Welcome!

By registering with us, you'll be able to discuss, share and private message with other members of our community.

SignUp Now!
  • Welcome to Talk Jesus Christian Forums

    Celebrating 20 Years!

    A bible based, Jesus Christ centered community.

    Register Log In

Can A Christian Lose Their Salvation?

Listen our Spirit is our Main eternal part! It a real being! He wants us walking and living thur our own Spirit man! yes the HOLY GHOST dwells in our Spirit with us !But we live thur our own Spirit !

Rom_1:9 For God is my witness, whom I serve with my spirit in the gospel of his Son,

Rom_8:16 The Spirit itself beareth witness with our spirit, that we are the children of God:

Gal_6:18 Brethren, the grace of our Lord Jesus Christ be with your spirit. Amen. To the Galatians written from Rome.
Phm_1:25 The grace of our Lord Jesus Christ be with your spirit.



2Co_5:17 Therefore if any man be in Christ, he is a new creature: old things are passed away; behold, all things are become new.

Eph_2:15 Having abolished in his flesh the enmity, even the law of commandments contained in ordinances; for to make in himself of twain one new man, so making peace;

Eph_4:24 And that ye put on the new man, which after God is created in righteousness and true holiness.

Rom_7:22 For I delight in the law of God after the inward man:
2Co_4:16 For which cause we faint not; but though our outward man perish, yet the inward man is renewed day by day.


1Pe_3:4 But let it be the hidden man of the heart, in that which is not corruptible, even the ornament of a meek and quiet spirit, which is in the sight of God of great price.


Our New Spirit man CANNOT SIN! That why He tells us to walk in the spirit ,Our spirit !

1Jn_3:9 Whosoever is born of God doth not commit sin; for his seed remaineth in him: and he cannot sin, because he is born of God.


1Jn_5:18 We know that whosoever is born of God sinneth not; but he that is begotten of God keepeth himself, and that wicked one toucheth him not.

Our rflesh can still sin .it has a sin nature !We no longer in our Spirit man have a sin nature !we have the same nature in our Spirit man as our LORD JESUS !The Last adam ! Adam being beginning1 He became a New race of Beings !those Born of GOD!

1Co_15:45 And so it is written, The first man Adam was made a living soul; the last Adam was made a quickening spirit.

We are All in our spirit man a Quicking Spirit ! Gal_4:19 My little children, of whom I travail in birth again until Christ be formed in you,

Rom_8:10 And if Christ be in you, the body is dead because of sin; but the Spirit is life because of righteousness.


2Pe_1:4 Whereby are given unto us exceeding great and precious promises: that by these ye might be partakers of the divine nature, having escaped the corruption that is in the world through lust.

2Pe_1:3 According as his divine power hath given unto us all things that pertain unto life and godliness, through the knowledge of him that hath called us to glory and virtue:

1Co_2:16 For who hath known the mind of the Lord, that he may instruct him? But we have the mind of Christ.


GOD given Us everything we will ever need in our Spirit Man ! The temple of God He never leaves or Forsakes!

Our Spirit Man is the most Powerful being on EARTH1 He has the POWER of GOD within HIM! Jesus said if we had the Faith ? Nothing would be impossible for US and He said ? We could do greater works! i Have Not, but i have raised the dead healed the sick and cast out satan himself and more! miracles Do not make us More ! He could use a rock or a donkey so we should Never get high minded !
'
After all , HE DOES IT ALL ! We just allow Him to use Us !
We need to see ? We are All Equal in His body ! None greater or Less!
HE alone is the HEAD!

Rom_7:18 For I know that in me (that is, in my flesh,) dwelleth no good thing

This is the SEED we are born from in our new Spirit as a baby! Like any new birth!

1Pe_1:23 Being born again, not of corruptible seed, but of incorruptible, by the word of God, which liveth and abideth for ever.
This is GOD perfect SEED ! That why JESUs is Not ashamed to call us brother! and Why We are joint heirs with Him and He shares His throne with US ! He also has Declared us Overcomers at Salvation and more than Conquerors!

