Can A Saved person Ever Become Unsaved?

[Brighthouse]

Brother Dave,my problem is not that God is in control,my problem with your doctrine is that God is always in control. Here is an example I hope you will look at and see what i mean.( Matt 4:1-11) I wanted to show the entire portion to you bro,but i wish to discuss with you what you thought about verses 8-10 Here the devil has control,for if he did not have control, he could not have offered Jesus all the kingdoms of the world,for who could offer such unless they themselves had control to do this?

Jesus did not tell the devil he did not have control of these things,but rather said unto him verse 10! SO!!! The Calvin Doctrine cannot be true,even for this one instance.For Calvin believes only God has control of all things.Here he sure does not have control. And if one says well he allowed him to have control,then that would make the Lord part evil as well.Why would he tempt himself? When God cannot tempt nor be tempted.( James 1:13-14) SO!!! To tempt someone as the devil did here,he had to own what he tempted Jesus with!! Your serve bro hehe I hope you are having as much fun with this as i am looking to learn your doctrine.Not being mean in any way!! Just interested in how you will answer this.

 

[Dave M]

Brother Dave,my problem is not that God is in control,my problem with your doctrine is that God is always in control. Here is an example I hope you will look at and see what i mean.( Matt 4:1-11) I wanted to show the entire portion to you bro,but i wish to discuss with you what you thought about verses 8-10 Here the devil has control,for if he did not have control, he could not have offered Jesus all the kingdoms of the world,for who could offer such unless they themselves had control to do this?

Jesus did not tell the devil he did not have control of these things,but rather said unto him verse 10! SO!!! The Calvin Doctrine cannot be true,even for this one instance.For Calvin believes only God has control of all things.Here he sure does not have control. And if one says well he allowed him to have control,then that would make the Lord part evil as well.Why would he tempt himself? When God cannot tempt nor be tempted.( James 1:13-14) SO!!! To tempt someone as the devil did here,he had to own what he tempted Jesus with!! Your serve bro hehe I hope you are having as much fun with this as i am looking to learn your doctrine.Not being mean in any way!! Just interested in how you will answer this.

Hello Brighthouse First let me say that I love Christ with all my heart and soul, as I can see you do also, so it is a pleasure to converse with you. Most important of all, we Love and believe in Jesus, I seek only the truth, as you do I can clearly see, so I offer what I think, I do keep a open mind that I could be wrong. The first thing you ask about is the devil having control, the way I see it is the devil only has control because God allows it, and God already knows what the devils going to do before the devil knows, you may ask how (he is God) well the best way I can explain that in human terms is God lives outside of time, and can see the future past and present. (this is just my thoughts, but helps me understand predestination)

Then what about the Devil tempting Jesus in the desert and offering him the Earths kingdoms you ask. Well first He is the Devil and God gave him those Kingdoms, first thoughts that I think is that he is the devil he could be lying . But Why did Jesus go out to the desert and get tempted for 40 days?? I believe it was for us !! he is God and can not be tempted, he went out there for our sake so we could learn from his example, is what I believe, I believe he knew what was going to happen before it happened with the devil. Jesus whole life was for us to learn from.

For the record I am not a Calvinist I believe we have free will to choose and believe. I just believe God already knows what we are going to do before we do it, he is outside of time, time does not effect God like us he moves in and out of it, is the best I can understand it.

God Bless you Brighthouse

 

[Brighthouse]

Thanks bro! I do agree upon this! I am sure he knows all things!!! 1 Peter 1:2! We just differ on the difference between fore-knowledge and predestined. Rom 8:29 " He also predestined us TO CONFORM, not are conformed. Hence ( Phil 1:6) So thanks again bro!!

 

[amadeus2]

For the record I am not a Calvinist I believe we have free will to choose and believe. I just believe God already knows what we are going to do before we do it, he is outside of time, time does not effect God like us he moves in and out of it, is the best I can understand it.

Amen, I agree with your above cited words. The thing that is difficult or impossible for men to understand is that even while we make all of the choices ourselves, both the good ones and the bad ones, God already knows beforehand [before we have made them] what those choices are and what the final results are to be. Analysing what I have said [and what you have said] carefully may result in something of a quandary, but it is no quandary for God. When I don't and/or cannot understand what God is doing and how He is doing it I will often go to these words:

Isa 55:8 For my thoughts are not your thoughts, neither are your ways my ways, saith the LORD.
Isa 55:9 For as the heavens are higher than the earth, so are my ways higher than your ways, and my thoughts than your thoughts.

