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Can You Loose Your Salvation?

Moderator
Staff Member
Dear @Rant
Sometimes I truly believe you just can't help yourself! :(

Void only in understanding how one who professes to be a believer and seems to know scripture. Is unable to communicate with greater clarity and understanding between Brothers & Sisters in Christ Jesus.

You bring up items to the postings that require clarification, but when queried on them you only confuse the matter more without answering the question posed to you.

Maybe, I was not clear enough for you. Assuming you understood when I said "Grace" in my question that you would understand it to mean God's Saving Grace; Salvation. With that clarification, can you answer my question of "What do they (rapture, prophecy, hell) have to do with "Grace"? Since you seem to be implying that they do. Which of cause I found strange since these items tie directly to a works mentality that you abhor and say is unscriptural.

With the Love of Christ Jesus.
YBIC
Nick
<><

Titus 2:7
 
Loyal
Lan>> we always do what we want on this earth to a point if the ghost is in us we try our best but we have the fallen nature of Adam and Eve in us > we would all lost our salvation . but by GRACE!

You are right about one thing. None of us will make it on our own. None of us will will make it "without" grace.
But grace doesn't cover everything, it is possible to fall short of grace.

Heb 12:15; See to it that no one comes short of the grace of God; that no root of bitterness springing up causes trouble, and by it many be defiled;

Some people choose to return to sin.

2 Pet 2:18; For speaking out arrogant words of vanity they entice by fleshly desires, by sensuality, those who barely escape from the ones who live in error,
2 Pet 2:19; promising them freedom while they themselves are slaves of corruption; for by what a man is overcome, by this he is enslaved.
2 Pet 2:20; For if, after they have escaped the defilements of the world by the knowledge of the Lord and Savior Jesus Christ, they are again entangled in them and are overcome, the last state has become worse for them than the first.
2 Pet 2:21; For it would be better for them not to have known the way of righteousness, than having known it, to turn away from the holy commandment handed on to them.
2 Pet 2:22; It has happened to them according to the true proverb, "A DOG RETURNS TO ITS OWN VOMIT," and, "A sow, after washing, returns to wallowing in the mire."

I am going to Heaven, regardless of how I live. But you say, that's crazy! No! That's Bible! So do Christians have a license to sin? Yes, if you want to view it that way.

I am curious, what verse says we can live however we want to and we will still go to heaven?

Rom 6:14-15; say we aren't under "the law". We don't sacrifice animals anymore, go to priests anymore, confess to the priests anymore,
we don't stone people caught in adultery anymore. There is a lot of the ceremonial law and civil law we aren't under anymore.

But yet we are told about 20 times to "keep the commandments" in the new testament. Even by Paul.

1 Cor 7:19; Circumcision is nothing, and uncircumcision is nothing, but what matters is the keeping of the commandments of God.

Circumcision was "the law". Circumcision doesn't save us.

Why would you throw out all of these verses?

