Not under the Law?

[brakelite]

LOL, can you show a conflict between the your paraphrase and your scripture quote?

ahh duh. Of course, as was my intention. Net Chaplain claimed the Ten Commandments ended at Calvary. If that were so, Jesus would have said so. He didn't. Jesus said they would in no wise change before the world would end, and even then not until all was fulfilled. Clearly, because Jesus was a Prophet, He knew exactly when they would end. If they were going to end at Calvary He would have said something akin to my "paraphrase" as you so inaccurately describe it.

 

[jiggyfly]

ahh duh. Of course, as was my intention. Net Chaplain claimed the Ten Commandments ended at Calvary. If that were so, Jesus would have said so. He didn't. Jesus said they would in no wise change before the world would end, and even then not until all was fulfilled. Clearly, because Jesus was a Prophet, He knew exactly when they would end. If they were going to end at Calvary He would have said something akin to my "paraphrase" as you so inaccurately describe it.

But all was fulfilled concerning the law and later Paul said that the law was only intended to last until the Son of promise came, thus Jesus' statement "till all be fulfilled". When context and/or proper grammar is ignored one can make the scriptures mean whatever they like.

 

[B-A-C]

What are some of things Jesus said were sin? Jesus is who is speaking in all of the verses below.

Mat 5:21 "You have heard that the ancients were told, 'YOU SHALL NOT COMMIT MURDER' and 'Whoever commits murder shall be liable to the court.'
Mat 5:22 "But I say to you that everyone who is angry with his brother shall be guilty before the court; and whoever says to his brother, 'You good-for-nothing,' shall be guilty before the supreme court; and whoever says, 'You fool,' shall be guilty enough to go into the fiery hell.

Murder, but not only murder, even calling someone good for nothing or a fool.

Mat 5:27 "You have heard that it was said, 'YOU SHALL NOT COMMIT ADULTERY';
Mat 5:28 but I say to you that everyone who looks at a woman with lust for her has already committed adultery with her in his heart.

Adultery, but not only adutery, lust too.

Mat 5:31 "It was said, 'WHOEVER SENDS HIS WIFE AWAY, LET HIM GIVE HER A CERTIFICATE OF DIVORCE';
Mat 5:32 but I say to you that everyone who divorces his wife, except for the reason of unchastity, makes her commit adultery; and whoever marries a divorced woman commits adultery.
(Also see John 8:7 about the woman caught in adultery, Jesus told her to 'sin no more')

Divorcing for the wrong reason is a sin, marrying someone who got divorced for the wrong reason is a sin.

Mat 5:33 "Again, you have heard that the ancients were told, 'YOU SHALL NOT MAKE FALSE VOWS, BUT SHALL FULFILL YOUR VOWS TO THE LORD.'
Mat 5:34 "But I say to you, make no oath at all, either by heaven, for it is the throne of God,
Mat 5:35 or by the earth, for it is the footstool of His feet, or by Jerusalem, for it is THE CITY OF THE GREAT KING.
Mat 5:36 "Nor shall you make an oath by your head, for you cannot make one hair white or black.
Mat 5:37 "But let your statement be, 'Yes, yes' or 'No, no'; anything beyond these is of evil.

Lying, and making promises you can't keep are a sin.

Mat 5:43 "You have heard that it was said, 'YOU SHALL LOVE YOUR NEIGHBOR and hate your enemy.'
Mat 5:44 "But I say to you, love your enemies and pray for those who persecute you,

Hating your enemies is a sin.

Luk 7:39 Now when the Pharisee who had invited Him saw this, he said to himself, "If this man were a prophet He would know who and what sort of person this woman is who is touching Him, that she is a sinner."
Some say Mary Magdelene was an adulterous or prostitute. We do know she had seven demons at one point.
(Luke 8:2; Mark 16:9)
Whatever her sins might have been, Luke 7:47-48 says Jesus forgave her of them. Another note here, is that Jesus say your 'sin' (as in singular) he says your 'sins'. Another reason that unbelief cannot be the only sin,
if indeed that was one of her sins.

