Where do we go when we die?

[Brother-Paul]

It is in scripture, but everyone has their own interpretation..we'll all know for sure soon!

This is exactly the reason for this discussion, to share our thoughts from the scriptures, be open to the spirit, keep an open mind.

Every day is a school day, I believe I will learn something new every day, providing I am conscious, right up to my last breath. For that to happen I have to keep an open mind on all thing.

To God be the Glory


Shalom

 

[Bob Carabbio]

Where do we go one we die?

Paul says (for the Christian) "Absent from the Body = Present with the Lord" (2 cor 5:8).

Good enough for me.

 

[PloughBoy]

I see, y'all like , "home grown" Yana.

English Standard Version
And he said to him, “Truly, I say to you today,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,, you will ,be .....with me in paradise.” [and it will not be today] For the hard in hearing.


"And someone said this:
"He had a glorified body.
He was able to show his crucifixion wounds to his doubting [unconverted] disciples, John 20. But he was not flesh and blood when he ascended at the conclusion of his 40 days on earth."


"Jesus did not have a "Glorified Body" when HE got up out of the Gravel and walked on the earth for 40, He Had a "Resurrected" Body pumping Blood!


He got HIS "Glorified BODY" when HE got to "GLORY" To get your "Glorified BODY" you must pass beyond "BELUAH LAND" and on to "THE CELESTIAL CITY"

Sometimes, we let anybody just say anything unquestioned. Got Jesus, walking around and then no flesh and blood when he ascended at the conclusion of his 40 days on earth.

English Standard Version
For you will not abandon my soul to Hades, or let your Holy One see corruption.
Luke 24:44
Jesus said to them, "These are the words I spoke to you while I was still with you: Everything must be fulfilled that is written about Me in the Law of Moses, the Prophets, and the Psalms."

And when I speak, everybody , want to "crucify" me! People be clapping, grinning, jumping up and down and waving their arms.

====================================================================
Then another, I been warning about, having "SHEEP Clothes" on. He just now, come right out in the Open and And made an "indicative" statement. In BOLD TERMS

Spreading his leaves and branches ..............."Like A "Green Bay" Tree.

POST # 119

"The Bible is just as useless for proving the existence of an afterlife as the Koran is
useless for proving the existence of Allah, and/or Hindu literature for proving the
existence of Lord Vishnu.

The Bible is just as useless for proving the existence of an afterlife as the Koran is
useless for proving the existence of Allah, and/or Hindu literature for proving the
existence of Lord Vishnu.

You see, those holy books contain proprietary information rather than verified facts.
In other words: those books are useful for instructing people who believe in them
but nigh unto useless for instructing people who don't.

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Only one, really spoke up, kindly they did. But let me say this, a "WOLF" ain't no joke!.................... You ain't playing with a "GOAT"

You might pat a "goat", You put your hands on that "WOLF's" head, especially if he is old wolf. He knowns, he better stay away from me! I will never forget, "Little RED RIDING HOOD", My Uncle taught me how to use an "AXE"!

You see, must of you "Play Church"! Setting down with wolves and having Tea, and have "Ice Cream Socials" Asking them to come back and we are going to have a nice time. YOU might "Baptize" him too! "Went in a dry one, came out a wet one".

And he is not hunting "Goats" He is hunting "Lambs and Sheep"!

And Now "Where do we go when we die"?

 

[Born Again 2004]

I see, y'all like , "home grown" Yana.

English Standard Version
And he said to him, “Truly, I say to you today,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,, you will ,be .....with me in paradise.” [and it will not be today] For the hard in hearing.


"And someone said this:
"He had a glorified body.
He was able to show his crucifixion wounds to his doubting [unconverted] disciples, John 20. But he was not flesh and blood when he ascended at the conclusion of his 40 days on earth."


"Jesus did not have a "Glorified Body" when HE got up out of the Gravel and walked on the earth for 40, He Had a "Resurrected" Body pumping Blood!