Matt 5:19; "Whoever then annuls one of the least of these commandments, and teaches others to do the same, shall be called least in the kingdom of heaven; but whoever keeps and teaches them, he shall be called great in the kingdom of heaven.
Matt 19:17; And He said to him, "Why are you asking Me about what is good? There is only One who is good; but if you wish to enter into life, keep the commandments."
Matt 22:40; "On these two commandments depend the whole Law and the Prophets."
Mark 10:19; "You know the commandments, 'DO NOT MURDER, DO NOT COMMIT ADULTERY, DO NOT STEAL, DO NOT BEAR FALSE WITNESS, Do not defraud, HONOR YOUR FATHER AND MOTHER.'"
Luke 1:6; They were both righteous in the sight of God, walking blamelessly in all the commandments and requirements of the Lord.
Luke 18:20; "You know the commandments, 'DO NOT COMMIT ADULTERY, DO NOT MURDER, DO NOT STEAL, DO NOT BEAR FALSE WITNESS, HONOR YOUR FATHER AND MOTHER.'"
John 14:15; "If you love Me, you will keep My commandments.
John 14:21; "He who has My commandments and keeps them is the one who loves Me; and he who loves Me will be loved by My Father, and I will love him and will disclose Myself to him."
John 15:10; "If you keep My commandments, you will abide in My love; just as I have kept My Father's commandments and abide in His love.
1 Cor 7:19; Circumcision is nothing, and uncircumcision is nothing, but what matters is the keeping of the commandments of God.
1 Thes 4:2 For you know what commandments we gave you by the authority of the Lord Jesus.
1 Jn 2:3 By this we know that we have come to know Him, if we keep His commandments.
1 Jn 2:4 The one who says, "I have come to know Him," and does not keep His commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him;
1 Jn 3:22 and whatever we ask we receive from Him, because we keep His commandments and do the things that are pleasing in His sight.
1 Jn 3:24 The one who keeps His commandments abides in Him, and He in him. We know by this that He abides in us, by the Spirit whom He has given us.
1 Jn 5:2 By this we know that we love the children of God, when we love God and observe His commandments.
1 Jn 5:3 For this is the love of God, that we keep His commandments; and His commandments are not burdensome.
2 Jn 1:6 And this is love, that we walk according to His commandments. This is the commandment, just as you have heard from the beginning, that you should walk in it.
Rev 12:17 So the dragon was enraged with the woman, and went off to make war with the rest of her children, who keep the commandments of God and hold to the testimony of Jesus.
Rev 14:12 Here is the perseverance of the saints who keep the commandments of God and their faith in Jesus.
 
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Loyal
Its very intro how some people think!>>>>!He has always been fair, but He does not want anyone as a part of the Body of Christ who is unwillingly to strive to do the impossible to please Him. Those He will help when they ask for it.>>> Can you loose your salvation?? that's what I'm talking about>> they wiggle like a worm but say nothing>> well this and that and that and this !! No you can not loose your salvation!! that's It! only man says you can!!
And all you have done is repeat yourself my friend. You may believe what you say, but do you really hear all that God speaks to people through the Bible? It is His voice that we need to be hearing, but when we have decided that we have it all, we [this includes me] are in trouble. We must be increasing in Him while the old man is decreasing in us:

"He must increase, but I must decrease. " John 3:30

If you disagree with what I have said that is allowed, but please do more than rant.

Are you abiding in Him?

Please dont tell me you can do whatever you want.>> Yes you Can!!>>>>> This forum and your members talk about Jesus even your forum is called Jesus talk but lack the understanding about Jesus Salvation and Grace! prophecy and lean to slavery that Jesus Christ came to set us free!
When someone is really free in every aspect of the bonds of this world then should not they always manifest it? Consider what charity is [I Cor 13:4-7]my friend and manifest that instead of ranting continously that you are right and everyone else is wrong. Without charity your words are noise and nothing [I Cor 13:1-2].
 
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Active
A License to Sin?

I am going to Heaven, regardless of how I live. But you say, that's crazy! No! That's Bible! So do Christians have a license to sin? Yes, if you want to view it that way. Of course, no believer has God's permission to sin, which is why He has set apart a judgment, i.e., the JUDGMENT SEAT OF CHRIST, just for believers (2nd Corinthians 5:10; 1st Thessalonians 4:6; Romans 12:19; 14:12). God expects every believer to fulfill the Law. The Apostle Paul makes this very clear...

"Do we then make void the law through faith? God forbid: yea, we establish the law" —Romans 3:31

"What then? shall we sin, because we are not under the law, but under grace? God forbid." —Romans 6:15

Carefully notice that a believer is NO LONGER UNDER THE LAW. There is no condemnation for the believer. However, a believer who sins must give account to God at the Judgment Seat of Christ someday (2nd Corinthians 5:10). Please read Defraud Not Thy Brother. No one is going to get away with anything friend. It is this misunderstanding that often prompts people to create false doctrines about losing one's salvation. They are tired of phony Christians, and so am I. However, we are all phonies to some degree if we'll be honest with ourselves, because even the best of Christians still sin.
No! A person who thinks they have a right /license to sin is no Christian at all. To be remorseful and ever wanting to abide in Christ and having the understanding that we are forgiven despite our inequities, now that is a Christian! Romans 8:1
 
Member
I sin every day> You sin every day >your and my wife sin every day!>>I like the small sin or the BIIIIIIG Sin!! all is sin!
 
