Here's a Riddle

[Bendito]

2 Thessalonians 2:6-10King James Version (KJV)

6 And now ye know what withholdeth that he might be revealed in his time.

7 For the mystery of iniquity doth already work: only he who now letteth will let, until he be taken out of the way.

8 And then shall that Wicked be revealed, whom the Lord shall consume with the spirit of his mouth, and shall destroy with the brightness of his coming:

9 Even him, whose coming is after the working of Satan with all power and signs and lying wonders,

10 And with all deceivableness of unrighteousness in them that perish; because they received not the love of the truth, that they might be saved.

The question is; Who is "he that letteth"?

Wow! There is some awesome discussion here. And such a good question too. LOL

At this point I will submit my answer to the question. See what you think....

I believe that the 'one that letteth' is not the Holy Spirit because in the tribulation period following nobody could be saved because no one is saved without the Holy Spirit draws them. Already said..Right
I believe that he that letteth is the bride, the one new man mentioned in Ephesians 2:15 (the manchild if you will) I believe that the woman talked of in Revelation 12 is the church....giving "birth" to the bride


The Bride of Christ


It is a widespread and common misconception among Christians that the bride of Christ and the Church are synonymous. The bride of Christ is not the Church, contrary to popular belief and teaching. It is true that the Church is the body of Christ, and the entire Church has been espoused or engaged to Christ, but every member of the Church will not be the bride of Christ. Faith in Christ is necessary to be in the Church, but faithfulness to Christ is necessary to be the bride of Christ.

The Church and the body of Christ are one and the same (Eph. 1:22-23), but no Scripture equates either one of these groups of Christians with the bride of Christ. Tradition is responsible for this doctrinal error, and tradition is a worthy opponent for anyone attempting to replace it with Scriptural truth.

The Church consists of all spiritually regenerated people from Pentecost to the end of the Age of Grace, which will end with the Firstfruits Rapture of the bride and her court. John the Baptist was not a member of the Church, since he died before Pentecost. Since the bride comes out of the Church, he could not be a member of the bride, and he even referred to himself as a “friend of the bridegroom” (John 3:29).

In 2 Corinthians 11:2-3 (KJV) Paul tells the Corinthians that he has “espoused” them to Christ:

For I am jealous over you with godly jealousy: for I have espoused you to one husband, that I may present [you as] a chaste virgin to Christ. But I fear, lest by any means, as the serpent beguiled Eve through his subtilty, so your minds should be corrupted from the simplicity that is in Christ.

Espoused means betrothed or engaged, and Paul clarifies his statement by saying that he desires to present them as a chaste (i.e., pure) virgin, but he is afraid that their minds would be led astray from sincere and pure devotion to Christ. This Scripture clearly states that sincere and pure devotion to Christ is a prerequisite for being presented as the chaste bride of Christ.

We know that Mary was betrothed to Joseph, and his intent was to “put her away” when he thought she had been unfaithful. There will be numerous Christians who will be put away or disqualified as the bride of Christ at the First fruits Rapture.

Paul compared the Christian life to a race where all run, but only one receives the “prize”. Paul was fearful that he would become a “castaway” so he worked diligently to keep his body in subjection:

Know ye not that they which run in a race run all, but one receiveth the prize? So run, that ye may obtain. And every man that striveth for the mastery is temperate in all things. Now they do it to obtain a corruptible crown; but we an incorruptible. I therefore so run, not as uncertainly; so fight I, not as one that beateth the air: But I keep under my body, and bring [it] into subjection: lest that by any means, when I have preached to others, I myself should be a castaway. (1 Cor 9:24-27 KJV)

In chapter three of Philippians, Paul talks about losing all things so that he might “gain Christ.” He also says that he wants to “know Christ and the power of his resurrection and the fellowship of sharing in his sufferings, becoming like him in his death, and so, somehow, to attain to the resurrection from the dead.” The resurrection Paul is talking about in this passage of Scripture is something that is earned. The usual transliterated Greek word for resurrection is anastasis. The Greek word used in Philippians 3:11 is exanastasis. The word literally means the out-resurrection from among the dead. This is the only place this Greek word is found in the Bible. It refers to a partial resurrection of Christians who have attained to a certain standard. Hebrews 11:35 calls it the “better resurrection” (Women received their dead raised to life again: and others were tortured, not accepting deliverance; that they might obtain a better resurrection and it is also related to works. In this passage of Scripture Paul emphasizes that he is working very hard to win the “prize”, which is in Christ Jesus. The prize is clearly the highest reward that a believer can receive for faithful, spirit-filled service in the Lord’s work. The Scriptures are replete with types, parables and doctrinal statements that express the honor and blessing attached to those who attend the wedding of the Lord Jesus Christ.

The Scriptures also attach shame and reproof to those Christians who have not prepared for themselves a wedding garment (Mat. 22:1-14). The wedding garment represents the good works that pass through the judgment fire at the Judgment Seat of Christ. It is clear from these Scriptures that being selected as the bride of Christ was Paul’s goal for himself and for as many Christians as Paul could persuade to make the supreme sacrifice of self.

The Church and the Bride are not the same. The Scriptures confirm that the bride of Christ comes out of the body of Christ. They also give the Biblical criteria for being a member of the bride of Christ. As stated above, pure and sincere devotion to Christ is one of the criteria. Preparing for oneself a wedding garment of good works is another criterion. It is also required that a Christian be found watching at the time of the Firstfruits Rapture of the Church. The bride of Christ will come from those Christians that are longing for the Return of Christ. They will be among the Five Wise Virgins that have trimmed their lamps and beckoned for the Lord’s return at the midnight hour. The bride of Christ will be among the watchful and waiting Christians anxious for the Lord to return for them. She has separated herself from the cares of this world, and the riches of this world do not deceive her. The Main Body of the Church does not see her as worthy, and it may even see her as being eccentric, fanatical or even too heavenly minded to be of any earthly good.

The first bride in Scripture was Eve and her origin (Gen. 2:22-23) is well known among Christians, but few understand the prophetic significance of her origin. The different methods for the creation of Adam and Eve were for a reason. Adam is a type of Christ, and just as Adam’s bride was taken out of his body, Christ’s bride will be taken out of his body, the Church. Eve was made from a small portion of Adam’s body. She was made out of one rib and the flesh attached to that rib. The type is accurate for the bride of Christ, since the bride of Christ will come from a very small portion of the body of Christ. Adam was put to sleep before his side was opened. Christ was also put to sleep before his side was pierced and blood and water poured out. The blood represents the salvation of the spirit, which is by grace. The water represents the salvation of the life, which is a work and is attained by the washing of water by the Word (Eph. 5:25-27). Thus, the bride of Christ must “be born of water and the spirit.” Many in the Church are not “born of water”, since they do not avail themselves of the cleansing that Jesus is now providing as our High Priest (1 John 1:9), and they do not study the Bible and apply it to their lives. The bride of Christ will come out of those who not only see the kingdom (John 3:3), but those who enter the kingdom (John 3:5). The bride will be at the highest level in reigning and ruling with Jesus Christ. The Four Living Creatures in Revelation represent her. The bride will share the throne of Jesus Christ—unlike the 24 elders that have their own thrones and occupy the second level in the kingdom of the heavens.

