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When the Disciples Were Saved By Faith in Jesus Christ?

Discussion in 'Bible Chat' started by JesusIs4Me, Dec 4, 2017.

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  1. It really is just semantics.
    If your conversion was real, and you don't return to the ways of unbelief, sin, you are walking as a saved man.
    It is just that there is a judgement coming up wherein all men will be shown exactly what they really are...lovers of, or haters of God.
    I won't say I am "saved" till after that day.
    There is plenty of work to do before I breathe my last, so must "endure till the end" to warrant that promised eternal life with God.
     
  2. Well Paul says dont forbid to speak in tongues.

    Dont quench the spirit. We know we are saved, if you have doubts or never had an encounter with God then we wouldnt even be having this conversation.

    The thing is we can ask God for anything in Jesus name. Just because it is an unknown tongue to YOU does not mean it is not from God. How many languages do you speak...just the one? HOw many does God know? All of them!
     
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  3. The baptism of the Holy Spirit and baptism in water, in Jesus' name for the remission of past sins, are different events.
     
  4. When I was baptised in the holy spirit God gave me utterance. So praise the Lord for that. It is just magnifying the Lord, nothing to be afraid of. It is not me faking it its of God, nobody told me to do it, didnt even really know what it was at first.

    It is not if myself, it is magnifying the Lord.
     
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  5. If you already saved then dont worry about it, magnify the Lord im your own tongue, but dont be surprised when other believers speak in other languages you do not know, if you dont understand what they are saying, ask for interpretation.


    Its no big deal!
     
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  6. Acts 2:38 does the job..."Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost."
    Perhaps you can furnish the verse that says "unbelief" is a sin?
    Unbelievers will be judged for every other sin they have ever done, on the day of judgement, so unbelief will matter little.

    Grieving the Spirit...committing sin, is a manifestation of unbelief. It is the act of an unrepentant poser.

    Your misinterpretation of that verse is at odds with the one before it..."if we deny him, he also will deny us:"
    Your "former believers" have manifested that they never believed in the first place...by their sin.

    Just as I have written, the power of God is illustrated by the actions of an assumed believer.
    Of course the opposite is also true...the power of the devil is illustrated by the acts of an unbeliever.
    That action would be...sinning.


    Amen to that!

    Salvation won't be assured till after the final judgement.
    That doesn't keep me from presenting the gospel to anyone else looking for the freedom Christ Jesus has enabled us to exercised on earth.

    If you endure till the end, in your fight against temptation and sin, your salvation will be evidenced by your judgement at the end of time.
    Please stay on your toes against the wiles of the deceiver.
     
  7. There is eternal salvation, and then there is salvation from what is coming on the earth for why a saved believer is to be enduring as His disciples which is done by faith in Jesus Christ; not religiously by your merit, nor willpower.

    Paul spoke of that enduring to be saved from what is coming on the earth in 2 Peter 3rd chapter.

    2 Peter 3:3 Knowing this first, that there shall come in the last days scoffers, walking after their own lusts,4 And saying, Where is the promise of his coming? for since the fathers fell asleep, all things continue as they were from the beginning of the creation. 5 For this they willingly are ignorant of, that by the word of God the heavens were of old, and the earth standing out of the water and in the water: 6 Whereby the world that then was, being overflowed with water, perished:7 But the heavens and the earth, which are now, by the same word are kept in store, reserved unto fire against the day of judgment and perdition of ungodly men.8 But, beloved, be not ignorant of this one thing, that one day is with the Lord as a thousand years, and a thousand years as one day. 9 The Lord is not slack concerning his promise, as some men count slackness; but is longsuffering to us-ward, not willing that any should perish, but that all should come to repentance.10 But the day of the Lord will come as a thief in the night; in the which the heavens shall pass away with a great noise, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat, the earth also and the works that are therein shall be burned up.11 Seeing then that all these things shall be dissolved, what manner of persons ought ye to be in all holy conversation and godliness, 12 Looking for and hasting unto the coming of the day of God, wherein the heavens being on fire shall be dissolved, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat?13 Nevertheless we, according to his promise, look for new heavens and a new earth, wherein dwelleth righteousness.14 Wherefore, beloved, seeing that ye look for such things, be diligent that ye may be found of him in peace, without spot, and blameless. 15 And account that the longsuffering of our Lord is salvation;:

