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The Trinity

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Because it is ANTI CHRIST doctrine.


You proved you can't see truth when it's right in front of you. And I am not angry just frustrated by stubbornness. But why should I try to make you see what you are
not allowed to see? Lest I find myself trying to undo Gods decision.


If you can't see the many scriptures used to prove the point in the post then you sir are spiritually as blind as a bat.
And having said that I bid you farewell for I am just wasting my time.
Hi Samson2020, please do not go yet. This discussion is my favourite topic in Christianity ... and [mostly] support your view...

I read what you say about the strange anomalies that trinity throws up and agree that they make no sense. I agree that Jesus was born in the same manner as Adam, and is why he is called, the LAST ADAM. I don’t see trinity believers upholding this clear scriptures because they are afraid of the truth.
Oh, and by the way, ‘Son of God’ means:
  • ‘He who does the works of the Father’
A TRUE SON does exactly what his father commands, instructs, directs, asks, him to do. A true ‘Sons does not ‘spiritually’ have to be a PROCREATED offspring... Paul, the Apostle, ADOPTED the runaway slave, Onesimus (Philemon 1) AS HIS SON, because Onesimus did EXACTLY and DUTIFULLY what Paul taught him to do. This scenario is not related as a simple passing event... it is designed to uphold the scriptures...
Adam, is described as ‘Son of God’ (Luke 3:38). Adam, up until he sinned, followed the spirit of a God exactly as he was commanded. After sinning, he lost his place as ‘Son’.
Jesus stated to the Jews that he had not called himself, ‘God’ when he had only said that he was ‘the SON of God’... because... he was ‘doing the works of the Father’.
And, scriptures further states that:
  • ‘All who follow the Spirit [of God] are CHILDREN of God’
Finally, the holy angels are [Spirit] ‘SONS’ of God because... they dutifully do the works of their creator and God - Adam, and Jesus, and those destined for eternal life, are, were, and will be (as appropriate) HUMAN SONS of God.... because... !!

You are right that Jesus, at his baptism at the river Jordan, was MADE SON of God and this is qualified by the Father saying:
  • ‘This is my Son in whom I am well pkeased’
  • ‘This day I have become to you, a Father, and you have become to me, A SON’
I warrant that this latter statement is an ADOPTION DECLARATION. Hence, Jesus was ‘ADOPTED’ as ‘SON OF GOD’ - a human Being who fully followed the Spirit of his Father... notice that until he was baptised with Holy Spirit he did no miracles... he had no power to do so! Even afterwards, he was TEMPTED FIRST to see if he would MISUSE those powers...

If Jesus was GIVEN powers of God, what was he BEFORE he was given those powers? A question no trinitarian has answered to me so far - and I’ve been asking for YEARS!
 
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If Jesus was GIVEN powers of God, what was he BEFORE he was given those powers? A question no trinitarian has answered to me so far - and I’ve been asking for YEARS!

The simple answer is a HUMAN BEING. He however did not have a carnal mind as God his Father could not pass that trait as he was not at enmity with himself. The curses
of Eden are passed through the Father to the child.

I find this almost exhausting, probably like you, in that the so called defenders of Trinity doctrine really don't support anything they say just toss out a few verses with
no understanding of their meaning and refuse to even consider they are WRONG.

They will defend with nothing unto the death and say that you have presented nothing even though you use verse after verse after verse to prove their doctrine false.
I don't mind having a conversation with a true seeker of truth, but most are not seeking anything except to shut you down or divert the conversation away from the truth
then beat their chests like KING KONG as though they actually accomplished something, and I guess they did. KEPT THEIR EYES CLOSED TO THE TRUTH.

Ask away but I have finished speaking to David for now. So anything he posts will not be answered by me. I have already answered everything he has several times.
 
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The simple answer is a HUMAN BEING. He however did not have a carnal mind as God his Father could not pass that trait as he was not at enmity with himself. The curses
of Eden are passed through the Father to the child.

I find this almost exhausting, probably like you, in that the so called defenders of Trinity doctrine really don't support anything they say just toss out a few verses with
no understanding of their meaning and refuse to even consider they are WRONG.

They will defend with nothing unto the death and say that you have presented nothing even though you use verse after verse after verse to prove their doctrine false.
I don't mind having a conversation with a true seeker of truth, but most are not seeking anything except to shut you down or divert the conversation away from the truth
then beat their chests like KING KONG as though they actually accomplished something, and I guess they did. KEPT THEIR EYES CLOSED TO THE TRUTH.

Ask away but I have finished speaking to David for now. So anything he posts will not be answered by me. I have already answered everything he has several times.
Yes, I agree that Jesus was a human Being - pure and innocent, sinless and Holy.

Please do not lose heart - it is exactly what Satan desires - that you should get so frustrated that you wonder if it is YOU who is wrong! So angered by the futility that you get burn-out repeating the same truth to deaf ears and blind eyes. Honestly, I see your ‘Angered’ capitals and beginnings of insults .... beware: Thats what they want you to do... it will draw the moderators to throw you out!!