Luke 17:3-4 say that sins aren't only against God, they can be against other people.
Luke 17:3 "Be on your guard! If your brother sins, rebuke him; and if he repents, forgive him.
Luke 17:4 "And if he sins against you seven times a day, and returns to you seven times, saying, 'I repent,' forgive him."

Luke 12:1 Under these circumstances, after so many thousands of people had gathered together that they were stepping on one another, He began saying to His disciples first of all, "Beware of the leaven of the Pharisees, which is hypocrisy.

Jesus says hypocrisy is a sin.

Mar 11:17 And He began to teach and say to them, "Is it not written, 'MY HOUSE SHALL BE CALLED A HOUSE OF PRAYER FOR ALL THE NATIONS'? But you have made it a ROBBERS' DEN."

Doing business for gain in church could be a sin.

If unbelief is the only sin, then I have to wonder about Matt 7:22
Mat 7:22 "Many will say to Me on that day, 'Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in Your name, and in Your name cast out demons, and in Your name perform many miracles?'
Mat 7:23 "And then I will declare to them, 'I never knew you; DEPART FROM ME, YOU WHO PRACTICE LAWLESSNESS.'

It sounds like 'practicing lawlessness' is also something to stay away from.
I woder what the definition of lawlessness is?

How about causing others to stumble?
Mat 18:6 but whoever causes one of these little ones who believe in Me to stumble, it would be better for him to have a heavy millstone hung around his neck, and to be drowned in the depth of the sea.

It doesn't specifically say it is a sin, but it sounds like bad things will happen to you.

As for unbelief being the only sin, James 2:19 says even the demons believe. Apparently they must have committed some other sin also.

These were some of things Jesus said were sin. Perhaps in another message we should consider what Paul called sin in his letters to the Gentiles.

 

[brakelite]

But all was fulfilled concerning the law and later Paul said that the law was only intended to last until the Son of promise came, thus Jesus' statement "till all be fulfilled". When context and/or proper grammar is ignored one can make the scriptures mean whatever they like.

They sure can, and you are doing just that by ignoring the God given revelation that there are more than just one law, and that Jesus said 'all' would not be fulfilled at least until heaven and earth pass away. As far as I am aware that has yet to happen.
Jiggy, how can all be fulfilled regarding the Ten Commandment law when there is yet billions of people worldwide who have yet not met Jesus? How can the unlearned know they are sinners without the law to tell them? Does not the law still have a purpose just as we have been discussing? Was that purpose expressly designed to point out our need of a Saviour? So if there are so many that still need a Saviour, how can they know their need without someone telling them what the law says? Jiggy, the law must still aplly, at the very least until the very last person repents of his sin and acknowledges His Saviour.

 

[B-A-C]

What are some of the things Paul, Peter and James say are sin?

Rom 6:12 Therefore do not let sin reign in your mortal body so that you obey its lusts,
This could mean a few things, but at the very least, it means lust.

Jas 1:15 Then when lust has conceived, it gives birth to sin; and when sin is accomplished, it brings forth death.
James agrees that lust is sin.

Rom 7:7 What shall we say then? Is the Law sin? May it never be! On the contrary, I would not have come to know sin except through the Law; for I would not have known about coveting if the Law had not said, "YOU SHALL NOT COVET."
Coveting is a sin.

Rom 14:23 But he who doubts is condemned if he eats, because his eating is not from faith; and whatever is not from faith is sin.
Eating food sacrificed to idols is sin under some conditions.

1 Cor 8:12 And so, by sinning against the brethren and wounding their conscience when it is weak, you sin against Christ.
1 Cor 8:13 Therefore, if food causes my brother to stumble, I will never eat meat again, so that I will not cause my brother to stumble.
Causing someone else to stumble is a sin.

Heb 4:15 For we do not have a high priest who cannot sympathize with our weaknesses, but One who has been tempted in all things as we are, yet without sin.
This is a very interesting verse. Now we may not know every way in which Jesus was tempted, but we know some of them. (Matt 4:1-10)

Jas 2:9 But if you show partiality, you are committing sin and are convicted by the law as transgressors.
Showing favoritism is sin.

Jas 4:17 Therefore, to one who knows the right thing to do and does not do it, to him it is sin.
Simply not doing the right thing is sin.