    So you need His wisdom in how you are applying your verses because Jesus is meaning enduring in this life while persecuted to escape what is coming on the earth as even those during the great tribulation has to endure persecution till the end to be saved ( as in being out of the way ) from His wrath on Satan and the world's armies when He returns as King of kings and not as the Bridegroom. Jesus is faithful in keeping even their souls while they suffer the great tribulation. 1 Peter 4:19 KJV

    You can't run that race, looking to the author & finisher of our faith in helping us lay aside every weight & sin to be received by Him as a vessel unto honor in His House unless you are saved.

    If you run that race to obtain salvation, the you dishonor Him by denying Him as your Savior that you are saved, and although coming short of that rest in Him for laboring in unbelief, He still abides in you for why one would be received as a vessel unto dishonor in His House after the great tribulation as a testimony of the power of God in salvation for all those that even just believe in His name.

    So there are consequences for saved believers for not abiding in Him as His disciple, but it is not loss of salvation; and it is greater than the loss of the rewards of crowns, but the lost of being of the firstfruits of the resurrection to attend the Marriage Supper in His honor at the pre great trib rapture event, thus becoming a castaway to be forever damned as a vessel unto dishonor BUT still in His House. That is why God is wiping the tears away from the eyes of those saints coming out of the great tribulation to help them get past that loss of that first inheritance from which there will be weeping and gnashing of teeth ( but not forever.. because again, He will perform a miracle by wiping the tears from their eyes to get past that loss. The prodigal son may have given up his first inheritance for wild living, and although he can never get it back, he is still son.

    So how do you tell sinners that Jesus Christ is your Savior if you are not saved yet? How can Jesus Christ be that Good News to mankind if that is how you read His selected verses out of context at the expense of His many other words that you are saved?
     
  8. In context of Acts 2:38...

    Acts 2:36 Therefore let all the house of Israel know assuredly, that God hath made the same Jesus, whom ye have crucified, both Lord and Christ. 37 Now when they heard this, they were pricked in their heart, and said unto Peter and to the rest of the apostles, Men and brethren, what shall we do? 38 Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost. 39 For the promise is unto you, and to your children, and to all that are afar off, even as many as the Lord our God shall call. 40 And with many other words did he testify and exhort, saying, Save yourselves from this untoward generation.

    What were they pricked in their hearts for? For crucifying Jesus Christ Whom they had not believed in. So the call to repent is to do what? To believe in Him for the remission of sins. Proof?

    Let's look at this same Peter in giving the same gospel to the Gentiles in how they were to receive the same remission of sins by believing in Him too..

    Acts 10:43 To him give all the prophets witness, that through his name whosoever believeth in him shall receive remission of sins. 44 While Peter yet spake these words, the Holy Ghost fell on all them which heard the word. 45 And they of the circumcision which believed were astonished, as many as came with Peter, because that on the Gentiles also was poured out the gift of the Holy Ghost.

    So water baptism has nothing to do with salvation, but just an ordinance for saved believers to follow after, but by believing in Him is how one receives teh remission of sins and the promise of the Holy Ghost at their salvation.

    Those names not found written in the Book of Life are cast into the lake of fire. All those other sins are just listed is to identify the unrepentant unbelieving sinner as being such.

    Still, he is sealed with the Holy Spirit which is why comeuppance will come from the Father for defiling the temple of God by paying for it with physical death; not by paying for it by loss of salvation.

    God will judge His House first at the pre great trib rapture event ( 1 Peter 4:17 KJV ) In that day, how each believer has built on that foundation will be judged ( 1 Corinthians 3:10-15 ) but they will be saved so as thru fire in that day incurring physical death for defiling the temple of God by not departing from iniquity before the Bridegroom had come ( 1 Corinthians 3:16-17 KJV & 2 Timothy 2:18-21 KJV )

    That foundation is still there. The seal of redemption is still there. The Holy Spirit is not going anywhere, but not every believer will be found abiding in Him as His disciple to be ready as well as willing to go when He comes.

    We endure by continuing to believe in Him and even then we are allowed to ask Him for help when we are being overcome with doubts.