The bride of Christ constantly confesses her sin, is filled or controlled by the Holy Spirit and performs righteous deeds that prevent her from being put away because of her unfaithfulness. Just as Ruth (Book of Ruth) did before she met Boaz, the bride washes herself, anoints herself with oil and dresses herself in the wedding garment of good works. The bride has made herself ready, just as the following Scripture confirms:

(Rev 19:7-8 NASB) (7) "Let us rejoice and be glad and give the glory to Him, for the marriage of the Lamb has come and His bride has made herself ready." (8) And it was given to her to clothe herself in fine linen, bright and clean; for the fine linen is the righteous acts of the saints.

The bride of Christ remains faithful to Christ until the end, and she has the pure and sincere devotion that qualifies her for the prize of the high calling of God, which is to be presented as the bride of Christ

Your thoughts?

 

[Bendito]

Incorrect. There is NO seven year tribulation period. This is merely the teachings of groupthink amongst TV evangelist types.
Paul is clearly talking about what was to become in the future - that Man of Sin usurping the authority of God [Jesus] as head of the Church,
can be no other than Papal Rome. The revealing may well also correspond to the Reformation which Martin Luther began.
The early Protestant Faiths were pretty unanimous in identifying the Popes as the Anti-Christ of Revelation and elsewhere in the Scriptures.

Here Waggles Chew on these and pray about them. Let me know what you think

Matthew 24:21- For then shall be great tribulation, such as was not since the beginning of the world to this time, no, nor ever shall be.

Daniel 12:1- And at that time shall Michael stand up, the great prince which standeth for the children of thy people: and there shall be a time of trouble, such as never was since there was a nation [even] to that same time: and at that time thy people shall be delivered, every one that shall be found written in the book.

Matthew 24:29- Immediately after the tribulation of those days shall the sun be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken:

Revelation 7:14- And I said unto him, Sir, thou knowest. And he said to me, These are they which came out of great tribulation, and have washed their robes, and made them white in the blood of the Lamb.

Matthew 24:22- And except those days should be shortened, there should no flesh be saved: but for the elect's sake those days shall be shortened.

Revelation 13:1-18- And I stood upon the sand of the sea, and saw a beast rise up out of the sea, having seven heads and ten horns, and upon his horns ten crowns, and upon his heads the name of blasphemy. (Read More...)

Daniel 9:27- And he shall confirm the covenant with many for one week: and in the midst of the week he shall cause the sacrifice and the oblation to cease, and for the overspreading of abominations he shall make [it] desolate, even until the consummation, and that determined shall be poured upon the desolate.

Also study Mark 13

 

[Itz Me]

Wow! There is some awesome discussion here. And such a good question too. LOL

Before I give Comment to your own explanation of the Bride, I noticed that I neglected to offer a more specific answer to your original 'riddle'. What/Who is "HE who now letteth will let"?, (2Thess 2:7):
--
What entity was it? What had to be taken away before the man of sin could come to power? Plainly, Paul was referring to the powers of civil authority. It was these "elemental [human] spirits" which were hindering the rise of the Anti-Christ.

There is a power of some sort holding back the mystery of iniquity. The word "let" in verse 7 means to "withhold" as in verse 6 is the Greek word "katecho." In verse 6 is "withholdeth".
Romans 13:1-5 explains to us that the authority to govern are put in the world to restrain evil and are from God, (not governments that oppose justice or God). “For rulers are not a terror to good works, but to evil; "For he is God's minister to you for good. But if you do evil, be afraid; for he does not bear the sword in vain; for he is God's minister, an avenger to execute wrath on him who practices evil”, Rom 13:4)

So in a certain sense they are part of what restrains the evil. However no government, (elemental human spirits), can fully restrain evil. In the end it's lawlessness run by the man of lawlessness, (sin) overwhelms the the governments of the world.

"Woe unto them that call evil good, and good evil; that put darkness for light, and light for darkness; that put bitter for sweet, and sweet for bitter!", Isaiah 5:20 .

I've often commented that we're living in an age of "AFRAIDS". Of course, we all know that AIDS is the abbreviation for 'Acquired Immune Deficiency Syndrome'. Yet, there’s something equally devouring which I’ve named with the acronym of "AFRAIDS" ... 'A Fear Related [to the] Acquired Immune Deficiency [of the human] Spirit'.

‘AFRAIDS’ could perhaps be better understood by the illustration of physicists who tell us that everything from protons to sub-atomic particles have both an inner and outer aspect; what we might name as 'spirit matter'. The collective profundity of the evil behind the ‘domination system’ is that it simultaneously manifests itself as both physical and spiritual.

We’re indeed living in a time when a confluence of stimuli are increasingly afflicting us with ‘AFRAIDS’. From a very early age, we're induced to seek intense emotive and psychological drama. By the time we reached early adult years, this desire had matured to become an addiction. Not surprisingly, we find ourselves craving the invented stimuli of suspense, anxiety, fear, disquiet and a host of other emotional responses.
In ancient days, the people largely depended on cave drawings and physical idols fulfill their inherent lust for stimulation. These have all been replaced in our days by mass media of every sort.
However, the manipulative stimuli of our day is far more persuasive and hypnotizing; exceedingly more addictive than of ancient days … even more so than a mere 20 years ago! The effectiveness of its cultural and societal influence cannot be downplayed. For instance, when we were young teens, our heroes were mostly imaged by caricatures of harmless animals or cartoons. in these days, children from a very young age find corporate Logos much more meaningful and recognizable than cartoon characters.

But as I mentioned earlier, the birth of our modern cities and the dominating powers behind them goes back to Uruk in Mesopotamia, 4th millennium BC; and other great cities like Ninevah, Khorsbad, Nimrud, Babylon and so on. The city was the center of political and religious culture. Its walls were not only physical but also spiritual; thereby giving the pretense of form, purpose and meaning to man's alienated existence. Cities exist as symbols of a pervading domination system which violently compels to subjugate and control in order to sustain itself. This also explains why violence adorns its very core.

From the times of Cain, Nimrod, and through to Babylon, (including our present day), the city represents a desire to violently dominate and destroy man for the sake of human works. At the moment that Cain decided to "build himself a city", he had entered into a personal reverse-metamorphosis which would ultimately have him sanctify, justify and glorify the violence against the inherent values and treasures of the human spirit.

In spite of all the boastful piety from the leaders of the so-called religious-right, they remain completely ignorant of the dramatic meaning behind Cain's desire to build himself a city. Not unlike earthly Jerusalem, Cain's city too is a visible image of an invisible reality. By its very construct, Cain's city was fundamentally a counter-creation possessing a negative spiritual identity ... a counterfeit reality. Cain's city has spiritual significance because it's capable of directing and changing a man's inner being and value. It brings its domination powers to bear in man and swallows up his life, (his entire being, not simply his 'house'). And that is both the fearful legacy of Cain and also its fearful mystery.

