God's gift of Tongues Are Not for Private Use

[GodB4Us]

When believers defend tongues for private use, they are ignoring Paul's teaching on gifts are not for private use & more importantly, none of those gifts are gained by having another drink of the One Spirit that we are all supposed to share in that same testimony as baptized into one body by.

1 Corinthians 12:7 But the manifestation of the Spirit is given to every man to profit withal:

11 But all these worketh that one and the selfsame Spirit, dividing to every man severally as he will. 12 For as the body is one, and hath many members, and all the members of that one body, being many, are one body: so also is Christ. 13 For by one Spirit are we all baptized into one body, whether we be Jews or Gentiles, whether we be bond or free; and have been all made to drink into one Spirit. 14 For the body is not one member, but many.

19 And if they were all one member, where were the body? 20 But now are they many members, yet but one body. 21 And the eye cannot say unto the hand, I have no need of thee: nor again the head to the feet, I have no need of you.

Then Paul began using hyperboles in explaining why love is better than anything else for why tongues are not of angels since he is not like sounding brass, or a tinkling cymbal

1 Corinthians 13:1Though I speak with the tongues of men and of angels, and have not charity, I am become as sounding brass, or a tinkling cymbal. 2 And though I have the gift of prophecy, and understand all mysteries, and all knowledge; and though I have all faith, so that I could remove mountains, and have not charity, I am nothing. 3 And though I bestow all my goods to feed the poor, and though I give my body to be burned, and have not charity, it profiteth me nothing.

Paul has certainly not sold everything and given to the poor and gave his body up for burning either les he has become a ghost writer. Hyperbole. Just as referring to tongues of angels is a hyperbole, an exaggerated sense of tongues which is not being done in reality.

Then those who speak in tongues try to claim that tongues are for private use by inserting their meaning in complete disregard for why Paul is exhorting the gift of prophesy over all spiritual gifts in verse 1 ad then explained why by comparing tongues against prophesy for why prophesy is the better gift to seek after in the whole message of that chapter because tongues is not a stand alone gift for it needs interpretation for the tongue speaker to truly benefit when he understood what that tongue is saying as manifested by the Holy Ghost.

1 Corinthians 14:1Follow after charity, and desire spiritual gifts, but rather that ye may prophesy. 2 For he that speaketh in an unknown tongue speaketh not unto men, but unto God: for no man understandeth him; howbeit in the spirit he speaketh mysteries. 3 But he that prophesieth speaketh unto men to edification, and exhortation, and comfort. 4 He that speaketh in an unknown tongue edifieth himself; but he that prophesieth edifieth the church. 5 I would that ye all spake with tongues but rather that ye prophesied: for greater is he that prophesieth than he that speaketh with tongues, except he interpret, that the church may receive edifying.

Discern with Him now.

2 Corinthians 13:1 This is the third time I am coming to you. In the mouth of two or three witnesses shall every word be established.

Paul cannot claim he speak more in tongues than them all unless he had witnesses to that truth therefore not for private use as this was done in the assembly as witnessed before all.

Paul is not saying the tongue speaker is speaking to God because he is in the assembly where no man understands him but God does, as the tongue speaker speaks in mysteries to those around him but God understands that tongue. That does not mean he is speaking TO God because there are no mysteries to God for why he is not speaking TO God. Paul is meaning God understands what us being said as manifested by the Holy Ghost. God's gift of tongues can be self edifying but only when interpreted for Paul to benefit from that tongue.

12 Even so ye, forasmuch as ye are zealous of spiritual gifts, seek that ye may excel to the edifying of the church. 13 Wherefore let him that speaketh in an unknown tongue pray that he may interpret. 14 For if I pray in an unknown tongue, my spirit prayeth, but my understanding is unfruitful. 15 What is it then? I will pray with the spirit, and I will pray with the understanding also: I will sing with the spirit, and I will sing with the understanding also. 16 Else when thou shalt bless with the spirit, how shall he that occupieth the room of the unlearned say Amen at thy giving of thanks, seeing he understandeth not what thou sayest?

Tongue speakers ignore verse 13 and point to verse 14 as if Paul is praying in tongues when he is really praying someone will interpret that tongue. everything Paul has said about tongues is being done in the assembly and not for private use. tongue speakers for private use are inserting their tongues in there when Paul is explaining why prophesy is better than tongues because it is not for private use.

17 For thou verily givest thanks well, but the other is not edified. 18 I thank my God, I speak with tongues more than ye all: 19 Yet in the church I had rather speak five words with my understanding, that by my voice I might teach others also, than ten thousand words in an unknown tongue.

The only way Paul can say that if tongues were done in the assembly where there are more than 3 witnesses to that truth. He cannot testify of tongues for private use when there are no witnesses.

20 Brethren, be not children in understanding: howbeit in malice be ye children, but in understanding be men. 21 In the law it is written, With men of other tongues and other lips will I speak unto this people; and yet for all that will they not hear me, saith the Lord.

