Can A Saved person Ever Become Unsaved?

[Mr Popples]

my kids are all old enough to look after themselves no one is getting hurt so I cant see any problems...and God being at our vows???? I find that hard to believe

 

[KingJ]

1. No, that isn't scripture that is KingJ leaning to his own understanding (again). Praise God for him. However, you took a vow to your wife in the presence of God, whether you (felt) him there or not, He was, still is, and will be.

2. If no one knows then nobody gets hurt. Really? She already knows. There are spirits hanging on you, and you don't even realize they are there.

3. You know it is wrong and Now you are in greived in heart for being unfaithful.
Here is a scripture for you.
There is nothing hidden that shall not be revealed.

4. REPENT; least greater destruction come upon you.
The goodness of God brings a soul to repentance.
We witness the goodness of God's grace and forgiveness at our lowest, darkest journeys in this life.

1. God forbid we not use the brains He gave us. Please read 1 Cor 11:31 properly. Add Phil 2:12 to it. I am happy to discuss it further with you.
2. Don't mean to be a nuisance, but how do you know there are spirits hanging on him?
3. He has said he does not feel it is wrong. We are exempt for things we don't perceive. The issue is that we don't perceive because of other reasons. Those reasons are sins we need to perceive. IE Removing God from our thoughts / entering into unbelief. Seared conscience.
4. What destruction is on him? How can he repent of something he is not convicted of?

 

[KingJ]

my kids are all old enough to look after themselves no one is getting hurt so I cant see any problems...and God being at our vows???? I find that hard to believe

Mr Popples you are hardly trying to examine yourself for sin if you see nothing wrong with adultery.

God ordained adulterers be stoned to death in the OT for many reasons. You really can't think of any?

 

[Mr Popples]

all I am saying is I don't believe I am hurting anyone....I am a good person...I help in the community....I give to the poor....I have needs and I have them met...sin or not I don't see it as Im doing anything wrong.. Am I meant to feel bad because I don't.

 

[KingJ]

1. all I am saying is I don't believe I am hurting anyone....
2. I am a good person...I help in the community....I give to the poor....
3. I have needs and I have them met...
4. sin or not I don't see it as Im doing anything wrong..
5. Am I meant to feel bad because I don't.

1. You have good intentions. That is good. But I don't believe it is truthful discernment on your part as 1 Cor 11:31 says we need.
2. That is good.
3. A pedophile could say the same thing.
4. It is sin. Would you like it if your wife was doing this to you? You really believe your kids are not going to be affected?
5. Yes, you should. According to the bible this is a mortal sin. According to the bible those who continue in willful mortal sin do not enter heaven, nor live long.

 

[rag4aCrown]

@mrpopples
You are having remorse over your actions; hence, you came to a Christian forum site seeking justifcation for your deeds, unfortunately you will not find that pat on the back you seek.

No one is being hurt? Really? The mental abuse and turmoil of feelings you are already going through isn't hurting anyone?
That is what a sinner tries to convince themselves of, so we can continue on our path of destruction.

If you do not repent and turn from your foul deeds, well God have mercy upon you.

You will be the one hurt more than all. We reap what we sow. Your kids may hate you for it and want nothing to do 28th you ever. Or, just maybe your example will fester to them and they follow in your deceitful acts. Well dad, pat yourself on the back. You taught them the acts of being a liar, a cheat and a thief; which is demonic spirits.

When your selfish little world crumbles around you, please come back and testify of the chaos you caused and all you have lost and only God is left to hold you.

All praise glory and honor be unto God Amen

 

[amadeus2]

my kids are all old enough to look after themselves no one is getting hurt so I cant see any problems...and God being at our vows???? I find that hard to believe

"The eyes of the LORD are in every place, beholding the evil and the good." Prov 15:3

"Whither shall I go from thy spirit? or whither shall I flee from thy presence?

If I ascend up into heaven, thou art there: if I make my bed in hell, behold, thou art there." Psalm 139:7-8

 

[Christ4Ever]

no I dont have a repented heart Ive come on this site to see how I feel

I really understand what you are saying but Im definitly confused about why Im not feeling any sorow so thats why Im asking or more like saying I believe I am unsaved,,,,can I decide to be unsaved??

New i actually think you are right i always sit on the fence i dont think ive ever chosen....it avtually feels good to realise that

New `so you said God doesnt walk away from us why cant I feel him

why arent I feeling anything bad about sinning??

is it because I wasnt baptised is why I am now unsaved

I think I have worked out that I CANNOT choose, I like both sides of the fence, Example having a family and having fun with my mates at the pub....Knowing about god but choosing not to follow him....sin or church...... I can never seem to make the right decission so I compensate ......eg by helping people in need donate financially to help pple out take stuff to the needy,,,,does that make up for my sin??? Does that make sense??

