Universities Offer Blasphemous “Queer Bible” Courses

[Bill]

Christ4Ever, going back to your OP, I agree completely that a “Queer Bible” course is blasphemous and I see no way that a person professing to be Christian could be truly regenerate could teach such things. But I wish to comment on a couple of the statements made in this OP, which I understand you quoted from another source.

“For generations, the KJV Bible provided the moral and ethical foundation”. I believe strongly that God for centuries blessed the KJV as THE translation for the English-speaking world. The ERV and ASV continue that faithfulness to God’s message. Once the NCC published the RSV, I do not trust any modern translation, conservative or literal, to the degree I will trust the KJV. In the past you and I have had discussion about the modern topic of “homosexuality”, and in a Christian spirit disagreed on it. For a person studying M-M relationships because of family or intimate church circumstances, I believe they are better off to trust the KJV while using the 1828 Webster’s English Dictionary with it.

The second statement I wish to comment on is: “God created man and woman, and ordained marriage to be between one man and one woman. Anything outside this divine institution is sin.”

Regarding this second statement:
1st, not all M-M relationships desire the legal entanglements of marriage and prefer a faithful promise with personal protections by legal documents.

2nd, not all M-M relationships are of the “gay” kind, or the LGBTQ perversions.

3rd, the conclusion drawn in the statement is a theological construction that cannot be supported by the following two statements:

“To the law and to the testimony: if they speak not according to this word, it is because there is no light in them.” (Isa 8:20, KJV)

“And these things, brethren, I have in a figure transferred to myself and to Apollos for your sakes; that ye might learn in us not to think of men above that which is written, that no one of you be puffed up for one against another.” (1Cor 4:6, KJV)
or as revised in the ASV
“Now these things, brethren, I have in a figure transferred to myself and Apollos for your sakes; that in us ye might learn not to go beyond the things which are written; that no one of you be puffed up for the one against the other.” (1Cor 4:6, ASV)

For Christians who study the modern hot-button issues of homosexuality and abortion, if a revision of the KJV is sought, go no more modern than the ERV or ASV. The Young’s Literal Translation is also safe on these topics. Even though I also use and study with modern translations such as the NEB, REB, NRSV & NRSVue, I reject their translations of 1 Cor. 6:9 and 1 Tim. 1:10 in particular.

Christ4Ever, I wish to close by remarking, I do not recall ever seeing any post or reply of yours written in a way inconsistent with Christian fellowship with love.

You know I used to think that there was a little bit of a difference in the different types of homosexual Behavior. He have those who are extremely aggressive as in the story of Lot, and then there are those few that actually seem to have love for each other.

However I spoke to the Lord on the subject, and Lord made it plain as day to me that there is no acceptance of homosexuality of any type. That he made the family one man and one woman and that's it.

There is a unique sanctity that God has declared with His design. And let no one come between God and His design.

 

[Bill]

You’re seeing the fruit of the problem right there. Catholicism itself is not built on the Bible, it’s built on traditions of men. Jesus warned us about this: “Full well ye reject the commandment of God, that ye may keep your own tradition” (Mark 7:9). It’s not that this pope is liberal, popes, bishops, and councils never have been the authority God gave us. Scripture alone is God’s Word, and it alone is the standard of truth (2 Timothy 3:16–17).

So when Catholic leaders “go liberal” and approve what God calls sin, it only exposes the foundation they’re standing on. The Bible says clearly that marriage is one man and one woman (Genesis 2: 24; Matthew 19:4–6), and that same-sex unions are sin (Romans 1:26–27; 1 Corinthians 6:9–10). When religion contradicts God’s Word, the religion is false.

You don’t need a pope, a bishop, or a church tradition to know the truth. You need Christ and His Word. Jesus said, “If ye continue in my word, then are ye my disciples indeed; and ye shall know the truth, and the truth shall make you free” (John 8:31–32). The problem is not one liberal pope after another, the problem is following a system that replaced God’s Word with man’s authority.

You're welcome to have your own views, just make certain that they are with a pure heart. Because these things will be held against you, lying, stirring up trouble against your brothers and sisters, falsehood against your brothers and sisters.

Whether you want to accept it or not we are your brothers and sisters as you are mine.

Remember the second greatest commandment, love your neighbor as yourself. It's not limited to anyone in particular it's everyone.

 

[Kermos]

Not sure why i need to repeat myself. It is not my place to say if a person is worthy or not, that is between them and God. There are many who claim to be Christians who are devils too. Kkk comes to mind.yet all associated with them will not see it that way.

There are Muslims i have talked with who are turning to Christianity .

What i was trying to say, when a person loves God, they aready have faith in God. Because when you love God you already love Jesus, whether you know Jesus personally or not.

Jesus says he is the Alpha and Omega. He always was and always will be. This means that Jesus was present all through the Old Testament even though the Israelites did not recognize him. It's written in the scripture in the New Testament it states that Jesus was The Rock that followed the Israelites around in the desert during the time of Moses. The rock that gave people life-giving water.