No matter how we fail in the Flesh ? 1Jn_4:4 Ye are of God, little children, and have overcome them: because greater is he that is in you, than he that is in the world.
Rom_8:37 Nay, in all these things we are more than conquerors through him that loved us.

1Co_2:13 Which things also we speak, not in the words which man's wisdom teacheth, but which the Holy Ghost teacheth; comparing spiritual things with spiritual.

Rom_8:2 For the law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus hath made me free from the law of sin and death.


Because We need to grow in our Spirit Man after its birth! We can grow to be just like our LORD in Knowledge and understanding!

Eph_4:13 Till we all come in the unity of the faith, and of the knowledge of the Son of God, unto a perfect man, unto the measure of the stature of the fulness of Christ:

God has given Us a very High place in HIS Kingdom! We will judge the fallen angels and the World

1Co_6:3 Know ye not that we shall judge angels? how much more things that pertain to this life?

1Co_6:2 Do ye not know that the saints shall judge the world? and if the world shall be judged by you, are ye unworthy to judge the smallest matters?

We have the Same Power of GOD that created Everything that was ever Created ,The HOLY GHOST !


We are GOD Kings LORDS and Priests Forever more!

the kings will rule over nations the lords over cities! The priests have the Power to forgive Sins and intercede for others!

Luk 19:16 Then came the first, saying, Lord, thy pound hath gained ten pounds.
Luk 19:17 And he said unto him, Well, thou good servant: because thou hast been faithful in a very little, have thou authority over ten cities.

Joh_20:23 Whose soever sins ye remit, they are remitted unto them; and whose soever sins ye retain, they are retained.

1Pe_2:9 But ye are a chosen generation, a royal priesthood, an holy nation, a peculiar people; that ye should shew forth the praises of him who hath called you out of darkness into his marvellous light:


Rev_1:6 And hath made us kings and priests unto God and his Father; to him be glory and dominion for ever and ever. Amen.
Rev_5:10 And hast made us unto our God kings and priests: and we shall reign on the earth.

Mat_10:8 Heal the sick, cleanse the lepers, raise the dead, cast out devils: freely ye have received, freely give.
He Not asking us to do it ! He telling us to do it ! Of course we need to be led by the HOLY GHOSt and Not lean to our own thinking!

The true church has Not changed !it the Same Holy Ghost they had from the beginning! They almost conquerored the World for our LORD ! they only started with a few people who truly gave them selves to our LORD JESUS!

GOD is NO RESPECTER OF PERSONS !He does not count one more than another! He wants to use All of us and have all of us walking in the POWER OF THE HOLY GHOST!

He sees all of us as sinners in the flesh but virgins and Holy in our Spirit man!

2Co_11:2 For I am jealous over you with godly jealousy: for I have espoused you to one husband, that I may present you as a chaste virgin to Christ.

1Co_15:44 It is sown a natural body; it is raised a spiritual body. There is a natural body, and there is a spiritual body.


Heb_12:23 To the general assembly and church of the firstborn, which are written in heaven, and to God the Judge of all, and to the spirits of just men made perfect,

Heb_12:9 Furthermore we have had fathers of our flesh which corrected us, and we gave them reverence: shall we not much rather be in subjection unto the Father of spirits, and live?
 
Nothing can separate us from the love of God. But the love of God is not the salvation of God. God loves even sinners. (Rom 5:8 ) but just because He loves them doesnt mean they are saved.
 
Nothing can separate us from the love of God. But the love of God is not the salvation of God. God loves even sinners. (Rom 5:8 ) but just because He loves them doesnt mean they are saved.
Could you explain what that has to do with a Christian losing their salvation?
 
Can a Dancer Loose Her great dance? i don't know. even if it's relatable to the subject at hand - maybe, maybe not. Just wanted to write it.

