
in the future. This is due to the fact that the King of Israel is God Himself.

Isaiah 6
5 Then I said, “Woe is me, for I am ruined! Because I am a man of unclean lips, And I live
among a people of unclean lips; For my eyes have seen the King, the Lord of hosts.

Isaiah 43
15 I am the Lord, your Holy One, The Creator of Israel, your King.

Isaiah 44:6
Thus says the Lord, the King of Israel and his Redeemer, the Lord of hosts
‘I am the first and I am the last, And there is no God besides Me.

Israel's subjection was to the King, i.e., the Creator, the subjection of 'all things'
was also to the King and God of creation. There is no distinction between Jesus
the King of Israel, and the Creator God of Israel.

Matthew 2
2 Where is He who has been born King of the Jews?

Matthew 27
11 Now Jesus stood before the governor, and the governor questioned Him, saying,
“Are You the King of the Jews?” And Jesus said to him, “It is as you say.”

Matthew 27
29 And after twisting together a crown of thorns, they put it on His head, and a reed in
His right hand; and they knelt down before Him and mocked Him, saying, “Hail, King of the Jews!”

 

[Squeaky]

Hello Squeaky.

We are discussing the rule and the authority of Jesus Christ, the King of Israel.

Zechariah 9
9 Shout in triumph, O daughter of Jerusalem! Behold, your king is coming to you;
He is just and endowed with salvation, Humble, and mounted on a donkey

We have established that this Christ has dominion over all creation the 'all things'.
Christ reigns over the everything or 'all things', as the one and the only, royal King.
The King of Jerusalem, the King of Israel, the King of Creation ('all things').

Hebrews 2
8 You have put all things in subjection under his feet. For in subjecting all things to him,
He left nothing that is not subject to him.

We know everything is subjected to Jesus, so the important question then becomes,
when did the Father submit the rule and authority of the creation to the King?

Squeaky, the actual timing of the subjection of the 'all things' to the Christ by the Father,
cannot be defined within a creation time frame. The subjection of creation to the Son
occurred above the creation itself, hence, this subjection event will be eternal in nature.

We need to understand that the Christ is the reigning King, in the past, in the present and
in the future. This is due to the fact that the King of Israel is God Himself.

Isaiah 6
5 Then I said, “Woe is me, for I am ruined! Because I am a man of unclean lips, And I live
among a people of unclean lips; For my eyes have seen the King, the Lord of hosts.

Isaiah 43
15 I am the Lord, your Holy One, The Creator of Israel, your King.

Isaiah 44:6
Thus says the Lord, the King of Israel and his Redeemer, the Lord of hosts
‘I am the first and I am the last, And there is no God besides Me.

Israel's subjection was to the King, i.e., the Creator, the subjection of 'all things'
was also to the King and God of creation. There is no distinction between Jesus
the King of Israel, and the Creator God of Israel.

Matthew 2
2 Where is He who has been born King of the Jews?

Matthew 27
11 Now Jesus stood before the governor, and the governor questioned Him, saying,
“Are You the King of the Jews?” And Jesus said to him, “It is as you say.”

Matthew 27
29 And after twisting together a crown of thorns, they put it on His head, and a reed in
His right hand; and they knelt down before Him and mocked Him, saying, “Hail, King of the Jews!”

I said
I don't understand you. Your claim can only be accomplished if one does away with this verse. But the verse is still there.

http://ebible.com/query?utf=8✓&quer...e=http://www.talkjesus.com/pages.php?pageid=1Heb 2:8
8 You have put all things in subjection under his feet." For in that He put all in subjection under him, He left nothing that is not put under him. But now we do not yet see all things put under him.

I guess some are going to do it your way. But they will answer for it on the day of judgment. What you say will happen but it hasn't happened yet. I don't think you understand how the Word of God works. God can claim something now for later. But one needs the Holy Spirit to understand this. God can say that things exist now that don't. But again it takes the Holy Spirit to know this.

Rom 4:17
17 (as it is written, "I have made you a father of many nations") in the presence of Him whom he believed-- God, who gives life to the dead and calls those things which do not exist as though they did;
(NKJ)

 

[Taylor Barrett]

"No one has ever seen God, but the one and only Son, who is himself God and is in closest relationship with the Father, has made him known."

"Jesus said to them, "Truly, truly, I say to you, before Abraham was born, I am."

"The word was God...the word became flesh"


"Then he said to Thomas,“Put your finger here, and see my hands; and put out your hand, and place it in my side. Do not disbelieve, but believe.” Thomas answered him, “My Lord and my God!” Jesus said to him, “Have you believed because you have seen me? Blessed are those who have not seen and yet have believed.”

"waiting for our blessed hope, the appearing of the glory of our great God and Savior Jesus Christ,"

"Behold, I am coming quickly, and My reward is with Me, to render to every man according to what he has done. "I am the Alpha and the Omega, the first and the last, the beginning and the end."

"But of the Son he says,= “Your throne, O God, is forever and ever,
the scepter of uprightness is the scepter of your kingdom."

 

[DHC]

I said
I don't understand you. Your claim can only be accomplished if one does away with this verse. But the verse is still there.
Heb 2:8
8 You have put all things in subjection under his feet." For in that He put all in subjection under him, He left nothing that is not put under him. But now we do not yet see all things put under him.

