• Welcome to Talk Jesus

    A true bible based, Jesus centered online community. Join over 11,000 members today

    Register Log In

What does believing in Jesus mean?

Users who viewed this discussion (Total:0)

Member
Stoning.....love that term, also a misapplied one. Christ addressed actual stoning. Today men in debate or pointing out sins once the beam is cast from ones eye,too seem to be casting stones ,at least to some. Context is important. And following all Christ says is paramount . No one is getting stoned or stoning another to point out something in disagreement or pointing out a sin of another when the one pointing himself -clearly is set up by God as an edifying instrument.

The money thing? It is just this simple you can not serve God and money as Christ said. You either love one or hate the other ,but not both. It is clear He is speaking of trying to make money off of serving God. He has know problem with good honest work. Paul even said he made his own keep as to not be a burden to others.

Christ is calling out the money grubbers in all ages ,who seek to gain from the work of God. Now, no doubt the laborers deserve their wages, and no doubt men should not serve God to gain money, so no doubt God will provide for those who serve Him and work to get honest gain through work. Now , I believe donations are a righteous thing to give as to keep an institution , even an internet one, going. However, that institution better use that money to spread the gospel. It better not apply it to luxurious living.......big million or billion dollar Cathedrals , church buildings ,house, expensive cars. That is NOT what God's word is for gaining nor are the donations of faithful good intent people to be used for such things. The needs and care of the community should be met through all contributing.

But no doubt, priest, all ministers of the faith should get jobs and stop monkeying on the backs of men . A little hard work is good for the soul. It takes a good steward to know how to discern and properly manage the church community money and not become a money grubber! Bottom line as Christ said , "You can not serve God and money" but he did not say you cannot use money to serve God's purpose.

That is why the first churches were in people houses,' for wherever two or more gather in my name there too am I in their midst." Each man should get to knowing Christ personally and help others even if it is in their own homes, or on forums like this one ,which should be supported by users like myself . If I am allowed to stay and share in Christ, then I shall provide for my keep.

It is called charity and we should all do that to a reasonable degree if it is possible. As for any steward , he needs to be wise and God fearing and appropriate funds for the purpose of spreading the gospel.
 
Member
I
That's just it. You misapply Jesus teaching. Not all of what He said is to the Church.

I didn't give you my opinion in post #(25). I showed you in Scripture. Yet you ignore it. You can't argue against it which is why you say you have no argument with me.

Nothing wrong with taking Jesus literally. Just make sure you apply His literal teaching to the right people.

Quantrill
Jesus wasn't with the people (physically) in the books of Acts and they did the same thing as the Apostles.

I hope you have a good day.
 
Member
Hello Spreading the Gospel,
Contrary to what you are saying, we do pick and choose, or we'd be stoning the next person who does xy or z. It's what moves us in doing so that we need to understand. For if it's not the understanding provided by the Holy Spirit, one is right in questioning it.

Now, when we look at the Bible, it all comes down to the literal translation, translated verses, of what God would have us do by looking to the Words He has provided us in or out of context to the whole. Segmenting the Bible to this or that, with faulty reasoning does not make it right, even if the words were said by Jesus. Perfect example, is the temptation of Christ in the desert by the Adversary. Satan used Scripture to tempt Christ with. Our Lord used Scripture right back at him. What was the issue with what Satan did? Surely, it wasn't the Scripture was it? Of course not. It was the context to the situation that was wrong, and so the deception.

The theology that you are following, dilutes anything that is not seen as being spoken directly by Christ. Not realizing that when you diminish the rest of the Bible, you are also diminishing His Words as well. Why? Because the Godly men who penned the Gospels, are the same Godly men who penned the rest of Scripture. Now we do not have the original autographs to go by and I believe for very good reason. Man cannot help themselves, and would wind up venerating them. Now, for you and others who have come here in group, see it as a black & white issue. Jesus' Words are perfect, while everything else must fall exactly in accord with His Words, and context only a secondary consideration, if considered at all must be in accord with the literal meaning.

I'm sure you don't see the issue, because to think or believe otherwise, is to denigrate the very Words that were meant to be communicated to us. Yet, you do not believe in the infallibility of Scripture. Because you don't, it required someone to state what would be the standard that is acceptable. That is how the Words of Jesus only came about. All the Words in the Bible come by inspiration of the Holy Spirit. Probably the only ones in the NT that could be considered differently is Luke, and Acts. They were written by someone who had no actual direct communication with the Messiah that we are aware of, but doesn't mean he was not inspired to do so. Even Paul was taught directly of Christ, but if you don't believe what is written therein then that makes him a liar and every Epistle written by him, and of course Peter, because he backs up Paul, means he also is bogus and of Satan. If so, how can you trust that the very Gospels you proclaim over all others is anymore accurate? Understand that all of Scripture came by way of the Holy Spirit who spoke to them only reminded them of what Jesus said.