Can she? -I think it's like that but only 100 times stronger, maybe, idno, perhaps, Im perplexed -and i dont even really know what the word perplexed really means! least of all to you! D:
its all very confusing to know things like this i think, -maybe idno, yes? :S


though, I mean,,, Lucifer was like,, this,,, ehm... like this,,, great really nice angel that was like... idno,,, like, really pro n stuff? I mean most High in Heaven must count for something right? idno... retorical question, but,,, what im trying to get at is: He fell. and he was like this perfect angel (or, hehe... maybe not so perfect after all! or maybe he was.... He was made by GOD after all.... so maybe his "imperfection" isnt so imperfect after all??? a shame about the dead babies tho... n rape n murder n **** which "His imperfections surely are somewhat to a certain degree the responsive cause of"... but maybe... all works according to law??? and... like... maybe, atleast it sorta seems like so to me atm; that,,, everything has it's polar-opposition uknow.. there is antichrist for christ.. eternal life eternal damnation... ehm.. and lots of other examples i cant really be bothered to think up right now... so (day and night's a big polarisationopposite (had to make an edit for That One lolel) SO. (lol just realized im drifting faaar away from the subject-matter sorry , hehe .. ),,,,,,, aaaaand... because of those polar-LAWS then all that **** is required for opposition-thingsis n stuff..... but now I'm far out with my little narrow canoo in some un-known High-End territories which i think shouldn't really be communicated because like, sorta Lucifer-domains , for most people , i think, sorta, idno -beats me fosure yow


but when endingly considering your question (only read the thread's topic... sorry... wish i was better than this.. really do... Sorry.(haven't had my Jesus Bloodbath yet today n stuff so im not very down to earth n stuff (in my heaven n **** u know idno.. just rambling i guess -not really))), AAAANYHOW -again: when I think of your wondering, and a way to symbolise my understanding of it all -the sudden vision was given me (or something): A moth and a Flame amongst in the Night.

The Flame representing Godlyness, Heaven, Spirit, Enlightenment, Vision, Sight, Spiritual Understanding, -THE HOLY SPIRIT-, The Word of God, truth, Truth, Peace which passes all understanding, seeing the path out from the shadowy night of the Soul of matterilization and poor judgment and being lost and etc etc etc etc. God basically -sorta... and.... well, im sure u know wat im getting at; once the fly has been in the Light, drawn to it's Lighting up of Shadowy Self and so on,,, then yes, it may leave the flame which warms it up and makes it brighter and truer and this and that of great u know, ehm stuff...
Well you get the picture; yeah it may go into darkness, and be there for a long while, -like because the darkness has heroin, and ******, and smack and discos and shiny pumping bright light and Skrillex! Or this and that. But... Once haven been near the Flame -the nearer this is more true the nearer one is or has been- eeehm.... This leaves a mark on the Soul -it feels like Finding Home Finding Right finding truth and that which is truly Good and saves You.

That' ll be all. Thank you for your question-recepticle.

Giving back.

Bye.


(((((Need My bath Now.)))))
 
Can a Dancer Loose Her great dance? i don't know. even if it's relatable to the subject at hand - maybe, maybe not. Just wanted to write it.

Can she? -I think it's like that but only 100 times stronger, maybe, idno, perhaps, Im perplexed -and i dont even really know what the word perplexed really means! least of all to you! D:
its all very confusing to know things like this i think, -maybe idno, yes? :S


though, I mean,,, Lucifer was like,, this,,, ehm... like this,,, great really nice angel that was like... idno,,, like, really pro n stuff? I mean most High in Heaven must count for something right? idno... retorical question, but,,, what im trying to get at is: He fell. and he was like this perfect angel (or, hehe... maybe not so perfect after all! or maybe he was.... He was made by GOD after all.... so maybe his "imperfection" isnt so imperfect after all??? a shame about the dead babies tho... n rape n murder n **** which "His imperfections surely are somewhat to a certain degree the responsive cause of"... but maybe... all works according to law??? and... like... maybe, atleast it sorta seems like so to me atm; that,,, everything has it's polar-opposition uknow.. there is antichrist for christ.. eternal life eternal damnation... ehm.. and lots of other examples i cant really be bothered to think up right now... so (day and night's a big polarisationopposite (had to make an edit for That One lolel) SO. (lol just realized im drifting faaar away from the subject-matter sorry , hehe .. ),,,,,,, aaaaand... because of those polar-LAWS then all that **** is required for opposition-thingsis n stuff..... but now I'm far out with my little narrow canoo in some un-known High-End territories which i think shouldn't really be communicated because like, sorta Lucifer-domains , for most people , i think, sorta, idno -beats me fosure yow