We do really live by faith rather than by knowledge. God certainly gives us some knowledge, but sometimes He has not allowed us to understand for His own reasons.

 

[Dave M]

My of understand salvation is that no matter what I do I am not good enough, because we are all sinners even after we become saved we are still sinners not n as much, (we all still sin we do not live in sin) so with that said there is not difference in one little sin a whole lot of sin when it comes to salvation you have to be a admitted sinner in order to come to salvation. As a admitted sinner you know you are still a sinner so whats the difference does it make that you are still a sinner, now you are a believer you have faith you are a admitted sinner. Once you have Faith and become a believer you receive eternal life here and now. This is a gift from God by his grace. The bible tells us we can not return gifts from God

Romans 11:29
For God's gifts and his call can never be withdrawn.

Those that think we can loose our salvation by doing something, I cant help but to think you must think you have done something to earn salvation, we have to understand our good works are a result of faith, they have nothing to do with earning salvation, works are a by product of Faith in Christ. So if you can not do anything to earn your salvation, you can do nothing to loose it. And because of your faith your life will be transformed and you will become a totally different person once saved, yet you are still not good enough to earn salvation !! so thank God for grace and the gift of salvation.

Do not confuse your good works with salvation, because they have nothing to with salvation they are a byproduct of our faith.

 

[Brighthouse]

If we believe we are still sinners after receiving Jesus,then what has Jesus fulfilled? While most true I am far from perfect,I am no longer on the unbelieving status! ( Phil 3:12-14!!) Please show me a chapter and verse where any of the disciples after receiving Jesus called themselves a sinner.( Rom 6:14) The reason there is no more condemnation for those in Christ Jesus is because of what our Jesus did!( Rom 8:1!)

Every day I am thankful!!! Because without our Jesus I would still be a fool!( Psalm 14:1) ( 1 Thess 5:18) If I still see myself as before, then where is my victory at??( 2 Cor 2:14-17) Since Jesus set me free,to me I am free indeed!( John 8:36) Some love to quote this scripture ( Rom 3:23) BUT!!!! Forget the scripture before that one!( Rom 3:21-22!!!!)

I am not talking about sinless perfection,I am talking about staying thankful everyday for what our Jesus has done,because there is no way I could ever had done it! Here is a fine example of what I am talking about.Remember Paul? ( Acts 8:1-3) I sure give no rebuke to my fine brother in the Lord,I only look for all of us to consider a needed correction. ( 2 Tim 3:16-17)

But after Paul received Jesus in Acts 9:1-19 He later gave an account to Festus and look what Paul says!! ( Acts 25:8 and again at verse 10! Paul murdered!! Yet after receiving Jesus he knew what we now know! ( Psalm 103:11-17!!) Paul did not say he was a sinner,he rather spoke upon who we are in Christ after what our Jesus did for us!

I agree with you that our good works come from the Lord!( Gal 5:22-26!!) Jesus gave us himself, he shed his own blood so that we could be free through him,if I gave you a 100 dollar bill it is yours, to do with as you choose. ( Rom 11:29) as you so well quoted! I do not see any difference in receiving gifts. Both can be received, and both can become lost.To define what grace truly is here, please look here.( Titus 2:11-12) Grace instructs! can one become uninstructed? ( 1 Tim 4:1-2) SURE! So i hope this helps you understand who I believe we are now in our Christ Jesus.This is no rebuke upon my fine brother,I am only looking for all of us to understand a needed correction to our mindset.( 2 Tim 3:16-17).

 

[Dave M]

We are all sinners and only by grace of God so we receive salvation.

The decplies did not live in sin but some still sinned even after being saved they had racism towards the samartin women at the well did they not.

Have you had a lustful thought since you have been saved then you are still as sinner. You just no longer live in sin. But we are all still sinners

You and I still deserve hell but only by Gods grace do we receive salvation. Nothing you did or I did is good enough to earn salvation,

Are you to proud to admit that you have sinned since being saved that makes you a sinner. You probably like I have had a transformation of life and no longer live in your past sinful ways as I do not, but just a lustful thought makes you a sinner, I am sure you do not live in sin any longer but you still sin only Jesus lived a sinless life.