He got HIS "Glorified BODY" when HE got to "GLORY" To get your "Glorified BODY" you must pass beyond "BELUAH LAND" and on to "THE CELESTIAL CITY"

Sometimes, we let anybody just say anything unquestioned. Got Jesus, walking around and then no flesh and blood when he ascended at the conclusion of his 40 days on earth.

English Standard Version
For you will not abandon my soul to Hades, or let your Holy One see corruption.
Luke 24:44
Jesus said to them, "These are the words I spoke to you while I was still with you: Everything must be fulfilled that is written about Me in the Law of Moses, the Prophets, and the Psalms."

And when I speak, everybody , want to "crucify" me! People be clapping, grinning, jumping up and down and waving their arms.

====================================================================
Then another, I been warning about, having "SHEEP Clothes" on. He just now, come right out in the Open and And made an "indicative" statement. In BOLD TERMS

Spreading his leaves and branches ..............."Like A "Green Bay" Tree.

POST # 119

"The Bible is just as useless for proving the existence of an afterlife as the Koran is
useless for proving the existence of Allah, and/or Hindu literature for proving the
existence of Lord Vishnu.

The Bible is just as useless for proving the existence of an afterlife as the Koran is
useless for proving the existence of Allah, and/or Hindu literature for proving the
existence of Lord Vishnu.

You see, those holy books contain proprietary information rather than verified facts.
In other words: those books are useful for instructing people who believe in them
but nigh unto useless for instructing people who don't.

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Only one, really spoke up, kindly they did. But let me say this, a "WOLF" ain't no joke!.................... You ain't playing with a "GOAT"

You might pat a "goat", You put your hands on that "WOLF's" head, especially if he is old wolf. He knowns, he better stay away from me! I will never forget, "Little RED RIDING HOOD", My Uncle taught me how to use an "AXE"!

You see, must of you "Play Church"! Setting down with wolves and having Tea, and have "Ice Cream Socials" Asking them to come back and we are going to have a nice time. YOU might "Baptize" him too! "Went in a dry one, came out a wet one".

And he is not hunting "Goats" He is hunting "Lambs and Sheep"!

And Now "Where do we go when we die"?

You got something in you eye?

 

[PloughBoy]

You got something in you eye?

I got something else in my eye too! So far i have heard many act and say "That Jesus IS The Christ" And they Claim they "Believe: in The "Trinty" and they say That "JESUS CHRIST" is THE SON of GOD who HAVE Come down from Heaven and Walked among us! 100% PERCENT GOD and 100 PERCENT man.
This same JESUS That turn Water into WINE, The Same JESUS that "Created" The UNIVERSE, The STARS, The Heavens, The ANGELS and every other thing that has been "CREATED" Both "VISIBLE and The INVISIBLE" AND RISE HIS OWN BODY from The GRAVE!

A lot around here are asking and proclaiming, HE can walk through "WALLS" and others when can HE do it? He can do anything HE want! But Lie and Deny HIS self!

He can walk, appear, come, DISAPPEAR, stand still, HE can do anything He want. right from where HE is AT. Where was HE at, when HE Created the UNIVERSE Just before He was standing in "ETERNITY" where was HIS "ABODE"?

You smart, speak up! The Bible says: Everything that has been "Created" JESUS did it. Because HIS FATHER TOLD HIM to do it! ETERNITY is a PLACE!

"He can walk through "DOORS" walls" GALAXIES, SOLAR SYSTEMS, too. He can ride, walk, run, appear. Or Just Be, and still put The SUN in HIS pocket. If HE wanted to.

(2 TIM. 2)BSB
"Remind the believers of these things, charging them before God to avoid quarreling over words, which succeeds only in leading the listeners to ruin. Make every effort to present yourself approved to God, an unashamed workman who accurately handles the word of truth. But avoid irreverent, empty chatter, which will only lead to more ungodliness,…"

Keep talking about walking through walls, And the BIBLE is a useless BOOK! ain't no better than any other holy book! And making faces at me because I am in defense.