but when endingly considering your question (only read the thread's topic... sorry... wish i was better than this.. really do... Sorry.(haven't had my Jesus Bloodbath yet today n stuff so im not very down to earth n stuff (in my heaven n **** u know idno.. just rambling i guess -not really))), AAAANYHOW -again: when I think of your wondering, and a way to symbolise my understanding of it all -the sudden vision was given me (or something): A moth and a Flame amongst in the Night.

The Flame representing Godlyness, Heaven, Spirit, Enlightenment, Vision, Sight, Spiritual Understanding, -THE HOLY SPIRIT-, The Word of God, truth, Truth, Peace which passes all understanding, seeing the path out from the shadowy night of the Soul of matterilization and poor judgment and being lost and etc etc etc etc. God basically -sorta... and.... well, im sure u know wat im getting at; once the fly has been in the Light, drawn to it's Lighting up of Shadowy Self and so on,,, then yes, it may leave the flame which warms it up and makes it brighter and truer and this and that of great u know, ehm stuff...
Well you get the picture; yeah it may go into darkness, and be there for a long while, -like because the darkness has heroin, and ******, and smack and discos and shiny pumping bright light and Skrillex! Or this and that. But... Once haven been near the Flame -the nearer this is more true the nearer one is or has been- eeehm.... This leaves a mark on the Soul -it feels like Finding Home Finding Right finding truth and that which is truly Good and saves You.

That' ll be all. Thank you for your question-recepticle.

Giving back.

Bye.


(((((Need My bath Now.)))))

.......Dude, what in the world is this??? This is a very serious! topic. I don't know your motive behind this post, whether you meant to be funny.... but it's not funny. Please stop trolling! God bless.
 
it's ok

see i am forgiven by Christ when he died for my un-fulfilled ways

my ways are obscure to many, and it may seem as foolish ramblings much of what I write, yet i assure u it is not. i may be wrong tho - (-to seem humble.......

merely, spoke in words written to convey -in my unusual & odd ways- the perspective i held concerning the confusion at hand (lack of seeing (from whence the question was brought to us all here)) do not let yourself be troubled by how i write but take faith (if i may advice) and have forgiveness and consideration for the way i am trying to speak my heart concerning this subject at hand to you (and also a little bit to the rest, but 90% to you). We are all incomplete in the eyes of the Lord and I am merely trying to do what is right and what I see best -but I fall short ofcourse. I will not alter the way I see fit to communicate my heart Soul and Mind for your sake or other people of different sorts -yet I may change if I see it fit. See through eyes of Good and forgive me, and if you may not forgive me and have consideration for my Ways -then please keep it to yourself, and if i may suggest: -pray that u may Love Your Enemy.

"Quote from the Bible about "removing the thorn from your Brother's eye when a (hmmm... ehm.. can't really remember the word... bjälke in my native language... eeh.. like.. lets use a tree-pole for a substitute lol.. ^^ -.-' .. :) : / .. u know the verse, Hopefully..

i don't like taking the roll of a teacher like this, as an advicer, but it was called for, i guess, idno... Forgive me for my unusual and 'to-many' rude ways. I only intend the best of All -yet I fall terribly short in the eyes of God.


What i meant was: the Dance Never leaves The-Dancer>Yet the dancer may Leave The Dance<Yet it is Always in Her Heart--tho-it-may-be-obscured-- and maybe even Taken Away if she abuses it or similar sort of transgressions which would cause suchness of disappearance of the seed or root or young plant or Tree of Knowledge or holiness or whatever it means to be a Christian to your eyes and mine. (the disappearance of the residues (that which remains/is left) by the Christian Inclination..).