The Libertarians too are constantly boasting about having an ‘open mind’. However, any concept of a genuinely freed mind completely escapes them. Perhaps it may be sufficient for some to have open minded rebels among us. But our troubled world is demanding something more than mere rebels; it's in desperate need of daring revolutionaries! Revolutionaries whose minds are trained to think outside-the-box; equipped to triumph above the voices of the clamoring clones and their empty discourses. Only revolutionaries are capable of peering beyond the suffocating ideologies and murky thought-worlds of the poisonous frauds among us.

The defeat of the 'domination system' can only occur by our refusing it's controlling powers; by becoming immune to its jurisdiction and command. This is the only way that we can unmask our oppressors. We must determine to abandon our sense of hopelessness, fatalism … our acquiescence to our own despoiling. Only then can there be the gospel orientated revolutionary change that is so urgently needed in these most troubling days.

 

[Bendito]

Before I give Comment to your own explanation of the Bride, I noticed that I neglected to offer a more specific answer to your original 'riddle'. What/Who is "HE who now letteth will let"?, (2Thess 2:7):
--
What entity was it? What had to be taken away before the man of sin could come to power? Plainly, Paul was referring to the powers of civil authority. It was these "elemental [human] spirits" which were hindering the rise of the Anti-Christ.

There is a power of some sort holding back the mystery of iniquity. The word "let" in verse 7 means to "withhold" as in verse 6 is the Greek word "katecho." In verse 6 is "withholdeth".
Romans 13:1-5 explains to us that the authority to govern are put in the world to restrain evil and are from God, (not governments that oppose justice or God). “For rulers are not a terror to good works, but to evil; "For he is God's minister to you for good. But if you do evil, be afraid; for he does not bear the sword in vain; for he is God's minister, an avenger to execute wrath on him who practices evil”, Rom 13:4)

So in a certain sense they are part of what restrains the evil. However no government, (elemental human spirits), can fully restrain evil. In the end it's lawlessness run by the man of lawlessness, (sin) overwhelms the the governments of the world.

"Woe unto them that call evil good, and good evil; that put darkness for light, and light for darkness; that put bitter for sweet, and sweet for bitter!", Isaiah 5:20 .

I've often commented that we're living in an age of "AFRAIDS". Of course, we all know that AIDS is the abbreviation for 'Acquired Immune Deficiency Syndrome'. Yet, there’s something equally devouring which I’ve named with the acronym of "AFRAIDS" ... 'A Fear Related [to the] Acquired Immune Deficiency [of the human] Spirit'.

‘AFRAIDS’ could perhaps be better understood by the illustration of physicists who tell us that everything from protons to sub-atomic particles have both an inner and outer aspect; what we might name as 'spirit matter'. The collective profundity of the evil behind the ‘domination system’ is that it simultaneously manifests itself as both physical and spiritual.

We’re indeed living in a time when a confluence of stimuli are increasingly afflicting us with ‘AFRAIDS’. From a very early age, we're induced to seek intense emotive and psychological drama. By the time we reached early adult years, this desire had matured to become an addiction. Not surprisingly, we find ourselves craving the invented stimuli of suspense, anxiety, fear, disquiet and a host of other emotional responses.
In ancient days, the people largely depended on cave drawings and physical idols fulfill their inherent lust for stimulation. These have all been replaced in our days by mass media of every sort.
However, the manipulative stimuli of our day is far more persuasive and hypnotizing; exceedingly more addictive than of ancient days … even more so than a mere 20 years ago! The effectiveness of its cultural and societal influence cannot be downplayed. For instance, when we were young teens, our heroes were mostly imaged by caricatures of harmless animals or cartoons. in these days, children from a very young age find corporate Logos much more meaningful and recognizable than cartoon characters.

But as I mentioned earlier, the birth of our modern cities and the dominating powers behind them goes back to Uruk in Mesopotamia, 4th millennium BC; and other great cities like Ninevah, Khorsbad, Nimrud, Babylon and so on. The city was the center of political and religious culture. Its walls were not only physical but also spiritual; thereby giving the pretense of form, purpose and meaning to man's alienated existence. Cities exist as symbols of a pervading domination system which violently compels to subjugate and control in order to sustain itself. This also explains why violence adorns its very core.

From the times of Cain, Nimrod, and through to Babylon, (including our present day), the city represents a desire to violently dominate and destroy man for the sake of human works. At the moment that Cain decided to "build himself a city", he had entered into a personal reverse-metamorphosis which would ultimately have him sanctify, justify and glorify the violence against the inherent values and treasures of the human spirit.

In spite of all the boastful piety from the leaders of the so-called religious-right, they remain completely ignorant of the dramatic meaning behind Cain's desire to build himself a city. Not unlike earthly Jerusalem, Cain's city too is a visible image of an invisible reality. By its very construct, Cain's city was fundamentally a counter-creation possessing a negative spiritual identity ... a counterfeit reality. Cain's city has spiritual significance because it's capable of directing and changing a man's inner being and value. It brings its domination powers to bear in man and swallows up his life, (his entire being, not simply his 'house'). And that is both the fearful legacy of Cain and also its fearful mystery.

The Libertarians too are constantly boasting about having an ‘open mind’. However, any concept of a genuinely freed mind completely escapes them. Perhaps it may be sufficient for some to have open minded rebels among us. But our troubled world is demanding something more than mere rebels; it's in desperate need of daring revolutionaries! Revolutionaries whose minds are trained to think outside-the-box; equipped to triumph above the voices of the clamoring clones and their empty discourses. Only revolutionaries are capable of peering beyond the suffocating ideologies and murky thought-worlds of the poisonous frauds among us.

The defeat of the 'domination system' can only occur by our refusing it's controlling powers; by becoming immune to its jurisdiction and command. This is the only way that we can unmask our oppressors. We must determine to abandon our sense of hopelessness, fatalism … our acquiescence to our own despoiling. Only then can there be the gospel orientated revolutionary change that is so urgently needed in these most troubling days.

I think though that this would be Satan fighting against Satan as Jesus mentioned in the gospels when they accused Him of casting out demons with the authority of Beelzebub. We live under the Babylonian system in this world, though thankfully Christians are not subject to Satan's system. We Christians are in charge in this world, not Satan.

 

[Itz Me]

I think though that this would be Satan fighting against Satan as Jesus mentioned in the gospels when they accused Him of casting out demons with the authority of Beelzebub. We live under the Babylonian system in this world, though thankfully Christians are not subject to Satan's system. We Christians are in charge in this world, not Satan.

Hi! 'Bendito'

Satan is the current god of this world. Satan is a spirit conspirator manipulating the world by deception and by fostering the spirit of disobedience. While on this Earth, Christ admitted that someone other than himself was the current ruler of the world.
Jesus said, "My kingdom is not of this world. If it were, my servants would fight to prevent my arrest by the Jews. But now my kingdom is from another place", (John 18:36)

Paul identified who was the god of this world and warned his followers that it was Satan who blinded the world to the glorious gospel of Christ. 2 Corinthians 4:3, "But if our gospel be hid, it is hid to them that are lost: In whom the god of this world hath blinded the minds of them which believe not, lest the light of the glorious gospel of Christ, who is the image of God, should shine unto them. For we preach not ourselves, but Christ Jesus the Lord; and ourselves your servants for Jesus' sake".

