Where do we go when we die?

[Brother-Paul]

Topic:
Where do we go when we die?

According to the Bible, The Word of God

- Flesh body
- Soul
- Spirit

 

[Beetow]

The Bible Is the Word of God.

No one yet has proven beyond a hint of sensible doubt that the Bible is a god's
word; just as no one yet has proven beyond a hint of sensible doubt that the Koran
is a god's word, nor that the Bhagavad Gita is a god's word.

Going back to 2 Timothy 3:16

Quoting the Bible itself to prove that the Bible itself is a god's word is sort of like a
judge acquitting a defendant based upon the defendant saying he didn't do it.
_

 

[Brother-Paul]

No one yet has proven beyond a hint of sensible doubt that the Bible is a god's
word; just as no one yet has proven beyond a hint of sensible doubt that the Koran
is a god's word, nor that the Bhagavad Gita is a god's word.


Quoting the Bible itself to prove that the Bible itself is a god's word is sort of like a
judge acquitting a defendant based upon the defendant saying he didn't do it.
_

Greetings @Beetow

The topic is a discussion about where we go when we die, according to the Bible, The Word of God.

It would seem more appropriate to start a new thread if you wish to discuss the items you mention above.

Shalom

 

[Beetow]

According to the Bible, The Word of God

- Flesh body
- Soul
- Spirit

According to Matt 10:28, the body and the soul are perishable; and though the
body is perishable by any means, the soul is perishable only by divine means; i.e.
the deaths of body and soul aren't necessarily simultaneous, viz: the soul lives on
until such a time as God decides to give it either a thumb up or a thumb down.

Now, death is a verified fact; however the existence of soul and the existence of
God are unverified, i.e. they're assumed true by believers rather than proven true.

Were the existence of soul and the existence of God to be scientifically proven true
beyond even a hint of sensible doubt; news of the discovery would make headlines
all 'round the world, even on FaceBook and Twitter, and in China and North Korea.
_

 

[Brother-Paul]

According to Matt 10:28, the body and the soul are perishable; and though the
body is perishable by any means, the soul is perishable only by divine means; i.e.
the deaths of body and soul aren't necessarily simultaneous, viz: the soul lives on
until such a time as God decides to give it either a thumb up or a thumb down.

Now, death is a verified fact; however the existence of soul and the existence of
God are unverified, i.e. they're assumed true by believers rather than proven true.

Were the existence of soul and the existence of God to be scientifically proven true
beyond even a hint of sensible doubt; news of the discovery would make headlines
all 'round the world, even on FaceBook and Twitter, and in China and North Korea.
_

Thank you for taking part in the discussion @Beetow

Whether God or the soul is verified or unverified, by what ever terms you wish to come to that conclusion, I would put it like this, a born again from above believer knows beyond doubt God is real, they are washed and regenerated by the Spirit who has entered their heart, the second they repent and confess the Lord Jesus with their lips and from their heart, they are made new, if that hasn't happened they remain lost souls and will pay the price for there sins, according to God's Holy Word.

Once we are born anew, we do not need any further proof, it is real, so what ever God's Word says is real also, every word, every dot and tittle of it.

Now it is only the lost soul who questions this, because they cannot see and will not enter the Kingdom of Heaven, unless they are born again. John 3:1-21

A truly born again soul accepts God at His Word, doesn't need to compare to the Koran or any other religion, the spirit within reveals the Truth to us, it is spiritually verified.

In His Love

 

[B-A-C]

Now, death is a verified fact; however the existence of soul and the existence of
God are unverified, i.e. they're assumed true by believers rather than proven true.

Were the existence of soul and the existence of God to be scientifically proven true
beyond even a hint of sensible doubt; news of the discovery would make headlines
all 'round the world, even on FaceBook and Twitter, and in China and North Korea.

This is of course... what "faith" is all about.

Heb 11:1; Now faith is the substance of things hoped for, the evidence of things not seen.

But if there is no after-life, then there is no reason to be a Christian or believe in God.
If this is all there is, then why bother?
All your posts about how many people have gone to hell have no meaning if everyone just ceases to exist.
It's just meaningless babble to fill up space on a web-page.

 

[Beetow]

• Heb 11:1 . . Now faith is the substance of things hoped for, the evidence of things
not seen.

The Greek word translated "substance" is somewhat ambiguous. It basically refers
to support whose purpose is to hold something up or in place so it doesn't collapse.
The same word is sometimes translated "confidence".

Most religions incorporate faith to some degree; including but not limited to:
Buddhism Hinduism, Mormonism, Islam, Christianity, Baha'i, Judaism, etc.

Now, I should think it goes without saying that faith is not fact, i.e. faith is neither
reasonable, nor logical, nor empirical nor scientific. So then, I think it's safe to
guess that Heb 11:1 implies-- in so many words --one's faith in Christianity in no
way proves Christianity is true. The world's most famous philosopher would likely
agree with that assessment.