Verses 20-21 is Paul giving the bottom line on what God's gift of tongues are for, being of other men's lips to speak unto the people.

22 Wherefore tongues are for a sign, not to them that believe, but to them that believe not: but prophesying serveth not for them that believe not, but for them which believe.

And yet believers are using tongues as a sign or proof of salvation or proof f Gd calling them into the ministries or as the early Catholic Church claimed, proof that they are keeping the doctrines within. I cannot find that latter info again, but it is so. I would not be surprise that believers that fornicate use tongues as a sign that everything is still okay between Him & them. Is everything okay between Him & the catholic Charismatic Church? I think not. Therefore tongues are not supposed to serve as a sign nor proof to the believers about anything but to the believers.

And yet they preach another baptism with the Holy Ghost with evidence of tongues ( used to be heralded as "by that sign of tongues" ). Red flag. That is why that tongue is not coming with interpretation as it is a voice of stranger's they follow for climbing up another way John 10:1-5

Then getting back to Paul on tongues; I remind you abut verse 2 in how a tongue speaker speaks unto God but not to God but He understands what is being said as we read this below.

26 How is it then, brethren? when ye come together, every one of you hath a psalm, hath a doctrine, hath a tongue, hath a revelation, hath an interpretation. Let all things be done unto edifying. 27 If any man speak in an unknown tongue, let it be by two, or at the most by three, and that by course; and let one interpret. 28 But if there be no interpreter, let him keep silence in the church; and let him speak to himself, and to God.

How can Paul instruct someone to be silent IF that tongue was manifested by the Holy Ghost just because there was no interpretation? And yet at the end of the chapter he has written not to forbid speaking in tongues in the assembly but order and decency must be maintained?

Reread the 3 verses of 26-28. When you have 2 or 3 speak in tongues, one by one, and another interpret, when you have a practice like that in the assembly, a foreign visitor could very well stand up and speak out of turn. That is why he is to keep silence because he speaks to himself, meaning he understands what he is saying as God does too, not that he is a crazy person speaking to himself and to God.

There can be no speaking in tongues quietly to oneself when even whispering bothers people around them trying to listen to the sermon or in this case, when 2 or 3 speak in tongues for that one to interpret it.

Just another example of how tongue speakers for private use today try to insert that tongue for private use into scripture when that is not what Paul is saying. Indeed, they make Paul look like an idiot for exhorting prophesy over tongues as they are today hyping believers to seek another baptism with the Holy Ghost with evidence of tongues and not prophesy when there is no other baptism with the Holy Ghost to seek after salvation.

That is why I do not believe God's gift of tongues were ever meant for private use.

 

[B-A-C]

Rom 8:26; In the same way the Spirit also helps our weakness; for we do not know how to pray as we should, but the Spirit Himself intercedes for us with groanings too deep for words;

Eph 6:18; With all prayer and petition pray at all times in the Spirit, and with this in view, be on the alert with all perseverance and petition for all the saints,

 

[Samson2020]

When believers defend tongues for private use, they are ignoring Paul's teaching on gifts are not for private use & more importantly, none of those gifts are gained by having another drink of the One Spirit that we are all supposed to share in that same testimony as baptized into one body by.

1 Corinthians 12:7 But the manifestation of the Spirit is given to every man to profit withal:

11 But all these worketh that one and the selfsame Spirit, dividing to every man severally as he will. 12 For as the body is one, and hath many members, and all the members of that one body, being many, are one body: so also is Christ. 13 For by one Spirit are we all baptized into one body, whether we be Jews or Gentiles, whether we be bond or free; and have been all made to drink into one Spirit. 14 For the body is not one member, but many.

19 And if they were all one member, where were the body? 20 But now are they many members, yet but one body. 21 And the eye cannot say unto the hand, I have no need of thee: nor again the head to the feet, I have no need of you.

Then Paul began using hyperboles in explaining why love is better than anything else for why tongues are not of angels since he is not like sounding brass, or a tinkling cymbal

1 Corinthians 13:1Though I speak with the tongues of men and of angels, and have not charity, I am become as sounding brass, or a tinkling cymbal. 2 And though I have the gift of prophecy, and understand all mysteries, and all knowledge; and though I have all faith, so that I could remove mountains, and have not charity, I am nothing. 3 And though I bestow all my goods to feed the poor, and though I give my body to be burned, and have not charity, it profiteth me nothing.

Paul has certainly not sold everything and given to the poor and gave his body up for burning either les he has become a ghost writer. Hyperbole. Just as referring to tongues of angels is a hyperbole, an exaggerated sense of tongues which is not being done in reality.

Then those who speak in tongues try to claim that tongues are for private use by inserting their meaning in complete disregard for why Paul is exhorting the gift of prophesy over all spiritual gifts in verse 1 ad then explained why by comparing tongues against prophesy for why prophesy is the better gift to seek after in the whole message of that chapter because tongues is not a stand alone gift for it needs interpretation for the tongue speaker to truly benefit when he understood what that tongue is saying as manifested by the Holy Ghost.

