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Only One God The Father

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How do you deny the Trinity? Read John chapter 1, it's all right there. The word became flesh.

Let's also not forget Isaiah 9:6

For to us a child is born, to us a son is given, and the government will be on his shoulders. And he will be called Wonderful Counselor, Mighty God, Everlasting Father, Prince of Peace.

Jesus is both the son and the father. Beginning and the end. They are one, not separate.

There are three persons in the Godhead:

Matthew 3
15 But Jesus answered him, "Let it be so now, for thus it is fitting for us to fulfill all righteousness." Then he consented. 16 And when Jesus was baptized, immediately he went up from the water, and behold, the heavens were opened to him, and he saw the Spirit of God descending like a dove and coming to rest on him; 17 and behold, a voice from heaven said, "This is my beloved Son, with whom I am well pleased."

The three are one in substance, but are most definitely three distinct persons. There's an old image that doesn't do it justice, but is at least helpful:

1959469_10152041965730764_205168136638340166_n.jpg
 
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There are three persons in the Godhead:
Matthew 3
15 But Jesus answered him, "Let it be so now, for thus it is fitting for us to fulfill all righteousness." Then he consented. 16 And when Jesus was baptized, immediately he went up from the water, and behold, the heavens were opened to him, and he saw the Spirit of God descending like a dove and coming to rest on him; 17 and behold, a voice from heaven said, "This is my beloved Son, with whom I am well pleased."

The three are one in substance, but are most definitely three distinct persons. There an old image that doesn't do it justice, but is at least helpful:
Yes I understand that. But Jesus and the father are one. That means they are the same, you cannot separate the two. You cannot have God without Jesus, and you cannot have Jesus without God.
 
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Yes I understand that. But Jesus and the father are one. That means they are the same, you cannot separate the two. You cannot have God without Jesus, and you cannot have Jesus without God.

Does "one" mean inseparably the same, as in not the slightest distinction? If so, then Jesus prayed you and I and every other believer would be identically the same person. Then… essentially you and I would cease to be you and I, but instead be one single person. I don't think that's the case. The logic doesn't add up. The book of Revelation tells us that those who overcome will be given a stone with a name written in it that no one else knows. I'm a separate and distinct person from you and always will be.

John 17
1 When Jesus had spoken these words, he lifted up his eyes to heaven, and said, "Father, the hour has come; glorify your Son that the Son may glorify you, 2 since you have given him authority over all flesh, to give eternal life to all whom you have given him. 3 And this is eternal life, that they know you the only true God, and Jesus Christ whom you have sent. 4 I glorified you on earth, having accomplished the work that you gave me to do. 5 And now, Father, glorify me in your own presence with the glory that I had with you before the world existed. 6 "I have manifested your name to the people whom you gave me out of the world. Yours they were, and you gave them to me, and they have kept your word. 7 Now they know that everything that you have given me is from you. 8 For I have given them the words that you gave me, and they have received them and have come to know in truth that I came from you; and they have believed that you sent me. 9 I am praying for them. I am not praying for the world but for those whom you have given me, for they are yours. 10 All mine are yours, and yours are mine, and I am glorified in them. 11 And I am no longer in the world, but they are in the world, and I am coming to you. Holy Father, keep them in your name, which you have given me, that they may be one, even as we are one. 12 While I was with them, I kept them in your name, which you have given me. I have guarded them, and not one of them has been lost except the son of destruction, that the Scripture might be fulfilled. 13 But now I am coming to you, and these things I speak in the world, that they may have my joy fulfilled in themselves. 14 I have given them your word, and the world has hated them because they are not of the world, just as I am not of the world. 15 I do not ask that you take them out of the world, but that you keep them from the evil one. 16 They are not of the world, just as I am not of the world. 17 Sanctify them in the truth; your word is truth. 18 As you sent me into the world, so I have sent them into the world. 19 And for their sake I consecrate myself, that they also may be sanctified in truth. 20 "I do not ask for these only, but also for those who will believe in me through their word, 21 that they may all be one, just as you, Father, are in me, and I in you, that they also may be in us, so that the world may believe that you have sent me. 22 The glory that you have given me I have given to them, that they may be one even as we are one, 23 I in them and you in me, that they may become perfectly one, so that the world may know that you sent me and loved them even as you loved me. 24 Father, I desire that they also, whom you have given me, may be with me where I am, to see my glory that you have given me because you loved me before the foundation of the world. 25 O righteous Father, even though the world does not know you, I know you, and these know that you have sent me. 26 I made known to them your name, and I will continue to make it known, that the love with which you have loved me may be in them, and I in them."​

Just reading this chapter makes it very plain. Jesus was not praying to himself, he was praying to his Father.