"Faith is believin' what you know ain't so." (Mark Twain)

When skeptics demand a Christian to show them proof that Christianity is true; the
Christian's reply had better be "I don't have any" and that's because their faith
should not stand in the wisdom of men, but in the power of God. (1Cor 2:5)
_

 

[Brother-Paul]

Greetings @Beetow

The topic is a discussion about where we go when we die, according to the Bible, The Word of God.

It would seem more appropriate to start a new thread if you wish to discuss the items you mention above.

Shalom

 

[Sue D.]

@Beetow -- a truly born again believer will have a peacefulness in their heart that wasn't there previously. That is -- previous to having accepted Jesus Christ as their personal Savior. I can tell you exactly when the Holy Spirit came to indwell me as a born again believer -- I had an inner peace that hadn't been there before. And it's never left.

I hope that someday , you, too, will know that inner peace. And that someday we can meet in heaven. The New Jerusalem.

 

[Butch5]

According to Matt 10:28, the body and the soul are perishable; and though the
body is perishable by any means, the soul is perishable only by divine means; i.e.
the deaths of body and soul aren't necessarily simultaneous, viz: the soul lives on
until such a time as God decides to give it either a thumb up or a thumb down.

Now, death is a verified fact; however the existence of soul and the existence of
God are unverified, i.e. they're assumed true by believers rather than proven true.

Were the existence of soul and the existence of God to be scientifically proven true
beyond even a hint of sensible doubt; news of the discovery would make headlines
all 'round the world, even on FaceBook and Twitter, and in China and North Korea.
_

Hi Beetow,

The soul is provable. That any of us type on this forum proves the soul exists. The soul in the Bible isn't the same thing as the soul in Greek philosophy. In Greek philosophy the soul is some immaterial thing. In the Bible the soul is a living being. Living beings are all around us, thus proving the existence of the soul.

 

[Butch5]

• Heb 11:1 . . Now faith is the substance of things hoped for, the evidence of things
not seen.

The Greek word translated "substance" is somewhat ambiguous. It basically refers
to support whose purpose is to hold something up or in place so it doesn't collapse.
The same word is sometimes translated "confidence".

Most religions incorporate faith to some degree; including but not limited to:
Buddhism Hinduism, Mormonism, Islam, Christianity, Baha'i, Judaism, etc.

Now, I should think it goes without saying that faith is not fact, i.e. faith is neither
reasonable, nor logical, nor empirical nor scientific. So then, I think it's safe to
guess that Heb 11:1 implies-- in so many words --one's faith in Christianity in no
way proves Christianity is true. The world's most famous philosopher would likely
agree with that assessment.

"Faith is believin' what you know ain't so." (Mark Twain)

When skeptics demand a Christian to show them proof that Christianity is true; the
Christian's reply had better be "I don't have any" and that's because their faith
should not stand in the wisdom of men, but in the power of God. (1Cor 2:5)
_

Why do you say faith isn't reasonable or logical? When I sit on a park bench it's because I have faith that it will support me? That faith is based on experience. I've sat on many park benches and they have supported me. If 50% of the time the bench collapsed, I won't have faith in a park bench and would check it structurally before I would sit on it. When a doctor gives us medicine we take it by faith. We trust that the doctor has our best interest at heart. Again, if half of the people who got medicine from the doctor died, you can bet I'm not taking medicine from that doctor. We take that medicine by faith.

 

[Beetow]

In the Bible the soul is a living being. Living beings are all around us, thus proving
the existence of the soul.

The soul spoken of at Gen 1:20-30 and Gen 2:7 is not the same soul as that
spoken of at Matt 10:28. Same spelling, different meaning.
_

 

[Butch5]

The soul spoken of at Gen 1:20-30 and Gen 2:7 is not the same soul as that
spoken of at Matt 10:28. Same spelling, different meaning.
_

Can you establish that? Simply saying it doesn't make it so. I'd submit they are one and the same.

 

[Beetow]

Can you establish that?

Yes.
_

 

[Butch5]

Yes.
_

Looking forward to it.

 

[Brother-Paul]

The soul spoken of at Gen 1:20-30 and Gen 2:7 is not the same soul as that
spoken of at Matt 10:28. Same spelling, different meaning.
_

Greetings @Beetow

Please confirm your reasoning to your statement.

I refer to the following.

The soul quoted in Genesis is in Hebrew H5315 nephesh

Genesis 2:7
And the LORD God formed man of the dust of the ground, and breathed into his nostrils the breath of life; and man became a living soul.