1 Corinthians 14:1Follow after charity, and desire spiritual gifts, but rather that ye may prophesy. 2 For he that speaketh in an unknown tongue speaketh not unto men, but unto God: for no man understandeth him; howbeit in the spirit he speaketh mysteries. 3 But he that prophesieth speaketh unto men to edification, and exhortation, and comfort. 4 He that speaketh in an unknown tongue edifieth himself; but he that prophesieth edifieth the church. 5 I would that ye all spake with tongues but rather that ye prophesied: for greater is he that prophesieth than he that speaketh with tongues, except he interpret, that the church may receive edifying.

Discern with Him now.

2 Corinthians 13:1 This is the third time I am coming to you. In the mouth of two or three witnesses shall every word be established.

Paul cannot claim he speak more in tongues than them all unless he had witnesses to that truth therefore not for private use as this was done in the assembly as witnessed before all.

Paul is not saying the tongue speaker is speaking to God because he is in the assembly where no man understands him but God does, as the tongue speaker speaks in mysteries to those around him but God understands that tongue. That does not mean he is speaking TO God because there are no mysteries to God for why he is not speaking TO God. Paul is meaning God understands what us being said as manifested by the Holy Ghost. God's gift of tongues can be self edifying but only when interpreted for Paul to benefit from that tongue.

12 Even so ye, forasmuch as ye are zealous of spiritual gifts, seek that ye may excel to the edifying of the church. 13 Wherefore let him that speaketh in an unknown tongue pray that he may interpret. 14 For if I pray in an unknown tongue, my spirit prayeth, but my understanding is unfruitful. 15 What is it then? I will pray with the spirit, and I will pray with the understanding also: I will sing with the spirit, and I will sing with the understanding also. 16 Else when thou shalt bless with the spirit, how shall he that occupieth the room of the unlearned say Amen at thy giving of thanks, seeing he understandeth not what thou sayest?

Tongue speakers ignore verse 13 and point to verse 14 as if Paul is praying in tongues when he is really praying someone will interpret that tongue. everything Paul has said about tongues is being done in the assembly and not for private use. tongue speakers for private use are inserting their tongues in there when Paul is explaining why prophesy is better than tongues because it is not for private use.

17 For thou verily givest thanks well, but the other is not edified. 18 I thank my God, I speak with tongues more than ye all: 19 Yet in the church I had rather speak five words with my understanding, that by my voice I might teach others also, than ten thousand words in an unknown tongue.

The only way Paul can say that if tongues were done in the assembly where there are more than 3 witnesses to that truth. He cannot testify of tongues for private use when there are no witnesses.

20 Brethren, be not children in understanding: howbeit in malice be ye children, but in understanding be men. 21 In the law it is written, With men of other tongues and other lips will I speak unto this people; and yet for all that will they not hear me, saith the Lord.

Verses 20-21 is Paul giving the bottom line on what God's gift of tongues are for, being of other men's lips to speak unto the people.

22 Wherefore tongues are for a sign, not to them that believe, but to them that believe not: but prophesying serveth not for them that believe not, but for them which believe.

And yet believers are using tongues as a sign or proof of salvation or proof f Gd calling them into the ministries or as the early Catholic Church claimed, proof that they are keeping the doctrines within. I cannot find that latter info again, but it is so. I would not be surprise that believers that fornicate use tongues as a sign that everything is still okay between Him & them. Is everything okay between Him & the catholic Charismatic Church? I think not. Therefore tongues are not supposed to serve as a sign nor proof to the believers about anything but to the believers.

And yet they preach another baptism with the Holy Ghost with evidence of tongues ( used to be heralded as "by that sign of tongues" ). Red flag. That is why that tongue is not coming with interpretation as it is a voice of stranger's they follow for climbing up another way John 10:1-5

Then getting back to Paul on tongues; I remind you abut verse 2 in how a tongue speaker speaks unto God but not to God but He understands what is being said as we read this below.

26 How is it then, brethren? when ye come together, every one of you hath a psalm, hath a doctrine, hath a tongue, hath a revelation, hath an interpretation. Let all things be done unto edifying. 27 If any man speak in an unknown tongue, let it be by two, or at the most by three, and that by course; and let one interpret. 28 But if there be no interpreter, let him keep silence in the church; and let him speak to himself, and to God.

How can Paul instruct someone to be silent IF that tongue was manifested by the Holy Ghost just because there was no interpretation? And yet at the end of the chapter he has written not to forbid speaking in tongues in the assembly but order and decency must be maintained?

Reread the 3 verses of 26-28. When you have 2 or 3 speak in tongues, one by one, and another interpret, when you have a practice like that in the assembly, a foreign visitor could very well stand up and speak out of turn. That is why he is to keep silence because he speaks to himself, meaning he understands what he is saying as God does too, not that he is a crazy person speaking to himself and to God.