    Mark 9:23 Jesus said unto him, If thou canst believe, all things are possible to him that believeth. 24 And straightway the father of the child cried out, and said with tears, Lord, I believe; help thou mine unbelief.
     
  9. Hmm both of you have interesting points, are there two kinds of salvation, is one meaning you are saved FROM hell and the other you are saved FOR heaven, when they really are the same thing?
    From Gods perspective..which is heavenly, it seems He knows what each and every soul requires.

    Some christians believe in pretribulation (is that even a real word?) and others believe Jesus saves us after tribulation, well it may be different for each individual. Or even during tribulation.

    In my experience whatever trial or tribulation I have just count it all joy.

    As for the disciples in the Bible, we do know apsotle Paul had many tribulations, he was stoned, was in a shipwreck, was put in jail...so its not as if he never suffered. The other disciples went through a lot too, they had to leave Judea go into all the world to preach the gospel and many were matryed. Also seeing the temple destroyed would have been devastating but Jesus warned them about that.
     
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  10. Salvation is a gift of God given by the grace of God to all those who believe in Him, even in His name.

    BUT discipleship requires applying belief in Jesus Christ as our Good Shepherd to help us understand & discern by His words in the KJV to expose the works of darkness that all modern Bibles are failing to do in all things in these latter days as only He can help us to lay aside every weight & sin and that is by LOOKING to the author & finisher of our faith to help us to do it..

    Not every saved believer will grow in His words to be rooted in His words for which many will fall away from the faith or be foolishly entangled in sins after having escaped the pollution of this world in reaping corruptions or just plain lose sight of Him for the cares of this life that it chokes the word and does not produce fruits and not want to leave when the Bridegroom comes ; see Luke 21:33-36 KJV. These be the vessels unto dishonor in His House for not abiding in Him nor being willing to go.

    The vessels unto dishonor will have a terrestrial inheritance in serving the King of kings as they are be those that are Christ's at His coming. The glorified terrestrial inheritance are those who will marry and have children, and serve the King of kings in being leaders in representing Him all over the world in raising up the coming generations in the millennium reign of Christ. They will not have the power of the second death over them which may be indicative that physical death may still have power over them until the end when death and hell has been cast into the lake of fire.

    Whereas the vessels unto honor are those of the first fruits of the resurrection that will inherit the eternal glory that comes with their salvation in that they will not die any more nor marry and have a place in the city of God in Heaven ( which will eventually come down to earth as New Jerusalem after the great tribulation along with her inhabitants.

    So there are 2 kinds of inheritance .as I see them in 2 Timothy 2:20-21 KJV for why we are to seek the good of our fellow brethren in the hopes that God is ministering to the wayward to depart from iniquity so they too can obtain the eternal glory that comes with our salvation in Christ Jesus ( 2 Timothy 2:10 KJV )

    As it is, i n these latter days, it seems the love of most believers as well as churches have grown cold. I am hoping the Bridegroom is coming soon.

    There is tribulation and then there is great tribulation in that hour of temptation that shall try all upon the earth to take the mark of the beast to buy & sell in the new world order in order to survive by man's provision or not, which by taking the mark is the eternal consequence of suffering in the lake of fire.
     
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  11. It's important to remember that salvation is a process, not a one-time event. My conversion from an unbeliever headed for Hell to a saint headed for Heaven was a one-time event: my conversion began the process of salvation that encompasses the doctrines of justification, sanctification and glorification.

    When I was born again, I was saved from the penalty of sin (Romans 8:1; Ephesians 2:5, 8-9) We can think of it as "salvation in the past tense" or the first phase of salvation. The doctrine involved is the doctrine of justification: being made "just as if I'd never sinned" in the eyes of God because He now sees me through the blood of Christ and not as a sinner. Justification can be defined as "the instantaneous act of God whereby He forgives the sinner of all past, present and future sins and declares him perfectly righteous in His sight." It is possible only because Christ paid the penalty for all sins committed by every sinner when He said "It is finished" (John 19:30) and died on the cross.