 

[Dave M]

Please show me a chapter and verse where any of the disciples after receiving Jesus called themselves a sinner

Peter denied our Lord three times my brother, we all still sin we just do not live in sin. But that still makes us all sinners

 

[Brighthouse]

Hehe Dave, whoever said any of the disciples were believers until after Jesus rose again?? ( Matt 26:56!)

 

[Dave M]

HI Brighthouse, I really think the difference we are seeing is this.


I say we are all sinners even the born again people like you and me. Please understand I mean we are sinners because we still sin on a rare occasion. To me that makes us sinners. Please understand I know we are NOT slaves to sin any longer. We are not "in sin" like we used to be. But if you sin that makes you a sinner, how can you argue that?? even your self said you are not perfect. I know I am not. Like you my life has been transformed, but I still on a rare occasion sin. As long as we are in the flesh we are corrupt.

So even though we are so much better then what we used to be we still sin yet we do not loose our salvation because we believe and have faith in our Lord Jesus Christ who died for us. So I have no idea how you can say someone can loose there salvation by sinning since we all still sin. It sounds to me like you believe is based on something you did or some sort of works.

Romans 3:23
For all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God,

Romans 3:10
As it is written: “None is righteous, no, not one;

 

[rag4aCrown]

All tres

Jesus referred to himself in many different ways, such as “the bread of life”, “the true vine”, “the Son of
man who lays down his life.”, “the good shepherd”, and also as “ The sower” (Matt 13:37)

Jesus told his disciples that if they did not understand the parable of the sower, then they will not
understand any parable. The parable of the sower is the grand daddy of all parables!!! If we do not grasp this parables meaning then the parable of "Jesus being the vine" will be interpreted in error.

Mar 4:13 And he said to them, "Do you not understand this parable? How then will you
understand all the parables?

This parable was so important for his followers to understand that Jesus did not let them try, and
figure it out on their own, so he explains it to them clearly.

Jesus referred to the Word of God as a “seed” which must be planted into the soil. Seeds do not
produce fruit out of the soil except after a certain time elapses. Fruit is what determines if a person is
saved or not. The very first fruit the Word of God produces in a person's life is the “new birth”

1Pe 1:23 Being born again, not of corruptible seed, but of incorruptible, by the word of God, which liveth and abideth for ever.

Mat 13:18 "Hear then the parable of the sower:
Mat 13:19 When anyone hears the word of the kingdom and does not understand it, the evil one comes and snatches away what has been sown in his heart. This is what was sown along the path. (ESV)

(This first person hears the Word of God, and immediately the evil ones steals the
Word out of their heart. They never get saved, and never produce fruit unto salvation.)

Mat 13:20 As for what was sown on rocky ground, this is the one who hears the word and immediately receives it with joy,
Mat 13:21 yet he has no root in himself, but endures for a while, and when tribulation or persecution arises on account of the word, immediately he falls away. (ESV)

(This second person hears the Word, receives it with joy, but has no root in himself,
and later falls away. With out roots fruit can never be produced unto salvation. This
can be used to describe a person who abides in the vine for awhile, but never produces
fruit, so he is cut off from the vine.)

Mat 13:22 As for what was sown among thorns, this is the one who hears the word, but the cares of the world and the deceitfulness of riches choke the word, and it proves unfruitful. (ESV)

(This third person is the scariest of them all. He hears the Word of God, but the cares of
this world prevent it from producing fruit unto salvation. Church's are filled to
capacity with these kinds people. They received the Word, but never get saved, but
they think they are!!! Notice: they never fall away, but never get saved either. They are
cut off from the vine because they never produce fruit. Have ever spotted these kinds of
people in your Church? There is no joy or peace in their lives, and they look and act
just like the world!!)

Mat 13:23 As for what was sown on good soil, this is the one who hears the word and understands it. He indeed bears fruit and yields, in one case a hundredfold, in another sixty, and in another thirty." (ESV)

(The last and final kind of person is the one who hears the Word of God, understands it
and produces fruit unto salvation. He remains in the vine, and produces much fruit.
These people are easy to spot within any Church.)

These four kinds of people that Jesus is describing here are typical to those found in every Church.
There is no such a thing as a Christian bearing good fruit, and than all of a sudden producing no or bad
fruit, which is impossible!!

