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Should Women Be Pastors and Elders?

Chad

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Should Women Be Pastors and Elders?

by Matt Slick

In a social climate of complete equality in all things, the biblical teaching of only allowing men to be pastors and elders is not popular. Many feminist organizations denounce this position as antiquated and chauvinistic. In addition, many Christian churches have adopted the "politically correct" social standard and have allowed women pastors and elders in the church. But the question remains, is this biblical?

My answer to this question is, "No, women are not to be pastors and elders." Many may not like that answer, but it is, I believe, an accurate representation of the biblical standard. You make the decision after reading this paper.

First of all, women are under-appreciated and under-utilized in the church. There are many gifted women who might very well do a better job at preaching and teaching than many men. However, it isn't gifting that is the issue, but God's order and calling. What does the Bible say? We cannot come to God's word with a social agenda and make it fit our wants. Instead, we must change and adapt to what it says.

In the beginning God created the heavens and the earth, the garden of Eden, and Adam and Eve. He put Adam in the garden and gave him the authority to name all the animals. Afterwards, God made Eve as a helper to Adam.1 This is an important concept because Paul refers to the order of creation in his epistle to Timothy when he discusses the relationship between men and women in the church context. Let's take a look.

"But I do not allow a woman to teach or exercise authority over a man, but remain quiet. For it was Adam who was first created, and then Eve. And it was not Adam who was deceived, but the woman being quite deceived, fell into transgression," (1 Tim. 2:12-14 -- all quotes from the Bible are from the NASB).

This passage has several interesting areas of discussion, but for our purpose we will focus on authority. At the very least, there is an authority structure set up by God. The woman is not to have authority over the man in the church context. But this does not extend to the political/economic world. In the Old Testament Deborah was a judge in Israel over men. Also, in the New Testament, Phoebe played an important role in the church at Cenchrea (Romans 16). There is no doubt that women supported Paul in many areas and were great helpers in the church (Acts 2:17; 18:24-26; 21:8-9). But what Paul is speaking of in 1 Tim. 2 is the relationship between men and women in the church structure, not in a social or political context.

When we look further at Paul's teachings we see that the bishop/overseer is to be the husband of one wife (1 Tim. 3:2) who manages his household well and has a good reputation (1 Tim. 3:4-5, 7). Deacons must be "men of dignity" (1 Tim. 3:8). Paul then speaks of women in verse 11 and their obligation to receive instruction. Then in verse 12, Paul says "Let deacons be husbands of one wife..." Again, in Titus 1:5-7, Paul says, "For this reason I left you in Crete, that you might set in order what remains, and appoint elders in every city as I directed you, namely, if any man be above reproach, the husband of one wife, having children who believe, not accused of dissipation or rebellion. For the overseer must be above reproach as God's steward..." Notice that Paul interchanges the word 'elder' and 'overseer'.

In each case, the one who is an elder, deacon, bishop, or overseer is instructed to be male. He is the husband of one wife, responsible, able to "exhort in sound doctrine and to refute those who contradict" (Titus 1:9). We see no command for the overseers to be women. On the contrary, women are told to be "dignified, not malicious gossips, but temperate, faithful in all things" (1 Tim. 3:11). Why is it that it is the men who are singled out as the overseers? It is because of the created order of God that Paul references (Gen. 1-2; 1 Tim. 2:12-14). This is not merely a social custom that fell away with ancient Israel.

Additionally, in the Old Testament in over 700 mentions of priests, every single one was a male. There is not one instance of a female priest. This is significant because priests were ordained by God to hold a very important office of ministering the sacrifices. This was not the job of women. Therefore, from what I see in Genesis 1-2, 1 Timothy 2, and Titus 1, the normal and proper person to hold the office of elder/pastor is to be a man.

What About Galatians 3:28?

"There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither slave nor free man, there is neither male nor female; for you are all one in Christ Jesus," (Gal. 3:28).

This verse is often used to support the idea that women can hold the offices of elder and pastor because there is neither male nor female in Christ. The argument states that if we are all equal, then women can be pastors.
Unfortunately, those who use this verse this way have failed to read the context. Verse 23 talks about being under the Law "before faith came" and how we are brought closer to Jesus and have become sons of God by faith. We are no longer under law, but grace and we are "Abraham's offspring, heirs according to the promise," (v. 29).2 The point of this passage is that we are all saved by God's grace according to the promise of God and that it doesn't matter who you are, Jew, Greek, slave, free, male, or female. All are saved the same way, by grace. In that, there is neither male nor female.

