STOP Asking God To Forgive You

[dannibear]

I knew what you were trying to say Tranquility
It might have been worded a bit differently but
I see where you were going with it. I have the same
issue. When I have committed a sin, I don't pray to God
for awhile thinking I am unworthy of approaching Him,
that He would never again look upon the likes of me
or bother with tiny insignificant meager me.

This post says to me:
STOP ACTING LIKE JESUS DIED AND NEVER ROSE AGAIN.

He is living, He has defeated death and sin and satan,
and I should stop dragging my feet across the ground
when I could accept His forgiveness and begin carrying
that cross once more. After all, He said to pick up
our cross daily and follow Him. Not 'once and if you mess
up your out of the race', not 'you have 3 strikes and your
out' He said daily.

Luke 9:23

 

[SpiritLedEd]

I John is to Isreal.

My study bible says that 1 John was not addressed to any particular church; that it was probably a circular letter passed around to churches in the province of Asia to combat Gnosticism.

SLE

 

[B-A-C]

Hmmm....
The more I read this thread, the more it seems like another onced saved, always....

The problem with living like all sins are forgiven, even if I don't ask for forgiveness is that we tend to forget about our sins, downplay them, pretend like they don't matter and just keep on living the way we were living before. With this mindset, it's really just a license to sin because after all "we're forgiven".

Jesus told us to pray like this...
Mat 6:9 "Pray, then, in this way: 'Our Father who is in heaven, Hallowed be Your name.
Mat 6:10 'Your kingdom come. Your will be done, On earth as it is in heaven.
Mat 6:11 'Give us this day our daily bread.
Mat 6:12 'And forgive us our sins, as we also have forgiven those who have sinned against us.
Mat 6:13 'And do not lead us into temptation, but deliver us from evil. [For Yours is the kingdom and the power and the glory forever. Amen.]'
Mat 6:14 "For if you forgive others for their transgressions, your heavenly Father will also forgive you.
Mat 6:15 "But if you do not forgive others, then your Father will not forgive your transgressions.

Its sounds like we should ask for forgiveness every time we pray.

Jesus also said that even though we are forgiven and washed by the blood, we still need the occassional foot washing.
Joh 13:8 Peter *said to Him, "Never shall You wash my feet!" Jesus answered him, "If I do not wash you, you have no part with Me."
Joh 13:9 Simon Peter *said to Him, "Lord, then wash not only my feet, but also my hands and my head."
Joh 13:10 Jesus *said to him, "He who has bathed needs only to wash his feet, but is completely clean; and you are clean, but not all of you."

James 5:16 tells us to confess ours sins so that we may be healed.

1 John 1:9 tells us that IF we confess our sins he will forgive us, it doesn't say he will forgive us if we don't. (yes there is grace for the little sins we forget to ask for forgiveness for along the way, but that is different from completely neglecting asking for forgiveness).

Can a Christian believer have unconfessed sin in his life that is held against him by God?
1Cor 11:27 Therefore whoever eats the bread or drinks the cup of the Lord in an unworthy manner, shall be guilty of the body and the blood of the Lord.
1Cor 11:28 But a man must examine himself, and in so doing he is to eat of the bread and drink of the cup.
1Cor 11:29 For he who eats and drinks, eats and drinks judgment to himself if he does not judge the body rightly.
1Cor 11:30 For this reason many among you are weak and sick, and a number sleep.

Rom 6:1 What shall we say then? Are we to continue in sin so that grace may increase?
Rom 6:2 May it never be! How shall we who died to sin still live in it?

Psa 32:3 When I kept silent about my sin, my body wasted away Through my groaning all day long.

Psa 32:5 I acknowledged my sin to You, And my iniquity I did not hide; I said, "I will confess my transgressions to the LORD"; And You forgave the guilt of my sin. Selah.