2 Pet 2:14 having eyes full of adultery that never cease from sin, enticing unstable souls, having a heart trained in greed, accursed children;
Adultery and greed are sin.

1 John 5:17 All unrighteousness is sin, and there is a sin not leading to death.
All unrighteousness, wow, that covers a LOT of stuff.

Rom 1:29 being filled with all unrighteousness, wickedness, greed, evil; full of envy, murder, strife, deceit, malice; they are gossips,
Rom 1:30 slanderers, haters of God, insolent, arrogant, boastful, inventors of evil, disobedient to parents,

1 Cor 6:18 Flee immorality. Every other sin that a man commits is outside the body, but the immoral man sins against his own body.
Immorality is a sin.

Jas 3:16 For where jealousy and selfish ambition exist, there is disorder and every evil thing.
Jas 4:16 But as it is, you boast in your arrogance; all such boasting is evil.

Col 3:5 Therefore consider the members of your earthly body as dead to immorality, impurity, passion, evil desire, and greed, which amounts to idolatry.
Col 3:9 Do not lie to one another, since you laid aside the old self with its evil practices,

1 Tim 6:10 For the love of money is a root of all sorts of evil, and some by longing for it have wandered away from the faith and pierced themselves with many griefs.
Loving money too much is a sin.

1 Cor 5:1 It is actually reported that there is immorality among you, and immorality of such a kind as does not exist even among the Gentiles, that someone has his father's wife.
1 Cor 5:2 You have become arrogant and have not mourned instead, so that the one who had done this deed would be removed from your midst.
1 Cor 5:3 For I, on my part, though absent in body but present in spirit, have already judged him who has so committed this, as though I were present.
1 Cor 5:5 I have decided to deliver such a one to Satan for the destruction of his flesh, so that his spirit may be saved in the day of the Lord Jesus.
1 Cor 5:6 Your boasting is not good. Do you not know that a little leaven leavens the whole lump of dough?
Sleeping with your das wife is a sin, boasting is a sin.

More from Jesus
Mat 15:4 "For God said, 'HONOR YOUR FATHER AND MOTHER,' and, 'HE WHO SPEAKS EVIL OF FATHER OR MOTHER IS TO BE PUT TO DEATH.'
Not honoring your mother and father is a sin.

Mark 7:20 And He was saying, "That which proceeds out of the man, that is what defiles the man.
Mark 7:21 "For from within, out of the heart of men, proceed the evil thoughts, fornications, thefts, murders, adulteries,
Mark 7:22 deeds of coveting and wickedness, as well as deceit, sensuality, envy, slander, pride and foolishness.
Mark 7:23 "All these evil things proceed from within and defile the man."

I'm sure this is by no means an exhaustive list, but the fact is, many things are considered sin.

 

[jiggyfly]

They sure can, and you are doing just that by ignoring the God given revelation that there are more than just one law, and that Jesus said 'all' would not be fulfilled at least until heaven and earth pass away. As far as I am aware that has yet to happen.
Jiggy, how can all be fulfilled regarding the Ten Commandment law when there is yet billions of people worldwide who have yet not met Jesus? How can the unlearned know they are sinners without the law to tell them? Does not the law still have a purpose just as we have been discussing? Was that purpose expressly designed to point out our need of a Saviour? So if there are so many that still need a Saviour, how can they know their need without someone telling them what the law says? Jiggy, the law must still aplly, at the very least until the very last person repents of his sin and acknowledges His Saviour.

Haven't you heard? The HolySpirit has come and He will convict the world of it's sin. You ignore or at best misunderstand much of the new testament scriptures especially those in which Paul clearly explains that we are no longer bound, under, governed, guided, ruled, judged, convicted by the law and anyone who preaches/teaches to the contrary is not sent by God.

Good luck trying to earn God's favor by keeping rules and laws given to Israel in a covenant that is no longer active.

 

[jiggyfly]

What are some of the things Paul, Peter and James say are sin?

Rom 6:12 Therefore do not let sin reign in your mortal body so that you obey its lusts,
This could mean a few things, but at the very least, it means lust.

Jas 1:15 Then when lust has conceived, it gives birth to sin; and when sin is accomplished, it brings forth death.
James agrees that lust is sin.