Hello Bill,

You are not repeating yourself because you keep adjusting your answer by degrees. For example, this time you wrote "It is not my place to say if a person is worthy or not, that is between them and God" which deviates from your stated belief of "Why, what is the Eucharist, Jesus." so worthiness is irrelevant to your original declaration/question of "Does receiving the Eucharist give me salvation, yes." (proof post #59).

Paul does not state that an unworthy person is disqualified for salvation in 1 Corinthians 11:23-32, so there is no reason for you to return to your explanation.

Please answer this question which is derived from your original declaration/question:

​

Does receiving the Eucharist give a muslim who rejects Jesus salvation?​

​

Love,
Kermos

 

[Kermos]

Why can't you tell me whose fault it is that people go to hell?

1Ti 2:3 For this is good and acceptable in the sight of God our Savior,
1Ti 2:4 who desires all men to be saved and to come to the knowledge of the truth.

If God desires ALL men to be saved, why aren't all men saved?

What causes a man not to be saved? Does God cause a man not to be saved, or is it man who causes a man not to be saved?

Hello Curtis and @B-A-C (since you Like Curtis' post),

Why would anyone contradict the Christ's words of “This is the work of God, that you believe in Him whom He has sent” (John 6:29) and “you did not choose Me, but I chose you” (John 15:16) and “I chose you out of the world” (John 15:19 Includes salvation)?

The Almighty God's desire is always satisfied, so all men mentioned in 1 Timothy 2:3-4 exceeds not the exclusivity of current and future members of the Assembly of God.

God is good to cause men to be saved by God’s grace for God's glory! See post #88, too.

Believe the Word of God!

Love,
Kermos

 

[Jesua888]

2Th 2:10 and with all wicked deception for those who are perishing, because they refused to love the truth and so be saved.

Why are people going to hell (perishing) when they don't have to if they choose to love the truth and so be saved?

My thoughts on this (do not know the scripture back ups for this or not for this?) are:
Judgement Day and the Lake of Fire come at End Times
I do not know where to find proof that people who died and were not saved by Jesus, went to hell?
This is an interesting topic : )

 

[Kermos]

1Jn 2:2 And He Himself is the propitiation for our sins, and not for ours only but also for the whole world.

Did Jesus die on the cross for the sins of the whole world? Yes he did!,

There is no reason for anyone to spend eternity in the lake of fire.

If Jesus died for every person, why are most going to hell?

Because people refuse to choose the love of truth so they could be saved.

God does not make that choice for you. You have to choose life yourself.

God only provides the choices for man to pick from.

Deu 30:19 I call heaven and earth to witness this day against you that I have set before you life and death, the blessings and the curses; therefore choose life, that you and your descendants may live

Hi Curtis,

You preach "Did Jesus die on the cross for the sins of the whole world? Yes he did" regarding 1 John 2:2, so according to your Free-willian Philosophy, the following represents fleshly people, dead in sin, ungodly multitude, unbelievers:

• if Tom of the world chooses to believe in Christ before he dies, then God must profit Tom with eternal life being saved from the wrath of God.
• if Nancy of the world chooses to believe not in Christ right until her dying thoughts expire, then God must punish Nancy with eternal damnation being under the wrath of God.
• The conclusion: Christ's atonement succeeded in saving Tom of the world, and Christ's atonement failed in saving Nancy of the world.

So, you preached failure atonement per your own writing, there.

Notice the phrase "the whole world" occurs twice in the same book with the same author, the First Book of John inspired by the glorious Holy Spirit.

You brought up 1 John 2:2 which shall be examined in a moment, but the second location is "We know that we are of God, and that the whole world lies in the power of the evil one" (1 John 5:19).

The Apostle John further wrote "you have overcome the evil one" (1 John 2:13), and John uses the "you" to refer to Christians exclusively; therefore, no Christian lies in the evil one, so current Christians are excluded from "the whole world" in 1 John 5:19.

Since current Christians are absent from "the whole world" in 1 John 5:19, then context establishes the definition of "the whole world".

Now, returning to 1 John 2:2 for the context of "the whole world":

​

He is the atoning sacrifice for our sins, and not only for ours but also for the sins of the whole world.​

(Holy Spirit inspired Apostle John, 1 John 2:2)​

​

Christ's atonement succeeds without exception; therefore, "the whole world" 1 John 2:2 context excludes people like Nancy from the example above. This describes Christ's complete atonement.

Your belief includes people like Nancy from the example above in "the whole world" 1 John 2:2 context, so that describes Christ's failure atonement.

You just pressed on with "There is no reason for anyone to spend eternity in the lake of fire" which nullifies the need for the Savior from the wrath of God! You negated that all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God (Romans 3:23)!

Hear Savior Jesus Christ, "fear Him who is able to destroy both soul and body in hell" (Matthew 10:28)!

Praise be to the exclusive Chooser unto Life, Lord and God Jesus Christ (John 15:16; John 15:19; John 14:6)!

