Richard Aberdeen
Member
- Joined
- Jun 4, 2026
- Messages
- 70
Paul opens and closes every letter attributed to him with "grace" to you followed often by "mercy" and/or "peace", always listing grace first. He also says that Jesus gives us more grace and, we grow from grace to grace (more free, bigger and better understanding).
Unlike many Christians teach, why would Paul say this if salvation isn't an ongoing process, as if we no longer need any more grace or understanding ? ? ? Consider how crazy it would be for someone to believe they could read and understand the entire Encyclopedia Britannica in one day. And that is nothing, compared to what Jesus knows and, we have yet to learn.
Salvation is not just about learning, but also about being changed by God from the inside out and as a result, having more love and becoming more free. It may be fair to define "salvation" as everything God wants to do for us, in us and through us. If we don't want Jesus to save us from our sins, we will never be remotely free, for sin makes us less free, not more free. And, it is a hard and difficult row to hoe to try to care without God's help, "for God is love".
"Moreover, the Lord is the spirit; where the spirit of the Lord is, there is freedom. We all moreover, with unveiled face, beholding as in a mirror the glory of the Lord, are being transformed into the same image from glory to glory, even as from the Lord the spirit" II Corinthians 3:17-18 (corrected to the Greek).
Verse 18 cannot rationally be interpreted some other way, other than an ongoing process. Over time, the better we will know and understand what is true, the more free we will become and, the more love we will have for both ourselves and other people; "for God is love" 1 John 4:7-8.
God's salvation, found only in Jesus, is a lifetime ongoing process, as indicated by Paul several times, who after many years, did not view himself as having attained. In I Corinthians 1:18 Paul says, "For the message of the cross is foolishness to those who are perishing, but to us who are being saved it is the power of God." The Greek definitely means "being saved".
And as Paul writes in Philippians 3:12-14: "Not that I have already attained, or am already perfected; but I press on, that I may lay hold of that for which Messiah Jesus has also laid hold of me. Brethren, I do not count myself to have apprehended; but one thing I do, forgetting those things which are behind and reaching forward to those things which are ahead, I press toward the goal for the prize of the upward call of God in Messiah Jesus."
Again, Paul writes elsewhere in I Corinthians 8:2: "And if anyone thinks that they know anything, they know nothing yet as they ought to know". Those who teach that salvation is not an ongoing daily process and, who say if we have asked Jesus to forgive us, we no longer need him to forgive us, are in direct contradiction to the New Testament.
According to John 1:8-9, written to people who are already believers in Jesus: "If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us. If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive us our sins and, to cleanse us from all unrighteousness." Note that John says if "we" confess "our" sins, including himself personally.
Jesus saving us from our sins is quite clearly a daily, ongoing process. Otherwise, the above quotations from Paul and John quite literally, don't make any sense. The entire idea of God's free salvation is to believe in and know Jesus better and in doing so, become more and more free and have more "love, one for another". As noted earlier, Jesus says if we listen to him, we "will know the truth and the truth will make us free" and if he makes us free, we will be "free, indeed".
Jesus clearly implies an ongoing learning process when he says "you will know the truth and the truth will make you free", which agrees with Paul and I John. Who for example, has shown up for the first day of elementary school and, learned everything they need to know about God and life on the first day?
If the idea is to learn more of what is true so we can be more free, how could anyone claim that salvation isn't an ongoing process? And, if we don't want Jesus to continue to forgive us once we have asked him, who is going to "cleanse us from all sin", like John says in I John 1:7?
Conservative Christianity very wrongly teaches that once we are saved, we no longer need to be saved and, once we are forgiven, we no longer need to be forgiven. Hopefully the above few paragraphs puts this twisted teaching down in the Pit permanently where it belongs. Apparently, the truth is, once we have asked Jesus to forgive us, we are saved from God's wrath and, we have eternal life from that point forward.