Loyal
one thing to stumble in sin it another to live in sin,

1 Corinthians 6:9-10
Or do you not know that the unrighteous will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived: neither the sexually immoral, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor men who practice homosexuality, nor thieves, nor the greedy, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor swindlers will inherit the kingdom of God.
 
Loyal
"These things have I written unto you that believe on the name of the Son of God; that ye may know that ye have eternal life, and that ye may believe on the name of the Son of God." —1st John 5:13

I love this verse!... that we may "KNOW," not think, but KNOW that we have eternal life. How could anyone be so foolish as to think that a person could lose "eternal life?" If you can lose it, then is it eternal? No! When God promises us eternal life, that is exactly what He means. Jesus didn't say, "I give unto them temporal life"; no rather, He said, "I give unto them eternal life (John 10:28)." I am eternally secure in Jesus' arms...

"The eternal God is thy refuge, and underneath are the everlasting arms..." —Deuteronomy 33:27

Don't tell me I can lose my salvation! There is NO such teaching in the Bible!

You simply don't want to see it.

If once saved always saved is true then why did the Lord say this?

Revelation 2: 4 Nevertheless I have somewhat against you, because you have left your first love.

5 Remember therefore from where you are fallen, and repent, and do the first works; or else I will come unto you quickly, and will remove your lampstand out of its place, except you repent.

Then to the children of the harlot fleshly church that are driven by the seductions of Jezebel Jesus says the following.

Revelation 2:21 And I gave her time to repent of her fornication; and she repented not.

22 Behold, I will cast her into a bed, and them that commit adultery with her into great tribulation, except they repent of their deeds.

23 And I will kill her children with death; and all the churches shall know that I am he who searches the minds and hearts: and I will give unto every one of you according to your works.

Then to the Laodicean fleshly church that fell into deception of the gospel of greed He says;

Revelation 3 : 15 I know your works, that you are neither cold nor hot: I would that you were cold or hot.

16 So then because you are lukewarm, and neither cold nor hot, I will spew you out of my mouth.

17 Because you say, I am rich, and increased with goods, and have need of nothing; and know not that you are wretched, and miserable, and poor, and blind, and naked.

Then we see God's call to repentance through Isaiah 1: 2 Hear, O heavens, and give ear, O earth: for the LORD has spoken, I have nourished and brought up children, and they have rebelled against me.

3 The ox knows his owner, and the donkey his master's crib: but Israel does not know, my people do not consider.

4 Ah sinful nation, a people laden with iniquity, a descendant of evildoers, children that are corrupters: they have forsaken the LORD, they have provoked the Holy One of Israel unto anger, they have turned away backward.

5 Why should you be stricken any more? you will revolt more and more: the whole head is sick, and the whole heart faint.

6 From the sole of the foot even unto the head there is no soundness in it; but wounds, and bruises, and putrefying sores: they have not been closed, neither bound up, neither soothed with ointment.

7 Your country is desolate, your cities are burned with fire: your land, strangers devour it in your presence, and it is desolate, as overthrown by strangers.

8 And the daughter of Zion is left as a booth in a vineyard, as a hut in a garden of cucumbers, as a besieged city.

9 Unless the LORD of hosts had left unto us a very small remnant, we should have been as Sodom, and we should have been like unto Gomorrah.

10 Hear the word of the LORD, you rulers of Sodom; give ear unto the law of our God, you people of Gomorrah.

11 To what purpose is the multitude of your sacrifices unto me? says the LORD: I am full of the burnt offerings of rams, and the fat of fed beasts; and I delight not in the blood of bullocks, or of lambs, or of male goats.

12 When you come to appear before me, who has required this at your hand, to trample my courts?

13 Bring no more vain offerings; incense is an abomination unto me; the new moons and sabbaths, the calling of assemblies, I cannot endure; it is iniquity, even the solemn meeting.

14 Your new moons and your appointed feasts my soul hates: they are a trouble unto me; I am weary of bearing them.

15 And when you spread forth your hands, I will hide my eyes from you: yea, when you make many prayers, I will not hear: your hands are full of blood.