There can be no speaking in tongues quietly to oneself when even whispering bothers people around them trying to listen to the sermon or in this case, when 2 or 3 speak in tongues for that one to interpret it.

Just another example of how tongue speakers for private use today try to insert that tongue for private use into scripture when that is not what Paul is saying. Indeed, they make Paul look like an idiot for exhorting prophesy over tongues as they are today hyping believers to seek another baptism with the Holy Ghost with evidence of tongues and not prophesy when there is no other baptism with the Holy Ghost to seek after salvation.

That is why I do not believe God's gift of tongues were ever meant for private use.

Could I assume that you do not pray in another language, and this is why this subject bothers you as much as it does?

And could I ask if you have ever cast out an unclean spirit, or laid hands on an ill person, as the Lord instructed you, who was then healed, or any other thing spoken of a true believer?

 

[GodB4Us]

Thank you for sharing.

Rom 8:26; In the same way the Spirit also helps our weakness; for we do not know how to pray as we should, but the Spirit Himself intercedes for us with groanings too deep for words;

Bible versions matter. The Bible version you are using, check with John 16:13 in that Bible version you are using and it will testify that the Holy Spirit will not speak from Himself but speaks what He hears. That is why you can know that Romans 8:26-27 was not translated properly because it does not align with John 16:13 in that Bible version.

KJV and a few other modern Bibles has it right below in Romans 8:26-27

Romans 8:26 Likewise the Spirit also helpeth our infirmities: for we know not what we should pray for as we ought: but the Spirit itself maketh intercession for us with groanings which cannot be uttered. KJV

That means no sound at all and so it aligs with the truth in His words in John 16:13

27 And he that searcheth the hearts knoweth what is the mind of the Spirit, because he maketh intercession for the saints according to the will of God. KJV

The "he" is Jesus Christ that searches our hearts per Hebrews 4:12-16 as this is the same "he" that knows the mind of the Spirit as Jesus makes intercessions for the saints in according to the will of God because there is only One Mediator between God & men, the man Christ Jesus. This is so because He is at that throne of grace for how all intercessions pass through the Son, including our own's, the Spirit's silent intercessions, & the Son's own intercessions ( Hebrews 7:25 ) s that whichever the intercessions the Father agrees to, the Son answers the prayers so that the Father may be glorified in the Son for answers to prayers ( John 14:13-14 ) This is how and why the father knows everything before we , ourselves, ask anything in prayer and so there is no need for the Holy Spirit to use God's gift of tongues as He will continue John 16:13 for speaking what He hears unto the people.

Eph 6:18; With all prayer and petition pray at all times in the Spirit, and with this in view, be on the alert with all perseverance and petition for all the saints,

Now some believers that believe they were born again of the Spirit at their salvation and then they believe there is a baptism with the Holy Ghost with that evidence of tongues that happens after that. Can they be praying in the Spirit to be baptized with the Holy Ghost as if they are not IN the Holy Ghost? No. It is hypocrisy. I cannot see how they can avoid it.

Praying in the Holy Ghost is not saying the Holy Spirit is praying in tongues.

Let us put it in this way, Romans 8:26-27 is the Holy Spirit making silent intercessions for all believers for how & with the Son searching our hearts and knowing the mind of the Spirit, is why the Father knows before we ask anything in prayer.

There can be no schism in the body of Christ and God will not be partial or showing favoritism in the body of Christ. We are to sow he same care for every member of the body of Christ as God does for why He is not a hypocrite.

1 Corinthians 12:19 And if they were all one member, where were the body? 20 But now are they many members, yet but one body. 21 And the eye cannot say unto the hand, I have no need of thee: nor again the head to the feet, I have no need of you.

25 That there should be no schism in the body; but that the members should have the same care one for another. 26 And whether one member suffer, all the members suffer with it; or one member be honoured, all the members rejoice with it. 27 Now ye are the body of Christ, and members in particular. 28 And God hath set some in the church, first apostles, secondarily prophets, thirdly teachers, after that miracles, then gifts of healings, helps, governments, diversities of tongues. 29 Are all apostles? are all prophets? are all teachers? are all workers of miracles? 30 Have all the gifts of healing? do all speak with tongues? do all interpret?

This is why believers today that believe God's gift of tongues can also be used for private use should discern that tongue for private use and how they got that tongue for private use for why that extra phenomenon and that tongue is not of Him at all. Do not believe every spirit but test them & the tongues they bring

1 John 4:1Beloved, believe not every spirit, but try the spirits whether they are of God: because many false prophets are gone out into the world. 2 Hereby know ye the Spirit of God: Every spirit that confesseth that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh is of God:

Verse 2 is the same thing as saying 2 Corinthians 13:5 of Jesus Christ being in us presently as "is come in the flesh" in 1 John 4:2.