First Welcome to Talk Jesus @Mr Popples

I truly hope that you will benefit from your talks with those who believe in the Lord Jesus Christ as their Savior.

The starting point of everyone here who does call Jesus Savior has always been the knowledge that the life they had been living up to that point was lacking and/or the knowledge that Jesus Christ died on the Cross so that they could be reconciled with God. The need for reconciliation being needed because of the "sin" that has until that moment kept us separated from Him. Only through Jesus Christ is this possible.

I've added a few links below that would be good for you to read. Hopefully they will open not only your eyes, but your heat & spirit to what much of what you've been reading and attempting to understand is about. You are fully aware that you are doing something wrong, even though it gives you pleasure. That is a truism that just about everyone is faced with in the World. Oh, you might believe that many who are rich, famous, successful, etc. Are somehow complete. Should they ever open up, you will find the opposite. Material things are transitory and only give a momentary respite of what is really ailing us. I once heard an interview by Cher who has fame, riches, success' etc. Yet, in a moment of honesty she said something that maybe she might not have realized the significance of. Which truly speaks to humanity in general. She said that even with all the success', fame, riches it was as if something was missing. She was yet incomplete.

That is the case with you as well. Also, the same for us before we came to Jesus. No matter what you gain, lose, and gain back. You will always feel incomplete. Even after all the excesses have been satisfied. There will always remain a part that is empty. We here can tell you what the cause of that emptiness is, but it will be up to you to know it and realize what you need to do.

For if you have any doubt about your salvation. A moment in time that it was you & God. Acknowledging your lack, His Sacrifice surety by His Resurrection. If you can't go back to that moment and know! I hope and pray that some of the below links will help you to. If you're not sure what I'm talking about in asking you to go back to that one moment. Take time to look at some of the testimonies/bio's around Talk Jesus from those I can rejoice in and am blessed to call brother or sister in Christ Jesus. You will find that none speak of the good acts of charity that they have done to achieve that moment in time. For the good intentions, acts you do in helping people will never negate or balance the other side of the scale. Sadly, in this you will always fall short. You can never justify yourself to God or in truth to anyone by saying.....but what about (place justification here).
I will pray for you.
C4E
<><


Questions and Objections
Attributes of God
What if you die tonight
Why Believe in Christianity
How do I accept Jesus as my Savior
How to be friends with God

 

[Erikb]

all I am saying is I don't believe I am hurting anyone....I am a good person...I help in the community....I give to the poor....I have needs and I have them met...sin or not I don't see it as Im doing anything wrong.. Am I meant to feel bad because I don't.

Mr Popples your smart. Good play of questions, very engaging. Are you in a situation like this of unbelief or you want to find someone to support your ideas or both God Knows. One thing I can say from experience,

I have had many friends who I served on missionary fields, evangelisms, etc powerful men of God, yes young and zealous who preached and people came to repentance transformed lives, but today a few of them are living completely immoral lives and curse God. And.., and the very thing they preached before, if they would only belive it can save them!

 

[Mr Popples]

wow that was alot of thinking... I will be honest I came on this site to see how it would make me feel....Ive been feeling very empty.... so much in my life run a business have a family involved in the comunity but feel empty....wanted to see how I felt and maybe find an excuse for what I have been doing....

 

[KingJ]

wow that was alot of thinking... I will be honest I came on this site to see how it would make me feel....Ive been feeling very empty.... so much in my life run a business have a family involved in the comunity but feel empty....wanted to see how I felt and maybe find an excuse for what I have been doing....

God lead you here before you became further lost. It happens to all of us. Don't beat yourself up too much. Just focus on falling in love with God and your wife again. Praying for you bud. Good luck!

 

[bijush.mbcam1]

Just wanted to ask you a question RJ, even if it be hypothetical.

What if a person truly repented of his sins and accepted Jesus as Savior and later on (say maybe 5-6 yrs. later) falls into a specific sin of which he does not repent and continues in it and suddenly dies?

 

[bijush.mbcam1]

Well God gives changes and waits for us. Jesus is sitting at the right hand of God and ask his father(God ) for forgiveness.... daily...
If a person falls again and again to sin , God forgives us and understands that we are dust.
When Jesus came to a fig tree and came to know that it did not bear any fruit he cursed...
Same thing should not came to us.John 3:3
Read from Mathew 7:16 to 20...

 

[bijush.mbcam1]

I'm interested to hear why people who say we can lose salvation havent ever explained Ephesians 4:30 ? Atleast I've never heard explantion to this.

Is it possible that by disobedience or willingful sin , God takes back His holy spirit?
And we become dead?