Paul preached to the Ephesians that mankind's true battle is against Satan and his demons. "Put on the whole armor of God, that ye may be able to stand against the wiles of the devil. For we wrestle not against flesh and blood, but against principalities, against powers, against the rulers of the darkness of this world, against spiritual wickedness in high places. Wherefore take unto you the whole armor of God, that ye may be able to withstand in the evil day, and having done all, to stand", (Eph 6:11).

Peter stated that a Christian's enemy is the devil. "Be self-controlled and alert. Your enemy the devil prowls around like a roaring lion looking for someone to devour. Resist him, standing firm in the faith, because you know that your brothers throughout the world are undergoing the same kind of sufferings", (1Peter 5:8).

 

[Bendito]

Hi! 'Bendito'

Satan is the current god of this world. Satan is a spirit conspirator manipulating the world by deception and by fostering the spirit of disobedience. While on this Earth, Christ admitted that someone other than himself was the current ruler of the world.
Jesus said, "My kingdom is not of this world. If it were, my servants would fight to prevent my arrest by the Jews. But now my kingdom is from another place", (John 18:36)

Paul identified who was the god of this world and warned his followers that it was Satan who blinded the world to the glorious gospel of Christ. 2 Corinthians 4:3, "But if our gospel be hid, it is hid to them that are lost: In whom the god of this world hath blinded the minds of them which believe not, lest the light of the glorious gospel of Christ, who is the image of God, should shine unto them. For we preach not ourselves, but Christ Jesus the Lord; and ourselves your servants for Jesus' sake".


Peter stated that a Christian's enemy is the devil. "Be self-controlled and alert. Your enemy the devil prowls around like a roaring lion looking for someone to devour. Resist him, standing firm in the faith, because you know that your brothers throughout the world are undergoing the same kind of sufferings", (1Peter 5:8).

Satan is god of this world, that's right. But!! He is not our god. Our God is God. For us Satan is a powerless, puffed up puppet of his own narcissism He's a liar who even believes his own lies.
Still, it's the bride who holds him back. The bride acting under the authority of our Jesus, praying, interceding, and doing outright warfare against this deceiver who, as you said, wants to blind mankind and take everyone he can to the Lake of fire. Ephesians 6:12
Paul preached to the Ephesians that mankind's true battle is against Satan and his demons. "Put on the whole armor of God, that ye may be able to stand against the wiles of the devil. For we wrestle not against flesh and blood, but against principalities, against powers, against the rulers of the darkness of this world, against spiritual wickedness in high places. Wherefore take unto you the whole armor of God, that ye may be able to withstand in the evil day, and having done all, to stand", (Eph 6:11).

 

[complete]

I believe that the 'one that letteth' is not the Holy Spirit because in the tribulation period following nobody could be saved because no one is saved without the Holy Spirit draws them. Already said..Right
I believe that he that letteth is the bride, the one new man mentioned in Ephesians 2:15 (the manchild if you will) I believe that the woman talked of in Revelation 12 is the church....giving "birth" to the bride

Hello Bendito,

There is nothing to warrant this suggestion in either the context of 2 Thessalonians 2, or in the rest of Scripture.

God does not mix His metaphors I agree. The Bride is one calling, The Church which is His Body is another calling, but you are not correct in your understanding of them, Bendito.

These companies of the redeemed are too precious to be the subject of debate, so I will not say more regarding them here. Tread softly, Bendito.

May God's perfect will be done in you, for His Name and glory's sake.

In Christ Jesus,
Our risen and glorified
Saviour, Lord and Head.
Chris

 

[Travis]

Matthew 22:1-22

1 And again Jesus spoke to them in parables, saying,
2 "The kingdom of heaven may be compared to a king who gave a wedding feast for his son,
3 and sent his servants to call those who were invited to the wedding feast, but they would not come.
4 Again he sent other servants, saying, 'Tell those who are invited, "See, I have prepared my dinner, my oxen and my fat calves have been slaughtered, and everything is ready. Come to the wedding feast."'
5 But they paid no attention and went off, one to his farm, another to his business,
6 while the rest seized his servants, treated them shamefully, and killed them.
7 The king was angry, and he sent his troops and destroyed those murderers and burned their city.
8 Then he said to his servants, 'The wedding feast is ready, but those invited were not worthy.
9 Go therefore to the main roads and invite to the wedding feast as many as you find.'
10 And those servants went out into the roads and gathered all whom they found, both bad and good. So the wedding hall was filled with guests.
11 "But when the king came in to look at the guests, he saw there a man who had no wedding garment.
12 And he said to him, 'Friend, how did you get in here without a wedding garment?' And he was speechless.
13 Then the king said to the attendants, 'Bind him hand and foot and cast him into the outer darkness. In that place there will be weeping and gnashing of teeth.'
14 For many are called, but few are chosen."
15 Then the Pharisees went and plotted how to entangle him in his words.
16 And they sent their disciples to him, along with the Herodians, saying, "Teacher, we know that you are true and teach the way of God truthfully, and you do not care about anyone's opinion, for you are not swayed by appearances.
17 Tell us, then, what you think. Is it lawful to pay taxes to Caesar, or not?"
18 But Jesus, aware of their malice, said, "Why put me to the test, you hypocrites?
19 Show me the coin for the tax." And they brought him a denarius.
20 And Jesus said to them, "Whose likeness and inscription is this?"
21 They said, "Caesar's." Then he said to them, "Therefore render to Caesar the things that are Caesar's, and to God the things that are God's."
22 When they heard it, they marveled. And they left him and went away.


Many things in the scriptures are very straightforward and simple. Some are not. Many times I think we all have a tendency to take simple things and make them more complicated than needs be because many parts of it are hard to swallow.

14 For many are called, but few are chosen."​

The scriptures teach election, God choosing people out of this fallen world to be saved. They also teach free will, men choosing to follow after Christ willingly in order to save themselves from the wrath to come.

Those who don't have a proper wedding garment on will be eternally separated from the Lord. They are not believers, nor are they part of the church.

There are two types of people in this world, wheat and tares. Goats and sheep. The redeemed and the unredeemed.

And those servants went out into the roads and gathered all whom they found, both bad and good. So the wedding hall was filled with guests.​

The gospel call is universal and open to all. No one people group is excluded from such. Poor and rich; big and small; male and female; Asian, Malaysian, African, South American, European, Palestinian, Jew, it does not matter. Only those who accept the precious blood of Christ as atonement for their sin will enjoy said feast though. And all who are covered in the blood of the lamb will join the Lord when he breaks the eastern sky.

Keep your eyes on the sky, for he is coming quickly. Much must happen first, but it will be worth it all when we see his blessed face.

“He which testifieth these things saith, Surely I come quickly. Amen. Even so, come, Lord Jesus. Amen.”