I, myself have been through all that - even physically: I visited a church (Pentecostal) searching for a communion group. I couldn’t believe what I heard being taught. I asked questions but got tight lipped responses - nobody knew anything!!!!!! The place was otherwise wonderful: great people, charismatic outpourings, everyone loving each other in brotherhood. I prayed and asked if I should join this church... a few days later I received an unprompted letter saying:
  • ‘Do not come back to this church / you are an Anti-Christ ....!’
I wept real tears... through Jesus Christ, by the Holy Spirit of God, ALMIGHTY GOD HAD SPOKEN TO ME... (not the Anti-Christ part!):
  • ‘Thank you, Jesus Christ Lord, thank you Yhwh Father God’
But where can I fellowship? Everywhere speaks trinity, elsewhere speaks JW, and a few speak Mormon! I still haven’t found a place...! But online offers a possibility - yet again, nearly all are trinitarian based... and what a load of nonsense is spoken and discussed and debated and argued????

Samson, you are the FIRST I have encountered that speaks a [kind of] truth that mirrors my own reading. Thank you brother... but don’t think I will agree in total as I can see you too have some misunderstandings... forgive me if I present a fuller truth to you - let us work together to put a more cohesive bit of flesh on the bones of gospel truth.

... concerning a church... did Jesus not say that we are to worship God, the Father, not in a building, not on a mountain... but ‘In Spirit and Truth’... basically,
  • “Anywhere and everywhere - as long as it is with righteousness, in glory, in truth, in non-selfishness, in sacrifice, in reverence, in repentance, in acknowledgement of almighty God’s majesty....” to wit: In the Name of Jesus Christ!
 
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Yes, I agree that Jesus was a human Being - pure and innocent, sinless and Holy.

Please do not lose heart - it is exactly what Satan desires - that you should get so frustrated that you wonder if it is YOU who is wrong! So angered by the futility that you get burn-out repeating the same truth to deaf ears and blind eyes. Honestly, I see your ‘Angered’ capitals and beginnings of insults .... beware: Thats what they want you to do... it will draw the moderators to throw you out!!

I, myself have been through all that - even physically: I visited a church (Pentecostal) searching for a communion group. I couldn’t believe what I heard being taught. I asked questions but got tight lipped responses - nobody knew anything!!!!!! The place was otherwise wonderful: great people, charismatic outpourings, everyone loving each other in brotherhood. I prayed and asked if I should join this church... a few days later I received an unprompted letter saying:
  • ‘Do not come back to this church / you are an Anti-Christ ....!’
I wept real tears... through Jesus Christ, by the Holy Spirit of God, ALMIGHTY GOD HAD SPOKEN TO ME... (not the Anti-Christ part!):
  • ‘Thank you, Jesus Christ Lord, thank you Yhwh Father God’
But where can I fellowship? Everywhere speaks trinity, elsewhere speaks JW, and a few speak Mormon! I still haven’t found a place...! But online offers a possibility - yet again, nearly all are trinitarian based... and what a load of nonsense is spoken and discussed and debated and argued????

Samson, you are the FIRST I have encountered that speaks a [kind of] truth that mirrors my own reading. Thank you brother... but don’t think I will agree in total as I can see you too have some misunderstandings... forgive me if I present a fuller truth to you - let us work together to put a more cohesive bit of flesh on the bones of gospel truth.

... concerning a church... did Jesus not say that we are to worship God, the Father, not in a building, not on a mountain... but ‘In Spirit and Truth’... basically,
  • “Anywhere and everywhere - as long as it is with righteousness, in glory, in truth, in non-selfishness, in sacrifice, in reverence, in repentance, in acknowledgement of almighty God’s majesty....” to wit: In the Name of Jesus Christ!


Well spoken my brother. I too have been tossed out of several "churches" of different denominations. Your fine as long as you agree with what they say and keep your mouth shut. But when the Lord sends you in you go. You may not want to but you go. Sometimes it's actually a word for you through them. Most times it's showing you what
they say that is opposite of what the Spirit has taught you. If you speak up you know your only trying to show them error but like he said they will hate you and even kill you
thinking they are doing God a favor.
Thing is when one is stuck in Church the Lord will not give them the Hidden Manna reserved for the overcomer. Church is something that needs to be overcome in it's
current organizational form. A spiritual exercise if you will. He shows you the truth, you hear what they say then comes a decision GO OR STAY? Do I love the truth more
or the fellowship and comradery more? You go to be alone as Jesus in the wilderness, Paul in the desert, John on Patmos, and there the revelations will flow as the relationship gets stronger and stronger. When you know the voice of he who teaches you, that comes from inside you, that is greater than he who is in the world, you find yourself freed from the games of "church",and have become the Church 24/7. A true disciple of the Lord Jesus Christ. Some of what we do is not meant for those we speak/post to but rather those who read and or hear as you, and I would assume others that are not ready for persecutions just yet so they remain silent. But how can they choose the truth if they never hear/see it? Or unless God allow it.
When the responses we get are nearly 100% negative we wonder, am I fighting against God by trying to reveal this error? Or is there another purpose that I cannot or do not know of yet. As in this case it seems there was but it took several weeks to find that purpose.
And I would say that as we see in part and know in part that none of us has everything nailed down perfectly. But we have the spirit of truth that will guide us into the
whole truth eventually. As long as were willing to be taught. Repent-change your mind.
I had never heard of trinity doctrine until recently and I have been filled with the Spirit nearly 20 years and had encounters with fellow believers, casually, almost weekly, ever since. I can suppose it was my turn to learn about the false doctrine and to defend the truth for myself. Learned a few things in the process.
Guess the subject just never came up on their end and I wouldn't have ever asked. I assumed that when they said they believed that God raised his Son from the dead they
knew it was his SON. Guess that assumption was wrong. But the deceived are many many more than the hearers of the truth, so not surprised by the reactions.