Rom 7:7 What shall we say then? Is the Law sin? May it never be! On the contrary, I would not have come to know sin except through the Law; for I would not have known about coveting if the Law had not said, "YOU SHALL NOT COVET."
Coveting is a sin.

Rom 14:23 But he who doubts is condemned if he eats, because his eating is not from faith; and whatever is not from faith is sin.
Eating food sacrificed to idols is sin under some conditions.

1 Cor 8:12 And so, by sinning against the brethren and wounding their conscience when it is weak, you sin against Christ.
1 Cor 8:13 Therefore, if food causes my brother to stumble, I will never eat meat again, so that I will not cause my brother to stumble.
Causing someone else to stumble is a sin.

Heb 4:15 For we do not have a high priest who cannot sympathize with our weaknesses, but One who has been tempted in all things as we are, yet without sin.
This is a very interesting verse. Now we may not know every way in which Jesus was tempted, but we know some of them. (Matt 4:1-10)

Jas 2:9 But if you show partiality, you are committing sin and are convicted by the law as transgressors.
Showing favoritism is sin.

Jas 4:17 Therefore, to one who knows the right thing to do and does not do it, to him it is sin.
Simply not doing the right thing is sin.

2 Pet 2:14 having eyes full of adultery that never cease from sin, enticing unstable souls, having a heart trained in greed, accursed children;
Adultery and greed are sin.

1 John 5:17 All unrighteousness is sin, and there is a sin not leading to death.
All unrighteousness, wow, that covers a LOT of stuff.

Rom 1:29 being filled with all unrighteousness, wickedness, greed, evil; full of envy, murder, strife, deceit, malice; they are gossips,
Rom 1:30 slanderers, haters of God, insolent, arrogant, boastful, inventors of evil, disobedient to parents,

1 Cor 6:18 Flee immorality. Every other sin that a man commits is outside the body, but the immoral man sins against his own body.
Immorality is a sin.

Jas 3:16 For where jealousy and selfish ambition exist, there is disorder and every evil thing.
Jas 4:16 But as it is, you boast in your arrogance; all such boasting is evil.

Col 3:5 Therefore consider the members of your earthly body as dead to immorality, impurity, passion, evil desire, and greed, which amounts to idolatry.
Col 3:9 Do not lie to one another, since you laid aside the old self with its evil practices,

1 Tim 6:10 For the love of money is a root of all sorts of evil, and some by longing for it have wandered away from the faith and pierced themselves with many griefs.
Loving money too much is a sin.

1 Cor 5:1 It is actually reported that there is immorality among you, and immorality of such a kind as does not exist even among the Gentiles, that someone has his father's wife.
1 Cor 5:2 You have become arrogant and have not mourned instead, so that the one who had done this deed would be removed from your midst.
1 Cor 5:3 For I, on my part, though absent in body but present in spirit, have already judged him who has so committed this, as though I were present.
1 Cor 5:5 I have decided to deliver such a one to Satan for the destruction of his flesh, so that his spirit may be saved in the day of the Lord Jesus.
1 Cor 5:6 Your boasting is not good. Do you not know that a little leaven leavens the whole lump of dough?
Sleeping with your das wife is a sin, boasting is a sin.

More from Jesus
Mat 15:4 "For God said, 'HONOR YOUR FATHER AND MOTHER,' and, 'HE WHO SPEAKS EVIL OF FATHER OR MOTHER IS TO BE PUT TO DEATH.'
Not honoring your mother and father is a sin.

Mark 7:20 And He was saying, "That which proceeds out of the man, that is what defiles the man.
Mark 7:21 "For from within, out of the heart of men, proceed the evil thoughts, fornications, thefts, murders, adulteries,
Mark 7:22 deeds of coveting and wickedness, as well as deceit, sensuality, envy, slander, pride and foolishness.
Mark 7:23 "All these evil things proceed from within and defile the man."

I'm sure this is by no means an exhaustive list, but the fact is, many things are considered sin.

Have you heard about Jesus?

29 The next day John saw Jesus coming toward him and said, “Look! The Lamb of God who takes away the sin of the world!
John 1:29 (NLT)

19 For God in all his fullness

was pleased to live in Christ,
20 and through him God reconciled

everything to himself.