    Because I have been born again, I am saved from the power of sin in my life. Romans 6:11-14 is one of the passages that explains that I don't have to give in to the sin in my life - I have power in Christ (Phil 4:13) to ''put off the old man'' and ''put on the new man'' as Paul explained in Ephesians 4:22-32 and Colossians 3:1-17. We can think of it as ''salvation in the present tense" or the second phase of salvation, which is the doctrine of sanctification, or spiritual growth and maturity over time as we learn to live for God and put down (mortify) our flesh. Sanctification is never instantaneous and it occurs as the believer grows in grace and in the knowledge of our Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ (2 Peter 3:18), spends time in God's word and gradually learns how to walk in the Spirit and not fulfil the lust of the flesh (Gal 5:16).

    Because I am born again, I will be saved from the presence of sin when I go Home to Heaven either by death or by rapture. God will give me a new body like unto Christ's glorious body (Philippians 3:21) and I'll ultimately leave my body of flesh in the grave. We can think of it as "salvation in the future tense" or the third phase in the process of salvation, which is the doctrine of glorification. Until I'm Home and in my glorified body, I won't achieve total sinlessness. Glorification is the point at which my sin nature will be completely eradicated, I will be perfected, and my earthly struggle between my two natures as a Christian will be over.
     
  12. [QUOTE="Laura1557, post: 295368, member: 33045"]It's important to remember that salvation is a process, not a one-time event. My conversion from an unbeliever headed for Hell to a saint headed for Heaven was a one-time event: my conversion began the process of salvation that encompasses the doctrines of justification, sanctification and glorification.

    When I was born again, I was saved from the penalty of sin (Romans 8:1; Ephesians 2:5, 8-9) We can think of it as "salvation in the past tense" or the first phase of salvation. The doctrine involved is the doctrine of justification: being made "just as if I'd never sinned" in the eyes of God because He now sees me through the blood of Christ and not as a sinner. Justification can be defined as "the instantaneous act of God whereby He forgives the sinner of all past, present and future sins and declares him perfectly righteous in His sight." It is possible only because Christ paid the penalty for all sins committed by every sinner when He said "It is finished" (John 19:30) and died on the cross.

    Because I have been born again, I am saved from the power of sin in my life. Romans 6:11-14 is one of the passages that explains that I don't have to give in to the sin in my life - I have power in Christ (Phil 4:13) to ''put off the old man'' and ''put on the new man'' as Paul explained in Ephesians 4:22-32 and Colossians 3:1-17. We can think of it as ''salvation in the present tense" or the second phase of salvation, which is the doctrine of sanctification, or spiritual growth and maturity over time as we learn to live for God and put down (mortify) our flesh. Sanctification is never instantaneous and it occurs as the believer grows in grace and in the knowledge of our Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ (2 Peter 3:18), spends time in God's word and gradually learns how to walk in the Spirit and not fulfil the lust of the flesh (Gal 5:16).

    Because I am born again, I will be saved from the presence of sin when I go Home to Heaven either by death or by rapture. God will give me a new body like unto Christ's glorious body (Philippians 3:21) and I'll ultimately leave my body of flesh in the grave. We can think of it as "salvation in the future tense" or the third phase in the process of salvation, which is the doctrine of glorification. Until I'm Home and in my glorified body, I won't achieve total sinlessness. Glorification is the point at which my sin nature will be completely eradicated, I will be perfected, and my earthly struggle between my two natures as a Christian will be over.[/QUOTE]

    Did you mean to say that sanctification is a process, not a one time event? Salvation has to be a one time event for any one to receive the actual sanctification of the Spirit and the belief of the truth at the calling of the gospel from which since then, we go through this sanctification process by walking in the light as He has done as the blood of Jesus cleanses us from all sins until He brings us Home to the redemption of our glorified body.

    1 John 1:3 That which we have seen and heard declare we unto you, that ye also may have fellowship with us: and truly our fellowship is with the Father, and with his Son Jesus Christ. 4 And these things write we unto you, that your joy may be full. 5 This then is the message which we have heard of him, and declare unto you, that God is light, and in him is no darkness at all. 6 If we say that we have fellowship with him, and walk in darkness, we lie, and do not the truth: 7 But if we walk in the light, as he is in the light, we have fellowship one with another, and the blood of Jesus Christ his Son cleanseth us from all sin.

