Quran A false Writing

[Rhema]

Dear Brother,
You are under the misperception that @Rhema believes in the Trinity, and that he is a Christian.
He is not, nor does he believe that Jesus is the 2nd person of the Trinity.

Dear Brother,
I can speak for myself.
And while I do not believe in the Trinity, I am a Christian as a disciple of the Teachings of Jesus.

So what a horrid and evil thing to say about me.
You scold me for questioning the salvation of another, and then you turn around and do the same to me.
How is this not hypocrisy?

To be clear, then. Do you believe that only Trinitarians are Christians?
An answer would be appreciated.

Rhema
(And I forgive you.)

 

[Rhema]

Right — and neither is the word "Trinity," but I bet you still believe God is three-in-one.

I think you just blew up your assumption meter.

(And you sound like a chewing gum commercial.)

 

[The Gospel of Christ]

Such an evil translation of the Greek text given to you by the Church of England.

All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness:​

- 2 Timothy 3:16 KJV

There is no verb "is." There is no verb "given." If you think so, show me....

και οτι απο βρεφους τα ιερα γραμματα οιδας τα δυναμενα σε σοφισαι εις σωτηριαν δια πιστεως της εν χριστω ιησου πασα γραφη θεοπνευστος και ωφελιμος προς διδασκαλιαν προς ελεγχον προς επανορθωσιν προς παιδειαν την εν δικαιοσυνη ​

- 2 Timothy 3:15-16 Greek NT TR

While I don't have the time to post a detailed essay, here's what the Greek texts say:

(2Ti 3:15,16) And that from a child thou hast known the holy scriptures (which are able to make thee wise unto salvation through faith which is in Christ Jesus) every inspired and profitable writing for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness:​

The text is saying, "thou has known the holy scriptures - every inspired and profitable scripture for..." that Timothy knew every inspired scripture, not that all scriptures are inspired.

Second Timothy 3:16 is purposefully mistranslated so someone can Bible thump you over the head. Christians like to do that. And most of them don't even know where their Bible comes from.

Rhema

Rebuttal to your 2 Timothy 3:16 Spin Job:

You said:
“There is no verb ‘is.’ There is no verb ‘given.’... It’s a mistranslation. It just means the Scripture Timothy read was inspired, not that all Scripture is.”

That’s not exegesis — that’s sleight of hand. You’re not reading Greek; you’re bending it to avoid what the Spirit is plainly saying.

Let’s set the record straight:

1. Koine Greek regularly omits “is” in simple declarative statements.

The phrase πᾶσα γραφὴ θεόπνευστος καὶ ὠφέλιμος means:

“All Scripture is God-breathed and profitable...”
There’s no need for the verb “is” to appear — it’s implied, as is normal and expected in Koine Greek syntax.
You don’t need to inject your theology to explain the grammar. It’s basic Greek 101.

2. There’s no restrictive clause here.

If Paul meant to say “only the Scriptures Timothy already read that happen to be inspired,” he would’ve said:

πᾶσα γραφὴ ἡ θεόπνευστος – “every Scripture which is God-breathed.”

But he didn’t.
He said:

πᾶσα γραφὴ θεόπνευστος – All Scripture is God-breathed.

It’s a universal declaration, not a selective one. You’re trying to smuggle in qualifiers the Holy Spirit never gave.


3. You’re not smarter than the Church Fathers.

Let’s be blunt. The early Church didn’t read 2 Timothy 3:16 and say,

“Hmm... maybe only some Scripture is inspired.”

No.

Irenaeus said Scripture is perfect because it’s from God.
Athanasius said no man can add or subtract from it.
Augustine literally called it divinitus inspirata — “divinely breathed.”

They understood it. The Reformers understood it. Even the KJV translators you revere understood it.

The only ones who seem confused are modern skeptics looking for a loophole.


Let’s just be honest:
This whole “mistranslation” argument exists so you can disqualify parts of the Bible you don’t like.

You want to say:

Paul isn’t really an apostle.
The Old Testament doesn’t count.
God changed His mind about sin.
Scripture is “profitable,” but not binding.

In other words: you want a Gospel without God’s Word — and that’s no Gospel at all.

“All Scripture is God-breathed.” Period.
Not “some.” Not “only the ones you like.”
All.

You can argue with Paul if you want. But you won’t win.
Because you're not debating a translation.
You're rejecting the Spirit who breathed the Word.

“The words that I speak unto you, they are spirit, and they are life.” – John 6:63
“Forever, O LORD, Thy Word is settled in heaven.” – Psalm 119:89

 

[Rhema]

Repent.
Before the Gospel you mock becomes your Judge.

Despite your pretentious name, you really don't know what the Gospel is. And that's sad.