This verse is not talking about church structure. It is talking about salvation "in Christ." It cannot be used to support women as pastors because that isn't what it is talking about. Instead, to find out about church structure and leadership, you need to go to those passages that talk about it: 1 Timothy 2 and Titus 1.

Being a Pastor or Elder is to be in Authority

God is a God of order and balance. He has established order within the family (Gen. 3:16; 1 Cor. 11:3; Eph. 5:22-33; Col. 3:18-21 ) and the church (1 Tim. 2:11-14; 1 Cor. 11:8-9). Even within the Trinity there is an order, a hierarchy. The Father sent the Son (John 6:38) and both the Father and the Son sent the Holy Spirit (John 14:26; 15:26). Jesus said, "For I have come down from heaven, not to do My own will, but the will of Him who sent Me," (John 6:38). It is clear that God is a God of order and structure.

In creation, God made Adam first and then Eve to be his helper. This is the order of creation. It is this order that Paul mentions in 1 Tim. 2:11-14 when speaking of authority. Being a pastor or an elder is to be in the place of authority. Therefore, within the church, for a woman to be a pastor or elder, she would be in authority of men in the church which contradicts what Paul says in 1 Tim. 2:11-14.

But Doesn't This Teaching Belittle Women?

No, male leadership does not belittle women. Jesus was given his authority by God the Father (Matt. 28:18). He was sent by God (John 6:38). He said the Father was greater than He (John 14:28). Did this belittle Jesus? Of course not. Women are of great value in the church and need to be used more and more according to the gifts given them.

Does the wife's submission to the husband mean that she is less than the husband, less important, or belittled? Again, not at all. Not having a place of leadership in the church does not mean a woman is less of a person, less important to God, or inferior. All are equal before God whether it be Jew, Gentile, free, slave, male, or female. But in the church, God has set up an order the same way he set one up in the family. The chain of command is Jesus, the man, the wife, and the children.

What About Women Who Say They are Called By God to Be Pastors?

There are women pastors in the world who love their congregations and have stated that they are called by God to be pastors. Of course, I cannot agree with this considering the previous analysis of the biblical position. Instead, I believe they have usurped the position of men and gone against the norm of scriptural revelation. Additionally, those who state that they are called by God because of the great job they are doing and the gifting they have received are basing their theology upon experience and not scripture.

The issue is simple: are they submitting to the word of God or are they making the word of God submit to their desires?

What About a Missionary Woman Who Establishes a Church?

Scripture establishes the norm. As Christians we apply what we learn from the word, to the situations at hand. So, what about the situation where a woman missionary has converted a group of people, say in the jungle somewhere, and she has established a church? In that church, she is then functioning as a pastor and teacher having authority over men in the church. Should she not do this?

First of all, she should not be out there alone. She should be with her husband or, at the very least, under the oversight of a church body in the presence of other women and men. Missionary work is not a lone endeavor to be handled by single women.

Second, if in some highly unusual set of circumstances there is a woman in a lone situation, it is far more important that the word of God be preached and the gospel of salvation go forth to the lost than not. Whether it be male or female, let the gospel be spoken. However, I would say that as soon as there is/are males mature enough to handle eldership, that she should then establish the proper order of the church as revealed in scripture and thereby, show her submission to it.

Does this also mean that women shouldn't wear jewelry?

"Likewise, I want women to adorn themselves with proper clothing, modestly and discreetly, not with braided hair and gold or pearls or costly garments; 10 but rather by means of good works, as befits women making a claim to godliness. 11 Let a woman quietly receive instruction with entire submissiveness. 12 But I do not allow a woman to teach or exercise authority over a man, but to remain quiet. 13 For it was Adam who was first created, and then Eve," (1 Tim. 2:9-13).

Some argue that if we are to forbid women to be elders then the context of 1 Tim. 2:9-13 demands that we require women to no have braided hair, wear gold, or have costly garments. Since no one wants to put that sort of a demand on a woman (since it is cultural), then why should we also demand that they not be elders since it would logically follow that it was also a culturally based admonition?