He made peace with everything in heaven and on earth

by means of Christ’s blood on the cross.


21 This includes you who were once far away from God. You were his enemies, separated from him by your evil thoughts and actions.22 Yet now he has reconciled you to himself through the death of Christ in his physical body. As a result, he has brought you into his own presence, and you are holy and blameless as you stand before him without a single fault.
Col 1:19-22 (NLT)

 

[David777]

Now which commands are we talking about?

Matthew 28
19 Go therefore and make disciples of all the nations, baptizing them in the
name of the Father and the Son and the Holy Spirit,
20 teaching them to observe all that I commanded you; and lo, I am with you
always, even to the end of the age.”

When God speaks directly to us we listen.

Observe all that Jesus commanded us to observe!

 

[David777]

Hello all.

Has anyone noticed that there are two parts
to the Bible, the Old and the New?

 

[David777]

Hey jiggyfly, having fun?

Romans 9:4
who are Israelites, to whom belongs the adoption as sons, and the glory
and the covenants and the giving of the Law and the temple service
and the promises,


No one understands context hence they blur old covenants
with the new covenant. Sowing an old patch on new fabric will
tear the fabric. New wineskins are required for the new wine.

Jesus Christ has instituted a New Covenant in His own blood.

Look up the word "covenant".

 

[brakelite]

Haven't you heard? The HolySpirit has come and He will convict the world of it's sin. You ignore or at best misunderstand much of the new testament scriptures especially those in which Paul clearly explains that we are no longer bound, under, governed, guided, ruled, judged, convicted by the law and anyone who preaches/teaches to the contrary is not sent by God.

Good luck trying to earn God's favor by keeping rules and laws given to Israel in a covenant that is no longer active.

Jesus said: Mt 5:27,28 Ye have heard that it was said by them of old time, Thou shalt not commit adultery: But I say unto you, That whosoever looketh on a woman to lust after her hath committed adultery with her already in his heart.

Jiggy says this only applies to Israel.

Jesus said: Matt. 5:21 ¶ Ye have heard that it was said by them of old time, Thou shalt not kill; and whosoever shall kill shall be in danger of the judgment:
22 But I say unto you, That whosoever is angry with his brother without a cause shall be in danger of the judgment: and whosoever shall say to his brother, Raca, shall be in danger of the council: but whosoever shall say, Thou fool, shall be in danger of hell fire.

Jiggy says this only applies to Israel.

So to those reading this thread, you be the judge. Who is right? Jiggy, or Jesus?

B-A-C has done a great job showing NT references to sin, transgressions all of which are against the law according to the Apostle John.

Jiggy, when the Holy Spirit convicts you of sin, is He agreeing or disagreeing with the law?

 

[jiggyfly]

Jesus said: Mt 5:27,28 Ye have heard that it was said by them of old time, Thou shalt not commit adultery: But I say unto you, That whosoever looketh on a woman to lust after her hath committed adultery with her already in his heart.

Jiggy says this only applies to Israel.

Jesus said: Matt. 5:21 ¶ Ye have heard that it was said by them of old time, Thou shalt not kill; and whosoever shall kill shall be in danger of the judgment:
22 But I say unto you, That whosoever is angry with his brother without a cause shall be in danger of the judgment: and whosoever shall say to his brother, Raca, shall be in danger of the council: but whosoever shall say, Thou fool, shall be in danger of hell fire.

Jiggy says this only applies to Israel.

So to those reading this thread, you be the judge. Who is right? Jiggy, or Jesus?

B-A-C has done a great job showing NT references to sin, transgressions all of which are against the law according to the Apostle John.

Jiggy, when the Holy Spirit convicts you of sin, is He agreeing or disagreeing with the law?

I have accepted Jesus' death sacrifice as my atonement. You seem to suggest more is need for my atonement but I am dead to what you teach and believe. Christ has set me free and I am now living in the new covenant between me and Father and HolySpirit is my guide.

At any rate, good luck to you and BAC if either of you ever want to enter God's rest and enjoy the freedom that Christ brings let me know, I will try to encourage you as you do.