 

[Itz Me]

Wow! There is some awesome discussion here. And such a good question too. LOL

At this point I will submit my answer to the question. See what you think....

I believe that the 'one that letteth' is not the Holy Spirit because in the tribulation period following nobody could be saved because no one is saved without the Holy Spirit draws them. Already said..Right
I believe that he that letteth is the bride, the one new man mentioned in Ephesians 2:15 (the manchild if you will) I believe that the woman talked of in Revelation 12 is the church....giving "birth" to the bride .....

Hi! 'Bendito'
You wrote:
" I believe that he that letteth is the bride, the one new man mentioned in Ephesians 2:15 (the manchild if you will) I believe that the woman talked of in Revelation 12 is the church....giving "birth" to the bride"
If you don't mind me being forthright, this above seems to me to be a rather convoluted and labyrinthine conclusion. "

Earthly marriage was established by God to foreshadow the spiritual reality behind God's ultimate purposes and intents with mankind,(Rom 1:18-27). in other words: marriage is an earthly picture of a heavenly reality.

Amos 4:13 tells us that, "God, declareth unto man what is His thought". While we are presently unable to be entirely complete the mind of God, the Scriptures do however offer valuable insights. For instance, we can, from the works of God, construct the original plan of God pertaining to marriage.

While it's true that the future humanity as 'bride' remains largely 'veiled', (because its full essence is hidden in God), nevertheless, the bride is now being revealed publicly as the "Lamb's wife" and, as such, she has been completely accepted by the Creator.

We Christians desperately need to understand that marriage was born in the heart of God; in His being and from the depths of God. John 1:1 says, "In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. The same was in the beginning with God. All things were made by Him, and without Him was not anything made that was made". In God "the Word" was formed and that 'word' is the substance of all things which were to be.

God worked on a plan. In His inner self a fantastically marvelous idea evolved; a thought containing all. And it was with God. It was hidden with God as a yet an unspoken thought. The word was with God; the word was God. That plan, that unspoken word, is what formed the beginning.

Before God spoke one word, that word - meaning: the complete plan of God - was in Him, and God had thought of everything, (including even the most tiny details), and considered and concluded to Himself: this is it! This is the plan I will accomplish.

In the beginning, this word was with God and all things came to be of that word, (this thought), and became the basis of God's plan. The Apostle John stated that without this Word was not anything made that was made.

We can see just how deep and profound was the insight which John had in the eternal purposes and intents of God. It formed the very basis of his thinking and the starting-point of his gospel and letters, (John1:1 and 1John 1:1). We should want to posture ourselves on this basis also; on the original Word of God. God continues to work and carries out His plans from out of His original intentions. His actions are always based on the "Word that is from the beginning" and are aimed to complete realization of that Word; that plan.

John 1:1 says, "In the beginning was the Word". This verse tells us about the time preceding Genesis 1:1. The creator started executing His plan only after everything concerning this plan had completely matured. It is because of this that His work can never be stopped. God didn't start on impulse. He prepared everything in an uninterrupted peace and confidence which characterizes His very being. God is absolutely confident about His plan.

God wanted to give from Himself; He wanted us to be a part of Him. God wanted a partner to whom He could give Himself completely in love and in whom He could rejoice until eternity. This partner would be able to return His love and have an enormous amount of possibilities and thus God would never lose interest in him. This partner would be able to be a part of all of God's plans.

Also, this partner, of whom God was thinking, would be on His level. A partner able to live in an atmosphere of pure love and who would, from out of their free will, dedicate all their created abilities and talents to a relationship in complete dependence on God.

No, God wasn't thinking of a second God, but He thought of a worthy partner that would fit Him perfectly and harmoniously. A woman to God, after His image and likeness. We could perhaps describe as "complementary" to God; completely belonging to one another, in beings and works.

God pictured Himself a being that would fulfill all His needs. He saw a being with unimaginable, never ending possibilities. A being with a heart that could love Him. A being that could develop in many respects, in quality and quantity. A being that would manifest itself in infinite variations and in many personalities so that God would be able to manifest Himself completely in him. A being in whom God could be "all in all", (1Cor 15:28).

This total of personalities could live together formed as one. Each individually and together forming a unity in a narrow love relationship with God. This was the substance of God's motivation and to which everything visible and invisible evolve. This would come forth from Him to be created by Him and exist for the glory of His blessedness.

The splendid wonder of God's thoughts concerning marriage is that God was thinking of man; of you and me! Since the beginning, God had us envisioned.
All of God's plans and purposes are based on that thought: on God's longing for man. It was man, who would be created as "God's son"; born from God, and to God, and would grow into an adult son. Man, with his (by God) created potential to grow into a mankind, who as God's wife would live with Him until eternity.

In order to acquire this woman, God created everything that would be needed. In His thoughts He prepared the greatest work possible. A perfect work. A creation, a grand Godly creation. There would be a heaven and an earth, richly and abundantly provided with all possibilities and means to prepare that man for his godly destiny. It is for that purpose that God created the heaven and the earth, (Gen.1:1).

I differ with Bendito's thoughts concerning the Bride:
A bridegroom has not yet had intercourse with his bride. For that reason the Lord is compared with a husband and his congregation with a wife, as the Scripture says, " He who is united to the Lord becomes one spirit with Him", (1Cor 6:17). It also says, "For the husband is the head of the wife as Christ is the head of the church, (Eph 5:23).

But Revelation 21:9 mentions, "the Bride, the wife of the Lamb'. In this case the wife of the Lamb is the congregation; but it also says, "By thy blood thou didst ransom men for God", (Rev 5:9).
Jesus Christ and His congregation therefore are the bride of God, and, "The marriage of the Lamb", is still to come, (Rev 19:7).
It says that, "His Bride", has made herself ready. The marriage of the Lamb will take place when the wife of the Lamb has prepared herself and our Lord delivers "the kingdom to God the Father that God may be everything in every one", (1Cor 15:24-28).

The woman of Revelation is the image of the church of Jesus Christ. She is now, "called into the fellowship of his Son, Jesus Christ our Lord", (1 Cor 1:9). In Ephesians 5: 31-32 it says, "For this reason a man shall leave his father and mother and be joined to his wife, and the two shall become one. This is a great mystery, and I take it to mean Christ and the church". In 1 Cor 6:16 we read, "The two shall become one. But he who is united to the Lord becomes one spirit with him".
It is therefore incorrect to speak of a bride-church of which Jesus is the bridegroom. The church is PRESENTLY/NOW the wife of Christ because she already has fellowship with Him.
Together with her Head, (Jesus), she is the bride of God the Father. Scripture says, "I will show you the Bride, the wife of the Lamb", and again, "His Bride has made herself ready", (Rev 21:9 and Rev 19:7). [Opposite the wife of the Lamb, we see her great adversary, the great harlot, Babylon, the unfaithful apostate church.]