I know many of you think the words i speak ain't nothing but a yard full wasted junk, But one thing for sure, we all are going to be JUDGE! Whether it is our words or HIS. No ONE, will escape. JUDGMENT DAY! And on that DAY "JESUS" is GOING TO BE JUDGE" and He ain't going to be smiling

 

[Butch5]

I wanted to look at Hades a little more. It's my contention that Hades is the grave, and not a place under the earth for departed souls. Having said that here are a few passages that I think pretty much make that case. The first one is the parable of Lazarus and the Rich Man.

22 'And it came to pass, that the poor man died, and that he was carried away by the messengers to the bosom of Abraham -- and the rich man also died, and was buried;
23 and in the hades having lifted up his eyes, being in torments, he doth see Abraham afar off, and Lazarus in his bosom,
(Lk. 16:22-23 YLT)

In this passage we notice a few things. One is that when Lazarus died, he was taken to Abraham's bosom. It doesn't say he went to Hades. However, the Rich Man is said to have been buried and in Hades. Look at Jesus' words, "the rich man also died and was buried; and being in Hades". Jesus equates being buried with being in Hades. They are the same thing. The Rich Man was buried and being in Hades, it's the same place. So according to this Hades and the grave are one and the same.


28 And Moses said, Hereby shall ye know that the Lord has sent me to perform all these works, that I have not done them of myself.
29 If these men shall die according to the death of all men, if also their visitation shall be according to the visitation of all men, then the Lord has not sent me.
30 But if the Lord shall shew by a <1> wonder, and the earth shall open her mouth and swallow them up, and their houses, and their tents, and all that belongs to them, and they shall go down alive into Hades, then ye shall know that these men have provoked the Lord.
31 And when he ceased speaking all these words, the ground clave asunder beneath them.
32 And the ground opened, and swallowed them up, and their houses, and all the men that were with Core, and their cattle.
33 And they went down and all that they had, alive into Hades; and the ground covered them, and they perished from the midst of the congregation. (Num. 16:28-33 LXE)

Here Moses brings the congregation before the Lord. We see here that they and all they had went down alive into Hades. Is Moses saying that tents, cooking instruments, eating utensils, cattle, sheep, etc. all go to a place for departed souls somewhere in the earth? Or, is this saying they were buried alive and thus in their graves. Again, they were alive, they were not departed souls. They were living flesh beings. Do living flesh beings go to a place in the earth for departed souls? Or, do they go to the grave?

I will exalt thee, O Lord; for thou hast lifted me up, and not caused mine enemies to rejoice over me.
2 O Lord my God, I cried to thee, and thou didst heal me.
3 O Lord, thou hast brought up my soul from Hades, thou hast delivered me from among them that go down to the pit. (Ps. 30:1-3 LXE)

Here David is close to death. Would David have gone to Hades a place in the earth for departed souls? Or, is this saying he was saved from the grave?

But God shall deliver my soul from the power of Hades, when he shall receive me. Pause. (Ps. 49:15 LXE)

God shall deliver David's soul from the power of Hades. David was a man after God's own heart. Was he in danger of going to a place of torment for departed souls somewhere in the earth? Or, is David saying that God shall deliver him from the power of the grave when He receives him? Remember what Paul about the Resurrection (when God will receive David).

54 So when this corruptible shall have put on incorruption, and this mortal shall have put on immortality, then shall be brought to pass the saying that is written, Death is swallowed up in victory.
55 O death, where is thy sting? O grave, where is thy victory? (1 Cor. 15:54-55 KJV)

Or, 'O Hades, where is thy victory?


13 But thou, O man like minded, my guide, and my acquaintance,
14 who in companionship with me sweetened our food: we walked in the house of God in concord.
15 Let death come upon them, and let them go down alive into Hades, for iniquity is in their dwellings, in the midst of them. (Ps. 55:13-15 LXE)

Again, we have people going alive down into Hades. Are we to believe that living people can go into Hades? How does a living person travel through solid rock and earth? This isn't speaking of departed souls.