 

[jiggyfly]

Hey jiggyfly, having fun?

Romans 9:4
who are Israelites, to whom belongs the adoption as sons, and the glory
and the covenants and the giving of the Law and the temple service
and the promises,


No one understands context hence they blur old covenants
with the new covenant. Sowing an old patch on new fabric will
tear the fabric. New wineskins are required for the new wine.

Jesus Christ has instituted a New Covenant in His own blood.

Look up the word "covenant".

No not really, it's like arguing with a blind man about the color of his socks. I've decided to leave them to propagate their teachings of Jesus + works = salvation. The responsibility rests on the admin and mods here so I will leave it to them to deal with those who do such things.I will pray for BL and BAC and the others who share the same religious paradigm that God will heal them.

 

[B-A-C]

No not really, it's like arguing with a blind man about the color of his socks. I've decided to leave them to propagate their teachings of Jesus + works = salvation. The responsibility rests on the admin and mods here so I will leave it to them to deal with those who do such things.I will pray for BL and BAC and the others who share the same religious paradigm that God will heal them.

Again I say, my salvation doesn't depend on it.
We should just do it because we love him.

 

[brakelite]

Jiggy, you seem to be insinuating that those of us who believe in keeping God's commanments are somehow 'outside' the accepted norm for Christian practice. Allow me to quote a few people:

Calvin—Eternal Rule of Life.—We must not imagine that the coming of Christ has freed us from the authority of the law; for it is the eternal rule of a devout and holy life, and must, therefore, be as unchangeable, as the justice of God, which it embraced, is constant and uniform.—Commentary on a Harmony of the Evangelists (1845), Vol. 1, p. 277.
Wesley—Remains in Force.—But the moral law contained in the ten commandments, and enforced by the prophets, he did not take away. It was not the design of his coming to revoke any part of this. This is a law which never can be broken, which "stands fast as the faithful witness in heaven." The moral stands on an entirely different foundation from the ceremonial or ritual law. . . . Every part of this law must remain in force upon all mankind, and in all ages; as not depending either on time or place, or any other circumstances liable to change, but on the nature of God, and the nature of man, and their unchangeable relation to each other.—Sermons on Several Occasions, vol. 1, pp. 221, 222.

​

Morgan—Obedience by Faith.—It is only when grace enables men to keep the law, that they are free from it; just as a moral man who lives according to the laws of the country is free from arrest. God has not set aside law, but he has found a way by which man can fulfill law, and so be free from it—The Ten Commandments (1901), p. 23.

Spurgeon—The Law of God Perpetual.—Very great mistakes have been made about the law. Not long ago there were those about us who affirmed that the law is utterly abrogated and abolished, and they openly taught that believers were not bound to make the moral law the rule of their lives. What would have been sin in other men they counted to be no sin in themselves. From such Antinomianism as that may God deliver us. . . .

The Law of God Must Be Perpetual. There is no abrogation of it, nor amendment of it. It is not to be toned down or adjusted to our fallen condition; but every one of the Lord's righteous judgments, abideth for ever. . . .

Does any man say to me, "You see, then, instead of the ten commandments we have received the two commandments, and these are much easier." I answer that this reading of the law is not in the least easier. Such a remark implies a want of thought and experience. Those two precepts comprehend the ten at their fullest extent, and cannot be regarded as the erasure of a jot or tittle of them. . . .

Christ has not, therefore, abrogated or at all moderated the law to meet our helplessness; he has left it in all its sublime perfection, as it always must be left, and he has pointed out how deep are its foundations, how elevated are its heights, how measureless are its length and breadth. . . .

To show that he never meant to abrogate the law, our Lord Jesus has embodied all its commands in his own life. In his own person there was a nature which was perfectly conformed to the law of God; and as was his nature such was his life. He could say, "Which of you convinceth me of sin?" and again "I have kept my Father's commandments and abide in his love.". . .