    Ephesians 5:25 Husbands, love your wives, even as Christ also loved the church, and gave himself for it; 26 That he might sanctify and cleanse it with the washing of water by the word, 27 That he might present it to himself a glorious church, not having spot, or wrinkle, or any such thing; but that it should be holy and without blemish.

    Salvation has been achieved so that we can tell others that Jesus Christ IS our Savior for He has saved us as the Holy Ghost in us is Witness, but whether or not we apply faith in Him as our Good Shepherd in living that reconciled relationship with God thru Jesus Christ to help us lay aside every weight & sin so that we may be received by the Bridegroom as vessels unto honor in His House is the question towards every saved believer as not every one will apply that faith & hope in Him for.

    Even those saved believers that did not depart from iniquity and get left behind as castaways, He will finish His work even in them even though, instead of a celestial inheritance, it will be a glorified terrestrial one after the great tribulation.

    Hebrews 12:5 And ye have forgotten the exhortation which speaketh unto you as unto children, My son, despise not thou the chastening of the Lord, nor faint when thou art rebuked of him:6 For whom the Lord loveth he chasteneth, and scourgeth every son whom he receiveth.7 If ye endure chastening, God dealeth with you as with sons; for what son is he whom the father chasteneth not? 8 But if ye be without chastisement, whereof all are partakers, then are ye bastards, and not sons.9 Furthermore we have had fathers of our flesh which corrected us, and we gave them reverence: shall we not much rather be in subjection unto the Father of spirits, and live? 10 For they verily for a few days chastened us after their own pleasure; but he for our profit, that we might be partakers of his holiness.11 Now no chastening for the present seemeth to be joyous, but grievous: nevertheless afterward it yieldeth the peaceable fruit of righteousness unto them which are exercised thereby..

    So even those wayward saints & former believers that get left behind will be sanctified the hard way thru scourging and chastening from the Father, but it is for their own good in the Lord, but do note, He does so because they are His children just as the prodigal son that gave up his first inheritance for wild living is still son even though he can never get that first inheritance back once the Bridegroom had come & gone, leaving him behind so to speak.
     
  13. I did say sanctification is a process and not a one time event when I said Sanctification is never instantaneous and it occurs as the believer grows in grace and in the knowledge of our Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ (2 Peter 3:18), spends time in God's word and gradually learns how to walk in the Spirit and not fulfil the lust of the flesh (Gal 5:16). At least that's what I was trying to say, although sometimes what I'm trying to say and what's understood by the reader aren't the same thing. :) We're in agreement; we're just describing it somewhat differently.

    The one time event that 90% of the time we refer to as our salvation is actually our conversion experience. When I say "I was saved on Nov 20 1997," for example, I'm talking about the day I came to Christ as a sinner and accepted His payment of the penalty for my sins: I made the decision that justified me in God's sight. Most times, sure, we simply call it salvation, but what I'm saying is that the process of salvation goes beyond our conversion.

    For example, if someone were to ask the question ''saved from what?" I'd answer that I've been saved from much more than just (just??) the penalty of my sin. I'm also being saved presently from its power in my life and in eternity will be saved from its presence in my life.

    When I was saved (converted), you betcha I received the actual sanctification of the Spirit and belief of the truth. I was set apart from the world and the sin I used to serve to God and His purposes for my life. Then as you said, "we go through this sanctification process by walking in the light as He has done as the blood of Jesus cleanses us from all sins until He brings us Home to the redemption of our glorified body."

    Right. That's why we're told to ''work out our own salvation with fear and trembling (Phil 2:12). We accept Jesus' death to save us from the penalty of our sin: it's all Him; but we're partly responsible for our own sanctification (ongoing process toward spiritual growth and maturity that you and I have both mentioned) from the present power of sin in that we are the ones who need to obey God in matters of renewing our mind (Romans 12:1-2), putting off the old man and putting on the new man (Ephesians 4 and Colossians 3), walking in the Spirit and not fulfilling the lusts of the flesh (Gal 5:16), reckoning ourselves to be dead to sin (Romans 6:11), obeying the authorities even when we disagree with them because we understand from Romans 13:1 that the powers that be are ordained of God, etc. He won't do it for us, nor force us to.