But we have much to improve on, experience, understand, go through and grow over time and thus, salvation is also an ongoing lifetime process. Who among us can say "I have achieved", as if we need no more improvement and have nothing left to understand or accomplish?
Unlike many Christians teach, why would Paul say this if salvation isn't an ongoing process, as if we no longer need any more grace or understanding ? ? ? Consider how crazy it would be for someone to believe they could read and understand the entire Encyclopedia Britannica in one day. And that is nothing, compared to what Jesus knows and, we have yet to learn.
Salvation is not just about learning, but also about being changed by God from the inside out and as a result, having more love and becoming more free. It may be fair to define "salvation" as everything God wants to do for us, in us and through us. If we don't want Jesus to save us from our sins, we will never be remotely free, for sin makes us less free, not more free. And, it is a hard and difficult row to hoe to try to care without God's help, "for God is love".
"Moreover, the Lord is the spirit; where the spirit of the Lord is, there is freedom. We all moreover, with unveiled face, beholding as in a mirror the glory of the Lord, are being transformed into the same image from glory to glory, even as from the Lord the spirit" II Corinthians 3:17-18 (corrected to the Greek).
Verse 18 cannot rationally be interpreted some other way, other than an ongoing process. Over time, the better we will know and understand what is true, the more free we will become and, the more love we will have for both ourselves and other people; "for God is love" 1 John 4:7-8.
God's salvation, found only in Jesus, is a lifetime ongoing process, as indicated by Paul several times, who after many years, did not view himself as having attained. In I Corinthians 1:18 Paul says, "For the message of the cross is foolishness to those who are perishing, but to us who are being saved it is the power of God." The Greek definitely means "being saved".
And as Paul writes in Philippians 3:12-14: "Not that I have already attained, or am already perfected; but I press on, that I may lay hold of that for which Messiah Jesus has also laid hold of me. Brethren, I do not count myself to have apprehended; but one thing I do, forgetting those things which are behind and reaching forward to those things which are ahead, I press toward the goal for the prize of the upward call of God in Messiah Jesus."
Again, Paul writes elsewhere in I Corinthians 8:2: "And if anyone thinks that they know anything, they know nothing yet as they ought to know". Those who teach that salvation is not an ongoing daily process and, who say if we have asked Jesus to forgive us, we no longer need him to forgive us, are in direct contradiction to the New Testament.
According to John 1:8-9, written to people who are already believers in Jesus: "If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us. If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive us our sins and, to cleanse us from all unrighteousness." Note that John says if "we" confess "our" sins, including himself personally.
Jesus saving us from our sins is quite clearly a daily, ongoing process. Otherwise, the above quotations from Paul and John quite literally, don't make any sense. The entire idea of God's free salvation is to believe in and know Jesus better and in doing so, become more and more free and have more "love, one for another". As noted earlier, Jesus says if we listen to him, we "will know the truth and the truth will make us free" and if he makes us free, we will be "free, indeed".
Jesus clearly implies an ongoing learning process when he says "you will know the truth and the truth will make you free", which agrees with Paul and I John. Who for example, has shown up for the first day of elementary school and, learned everything they need to know about God and life on the first day?
If the idea is to learn more of what is true so we can be more free, how could anyone claim that salvation isn't an ongoing process? And, if we don't want Jesus to continue to forgive us once we have asked him, who is going to "cleanse us from all sin", like John says in I John 1:7?
Conservative Christianity very wrongly teaches that once we are saved, we no longer need to be saved and, once we are forgiven, we no longer need to be forgiven. Hopefully the above few paragraphs puts this twisted teaching down in the Pit permanently where it belongs. Apparently, the truth is, once we have asked Jesus to forgive us, we are saved from God's wrath and, we have eternal life from that point forward.
But we have much to improve on, experience, understand, go through and grow over time and thus, salvation is also an ongoing lifetime process. Who among us can say "I have achieved", as if we need no more improvement and have nothing left to understand or accomplish?