3 And every spirit that confesseth not that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh is not of God: and this is that spirit of antichrist, whereof ye have heard that it should come; and even now already is it in the world. 4 Ye are of God, little children, and have overcome them: because greater is he that is in you, than he that is in the world.

So any spirit outside of us or coming over us later in life as a saved believer when we know He is in us by faith in Jesus Christ, is not the real Holy Spirit, but the spirit of the antichrist for why that tongue is found in the world Isaiah 8:19

5 They are of the world: therefore speak they of the world, and the world heareth them. 6 We are of God: he that knoweth God heareth us; he that is not of God heareth not us. Hereby know we the spirit of truth, and the spirit of error.

It does make me wonder how Pentecostals/Charismatics or any other denomination test the spirits when they believe the Holy Spirit can be felt outside of them where the spirits of the antichrist are at. Indeed, those Protestant denomination do not apply that test to believing His Presence is in the bread and wine at "holy" communion when we are only supposed to do "communion" in remembrance of Him. some Protestant begins communion service by saying " We come into His Presence today.." which is a lie and not in according to our faith in Jesus Christ when He is in us and with us always as our bodies are the temples of the Holy Spirit per 1 Corinthians 6:19-20 for why He would not be out there in the assembly.

1 Corinthians 6:19 What? know ye not that your body is the temple of the Holy Ghost which is in you, which ye have of God, and ye are not your own? 20 For ye are bought with a price: therefore glorify God in your body, and in your spirit, which are God's.

2 Corinthians 11:1Would to God ye could bear with me a little in my folly: and indeed bear with me. 2 For I am jealous over you with godly jealousy: for I have espoused you to one husband, that I may present you as a chaste virgin to Christ. 3 But I fear, lest by any means, as the serpent beguiled Eve through his subtilty, so your minds should be corrupted from the simplicity that is in Christ. 4 For if he that cometh preacheth another Jesus, whom we have not preached, or if ye receive another spirit, which ye have not received, or another gospel, which ye have not accepted, ye might well bear with him.

1 Timothy 4:1Now the Spirit speaketh expressly, that in the latter times some shall depart from the faith, giving heed to seducing spirits, and doctrines of devils; 2 Speaking lies in hypocrisy; having their conscience seared with a hot iron;

Isaiah 8: 19 And when they shall say unto you, Seek unto them that have familiar spirits, and unto wizards that peep, and that mutter: should not a people seek unto their God? for the living to the dead?

2 Corinthians 13: 5 Examine yourselves, whether ye be in the faith; prove your own selves. Know ye not your own selves, how that Jesus Christ is in you, except ye be reprobates?

Colossians 2:5 For though I be absent in the flesh, yet am I with you in the spirit, joying and beholding your order, and the stedfastness of your faith in Christ. 6 As ye have therefore received Christ Jesus the Lord, so walk ye in him: 7 Rooted and built up in him, and stablished in the faith, as ye have been taught, abounding therein with thanksgiving. 8 Beware lest any man spoil you through philosophy and vain deceit, after the tradition of men, after the rudiments of the world, and not after Christ. 9 For in him dwelleth all the fulness of the Godhead bodily. 10 And ye are complete in him, which is the head of all principality and power:

Thank you for sharing, but hopefully, you can see my concern for the body of Christ today is honest, sincere, and legit Biblically. I know that only God can cause the increase but this is His warning for today.

 

[GodB4Us]

Could I assume that you do not pray in another language, and this is why this subject bothers you as much as it does?

It bothers me that you guys believe God's gift of tongues of other men's lips is for speaking unto the people and you got that tongue by believing the lie that you can receive the Holy Spirit again apart from salvation.

This is about keeping the faith which is the good fight.

And could I ask if you have ever cast out an unclean spirit, or laid hands on an ill person, as the Lord instructed you, who was then healed, or any other thing spoken of a true believer?

Khundalini can do the same thing, so time to start testing the spirits, brother. Jesus did warn believers of false prophets coming into the churches that will lead many astray & by miracles too.

Matthew 7:21 Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven. 22 Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works? 23 And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity.

God has delivered me from dark forces and kept me from falling in serving holy laughter movement too when I am to serve Him in seeking His glory not the glory of something else in His name.

 

[Curtis]

Romans 8:26 Likewise the Spirit also helpeth our infirmities: for we know not what we should pray for as we ought: but the Spirit itself maketh intercession for us with groanings which cannot be uttered. KJV

That means no sound at all and so it aligs with the truth in His words in John 16:13

That is not true. The word, "groanings" in this scripture (Romans 8:26) is the exact same word used in Acts 7:34

Rom 8:26 Likewise the Spirit also helpeth our infirmities: for we know not what we should pray for as we ought: but the Spirit itself maketh intercession for us with groanings which cannot be uttered.

Act 7:34 I have seen, I have seen the affliction of my people which is in Egypt, and I have heard their groaning, and am come down to deliver them. And now come, I will send thee into Egypt.

