Tithing?

[spirit1st]

Wendy , I am not being smart.
But it has nothing to do with giving. It has to do with WHY , We do things. Not the ACT.

God Loves a cheerful giver .He wants us here being a li8ving blessing , with every part of our lives!

But if we are giving because we are trying to obey the laws of moses? then we are rejecting the laws of Christ!

The laws of Christ are Love and Faith !
We give out Of LOVE .We cannot say ? Well I am obeying the laws of Moses out of LOVE!


Heb 10:29 Of how much sorer punishment, suppose ye, shall he be thought worthy, who hath trodden under foot the Son of God, and hath counted the blood of the covenant, wherewith he was sanctified, an unholy thing, and hath done despite unto the Spirit of grace?


Heb 7:12 For the priesthood being changed, there is made of necessity a change also of the law.


Gal 5:4 Christ is become of no effect unto you, whosoever of you are justified by the law; ye are fallen from grace.
Gal 2:21 I do not frustrate the grace of God: for if righteousness come by the law, then Christ is dead in vain.


Gal 3:24 Wherefore the law was our schoolmaster to bring us unto Christ, that we might be justified by faith.
Gal 3:25 But after that faith is come, we are no longer under a schoolmaster.
Gal 3:26 For ye are all the children of God by faith in Christ Jesus.


Gal 3:12 And the law is not of faith: but, The man that doeth them shall live in them.


Php 3:9 And be found in him, not having mine own righteousness, which is of the law, but that which is through the faith of Christ, the righteousness which is of God by faith:

I hope you understand this.I think it is important !


Gal 2:16 Knowing that a man is not justified by the works of the law, but by the faith of Jesus Christ, even we have believed in Jesus Christ, that we might be justified by the faith of Christ, and not by the works of the law: for by the works of the law shall no flesh be justified.





Jas 1:25 But whoso looketh into the perfect law of liberty, and continueth therein, he being not a forgetful hearer, but a doer of the work, this man shall be blessed in his deed. Jas 2:12 So speak ye, and so do, as they that shall be judged by the law of liberty.


Rev 1:6 And hath made us kings and priests unto God and his Father; to him be glory and dominion forever and ever. Amen.

You understand ?There are no People on the earth higher than these GOD has MADE PRIESTS. So then ,Who would there Priests pay tithes To?

So we give because we want to bless others ! Not because we are forced to

The law is Force!
Love gives freely !

 

[jond]

tithe

Thank you Wendy, matt 23: 23 puts to rest the doubt about what Jesus thinks says about "tithing", in the "living bible" translation it says "yes, you should tithe, but you shouldn't leave the more important things undone"
God bless you Wendy.

and may He bless all of us as we follow His will in our lives each day

Jond

 

[Blademan]

Has any of you read Matthew23:23 yet?If you love God tithing wouldn't be grievous in any form.

To me, giving isn't grievous. What I find highly objectionable is the idea that it's right and proper to hand over to religious church organizations the primary portion of our giving, whether it be a tenth, or whatever percentage it ends up being.

The tithing example of the OT texts had everything to do with with meeting needs, not supporting buildings and their operations. Today, however, the avarice of institutionalism's leadership has created a shift in the biblical paradigm. They teach that giving to the institution is synonymous with giving to God...that the institution is the "storehouse".

The blind acceptance of such falsehoods routinely turns a blind eye to the many needs within the membership of institutionalism's own ranks. It fosters the assumption in the minds many that it's not right to beg sustinance from that to which they have given.

There's churches on every corner,

...many being nothing more than monuments to man's pride...

but how many are really doing the will of God?

Very few church organizations serve anyone but their own interests.

Oh yes. Many support the missions of men who are overseas laboring at modeling that same institution's failures upon foreign soil.

How many really knows His will? They all profess to do His will,but the fruits certainly don't bare out.

Touche'

Of course there's people who disobey the Spirit because of being rebellious.

This very well describes much of the modern leadership over church organizations. The appeal of modern architecture drives the leadership to errect fancier and more expensive monuments to proclaim a false gospel to the world.

"Come hither, and within ye shall enjoy the latest in sound and video technology. Come and lay with the harlots of our socially acceptable and culturally relevant teachings that tickle the ear and tatilate the intellect to imaginative wonders the world over..."

I would have far less negative to say about modern institutionalism if the people would do with the primary portion of their giving in accordance with the examples of scripture. We would then have far fewer monuments to man's pride, and more meeting of needs in order to release the needy to offer up to the Lord even greater gifts of praise to His Glory.

 

[Blademan]

matt 23: 23 puts to rest the doubt about what Jesus thinks says about "tithing", in the "living bible" translation it says "yes, you should tithe, but you shouldn't leave the more important things undone"

Context is also important in Jesus' words in Matthew 23. Please observe that He was addressing a people who were still under the requirement to obey the Law, which demanded that a tenth of the increase from crops and livestock be handed over as a tithe.

There isn't one command anywhere in the OT demanding that wage-earners hand over a tenth of their wages to the Levite or anyone else.

 

[jiggyfly]

Has any of you read Matthew23:23 yet?If you love God tithing wouldn't be grievous in any form. Whether you thought you had to or not you would want to. That's being a cheerful giver.A lot of people profess being cheerful givers,but they never do it.I can profess to be a lot of things,but it doesn't mean that I am those things.I see today a religious world,but not true salvation.There's churches on every corner,but how many are really doing the will of God? How many really knows His will? They all profess to do His will,but the fruits certainly don't bare out.May God help us all.If you are truly saved the Spirit of God would lead you into all understanding.Of course there's people who disobey the Spirit because of being rebellious.That spirit of rebellion is like the spirit of witchcraft.The true believers isn't going to be in the majority, it's going to be in the few.May God Bless and Help Us All!