LIVING = Hebrew Strong's Number: 2416
Hebrew Word: ‏חַי‎
Transliteration: ḥay
Phonetic Pronunciation: khah'ee
Root: from <H2421>

Vine's Words: Live (To)

Usage Notes:
English Words used in KJV:
live 197
life 144
beast 76
alive 31
creature 15
running 7
living thing 6
raw 6
miscellaneous translations 19
[Total Count: 501]

from <H2421> (chayah); alive; hence raw (flesh); fresh (plant, water, year), strong; also (as noun, especially in the feminine singular and masculine plural) life (or living thing), whether literal or figurative :- + age, alive, appetite, (wild) beast, company, congregation, life (-time), live (-ly), living (creature, thing), maintenance, + merry, multitude, + (be) old, quick, raw, running, springing, troop.

Strong, J. (2020). Strong’s Talking Greek and Hebrew Dictionary

SOUL = Hebrew Strong's Number: 5315
Hebrew Word: ‏נֶפֶשׁ‎
Transliteration: nepesh
Phonetic Pronunciation: neh'-fesh
Root: from <H5314>

Vine's Words: None

Usage Notes:
English Words used in KJV:
soul 475
life 117
person 29
mind 15
heart 15
creature 9
body 8
himself 8
yourselves 6
dead 5
will 4
desire 4
man 3
themselves 3
any 3
appetite 2
miscellaneous translations 47
[Total Count: 753]

from <H5314> (naphash); properly a breathing creature, i.e. animal or (abstract) vitality; used very widely in a literal, accommodated or figurative sense (bodily or mental) :- any, appetite, beast, body, breath, creature, × dead (-ly), desire, × [dis-] contented, × fish, ghost, + greedy, he, heart (-y), (hath, × jeopardy of) life (× in jeopardy), lust, man, me, mind, mortally, one, own, person, pleasure, (her-, him-, my-, thy-) self, them (your) -selves, + slay, soul, + tablet, they, thing, (× she) will, × would have it.

Strong, J. (2020). Strong’s Talking Greek and Hebrew Dictionary. WORDsearch.



The soul quoted in the New Testament is in Greek G5590 psyche

Matthew 10:28
And fear not them which kill the body, but are not able to kill the soul: but rather fear him which is able to destroy both soul and body in hell.

SOUL = Greek Strong's Number: 5590
Greek Word: ψυχή
Transliteration: psychē
Phonetic Pronunciation: psoo-khay'
Root: from <G5594>

Vine's Words: Doubt (be in; make to), Doubtful, Doubting, Heart, Heartily, Life, Living, Lifetime, Life-giving, Soul

Usage Notes:
English Words used in KJV:
soul 58
life 40
mind 3
heart 1
heartily + <G1537> 1
not tr 2
[Total Count: 105]

from <G5594> (psucho); breath, i.e. (by implication) spirit, abstract or concrete (the animal sentient principle only; thus distinguished on the one hand from <G4151> (pneuma), which is the rational and immortal soul; and on the other from <G2222> (zoe), which is mere vitality, even of plants: these terms thus exactly correspond respectively to the Hebrew <H5315> (nephesh), <H7307> (ruwach) and <H2416> (chay)) :- heart (+ -ily), life, mind, soul, + us, + you.

Strong, J. (2020). Strong’s Talking Greek and Hebrew Dictionary.

 

[Beetow]

Please confirm your reasoning to your statement.

I'm declining your request because I've seen too many discussions of soul on
internet forums become perpetual bull sessions that never get to the bottom of
anything. I made up my mind long ago to avoid going down that road. Sorry.
_

 

[Brother-Paul]

I'm declining your request because I've seen too many discussions of soul on
internet forums become perpetual bull sessions that never get to the bottom of
anything. I made up my mind long ago to avoid going down that road. Sorry.
_

No bull sessions here @Beetow

We discuss things together, show scripture to back up what we believe, use regognised dictionaries etc, if I am wrong I always hold my hand up, I can only assume that what has been said already goes against your thinking, but as said, we discuss things together, share our understanding, is that not the proper thing to do?

You may know something that makes me or us think, makes us question our understanding, please feel free to share your thoughts and scriptural understanding according to God's Holy Word.

In His Love

 

[Beetow]

No bull sessions here

I am not a new kid on the block

I've been active on Talk Jesus since April of 2020 and composed 1350+ comments.
I've seen for myself what goes on around here. Some of you people fancy
yourselves as sophisticated students of the Bible while in reality you're a Sunday
school teacher's worst nightmare.
_

 

[Brother-Paul]

I am not a new kid on the block

I've been active on Talk Jesus since April of 2020 and composed 1350+ comments.
I've seen for myself what goes on around here. Some of you people fancy
yourselves as sophisticated students of the Bible while in reality you're a Sunday
school teacher's worst nightmare.
_

Read back through this thread, though some things I can agree with, certainly not all, the thread has been interesting and really does encourages interaction, we just ask that all backed up what they say with scripture.

Shalom