 

[Samson2020]

It bothers me that you guys believe God's gift of tongues of other men's lips is for speaking unto the people and you got that tongue by believing the lie that you can receive the Holy Spirit again apart from salvation.

But I received that gift at the infilling of the Holy Ghost. I never used it for anyones edification other than my own. I have never been given utterance in a group.
The spiritual son of God that is in me speaks for me. Thats it.

It is possible that you have the gift but since your convinced it isn't of God then you will not allow that to occur.

But you never answered the questions.
For me the casting out, and the healing issues are the ways that the Lord confirms to us that we are who He says we are in Him. I do not seek works, but as He instructs
those are the works specifically for me.

He did say in John 14:12 "Verily, Verily, I say unto you, he that believeth on me, the works that I do shall he do also; and greater works than these shall he do; because I go unto the Father."

Do we believe there are fakes out there? Sure. But the sheep know His voice and do what He instructs and leave it at that.
If one claims to be one of His sheep and cannot hear His voice maybe they should reconsider their position.
I know a lot of professing Christians that do not have the Holy Ghost, they're just Bible readers, well versed, but are not part of the flock. "Without the Spirit ye are none of His"
It is this group that are held captive by the "church" and continue to be robbed every Sunday, and will be those that fall away when what they believe does not come to pass
according to the timeline they hold. Rapture that doesn't happen will cause their faith to completely fall apart.
They have no personal relationship and only believe, they do not KNOW HIM or His voice.
I realize the Bible speaks of the believer, but those who know Him are knowers, not just believers.

We have faith that God raised Jesus from the dead, and that Jesus is the Son of God in the flesh and in the spirit. Why can one not have faith in the gifts that He gave to men to
either edify themselves or others?

 

[Samson2020]

That is not true. The word, "groanings" in this scripture (Romans 8:26) is the exact same word used in Acts 7:34

Rom 8:26 Likewise the Spirit also helpeth our infirmities: for we know not what we should pray for as we ought: but the Spirit itself maketh intercession for us with groanings which cannot be uttered.

Act 7:34 I have seen, I have seen the affliction of my people which is in Egypt, and I have heard their groaning, and am come down to deliver them. And now come, I will send thee into Egypt.

I agree. If you couldn't hear it, how would you know it's taking place???? That is the spirit speaking for you.

 

[GodB4Us]

That is not true. The word, "groanings" in this scripture (Romans 8:26) is the exact same word used in Acts 7:34

Rom 8:26 Likewise the Spirit also helpeth our infirmities: for we know not what we should pray for as we ought: but the Spirit itself maketh intercession for us with groanings which cannot be uttered.

Act 7:34 I have seen, I have seen the affliction of my people which is in Egypt, and I have heard their groaning, and am come down to deliver them. And now come, I will send thee into Egypt.

Brother,

There is a difference between claiming the Holy Spirit is groaning which the KJV and a few other modern Bibles say it is not being uttered, and God hearing people groaning.

 

[GodB4Us]

I agree. If you couldn't hear it, how would you know it's taking place???? That is the spirit speaking for you.

But the Spirit cannot speak from Himself but speaks what He hears. Whatever bible version you are using check out John 16:13.

John 16: 13 Howbeit when he, the Spirit of truth, is come, he will guide you into all truth: for he shall not speak of himself; but whatsoever he shall hear, that shall he speak: and he will shew you things to come. KJV

John 16: 13 When the Spirit of truth comes, he will guide you into all the truth, for he will not speak on his own authority, but whatever he hears he will speak, and he will declare to you the things that are to come. ESV

John 16: 13 Howbeit when he, the Spirit of truth, is come, he shall guide you into all the truth: for he shall not speak from himself; but what things soever he shall hear, these shall he speak: and he shall declare unto you the things that are to come. ASV

John 16: 13 But when he, the Spirit of truth, comes, he will guide you into all the truth. He will not speak on his own; he will speak only what he hears, and he will tell you what is yet to come. NIV

John 16: 13 But when He, the Spirit of truth, comes, He will guide you into all the truth; for He will not speak on His own initiative, but whatever He hears, He will speak; and He will disclose to you what is to come. NASB

Therefore the Holy Spirit is not uttering His groanings out loud when making intercessions for believers for why we would not know when the Holy Spirit does that, indeed, He could be doing it non-stop for how else would the father knows everything before we ask anything in prayer?

Matthew 6:7 But when ye pray, use not vain repetitions, as the heathen do: for they think that they shall be heard for their much speaking. 8 Be not ye therefore like unto them: for your Father knoweth what things ye have need of, before ye ask him.

God's gift of tongues are not needed by the Holy Spirit to pray for us and therefore tongues are not for private use.

 

[Curtis]

Brother,

There is a difference between claiming the Holy Spirit is groaning which the KJV and a few other modern Bibles say it is not being uttered, and God hearing people groaning.