    Also, that Heb 12:5 chastening is a tool that God uses in our growth and maturity to encourage us to make those decisions to live in a way that honours Him.

    We do largely seem to agree; but we're coming at it from different angles.
     
  14. I believe I would defer here in that our salvation is our conversion experience as it is a one time event, but the sanctification process which is also known as discipleship, is an ongoing walk with Him which has to be done by the same grace of God by faith in Jesus Christ as our Good Shepherd.



    I reckon I separate the salvation as a done deal from the ongoing sanctification wherein we are to walk in newness of life as His disciple totally dependent on Him to help us to follow Him.

    The truth that you can call God Father means by His word which cannot be undone, He cannot cease to be our Father. Psalm 89th chapter testifies to what God does when His children are disobedient wherein He will keep His word and yet give stripes to those under the New Covenant that Jesus ( His seed ) is behind in.

    Psalm 89:27 Also I will make him my firstborn, higher than the kings of the earth. 28 My mercy will I keep for him for evermore, and my covenant shall stand fast with him.29 His seed also will I make to endure for ever, and his throne as the days of heaven.30 If his children forsake my law, and walk not in my judgments; 31 If they break my statutes, and keep not my commandments;32 Then will I visit their transgression with the rod, and their iniquity with stripes.33 Nevertheless my lovingkindness will I not utterly take from him, nor suffer my faithfulness to fail.34 My covenant will I not break, nor alter the thing that is gone out of my lips.35 Once have I sworn by my holiness that I will not lie unto David.36 His seed shall endure for ever, and his throne as the sun before me.37 It shall be established for ever as the moon, and as a faithful witness in heaven. Selah.

    I really do see this portion as a hidden prophesy to the New Covenant for why those saints left behind for not departing from iniquity are still His as they would receive stripes for that reasons as Jesus warned here.

    Luke 12:.40 Be ye therefore ready also: for the Son of man cometh at an hour when ye think not. 41 Then Peter said unto him, Lord, speakest thou this parable unto us, or even to all? 42 And the Lord said, Who then is that faithful and wise steward, whom his lord shall make ruler over his household, to give them their portion of meat in due season? 43 Blessed is that servant, whom his lord when he cometh shall find so doing. 44 Of a truth I say unto you, that he will make him ruler over all that he hath. 45 But and if that servant say in his heart, My lord delayeth his coming; and shall begin to beat the menservants and maidens, and to eat and drink, and to be drunken; 46 The lord of that servant will come in a day when he looketh not for him, and at an hour when he is not aware, and will cut him in sunder, and will appoint him his portion with the unbelievers. 47 And that servant, which knew his lord's will, and prepared not himself, neither did according to his will, shall be beaten with many stripes. 48 But he that knew not, and did commit things worthy of stripes, shall be beaten with few stripes. For unto whomsoever much is given, of him shall be much required: and to whom men have committed much, of him they will ask the more. 49 I am come to send fire on the earth; and what will I, if it be already kindled?

    For Him to call those cut off and having their portions with unbelievers and yet still be called His servants in getting stripes for the degree of knowledge for lack of preparedness but yet in iniquity, they are still His as in saved for that to happen. So salvation has to be succinctly a one tome event; a dine deal; that foundation cannot be removed that was laid by Christ Jesus; the seal of adoption is forever unto the day of redemption for why we are not to grieve the Holy Spirit or risk stripes..

    Philippians 2:13 tells us why.

    Philippians 2:13 For it is God which worketh in you both to will and to do of his good pleasure.

    That means no saved believer can make a promise nor a commitment to Christ that is His to keep and to finish which is why the just shall live by faith in Him & all His promises to us that no promises from us is needed. No man can add to the New Covenant nor take away from it. It is a done deal by believing in Him as our Saviour that we are saved and by that same grace of God, we live by faith in Him as our Good Shepherd in following Him as our confidence is to rest in Him.

    Philippians 1:6 Being confident of this very thing, that he which hath begun a good work in you will perform it until the day of Jesus Christ:....9 And this I pray, that your love may abound yet more and more in knowledge and in all judgment; 10 That ye may approve things that are excellent; that ye may be sincere and without offence till the day of Christ. 11 Being filled with the fruits of righteousness, which are by Jesus Christ, unto the glory and praise of God.