In the endtimes the true church appears in divine splendor.
In the unseen world she is clothed with the sun, for, "the glory of God is its light", (Rev 21:23).
The moon is the image of the Word of God. She is the reflection of the sun; that is of God's glory, and the stamp of His nature, (Heb 1:3). The moon was under her feet. This means to say that the church stands on the Word of God and is borne by it. It is her foundation.
For a crown, she has twelve stars on her forehead. "Those who turn many to righteousness shall shine like the stars forever", (Dan 12:3). They do this by means of the doctrine of the twelve apostles. This is the reason why the names of the apostles appear on the foundation of the New Jerusalem.
The moon and the stars, which is Christ and the apostles who laid the foundation, are inseparably united with the woman. They form one body and belong with the woman.

"Come, I will show you the Bride, the wife of the Lamb." And in the Spirit he carried me away to a great, high mountain, and showed me the holy city Jerusalem coming down out of heaven from God, having the glory of God, its radiance like a most rare jewel, like jasper, clear as crystal", (Rev 21-9-27).

John saw the revelation of the nearly completed city of God in all its glory. It descended, (became visible from out of the invisible world), in order to manifest itself on the new earth.
It was the city that Abraham had been looking forward to. The Scriptures state that the patriarch's spiritual eyes were enlightened; he saw the invisible from out of the visible, the reality behind the shadow. "For he looked for a city which had foundations, whose builder and maker is God", (Heb 11:10-16). Therefore he and his heirs confessed that they were, "strangers and exiles on the earth"; "... for He had prepared for them a city ".

We Christians today are also looking forward to the heavenly Jerusalem because we too have received the promise. Because looking for the holy city is synonymous with seeking a Kingdom which is not of this earth, we are also "strangers and exiles". Not not only do we see it from a far distance, but we have come near to it, "But ye are come unto Mount Zion and unto the city of the living God, the heavenly Jerusalem", (Heb 12:22).

The holy city is an image of the church, the wife of the Lamb. It is a city whose inhabitants are a spiritual, righteous people who have been washed and cleansed by the blood of the Lamb. Therefore, we speak of the 'Wife of the Lamb' as being His church.

Scripture always mentions marriage as the ideal image representing the relation between God and man. Several prophets prophesied about the frequent unfaithfulness people of Israel, the first bride of God, (descendant from Adam), who were meant to bring forth the Messiah, God's anointed Son, (Isaiah 54; Hosea). The last bride, (descendant of the last Adam), of God is preparing herself for an eternal marriage since the revelation of Jesus Christ.

Jesus was the 'fruit' of the first bride - the first people of Israel representing the first mankind - of God. He was made Messiah, (the Anointed one), by the infilling with the Spirit of the Father.

 

[Bendito]

Hello Bendito,

There is nothing to warrant this suggestion in either the context of 2 Thessalonians 2, or in the rest of Scripture.

God does not mix His metaphors I agree. The Bride is one calling, The Church which is His Body is another calling, but you are not correct in your understanding of them, Bendito.

These companies of the redeemed are too precious to be the subject of debate, so I will not say more regarding them here. Tread softly, Bendito.

May God's perfect will be done in you, for His Name and glory's sake.

In Christ Jesus,
Our risen and glorified
Saviour, Lord and Head.
Chris

It is my belief though Complete. I'm open to correction. You said that both the Bride and the Church are separate callings. How does that differ from what I said.
Also What is meant by "Tread softly"?

 

[complete]

Hello Bendito,

There is nothing to warrant this suggestion in either the context of 2 Thessalonians 2, or in the rest of Scripture.

God does not mix His metaphors I agree. The Bride is one calling, The Church which is His Body is another calling, but you are not correct in your understanding of them, Bendito.

These companies of the redeemed are too precious to be the subject of debate, so I will not say more regarding them here. Tread softly, Bendito.

May God's perfect will be done in you, for His Name and glory's sake.

In Christ Jesus,
Our risen and glorified
Saviour, Lord and Head.
Chris

It is my belief though Complete. I'm open to correction. You said that both the Bride and the Church are separate callings. How does that differ from what I said.
Also What is meant by "Tread softly"?

'And hath put all things under His feet,
and gave Him to be the head
over all things to the church which is His body,
the fulness of Him that filleth all in all.'
(Eph 1:22,23)

Forgive me Bendito,

I said, 'tread softly', because this Word is so precious, isn't it? God's wondrous grace so open and full of glorious invitation, to us who were enemies of God, undeserving and far off from Him.

I thank God for giving you the grace to respond so graciously.

I will address your post more particularly, and then perhaps we will understand where we differ on these things, and will be able to consider it together.

By God's grace
In Christ Jesus
Chris

 

[complete]

Satan is god of this world, that's right. But!! He is not our god. Our God is God. For us Satan is a powerless, puffed up puppet of his own narcissism He's a liar who even believes his own lies.

Hi there, Bendito,

I agree that Satan, although the ruler of this world's darkness, has no hold on you or I, for we are in Christ, and Christ is in God. Seated in Christ, by God's reckoning: we are far above all principality, power, might and dominion, and that includes Satan. Ephesians 2:1-6 assure us of that.

'And you hath He quickened,
who were dead in trespasses and sins;
Wherein in time past ye walked
according to the course of this world,
according to the prince of the power of the air,
the spirit that now worketh in the children of disobedience:
Among whom also we all had our conversation in times past
in the lusts of our flesh, fulfilling the desires of the flesh and of the mind;
and were by nature the children of wrath, even as others.
But God, who is rich in mercy,
for His great love wherewith He loved us,
Even when we were dead in sins,
hath quickened us together with Christ, [by grace ye are saved]
And hath raised us up together,
and made us sit together in heavenly places
in Christ Jesus:'

Praise God!

Bendito:
... Still, it's the bride who holds him back.

* Would you please explain, from Scripture, why you believe this to be true, Bendito.

Thank you
In Christ Jesus
Chris

 

[complete]

... I believe that the 'one that letteth' is not the Holy Spirit because in the tribulation period following nobody could be saved because no one is saved without the Holy Spirit draws them. Already said..Right
I believe that he that letteth is the bride, the one new man mentioned in Ephesians 2:15 (the manchild if you will) I believe that the woman talked of in Revelation 12 is the church....giving "birth" to the bride

* Why do you believe the 'one new man' (Eph. 2:15) is the 'bride'?
* Why do you believe the 'man child' of (Rev.12:5,13), is the 'bride' ?

The Bride of Christ
It is a widespread and common misconception among Christians that the bride of Christ and the Church are synonymous. The bride of Christ is not the Church, contrary to popular belief and teaching. It is true that the Church is the body of Christ, and the entire Church has been espoused or engaged to Christ, but every member of the Church will not be the bride of Christ. Faith in Christ is necessary to be in the Church, but faithfulness to Christ is necessary to be the bride of Christ.

* I agree, as I said previously, that the Church which is the Body of Christ (of Eph.1:22,23), is not the 'Bride'.
* Why do you say that the Church which is His Body has been 'espoused' to Christ?
[Surely if the Church is described as HIS BODY, it cannot also be spoken of as being espoused to Him]

The Church consists of all spiritually regenerated people from Pentecost to the end of the Age of Grace, which will end with the Firstfruits Rapture of the bride and her court. John the Baptist was not a member of the Church, since he died before Pentecost. Since the bride comes out of the Church, he could not be a member of the bride, and he even referred to himself as a “friend of the bridegroom” (John 3:29).