Wendy did you read the Original Post yet????

 

[wendy28davis]

tithing

Wendy did you read the Original Post yet????

Jiggyfly,May God Bless you.But I am led of the Spirit of the Holy Ghost to pay tithes,so no matter how you define the scriptures I will obey God whether than man.Thank you for your opinions and thoughts.Again may God Bless you and direct you in all Spiritual knowledge.

 

[wendy28davis]

tithing

Thank you Wendy, matt 23: 23 puts to rest the doubt about what Jesus thinks says about "tithing", in the "living bible" translation it says "yes, you should tithe, but you shouldn't leave the more important things undone"
God bless you Wendy.

and may He bless all of us as we follow His will in our lives each day

Jond

you are correct in believing the Bible don't let any tell you different.The Word is The Word and we all will be judge by it. People who love money more than God has made that money an idol. Let God's Spirit lead you not man.May God Richly Bless You!

 

[wendy28davis]

tithing

Context is also important in Jesus' words in Matthew 23. Please observe that He was addressing a people who were still under the requirement to obey the Law, which demanded that a tenth of the increase from crops and livestock be handed over as a tithe.

There isn't one command anywhere in the OT demanding that wage-earners hand over a tenth of their wages to the Levite or anyone else.

Blademan may God direct you.Jesus Himself was telling us that paying tithes is something we are suppose to do. It's part of obeying the Word of God.Ask God to tell you what you should do. Never go on your on thoughts or feelings. Don't believe me for my words or anyone elses words at that. Listen to God.As I told jiggyfly the Holy Ghost has led me to pays tithes the Holy Ghost don't lie nor will He tell one to do something and tell another not too. When people get the real Spirit of God He will lead them into all truth.May God Bless You

 

[wendy28davis]

tithing

Wendy , I am not being smart.
But it has nothing to do with giving. It has to do with WHY , We do things. Not the ACT.

God Loves a cheerful giver .He wants us here being a li8ving blessing , with every part of our lives!

But if we are giving because we are trying to obey the laws of moses? then we are rejecting the laws of Christ!

The laws of Christ are Love and Faith !
We give out Of LOVE .We cannot say ? Well I am obeying the laws of Moses out of LOVE!


Heb 10:29 Of how much sorer punishment, suppose ye, shall he be thought worthy, who hath trodden under foot the Son of God, and hath counted the blood of the covenant, wherewith he was sanctified, an unholy thing, and hath done despite unto the Spirit of grace?


Heb 7:12 For the priesthood being changed, there is made of necessity a change also of the law.


Gal 5:4 Christ is become of no effect unto you, whosoever of you are justified by the law; ye are fallen from grace.
Gal 2:21 I do not frustrate the grace of God: for if righteousness come by the law, then Christ is dead in vain.


Gal 3:24 Wherefore the law was our schoolmaster to bring us unto Christ, that we might be justified by faith.
Gal 3:25 But after that faith is come, we are no longer under a schoolmaster.
Gal 3:26 For ye are all the children of God by faith in Christ Jesus.


Gal 3:12 And the law is not of faith: but, The man that doeth them shall live in them.


Php 3:9 And be found in him, not having mine own righteousness, which is of the law, but that which is through the faith of Christ, the righteousness which is of God by faith:

I hope you understand this.I think it is important !


Gal 2:16 Knowing that a man is not justified by the works of the law, but by the faith of Jesus Christ, even we have believed in Jesus Christ, that we might be justified by the faith of Christ, and not by the works of the law: for by the works of the law shall no flesh be justified.





Jas 1:25 But whoso looketh into the perfect law of liberty, and continueth therein, he being not a forgetful hearer, but a doer of the work, this man shall be blessed in his deed. Jas 2:12 So speak ye, and so do, as they that shall be judged by the law of liberty.


Rev 1:6 And hath made us kings and priests unto God and his Father; to him be glory and dominion forever and ever. Amen.

You understand ?There are no People on the earth higher than these GOD has MADE PRIESTS. So then ,Who would there Priests pay tithes To?

So we give because we want to bless others ! Not because we are forced to

The law is Force!
Love gives freely !

Friend feel free to express your thoughts to me. I don't think you are being smart at all.I have explained to others that I am led of the Holy Ghost to pay tithes. I also have said the Holy Ghost does not lie nor does He require one to do something and not the other.May God Bless you and let God's spirit lead you. Not Me or any one else on this site.

 

[jiggyfly]

Jiggyfly,May God Bless you.But I am led of the Spirit of the Holy Ghost to pay tithes,so no matter how you define the scriptures I will obey God whether than man.Thank you for your opinions and thoughts.Again may God Bless you and direct you in all Spiritual knowledge.

So is that a no?

Praise God, that is exactly the goal of many here and including myself. We want you to be led of the HolySpirit. If HolySpirit leads you to give a tenth, then please by all means do so, just be careful not to make it a command for others.

 

[wendy28davis]

tithing

By Roger Sapp

Take the following True or False quiz to see how much your really understand about tithing. We predict that many of you will be surprised. Record your answers.

True or False? 1. The Lord Jesus Christ would have tithed.

True or False? 2. Simon Peter, originally a fisherman, would have tithed of the fish that he caught.

True or False? 3. Everyone in the Old Testament seeking to obey the Law of Moses would have tithed.

True or False 4. Abraham tithed to Melchizedek in the same way that believers tithe to the Lord Jesus Christ.

True or False? 5. The Lord Jesus Christ taught His disciples that they should tithe.

True or False? 6. There are many examples of people tithing of their incomes in the Bible.

True or False? 7. The New Testament teaches that we should tithe to ministers in the same way that Jews tithed to the Priests.

True or False? 8. The Bible teaches that God’s standard for giving is ten-percent.