The problem here is that multifaceted. First, the objection ignores what the scriptures plainly teach about the elder being the husband of one wife. Second, it fails to address the real issue of biblical headship residing in the male. Third, it fails to properly exegete the scripture in question.

In 1 Tim. 2:9-13 Paul tells us that women should be modestly dressed. He uses the example of the then present day adornment as an example of what not to do. This is a culturally based assessment by Paul. Notice that Paul emphasizes good works and godliness as a qualifier (as does Peter, see 1 Pet. 3:2). This is not a doctrinal statement tied to anything other than being a godly woman in appearance as well as attitude.

In verse 11, Paul says that a woman should quietly receive instruction. Please note that "The word, heµsychia, translated “quietness” in 1 Timothy 2:11 and silent in verse 12, does not mean complete silence or no talking. It is clearly used elsewhere (Acts 22:2; 2 Thes. 3:12) to mean “settled down, undisturbed, not unruly. A different word (sigaoµ) means “to be silent, to say nothing” (cf. Luke 18:39; 1 Cor. 14:34).”3 Paul is advocating orderliness in this verse.

Then in verse 12-13, Paul says, "But I do not allow a woman to teach or exercise authority over a man, but to remain quiet. 13 For it was Adam who was first created, and then Eve." Notice that Paul directly relates the authority issue with the created order. He does not do this with the woman's dress code. Therefore, the dress code is cultural and the authority issue as doctrinal since the latter is tied to the creation order and the dress code and authority issue are not.

Conclusion

God's word clearly tells us that the elder is to be the husband of one wife. A woman cannot qualify for this position by virtue of her being female. Whether anyone likes it or not is irrelevant to the fact that this is what the Bible teaches.

 
Should Women Be Pastors and Elders?......
God's word clearly tells us that the elder is to be the husband of one wife. A woman cannot qualify for this position by virtue of her being female. Whether anyone likes it or not is irrelevant to the fact that this is what the Bible teaches.

Very useful article Chad.
In full agreement that women should not be pastors or elders....the Bible is very clear on this
 
Listen i sure God does not want women Lording over men ! Still I sure God can use a woman to do about anything ?
There are women preaching the gospel who have More Spiritual understanding than Most men on the earth ! They could not have gotten these deep trues , unless the Hpoly Ghost revealed it too them !
One lady i know of ! Accepts HEr husband as over HER ! But preaches and mostly to women ? But there are Men in these groups She preaches too ! She does not have a church ! But sure She used to bring others into the kingdom ! In our Spirit we are equal , but in our Flesh We are Not ! Of course we are to go out of our way to help women !

Php_4:3 And I intreat thee also, true yokefellow, help those women which laboured with me in the gospel, with Clement also, and with other my fellowlabourers, whose names are in the book of life.

We just do not want to look down on women as if they are less or nothing ! But i think most all men have a natural desire not to want women to Lord over them ! But at the same time, if they ask and are humble about it ? most men will gladly go out of there way to help them !

Bible calls them the weaker vessel and they are in many ways !

Once my wife would not do something i asked Her too ! I told Her if you refuse I going to talk it over with My Father GOD ! She laughed at me and told me to go too that !
I went in my room , got on my knees and told the LORD ? This woman You gave me will not listen to me !
I never said anything else too Her about it that night ! The next day i asked Her ? You going to help the pastor or Not ? She said yes !

A couple weeks later , i asked Her to do some thing else 1 She said No ! I said , ok i just go talk to the Lord again and started walking toward the bedroom ! She ran behind me , got a hold of my shoulder and said ? Please Never do that again and I will do anything You say !

I found it Lots better to turn things over too HIm and trust in Him , than my understanding !
 
1 Tim 2:12; But I do not allow a woman to teach or exercise authority over a man, but to remain quiet.

1 Cor 14:34; The women are to keep silent in the churches; for they are not permitted to speak, but are to subject themselves, just as the Law also says.
1 Cor 14:35; If they desire to learn anything, let them ask their own husbands at home; for it is improper for a woman to speak in church.