* Why do you believe that the Church which is His Body (Eph. 1:22,23) began at Pentecost? When Paul says clearly that the truth concerning this company of called-out believers, the subject of 'the mystery' of Ephesians 3:9, was 'hid in God' until revealed to Paul at the end of the period covered by the record of 'The Acts of the Apostles'?

In 2 Corinthians 11:2-3 (KJV) Paul tells the Corinthians that he has “espoused” them to Christ:

* The 'Church of the mystery', the 'one new man' of Ephesians, Colossians, Philippians, 1&2 Timothy and Titus, was not revealed intil after the letter to the Corinthians was written. It was, 'hid in God', until after the laying aside (temporarily) of Israel, in unbelief, at the end of the Acts period, following the 40 years (approx.) of opportunity given to Israel to repent: and made known through Paul, in the epistles written following that (named above).

* I acknowledge that the resurrection referred to in Philippians 3:11 (exanastasis) is a resurrection which Paul desired to attain unto, (having already, as one of the chosen nation, the hope of resurrection, and as a believer in the Lord Jesus Christ the hope of the resurrection detailed in Thessalonians), this 'further' (better) resurrection required that he remain faithful unto the end, to the truth committed unto Him, concerning the Church of the mystery, even if that 'end' be the ultimate sacrifice of His own life. Which it was in his case. Praise God! that He will have attained that resurrection hope.

* The prize that Paul strove for, was not to be a guest at the wedding of the Lamb, or to be part of that company represented by the figure of The Bride of the Lamb (the new Jerusalem - Rev.21:9,10), but to reign with Christ. For though all, 'in Christ', will live, not all will reign with Him.

The Scriptures also attach shame and reproof to those Christians who have not prepared for themselves a wedding garment (Mat. 22:1-14). The wedding garment represents the good works that pass through the judgment fire at the Judgment Seat of Christ. It is clear from these Scriptures that being selected as the bride of Christ was Paul’s goal for himself and for as many Christians as Paul could persuade to make the supreme sacrifice of self.

* Why do you believe this to be the goal to which Paul strove? For this is Kingdom truth, and is associated with Israel as a nation, and not the Church which is His Body.

The Church and the Bride are not the same. The Scriptures confirm that the bride of Christ comes out of the body of Christ.

* The Church which is the Body of Christ was not the subject of Old Testament prophecy, or type, Bendito, for it was, 'hid in God, since before the foundation of the world.

* The Bride does not come out from the company described as the Body of Christ, but out of redeemed Israel.

THE BRIDE:-
The association of the heavenly city with this special company, is seen in Hebrews chapters 11 and 12, there we see that Abraham, who by Divine election was already part of the “treasure”, voluntarily chose to be a pilgrim and a stranger, walking by faith, because “He looked for a city which hath THE foundations (i.e. the city of Revelation 21), whose builder and maker is God” (Heb. 11:9-10). This voluntary and overcoming aspect of Abraham’s faith is expanded in the twelfth chapter of Hebrews, a study of which will throw light upon the peculiar constitution of the company called “The Bride”.

The teaching of Hebrews revolves around the exhortation “Let us go on unto perfection”, with the alternative of drawing back “unto perdition or waste”. The heavenly “city” which Abraham had in view was something over and above the inheritance of the “land”, an inheritance he could neither win nor lose, but the heavenly “city” when seen in the light of the inspired type, Esau, and its relation to his attitude to the “birthright” and its resultant forfeiture, ranges the bridal calling with the “Prize” rather than with “Hope”. All Israel shall be saved. That is basic, it is the “Hope of Israel” entertained by the “twelve tribes” (Acts 26:6,7). Some out of Israel will go on unto perfection, this is something super-added, it is in the nature of a prize, and could be missed. Hebrews 11.

These are my thoughts, Bendito.

http://www.charleswelch.net/Bride and the Body.PDF

In Christ Jesus
Chris

 

[B-A-C]

Eph 5:23 For the husband is the head of the wife, as Christ also is the head of the church, He Himself being the Savior of the body.
Eph 5:24 But as the church is subject to Christ, so also the wives ought to be to their husbands in everything.
Eph 5:25; Husbands, love your wives, just as Christ also loved the church and gave Himself up for her,
Eph 5:26; so that He might sanctify her, having cleansed her by the washing of water with the word,
Eph 5:27; that He might present to Himself the church in all her glory, having no spot or wrinkle or any such thing; but that she would be holy and blameless.
Eph 5:28; So husbands ought also to love their own wives as their own bodies. He who loves his own wife loves himself;

We are the "wife" of Christ in the sense that we are subject to Him. Christ is.. of course the head of the church.

Col 1:18; He is also head of the body, the church; and He is the beginning, the firstborn from the dead, so that He Himself will come to have first place in everything.
Col 1:19; For it was the Father's good pleasure for all the fullness to dwell in Him,
Col 1:20; and through Him to reconcile all things to Himself, having made peace through the blood of His cross; through Him, I say, whether things on earth or things in heaven.
Col 1:21; And although you were formerly alienated and hostile in mind, engaged in evil deeds,
Col 1:22; yet He has now reconciled you in His fleshly body through death, in order to present you before Him holy and blameless and beyond reproach--
Col 1:23; if indeed you continue in the faith firmly established and steadfast, and not moved away from the hope of the gospel that you have heard, which was proclaimed in all creation under heaven, and of which I, Paul, was made a minister.
Col 1:24; Now I rejoice in my sufferings for your sake, and in my flesh I do my share on behalf of His body, which is the church, in filling up what is lacking in Christ's afflictions.

It could be argued that the New Jerusalem is the bride.

Rev 19:7; "Let us rejoice and be glad and give the glory to Him, for the marriage of the Lamb has come and His bride has made herself ready."
Rev 19:8; It was given to her to clothe herself in fine linen, bright and clean; for the fine linen is the righteous acts of the saints.
Rev 19:9; Then he *said to me, "Write, 'Blessed are those who are invited to the marriage supper of the Lamb.'" And he *said to me, "These are true words of God."

Rev 21:2; And I saw the holy city, new Jerusalem, coming down out of heaven from God, made ready as a bride adorned for her husband.
Rev 21:9; Then one of the seven angels who had the seven bowls full of the seven last plagues came and spoke with me, saying, "Come here, I will show you the bride, the wife of the Lamb."
Rev 21:10; And he carried me away in the Spirit to a great and high mountain, and showed me the holy city, Jerusalem, coming down out of heaven from God,
Rev 21:11; having the glory of God. Her brilliance was like a very costly stone, as a stone of crystal-clear jasper.

But is it the city itself, or those who dwell in the city?