 

[Thiscrosshurts]

Jesus told us to pray like this...
Mat 6:9 "Pray, then, in this way: 'Our Father who is in heaven, Hallowed be Your name.
Mat 6:10 'Your kingdom come. Your will be done, On earth as it is in heaven.
Mat 6:11 'Give us this day our daily bread.
Mat 6:12 'And forgive us our sins, as we also have forgiven those who have sinned against us.
Mat 6:13 'And do not lead us into temptation, but deliver us from evil. [For Yours is the kingdom and the power and the glory forever. Amen.]'
Mat 6:14 "For if you forgive others for their transgressions, your heavenly Father will also forgive you.
Mat 6:15 "But if you do not forgive others, then your Father will not forgive your transgressions.

So, according to this prayer,what is the requirement to be forgiven?
Are we asking God to forgive us unconditionally or is it dependent on our relationships with others?

Scripture leads me to believe God has forgiven and now it's up to us to apply or enforce that forgiveness by forgiving others.
How someone deals with being forgiven is between God and them(actually between others and them).
I am not going to manipulate scripture to please my carnal understanding.

What ever is not of faith is sin and I don't see forgiveness as a license to walk in the flesh.I see forgiveness as the freedom to walk in the Spirit by faith.

 

[dannibear]

Hmmm....
The more I read this thread, the more it seems like another onced saved, always....

And hopefully this thread is not as long and
drawn out now that you bring up that point.
I am gonna monitor threads with a more
microscopic point of view when I graduate
to determine the fine line between a discussion
and debate. I wish for TJ to be an oasis for
those who wish to fellowship online with other
believers and praise Jesus, not for members to
separate themselves based on differing opinions
when we are supposed to be one in Christ.

 

[B-A-C]

So, according to this prayer,what is the requirement to be forgiven?

Simply asking for it.
James 4:2b - You have not because you ask not.not ask.

Are we asking God to forgive us unconditionally or is it dependent on our relationships with others?

It doesn't depends on others, but we do have to continually ask for it.

Scripture leads me to believe God has forgiven and now it's up to us to apply or enforce that forgiveness by forgiving others.
How someone deals with being forgiven is between God and them(actually between others and them).
I am not going to manipulate scripture to please my carnal understanding.

Some would say that's why you haven't given a single scripture to support this. Nor can I find a single scripture to support it.
Our walk is daily, we need continual reneweing of the spirit. It isn't a one time thing that just happens and it's over. If we say we have no sin we are liars and we make him a liar.

What ever is not of faith is sin and I don't see forgiveness as a license to walk in the flesh.I see forgiveness as the freedom to walk in the Spirit by faith.

Ahhh... but is forgiveness a one time thing, or do we need to continue to ask for it?

 

[B-A-C]

And hopefully this thread is not as long and
drawn out now that you bring up that point.
I am gonna monitor threads with a more
microscopic point of view when I graduate
to determine the fine line between a discussion
and debate. I wish for TJ to be an oasis for
those who wish to fellowship online with other
believers and praise Jesus, not for members to
separate themselves based on differing opinions
when we are supposed to be one in Christ.

We are to ready to reprove rebuke and reprove in season and out of season.
I am appointed for the defense of the Gospel.
We are to silence those who oppose the Gospel.

What you say is true, when people oppose scripture, we are not one with them, nor should we be.

 

[Thiscrosshurts]

Some would say that's why you haven't given a single scripture to support this. Nor can I find a single scripture to support it.

The idea of one man atoning for the sins of all is found all over scripture.
Remember the Lamb was slain from the foundation of the world.

The priest entered once for all the people:
Numbers 15:25 And the priest shall make an atonement for all the congregation of the children of Israel, and it shall be forgiven them; for it is ignorance: and they shall bring their offering, a sacrifice made by fire unto the LORD, and their sin offering before the LORD, for their ignorance:

Our sin offering(request for forgiveness and cleansing and right standing and relationship) is the Lamb that God provided.

This mans' sins were forgiven simply because his friends had faith in the finished work of the Lamb of God:
Luke 5:19 And when they could not find by what way they might bring him in because of the multitude, they went upon the housetop, and let him down through the tiling with his couch into the midst before Jesus.
Luke 5:20 And when he saw their faith, he said unto him, Man, thy sins are forgiven thee.
Luke 5:23 Whether is easier, to say, Thy sins be forgiven thee; or to say, Rise up and walk?