16 Wash you, make yourself clean; put away the evil of your doings from before my eyes; cease to do evil;

17 Learn to do good; seek justice, relieve the oppressed, judge the fatherless, plead for the widow.

18 Come now, and let us reason together, says the LORD: though your sins be as scarlet, they shall be as white as snow; though they be red like crimson, they shall be as wool.

19 If you are willing and obedient, you shall eat the good of the land:

20 But if you refuse and rebel, you shall be devoured with the sword: for the mouth of the LORD has spoken it.

21 How has the faithful city become a harlot! it was full of justice; righteousness lodged in it; but now murderers.

22 Your silver has become dross, your wine mixed with water:

23 Your princes are rebellious, and companions of thieves: everyone loves bribes, and follows after rewards: they judge not the fatherless, neither does the cause of the widow come before them.

24 Therefore says the Lord, the LORD of hosts, the mighty One of Israel, Ah, I will rid myself of my adversaries, and avenge myself of my enemies:

25 And I will turn my hand upon you, and thoroughly purge away your dross, and take away all your alloy:

26 And I will restore your judges as at the first, and your counselors as at the beginning: afterward you shall be called, The city of righteousness, the faithful city.

27 Zion shall be redeemed with justice, and her converts with righteousness.

28 And the destruction of the transgressors and of the sinners shall be together, and they that forsake the LORD shall be consumed.

29 For you shall be ashamed of the sacred oaks which you have desired, and you shall be embarrassed for the gardens that you have chosen.

30 For you shall be as an oak whose leaf fades, and as a garden that has no water.

31 And the strong shall be as tinder, and the work of it as a spark, and they shall both burn together, and none shall quench them.

Isaiah 5: 11 Woe unto them that rise up early in the morning, that they may follow strong drink; that continue until night, till wine inflames them!

12 And the harp, and the lyre, the timbrel, and flute, and wine, are in their feasts: but they regard not the work of the LORD, neither consider the operation of his hands.

13 Therefore my people have gone into captivity, because they have no knowledge: and their honorable men are famished, and their multitude dried up with thirst.

14 Therefore sheol has enlarged itself, and opened its mouth without measure: and their glory, and their multitude, and their pomp, and he that exults, shall descend into it.

15 And man shall be brought down, and the mighty man shall be humbled, and the eyes of the lofty shall be humbled:

16 But the LORD of hosts shall be exalted in justice, and God who is holy shall be sanctified in righteousness.

17 Then shall the lambs feed in their pasture, and the waste places of the rich ones shall strangers eat.

18 Woe unto them that draw iniquity with cords of vanity, and sin as it were with a cart rope:

19 That say, Let him make speed, and hasten his work, that we may see it: and let the counsel of the Holy One of Israel draw near and come, that we may know it!

20 Woe unto them that call evil good, and good evil; that put darkness for light, and light for darkness; that put bitter for sweet, and sweet for bitter!

21 Woe unto them that are wise in their own eyes, and prudent in their own sight!

22 Woe unto them that are mighty to drink wine, and men of strength to mix strong drink:

23 Who justify the wicked for a bribe, and take away the justice of the righteous from him!

24 Therefore as the fire devours the stubble, and the flame consumes the chaff, so their root shall be as rottenness, and their blossom shall go up as dust: because they have rejected the law of the LORD of hosts, and despised the word of the Holy One of Israel.


 
Loyal
A License to Sin?

I am going to Heaven, regardless of how I live. But you say, that's crazy! No! That's Bible! So do Christians have a license to sin? Yes, if you want to view it that way. Of course, no believer has God's permission to sin, which is why He has set apart a judgment, i.e., the JUDGMENT SEAT OF CHRIST, just for believers (2nd Corinthians 5:10; 1st Thessalonians 4:6; Romans 12:19; 14:12). God expects every believer to fulfill the Law. The Apostle Paul makes this very clear...