I guess some are going to do it your way

Hello Squeaky.

Your understanding or interpretation of the following verse appears to be inaccurate Squeaky.

Hebrews 2
8 You have put all things in subjection under his feet. For in subjecting all things to him, He left
nothing that is not subject to him. But now we do not yet see all things subjected to him.

You are reading this crucial verse, the subjection of all things to the Christ, as a future event.

Your reading the verse as saying, the creation is not yet subjected to the authority of the Christ
until some future time. The rule of the Christ over the 'all things' has not as yet happened.

So when you apply this same method of interpretation to others verses, such as the one below.

Colossians 1
13 For He rescued us from the domain of darkness, and transferred us to the kingdom of
His beloved Son

You see the rescue and the transfer of the believers into this Kingdom of the Son, as an event
that is yet to happen. This future event, this transfer has not occurred yet, because you see the
'all things subjected to Him' as some future event, not as yet fulfilled. Jesus has, as yet not recieved
authority over the kingdom.

This verse (Colossians 1:13) talks in the past tense Squeaky, 'for He rescued us' this has already
taken place. The Son is the King of this heavenly kingdom and that is a past tense event!

That is why Paul talks in the past tense when he says the following.

Colossians 3
1 Therefore if you have been raised up with Christ, keep seeking the things above, where Christ is,
seated at the right hand of God.

Past tense Squeaky, 'you have been', not future tense. The transfer of the subjects to the reign of the
King or Lord, has already occurred.

Jesus and His rule is in the past, present and future, and the King of heaven and earth's reign, is in
the past, present and future.

Colossians 1
16 For by Him all things were created, both in the heavens and on earth, visible and invisible,
whether thrones or dominions or rulers or authorities—all things have been created through
Him and for Him.

All creation was channeled through the Christ and all creation exists solely for the Christ.

You were created for Jesus Christ.

How can you possibly call Jesus the Lord, unless you recognize His sovereignty over all?

1 Corinthians 12
3 Therefore I make known to you that no one speaking by the Spirit of God says,
“Jesus is accursed”; and no one can say, “Jesus is Lord,” except by the Holy Spirit.

Calling Jesus 'the Lord' means you recognize that Jesus is the King of all creation.

'all things have been created through Him and for Him'

Your existence is subject to the Christ and you have been created for the Christ.

A Christian is a believer in the Christ, that is what the definition of a Christian is Squeaky.

A Christian is a person who believes that Jesus is Lord!

Colossians 2
10 and in Him you have been made complete, and He is the head over all rule and authority

Colossians 2
15 When He had disarmed the rulers and authorities, He made a public display of them,
having triumphed over them through Him.

Past tense Squeaky, 'triumphed', Jesus is the Lord of the creation and was the Lord at the
very beginning of the creation. Jesus will also be the Lord of the created order at the very
end of 'all things'.

Romans 10
9 that if you confess with your mouth Jesus as Lord

Jesus is Lord and King of all things, this truth is the very core of the Gospel itself Squeaky.

 

[post]

JESUS IS NOT GOD

it is all very clearly written for any of us who are not too blind to read:
John 1
1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.
2 The same was in the beginning with God.
3 All things were made by him; and without him was not any thing made that was made.
4 In him was life; and the life was the light of men.
5 And the light shineth in darkness; and the darkness comprehended it not.

. . .

14 And the Word was made flesh, and dwelt among us, (and we beheld his glory, the glory as of the only begotten of the Father,) full of grace and truth.


don't like it? take it up with the apostle, or better yet try and argue with Jesus Christ, the Word of God, the only begotten Son.

 

[Chad]

JESUS IS NOT GOD

Nonsense. Nothing else I could honestly say but that.

 

[Cosmicwaffle]

How do you deny the Trinity? Read John chapter 1, it's all right there. The word became flesh.

Let's also not forget Isaiah 9:6

For to us a child is born, to us a son is given, and the government will be on his shoulders. And he will be called Wonderful Counselor, Mighty God, Everlasting Father, Prince of Peace.

Jesus is both the son and the father. Beginning and the end. They are one, not seperate.

 

[Cosmicwaffle]

If God decreed in eternity past that he has always been and would become the son of God and the spirit of God, and have a relationship with himself, who could deny him the right and privilege? You can't. It may not make sense to us, but that's what makes God God, and humans human. Jesus Christ is God, and God is Jesus Christ.

John 14:6-11
6 Jesus answered, “I am the way and the truth and the life. No one comes to the Father except through me. 7 If you really know me, you will know my Father as well. From now on, you do know him and have seen him.”
8 Philip said, “Lord, show us the Father and that will be enough for us.”
9 Jesus answered: “Don’t you know me, Philip, even after I have been among you such a long time? Anyone who has seen me has seen the Father. How can you say, ‘Show us the Father’? 10 Don’t you believe that I am in the Father, and that the Father is in me? The words I say to you I do not speak on my own authority. Rather, it is the Father, living in me, who is doing his work. 11 Believe me when I say that I am in the Father and the Father is in me; or at least believe on the evidence of the works themselves.