1 Tim 3:2; An elder, then, must be above reproach, the husband of one wife, temperate, prudent, respectable, hospitable, able to teach,
1 Tim 3:3; not addicted to wine or pugnacious, but gentle, peaceable, free from the love of money.
1 Tim 3:4; He must be one who manages his own household well, keeping his children under control with all dignity
1 Tim 3:5; (but if a man does not know how to manage his own household, how will he take care of the church of God?),
1 Tim 3:6; and not a new convert, so that he will not become conceited and fall into the condemnation incurred by the devil.
1 Tim 3:7; And he must have a good reputation with those outside the church, so that he will not fall into reproach and the snare of the devil.
1 Tim 3:8; Deacons likewise must be men of dignity, not double-tongued, or addicted to much wine or fond of sordid gain,
1 Tim 3:9; but holding to the mystery of the faith with a clear conscience.
1 Tim 3:10; These men must also first be tested; then let them serve as deacons if they are beyond reproach.
1 Tim 3:11; Women must likewise be dignified, not malicious gossips, but temperate, faithful in all things.
1 Tim 3:12; Deacons must be husbands of only one wife, and good managers of their children and their own households.
1 Tim 3:13; For those who have served well as deacons obtain for themselves a high standing and great confidence in the faith that is in Christ Jesus.

Tit 1:5; For this reason I left you in Crete, that you would set in order what remains and appoint elders in every city as I directed you,
Tit 1:6; namely, if any man is above reproach, the husband of one wife, having children who believe, not accused of dissipation or rebellion.
Tit 1:7; For the overseer must be above reproach as God's steward, not self-willed, not quick-tempered, not addicted to wine, not pugnacious, not fond of sordid gain,
Tit 1:8; but hospitable, loving what is good, sensible, just, devout, self-controlled,
Tit 1:9; holding fast the faithful word which is in accordance with the teaching, so that he will be able both to exhort in sound doctrine and to refute those who contradict.

I think woman can teach in church, be in ministry. Teach children's Sunday school, teach other women, and be involved in many ways.
Sometimes this gets "iffy" in situations of worship leaders or women teaching college classes (when does a child become a man?)
But my opinion here is that as long as they are under authority of a man (church elder, or pastor) who knows what they are doing and teaching, it's probably OK.

Still as Chad says, this kind of leaves women out from being Pastors or elders, as there would be no man in authority over them. Some churches say
women can be pastors if they have a male presbyter over them. I think this is really stretching it. How can the presbyter know what the woman is teaching if he isn't there directly involved?
 
Personally I think GOd can use anyone any way HE wants too at any time! but Normally He set His rules down already ! I do not think He bound to do as these scriptures appear !
If HE cannot find faithful Men to do His Will ? Then He might use a woman or a child ? But , They would Not be Lording over Men !

I do not think Pastors are any more than anyone else in HIS Body 1 They just if called for that job ! Anointed for it ! It does not make them a Big deal or greater than others !

There been prophetess as women and used mighty of the LORD! And that was started in the Old Testament , where it was much harder on women !
But i do agree , they should not be holding certain places in the church ! But they can have a Ministry !

Just think ? If God can use a rock or a donkey , Why Not use a woman ? They are much brighter and normally more willing to listen and obey the Lord !
A righteous womans worth LOTS! Not many Men or women are Learning from the Lord ,it appears to me !

Many churches today are mainly concerned about getting more money and using people !

Luk_18:8 I tell you that he will avenge them speedily. Nevertheless when the Son of man cometh, shall he find faith on the earth?


I have no problem listening to a woman or even a child !
 
In a social climate of complete equality in all things, the biblical teaching of only allowing men to be pastors and elders is not popular. Many feminist organizations denounce this position as antiquated and chauvinistic

Mal 3:6; "For I, the LORD, do not change; therefore you, O sons of Jacob, are not consumed.
Jas 1:17; Whatever is good and perfect comes down to us from God our Father, who created all the lights in the heavens. He never changes or casts a shifting shadow.
Heb 13:8; Jesus Christ is the same yesterday and today and forever.

It seems to be the way of mankind to change what God wants to meet our desires, rather than changing ourselves to meet his desires.
I wonder if sometimes we think the "social climate" is what determines how God should be doing things, instead of God deciding how we (society) should be doing things?
 