"Do we then make void the law through faith? God forbid: yea, we establish the law" —Romans 3:31

"What then? shall we sin, because we are not under the law, but under grace? God forbid." —Romans 6:15

Carefully notice that a believer is NO LONGER UNDER THE LAW. There is no condemnation for the believer. However, a believer who sins must give account to God at the Judgment Seat of Christ someday (2nd Corinthians 5:10). Please read Defraud Not Thy Brother. No one is going to get away with anything friend. It is this misunderstanding that often prompts people to create false doctrines about losing one's salvation. They are tired of phony Christians, and so am I. However, we are all phonies to some degree if we'll be honest with ourselves, because even the best of Christians still sin.

What law are we not under? There are/were two sets of laws. What law are we not under?

I LOV when people just take a pile of verses and try make it look like the bible is saying something that it is not!!!!! that is called twisting the bible for your own lusts!
You should stop twisting it then. I agree its not a good thing.

Are you abiding in Him?

Please dont tell me you can do whatever you want.>> Yes you Can!!>>>>> This forum and your members talk about Jesus even your forum is called Jesus talk but lack the understanding about Jesus Salvation and Grace! prophecy and lean to slavery that Jesus Christ came to set us free!
Tell me son.....You've been talking a lot about grace....Can you even tell me what grace is?
 
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Loyal
I love this verse!... that we may "KNOW," not think, but KNOW that we have eternal life.

I'm not sure what "knowing" has to do with anything. Just about anything we "know" can change.

People "know" they are married today. Those same people aren't married tomorrow.
People "know" they have a job today, those same people don't have a job tomorrow.
People "know" their team won the superbowl or world series last year, those same people don't know that next year.

Matt 7:21; "Not everyone who says to Me, 'Lord, Lord,' will enter the kingdom of heaven, but he who does the will of My Father who is in heaven will enter.
Matt 7:22; "Many will say to Me on that day, 'Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in Your name, and in Your name cast out demons, and in Your name perform many miracles?'
Matt 7:23; "And then I will declare to them, 'I never knew you; DEPART FROM ME, YOU WHO PRACTICE LAWLESSNESS.'

I'm sure these people "knew" they were saved, up until this point.

I sin every day> You sin every day >your and my wife sin every day!>>I like the small sin or the BIIIIIIG Sin!! all is sin!

We all make mistakes from time to time. The Bible says there is a difference between sinning, and those who practice sin.
It makes a distinction about willfully choosing to sin.

Matt 7:23; "And then I will declare to them, 'I never knew you; DEPART FROM ME, YOU WHO PRACTICE LAWLESSNESS.'

Notice it doesn't say "if you 'ever' sinned" or committed lawlessness. It says those who "practice" lawlessness.

Gal 5:21; envying, drunkenness, carousing, and things like these, of which I forewarn you, just as I have forewarned you, that those who practice such things will not inherit the kingdom of God.

1 Jn 3:4; Everyone who practices sin also practices lawlessness; and sin is lawlessness.

1 Jn 3:8; the one who practices sin is of the devil; for the devil has sinned from the beginning. The Son of God appeared for this purpose, to destroy the works of the devil.
1 Jn 3:9; No one who is born of God practices sin, because His seed abides in him; and he cannot sin, because he is born of God.

If we sin, there is grace. If we continue to willfully "practice" sin....

Heb 10:26; For if we go on sinning willfully after receiving the knowledge of the truth, there no longer remains a sacrifice for sins,

Rom 1:29; being filled with all unrighteousness, wickedness, greed, evil; full of envy, murder, strife, deceit, malice; they are gossips,
Rom 1:30; slanderers, haters of God, insolent, arrogant, boastful, inventors of evil, disobedient to parents,
Rom 1:31; without understanding, untrustworthy, unloving, unmerciful;
Rom 1:32; and although they know the ordinance of God, that those who practice such things are worthy of death, they not only do the same, but also give hearty approval to those who practice them.
 
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Active
Rant maybe you need deliverance. Your posts are disturbing and not the norm for a christian...we are to walk in the spirit and make no provision for the flesh. Jesus sets us free from sin so we do not live how we want we live how He wants. We do not deliberately choose to sin and hurt other people. That is not glorifying God.

I dont know what sin you 'struggle' with but from your posts it could be anger. I get the impression you have a lot of anger.

Galatians tells us we have been crucified with Christ. No longer we live but the life we live in the flesh we live by the Son of God who gave himself for us and loved us.