I appreciate your input and reply or response, I appreciate it..

God Blesses Truly

i am but a servant and slave

Bye..

.

Take care fellow human.

I am Sorry and thankful.
 
it's ok

see i am forgiven by Christ when he died for my un-fulfilled ways

my ways are obscure to many, and it may seem as foolish ramblings much of what I write, yet i assure u it is not. i may be wrong tho - (-to seem humble.......

merely, spoke in words written to convey -in my unusual & odd ways- the perspective i held concerning the confusion at hand (lack of seeing (from whence the question was brought to us all here)) do not let yourself be troubled by how i write but take faith (if i may advice) and have forgiveness and consideration for the way i am trying to speak my heart concerning this subject at hand to you (and also a little bit to the rest, but 90% to you). We are all incomplete in the eyes of the Lord and I am merely trying to do what is right and what I see best -but I fall short ofcourse. I will not alter the way I see fit to communicate my heart Soul and Mind for your sake or other people of different sorts -yet I may change if I see it fit. See through eyes of Good and forgive me, and if you may not forgive me and have consideration for my Ways -then please keep it to yourself, and if i may suggest: -pray that u may Love Your Enemy.

"Quote from the Bible about "removing the thorn from your Brother's eye when a (hmmm... ehm.. can't really remember the word... bjälke in my native language... eeh.. like.. lets use a tree-pole for a substitute lol.. ^^ -.-' .. :) : / .. u know the verse, Hopefully..

i don't like taking the roll of a teacher like this, as an advicer, but it was called for, i guess, idno... Forgive me for my unusual and 'to-many' rude ways. I only intend the best of All -yet I fall terribly short in the eyes of God.


What i meant was: the Dance Never leaves The-Dancer>Yet the dancer may Leave The Dance<Yet it is Always in Her Heart--tho-it-may-be-obscured-- and maybe even Taken Away if she abuses it or similar sort of transgressions which would cause suchness of disappearance of the seed or root or young plant or Tree of Knowledge or holiness or whatever it means to be a Christian to your eyes and mine. (the disappearance of the residues (that which remains/is left) by the Christian Inclination..).

I appreciate your input and reply or response, I appreciate it..

God Blesses Truly

i am but a servant and slave

Bye..
.

Take care fellow human.

I am Sorry and thankful.


I apologise again sincerely for my odd and easily offensive writing here, foremost to you. Sorry. and thank you.

Hereby uplifting all parties' involved responsibilities concerning my previous input here.

I may not come back.

thank you.

bye

.

im a screwball i know ^^ OR AM I (dramatical sounds n stuff for effects!) :p

for now.
 
I do not believe God gives you a free license to sin.No I do not believe we can walk in sin.But I believe once saved always saved.I am not saying you must sin.
 
I believe that OSAS exists.
God says he will never leave or forsake us and Jesus said he would never loose who God gives him. How do you fall away to Apostasy with a God like that?
 
Anyone who preaches OSAS is on their way to hell
Let's see:
  • I am a believer
  • I love Jesus
  • I give him all the glory and I take none
  • And I am going to "Hell".
Sure glad to know that you are the judge and not Jesus!
With your perfect ability, would you be so kind as to judge what these vesres say?::
  1. Deuteronomy 31:6 for the LORD your God goes with you; he will never leave you nor forsake you."
  2. Deuteronomy 31:8 The LORD himself goes before you and will be with you; he will never leave you nor forsake you. Do not be afraid; do not be discouraged."
  3. John 6:37 All those the Father gives me will come to me, and whoever comes to me I will never drive away.
  4. John 6:39 And this is the will of him who sent me, that I shall lose none of all those he has given me, but raise them up at the last day.
 
  • Deuteronomy 31:6 for the LORD your God goes with you; he will never leave you nor forsake you."
  • Deuteronomy 31:8 The LORD himself goes before you and will be with you; he will never leave you nor forsake you. Do not be afraid; do not be discouraged."
  • John 6:37 All those the Father gives me will come to me, and whoever comes to me I will never drive away.
  • John 6:39 And this is the will of him who sent me, that I shall lose none of all those he has given me, but raise them up at the last day.