14 For the Lord will not cast off his people, neither will he forsake his inheritance;
15 until righteousness return to judgment, and all the upright in heart shall follow it. Pause.
16 Who will rise up for me against the transgressors? or who will stand up with me against the workers of iniquity?
17 If the Lord had not helped me, my soul had almost sojourned in Hades. (Ps. 94:14-17 LXE)

Here David says if the Lord had not helped him his soul had almost sojourned in Hades. Is he saying that if the Lord had not helped him his soul would have been in a place of torment somewhere in the earth? Or, his he saying if the lord hadn't helped him his soul had almost been in the grave?



I perish, carried away by the wind, and I seek for burial, and obtain it not.
2 Weary I intreat; and what have I done? and strangers have stolen my goods.
3 Who is this? let him <1> join hands with me.
4 For thou hast hid their heart from wisdom; therefore thou shalt not exalt them.
5 He shall promise mischief to his companions: but their eyes have failed for their children.
6 But thou has made me a byword amount the nations, and I am become a scorn to them.
7 For my eyes are dimmed through pain; I have been grievously beset by all.
8 Wonder has seized true men upon this; and let the just rise up against the transgressor.
9 But let the faithful hold on his own way, and let him that is pure of hands take courage.
10 Howbeit, do ye all strengthen yourselves and come now, for I do not find truth in you.
11 My days have passed in groaning, and my heart-strings are broken.
12 I have turned the night into day: the light is short because of darkness.
13 For if I remain, Hades is my habitation: and my bed has been made in darkness.
14 I have called upon death to be my father, and corruption to be my mother and sister.
15 Where then is yet my hope? or where shall I see my good?
16 Will they go down with me to Hades, or shall we go down together to the tomb? (Job 17:1-16 LXE)
13 For if I remain, Hades is my habitation: and my bed has been made in darkness.
14 I have called upon death to be my father, and corruption to be my mother and sister.
15 Where then is yet my hope? or where shall I see my good?
16 Will they go down with me to Hades, or shall we go down together to the tomb? (Job 17:13-16 LXE)

Here Job equates Hades with the tomb.

9 O Israel, who will aid thee in thy destruction?
10 Where is this thy king? let him even save thee in all thy cities: let him judge thee, of whom thou saidst, Give me a king and a prince.
11 And I gave thee a king in mine anger, and kept him back in my wrath.
12 Ephraim has framed a <1> conspiracy of unrighteousness, his sin is hidden.
13 Pains as of a woman in travail shall come upon him: he is thy wise son, because he shall not stay in the destruction of thy children.
14 I will deliver them out of the power of Hades, and will redeem them from death: where is thy <1> penalty, O death? <2> O Hades, where is thy sting? comfort is hidden from mine eyes. (Hos. 13:9-14 LXE)

Again, is God going to save his people from a subterranean place of torment for departed souls? Or is He going to save them from the grave? The KJV and the NKJV translate this passage as 'O grave, where is thy sting?'

And they are laid with the giants that fell of old, who went down to Hades with their weapons of war: and they laid their swords under their heads, but their iniquities were upon their bones, because they terrified all men during their life. (Ezek. 32:27 LXE)

Here again, we have people who went down to Hades with their weapons of war. Do we believe that departed souls take swords, shields, and armor, to a place of torment for departed souls? Are there wars in Hades?

These are a few passages that I found quickly that I believe show pretty clearly that Hades is the grave. Now, there are passages about Hades that one could read as a place of torment if one already believes that. But, those same passages could be understood as the grave also. To get a definitive answer what we need are passages that can only be interpreted one way. A passage that can be understood either way doesn't prove either way. However, a passage that can only be understood one way will go a long way to telling us what the word really means. I believe these passages do just that.