True or False? 9. The righteous poor tithed in the Old Testament.

True or False? 10. Since everyone is held to the same standard, tithing is fair to everyone.

True or False? Bonus Question. The Bible teaches that everyone should give ten-percent of their ongoing income.

Here are the answers.

True or False? 1. The Lord Jesus Christ would have tithed of His income. This one is false. The Lord Jesus Christ was a carpenter by profession and then after He became 30 years old He was a preacher and teacher. Neither of these professions was required by the Law of Moses to tithe anything.

True or False? 2. Simon Peter, originally a fisherman, would have tithed of the fish that he caught. This one is false also. Fishermen were not required to tithe anything either. There were only two kinds of professions in ancient Israel that were required to tithe. Farmers and husbandmen (shepherds and herders) were the only tithers in ancient Israel. They only tithed food.

True or False? 3. Everyone in the Old Testament seeking to obey the Law of Moses would have tithed. It should be evident by now that this one is false also. There were many people with other professions who were not required by the Law to tithe. For instance, the apostle Paul being a tent-maker was not required to tithe. In fact, none of the Twelve apostles would have been tithers because none of them came from the required professions.

True or False? 4. Abraham tithed to Melchizedek in the same way that believers tithe to the Lord Jesus Christ. This one is false also. Abraham’s tithe was very different than what the Church practices today. For instance, Abraham only tithed once. The Church tithes continually. Abraham tithed of the spoils of a war. The Church tithes of its income. Abraham had no increase because he gave the other 90% of the spoils of the war back to the original owner. The Church tithes of its increase. There is no commandment or any logic or indication in the New Testament that believers are to tithe anything to the Lord Jesus Christ. Believers are to give generously as God blesses them.

True or False? 5. The Lord Jesus Christ taught His disciples that they should tithe. False. Christ only makes two statements about tithing. Neither statement says that His disciples should tithe anything. Christ first statement is to the Pharisees not to His disciples. In that statement, Christ says that the Pharisees should continue to tithe food not money. He also says that this tithe of food is a part of the Law and says that it is not even an important part of the Law. His other statement is about a self-righteous Pharisee bragging that he tithes. Christ says that the other man who was not tithing who humbled himself was justified in the sight of God. The self-righteous tither was not justified in the sight of God.

True or False? 6. There are many examples of people tithing of their incomes in the Bible. False. In 4000 years of recorded biblical history there is not a single example of what the Church practices today in tithing money. There are two one-time acts of tithing recorded before the Law. Neither man, Abraham or Jacob, seems to think that they should continue this process beyond the one-time act. Neither man is tithing of their income since each is only involved in a one-time act. Abraham is tithing of the spoils of a war. All the other tithing recorded in the Bible is found in the Law of Moses. In the Law, money was never used to tithe only food. In fact, when someone wanted to use money rather than bring the produce to Jerusalem, God required a 20% penalty to be added. In other words, God discouraged the tithing of money.

True or False? 7. The New Testament teaches that we should tithe to ministers in the same way that Jews tithed to the Priests. False. The New Testament has nothing at all to say about this. This is extra-biblical logic that is not found in the New Testament. In fact, the Book of Hebrews makes it clear that believers are not of the Levitical order of priests. Believers are of a higher order, the order of Melchizedek.

True or False? 8. The Bible teaches that God’s standard for giving is ten-percent. False. Neither the Old Testament or the New Testament teaches this. This is extra-biblical logic again. First of all, the food tithe in the Old Testament was not ten-percent. It was actually more like 23% annually on average. There were three tithes in the Law of Moses. The first tithe was paid only by agrarian families three times yearly to the Priests in Jerusalem. The second tithe was saved by the agrarian families to support this annual trip. It was called the festival tithe. It was for a family vacation. The third tithe was given every three years to the local storehouse, so it amounted to about 3% annually. This was the poor tithe collected for those in need. This is the tithe that Malachi wrote about. None of these tithes were money. They were only food. Those who earned their livings by other occupations did not pay a tithe of anything. However, they did give offerings required by the Law some of which were in silver, gold, bronze and copper coins. Nowhere does the New Testament change this legal obligation of tithe food for some agrarian Israelites in the Law to money tithing for all Christians.

True or False? 9. The righteous poor tithed in the Old Testament. False. The poor had no harvest or flocks to tithe from. They were able to glean the corners of the field of those who were more prosperous.

True or False? 10. Since everyone is held to the same standard, tithing is fair to everyone. False. Tithing is incredibly unfair. Ten-percent of the income of a poor person is a great burden, while ten-percent of the income of a rich person may be no burden at all. If a person only has a $1000 a month income, then $100 of that income will affect their lifestyle and may even impact their ability to take care of their children’s basic needs and pay their bills. If a person has a $10,000 a month income then giving $1,000 per month should have little affect on their lifestyle since they should have a good amount of disposable income beyond their basic needs. If a person has a $100,000 a month income, then $10,000 a month has no appreciable affect on their lifestyle at all.

True or False? Bonus Question. The Bible teaches that everyone should give ten-percent of their ongoing income. False. The modern practice of tithing has five basic elements expressed as everyone gives 10% of ongoing income. How do Bible facts about tithing actually fit with this teaching? Lets compare and contrast the modern teaching of tithing with the Bible.

Everyone gives 10% of ongoing income. Considering the Everyone element. The two events before the Law do not support the idea that everyone should pay tithe. Only Abraham and Jacob in each situation are paying tithe. Genesis doesn’t record anyone else tithing. Abraham and Jacob don’t seem to teach their children to tithe. One of Jacob’s children, Joseph, is a particularly righteous man. In the more than ten detailed chapters devoted to Joseph, we don’t discover him tithing either. Not everyone tithed in Genesis before the Law.