Love,
Kermos

 

[KingJ]

Wow lol, did not expect this thread to result in a Catholic discussion .

@Kermos start a new thread with all your Catholic questions.

You are proposing that Catholics believe the Pope is infallible. Where do you get that nonsense from?

 

[Curtis]

Hello Curtis and @B-A-C (since you Like Curtis' post),

Why would anyone contradict the Christ's words of “This is the work of God, that you believe in Him whom He has sent” (John 6:29) and “you did not choose Me, but I chose you” (John 15:16) and “I chose you out of the world” (John 15:19 Includes salvation)?

The Almighty God's desire is always satisfied, so all men mentioned in 1 Timothy 2:3-4 exceeds not the exclusivity of current and future members of the Assembly of God.

God is good to cause men to be saved by God’s grace for God's glory! See post #88, too.

Believe the Word of God!

Love,
Kermos

Joh 6:28 They then said, What are we to do, that we may [habitually] be working the works of God? [What are we to do to carry out what God requires?]
Joh 6:29 Jesus replied, This is the work (service) that God asks of you: that you believe in the One Whom He has sent [that you cleave to, trust, rely on, and have faith in His Messenger]. (Amp)

Joh 14:12 I assure you, most solemnly I tell you, if anyone steadfastly believes in Me, he will himself be able to do the things that I do; and he will do even greater things than these, because I go to the Father.

 

[Kermos]

Wow lol, did not expect this thread to result in a Catholic discussion .

@Kermos start a new thread with all your Catholic questions.

You are proposing that Catholics believe the Pope is infallible. Where do you get that nonsense from?

No. The discussion initiated by @Bill is relevant to this thread topic.

 

[bdavidc]

You're welcome to have your own views, just make certain that they are with a pure heart. Because these things will be held against you, lying, stirring up trouble against your brothers and sisters, falsehood against your brothers and sisters.

Whether you want to accept it or not we are your brothers and sisters as you are mine.

Remember the second greatest commandment, love your neighbor as yourself. It's not limited to anyone in particular it's everyone.

Yes, we are commanded to love our neighbor as ourselves (Matthew 22:39). But Scripture also warns against calling everyone “brother” without distinction. Paul makes it clear that not everyone who claims Christ is truly His: “They went out from us, but they were not of us” (1 John 2:19). Jesus Himself said there would be many who say, “Lord, Lord,” yet He will reply, “I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity” (Matthew 7:21–23).

So while we should love all people, true spiritual brotherhood is only among those who are born again through faith in Christ. To call someone a brother or sister in Christ when they are not saved is to blur the truth and give false assurance. The second commandment to love your neighbor is universal, but the fellowship of the saints is limited to the redeemed (Ephesians 2:19).

If someone is lying, stirring up strife, or spreading falsehood, Scripture says they are not walking as a brother but as one who needs correction and possibly even rejection after warning (Titus 3:10). Love does not mean ignoring truth. It means speaking truth, even when it cuts.

The Bible never commands us to remain silent when false doctrine is being taught. It tells us the exact opposite. Paul wrote, “Whose mouths must be stopped, who subvert whole houses, teaching things which they ought not” (Titus 1:11). He commanded Timothy to “reprove, rebuke, exhort with all longsuffering and doctrine” (2 Timothy 4:2).

Roman Catholicism is a false gospel. It adds works, sacraments, church authority, and traditions to the finished work of Christ. But the Bible says plainly, “For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God: not of works, lest any man should boast” (Ephesians 2:8–9). Rome rejects that.

We are told to “mark them which cause divisions and offences contrary to the doctrine which ye have learned; and avoid them” (Romans 16:17). Jude 1: 3 commands us to “earnestly contend for the faith which was once delivered unto the saints.” That means we expose error, we don’t coddle it.

So NO, I will not call Catholicism “Christian” when it denies the true gospel. I will not pretend its priests, popes, and councils speak for God. The Word of God stands above every man-made system. “Let God be true, but every man a liar” (Romans 3:4).

You said: “be held against you, lying, stirring up trouble against your brothers and sisters, falsehood against your brothers and sisters.” I have no problem standing before God for speaking the truth He commands us to speak, but you should be concerned about promoting a false gospel. I don’t need your permission or your advice about what I say.

 

[Bill]

Yes, we are commanded to love our neighbor as ourselves (Matthew 22:39). But Scripture also warns against calling everyone “brother” without distinction. Paul makes it clear that not everyone who claims Christ is truly His: “They went out from us, but they were not of us” (1 John 2:19). Jesus Himself said there would be many who say, “Lord, Lord,” yet He will reply, “I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity” (Matthew 7:21–23).

So while we should love all people, true spiritual brotherhood is only among those who are born again through faith in Christ. To call someone a brother or sister in Christ when they are not saved is to blur the truth and give false assurance. The second commandment to love your neighbor is universal, but the fellowship of the saints is limited to the redeemed (Ephesians 2:19).