    Galatians 5:1Stand fast therefore in the liberty wherewith Christ hath made us free, and be not entangled again with the yoke of bondage.....5 For we through the Spirit wait for the hope of righteousness by faith.

    I believe it is important to signify the one time deal of our salvation and not as an ongoing process of salvation but as an ongoing process of sanctification which is not about obtaining salvation but abiding in Him as His disciple; hence discipleship.

    We are accountable to what we sows towards; the works of the flesh which includes heresy as any iniquity that denies Him, He will deny us by, and to the fruits of the Spirit.

    I know we can make decisions, but by His words, there is no power in that decision. I know that when the Lord warned me ahead of time what was about to come my way and that was to decide this day Whom I will serve; the Lord Jesus Christ or something else in His name. I could not fathom why what I had just read leapt out at me as there was a sense of urgency, but I said ou tloud, "You of course," but the sense of urgency remained and so I said, Please help me to do it" and then the sense of urgency left. About a week later when I had visited my aunt several states over with my folks, I was confronted with the "holy laughter" movement in my aunt's church in 1994. I did not know what it was but I felt a hand pushed me 3 times to go forward, and later on by His words, He helped me to discern that was the spirit of the antichrist that was in the world and He kept me from falling after it in serving those seducing spirits in that apostate movement.

    So there is no power in that decision when things are beyond my wits end in meeting that, wherein my Good Shepherd was faithful to me in keeping me from falling to its supernatural powers to chase after them for a sign in serving that movement and sharing in the glory of that movement thereof.

    So He has set me free from all commitments and promises to rest in Him as my Good Shepherd to follow Him by faith for He is the power for living that reconciled relationship with God thru Jesus Christ.
     
  15. I wonder if you can give an example of someone who didn't?
     
  16. Yea signs following...speaking in tongues, picking up snakes, drinking deadly things that wont harm you.

    Unless you just recieve the holy spirit and nothing happens. Thats not the case. Something does happen. But, nobody can push you into receiving it. Those people that push people over on the head are strange. Stay away from them.

    Discipleship is our walk with God, wheras sanctification is His washing us. Although I think of sanctification as once started, as ongoing, I mean, once washed clean you keep clean dont you, you dont go back to the mud. Keep following Jesus.
     
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    At Peace likes this.
  17. Greetings Brother,


    I think 1Corinthians 12:30 might allude to that?


    Bless you ....><>
     
    Dave M likes this.
  18. 1 Cor 12:7; But to each one is given the manifestation of the Spirit for the common good.

    Out of the 8 gifts listed, I doubt many have every single gift. The entire passage is about the ears being different
    from the eyes, and the hands being different from the feet, but they are all still part of the body.

    But the Spiritual gifts are just one manifestation. I wasn't questioning them. I was questioning if he (Jesusis4Me) could show
    me anywhere in the new testament where it says someone received the baptism of the Holy Spirit and didn't
    speak in tongues.

    1 Cor 12:8; For to one is given the word of wisdom through the Spirit, and to another the word of knowledge according to the same Spirit;
    1 Cor 12:9; to another faith by the same Spirit, and to another gifts of healing by the one Spirit,
    1 Cor 12:10; and to another the effecting of miracles, and to another prophecy, and to another the distinguishing of spirits, to another various kinds of tongues, and to another the interpretation of tongues.
    1 Cor 12:11; But one and the same Spirit works all these things, distributing to each one individually just as He wills.

    All of the the "to another"'s seem to indicate.. "all" do not have all the gifts.
     
  19. The eunuch from Ethiopia. There was no one else around, let alone a foreigner to serve as a sign towards the unbelievers, especially after the Spirit took Philip away to another place supernaturally..

    Simon the sorcerer and the Samaritans of that local area. There were no foreigners among them for that to serve as a sign towards unbelievers for.

    Not every recipient of the Holy Spirit at their salvation spoke in tongues in the Book of Acts to serve as a sign towards the unbelieving foreigners among them.
     
  20. Greetings B-A-C,

    when I read your post that I replied to, that Scripture popped into my shed, so I thought I'd share it with you.

    Trying to help, Brother.

    Bless you ....><>
     

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