Acts 2:16 But this is what was uttered through the prophet Joel (Joel 2:28): 17 "'And in the last days it shall be, God declares, that I will pour out my Spirit on all flesh, and your sons and your daughters shall prophesy, and your young men shall see visions, and your old men shall dream dreams; 18 even on my male servants and female servants in those days I will pour out my Spirit, and they shall prophesy. 19 And I will show wonders in the heavens above and signs on the earth below, blood, and fire, and vapor of smoke; 20 the sun shall be turned to darkness and the moon to blood, before the day of the Lord comes, the great and magnificent day.

I think that in this day and age, people should not put down anyone called by God to preach the Gospel.

If we are to be legalistic, then is it proper for women to be moderators/elders on forums such as this one?

Seriously, Whom God calls He also equips. Who are we to judge those God has anointed to serve Him?
 
BTW...

I have very long hair and if I did not braid it then I would never get any work done... Just say'n
 
this is a touchy subject, we know what the bible states about women being silent in the church. however we also read in the bible where phillip had 5 daughters and they all preached the gospel.
 
God uses women but his order and structure He has ordained is for a purpose. Forbidding women to have authority is only in church, and women can preach through prophesying. All women can preach the gospel. Women can also be a type of elder. Behind male elders was position known as widows, and then deaconesses. Male elders have higher authority but this does not mean there are not positions of authority for women, particularly widowed /aged women who are no longer capable of having children. But the situation for example of a young female woman having authority over an elder male is not normal. I think men need to see that women have a definite place and calling and gifting in the chuch, and women also need to see that being under man is in the will of God and a blessing. One blessing is... if God's proper order is kept then there should be less opportunity for spiritual attack. If Eve had remained under the covering of her husband Adam, she may have been spared from being deceived by satan. This is the principle behind God's order in the church. God Himself is not legalistic! He wants His church to be protected.
 
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this is a touchy subject, we know what the bible states about women being silent in the church. however we also read in the bible where phillip had 5 daughters and they all preached the gospel.

Acts 21:9 "He had four unmarried daughters who proclaimed God's message".
 
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I just read Acts 21 and found something interesting...

Paul was staying with Philip (and his daughters) "several days" in Caesarea when a prophet named Agabus arrived from Judea and took Paul's belt and used it to provide a visual of what would happen to Paul.

It seems that God knew that Paul would not receive the message from a woman (as there were four prophets already in the house) but had to get a guy to come from afar to deliver the message of Paul's impending fate.
 
What a tough dilemma to solve, in an age where equality for women
is expected, a right.

If you restrict their ministry possibilities in your church, you could
be discouraging them.

It also gives the church the appearance of being backward and inflexible.
This is not a good advertisement for Christ at all.

In many backward societies women have no rights.

So when do you enforce the scripture and when do you take a softer touch?


Where do we draw the line between a rigid doctrinal church and a genuine loving
accepting church that is flexible?
 
I am currently in a Filapino house church. We are very small, and for the longest of times we did not even have a male attendee, which I found difficult because of God's word. I did find great blessing from it and a unity in the Spirit. Recently we had a visit from the head of FBIC, our mother church and who I found out was a woman. She is single and under the authority of her father who is head of FBIC internationally, and yet she is counselling and telling us what we should do. I found it repulsive and unbecoming of her (do not get me wrong, I am a woman myself, not a chauvinist). I have seen women leading Bible studies, heard Corrie Ten Boom preach, and listened to other women teach younger women Tit. 2:3, and have not been disturbed, and yet to see a woman excercising authority over a man was not glorifying to God. Moreover there came disunity and an unexplainable discord in my spirit. Do we as Christians have the right to change an ordinance appointed by God, so that we can fit in with society. Shouldn't we as women trust that God's order is the most honorable way, and the most glorifying to Him? And yet what do we do when there is no man to fill the shoes (I do not speak in regards to the woman mentioned but to the problem in our group i.e no men)?
 
What a tough dilemma to solve, in an age where equality for women
is expected, a right.

If you restrict their ministry possibilities in your church, you could
be discouraging them.

It also gives the church the appearance of being backward and inflexible.
This is not a good advertisement for Christ at all.

In many backward societies women have no rights.

So when do you enforce the scripture and when do you take a softer touch?