Agreed Jesus never leaves us or forsakes us. But many leave and forsake him. ( 70 disciples did, Peter did )
 
Agreed Jesus never leaves us or forsakes us. But many leave and forsake him. ( 70 disciples did, Peter did )
Under the New Covenant, a true "Born Again" believer is indwelt with the Holy Spirit, the spirit of Christ. God said he would never leave you and Jesus said he would never lose you. If you could keep falling in and out of grace, do you lose your salvation each time and then receive forgiveness and salvation again....of course not, Jesus died once and for all. Like Paul says in Hebrews, you can't keep crucifying and subjecting Jesus to ridicule each time you want to be saved again!. We can not confuse pulling away with "falling away" to apostasy each time. If you fall away, you were never "Born Again" in the first place.
 
Under the New Covenant, a true "Born Again" believer is indwelt with the Holy Spirit, the spirit of Christ. God said he would never leave you and Jesus said he would never lose you. If you could keep falling in and out of grace, do you lose your salvation each time and then receive forgiveness and salvation again....of course not, Jesus died once and for all. Like Paul says in Hebrews, you can't keep crucifying and subjecting Jesus to ridicule each time you want to be saved again!. We can not confuse pulling away with "falling away" to apostasy each time. If you fall away, you were never "Born Again" in the first place.

Jesus overcame His own world of sinful temptations and He provided the means for us to overcome ours. When a person first is drawn to God and repents for the first time he is already an overcomer. But, if he still has time left in this veil of flesh, he still has overcoming to do. Unfortunately, all of us have failed along our way after we overcame for the first time. We quench the power of God in us. Yes, we can do that which is why Paul warns:

"Quench not the Spirit." I Thess 5:19

As you indicate @RJ, we have received more rather than less than those who did not receive the gift of the Holy Spirit, so then more is expected of us and when we fail by following the ways of our "old man" (who is still seeking to regain his lost dominion). James makes it clear that there are two things working within us even though it is not a good thing, especially when the evil part gets the upper hand:

"Out of the same mouth proceedeth blessing and cursing. My brethren, these things ought not so to be." James 3:10

Jesus makes it clear that because we have received more (the gift of the Holy Spirit), more is required and expected of us:

"But he that knew not, and did commit things worthy of stripes, shall be beaten with few stripes. For unto whomsoever much is given, of him shall be much required: and to whom men have committed much, of him they will ask the more. Luke 12:48
 
look at another example please.Matt 25:31-46,all here believe they will enter,the sheep and the goats,the only difference between the two,is what they did,or didn't do. Both asked the Lord the same question.Both sides believed,but one side was a doer of the Word and not a hearer only

John 10:28-29
28And I give unto them eternal life; and they shall never perish, neither shall any man pluck them out of my hand.

29My Father, which gave them me, is greater than all; and no man is able to pluck them out of my Father's hand.

I think it is simple. There are many disputes on the subject, but when Christ says no one can take them out of His hand I see that as if they are truly saved in their heart then no.. they cannot "love their salvation" or be "plucked from His hand." I'm not sure of any other way to see what He said there.

2 Timothy 3:5
5Having a form of godliness, but denying the power thereof: from such turn away.


I believe anyone who is appearing to "lose" their salvation is just what Paul says... a look-a-like and were never saved.

The dispute arises, I think, when we forget that the heart is what needs to be seen, and in that... we cannot know who is and is not saved. Only God truly knows the heart. Some men may fool other men with "works" or a "form of godliness" for a time, but God knows what is deep within that man.

But... works, or "fruit" is a very very good indicator (Matthew 7:20). We are not saved by works, but we produce works if our heart is truly in Almighty Christ's hand.
 
Jesus makes it clear that because we have received more (the gift of the Holy Spirit), more is required and expected of us
Indeed. For just one example: Don't you suppose that is why He re-defined the act of Adultery, in that, if we even look at another with lust in our heart, we have already committed Adultery?
 
Back
Top