Mat 7:18 A good tree cannot bring forth evil fruit, neither can a corrupt tree bring forth good fruit.
Mat 7:19 Every tree that bringeth not forth good fruit is hewn down, and cast into the fire.
Mat 7:20 Wherefore by their fruits ye shall know them.

If a good tree can NEVER produce bad fruit as Jesus said, then a tree that produces bad fruit, never
did produce good fruit!!!

All trees have roots; but some roots have no depth of soil.
All trees produce fruit; perceiving good fruit (love, compassion, kindness, patience, long suffering...) perceiving bad fruit (hateful, devious, conniving, gossips, backbiters, envious, vindictive)..., these characters tell us what spirit is consuming the heart. What is in the heart comes out the mouth.
Does God not use both to teach the other?
Good or bad.....both are still fruit.
Both have rewards; though a goat's reward, most certainly, will not be as pleasant as a sheep's reward.
Both are saved; Jesus did not die in vain. Both are saved; either to eternal everlasting life or eternal everlasting salvation, where the worm never quits eating and the fire is never quenched.

We still have time to choose...
Our choice.
Perhaps, having a humble, unselfish heart has something to do with it.

All praise glory and honor be unto God Amen

 

[rag4aCrown]

HI Brighthouse, I really think the difference we are seeing is this.


I say we are all sinners even the born again people like you and me. Please understand I mean we are sinners because we still sin on a rare occasion. To me that makes us sinners. Please understand I know we are NOT slaves to sin any longer. We are not "in sin" like we used to be. But if you sin that makes you a sinner, how can you argue that?? even your self said you are not perfect. I know I am not. Like you my life has been transformed, but I still on a rare occasion sin. As long as we are in the flesh we are corrupt.

So even though we are so much better then what we used to be we still sin yet we do not loose our salvation because we believe and have faith in our Lord Jesus Christ who died for us. So I have no idea how you can say someone can loose there salvation by sinning since we all still sin. It sounds to me like you believe is based on something you did or some sort of works.

Romans 3:23
For all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God,

Romans 3:10
As it is written: “None is righteous, no, not one;

Rare occasions we sin....? Man if we are walking and talking we are sinning. If accused...don't fight back, take it with a humble heart and say nothing (if you heard nothing). God gives us what we ought to say.
Have you gossiped lately or perhaps a backbiter?
Jesus is perfect and we are perfect in Him, not self. Push to be Christ like; the closer we get to Him, the closer we are to forsaking all and picking up our cross and following Him. Amen

 

[rag4aCrown]

Can a saved person ever become unsaved?

Who is able to pluck me out of his hand?

 

[Br. Bear]

Greetings,

Excuse me please for quoting myself :

Greetings,

May I put forth something for consideration?

Did Adam and Eve believe?
There can be no doubt that they knew better than anyone else at the time that God is real. No question about it.

BUT, they did they believe God or did they believe a liar?

Bless you ....><>

Hath not GOD surely said,

Whoever believes in Him is not condemned, but whoever does not believe is already condemned, because he has not believed in the name of God's one and only Son. John 3:18

John 3:36
Whoever believes in the Son has eternal life. Whoever rejects the Son will not see life. Instead, the wrath of God remains on him."

He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved; but he that believeth not shall be damned. Mark 16:16

Acts 16:31
They replied, "Believe in the Lord Jesus and you will be saved, you and your household."

 

[KingJ]

Hello Brighthouse First let me say that I love Christ with all my heart and soul, as I can see you do also, so it is a pleasure to converse with you. Most important of all, we Love and believe in Jesus, I seek only the truth, as you do I can clearly see, so I offer what I think, I do keep a open mind that I could be wrong. The first thing you ask about is the devil having control, the way I see it is the devil only has control because God allows it, and God already knows what the devils going to do before the devil knows, you may ask how (he is God) well the best way I can explain that in human terms is God lives outside of time, and can see the future past and present. (this is just my thoughts, but helps me understand predestination)

Then what about the Devil tempting Jesus in the desert and offering him the Earths kingdoms you ask. Well first He is the Devil and God gave him those Kingdoms, first thoughts that I think is that he is the devil he could be lying . But Why did Jesus go out to the desert and get tempted for 40 days?? I believe it was for us !! he is God and can not be tempted, he went out there for our sake so we could learn from his example, is what I believe, I believe he knew what was going to happen before it happened with the devil. Jesus whole life was for us to learn from.