In the Law of Moses, not everyone was required to tithe or give firstfruits. Only those who were actually growing food or raising sheep or cattle were required by the Law to tithe the food or present firstfruits. People from other occupations were not required to tithe since they had no harvest or growth of flocks to tithe or to present firstfruits from. Not everyone tithed food who lived under the Law. No one under the Law tithed money at all.

Christ has only a few words to say about tithing. In those words, Christ does not say that everyone should tithe. He says that unbelieving Jews living under the Law should tithe food if they are growing it. He mentions three food plants. Christ is not addressing His disciples. He is addressing unbelieving Pharisees.

The apostle Paul does not teach that everyone is obligated to tithe or to even to give. He teaches that giving is completely voluntary. The first apostolic council in Acts Chapter 15 does not say that Gentile believers should tithe either. There is absolutely no evidence that any Gentile Christian in the First Century ever tithed anything.

Everyone gives 10% of ongoing income. Considering the gives element. The two events before the Law do seem like giving. They are both voluntary acts. God does not require either man, Abraham or Jacob, to give anything. While this does on the surface seem to support the tithing teaching, it actually contradicts some aspects of the Tithing Obligation teaching. While the proponents of tithing teach that tithing is giving, they also often teach that tithing is required, that a tithe must be paid. Of course, this is a contradiction in their teaching. Something can be only given if it is entirely voluntary. If it is required, then it is, in this case, a fee for spiritual services or a religious tax. If some teach that a believer comes under a curse if they do not tithe, then they are not teaching giving but teaching paying an obligated tithe. Of course, they are right in one sense because they are often spiritualizing the Law of Moses to teach tithing.

Tithing in the Law of Moses was never giving. It was much more like paying taxes. The Law of Moses required tithing by farmers and husbandmen. They would not have seen their tithing as giving. There was nothing voluntary in their paying tithe. They would have been in violation of the Law if they had not done it.

Again, Christ has very little to say about tithing. He did say that Jewish people living under the Law pay tithe. Christ does teach a great deal about finances and giving but never instructs His disciples to tithe money or anything else. He does not instruct them to receive tithes either.

Paul writes a great deal about finances and giving but never instructs anyone to tithe or to receive tithes. The first apostolic council in Acts Chapter 15 is silent on the subject of tithing but is clear that Gentiles are not to keep any aspects of the Law of Moses. That would include tithing of anything.

Everyone gives 10% of ongoing income. Considering the 10% element. The two events before the Law of Moses do seem to support the idea that ten percent of something should be given. The number ten is the same. However, the other four elements are significantly different. This makes tithing being practiced by the Church very different from what is happening in Genesis. The only similarity is the ten percent number.

Christ does validate the ten-percent number but only for Jews living under the Law of Moses. He tells the Pharisees that they should pay tithe, ten percent, of their produced food. He also tells them that paying ten-percent is not a weighty matter of the Law. In saying this, Christ does tell us that tithing is a matter of the Law.

The apostle Paul repeatedly warns believers about the curse of the Law. Gentile believers should not attempt to keep any aspects of the Law. Believers are not required to give ten-percent of food or anything else. The writings of the other apostles, James and Peter, are silent about Christians giving ten percent of food or anything else.

Everyone gives 10% of ongoing income. Considering the ongoing element. The two examples before the Law of Moses do not reveal the practice of on-going tithing. They both appear strongly to be one-time acts. In the case of Jacob, we don’t know exactly what he did but it does seem that he is promising to tithe once if God blesses him. The Church’s practice of ongoing, repetitious tithing simply cannot be validated by two one-time acts.

The only place in the Bible where ongoing, repetitious tithing can be found is in the Law of Moses. Those who were farming or practicing husbandry in Israel had a lifetime obligation to tithe the food that they produced. This ongoing food tithe to support the Mosaic Levitical ministry is often spiritualized to justify repetitious money tithing in support of Christian ministry. This justification is not found in the New Testament.

Christ’s statement about tithing reveals that the ongoing tithing of food is under the Law. Christ says nothing about His disciples practicing ongoing tithing of anything. While the writings of the apostles in the New Testament often speak of generous giving, they are silent about ongoing tithing of anything. The first apostolic council is also silent about ongoing tithing of anything but releases Gentile believers from any aspects of keeping the Law of Moses.

Everyone gives 10% of ongoing income. Considering the income element. Abraham tithes on the spoils of war, not his entire income. Abraham tithed the captured belongings of his defeated enemies. Additionally, Genesis reveals that Abraham didn’t even keep the ninety percent that was remaining. He returned those possessions to the King of Sodom. Abraham’s income, his possessions or any part of his own wealth wasn’t involved at all in his tithing. He had no increase to tithe on. In Jacobs case, we don’t know exactly what he did since all Genesis records is his promise to God. In other words, there is no support in the events before the Law that Christians should give ten percent of their ongoing income.

Nearly everyone that teaches tithing resorts to using the Law and prophets under the Law to teach it. Those that teach Christian tithing from the Law often neglect to reveal that only food produced was tithed on but never money. Only those who earned their livings by producing food tithed at all. Those Israelites who earned money by other means such as tent making, weaving, carpentry, money lending, fishing or many other occupations never tithed on their incomes since it was not commanded of them.

Christ does not change tithing food to tithing money. The writings of the apostles do not change tithing food to tithing money. The apostolic council releases the Gentile believers from any keeping of the Law. They certainly do not change tithing food to tithing money. The book of Hebrews does mention the Old Testament tithing of food but does not validate tithing money for believers today.