If someone is lying, stirring up strife, or spreading falsehood, Scripture says they are not walking as a brother but as one who needs correction and possibly even rejection after warning (Titus 3:10). Love does not mean ignoring truth. It means speaking truth, even when it cuts.

The Bible never commands us to remain silent when false doctrine is being taught. It tells us the exact opposite. Paul wrote, “Whose mouths must be stopped, who subvert whole houses, teaching things which they ought not” (Titus 1:11). He commanded Timothy to “reprove, rebuke, exhort with all longsuffering and doctrine” (2 Timothy 4:2).

Roman Catholicism is a false gospel. It adds works, sacraments, church authority, and traditions to the finished work of Christ. But the Bible says plainly, “For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God: not of works, lest any man should boast” (Ephesians 2:8–9). Rome rejects that.

We are told to “mark them which cause divisions and offences contrary to the doctrine which ye have learned; and avoid them” (Romans 16:17). Jude 1: 3 commands us to “earnestly contend for the faith which was once delivered unto the saints.” That means we expose error, we don’t coddle it.

So NO, I will not call Catholicism “Christian” when it denies the true gospel. I will not pretend its priests, popes, and councils speak for God. The Word of God stands above every man-made system. “Let God be true, but every man a liar” (Romans 3:4).

You said: “be held against you, lying, stirring up trouble against your brothers and sisters, falsehood against your brothers and sisters.” I have no problem standing before God for speaking the truth He commands us to speak, but you should be concerned about promoting a false gospel. I don’t need your permission or your advice about what I say.

I guess we will find out the real truth when the Mark of the beast is preached at the pulpit. When many preachers and priests will tell many that it is ok to take is.

If you do take it, it will be a guarenteed trip to the fire.

 

[Bill]

Hello Bill,

You are not repeating yourself because you keep adjusting your answer by degrees. For example, this time you wrote "It is not my place to say if a person is worthy or not, that is between them and God" which deviates from your stated belief of "Why, what is the Eucharist, Jesus." so worthiness is irrelevant to your original declaration/question of "Does receiving the Eucharist give me salvation, yes." (proof post #59).

Paul does not state that an unworthy person is disqualified for salvation in 1 Corinthians 11:23-32, so there is no reason for you to return to your explanation.

Please answer this question which is derived from your original declaration/question:

​

Does receiving the Eucharist give a muslim who rejects Jesus salvation?​

​

Love,
Kermos

""You are not repeating yourself because you keep adjusting your answer by degrees. For example, this time you wrote "It is not my place to say if a person is worthy or not, that is between them and God" which deviates from your stated belief of "Why, what is the Eucharist, Jesus." so worthiness is irrelevant to your original declaration/question of "Does receiving the Eucharist give me salvation, yes." (proof post #59).""

So maybe i am missing something.

How does " it is not my place to say if a person is worthy or not, that is between them and God" and "the Eucharist is Jesus" and " does receiving the Eucharist give me salvation, yes" these statements become at odds with each other?

It is not my place nor your place to say whether or not a person is worthy to be with God. That is between them and God.

We know that you have to receive Jesus to enter into eternal life. But because a person accepts Jesus doesn't mean that they actually do receive Jesus. They can say it all day long like many Christians claim to be Christians and claim to say that they know Jesus when in fact they don't really have Jesus in them, they just say they do.

Much like the Pharisees that condemn Jesus claim to be Jews, but they weren't really Jews because they didn't have God in their heart. They were only Israelis by birth but they weren't Israelis by faith and spirit

Being a Christian is not a Christian just in your head. It's just not knowing about Jesus that saves a person. You can read all you want all day long about Jesus, but if you don't receive Jesus into your heart then you're nothing just a hypocrite.

 

[bdavidc]

I guess we will find out the real truth when the Mark of the beast is preached at the pulpit. When many preachers and priests will tell many that it is ok to take is.

If you do take it, it will be a guarenteed trip to the fire.

The mark of the beast has nothing to do with what we were talking about. That is a future issue, but right now the Bible commands us to contend for the faith and guard the truth of the gospel (Jude 3). False gospels are already here, and they are just as damning as the mark will be when it comes. Paul said plainly that if anyone preaches another gospel, “let him be accursed” (Galatians 1:8–9).

This isn’t about speculation over end-times signs, it’s about the clear reality today. Catholicism denies salvation by grace through faith in Christ alone and replaces it with works, sacraments, and traditions. That is not Christianity, and calling it such gives people false assurance. The Bible says to mark and avoid those who spread false doctrine (Romans 16:17).

So no, I’m not going to let the subject be shifted. The issue is the gospel, and whether we are going to stand on the Word of God or compromise truth by giving a false system legitimacy. That’s what matters right now.

 

[Kermos]

Joh 6:28 They then said, What are we to do, that we may [habitually] be working the works of God? [What are we to do to carry out what God requires?]
Joh 6:29 Jesus replied, This is the work (service) that God asks of you: that you believe in the One Whom He has sent [that you cleave to, trust, rely on, and have faith in His Messenger]. (Amp)

Joh 14:12 I assure you, most solemnly I tell you, if anyone steadfastly believes in Me, he will himself be able to do the things that I do; and he will do even greater things than these, because I go to the Father.