For the record I am not a Calvinist I believe we have free will to choose and believe. I just believe God already knows what we are going to do before we do it, he is outside of time, time does not effect God like us he moves in and out of it, is the best I can understand it.

God Bless you Brighthouse

I agree completely with you.

The problem we all have is properly grasping God with a human mind.

Calvinists read scripture on God being omniscient (whole of Rom 9 ''I will have mercy on whom I will have mercy) and conclude there is no free will. When the rest of scripture speaks of how good God is. No darkness in God at all 1 John 1:5. Paul says give thanks because God is good Psalm 136:1. So the truth is that there is free will because our God is as good as He is great.

God is able to know all and still give true free will at the same time. Grasping this pops most peanuts.

 

[KingJ]

I believe these two scripture shed a lot more light on OSAS too:

1 Pet 4:18 And if the righteous scarcely be saved, where shall the ungodly and the sinner appear?

Mark 10:18 And Jesus said unto him, Why callest thou me good? there is none good but one, that is, God.

We have to understand that there is a cut off line. Only God can know this. God draws a line that separates all mankind.

There is no '''keeping yourself saved'' just as there is no ''getting yourself saved''. These concepts cause us to miss the boat. Which is a terribly painful reality. Namely: Do you truly hate or love what is evil? Rom 12:9.

If you love what is evil, you will not repent. If you hate what is evil, you will always repent.

Now, when you get saved you sink to a depth of intent. Without sinking to a sufficient satisfying to God depth, the Holy Spirit will not reveal Jesus to you. You will not be saved from death. If you continue to be unable to decide to properly hate what is evil, you will go to your eternal home with others like you. Nobody who goes to hell will ever be saved because they would never ever want to sincerely repent. There will be nobody in hell that has more hate for what is evil then love for it.

There is a terrible assumption going around that God helps us with being righteous. No He does not. We make the decision to hate what is evil. God then saves us from death (a life without Him).

If you believe that a person can lose their salvation well then you have to believe God is evil in that He keeps you around for longer then the sinner next to Jesus on the cross.

I like Mark 10:18 because it makes me think about how not even the angels in heaven are perfect. Nobody that goes to heaven is ....perfect.

 

[KingJ]

Hi Waggles, sorry for late reply, been so busy .

But it is a contract - a covenant - between two parties.
One party, God, is true and faithful and will always desire for our succeeding and coming to perfection. Completing the race.
BUT, the other party, us, can be fickle and start off with good intentions but for many many reasons pertinent to each person's
circumstances calls it quits. Walks away from their side of the contract - commitment.

You cannot look at it like this. God only gives His stamp of approval on a contract that He has faith in. He was prepared to let the Egyptians worshiping the golden calf die instant deaths, yet those in Nineveh He spared after they fasted for a month, why?

Scripture is crystal clear on what provokes God's wrath. It is our sin being full measure. God fully grasped the depth of evil intent those Egyptians sank to with the golden calf.

Once saved always saved makes the fatal flaw that there are some that are truly saved as opposed to others who are just saved, or are not really saved because they end up "not making it."

I don't see that at all. Just saved and unsaved. Those that can call / actually believe Jesus is Lord truthfully and those that can't / don't. 1 Cor 12:3 is crystal clear on that.

FALSE: you are saved when you believe and submit to the gospel [here is another bone of contention; which gospel?]
Anyway let's put that one aside for a moment.
When a believer takes on the gospel and obeys the fundamental commands to repent and be baptised in water and the Holy Spirit
then they are to all intents and purposes they are saved. One is either in the Kingdom of God or one is not.

I like how Paul explains this. He says let each be fully convinced in their minds on what they believe. Because this is not the real issue of our faith. 1 Cor 11:31 is, ''If we were more discerning with ourselves we would not be judged''. If something urks one person it may not urk another (our constant debates here for example). Yet we all have those things from working human minds that should urk us all. God knows this. So there is no '''I believe differently'' excuses that are going to pass with God. On the issues that matter, only a working brain is needed. Church on Saturday or Sunday vs rape and torture.....apples and oranges.

People do call it quits. Believers stop believing. Righteousness can be replaced by sinfulness. Christians do fall away.
There are backsliders. And some of these were as Christian as the next person who endures.