 

[Butch5]

@Hekuran

Genesis 2:7 (NKJV): 7 And the Lord God formed man of the dust of the ground, and breathed into his nostrils the breath of life; and man became a living being.

Genesis 2:7 (KJV 1900): 7 And the Lord God formed man of the dust of the ground, and breathed into his nostrils the breath of life; and man became a living soul.

The Bible doesn't say they have souls, it says they "became" souls.

Genesis 2:7 points out the man, the body of flesh, is what became a living soul when God breathed in his nostrils the breath of life.

Soul, nephish refers to throat not nostril, though they are attached, so I read as, God breathed into the nostrils, via the throat, the nephew, into the newly created body, and it, the flesh body, 'became' a Iiving soul.

Therefore the body is the soul, when the breath of life was added it became a living soul.

Would you agree?

Hi Brother Paul,

I would say the two together are a soul, the body and the breath of life. As I see it, the body wasn't called a soul until after the Breath of life was put into it.

 

[Born Again 2004]

I got something else in my eye too! So far i have heard many act and say "That Jesus IS The Christ" And they Claim they "Believe: in The "Trinty" and they say That "JESUS CHRIST" is THE SON of GOD who HAVE Come down from Heaven and Walked among us! 100% PERCENT GOD and 100 PERCENT man.
This same JESUS That turn Water into WINE, The Same JESUS that "Created" The UNIVERSE, The STARS, The Heavens, The ANGELS and every other thing that has been "CREATED" Both "VISIBLE and The INVISIBLE" AND RISE HIS OWN BODY from The GRAVE!

A lot around here are asking and proclaiming, HE can walk through "WALLS" and others when can HE do it? He can do anything HE want! But Lie and Deny HIS self!

He can walk, appear, come, DISAPPEAR, stand still, HE can do anything He want. right from where HE is AT. Where was HE at, when HE Created the UNIVERSE Just before He was standing in "ETERNITY" where was HIS "ABODE"?

You smart, speak up! The Bible says: Everything that has been "Created" JESUS did it. Because HIS FATHER TOLD HIM to do it! ETERNITY is a PLACE!

"He can walk through "DOORS" walls" GALAXIES, SOLAR SYSTEMS, too. He can ride, walk, run, appear. Or Just Be, and still put The SUN in HIS pocket. If HE wanted to.

(2 TIM. 2)BSB
"Remind the believers of these things, charging them before God to avoid quarreling over words, which succeeds only in leading the listeners to ruin. Make every effort to present yourself approved to God, an unashamed workman who accurately handles the word of truth. But avoid irreverent, empty chatter, which will only lead to more ungodliness,…"

Keep talking about walking through walls, And the BIBLE is a useless BOOK! ain't no better than any other holy book! And making faces at me because I am in defense.

I know many of you think the words i speak ain't nothing but a yard full wasted junk, But one thing for sure, we all are going to be JUDGE! Whether it is our words or HIS. No ONE, will escape. JUDGMENT DAY! And on that DAY "JESUS" is GOING TO BE JUDGE" and He ain't going to be smiling

 

[Butch5]

Paul says (for the Christian) "Absent from the Body = Present with the Lord" (2 cor 5:8).

Good enough for me.

Actually, that's not what the passage says. Paul is expressing a desire, not stating an equivalence.

We are confident, I say, and willing rather to be absent from the body, and to be present with the Lord.
(2 Cor. 5:8 KJV)

The context of this passage is the Resurrection.

 

[BunnyOnion]

It is in scripture, but everyone has their own interpretation..we'll all know for sure soon!

It is in scripture. Sadly, many interpretations are in error.
One example being there is a sect, likely more than one, that teach Jesus was mortal. He only became divine when he was baptized.
And after he resurrected and 40 days later went to heaven, he was then also mortal flesh and bone.

We'll know all once we're before God one day.
Sadly, false doctrine teachers shall regret that. To no avail.

 

[PloughBoy]

Actually, that's not what the passage says. Paul is expressing a desire, not stating an equivalence.