Where do we draw the line between a rigid doctrinal church and a genuine loving
accepting church that is flexible?

It doesn't matter what "age" we're in or culture. The Word of GOD is the same yesterday, today and tomorrow. It is timeless, so obviously are it's commands.

Also, why would not enforce Scripture ever and why would you ever at any time take a softer touch? Never. The bible should be enforced 100% always, all the time. Anything else is going against GOD's will.

Therefore, to "draw the line" is basically you either obey GOD or you do not. Plain and simple. There is no middle ground, nor grey area whatsoever.
 
It doesn't matter what "age" we're in or culture. The Word of GOD is the same yesterday, today and tomorrow. It is timeless, so obviously are it's commands.

Also, why would not enforce Scripture ever and why would you ever at any time take a softer touch? Never. The bible should be enforced 100% always, all the time. Anything else is going against GOD's will.

Therefore, to "draw the line" is basically you either obey GOD or you do not. Plain and simple. There is no middle ground, nor grey area whatsoever.
Thank you for that brother Chad.
 
We Need to understand ? God has a Perfect Will and Permissive will !
Everything will not be in His perfect will ! We might want it in His perfect will ? but it not going to be always !

God can work in ways we find not what the bible says ? Because it the only way ! The goal is salvation for mankind ! He knows the best way to reach the goal in each life ! A church without Men or Men strong in the LORD !

We need to be careful not to put God will in a box and say HE can only work this way and no other !

I seen God do Lots of miracles in many way , other might even count evil ?

Example ? Marriage is Holy and God perfect will ! Divorce is permited ,under some conditions ? Not God perfect will , only under His permissive will !

Some want to make GOD only work one way ! As if HE MUST ! I know ? in the Spirit beings , we are All equal in GOD Eyes !

You see one problem is we might start looking down on women as if they are just above a animal ! When We are vto Love women , our wives as Christ LOVED the church . Giving his life for it and helping others without evil thoughts toward them !

I do not look down on women , not even little children ! If anything i go out of my way to help and protect them ! and am careful how i speak too them !

It easy for Mankind to start seeing women as nothing , like in all muslim nations !
And some religions here in the United States ?

God LOVES them as much as any of us Men ! They just are Not allowed to hold certain offices in the church , under normal conditions !

Under GOD premissive Will they could ?

No one has too agree with me ! This is just the way i see it ! I do not mind listening too anyone who has true spiritual understanding !

Or even carnal understanding of the things of the world i need or want too know ! I can learn from about anyone i think ?
 
It doesn't matter what "age" we're in or culture. The Word of GOD is the same yesterday, today and tomorrow. It is timeless, so obviously are it's commands.

Also, why would not enforce Scripture ever and why would you ever at any time take a softer touch? Never. The bible should be enforced 100% always, all the time. Anything else is going against GOD's will.

Therefore, to "draw the line" is basically you either obey GOD or you do not. Plain and simple. There is no middle ground, nor grey area whatsoever.

Hello Chad, nice to receive a post in reply.

I would like to ask you whether in the church that you attend.

Do they greet one another with a holy kiss?

They do in the church I now attend, they are a Samoan church.

Very warm and friendly people, the service is not in english though.

The women kissed me on the cheek, I was stunned, but in there
understanding of the scripture, that is how they greet new members.
I doubt there would be many western churches that followed this
tradition.

They do not wear head coverings.

I have attended five different churches during my Christian life and
not one church enforced the head covering for women.

In fact, Chad not even the most traditional and the oldest churches
over here obey God on this directive. I would strongly doubt whether
many churches in the US would adhere to this rule.

Modern women mostly have short hair styles these days, this also
does not conform to the first century model.

Finally Chad, I am not a woman so the head covering rule does not
put me at risk of disobedience. But I am curious as to how many of the
female members of TJ wear a covering.
 
ive met many wounderful female pastors .and i can tell you God is no respecter of persons..my wife is a minister as well and He uses her many times for His Glory ..there is no room in Christ for the battle of the sex,s ..its about a heart to serve and a willingness to obey ..if not for woman the church would have been in sad shape during a time when men would not preach ...and if i may without offence ..If God can use an *** he can surley use anybody else He choses...........IMHO.........Rev
 
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