Christians fall but do not ''fall''.

1. Consider marriage. The decision to propose to your wife takes a mutual depth of intent and love for one another. Can you just 'divorce' if she starts being handful? If you did, all would argue if you genuinely loved her int he first place. Now this is where God does not make a mistake.

2. Consider a bully who makes your high school a living hell. Then in the army, he takes a bullet for you. Would you hold the past against him? How much future annoyance from him would you tolerate?

3. The sinner next to Jesus on the cross. Saved with no time to fall away. Why does God keep us on earth knowing we run the risk of losing our salvation? Is God evil?

That is why both in the gospels and in the epistles there are so many dire warnings in respect to keeping the faith, and in
overcoming by the power of the Holy Spirit. Staying true to one's calling. Not looking back. Not retreating unto perdition.

These are warnings to the congregation. To the body of people that attend church. To all of humanity. Ensuring that we know that we are saved. Testing ourselves to ensure we are in the faith.

A lot of confusion comes in with mixing the NT with the OT. Jews were not saved as we today are / can be. Jews were able to look back and be turned into a pillar of salt.

Many of the verses cited in respect to God's promises and faithfulness are expressions of God's nature and consistency.
But they are not insurance clauses for the unfaithful and quitters.

17 For the time is come that judgment must begin at the house of God: and if it first begin at us,
what shall the end be of them that obey not the gospel of God?
18 And if the righteous scarcely be saved, where shall the ungodly and the sinner appear?
19 Wherefore let them that suffer according to the will of God commit the keeping of their souls to him in well doing,
as unto a faithful Creator.
1Peter 4:17-19

Why do we obey the gospel of God? We obey it because we approve of it. Because we approve of it we love God. Genuine love is to hate what is evil Rom 12:9.
God will judge those in church who obey hypocritically.

These verses, as are the many others non OSAS would quote have there place. I am not in anyway trying to lesson them. We should all harshly judge ourselves and work out our salvation in fear and trembling. Everyone of us can think we are saved and not be saved.

 

[Br. Bear]

Greetings,

May I suggest correction on this point?

There is a terrible assumption going around that God helps us with being righteous. No He does not. We make the decision to hate what is evil. God then saves us from death (a life without Him).

Fact is actually that God does help us but we still need to choose.
Do you recall the LORD saying He puts before us life and death? He then drops a big hint (helps us make a decision) and says, Choose life!

All day every day we have one choice, and at every moment the LORD through the Holy Ghost says to us, Choose Life! We still have to choose but remember that our Lord Jesus Christ told us that He would send a Helper, that He would never leave us nor forsake us, even the spirit of Truth. Let us be persuaded by Him and believe in Him for He is the Way the Truth and the Life.
Do NOT listen to that old serpent, the liar.

The LORD is my Helper.
We have assurance, blessed assurance that He will deliver us from evil and that He can and He even gives us a clue what choice to make.

Believe dear reader ... He is our Salvation.

Bless you ....><>

 

[KingJ]

Greetings,

May I suggest correction on this point?



Fact is actually that God does help us but we still need to choose.
Do you recall the LORD saying He puts before us life and death? He then drops a big hint (helps us make a decision) and says, Choose life!

All day every day we have one choice, and at every moment the LORD through the Holy Ghost says to us, Choose Life! We still have to choose but remember that our Lord Jesus Christ told us that He would send a Helper, that He would never leave us nor forsake us, even the spirit of Truth. Let us be persuaded by Him and believe in Him for He is the Way the Truth and the Life.
Do NOT listen to that old serpent, the liar.

The LORD is my Helper.
We have assurance, blessed assurance that He will deliver us from evil and that He can and He even gives us a clue what choice to make.

Believe dear reader ... He is our Salvation.

Bless you ....><>

I completely agree. Perhaps I should have better explained what I meant.

My statement is loosely based off Psalm 37:29 The righteous shall inherit the land, and dwell therein for ever.

We are righteous when we choose to repent and hate what is evil at a significant depth of intent. When we decide to accept Jesus and make a stand for Him. Just as David was righteous when he repented sincerely of his grievous sins. As Nineveh was when they fasted for a month.

Our righteousness however does not qualify us for heaven. But without it we would not want salvation.

 

[Dave M]

My understanding and let me know what you think is we are only righteous through Jesus Christ in him,