By his death he has vindicated the honour of God's moral government, and made it just for him to be merciful. When the lawgiver himself submits to the law, when the sovereign himself bears the extreme penalty of that law, then is the justice of God set upon such a glorious high throne that all admiring worlds must wonder at it. If therefore it is clearly proven that Jesus was obedient to the law, even to the extent of death, he certainly did not come to abolish or abrogate it; and if he did not remove it, who can do so? If he declares that he came to establish it, who shall overthrow it?. . .
The law is absolutely complete, and you can neither add to it nor take from it. "For whosoever shall keep the whole law, and yet offend in one point, he is guilty of all. For he that said, Do not commit adultery, said also, Do not kill. Now if thou commit no adultery, yet if thou kill, thou art become a transgressor of the law." If, then, no part of it can be taken down, it must stand, and stand for ever.—The Perpetuity of the Law of God, published in Spurgeon's Expository Encyclopedia, by Baker.

Billy Graham—Permanent and Unchanging.—The word "Law" is used by the New Testament writers in two senses. Sometimes it refers to the ceremonial law of the Old Testament, which is concerned about ritual matters and regulations regarding food and drink and things of that kind. From this law Christians are indeed free. But the New Testament also speaks of the moral law, which is of a permanent, unchanging character and s summarized in the Ten Commandments.—Associated Press Dispatch, Chicago Tribune Syndicate.

Moody—Law Eternal: Obeyed With Love in the Heart.—The question for each one of us is—are we keeping them [the commandments]? If God should weigh us by them, would we be found wanting or not wanting? Do we keep the law, the whole law? Are we obeying God with all our heart? Do we render Him a full and willing obedience?

These ten commandments are not ten different laws; they are one law. If I am being held up in the air by a chain with ten links, and I break one of them, down I come, just as surely as if I break the whole ten. If I am forbidden to go out of an enclosure, it makes no difference at what point I break through the fence. "Whosoever shall keep the whole law and yet offend in one point, he is guilty of all." "The golden chain of obedience is broken if one link is missing." . . .
For fifteen hundred years man was under the law, and no one was equal to it. Christ came and showed that the commandments went beyond the mere letter; and can any one since say that he has been able to keep them in his own strength? . . .

I can imagine that you are saying to yourself, "If we are to be judged by these laws, how are we going to be saved? Nearly every one of them has been broken by us—in spirit, if not in letter."
I almost hear you say: "I wonder if Mr. Moody is ready to be weighed? Would he like to put those tests to himself?"
With all humility I reply that if God commanded me to step into the scales now, I am ready.
"What!" you say, "haven't you broken the law?"
Yes, I have. I was a sinner before God the same as you; but forty years ago I plead guilty at His bar. I cried for mercy, and He forgave me. If I step into the scales, the Son of God has promised to be with me. I would not dare to step in without Him. If I did, how quickly the scales would fly up!

Christ kept the law. If He had ever broken it, He would have had to die for Himself; but because He was a Lamb without spot or blemish, His atoning death is efficacious for you and me. . . . Christ is the end of the law for righteousness to every one that believeth. We are righteous in God's sight because the righteousness of God, which is by faith in Jesus Christ, is unto all and upon all them that believe. . . .
If the love of God is shed abroad in your heart, you will be able to fulfill the law.—Weighed and Wanting, pp. 119-124.

 

[David777]

With all humility I reply that if God commanded me to step into the scales now, I am ready.

If the love of God is shed abroad in your heart, you will be able to fulfill the law.—Weighed and Wanting, pp. 119-124.

Hey brakelite, if you have the righteousness of Christ
then you do not need to step on any scales.

Why would you bother to fulfill the letter of the law
when Christ has already fulfilled the law for the Jews
and all mankind.

 

[B-A-C]

Have you heard about Jesus?

29 The next day John saw Jesus coming toward him and said, “Look! The Lamb of God who takes away the sin of the world!
John 1:29 (NLT)

19 For God in all his fullness

was pleased to live in Christ,
20 and through him God reconciled

everything to himself.

He made peace with everything in heaven and on earth

by means of Christ’s blood on the cross.


21 This includes you who were once far away from God. You were his enemies, separated from him by your evil thoughts and actions.22 Yet now he has reconciled you to himself through the death of Christ in his physical body. As a result, he has brought you into his own presence, and you are holy and blameless as you stand before him without a single fault.
Col 1:19-22 (NLT)

I was wondering if you were a Unitarian Universalist. They believe this same thing.
Jesus died for everyone, the whole world, the whole world's sins are forgiven. It doesn't matter if you know him or believe in him, you're saved anyway.