Finally, it should be obvious to the reader that this doctrine is pieced together from these various passages. Not a single passage in itself actually teaches what the Church practices today. Spiritualization of the Law is used to teach tithing. Reasoning that is not found in the Bible is used to justify Christians embracing a legalistic practice from the Old Testament. In more than 4000 years of recorded Biblical history, there is not a single recorded example of tithing that is similar to what the Church practices today. We recommend that every Christian renounce this unscriptural practice and reject any lingering fear, guilt or condemnation! God’s children have no debt to their Father to pay other than thanksgiving and praise. Their elder brother, the Lord Jesus Christ, has paid in full the debt. Christ will build His Church but only with the truth. He needs no help from a false doctrine that puts the Children of God under bondage and the curse of the Law. The children are free!

it tells here to renounce something that God's spirit has told me to do. That would be false within it's self. sometimes people will go to great measures to justify theirselves because they want to find a reason to excuse them from obeying the word.Jesus says in Matthew5:17-20 Think not that I am come to destroy the law,or the prophets: I am not come to destroy,but to fulfil. For verily I say unto you,Till heaven and earth pass,one jot or one tittle shall in no wise pass from the law,till all be fulfilled.Whosoever therefore shall break one the least commandments,and shall teach men so,he shall be called the least in the kingdom of heaven:but whosoever shall do and teach them,the same shall be called great in the kingdom of heaven.For I say unto you, that except your righteousness shall exceed the righteousness of the scribes and Pharisees ,ye shall in no case enter into the kingdom of heaven. We all know they fasted twice a week and paid tithes on all they had. Paying tithes isn't just my belief it's Bible.This that you have here is just a mere man's opinion of scriptures. I'd whether listen to Jesus wouldn't you?

 

[jiggyfly]

it tells here to renounce something that God's spirit has told me to do. That would be false within it's self. sometimes people will go to great measures to justify theirselves because they want to find a reason to excuse them from obeying the word.Jesus says in Matthew5:17-20 Think not that I am come to destroy the law,or the prophets: I am not come to destroy,but to fulfil. For verily I say unto you,Till heaven and earth pass,one jot or one tittle shall in no wise pass from the law,till all be fulfilled.Whosoever therefore shall break one the least commandments,and shall teach men so,he shall be called the least in the kingdom of heaven:but whosoever shall do and teach them,the same shall be called great in the kingdom of heaven.For I say unto you, that except your righteousness shall exceed the righteousness of the scribes and Pharisees ,ye shall in no case enter into the kingdom of heaven. We all know they fasted twice a week and paid tithes on all they had. Paying tithes isn't just my belief it's Bible.This that you have here is just a mere man's opinion of scriptures. I'd whether listen to Jesus wouldn't you?

So what do you know about the tithe? Do you know who was to tithe and to whom they were to tithe to? Do you know what they were to tithe and how often they were to tithe? Do you know where they were to tithe?

Wendy the scriptures are very clear, tithing is an old covenant practice that is not found practiced in the new covenant by believers. Jesus was instructing people who were under the old covenant still, the new covenant was established at Christ's death on the cross.

Let's just look at the law on tithing for a minute.
Deuteronomy 14:22-28
22*“You must set aside a tithe of your crops—one-tenth of all the crops you harvest each year. 23*Bring this tithe to the place the Lord your God chooses for his name to be honored, and eat it there in his presence. This applies to your tithes of grain, new wine, olive oil, and the firstborn males of your flocks and herds. The purpose of tithing is to teach you always to fear the Lord your God. 24*Now the place the Lord your God chooses for his name to be honored might be a long way from your home. 25*If so, you may sell the tithe portion of your crops and herds and take the money to the place the Lord your God chooses. 26*When you arrive, use the money to buy anything you want—an ox, a sheep, some wine, or beer. Then feast there in the presence of the Lord your God and celebrate with your household. 27*And do not forget the Levites in your community, for they have no inheritance as you do.
28*“At the end of every third year bring the tithe of all your crops and store it in the nearest town. 29*Give it to the Levites, who have no inheritance among you, as well as to the foreigners living among you, the orphans, and the widows in your towns, so they can eat and be satisfied. Then the Lord your God will bless you in all your work.


So first off we can clearly see that the farmer/rancher was to bring a tenth of their increase to the temple/ tabernacle and eat it themselves in God's presence annually and every third year give it to the Levites. What we do not see are Carpenters, fishermen, or merchants commanded to tithe for that matter we don't see mention of farmhands and or ranch hands commanded to tithe. Secondly the tithe was a tenth of their increase of the crops and herds only and not all that they had.

But the old covenant is longer for today, we now have a new and better covenant. In the old covenant the third year tithe was to be given to the priest so who are the priests in the new covenant? In the old covenant the tithe was carried to the temple, what is the temple in the new covenant? Look at what Peter says.

1Peter 2:4&5
4*Come to Christ, who is the living cornerstone of God’s temple. He was rejected by the people, but he is precious to God who chose him.
5*And now God is building you, as living stones, into his spiritual temple. What’s more, you are God’s holy priests, who offer the spiritual sacrifices that please him because of Jesus Christ.

Now let me show you the reality of new covenant giving.

Acts 2:43-47
43*A deep sense of awe came over them all, and the apostles performed many miraculous signs and wonders. 44*And all the believers met together constantly and shared everything they had. 45*They sold their possessions and shared the proceeds with those in need. 46*They worshiped together at the Temple each day, met in homes for the Lord’s Supper, and shared their meals with great joy and generosity—47*all the while praising God and enjoying the goodwill of all the people. And each day the Lord added to their group those who were being saved.

Being led by the old covenant laws and regulations is not the same as being led by HolySpirit.

Romans 7:6
6*But now we have been released from the law, for we died with Christ, and we are no longer captive to its power. Now we can really serve God, not in the old way by obeying the letter of the law, but in the new way, by the Spirit.