Many of the preachers of the present generation should believe that every disobedience of man would attract punishment from God.
When we receive the Lord as our personal saviour-- different experience, when we accept water baptism---- different experience-- Holy spirit anointing---- different experience... If a person receives holy spirit anointing ( they speak in tongues) This experience happened when during the pentecost all the disciples,
people, received the holy spirit anointing... ( the power from of high)Refer acts chapter 2: 1 to 22...
When some people received the holy spirit anointing, have to keep the unity in obeying god by following his commandments. Some stray and do grave sins so God takes back his holy spirit...

 

[Erikb]

wow that was alot of thinking... I will be honest I came on this site to see how it would make me feel....Ive been feeling very empty.... so much in my life run a business have a family involved in the comunity but feel empty....wanted to see how I felt and maybe find an excuse for what I have been doing....

Yes, I know that feeling exactly, esp when I would go on missionary trips to foreign country's and serve full time, coming back home to the same vanity of work etc and church I would feel like I was so usless, and it would take weeks to get back into routine life.. Esp in America where everything is handed to you, don't get me wrong I work hard too.

Mark 4:18-19
[18] Still others, like seed sown among thorns, hear the word; [19] but the worries of this life, the deceitfulness of wealth and the desires for other things come in and choke the word, making it unfruitful.

The 3 things that can happen in a believes life 1 year later or 20 years later, that we must watch for.

 

[Thiscrosshurts]

Proverbs 20:24 A man’s steps are directed by the LORD. How then can anyone understand his own way?

wow that was alot of thinking... I will be honest I came on this site to see how it would make me feel....Ive been feeling very empty.... so much in my life run a business have a family involved in the comunity but feel empty....wanted to see how I felt and maybe find an excuse for what I have been doing....

It's the goodness of God that leads to repentance not remorse.
God is love.
God is not going to stop being love just to make you feel bad.

1 Corinthians 13:4 Love is patient, love is kind. It does not envy, it does not boast, it is not proud.
1 Corinthians 13:5 It does not dishonor others,It does not demand its own way. It is not irritable, and it keeps no record of being wronged.
1 Corinthians 13:6 it does not rejoice at wrongdoing, but rejoices with the truth.
1 Corinthians 13:7 It always protects, always trusts, always hopes, always perseveres.

Proverbs 19:22 What a man desires is unfailing love.

I think God knows what your really searching for and just scratching the itch is not going to work very long.
I love you also.

 

[Jesus_is_LORD]

"And grieve not the holy Spirit of God, whereby ye are sealed unto the day of redemption." Eph 4:30

When my mother and my wife used to can fruit and vegetables the sealing of those jars was a critical part. If all of the steps were followed correctly the result would be fruit or vegetables good to eat for years to come. At point in time if the seal were broken by accident or on purpose the contents would begin to spoil and what was good food would have to be thrown away. That which had been saved would be lost.

The Holy Spirit does not force us to do anything, but if we follow the lead of the Holy Spirit, we can do all things through Christ. We are sealed, yes, but as with the canned fruit and vegetables we are still in control. We can still override or limit the power of God (Psalm 78:41) [grieve the Holy Spirit or quench the Holy Spirit (I Thess 5:19)] because when men were created they were given the authority to obey God or not. We see which way Adam and Eve chose. That authority to choose has never been taken away from us. The sacrifice of Jesus did not remove that choice. The gift of the Holy Spirit did not override our right choose to serve God or mammon.

God through His Son opened up for us a way where there was no way, but the choice has always remained our to walk on the highway of holiness or not. God wants us to make to the end with Him and the Way is open for those who are properly prepared and submissive. Jesus paid the price to make that Way, but we have to walk in it to the end of our course.

Well said. I must confess I answered No but will have to change it to yes.

With that said, hear me out for a moment EVERYBODY.

Who does this question really matter to?
(1) If you are a Christian and you are following Christ and you think you are on the right path then this doesn't really matter
about if you can lose your salvation. You know you are sealed and after you slip and backslide you get back up knowing that God
promises to forgive your sins. You know you are saved.

(2) If you are an unbeliever and you will never accept Christ, this question doesn't really matter to you, because
you will never choose to get save or should I say, be called by the Father, in the first place.

(3) Then there might be those who call themselves Christians but live in sin and then question whether they are still saved, and
there are those who want to instruct new believers in Christ to feel safe and to comfort them in this new life with the security that Jesus brings.
I think this is the category, that this question really matters to.

I think we can still encourage new believers in the eternal security that Jesus provides against Satan and the power of sin, However; for those playing church I would not hide behind eternal security to get me into Heaven. Like brother Amadeus put it, freewill. Since God made us in His image, God give us freewill because He is a being of freewill that respects the free will of others. If we didn't have free will why are there so many Bible verses that give us a choice. Choose (life or death, narrow road or board road, etc)

I wrote an article on this once and to summarize, we often times look at Salvation like a commodity to obtain or a treasure to get and store.
This is not what it is. Salvation is in the person of Jesus Christ. It is a relationship with Jesus. It is about knowing Jesus. The danger of thinking of it (Salvation) as a commodity to obtain and put on the shelf is once we believe we have this commodity, we may ignore our relationship with God falsely believing, well I'm saved because I have my Salvation locked away in the vault.