Grace empowers us to STOP sinning. Grace is a divine work on your heart. God is merciful and patient. We dont sin so that we can have more grace. We stop sinning because of His grace.

All of us here are praying you will understand His word.

David lost the joy of his salvation when he commited adultery and murder and sinned with Bathsheba.
He did repent after a time and asked God to make his heart clean.

So this was back in the Old Testament.

He knew it was wrong but still did it and so was far from God. But David knew he had to repent and reconcile with God. Please dont kid yourself and think sin you commit does not matter to God. It does. Jesus does not want you to continue in sin. He sends us a helper so we wont...so that we CAN follow Him.

Do not grieve the helper!
 
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Active
Rant this is a delicate subject and there is no need to jump on those with opposing views as the underlying truth remains the same with either view. Namely, fruits of the Spirit are the sign to all Matt 7:16.

Example: If OSAS is true, we will see fruits of the Spirit in the saved person. If OSAS is not true, we will know who is still in the fold by their fruits of the Spirit. God is able to know who is His, but for us... people who seem lukewarm......not a chance as no human can grasp the heart in its entirety Jer 17:9-12.
 
Active
If once saved always saved is true then why did the Lord say this?

Revelation 2: 4 Nevertheless I have somewhat against you, because you have left your first love.

5 Remember therefore from where you are fallen, and repent, and do the first works; or else I will come unto you quickly, and will remove your lampstand out of its place, except you repent.

Then to the children of the harlot fleshly church that are driven by the seductions of Jezebel Jesus says the following.

Revelation 2:21 And I gave her time to repent of her fornication; and she repented not.

The once saved always saved refers to the Born Again Christian; I see no indication that the Lord was talking about the
" Born Again" here...just the opposite.....you can't be ( always saved) if you are not saved to start with!
 
Member
Rant maybe you need deliverance. Your posts are disturbing and not the norm for a Christian>>WOW<<

Are you saying I am demon possessed??>>>WOW>WOW>WOW! I dont know what sin you 'struggle' with but from your posts it could be anger. I get the impression you have a lot of anger. Its very intro how some so called Christian respond to a diff theology other then what they where force fed for years!, >> Well baby >keep reading my post and maybe the holy ghost will set you free and you may say why do I do this because there is a little verse in the bible that keeps me going!! Likewise, I say unto you, there is joy in the presence of the angels of God over one sinner that repenteth. And baby you need a better understanding of the Bible>>> the ones that thought you have no Ghost! Enjoy

you have a lot of anger>> Yes I do to satans perversion that has come into his BRIDE!

Lan I want to ask you a Q>> Have you ever heard that we Are The Bride Of Christ ? just want to ask.

Well what ever I will get on to do The Ghost Will.

I see I'm very censored now by c4> threads totally wiped out!>>good for you!
 
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Loyal
I see I'm very censored now by c4> threads totally wiped out!>>good for you!
It would appear, Rant, that you are the angry one. You seem to transfer your problems to someone else and give them your rant for it. You need to be honest with yourself now, and repent. Get right with God.

The once saved always saved refers to the Born Again Christian; I see no indication that the Lord was talking about the
" Born Again" here...just the opposite.....you can't be ( always saved) if you are not saved to start with!
That was a very astute observation. Of course it's talking to Christians. As you said...we cannot lose our salvation if we're not saved.
 
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Loyal
What is your proof that the verses are talking about Christians?
Excuse me? 1 Can God take your name from the book of life if He hasn't already put it into the Book?
2 Its in the bible That alone makes it to Christians.
Revelation 2:1-7 (CJB)
2 “To the angel of the Messianic Community in Ephesus, write: ‘Here is the message from the one who holds the seven stars in his right hand and walks among the seven gold menorahs: 2 “I know what you have been doing, how hard you have worked, how you have persevered, and how you can’t stand wicked people; so you tested those who call themselves emissaries but aren’t — and you found them to be liars. 3 You are persevering, and you have suffered for my sake without growing weary. 4 But I have this against you: you have lost the love you had at first. 5 Therefore, remember where you were before you fell, turn from this sin, and do what you used to do before. Otherwise, I will come to you and remove your menorah from its place — if you don’t turn from your sin! 6 But you have this in your favor: you hate what the Nicolaitans do — I hate it too. 7 Those who have ears, let them hear what the Spirit is saying to the Messianic communities. To him winning the victory I will give the right to eat from the Tree of Life which is in God’s Gan-‘Eden.”’