Your entire polemic is a rant against Scofield.

But since Nick has expressed concern for the divergence from the OP, I won't reply here in this thread any further.

 

[Rhema]

It just means the Scripture Timothy read was inspired, not that all Scripture is.”

YEAH.... You really DO have reading comprehension problems.

I'm sorry your 10th grade English teacher failed you.

But you might wish to improve your skill set.

 

[The Gospel of Christ]

YEAH.... You really DO have reading comprehension problems.

I'm sorry your 10th grade English teacher failed you.

But you might wish to improve your skill set.

All you have is hot air.. Try refuting something with Scripture..

 

[Christ4Ever]

So then you think your abilities in Linguistics are better than mine.

Are you saying those proficient in linguistics can't distort or lie?

Don't take this the wrong way, but you're not educated enough to make that determination.

I don't have to be educated to know when something smells bad. Even when it's coming from the most educated of people.

I'm sorry you feel that I'm mischaracterizing or distorting what you write

Stop lying! lol You're not sorry, or you'd stop doing it. This is not the first time and I'm sure it will be the last, since I believe it's the simplicity of some statements and not the complexity of others that escapes your understanding.

I'm sorry you feel that I'm mischaracterizing or distorting what you write but my confidence in what I write was expressed by a willingness to have my work independently reviewed by a competent third party mediator

So, who is this third-party mediator that you speak of? Did they give you a written review? Also, did you provide them my complete writings that you were commenting on so that they could see the context? I'd be interested to see it...date stamped of course.

If you are unable to provide proof of text of the review, it then makes the above words you shared with me of yours a lie.

This is exactly what you do which I am sure you will not see. As you haven't seen the other times, I did a chopped version of what you had written as an example in order to show your own failure to comprehend the need of context! How many times must I show you the importance of maintaining context or what is written, even with your own words as I have done above, which can be distorted enough to lose the intended meaning to what was intended by the writer to be conveyed though not a word has been changed.

I know how you operate brother, and I know how you will reply to this, and so you know what I'll do shortly thereafter.

Perhaps instead of continuing to pick the mote out of my posts

NO, YOU DIDN'T! ROFL
What really makes it a gut buster, is that you are unable to see the above in your reply to me! ROFL (At least I don't have to vacuum, just wash the t-shirt)

(But heaven forbid that you might wrong... eh?)

I moved to another room. ROFL
Thanks for the help with getting me to get my housework done.

Only in Love of Christ Brother!
YBIC
Nick
\o/
<><

 

[Christ4Ever]

Dear Brother,
I can speak for myself.
And while I do not believe in the Trinity, I am a Christian as a disciple of the Teachings of Jesus.

So what a horrid and evil thing to say about me.
You scold me for questioning the salvation of another, and then you turn around and do the same to me.
How is this not hypocrisy?

To be clear, then. Do you believe that only Trinitarians are Christians?
An answer would be appreciated.

Rhema
(And I forgive you.)

At least now they know, since you were not going to offer it.

Christian now are we! Gosh, it's nice to know. I might have confused you in this part with another anti-trinitarian who hated being identified as a Christian...who is probably no longer with us here on TJ.

Since you opened the door. I also don't believe that your Jesus and mine are the same, not in line with the Mormons or Muslims mind you, and so you can say you're a follower of Jesus and a Christian all you want, it's between you and him on that profession of faith. After all is said and done my doubts don't move the needle.

With the Love of Christ Jesus.
YBIC
Nick
\o/
<><

 

[Seethat]

And one Spirit? Not Seven?

You can have a spirit of Holiness as an example it doesnt mean 7 Gods

but you seem to think "Lord" means Jesus.

Jesus is Lord, there is no substitute, and it is a criteria to be saved... You would confess that Jesus is Lord

​

Romans 10:9 That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved.

you will know eventually

Philippians 2

10 That at the name of Jesus every knee should bow, of things in heaven, and things in earth, and things under the earth;
11 And that every tongue should confess that Jesus Christ is Lord, to the glory of God the Father.

 

[thelightbearsservant]

Asd for the Quran. It maybe interesting to many to read the story given in The Second chapter; about the creation of Adam and The Ohers. It does give One Food For Thought; Just like the Tree in The Garden did to Eve!
DeepSeeker

The devil has his version of what happened, too, but you can't trust him—God calls him the father of lies.

 

[Leumas]

The devil has his version of what happened, too, but you can't trust him—God calls him the father of lies.

And his children commit sin.

 

[Garee]

Dear Brother,
I can speak for myself.
And while I do not believe in the Trinity, I am a Christian as a disciple of the Teachings of Jesus.