We don't have every single thing that Jesus did. As Scripture points out, there won't be enough room in the world to contain all the books that would be written concerning them.

You can't narrow God by taking/ignoring away Words He has given us to know. We can only hope to as you are attempting to do, which I pray successfully, and that is follow them, but also something that you are having difficulty doing, and that is knowing/understanding them within the context provided.

With the Love of Christ Jesus.
YBIC
Nick
<><
I hope you have a good day.
 
Active
I

Jesus wasn't with the people (physically) in the books of Acts and they did the same thing as the Apostles.

I hope you have a good day.
Correct, but Jesus was with His people. (Acts 9:4-5)

Actually, they didn't do the same things. Their message went out to the Gentiles. They still preached to the Jews, but they did not avoid the Gentiles. They carried sword and purse with them which they didn't do before. I have already showed you this, yet you ignore it. Why?

Quantrill
 
Loyal
They carried sword and purse with them which they didn't do before. I have already showed you this, yet you ignore it. Why?
From reading through I dont believe you two are on the same page, it seems you are going in different directions.

At this rate you two will not ever come to any agreement
 
Active
Big Surprise!!
Rotfl.... It isn't to difficult to understand
I understood what you said. What is your point in saying it. Of course we are not on the same page and are going different directions. If we were I would't be having the discussion at all. That's not news.

So, tell me the point of your comment.

Quantrill
 
Least amongst the Best
Staff Member
Greetings,

I don't know about you blokes but I am still trying to get this one right and figure if I can't do that properly it is pointless and vain to try to perfect any other commandments you seem to disagree about.

A new commandment I give unto you, That ye love one another; as I have loved you, that ye also love one another. By this shall all men know that ye are My disciples, if ye have love one to another. John 13:34-35


Bless you ....><>
 
Least amongst the Best
Staff Member
And this is His commandment, That we should believe on the name of His Son Jesus Christ, and love one another, as He gave us commandment. And he that keepeth His commandments dwelleth in Him, and He in him. And hereby we know that He abideth in us, by the Spirit which He hath given us.
1John 3:23-24
 
Least amongst the Best
Staff Member
you see, anything whatsoever we do against any other person no matter how rotten they may appear to you or treat you or others or how jealous or justified you might believe you are is a sin against the Lord and shows a lack of trust in Him and a lack of living understanding of Who He is....
therefore, love one another

we are meant to be the image of God, not ourselves or parents or friends or society and certainly not our enemies or those we disagree with and definitely not the devil!

keep it simple


Bless you ....><>
 
Member
Correct, but Jesus was with His people. (Acts 9:4-5)

Actually, they didn't do the same things. Their message went out to the Gentiles. They still preached to the Jews, but they did not avoid the Gentiles. They carried sword and purse with them which they didn't do before. I have already showed you this, yet you ignore it. Why?

Quantrill
I am not trying to argue with you. If you don't want to obey Jesus, that is up to you. Whatever floats your boat.
 
Active
Hello Spreading the Gospel,
Contrary to what you are saying, we do pick and choose, or we'd be stoning the next person who does xy or z. It's what moves us in doing so that we need to understand. For if it's not the understanding provided by the Holy Spirit, one is right in questioning it.

Now, when we look at the Bible, it all comes down to the literal translation, translated verses, of what God would have us do by looking to the Words He has provided us in or out of context to the whole. Segmenting the Bible to this or that, with faulty reasoning does not make it right, even if the words were said by Jesus. Perfect example, is the temptation of Christ in the desert by the Adversary. Satan used Scripture to tempt Christ with. Our Lord used Scripture right back at him. What was the issue with what Satan did? Surely, it wasn't the Scripture was it? Of course not. It was the context to the situation that was wrong, and so the deception.

The theology that you are following, dilutes anything that is not seen as being spoken directly by Christ. Not realizing that when you diminish the rest of the Bible, you are also diminishing His Words as well. Why? Because the Godly men who penned the Gospels, are the same Godly men who penned the rest of Scripture. Now we do not have the original autographs to go by and I believe for very good reason. Man cannot help themselves, and would wind up venerating them. Now, for you and others who have come here in group, see it as a black & white issue. Jesus' Words are perfect, while everything else must fall exactly in accord with His Words, and context only a secondary consideration, if considered at all must be in accord with the literal meaning.