We are confident, I say, and willing rather to be absent from the body, and to be present with the Lord.
(2 Cor. 5:8 KJV)

The context of this passage is the Resurrection.

Will some of you please make up your minds, are you not in "The Body of Christ" NOW? Now think hard. Either you in or you are out! Is GOD in you NOW or HE ain't ?

 

[Born Again 2004]

Will some of you please make up your minds, are you not in "The Body of Christ" NOW? Now think hard. Either you in or you are out! Is GOD in you NOW or HE ain't ?

Your Born Again or you are not!

 

[PloughBoy]

It is in scripture. Sadly, many interpretations are in error.
One example being there is a sect, likely more than one, that teach Jesus was mortal. He only became divine when he was baptized.
And after he resurrected and 40 days later went to heaven, he was then also mortal flesh and bone.

We'll know all once we're before God one day.
Sadly, false doctrine teachers shall regret that. To no avail.

Well thank GOD, We have a "Greek and Hebrew" Scholar. a "Codex Alexandrinus" A "Codex Sinaiticus, Codex Vaticanus text. Or is your field and favorable "The Textus Receptus' it gets real then, no words of "Femininity" and not like translations that does not offend the female gender.

 

[PloughBoy]

Your Born Again or you are not!

Tell me why would a person even read his BIBLE for over 44 years and waste their time to even think about any kind of god! Or who would even think to hang around and talked to such a "Depraved" host of people who would call on the Name "of Jesus"? That is a question.

I just gave you my answer.

 

[Born Again 2004]

Well thank GOD, We have a "Greek and Hebrew" Scholar. a "Codex Alexandrinus" A "Codex Sinaiticus, Codex Vaticanus text. Or is your field and favorable "The Textus Receptus' it gets real then, no words of "Femininity" and not like translations that does not offend the female gender.

Huh? Your not right!

 

[PloughBoy]

Huh? Your not right!

Really It seems you still have "milk on your Breath", I can smell it from here,

 

[Butch5]

Will some of you please make up your minds, are you not in "The Body of Christ" NOW? Now think hard. Either you in or you are out! Is GOD in you NOW or HE ain't ?

No sure what you mean here.

 

[Born Again 2004]

Really It seems you still have "milk on your Breath", I can smell it from here,

Your arrogance and pride will be your undoing!

 

[Bob Carabbio]

Actually, that's not what the passage says.

Chuckle!!!! That's what it says to me. You can follow your own rabbit trail if you please.

 

[BunnyOnion]

Paradise is not heaven, totally agree.

Paradise is the waiting place for saved souls, Jesus said to the thief who asked to be remembered by him, today you will be with me in Paradise, so this thief, accepting Jesus in that way, was saved.

The thief indicated he knew who Jesus was when he rebuffed the taunting of the other thief hanging on his own cross.
We don't know if this meant he heard Jesus preach prior to arrest. But we do know his profession of faith in Jesus from his place on that cross beside him told Jesus of his faith in him. And Jesus promised him what Jesus preached prior to his own arrest.

But, Jesus did not say he would see the thief on Paradise, today and tomorrow, no, no, only that day. Jesus would not see him in paradise every day for several reasons. He would not be staying there. He would be seen ten times and then he would ascend to the Father.

Yes, I know. And I never stayed nor implied anything like what you state there.

Paradise is a waiting place for saved souls, but it is not soul sleep we will be conscious.

Shalom

While we don't know if we'll be conscious, we do know what the scriptures tell us.

Ecclesiastes 3:20 All go to one place. All are from the dust, and to dust all return.


Daniel 12:2 And many of those who sleep in the dust of the earth shall awake, some to everlasting life, and some to shame and everlasting contempt.


Psalm 115:17 The dead do not praise the Lord, nor do any who go down into silence.

John 5:28-29 Do not marvel at this, for an hour is coming when all who are in the tombs will hear his voice and come out, those who have done good to the resurrection of life, and those who have done evil to the resurrection of judgment.