Hi Curtis,

Let's review where this exchange started.

You wrote the true statement "The only work that gives eternal life is having "faith in Jesus Christ" We must never think that the things we do is giving us eternal life." (proof post #70), but you spent the last few days trying and failing to prove about you free-willians "that the things we do is giving us eternal life.[/I][/B]".

And, since you have resorted to repeat your previously proven to be failed position regarding various scriptures, then it is prudent to step through the subsequent history about those various scriptures.

In post #70, we find for us Christians “that you believe in Him whom He has sent” “is the work of God” (John 6:29), and you glaringly neglected to write anything about specifically that all good works by us Christian are truly works of God “he who practices the Truth comes to the Light, that his works may be revealed, that they are having been worked in God” (John 3:21).

In post #77, we find for us Christian that Romans 4:4-5, which you wrongly quoted as support for your free-willian philosophy, shows that we do not direct our belief to point at Jesus because that would be a work of ours, a doing of ours, but God does direct our belief to point at the Son of the Father because for this is the work of God just as our Creator says “This is the work of God, that you believe in Him whom He has sent” (John 6:29).

In post #78, we find for us Christian that the Deuteronomy 30:19 passage fails to say man has the free-will ability to choose God, so this is not a free-will to choose God proof text.

In post #83, we find exactly how your words change Deuteronomy 30:19 into a thing punctuated in your free-willian philosophy which is not Biblical, and a detailed explanation of how your words illegally covert the righteous "Christ's love" into the lawless "man's love" for 2 Thessalonians 2:9-10.

In post #85, we find your concluding paragraph of "Nobody is forced to believe it is a choice every man must make" contradicts your opening sentence of "Belief (faith) only comes from one source, the Word", and you abusively contort the Word of God recorded in John 5:39-40 to illogically preach that because Christ says "you are unwilling to come to Me so that you may have life" then such a one coming to Christ is a free-will choosing by man despite “he who practices the Truth comes to the Light, that his works may be revealed, that they are having been worked in God” (John 3:21) already being proclaimed to you in post #70. Your opening sentence is true, but your concluding paragraph of "Nobody is forced to believe it is a choice every man must make" demolishes the Sovereignty of God in your free-willian philosophy. The Word of God is “This is the work of God, that you believe in Him whom He has sent” (John 6:29)! Believe the Word of God!

In post #88, we find you subsequently misapplied other scriptures while (1) you disregard the unison prayer to God which includes Pontius Pilate to do whatever Your Hand predestined to occur as recorded in Acts 4:24-30, (2) you disregard the Lord God Almighty is always good (Mark 10:18), (3) you disregard the Lord God Almighty determines which of man perceive God (Matthew 11:25), (4) you disregard the Lord God Almighty declares the Sovereignty of God (John 3:3), (5) you disregard that self-will not free-will but self-will is Scriptural (2 Peter 2:9-10), (6) you nullify the Lord God Almighty graciously imparts belief into God's chosen persons according to God's good will (John 6:29), (7) you confusedly failed to associate "the Lord God Almighty declares man is accountable to God" (Matthew 12:36) with man's self-willed opposition toward God as recorded in 2 Peter 2:9-10, (8) you disregard the Lord God Almighty declares to man his thoughts (Amos 4:13), (9) you disregard the Lord God Almighty conveyed through the Apostle Paul about people who exalt the creature above the Grand Creator (2 Thessalonians 2:11) which includes the free-willian philosophy, (10) you disregard the Lord God Almighty lovingly causes God's chosen persons to will according to God's Way, and God lovingly causes God's chosen persons to work joyfully according to God's Way (Philippians 2:13), and (11) you disregard the Lord God Almighty is glorified with “he who practices the Truth comes to the Light, so that his works may be manifested as having been wrought in God” (The Word of God, John 3:21).

In post #91, we find your "Having faith means nothing if you don’t make the choce to use it" contradicts Christ's sayings of “This is the work of God, that you believe in Him whom He has sent” (John 6:29) and “you did not choose Me, but I chose you” (John 15:16) and “I chose you out of the world” (John 15:19 Includes salvation).

In post #95, we find your composition makes you sound like you believe that lost people are not lost. Everybody starts off as lost (1 Corinthians 15:46). My Lord Jesus declares "the Son of Man has come to save that which was lost" (Matthew 18:11).

In post #96, we find this is where you confusedly failed to associate "the Lord God Almighty declares man is accountable to God" (Matthew 12:36) with fleshly man's self-willed opposition to God as recorded in 2 Peter 2:9-10.

In post #104, we find both you and @B-A-C ask for help in understanding 1 Timothy 2:3-4, so the Wisdom of God (1 Corinthians 1:24) reveals that the Almighty God's desire is always satisfied, so all men mentioned in 1 Timothy 2:3-4 Includes exclusively current and future believers in Christ. God is good to cause men to be saved by God’s grace for God's glory!