I'm sure you don't see the issue, because to think or believe otherwise, is to denigrate the very Words that were meant to be communicated to us. Yet, you do not believe in the infallibility of Scripture. Because you don't, it required someone to state what would be the standard that is acceptable. That is how the Words of Jesus only came about. All the Words in the Bible come by inspiration of the Holy Spirit. Probably the only ones in the NT that could be considered differently is Luke, and Acts. They were written by someone who had no actual direct communication with the Messiah that we are aware of, but doesn't mean he was not inspired to do so. Even Paul was taught directly of Christ, but if you don't believe what is written therein then that makes him a liar and every Epistle written by him, and of course Peter, because he backs up Paul, means he also is bogus and of Satan. If so, how can you trust that the very Gospels you proclaim over all others is anymore accurate? Understand that all of Scripture came by way of the Holy Spirit who spoke to them only reminded them of what Jesus said.

We don't have every single thing that Jesus did. As Scripture points out, there won't be enough room in the world to contain all the books that would be written concerning them.

You can't narrow God by taking/ignoring away Words He has given us to know. We can only hope to as you are attempting to do, which I pray successfully, and that is follow them, but also something that you are having difficulty doing, and that is knowing/understanding them within the context provided.

With the Love of Christ Jesus.
YBIC
Nick
<><
Thanks for this great post!

It is truly impossible to have a productive discussion with those who claim that "You must follow all of Jesus' commands literally (sell everything etc) to be saved" because they do not believe scripture is infallible, therefore you cannot use scripture to refute their arguments. For those who are new here, just a warning, in order to accept this belief you must ignore and discredit other scripture. That is a test of true doctrine, which this doctrine fails. This has been proved in other threads here on this same subject. I don't feel to enter this argument or debate this.

It is good though, to examine my life in light of the life of Jesus and to see whether I am truly following Him. Where is my affection?
 
Active
Thanks for this great post!

It is truly impossible to have a productive discussion with those who claim that "You must follow all of Jesus' commands literally (sell everything etc) to be saved" because they do not believe scripture is infallible, therefore you cannot use scripture to refute their arguments. For those who are new here, just a warning, in order to accept this belief you must ignore and discredit other scripture. That is a test of true doctrine, which this doctrine fails. This has been proved in other threads here on this same subject. I don't feel to enter this argument or debate this.

It is good though, to examine my life in light of the life of Jesus and to see whether I am truly following Him. Where is my affection?
See this thread:

Questions Regarding Commands of Jesus
 
Loyal
It is truly impossible to have a productive discussion with those who claim that "You must follow all of Jesus' commands literally (sell everything etc) to be saved" because they do not believe scripture is infallible, therefore you cannot use scripture to refute their arguments
That's just it, in order to do what Jesus told us to do one must Actually know what Jesus really said.

Example....Jesus knew the young man had walked upright and followed the commandments.
HOWEVER there was one thing he lacked...Love and Trust in God. This young man had placed all his trust in his wealth. He knew his wealth got him what he wanted and enabled him with a temporary power over others.

The young man failed this test. He chose his natural power of wealth over God.

Blessings
 
Member
To everyone out there who thinks that Paul or whoever is equal to Jesus, read (Galatians 1:8). Paul even says if anything he teaches is different than what Jesus taught then throw it out.

Also, for everyone who thinks that the entire bible is the infallible word of God the please read (1 Corinthians 7:12 and 2 Corinthians 11:17). In both of these passages Paul says these thoughts are from him not God.

If people don't want to follow Jesus and walk as he did fine. But, don't condemn people who are actually trying to get his teachings out there.

One last thing, no one know's if they are saved are not. Jesus says, "those of you who make it to the end will be saved" (Mathew 24:13). But, I guess everyone wants to act like he didn't mean that either.

I hope this finds you all well. God bless.
 
Active
I am not trying to argue with you. If you don't want to obey Jesus, that is up to you. Whatever floats your boat.
You're willing to argue as long as you carry the argument. As soon as you can't, then you say, you don't want to argue. Your position is lacking, and you can see it. Instead of ignoring it, you should attempt to see why you can't support it. You may find it is because you are in the wrong in what you are stating.

I believe you want to obey and serve Jesus. Just be sure you are obeying the commands that are directed to you. This is a good rule with other Scripture also.

Quantrill
 

Top