2Corinthians 3:6
6*He is the one who has enabled us to represent his new covenant. This is a covenant, not of written laws, but of the Spirit. The old way ends in death; in the new way, the Holy Spirit gives life.

Bottom line Wendy, it is impossible to practice old covenant worship without compromising who we are in the new covenant. Now with that said, if you want to give ten percent of your earnings to a religious organization thats just fine, but understand that as a new covenant priest it does not substitute or diminish your responsibility to give and share with those around you who are in need.

 

[Blademan]

Jesus Himself was telling us that paying tithes is something we are suppose to do.

So, what you're saying is that you choose to ignore the context? Ok, let's try this one:

Matt 8:4 And Jesus saith unto him, See thou tell no man; but go thy way, shew thyself to the priest, and offer the gift that Moses commanded, for a testimony unto them.

We see here Jesus instructing someone to offer up a sacrifice (gift) according to the Law. Now, according to your system of interpretation, we're also still required today to offer up sacrifices.

It's part of obeying the Word of God.

You better hustle on over to the spot where the temple was once located, and start obeying the Law. After all, Jesus said that we're supposed to offer up sacrifices of thanksgiving.:helppc:

 

[Blademan]

it tells here to renounce something that God's spirit has told me to do.

How do you figure the God described within the pages of the Bible told you to do that which is not at all in keeping with even His own Law? The Law didn't require wage-earners to tithe, so what is the Lord allegedly telling you to mimmick in order to tithe of your wages?

Also, how do you figure that the God described within the Bible would direct you to give your tithe in a direction that is diabolically opposed to the examples of His own Law?

sometimes people will go to great measures to justify theirselves because they want to find a reason to excuse them from obeying the word.

And sometimes people use God allegedly telling them to do something as a battering ram to silence any and all challenges to the inconsistencies within their testimonies. Prayer will never motivate the Lord to move someone to do that which is contrary to His written word.

 

[wendy28davis]

tithing

So, what you're saying is that you choose to ignore the context? Ok, let's try this one:

Matt 8:4 And Jesus saith unto him, See thou tell no man; but go thy way, shew thyself to the priest, and offer the gift that Moses commanded, for a testimony unto them.

We see here Jesus instructing someone to offer up a sacrifice (gift) according to the Law. Now, according to your system of interpretation, we're also still required today to offer up sacrifices.



You better hustle on over to the spot where the temple was once located, and start obeying the Law. After all, Jesus said that we're supposed to offer up sacrifices of thanksgiving.:helppc:

yes we are still offering up sacrifices. ourselves, we are suppose to be a living sacrifice daily unto the Lord.

 

[wendy28davis]

tithing

So what do you know about the tithe? Do you know who was to tithe and to whom they were to tithe to? Do you know what they were to tithe and how often they were to tithe? Do you know where they were to tithe?

Wendy the scriptures are very clear, tithing is an old covenant practice that is not found practiced in the new covenant by believers. Jesus was instructing people who were under the old covenant still, the new covenant was established at Christ's death on the cross.

Let's just look at the law on tithing for a minute.
Deuteronomy 14:22-28
22*“You must set aside a tithe of your crops—one-tenth of all the crops you harvest each year. 23*Bring this tithe to the place the Lord your God chooses for his name to be honored, and eat it there in his presence. This applies to your tithes of grain, new wine, olive oil, and the firstborn males of your flocks and herds. The purpose of tithing is to teach you always to fear the Lord your God. 24*Now the place the Lord your God chooses for his name to be honored might be a long way from your home. 25*If so, you may sell the tithe portion of your crops and herds and take the money to the place the Lord your God chooses. 26*When you arrive, use the money to buy anything you want—an ox, a sheep, some wine, or beer. Then feast there in the presence of the Lord your God and celebrate with your household. 27*And do not forget the Levites in your community, for they have no inheritance as you do.
28*“At the end of every third year bring the tithe of all your crops and store it in the nearest town. 29*Give it to the Levites, who have no inheritance among you, as well as to the foreigners living among you, the orphans, and the widows in your towns, so they can eat and be satisfied. Then the Lord your God will bless you in all your work.


So first off we can clearly see that the farmer/rancher was to bring a tenth of their increase to the temple/ tabernacle and eat it themselves in God's presence annually and every third year give it to the Levites. What we do not see are Carpenters, fishermen, or merchants commanded to tithe for that matter we don't see mention of farmhands and or ranch hands commanded to tithe. Secondly the tithe was a tenth of their increase of the crops and herds only and not all that they had.

But the old covenant is longer for today, we now have a new and better covenant. In the old covenant the third year tithe was to be given to the priest so who are the priests in the new covenant? In the old covenant the tithe was carried to the temple, what is the temple in the new covenant? Look at what Peter says.

1Peter 2:4&5
4*Come to Christ, who is the living cornerstone of God’s temple. He was rejected by the people, but he is precious to God who chose him.
5*And now God is building you, as living stones, into his spiritual temple. What’s more, you are God’s holy priests, who offer the spiritual sacrifices that please him because of Jesus Christ.

Now let me show you the reality of new covenant giving.

Acts 2:43-47
43*A deep sense of awe came over them all, and the apostles performed many miraculous signs and wonders. 44*And all the believers met together constantly and shared everything they had. 45*They sold their possessions and shared the proceeds with those in need. 46*They worshiped together at the Temple each day, met in homes for the Lord’s Supper, and shared their meals with great joy and generosity—47*all the while praising God and enjoying the goodwill of all the people. And each day the Lord added to their group those who were being saved.

Being led by the old covenant laws and regulations is not the same as being led by HolySpirit.

Romans 7:6
6*But now we have been released from the law, for we died with Christ, and we are no longer captive to its power. Now we can really serve God, not in the old way by obeying the letter of the law, but in the new way, by the Spirit.