In post #106, we find (1) you assigning failure atonement to Christ regarding 1 John 2:2, (2) you nullifying the sinners (Romans 3:23) need for the Savior with your "There is no reason for anyone to spend eternity in the lake of fire", (3) your previously proven false concept "people refuse to choose the love of truth so they could be saved" regarding 2 Thessalonians 2:9-10 as proclaimed to you clear back in post #83, (4) you regurgitate your adulteration of Deuteronomy 30:19 to include free-will ability where free-will ability does not exist as shown way back in post #78 and post #83.

We Christians believe the Christ exclusively chooses persons unto salvation:

• "you did not choose Me, but I chose you" (Lord Jesus Christ, John 15:16), so God chooses people to be friends (John 15:15, the prior verse) and to believe (John 6:29) and to be born again (John 3:3-8) and for righteous works (John 3:21, John 15:5) and to repent (Matthew 11:25) and to love (John 13:34) and unto salvation (John 15:19 the same passage).
• "I chose you out of the world" (Lord Jesus Christ, John 15:19, includes salvation), so God exclusively chooses people unto salvation.
• "What I say to you I say to all" (Lord Jesus Christ, Mark 13:37 - Jesus had taken the Apostles Peter, Andrew, James, and John aside in private and said this), so all the blessings of God mentioned above are to all believers in all time.

The only way for free-willian philosophers to acheive free-will is for free-willians to add to the Word of God, and it is written "do not add to His words or He will reprove you, and you will be proved a liar" (Proverbs 30:6).

We Christians are blessed of God to be chosen by Lord Jesus without exception because the Word of God says "you did not choose Me, but I chose you" (Lord Jesus Christ, John 15:16) and "I chose you out of the world" (Lord Jesus Christ, John 15:19, includes salvation)!

Believe the Word of God!

Love,
Kermos

 

[Curtis]

Hi Curtis,

Let's review where this exchange started.

You wrote the true statement "The only work that gives eternal life is having "faith in Jesus Christ" We must never think that the things we do is giving us eternal life." (proof post #70), but you spent the last few days trying and failing to prove about you free-willians "that the things we do is giving us eternal life.[/I][/B]".

And, since you have resorted to repeat your previously proven to be failed position regarding various scriptures, then it is prudent to step through the subsequent history about those various scriptures.

In post #70, we find for us Christians “that you believe in Him whom He has sent” “is the work of God” (John 6:29), and you glaringly neglected to write anything about specifically that all good works by us Christian are truly works of God “he who practices the Truth comes to the Light, that his works may be revealed, that they are having been worked in God” (John 3:21).

In post #77, we find for us Christian that Romans 4:4-5, which you wrongly quoted as support for your free-willian philosophy, shows that we do not direct our belief to point at Jesus because that would be a work of ours, a doing of ours, but God does direct our belief to point at the Son of the Father because for this is the work of God just as our Creator says “This is the work of God, that you believe in Him whom He has sent” (John 6:29).

In post #78, we find for us Christian that the Deuteronomy 30:19 passage fails to say man has the free-will ability to choose God, so this is not a free-will to choose God proof text.

In post #83, we find exactly how your words change Deuteronomy 30:19 into a thing punctuated in your free-willian philosophy which is not Biblical, and a detailed explanation of how your words illegally covert the righteous "Christ's love" into the lawless "man's love" for 2 Thessalonians 2:9-10.

In post #85, we find your concluding paragraph of "Nobody is forced to believe it is a choice every man must make" contradicts your opening sentence of "Belief (faith) only comes from one source, the Word", and you abusively contort the Word of God recorded in John 5:39-40 to illogically preach that because Christ says "you are unwilling to come to Me so that you may have life" then such a one coming to Christ is a free-will choosing by man despite “he who practices the Truth comes to the Light, that his works may be revealed, that they are having been worked in God” (John 3:21) already being proclaimed to you in post #70. Your opening sentence is true, but your concluding paragraph of "Nobody is forced to believe it is a choice every man must make" demolishes the Sovereignty of God in your free-willian philosophy. The Word of God is “This is the work of God, that you believe in Him whom He has sent” (John 6:29)! Believe the Word of God!