This woman poured oil on the Lord but we are not told she asked for forgiveness.
Luke 7:48 And he said unto her, Thy sins are forgiven.
And they that sat at meat with him began to say within themselves, Luke 7:49 Who is this that forgiveth sins also?
Luke 7:50 And he said to the woman, Thy faith hath saved thee; go in peace.
The religious folk do tend to get upset by the idea of Jesus being able to Forgive.
I always thought the word forgive had the "for" in it to show that it is done before being asked.If I wait until someone asks me wouldn't that be aftergiving?

Matthew 6:12 And forgive us our debts, as we forgive our debtors.
I could just as easily say"reveal the Lamb's work in my life that I might reveal it to them to whom I have been sent".

 

[jari]

The religious folk do tend to get upset by the idea of Jesus being able to Forgive.

yes because if your forgiven why strive then?
but since we have grace i dont think we need to say sorry all the time either.

 

[B-A-C]

The idea of one man atoning for the sins of all is found all over scripture.
Remember the Lamb was slain from the foundation of the world.

The question never was, can/will God forgive us.
There is no doubt that he can and he will.
The question was do we have to ask for it.
Do you have any scripture saying we don't?

 

[jari]

Do you have any scripture saying we don't?

is there any scripture that you do?

 

[SpiritLedEd]

The question never was, can/will God forgive us.
There is no doubt that he can and he will.
The question was do we have to ask for it.

"If you forgive men when they sin against you, your heavenly Father will forgive you." (Mt 6:14)

A sin doesn't become a sin until its been committed. Therefore, the victim cannot forgive until there's an adverse action to forgive. God's forgiveness flows into us when we ask for it and, by habit, forgive those who sin against us when the offense is complete and we are aware of it.

SLE

 

[Chad]

"If you forgive men when they sin against you, your heavenly Father will forgive you." (Mt 6:14)

A sin doesn't become a sin until its been committed. Therefore, the victim cannot forgive until there's an adverse action to forgive. God's forgiveness flows into us when we ask for it and, by habit, forgive those who sin against us when the offense is complete and we are aware of it.

SLE

This I believe is the perfect answer to whether or not we need to continually ask for forgiveness. You hit the nail on the head brother.

I don't know about the OP and those who agree with the OP, but how is it your conscience doesn't weigh on you heavily if you know you have sinned, wronging someone or such?

The Scripture Ed quoted hits the truth.

 

[jari]

(Heb 10:16) This is the covenant that I will make with them after those days, saith the Lord, I will put my laws into their hearts, and in their minds will I write them;

(Heb 10:17) And their sins and iniquities will I remember no more.


seems like God doesn't remember our sins and iniquities anymore. as the first condition was to enter the new coveant with God, to have Him forget our sins.

so if it's true we are in new coveant then it's also true God doesn't remember our sins anymore.


or did He just forget past sins? and now it's piling up again and need to be asked to be forgiven and forgetten?

why would it be if entering His coveant forgave us the sins in the first place and made God say He will not remember them anymore?

 

[Chad]

Ok Jari. Please explain the verses brother Ed posted then. What do they say to you?

What about if you wronged someone (that's still sin)? Would you ask them to forgive you? How much more GOD? Yes, the same Jesus who paid the price for your sins, is the one you and I continually sin against. Is it too hard to ask forgiveness?

Commentary on Hebrews 10
Hebrews - Chapter 10 - Barnes' Notes on the New Testament on StudyLight.org

1 John 1:9 “If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just and will forgive us our sins and purify us from all unrighteousness.”

A good article also:
Do Christians have to keep asking for forgiveness for their sins?

 

[jari]

Ok Jari. Please explain the verses brother Ed posted then. What do they say to you?

What about if you wronged someone (that's still sin)? Would you ask them to forgive you? How much more GOD? Yes, the same Jesus who paid the price for your sins, is the one you and I continually sin against. Is it too hard to ask forgiveness?

Commentary on
Hebrews - Chapter 10 - Barnes' Notes on the New Testament on StudyLight.org

“If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just and will forgive us our sins and purify us from all unrighteousness.”