"not being uttered" means not in your normal kind of speech, which is why it is called an unknown tongue.

 

[GodB4Us]

But I received that gift at the infilling of the Holy Ghost. I never used it for anyones edification other than my own. I have never been given utterance in a group.
The spiritual son of God that is in me speaks for me. Thats it.

Pray tell, how can you know what that tongue for private use is doing? s it self edification? The Holy Spirit praying for you? There are other supposed claims of tongues for private use and yet you cannot know what that tongue is doing and so I ask you how is that not confusion?

I do not doubt your experience of that phenomenon, but by the scriptures I seriously do not believe that was the holy Ghost when you had been born again of the Spirit at your salvation before that "infilling".

It is possible that you have the gift but since your convinced it isn't of God then you will not allow that to occur.

When sinners got saved, they are complete in Christ and therefore there is no other calling to heed and so when a phenomenon happens to a believer later in life, they can test the spirits to know that was not the Holy Spirit when the real Holy Spirit has been in them since salvation.

But you never answered the questions

.
For me the casting out, and the healing issues are the ways that the Lord confirms to us that we are who He says we are in Him. I do not seek works, but as He instructs
those are the works specifically for me.

He did say in John 14:12 "Verily, Verily, I say unto you, he that believeth on me, the works that I do shall he do also; and greater works than these shall he do; because I go unto the Father."

But you are using miracles as proof or a sign that you are in Him when it isn't because of Matthew 7:21-23 as these professing believers were doing miracles too and guess what? They were workers of iniquity for why God was denying them.

That was what that video was all about in exposing the works of darkness as these believers "fall" for why it is not of Him per Matthew 7:24-27

Do we believe there are fakes out there?

Sure. But the sheep know His voice and do what He instructs and leave it at that.
If one claims to be one of His sheep and cannot hear His voice maybe they should reconsider their position.
I know a lot of professing Christians that do not have the Holy Ghost, they're just Bible readers, well versed, but are not part of the flock. "Without the Spirit ye are none of His"
It is this group that are held captive by the "church" and continue to be robbed every Sunday, and will be those that fall away when what they believe does not come to pass
according to the timeline they hold. Rapture that doesn't happen will cause their faith to completely fall apart.
They have no personal relationship and only believe, they do not KNOW HIM or His voice.
I realize the Bible speaks of the believer, but those who know Him are knowers, not just believers.

We have faith that God raised Jesus from the dead, and that Jesus is the Son of God in the flesh and in the spirit. Why can one not have faith in the gifts that He gave to men to
either edify themselves or others?

The fruit of the Spirit is temperance which is self control & so when a believer loses that by falling as supposedly the "Holy Spirit" is falling on them for miracles to occur, that is NOT the Holy Spirit. Test the spirits, brother. 1 John 4:1-6

 

[GodB4Us]

"not being uttered" means not in your normal kind of speech, which is why it is called an unknown tongue.

The wordings in the KJV is "with groanings which cannot be uttered" means no sound at all. It is not referring to normal speech that is not being uttered, but His groanings which cannot be uttered.

But the Spirit cannot speak from Himself but speaks what He hears. Whatever bible version you are using check out John 16:13. That has to include His groanings too because He cannot utter them from Himself.

John 16: 13 Howbeit when he, the Spirit of truth, is come, he will guide you into all truth: for he shall not speak of himself; but whatsoever he shall hear, that shall he speak: and he will shew you things to come. KJV

John 16: 13 When the Spirit of truth comes, he will guide you into all the truth, for he will not speak on his own authority, but whatever he hears he will speak, and he will declare to you the things that are to come. ESV

John 16: 13 Howbeit when he, the Spirit of truth, is come, he shall guide you into all the truth: for he shall not speak from himself; but what things soever he shall hear, these shall he speak: and he shall declare unto you the things that are to come. ASV

John 16: 13 But when he, the Spirit of truth, comes, he will guide you into all the truth. He will not speak on his own; he will speak only what he hears, and he will tell you what is yet to come. NIV

John 16: 13 But when He, the Spirit of truth, comes, He will guide you into all the truth; for He will not speak on His own initiative, but whatever He hears, He will speak; and He will disclose to you what is to come. NASB

Therefore the Holy Spirit is not uttering His groanings out loud when making intercessions for believers for why we would not know when the Holy Spirit does that, indeed, He could be doing it non-stop for how else would the father knows everything before we ask anything in prayer?

Matthew 6:7 But when ye pray, use not vain repetitions, as the heathen do: for they think that they shall be heard for their much speaking. 8 Be not ye therefore like unto them: for your Father knoweth what things ye have need of, before ye ask him.

God's gift of tongues are not needed by the Holy Spirit to pray for us and therefore tongues are not for private use.

 

[Samson2020]

But the Spirit cannot speak from Himself but speaks what He hears.