In post #88, we find you subsequently misapplied other scriptures while (1) you disregard the unison prayer to God which includes Pontius Pilate to do whatever Your Hand predestined to occur as recorded in Acts 4:24-30, (2) you disregard the Lord God Almighty is always good (Mark 10:18), (3) you disregard the Lord God Almighty determines which of man perceive God (Matthew 11:25), (4) you disregard the Lord God Almighty declares the Sovereignty of God (John 3:3), (5) you disregard that self-will not free-will but self-will is Scriptural (2 Peter 2:9-10), (6) you nullify the Lord God Almighty graciously imparts belief into God's chosen persons according to God's good will (John 6:29), (7) you confusedly failed to associate "the Lord God Almighty declares man is accountable to God" (Matthew 12:36) with man's self-willed opposition toward God as recorded in 2 Peter 2:9-10, (8) you disregard the Lord God Almighty declares to man his thoughts (Amos 4:13), (9) you disregard the Lord God Almighty conveyed through the Apostle Paul about people who exalt the creature above the Grand Creator (2 Thessalonians 2:11) which includes the free-willian philosophy, (10) you disregard the Lord God Almighty lovingly causes God's chosen persons to will according to God's Way, and God lovingly causes God's chosen persons to work joyfully according to God's Way (Philippians 2:13), and (11) you disregard the Lord God Almighty is glorified with “he who practices the Truth comes to the Light, so that his works may be manifested as having been wrought in God” (The Word of God, John 3:21).

In post #91, we find your "Having faith means nothing if you don’t make the choce to use it" contradicts Christ's sayings of “This is the work of God, that you believe in Him whom He has sent” (John 6:29) and “you did not choose Me, but I chose you” (John 15:16) and “I chose you out of the world” (John 15:19 Includes salvation).

In post #95, we find your composition makes you sound like you believe that lost people are not lost. Everybody starts off as lost (1 Corinthians 15:46). My Lord Jesus declares "the Son of Man has come to save that which was lost" (Matthew 18:11).

In post #96, we find this is where you confusedly failed to associate "the Lord God Almighty declares man is accountable to God" (Matthew 12:36) with fleshly man's self-willed opposition to God as recorded in 2 Peter 2:9-10.

In post #104, we find both you and @B-A-C ask for help in understanding 1 Timothy 2:3-4, so the Wisdom of God (1 Corinthians 1:24) reveals that the Almighty God's desire is always satisfied, so all men mentioned in 1 Timothy 2:3-4 Includes exclusively current and future believers in Christ. God is good to cause men to be saved by God’s grace for God's glory!

In post #106, we find (1) you assigning failure atonement to Christ regarding 1 John 2:2, (2) you nullifying the sinners (Romans 3:23) need for the Savior with your "There is no reason for anyone to spend eternity in the lake of fire", (3) your previously proven false concept "people refuse to choose the love of truth so they could be saved" regarding 2 Thessalonians 2:9-10 as proclaimed to you clear back in post #83, (4) you regurgitate your adulteration of Deuteronomy 30:19 to include free-will ability where free-will ability does not exist as shown way back in post #78 and post #83.

We Christians believe the Christ exclusively chooses persons unto salvation:

• "you did not choose Me, but I chose you" (Lord Jesus Christ, John 15:16), so God chooses people to be friends (John 15:15, the prior verse) and to believe (John 6:29) and to be born again (John 3:3-8) and for righteous works (John 3:21, John 15:5) and to repent (Matthew 11:25) and to love (John 13:34) and unto salvation (John 15:19 the same passage).
• "I chose you out of the world" (Lord Jesus Christ, John 15:19, includes salvation), so God exclusively chooses people unto salvation.
• "What I say to you I say to all" (Lord Jesus Christ, Mark 13:37 - Jesus had taken the Apostles Peter, Andrew, James, and John aside in private and said this), so all the blessings of God mentioned above are to all believers in all time.

The only way for free-willian philosophers to acheive free-will is for free-willians to add to the Word of God, and it is written "do not add to His words or He will reprove you, and you will be proved a liar" (Proverbs 30:6).

We Christians are blessed of God to be chosen by Lord Jesus without exception because the Word of God says "you did not choose Me, but I chose you" (Lord Jesus Christ, John 15:16) and "I chose you out of the world" (Lord Jesus Christ, John 15:19, includes salvation)!

Believe the Word of God!

Love,
Kermos

Question, did Adam Eve have a free will to choose between eating of the tree of knowledge of good and evil or God force them to disobey?

Did the people in hell right now have a choice between Heaven or hell?

Man has always been given a free will choice to choose between options presented by God to man.
If not then man is no different from a pre programmed robot who is forced to love its creator.

 

[Kermos]

""You are not repeating yourself because you keep adjusting your answer by degrees. For example, this time you wrote "It is not my place to say if a person is worthy or not, that is between them and God" which deviates from your stated belief of "Why, what is the Eucharist, Jesus." so worthiness is irrelevant to your original declaration/question of "Does receiving the Eucharist give me salvation, yes." (proof post #59).""

So maybe i am missing something.

How does " it is not my place to say if a person is worthy or not, that is between them and God" and "the Eucharist is Jesus" and " does receiving the Eucharist give me salvation, yes" these statements become at odds with each other?

It is not my place nor your place to say whether or not a person is worthy to be with God. That is between them and God.

We know that you have to receive Jesus to enter into eternal life. But because a person accepts Jesus doesn't mean that they actually do receive Jesus. They can say it all day long like many Christians claim to be Christians and claim to say that they know Jesus when in fact they don't really have Jesus in them, they just say they do.