"And now, Father, glorify me in your own presence with the glory that I had with you before the world existed."​

Two persons, the Father and the Son. The Son existed (as the Son) before the world existed.

"and I am coming to you"​

The fact that he is going to come to the Father (future), implies that he is not with the Father currently (at the time he said this). There is a distinction between the two persons.

"that they may be one, even as we are one."​
"that they may be one even as we are one, 23 I in them and you in me, that they may become perfectly one,"​

Perhaps there is a more clear way to understand what it means to be "one" with someone than to say they are actually one and the same person, just with different names one can call them by.

Travis
 
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DHC

Hello Squeaky.

Your missing in action, please respond as there is so much more to cover concerning the King.
 
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John (14:9)
Genesis (1:29)
Isaiah (9:6)
Isaiah (43:10-11)
John (1:1)
John (8:24)
If you don't believe Jesus and God are the same after reading these then take a look at this verse below!
John (3:18)
 
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I read this whole thread and still am confused as to what merit it has.

Let's suppose that The Lord is not God.

Does it:
1. Invalidate His ultimate sacrifice on the cross?

2. Make His claim in John 4:14 "...but whoever drinks of the water that I will give him will never be thirsty again." not true?

3. Provide another alternative other than John 14:6 ?

4. Somehow enable us to *not* follow Him and have a nice life and afterlife?

5. Enable us to escape His Judgement to come?

6. Give us an excuse not to be excited about what He has done in our lives?

7. Causes God to withheld all powers and authority over heaven and earth from Him?

No.

So instead of us slinging verses to each other -- as if that is proven effective in sharing the perspectives we get from The Holy Spirit, let us rejoice in His Majesty, Power, and Authority.

Personally, I believe that Lord Jesus is the only begotten Son of God. And that He cannot be *not* God.
He is just too cool / authoritative / awesome / loving / faithful / powerful / just / compassionate / magnificent / graceful / merciful *not* to be God.

It's Christmas season, let us all praise our Prince of Peace, Wonderful Counselor, and Mighty King.
 
Member
I read this whole thread and still am confused as to what merit it has.

Let's suppose that The Lord is not God.

Does it:
1. Invalidate His ultimate sacrifice on the cross?

2. Make His claim in John 4:14 "...but whoever drinks of the water that I will give him will never be thirsty again." not true?

3. Provide another alternative other than John 14:6 ?

4. Somehow enable us to *not* follow Him and have a nice life and afterlife?

5. Enable us to escape His Judgement to come?

6. Give us an excuse not to be excited about what He has done in our lives?

7. Causes God to withheld all powers and authority over heaven and earth from Him?

No.

So instead of us slinging verses to each other -- as if that is proven effective in sharing the perspectives we get from The Holy Spirit, let us rejoice in His Majesty, Power, and Authority.

Personally, I believe that Lord Jesus is the only begotten Son of God. And that He cannot be *not* God.
He is just too cool / authoritative / awesome / loving / faithful / powerful / just / compassionate / magnificent / graceful / merciful *not* to be God.

It's Christmas season, let us all praise our Prince of Peace, Wonderful Counselor, and Mighty King.

Mighty God

"For to us a child is born, to us a son is given, and the government will be on his shoulders. And he will be called Wonderful Counselor, Mighty God, Everlasting Father, Prince of Peace." Isaiah 9:6


Praise the Lord!
 
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RJ

Mighty God

"For to us a child is born, to us a son is given, and the government will be on his shoulders. And he will be called Wonderful Counselor, Mighty God, Everlasting Father, Prince of Peace." Isaiah 9:6


Praise the Lord!
Praise God from whom all blessings flow
Praise him above all creatures here and below
Praise him above the heavenly host
Praise him father , son and holy Gost!
 
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