On the other hand you might not be because most of the ones I have spoken to believe we can still sin, but if we do our sin is covered.
(I am actually in agreement with them about the second part)

In the New Testament, we have John 14:15; John 14:21; 1 John 5:2-3; 2 John 1:6 that all say if we love Jesus we will keep his commandments.
It's true, not a single one of them says we have to keep them to be saved.

But I wonder how much do you have to hate him to just wade through through his blood and say that none of it matters?

Now of course, where the Universalists are wrong, is that there is a requirement for salvation, nope it's not keeping the commandments.

John 3:16 "For God so loved the world, that He gave His only begotten Son, that whoever believes in Him shall not perish, but have eternal life.
You gotta believe.

They are also partially wrong on the second part.
1 John 1:9 If we confess our sins, He is faithful and righteous to forgive us our sins and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness.

Some of those verses about loving God and keeping his commandments are quotes from the OT.
Exo 20:6; Deut 5:10; Dan 9:4

But many of us, including David, just love him because he loved us, and that's a good enough reason.
Psa 119:47-48

 

[B-A-C]

How much does Jesus love you?

Jesus was falsely accused Luke 23:14
rejected by his own people Luke 23:21
denied Matt 26:75
whipped Matt 27:26
stripped Matt 27:28
had a crown of thorns placed on him Matt 27:29
spit upon Matt 27:30
beaten Matt 27:30
mocked Matt 27:31; Matt 27:41
crucified Matt 27:35
cursed at and insulted Matt 27:39; Matt 27:44
forsaken by God his father Matt 27:46
pierced John 19:34

Isa 53:3 He was despised and forsaken of men, A man of sorrows and acquainted with grief; And like one from whom men hide their face He was despised, and we did not esteem Him.
Isa 53:4 Surely our griefs He Himself bore, And our sorrows He carried; Yet we ourselves esteemed Him stricken, Smitten of God, and afflicted.
Isa 53:5 But He was pierced through for our transgressions, He was crushed for our iniquities; The chastening for our well-being fell upon Him, And by His scourging we are healed.
Isa 53:6 All of us like sheep have gone astray, Each of us has turned to his own way; But the LORD has caused the iniquity of us all To fall on Him.
Isa 53:7 He was oppressed and He was afflicted, Yet He did not open His mouth; Like a lamb that is led to slaughter, And like a sheep that is silent before its shearers, So He did not open His mouth.
Isa 53:8 By oppression and judgment He was taken away; And as for His generation, who considered That He was cut off out of the land of the living For the transgression of my people, to whom the stroke was due?
Isa 53:9 His grave was assigned with wicked men, Yet He was with a rich man in His death, Because He had done no violence, Nor was there any deceit in His mouth.
Isa 53:10 But the LORD was pleased To crush Him, putting Him to grief; If He would render Himself as a guilt offering, He will see His offspring, He will prolong His days, And the good pleasure of the LORD will prosper in His hand.
Isa 53:11 As a result of the anguish of His soul, He will see it and be satisfied; By His knowledge the Righteous One, My Servant, will justify the many, As He will bear their iniquities.

This is how much he loves you.

John 15:13 "Greater love has no one than this, that one lay down his life for his friends.
Rom 5:8 But God demonstrates His own love toward us, in that while we were yet sinners, Christ died for us.

 

[David777]

I was wondering if you were a Unitarian Universalist. They believe this same thing.
Jesus died for everyone, the whole world, the whole world's sins are forgiven.
It doesn't matter if you know him or believe in him, you're saved anyway.

Hello B-A-C.

Jiggyfly is extending the love of God to all mankind.

I hope and I pray that he is correct, I am not as
confident and I hope that I am wrong.

1 Timothy 4:10
For it is for this we labor and strive, because we have fixed our hope
on the living God, who is the Savior of all men, especially of believers.

 

[brakelite]

I think David that because Jesus sacrifice has the potential for salvation for all men, then He can be described as the Saviour of the world, but especially to those who believe.