2Corinthians 3:6
6*He is the one who has enabled us to represent his new covenant. This is a covenant, not of written laws, but of the Spirit. The old way ends in death; in the new way, the Holy Spirit gives life.

Bottom line Wendy, it is impossible to practice old covenant worship without compromising who we are in the new covenant. Now with that said, if you want to give ten percent of your earnings to a religious organization thats just fine, but understand that as a new covenant priest it does not substitute or diminish your responsibility to give and share with those around you who are in need.

I don't tithe to a religious organization. We tithe to the church we attend. that's what we are suppose to give, anything we give after that is consider an offering or a gift. our tithe money helps keep our lights on at the church, our running water,it buys our toilet paper, paper towels,hand soap, sunday school literature,it helps keep the maintenance up on our church,if our air unit goes out,or our floors need repair, and it takes care of our pastor.Our pastor put up his house to buy our church many years ago.our church and land is paid for,of course there will be property taxes always.Our pastor pays tithes and gives in offerings and helps people in need. He has even let me and my husband live with him and his wife when we were in need. we are suppose to keep up our place of worship.I feel sorry for the churches that have a congregation that don't believe in paying tithes.I mean where do you think that things you use in your church come from? is it the pastors full responsibility to supply the church with all these things?It starting to look like he'll be getting all the blessings and heavenly things from above, while others are wondering why they're in the bad shape they're in. tithes is Bibical whether anyone wants to acknowledge it or not.May God Help and Bless you!

 

[jiggyfly]

I don't tithe to a religious organization. We tithe to the church we attend. that's what we are suppose to give, anything we give after that is consider an offering or a gift. our tithe money helps keep our lights on at the church, our running water,it buys our toilet paper, paper towels,hand soap, sunday school literature,it helps keep the maintenance up on our church,if our air unit goes out,or our floors need repair, and it takes care of our pastor.Our pastor put up his house to buy our church many years ago.our church and land is paid for,of course there will be property taxes always.Our pastor pays tithes and gives in offerings and helps people in need. He has even let me and my husband live with him and his wife when we were in need. we are suppose to keep up our place of worship.I feel sorry for the churches that have a congregation that don't believe in paying tithes.I mean where do you think that things you use in your church come from? is it the pastors full responsibility to supply the church with all these things?It starting to look like he'll be getting all the blessings and heavenly things from above, while others are wondering why they're in the bad shape they're in. tithes is Bibical whether anyone wants to acknowledge it or not.May God Help and Bless you!

Well Wendy your entitled to your opinion but I have to say that your opinion is not scriptural at all. You seem to avoid commenting on the many scriptures quoted in this thread. Seems all that you know about tithing is only what religious tradition teaches. You seem to lack understanding concerning the new covenant and what it means for the believer. I have tried to lay it out as simple as I can and I'm not sure what else to do other than let it rest and hope that HolySpirit will reveal it in another way and time. God bless

 

[wendy28davis]

tithing

To All:

in the book of Acts chapter 4 starting at verse 32 says; And the multitude of them that believed were of one heart and of one soul:neither said any of them that ought of the things which he possessed was his own:but they had all things common. (see here they went as far as to have all things common.) Okay let's go to verse 34 it says;Neither was there any among them that lacked: for as many as were possessors of lands or houses sold them,and brought the prices of the things that were sold.Verse 35 And laid them down at the apostles' feet:and distribution was made unto every man according as he had need. Okay now they not only gave a tenth ,but all they had.How many here would do that today? Sell all they had to make someone equal unto them?If someone won't even pay tithes you can't tell me they would go all out to help someone like this.If you won't help support your church,then why would you give to anyone? The church is us,but we all know we have need of things in our church building to keep it in proper order for those who attend.Plus what about the widows and the fatherless? I guess that too is our pastors responsibility. No, as a church we are suppose to take care of one another.What about the Ten Commandments?I guess we're not suppose to go by that either because that's old testament right?:wink:I don't think so. Okay, now here is one in Luke18:18-25 And a certain ruler asked him,saying,Good Master,what shall I do to inherit eternal life?And Jesus said unto him, Why callest thou me good?none is good save one,that is,God.Thou knowest the commandments,Do not kill, Do not steal, Do not bear false witness,Honour thy father and thy mother,And he said,All these have I kept from my youth up.Now when Jesus heard these things,he said unto him,Yet lackest thou one thing:sell all that thou hast,and distribute unto the poor,and take up thy cross and follow me.Okay stop, Now Jesus Himself commanded not only to give a tenth,but to sell all thou hast.Do you believe Jesus?Verse 23 And when he heard this, he was very sorrowful:for he was very rich.And when Jesus saw that he was very sorrowful,he said,How hardly shall they that have riches enter into the kingdom of God!For it is easier for a camel to go through a needle's eye,than for a rich man to enter into the kingdom of God.Okay now Malachi is a book of prophecy = that means it talks of future things, chapter 3 and verse 10 says Bring ye all the tithes into the storehouse,that there may be meat in mine house,and prove me now herewith, saith the Lord of hosts,if I will not open you the windows of heaven,and pour you out a blessing,that there shall not be room enough to receive it. In the same book if you read chapter 3 verses 8-9 you'll see God calls it robbing Him if you don't pay tithes or give offerings.Again remember Malachi is a book of prophecy,it predicted John the Baptist coming in the spirit of Elijah. Now back to the Ten Commandments since some seem to think we are not required to live by the OT then why would we obey those commandments? That's right, no one does live by them ,they even got rid of them in the courthouses so they can continue the lies and not feel guilty.So sad.May God Have Mercy On Us For Our Folly! The Bible is Spiritually discern,so unless you have the True Spirit of God there will be scales on your eyes to the meaning of the scriptures.God Bless To All.

