Transformation Necessary For Salvation and Imputed Righteousness
- Thread starter tulsa 2011
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I agree , and would agree ,with most things said on this thread.
TaylorDonBarret
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nice to hear the positive responses. i was expecting some backlash calling me a legalist and brother paul washer a false prophet. You guys have any suggestions for other sermon's on youtube or elsewhere?
Taylor, Paul Washer I think is the only living preacher I will listen to......... Yes I listen to dead people. You may go to sermon audio there is a plethora of saint of the past and the present. I found a place on the net called librivox it is public domain all audio books ..... and if I may suggest ..down load Pursuit of God by A W Tozer I have read the book numerous times ... now when I am in the car I listen to it and it is real good stuff.... let me know
peter
tulsa 2011
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Pistis is used in II Thessalonians 2: 13-14, "But we are bound to give thanks alway to God for you, brethren beloved of the Lord, because God hath from the beginning chosen you to salvation through sanctification of the Spirit and belief of the truth: Whereunto he called you by our gospel, to the obtaining of the glory of our Lord Jesus Christ." In II Thessalonians 2: 13 belief is from the Greek word pistis. In Strong's Exhaustive Concordance number 4102, pistis, from number 3982, peitho, "to convince, to assent, agree, assume, believe, have confidence,obey, trust, yield." Then for the definition of 4102, pistis, Strong's says the word means "persuasion, i.e., credence, conviction of truth, especially reliance on Christ for salvation, assurance, belief, faith, fidelity."
In a great many verses in the Gospel of John Strong's number 4100 is used, pisteuo, meaning "to have faith...to entrust, especially one's spiritual well being to Christ, believe, put trust in."
Then, in the New Testament other than in John's Gospel, faith is from the Greek word pistis, Strong's number 4102, defined above.
So, to believe the word of God, to assent to it, obey it, to have a conviction of its truth, and to trust Christ for your salvation, is the same as having faith.
Man in the spiritual state of the natural man does not discern that which is spiritual (I Corinthians 2: 14). He may discern that which is of the flesh, of his heart and mind.
To have faith, to believe the word of God, and to see it as absolute truth which cannot be comprmized by man's reasoning, is given to us by God.
"For it is God which worketh in you both to will and to do of his good pleasure." Philippians 2: 13
In the compartmentalized world of the II Timothy 3: 5, 7-8 churches faith might be said tgo be different from the gift of God in the form of belief in and acceptance of the doctrines of scripture - because this gift from God implies some amount of change, or transformation in a person, and the II Timothy 3: 5, 7-8 churches do not want to go there.
"Having a form of godliness, but denying the power thereof: from such turn away.,
7. Ever learning, and never able to come to the knowledge of the truth.
8. Now as Jannes and Jambres withstood Moses, so do these also resist the truth: men of corrupt minds, reprobate concerning the faith." II Timothy 3: 5, 7-9
Having only a form, or appearance of godliness, never able to come to the knowledge of the truth and resisting the truth are outcomes of not being born again, or transformed in Christ, by those of the II Timothy 3: 5, 7-8 churches
In a great many verses in the Gospel of John Strong's number 4100 is used, pisteuo, meaning "to have faith...to entrust, especially one's spiritual well being to Christ, believe, put trust in."
Then, in the New Testament other than in John's Gospel, faith is from the Greek word pistis, Strong's number 4102, defined above.
So, to believe the word of God, to assent to it, obey it, to have a conviction of its truth, and to trust Christ for your salvation, is the same as having faith.
Man in the spiritual state of the natural man does not discern that which is spiritual (I Corinthians 2: 14). He may discern that which is of the flesh, of his heart and mind.
To have faith, to believe the word of God, and to see it as absolute truth which cannot be comprmized by man's reasoning, is given to us by God.
"For it is God which worketh in you both to will and to do of his good pleasure." Philippians 2: 13
In the compartmentalized world of the II Timothy 3: 5, 7-8 churches faith might be said tgo be different from the gift of God in the form of belief in and acceptance of the doctrines of scripture - because this gift from God implies some amount of change, or transformation in a person, and the II Timothy 3: 5, 7-8 churches do not want to go there.
"Having a form of godliness, but denying the power thereof: from such turn away.,
7. Ever learning, and never able to come to the knowledge of the truth.
8. Now as Jannes and Jambres withstood Moses, so do these also resist the truth: men of corrupt minds, reprobate concerning the faith." II Timothy 3: 5, 7-9
Having only a form, or appearance of godliness, never able to come to the knowledge of the truth and resisting the truth are outcomes of not being born again, or transformed in Christ, by those of the II Timothy 3: 5, 7-8 churches
Travis
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I <3 Paul Washer
Well, I didn't just wake up one day and decide, you know, I think i will make Jesus Lord of my life. I did notice the Lord working on me and drawing me to him in a number of ways. I recognized that Jesus Christ most definitely is Lord, my conscience could not deny that. I didn't stop there though. I wanted to know this Lord, so I sought after him and got to know him a little. Jesus quickly moved from just being Lord in my heart, to being MY Lord. He died for the world yes, but he died for ME. He loves me… even though I have done nothing to deserve that.
I find it hard not to serve someone who is like that.
Blessings,
Travis
Well, I didn't just wake up one day and decide, you know, I think i will make Jesus Lord of my life. I did notice the Lord working on me and drawing me to him in a number of ways. I recognized that Jesus Christ most definitely is Lord, my conscience could not deny that. I didn't stop there though. I wanted to know this Lord, so I sought after him and got to know him a little. Jesus quickly moved from just being Lord in my heart, to being MY Lord. He died for the world yes, but he died for ME. He loves me… even though I have done nothing to deserve that.
I find it hard not to serve someone who is like that.
Blessings,
Travis
B-A-C
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I have mostly stayed out of this because I tend to lean more to Wesleyan/Imparted rather than Calvinist/Imputed.
But this seems to be a chicken and egg question for the imputed crowd. Does the righteousness come first? Or the transformation?
If we aren't transformed, are we still righteous?
But this seems to be a chicken and egg question for the imputed crowd. Does the righteousness come first? Or the transformation?
If we aren't transformed, are we still righteous?
B-A-C
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I don't know about Paul Washer, I've never heard of him before reading this thread. But it sounds like he believes in Lordship Salvation, so that is a plus.
I would say the TalkJesus crowd is split pretty close to 50/50 when it comes to Lordship Salvation, which of course would not be imputed or infused righteousness.
After visiting his website, it appears he to follow the imparted belief.
I would say the TalkJesus crowd is split pretty close to 50/50 when it comes to Lordship Salvation, which of course would not be imputed or infused righteousness.
After visiting his website, it appears he to follow the imparted belief.
Travis
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You should definitely check him out.