I think I know the problem here. It is simply this. The Holy Ghost speaks to us. Our spirit once born from above is able to speak in spiritual language to the Father, thus it is not the Holy
Ghost speaking for us it is the New creature within us that speaks. The newly formed son of God.

 

[Curtis]

But the Spirit cannot speak from Himself but speaks what He hears. Whatever bible version you are using check out John 16:13. That has to include His groanings too because He cannot utter them from Himself.

1Co 14:14 For if I pray in an [unknown] tongue, my spirit [by the Holy Spirit within me] prays, but my mind is unproductive [it bears no fruit and helps nobody]. (AMP)

The Holy Spirit does not pray for us alone. He is the one telling us what to say, My spirit by the Holy Spirit prays.

 

[Curtis]

If Jesus only speaks what he hears his father say, and the Holy only speaks what he hears then where are his words coming from? Whose words is he repeating?

 

[Bob Carabbio]

When believers defend tongues for private use, they are ignoring Paul's teaching on gifts are not for private use

Sorry, but Paul NEVER teaches that "Tongues" are not for private use. That's nothing but your flawed opinion. Paul Teaches that Tongues spoken in private are EDIFYING to the Person speaking them. A Person who is spiritually edified becomes a more effective minister to the body.

Then follows a pile of absolute foolishness, indicating that you have little or NO actual knowledge of how tongues are actually manifested in meetings.

NATURALLY a person's private tongues have no place in an open meeting, but the Corinthians were a undisciplined bunch that actually JUDGED EACH OTHER by the gifts manifested (as though they had anything to do with them) - "My Gift is better than your gift - I Have no need for YOU!!" obviously the Corinthian church was experiencing folks blatting out their tongues without being burdened to do so (so that there was no interpreter), and generally "Showing off" disruptively. Paul NEVER says the Tongues were FALSE - he just instructs on their proper use IN THE MEETING CONTEXT.

When the Holy Spirit burdens a person in a meeting to manifest "Tongues" in a meeting, he'll also burden another(s) (or the tongues speaker themselves) to Interpret, and He'll also "hold" the service to make space for the Gifts to manifest. Tongues + Interpretation = Prophesy - i.e. a WORD FROM GOD for the congregation. which is the real topic of 1 Cor 14.

NOTHING in that chapter teaches anything negative about "Private use of tongues" at all. Paul clearly states that you are Praising WELL personally, but others aren't edified by it (duh) since they can't understand it. Your eisegesis is inaccurate, and ignored.

That is why I do not believe God's gift of tongues were ever meant for private use.

Fine, then DON'T EVER SPEAK IN TONGUES in private - since you apparently can't do it in FAITH (Rom 14:23).

 

[GodB4Us]

I think I know the problem here. It is simply this. The Holy Ghost speaks to us. Our spirit once born from above is able to speak in spiritual language to the Father, thus it is not the Holy
Ghost speaking for us it is the New creature within us that speaks. The newly formed son of God.

Thank you for sharing in trying to figure this out Biblically, but I disagree. And I doubt you can get others that use tongues for private use to all agree with you. Having been born of the Spirit, thus a new creature, we should all be bale to do that, but that is not what is happening. And so the defining line is that phenomenon apart from salvation moment when we had first believed in Him at the calling of the gospel.

It is better for us to pray normally to know what we had prayed for, so when we get an answer to prayers, we can give the Father genuine heartfelt thanks in Jesus's name for answers to prayers. That's better than not knowing what that tongue did in private use.

 

[GodB4Us]

1Co 14:14 For if I pray in an [unknown] tongue, my spirit [by the Holy Spirit within me] prays, but my mind is unproductive [it bears no fruit and helps nobody]. (AMP)

The Holy Spirit does not pray for us alone. He is the one telling us what to say, My spirit by the Holy Spirit prays.

1 Corinthians 14:12 Even so ye, forasmuch as ye are zealous of spiritual gifts, seek that ye may excel to the edifying of the church. 13 Wherefore let him that speaketh in an unknown tongue pray that he may interpret. 14 For if I pray in an unknown tongue, my spirit prayeth, but my understanding is unfruitful.

In context, brother Curtis, Paul is saying for those zealous for spiritual gifts, seek so as to excel the edifying of the church. Therefore those who speak in tongues, should pray that another may interpret that tongue being manifested by the Holy Ghost. Paul is praying that someone will interpret that tongue manifested through him by the Holy Ghost so he may understand it for that tongue to be fruitful to himself.

 

[joestue]

Therefore the Holy Spirit is not uttering His groanings out loud when making intercessions for believers for why we would not know when the Holy Spirit does that, indeed, He could be doing it non-stop for how else would the father knows everything before we ask anything in prayer?

Your logic here is flawed because you don't understand why Jesus said what he said.

Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works? 23 And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity.

Those people never cast out any demons, not prophesied any real prophecy from God. They were self decieved, and they lie to God at the day of judgement in an attempt of self justification.