Rev 22:14; Blessed are those who wash their robes, so that they may have the right to the tree of life, and may enter by the gates into the city.
Rev 22:15; Outside are the dogs and the sorcerers and the immoral persons and the murderers and the idolaters, and everyone who loves and practices lying.
Rev 22:16; "I, Jesus, have sent My angel to testify to you these things for the churches. I am the root and the descendant of David, the bright morning star."
Rev 22:17; The Spirit and the bride say, "Come." And let the one who hears say, "Come." And let the one who is thirsty come; let the one who wishes take the water of life without cost.

If Jesus is the head of the church, and the head of the body. And the church is the body.. (Rom 12:4-5; 1 Cor 12:12-27; ) Can the two bodies become "one flesh" as in a marriage?

Eph 5:30; because we are members of His body.
Eph 5:31; FOR THIS REASON A MAN SHALL LEAVE HIS FATHER AND MOTHER AND SHALL BE JOINED TO HIS WIFE, AND THE TWO SHALL BECOME ONE FLESH.
Eph 5:32; This mystery is great; but I am speaking with reference to Christ and the church.
Eph 5:33; Nevertheless, each individual among you also is to love his own wife even as himself, and the wife must see to it that she respects her husband.

 

[B-A-C]

An on-going theme through the old testament is that the Jews are the "wife" in their relationship with God.

Hos 1:2; When the LORD first spoke through Hosea, the LORD said to Hosea, "Go, take to yourself a wife of harlotry and have children of harlotry; for the land commits flagrant harlotry, forsaking the LORD."
Hos 14:1; Return, O Israel, to the LORD your God, For you have stumbled because of your iniquity.


Num 15:39; "It shall be a tassel for you to look at and remember all the commandments of the LORD, so as to do them and not follow after your own heart and your own eyes, after which you played the harlot,

Jer 3:1; God says, "If a husband divorces his wife And she goes from him And belongs to another man, Will he still return to her? Will not that land be completely polluted? But you are a harlot with many lovers; Yet you turn to Me," declares the LORD.

Ezek 16:

There are literally dozens of examples of this. I don't know that Israel is ever specifically called "wife". But whenever "she" (Israel) went after other
God's, "she" is called the harlot.

 

[complete]

Eph 5:23 For the husband is the head of the wife, as Christ also is the head of the church, He Himself being the Savior of the body.
Eph 5:24 But as the church is subject to Christ, so also the wives ought to be to their husbands in everything.
Eph 5:25; Husbands, love your wives, just as Christ also loved the church and gave Himself up for her,
Eph 5:26; so that He might sanctify her, having cleansed her by the washing of water with the word,
Eph 5:27; that He might present to Himself the church in all her glory, having no spot or wrinkle or any such thing; but that she would be holy and blameless.
Eph 5:28; So husbands ought also to love their own wives as their own bodies. He who loves his own wife loves himself;
We are the "wife" of Christ in the sense that we are subject to Him. Christ is.. of course the head of the church.

* With respect, B-A-C, that is not what is written.
Ephesians 5:12 to 28, concerns the relation of husbands and wives. The role of the husband is used to illustrate how Christ loved the Church and gave Himself for IT (not 'her').

* The use of figures of speech, such as the Body, The Bride, The Wife, are the prerogative of the Holy Spirit, it is not for us to use then as we choose

It could be argued that the New Jerusalem is the bride.---
But is it the city itself, or those who dwell in the city?

* The New Jerusalem is indeed called the Bride of the Lamb, and those who dwell within it comprise that company. I believe They are 'overcomers' , like Abraham, who looked for a city without hands. Those who have part in the first resurrection, spoken of in Revelation 20:5,6. Those also who sought, 'a better resurrection', in Hebrews eleven. Although my knowledge on this is weak at best.

If Jesus is the head of the church, and the head of the body. And the church is the body.. (Rom 12:4-5; 1 Cor 12:12-27; ) Can the two bodies become "one flesh" as in a marriage?

* The risen and exalted Christ is the Head of the Church which is His Body.
* The Bride of the Lamb is another company entirely

Thank you.
In Christ Jesus
Chris[/quote]

 

[Travis]

But is it the city itself, or those who dwell in the city?

They are one and the same so yes haha

 

[pajaro]

"For the mystery of iniquity doth already work: only he who now letteth will let, until he be taken out of the way."

The question was 'who is he who now letteth?'. This is talking about the time of great tribulation when God withdraws the Holy Spirit from the congregations that have come from the church age. The word 'let' means 'to restrain'. During the church age the Holy Spirit was present in the congregations to restrain the sin of unbelief. However, when the Holy Spirit is taken away from the congregations, Satan is able to take his seat there, spiritually speaking, and to cause unbelief to hold sway. Revelation 18 describes how the congregations no longer hear the voice of the bridegroom (Christ) because the Holy Spirit is no longer there to allow them to hear spiritually. Fallen, fallen are the congregations (that great city). So, in answer to the question: he who now letteth is the Holy Spirit. I am not saying that the Holy Spirit is destroyed in any way or that the true believers (whose true gospel is rejected in the congregations) do not have the Holy Spirit any longer. Rather, the congregations of the church age no longer have the Holy Spirit working within them. Just as Lot fled out of the overthrow of the city with his family in Genesis, so the true believers will flee out of the congregations.

 

[Bendito]

Hi there, Bendito,

I agree that Satan, although the ruler of this world's darkness, has no hold on you or I, for we are in Christ, and Christ is in God. Seated in Christ, by God's reckoning: we are far above all principality, power, might and dominion, and that includes Satan. Ephesians 2:1-6 assure us of that.

'And you hath He quickened,
who were dead in trespasses and sins;
Wherein in time past ye walked
according to the course of this world,
according to the prince of the power of the air,
the spirit that now worketh in the children of disobedience:
Among whom also we all had our conversation in times past
in the lusts of our flesh, fulfilling the desires of the flesh and of the mind;
and were by nature the children of wrath, even as others.
But God, who is rich in mercy,
for His great love wherewith He loved us,
Even when we were dead in sins,
hath quickened us together with Christ, [by grace ye are saved]
And hath raised us up together,
and made us sit together in heavenly places
in Christ Jesus:'

Praise God!



* Would you please explain, from Scripture, why you believe this to be true, Bendito.

Thank you
In Christ Jesus
Chris

I thought I already explained this. Let me take a bit of time and dig deeper for a more explicit explanation

 

[Curtis]

2 Thessalonians 2:6-10King James Version (KJV)

6 And now ye know what withholdeth that he might be revealed in his time.

7 For the mystery of iniquity doth already work: only he who now letteth will let, until he be taken out of the way.

8 And then shall that Wicked be revealed, whom the Lord shall consume with the spirit of his mouth, and shall destroy with the brightness of his coming:

9 Even him, whose coming is after the working of Satan with all power and signs and lying wonders,

10 And with all deceivableness of unrighteousness in them that perish; because they received not the love of the truth, that they might be saved.

The question is; Who is "he that letteth"?

I would say that would be the Church!! Some people might, no, that would be the Holy Spirit. If it was the Holy Spirit, then he can not go anywhere without us since Jesus said when Holy Spirit comes he will never leave us, so if he goes so do we!!!

The "man of "sin can not be revealed until the Church has left the premises!