 

[spirit1st]

The NEW TESTAMENT DID not start until our LORD DIED .HE became the NEW TESTAMENT ,Which we are to live under !

We can reject it or obey our LORD!


Heb 9:15 And for this cause he is the mediator of the new testament, that by means of death, for the redemption of the transgressions that were under the first testament, they which are called might receive the promise of eternal inheritance.
Heb 9:16 For where a testament is, there must also of necessity be the death of the testator.
Heb 9:17 For a testament is of force after men are dead: otherwise it is of no strength at all while the testator liveth.

Heb 9:20 Saying, This is the blood of the testament which God hath enjoined unto you.


HE has to die and give HIS Body and BLOOD for us to become the NEW WAY of life for us!

you were taught by mankind ,who refuses to live by Faith !

Act 15:23 And they wrote letters by them after this manner; The apostles and elders and brethren send greeting unto the brethren which are of the Gentiles in Antioch and Syria and Cilicia.
Act 15:24 Forasmuch as we have heard, that certain which went out from us have troubled you with words, subverting your souls, saying, Ye must be circumcised, and keep the law: to whom we gave no such commandment:
Act 15:25 It seemed good unto us, being assembled with one accord, to send chosen men unto you with our beloved Barnabas and Paul,
Act 15:26 Men that have hazarded their lives for the name of our Lord Jesus Christ.
Act 15:27 We have sent therefore Judas and Silas, who shall also tell you the same things by mouth.
Act 15:28 For it seemed good to the Holy Ghost, and to us, to lay upon you no greater burden than these necessary things;
Act 15:29 That ye abstain from meats offered to idols, and from blood, and from things strangled, and from fornication: from which if ye keep yourselves, ye shall do well, Fare ye well.
Act 15:30 So when they were dismissed, they came to Antioch: and when they had gathered the multitude together, they delivered the epistle:


Jas 2:12 So speak ye, and so do, as they that shall be judged by the law of liberty.

Joh 8:36 If the Son therefore shall make you free, ye shall be free indeed.

 

[jiggyfly]

To All:

in the book of Acts chapter 4 starting at verse 32 says; And the multitude of them that believed were of one heart and of one soul:neither said any of them that ought of the things which he possessed was his own:but they had all things common. (see here they went as far as to have all things common.) Okay let's go to verse 34 it says;Neither was there any among them that lacked: for as many as were possessors of lands or houses sold them,and brought the prices of the things that were sold.Verse 35 And laid them down at the apostles' feet:and distribution was made unto every man according as he had need. Okay now they not only gave a tenth ,but all they had.How many here would do that today? Sell all they had to make someone equal unto them?If someone won't even pay tithes you can't tell me they would go all out to help someone like this.If you won't help support your church,then why would you give to anyone? The church is us,but we all know we have need of things in our church building to keep it in proper order for those who attend.Plus what about the widows and the fatherless? I guess that too is our pastors responsibility. No, as a church we are suppose to take care of one another.What about the Ten Commandments?I guess we're not suppose to go by that either because that's old testament right?:wink:I don't think so. Okay, now here is one in Luke18:18-25 And a certain ruler asked him,saying,Good Master,what shall I do to inherit eternal life?And Jesus said unto him, Why callest thou me good?none is good save one,that is,God.Thou knowest the commandments,Do not kill, Do not steal, Do not bear false witness,Honour thy father and thy mother,And he said,All these have I kept from my youth up.Now when Jesus heard these things,he said unto him,Yet lackest thou one thing:sell all that thou hast,and distribute unto the poor,and take up thy cross and follow me.Okay stop, Now Jesus Himself commanded not only to give a tenth,but to sell all thou hast.Do you believe Jesus?Verse 23 And when he heard this, he was very sorrowful:for he was very rich.And when Jesus saw that he was very sorrowful,he said,How hardly shall they that have riches enter into the kingdom of God!For it is easier for a camel to go through a needle's eye,than for a rich man to enter into the kingdom of God.Okay now Malachi is a book of prophecy = that means it talks of future things, chapter 3 and verse 10 says Bring ye all the tithes into the storehouse,that there may be meat in mine house,and prove me now herewith, saith the Lord of hosts,if I will not open you the windows of heaven,and pour you out a blessing,that there shall not be room enough to receive it. In the same book if you read chapter 3 verses 8-9 you'll see God calls it robbing Him if you don't pay tithes or give offerings.Again remember Malachi is a book of prophecy,it predicted John the Baptist coming in the spirit of Elijah. Now back to the Ten Commandments since some seem to think we are not required to live by the OT then why would we obey those commandments? That's right, no one does live by them ,they even got rid of them in the courthouses so they can continue the lies and not feel guilty.So sad.May God Have Mercy On Us For Our Folly! The Bible is Spiritually discern,so unless you have the True Spirit of God there will be scales on your eyes to the meaning of the scriptures.God Bless To All.

Acts 4 makes no mention of tithing you just assume they tithed. The prophet Malachi was talking to the priests, you should try reading the whole context of scripture instead of picking a verse here and there that you can try to support your opinion. You quoted some great new covenant scriptures about giving and none concerning tithing.

I even showed you scriptures giving you the correct old covenant laws from God on tithing and yet you insist on conforming to the religious traditional teaching of man concerning the tithe. You have based most of your opinion on Mathew 23:23 and suggest that Jesus was talking to you. I doubt that you even read the whole chapter to capture the context of what is being said, if you had I think your opinion would change. Jesus was talking to pharisees, false teachers, blind guides and hypocrites, so Wendy which one of these do you consider yourself to be????

I am not sure why you refuse to apply the scriptures within the context that they are written, but I can't see continuing with this while you continue to use scripture out of context.