Salvation is Jesus. You have Jesus you are saved, simply put. Truly knowing Him will cause us to love Him, Loving Him will lead us to want to follow and obey Him. It is about knowing Jesus, not about some prize we get to put on the wall after we say a prayer.

As Jesus said in Matthew 7:21-23 " 21 “Not everyone who says to Me, ‘Lord, Lord,’ shall enter the kingdom of heaven, but he who does the will of My Father in heaven. 22 Many will say to Me in that day, ‘Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in Your name, cast out demons in Your name, and done many wonders in Your name?’ 23 And then I will declare to them, ‘I never knew you; depart from Me, you who practice lawlessness!’ "

 

[Erikb]

Jesus_is Lord: well said. Also a question to ask biblically; is is our salvation unconditional or conditional.

There is a great book on this topic, it's an atomic bomb when it comes to the teaching of Eternal security. It's worth owning; The Belivers Conditional Security by Dan Corner. I bought mine through Amazon.

 

[amadeus2]

Well said. I must confess I answered No but will have to change it to yes.

With that said, hear me out for a moment EVERYBODY.

Who does this question really matter to?
(1) If you are a Christian and you are following Christ and you think you are on the right path then this doesn't really matter
about if you can lose your salvation. You know you are sealed and after you slip and backslide you get back up knowing that God
promises to forgive your sins. You know you are saved.

But, each time a person does slip, [and who has not?], when he recognizes his mistake he must turn to our merciful Lord again for help. If we do then we are like King David. David was always willing to take the blame and his deserved punishment when his errors was brought to his attention. If on the other hand we walk the way of King Saul, we want to justify our actions and/or to put some or all of the blame on others. God is merciful, but to please Him and to be finally saved we must move the attitude of David and away from the attitude of Saul.

(2) If you are an unbeliever and you will never accept Christ, this question doesn't really matter to you, because
you will never choose to get save or should I say, be called by the Father, in the first place.

No disagreement, but just for clarification: Do we choose to be called by the Father, or do we choose to acknowledge His call to us? Think about the calling of the prophet, Samuel [I Samuel 3].

3) Then there might be those who call themselves Christians but live in sin and then question whether they are still saved, and
there are those who want to instruct new believers in Christ to feel safe and to comfort them in this new life with the security that Jesus brings.
I think this is the category, that this question really matters to.

This last group is perhaps represented in scripture by the religious leaders of Judaism (espec. Scribes & Pharisees]. Jesus made it clear what they were and what our position toward them should be:

"...The scribes and the Pharisees sit in Moses' seat:

All therefore whatsoever they bid you observe, that observe and do; but do not ye after their works: for they say, and do not." Matt 23:2-3

I think we can still encourage new believers in the eternal security that Jesus provides against Satan and the power of sin, However; for those playing church I would not hide behind eternal security to get me into Heaven. Like brother Amadeus put it, freewill. Since God made us in His image, God give us freewill because He is a being of freewill that respects the free will of others. If we didn't have free will why are there so many Bible verses that give us a choice. Choose (life or death, narrow road or board road, etc)

Amen! We are definitely secured by our Lord, but like Peter walking on water, we are able to look away from Him at any moment. To do so is to put ourselves into jeopardy

I wrote an article on this once and to summarize, we often times look at Salvation like a commodity to obtain or a treasure to get and store.
This is not what it is. Salvation is in the person of Jesus Christ. It is a relationship with Jesus. It is about knowing Jesus. The danger of thinking of it (Salvation) as a commodity to obtain and put on the shelf is once we believe we have this commodity, we may ignore our relationship with God falsely believing, well I'm saved because I have my Salvation locked away in the vault.

Salvation is Jesus. You have Jesus you are saved, simply put. Truly knowing Him will cause us to love Him, Loving Him will lead us to want to follow and obey Him. It is about knowing Jesus, not about some prize we get to put on the wall after we say a prayer.

Yes, we have salvation while we have Jesus. Judas Iscariot had Jesus, but then put aside the Master in favor of his own way. He did not lose Jesus. He put Him aside.

As Jesus said in Matthew 7:21-23 " 21 “Not everyone who says to Me, ‘Lord, Lord,’ shall enter the kingdom of heaven, but he who does the will of My Father in heaven. 22 Many will say to Me in that day, ‘Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in Your name, cast out demons in Your name, and done many wonders in Your name?’ 23 And then I will declare to them, ‘I never knew you; depart from Me, you who practice lawlessness!’ "

Give God the glory!

 

[Jesus_is_LORD]

Amen Give God the Glory indeed.

HE IS WORTHY !!!