Much like the Pharisees that condemn Jesus claim to be Jews, but they weren't really Jews because they didn't have God in their heart. They were only Israelis by birth but they weren't Israelis by faith and spirit

Being a Christian is not a Christian just in your head. It's just not knowing about Jesus that saves a person. You can read all you want all day long about Jesus, but if you don't receive Jesus into your heart then you're nothing just a hypocrite.

Hey Bill,

You are trying to evade answering the question after considering that you believe:

1. "Why, what is the Eucharist, Jesus." (proof post #59).
2. "Does receiving the Eucharist give me salvation, yes." (proof post #59).

This question is not about worthiness!

This question is about ingesting the Roman Catholic Church's Eucharist.

Please answer the following question as derived from your above quoted in item #2.

Does receiving the Eucharist give a muslim who rejects Jesus salvation?

Love,
Kermos

 

[Kermos]

Question, did Adam Eve have a free will to choose between eating of the tree of knowledge of good and evil or God force them to disobey?

Did the people in hell right now have a choice between Heaven or hell?

Man has always been given a free will choice to choose between options presented by God to man.
If not then man is no different from a pre programmed robot who is forced to love its creator.

Hello Curtis,

Now, you finally bypassed all of your questions with your underlying beliefs which is summed up in your concluding sentence of "If not then man is no different from a pre programmed robot who is forced to love its creator", and it is worth noting that you applied a lower case "c" to where an upper case "C" properly belongs for the word you wrote "creator", yet you diligently upper cased the "G" in the word you wrote "God" in the immediately preceding sentence.

Your statement with lack of capitalization demonstrates your antagonism against the Sovereignty of God.

You wrote "pre programmed robot" in contrast to "vessels" which God's vessel of mercy Apostle Paul wrote:

​

18 He has mercy on whom He desires, and He hardens whom He desires.​

​

19 You will say to me then, “Why does He still find fault? For who resists His will?” 20 On the contrary, who are you, O man, who answers back to God? The thing molded will not say to the molder, “Why did you make me like this,” will it? 21Or does not the Potter have a right over the clay, to make from the same lump one vessel for honorable use and another for common use? 22 What if God, although willing to demonstrate His wrath and to make His power known, endured with much patience vessels of wrath prepared for destruction? 23 And He did so to make known the riches of His glory upon vessels of mercy, which He prepared beforehand for glory​

(Romans 9:18-23)​

​

So, faithful, glorious, and graceful Lord and God Jesus Christ fills us vessels of mercy with God's works of mercy which God prepared beforehand for glory!

Paul declares God's Sovereign control of man with "He has mercy on whom He desires, and He hardens whom He desires" (Romans 9:18).

Immediately after writing that God is in control, Paul continued with "You will say to me then, 'Why does He still find fault? For who resists His will?'" (Romans 9:19) - herein resides man wrongly assigning man's accountability for sin to God - the fault question similar to your question you asked again and again in your posts, Curtis.

Romans 9:18 segues right into Romans 9:19-23.

Bringing these together:

Paul conveyed "God is in control" (Romans 9:18) then the "you" defiantly mocks God's control with "Why does He still find fault If not then man is no different from a pre programmed robot who is forced to love its creator? For who among pre programmed robot resists His will?" (the book of Second Opinions 9:19).

The "you" in Romans 9:19-20 is the person who rejects God by way of rejecting God's exclusive control of man's salvation; in other words, the "you" is the person that claims man has a free will.

Do not forget that it is written that no purpose of God's can be thwarted (Job 42:2), so scripture reveals that man cannot resist God's will, and Paul knows scripture.

Notice the "you" questioning why God still finds fault. Paul conveys that the "you" asks the fault question in a mocking manner, and the subsequent question about God's will continues with the "you" mocking God who is entirely in control of man's salvation according to Paul (Ephesians 2:8-10 for example).

The "you" is certainly mocking because immediately after the question about God's will, Paul wrote:

​

On the contrary, who are you, O man, who answers back to God? The thing molded will not say to the molder, "Why did you make me like this," will it? (Romans 9:20)​

​

See the "On the contrary" which is indicative that the following statement of Paul refutes the mocking questions of the "you" about the fault question and the question about God's will (in Romans 9:19).

Paul continues immediately after "On the contrary" in Romans 9:20 showing that the thing molded cannot resist the will of the Molder.

The thing molded represents the "you".

The Molder represents God.

IN TRUTH, PAUL CONVEYS THAT MAN CANNOT RESIST GOD'S WILL (ROMANS 9:19-20)!

Behold the parallel of the defiant "you" as adversary against God (in Romans 9:19-20) to free-willians based upon the content of free-willian philosophical writings - look at your post, Curtis. No Holy Scripture states Adam was imparted a free-will, so you are adding to Holy Scripture.

My brother Paul wrote "it does not depend on the man who wills or the man who runs, but on God who has mercy" (Romans 9:16).

Believe in the Holy Sovereign God!

Love,
Kermos