A good article also:
Do Christians have to keep asking for forgiveness for their sins?

but only humans are hurt by our sin, God isnt. so that's one reason why it would be different and no saying sorries are needed....



(Job 35:6) If thou sinnest, what doest thou against him? or if thy transgressions be multiplied, what doest thou unto him?

(Job 35:7) If thou be righteous, what givest thou him? or what receiveth he of thine hand?

(Job 35:8) Thy wickedness may hurt a man as thou art; and thy righteousness may profit the son of man.

 

[Chad]

but only humans are hurt by our sin, God isnt.

Jari, think about this very carefully. What did Jesus do on the Cross? If sin didn't hurt GOD, he would not care for sin. How can you possible even say sin doesn't hurt GOD?

Seek wisdom in prayer.

 

[jari]

Jari, think about this very carefully. What did Jesus do on the Cross? If sin didn't hurt GOD, he would not care for sin. How can you possible even say sin doesn't hurt GOD?

Seek wisdom in prayer.

i posted verses from job 35, what else there is to say?

in jewish law asking for forgiveness wasn't the way, it was the sacrafices for sins. that's why it talks about how Jesus is sacrafice for sins:

(Isa 53:10) Yet it pleased the LORD to bruise him; he hath put him to grief: when thou shalt make his soul an offering for sin, he shall see his seed, he shall prolong his days, and the pleasure of the LORD shall prosper in his hand.

(Isa 53:11) He shall see of the travail of his soul, and shall be satisfied: by his knowledge shall my righteous servant justify many; for he shall bear their iniquities.


(Isa 53:12) Therefore will I divide him a portion with the great, and he shall divide the spoil with the strong; because he hath poured out his soul unto death: and he was numbered with the transgressors; and he bare the sin of many, and made intercession for the transgressors.


and we are to make His soul an offering for our sins Isa 53:10. so that the sin is dealt with.

and because forgiveness of sins happens only through blood shed in the bible we actually have no other way to be forgiven than Jesus blood.


(Heb 10:17) And their sins and iniquities will I remember no more.

(Heb 10:18) Now where remission of these is,there is no more offering for sin.

(Heb 10:19) Having therefore, brethren, boldness to enter into the holiest by the blood of Jesus,

since Jesus blood is shed for us, and this is the remission, there's no more offering for our sin. Heb 10:18

Jesus blood is the final offering for our sin. there's nothing that could best that nor does it lack anything.

for bad conscience we are told to:


(Heb 10:22) Let us draw near with a true heart in full assurance of faith, having our hearts sprinkled from an evil conscience, and our bodies washed with pure water.

God bless you

 

[B-A-C]

i posted verses from job 35, what else there is to say?

in jewish law asking for forgiveness wasn't the way, it was the sacrafices for sins. that's why it talks about how Jesus is sacrafice for sins:
(Heb 10:22) Let us draw near with a true heart in full assurance of faith, having our hearts sprinkled from an evil conscience, and our bodies washed with pure water.

God bless you

LOL, well yes this is true. However remember, the sacrifices of the old testament weren't a one time thing. They were done as often "as needed" (I would guess, sometimes daily). It wasn't oh I told a lie, I need to go sacrifice a dove, ok, that's done, now I'm good for the rest of my life whenever I tell a lie again.
No, if you sinned again, you needed to sacrifice again and confess your sin (the priest would need to know why he is doing the sacrifice) and ask for forgiveness (it was priest talking to God back then, not you directly). The good news is, we don't have to do animals sacrifices anymore, and we don't have to go through a priest to ask God for forgiveness anymore. All of these things are covered in Hebrews.
However it does say that we need to keep confessing and asking for forgiveness, that part didn't change.
In a way.. it's reminds us of what Jesus was sacrificed for. He is our high priest after all. Why do we need a priest if there is no more sacrifice? Because we still need to confess.

 

[will]

yes because if your forgiven why strive then?
but since we have grace i dont think we need to say sorry all the time either.

We may not *need* to say sorry all the time, but I think we will end up *wanting* to do that.

Imagine when you are in a close relationship with someone, and you realize that you did something that hurt that person, wouldn't you *want* to say sorry? or would you skip it because you think it's not needed?