Notice? He was discussing the Ephesus church with its angel. How the people could be taken out of the Lambs book of life.
To the church of Thyatira They won't repent..
To the church in Laodicea.....

Are you trying to tell me that you actually read these verses? I hope you aren't. Because I would have a time believing that.
 
Active
Excuse me? 1 Can God take your name from the book of life if He hasn't already put it into the Book?
2 Its in the bible That alone makes it to Christians.
Revelation 2:1-7 (CJB)
2 “To the angel of the Messianic Community in Ephesus, write: ‘Here is the message from the one who holds the seven stars in his right hand and walks among the seven gold menorahs: 2 “I know what you have been doing, how hard you have worked, how you have persevered, and how you can’t stand wicked people; so you tested those who call themselves emissaries but aren’t — and you found them to be liars. 3 You are persevering, and you have suffered for my sake without growing weary. 4 But I have this against you: you have lost the love you had at first. 5 Therefore, remember where you were before you fell, turn from this sin, and do what you used to do before. Otherwise, I will come to you and remove your menorah from its place — if you don’t turn from your sin! 6 But you have this in your favor: you hate what the Nicolaitans do — I hate it too. 7 Those who have ears, let them hear what the Spirit is saying to the Messianic communities. To him winning the victory I will give the right to eat from the Tree of Life which is in God’s Gan-‘Eden.”’

Notice? He was discussing the Ephesus church with its angel. How the people could be taken out of the Lambs book of life.
To the church of Thyatira They won't repent..
To the church in Laodicea.....

Are you trying to tell me that you actually read these verses? I hope you aren't. Because I would have a time believing that.

Not only do I read them, I obviously differ on their meaning than you do. Its all about a need to satisfy salvation through works not faith...God says it is by faith!

In Revelation 3:5 the church in Sardis is told, "The one who conquers will be clothed thus in white garments, and I will never blot his name out of the book of life." These conquerors refer to all Christians, meaning every person who has genuine faith in Christ will never be removed from the book of life.....genuine faith, a true "Born Again" Christian, with God in him, will never loose his/her salvation. God says he will never leave or forsake a true Christian. How do you fall away from a God like ours? OSAS
God is the beginning and the end, he is not limited by time and he is Omnipotent... the Book of Life was written before the foundation of the world and certainly you or I. God knew then who he would be in and who he wouldn't well before it happened!
 
Loyal
Not only do I read them, I obviously differ on their meaning than you do. Its all about a need to satisfy salvation through works not faith...God says it is by faith!

In Revelation 3:5 the church in Sardis is told, "The one who conquers will be clothed thus in white garments, and I will never blot his name out of the book of life." These conquerors refer to all Christians, meaning every person who has genuine faith in Christ will never be removed from the book of life.....genuine faith, a true "Born Again" Christian, with God in him, will never loose his/her salvation. God says he will never leave or forsake a true Christian. How do you fall away from a God like ours? OSAS
God is the beginning and the end, he is not limited by time and he is Omnipotent... the Book of Life was written before the foundation of the world and certainly you or I. God knew then who he would be in and who he wouldn't well before it happened!
And what of the verses I gave you? Do they just get thrown away? It appears you've taken a single verse and built a doctrine on it. Read ALL of the chapter....
 
Active
And what of the verses I gave you? Do they just get thrown away? It appears you've taken a single verse and built a doctrine on it. Read ALL of the chapter....
I understand where you are coming from but I believe in this foundation of salvation: "For it is by grace you have been saved, through faith--and this is not from yourselves, it is the gift of God--"
 
Loyal
I understand where you are coming from but I believe in this foundation of salvation: "For it is by grace you have been saved, through faith--and this is not from yourselves, it is the gift of God--"
That's right but you're dodging the issue that you brought....We are saved by the empowering PRESENCE of God. but you still can throw it away.
 
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