The thing I would get tossed over is what they like to refer to as Universal salvation. They say they chose so everybody else deserves the fruits of their own choice as well.
I say no. God chose you therefore you can't say anything but thank you. Otherwise you try to justify his choice of you by making it about your choice. Chicken or the egg.
Self righteousness. Also a thing to be overcome with a reward for doing so.
There are many many verses in the Bible that speak to this very thing and yet those that call themselves Christians actually want the rest that do not do the same works
they do roasted for eternity and preach just that. I guess that to them is freedom??? Could be the fear factor keeps the sheep in the pen as well. Or the wolves in the pulpit actually believe what they preach. Or just simple spiritual blindness.

As God is Sovereign over all, the only way to get tossed off the site is if it is his will as no one can go against that. So not scared in the least. Kinda like the letter you received,
you got freed from going back!! My comments are not directed to the moderators and they are not derogatory. Just capped for emphasis so when they are read they stand out and won't get missed and usually scripture blown up to show the picture it paints. A picture is worth a thousand words and sometimes requires that many to paint it when posting.

Keep in touch. Back line if you prefer. Pick your subject and lets get to the truth.

In the Lord Jesus' name AMEN.
 
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I agree that Jesus was born in the same manner as Adam, and is why he is called, the LAST ADAM. I don’t see trinity believers upholding this clear scriptures because they are afraid of the truth.
47 The first man is of the earth, earthy: the second man is the Lord from heaven.
 
Loyal
God the Father, Jesus Christ His Son, and the Holy Spirit = tri-unity = Godhead.

Jesus Christ has Always been the Son of God -- He came to this earth for those 33 yrs. as God incarnate (God in the flesh) -- He came to show mankind the Father / His Father / via the miracles -- He died on the cross, shed His blood for our sins/ was buried and then rose again bodily and was seen by others (to be saved we believe this in our hearts and confess with our mouths) -- and then He, Jesus Christ, ascended back up into heaven.

When He had John baptize Him, the dove came down -- God the Father was acknowledging Him as being His Son. He was not 'becoming' His Son. He did not have to earn sonship -- He always Was the 2nd person of the Godhead.
 
Loyal
concerning a church... did Jesus not say that we are to worship God, the Father, not in a building, not on a mountain... but ‘In Spirit and Truth’... basically,

consider this
the bible clearly tells us to worship God and only God. And we do know that Jesus was worshiped when he was borne by the wise man. we do know that he was worshiped several times and never once did he tell them to stop. We can only conclude by this evidence that Jesus is God in the flesh.


Matthew 4:10
Then Jesus said to him, “Be gone, Satan! For it is written, “‘You shall worship the Lord your God and him only shall you serve.’”



Matthew 28:17
And when they saw him they worshiped him, but some doubted
.

John 20:28
Thomas answered him, “My Lord and my God!


Matthew 28:9
And behold, Jesus met them and said, “Greetings!” And they came up and took hold of his feet and worshiped him.
 
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I believe God the Father, created all things. His word/torah/instruction became flesh for our salvation called Jesus/Yeshua. I do believe His spirit is communes with us, giving us His instruction and divine revelation. I don't recognize these aspects of our creator in a singular formal way, cus I dont believe I know that is all He is.

We know who God is based on His character and how He reveals Himself to mankind throughout history, as presented in the scriptures. But don't think I can comprehend the fullness and reality of who He is because I am flesh within time and don't have the capacity to fully understand a timeless self-sustaining spirit.

I understand His nature and attributes,and my own personal experiences and relationship with Him. That's pretty much all I think I need to know. (Til He says otherwise)

For as the heavens are higher than the earth, so are my ways higher than your ways and my thoughts than your thoughts - Isaiah 55:9
 
Loyal
@JustAskin -- It's true -- no one Is told to worship in a building or on a mountain -- but 'worship in spirit and in truth'. But concerning the use Of a church -- haven't you ever heard people in a church building doing their worshiping in spirit and in truth." I certainly have.

The Jews did their worshiping in a synogogue -- why shouldn't the rest of us be able to use a building.
 
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