So what a horrid and evil thing to say about me.
You scold me for questioning the salvation of another, and then you turn around and do the same to me.
How is this not hypocrisy?

To be clear, then. Do you believe that only Trinitarians are Christians?
An answer would be appreciated.

Rhema
(And I forgive you.)

Hi brother I would offer. .

The word three throughout is used in parables denoting the end of a matter. It is first used in Genesis . Day three Christ seeing false pride in lucifer. The glory of Christ as the literal light departed.

God, who is light, will again be the literal light of the whole world on the last day under the Sun and moon. The two witnesses Father and Son. by the mouth of one no judgement.

The Sun metaphor represents the glorious witness of the Father. The Father working in the son of man Jesus represented by the Moon the lesser reflected light

Day 4 Switched on the two temporal corruption timekeepers winding down towards the last day under the Sun .

Two is the word designed to represent our Holy Father not seen has spoken using the Son of man to demonstrate his invisible power (faith)

Same kind used in the coin parables One side seen Cesar the other side not seen eternal God. Satan would make it all one in the same to take away the spiritual value

Two tables written on both sides (sola scriptura) Two sets were made the first set destroyed to represent the letter of the law Death and second the New Testament both working as one perfect law the just and justifier

Two working as one in respect to the gospel parable fulfilling the prophecy of the father bruising of heel the crushing of the head of the serpent gospel

The dynamic dual The propmised three days and three nights demonastation began in the garden .There the unseen Holy father struck and rised the heel .three times The Son ofman loked for suport form the other aotles three times the father put them aslep to foulfil the prophecy of two.The dynnaic fuadl

 

[thelightbearsservant]

And his children commit sin.

We have to suffer them on this earth, and the injustice they cause, but it is not forever "For the Lord knoweth the way of the righteous: but the way of the ungodly shall perish."

 

[Leumas]

We have to suffer them on this earth, and the injustice they cause, but it is not forever "For the Lord knoweth the way of the righteous: but the way of the ungodly shall perish."

I rule over them.

 

[Deep Seeker]

The Scofield breakdown.. “I don’t have Scripture to refute you, but your inability to convince me proves you’re wrong.”

That’s not theology.
That’s delusion.

I cited Acts 9 — Jesus personally calling Paul.
I cited Galatians 1 — Paul declaring his apostleship came directly from Christ.
I cited 2 Peter 3 — Peter calling Paul’s letters Scripture.
I cited 1 John 4 — John saying those who reject apostolic teaching are not of God.

That’s four witnesses from the Word, All in agreement.

Your response?
No chapter.
No verse.
Just: “You didn’t convince me, therefore it’s false.” <eye roll goes here>

That’s not proof —
that’s pride dressing up as discernment.

If your only standard for truth is whether you personally accept it,
then you’ve made yourself the final authority — not the Word of God.

And that’s exactly what Satan did in Eden.
“Has God really said?”

So again —
Refute what I actually said.
With Scripture.
Or admit you can’t.

Because your denial isn’t discernment.
It’s the last breath of a theology that can’t survive the light of the Word.

Interesting view of Your thoughts! However; It is exactly that, Your Thoughts.
Have your read The Book Of Enoch by any chance? I would like to hear what You think of It.
Deepseeker

 

[Deep Seeker]

"Son of man, stand on YOUR feet, I am sending You to The House Of Isreal" .
Jesus asl His disciples: "Who do men say I am?" They said: Some say You are this One and some say another something else. THEN: He turned to Peter and ask Him who He thought He was.

Peter said: "You are THE SON OF MAN" ! Jesus told Peter that He was blessed for understanding THAT. Who then is The Son Of Man? ?

It is Abel; The One that Cain killed. Hence: Son OF MAN, stand on Your feet ! THEN: "I YOU to the house of Isreal."

That is why it is said to Mary that, The One being in Her was because of God ! It was Abel reincarnated ! The One whom Cain killed. This also brings up another deep story which I will not enter into here.

Deepseeker

 

[Deep Seeker]

The devil has his version of what happened, too, but you can't trust him—God calls him the father of lies.

Greetings:
I would like to hear what You believe.

How did Todays Bible come to Be? Who wrote It? Why are there so many versions of It?
There being so many versions, which One is truly correct?
Why so many Denominations Today? There are some 34,000 various Denominations the last time I checked! Which One do You prefer?

So which is correct ?

Deepseeker

 

[Deep Seeker]

RHEMA
It appears that You have been given a GIFT of being able to venture into other countries. That however, in Itself does not bring spiritual knowledge, does it?
I too, thanks to the U.S. Army; had the opportunity to be in Eritrea in My young years. I did not know at The Time that it would turn out to The Gift It was.

Today, with what is going on in that region of The World, I can better understand the conditions There in that part of The World. There is indeed, beautiful country There. The people were also very nice, and intelligent. I often whish that I had stayed longer than I did; I could have. The Locust plague was something to behold !

DeepSeeker

 

[Rhema]

Peter said: "You are THE SON OF MAN" !

NO DEEP... you're making crap up. Peter did NOT say that. Shame on you.

READ -

He saith unto them, But whom say ye that I am? And Simon Peter answered and said, Thou art the Christ, the Son of the living God. And Jesus answered and said unto him, Blessed art thou, Simon Barjona: for flesh and blood hath not revealed it unto thee, but my Father which is in heaven.​

- Matthew 16:15-17 KJV

PETER DID NOT SAY, "You are the Son of Man." He said, "You are THE SON OF GOD."

Why would you make this kind of mistake?
Just don't.
Now how can anyone trust you in anything else you say?

Jesus told Peter that He was blessed for understanding THAT.

Again, no. Jesus told Peter that he was blessed because the FATHER revealed it to him. Not because his understanding figured it out.

Who then is The Son Of Man? ?

It is Abel;

No it isn't. Abel is dead. Dead-dead.

DEEP, you make these claims, and I'm sure you believe them, but what's your source. Quote your scripture. Or you just come across as a crazy person. We're willing to listen, but put your arguments together. Provide support.

Now the JW's claim that Jesus was the Archangel Michael, and they provide support - there's a lot of holes in the logic, but at least they try.

Greetings:
I would like to hear what You believe.

I know you didn't address the to me, but if you be so kind as to allow me to answer?

How did Todays Bible come to Be?

It takes a book to answer that just for the New Testament.

Goodreads

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www.goodreads.com

It's college level reading, so pretty comprehensive.

Who wrote It?

A lot of people. Tradition holds that Moses wrote the first five books of the OT. Nobody really knows who wrote the Gospels of the NT, but Matthew, Mark and Luke are very likely to be the actual authors. And only a part of the epistles attributed to Paul are confirmed as having been written by Paul. But you're heading into an academic field of Textual Criticism and it's not simple math.

Goodreads

Discover and share books you love on Goodreads.

www.goodreads.com

Why are there so many versions of It?

For the NT, first, the original Greek texts had to be copied and copied and copied over and over - by hand. Scribes do this work, and at times they make mistakes. Right now, because of archeology and academic rigor, there is only one compilation of the Greek New Testament that is considered to be as authentic as possible.

As far as translations go, each church that has its own Statement of Faith wants a Bible that supports their doctrines and beliefs, so out pops another English translation. While I quote the KJV because it's mostly accepted, NOBODY speaks a 400 year old dialect of English.

There being so many versions, which One is truly correct?

For the Greek NT, that would NA28 (LINK) but you have to be able to read Greek.

As far as English translations go, I've not found ONE SINGLE English translation that is "truly correct."

Why so many Denominations Today? There are some 34,000 various Denominations the last time I checked! Which One do You prefer?

The 34,000 number comes from a LEGAL perspective. Religious societies (legally incorporated) that establish ownership of buildings and furniture and hymnals. There are only about 300 PROTESTANT denominations with regards to the collections of doctrines and beliefs.

Two churches might believe the exact same thing, but one group has legal ownership of their stuff and another has legal ownership of their own other stuff.

So which is correct ?

None of them. But some are more correct than others.

RHEMA
It appears that You have been given a GIFT of being able to venture into other countries.

Why would you say that? I'm curious, because for the last 8 years I'm mostly unable to walk, let alone travel. I certainly would if I could, though.

That however, in Itself does not bring spiritual knowledge, does it?

Travel? No. But I have visited over 475 churches over my lifetime to get an understanding of these various denominations. Spiritual knowledge has to come as a revelation from the Holy Spirit, but unless one knows (deeply knows) the Bible scriptures, it will be hard to determine whether a teaching is true or just some idiot's brain fart.

thanks to the U.S. Army; had the opportunity to be in Eritrea in My young years.

That must have been really interesting. At least you didn't get stuck in Somalia.

God bless,
Rhema

 

[thelightbearsservant]

Greetings:
I would like to hear what You believe.

How did Todays Bible come to Be? Who wrote It? Why are there so many versions of It?
There being so many versions, which One is truly correct?
Why so many Denominations Today? There are some 34,000 various Denominations the last time I checked! Which One do You prefer?

So which is correct ?

Deepseeker

Deep seeker, I have a friend who is a muslim. They aren't even encouraged to ask questions of the quran until they reach Iman status. Why do you think this is? Could it be because there are a lot of discrepancies in the quran? It's also written from the perspective of Ishmael, Isaac's half-brother, is considered the father of the Arabs in Islamic tradition.