The truth revealed by the Holy Spirit about the sinful nature of certain acts is not wisdom? Please explain why it is not.
So are you saying the truth received from the Holy Spirit about how to live more like Christ is not wisdom?
Not really, truth revealed is called
revelation or
reality, and where it concerns sins, may also involve discernment, or conviction.
Truth received is called guidance, direction or instruction.
I think, perhaps we should consider Socrates guidance for a moment:
“All good counsel begins in the same way: A man should know what he is advising about, or his counsel will all come to nought. But people imagine that they know about the nature of things, when they really don’'t know about them. And not having come to an understanding at first--because they think that they know--they end up as might be expected, in contradicting one another and even themselves! Now you and I must not be guilty of this fundamental error which we condemn in others."
(Phaedrus)
His counsel seems wise to me, but also seems not to be an example of wisdom to you. For he is giving guidance about seeking the truth: One must know what he is talking about. In other words, one must define his terms. Wisdom or not, I think this is good advice in our case.
His counsel may be wise, but his counsel is not wisdom. You said it yourself, it is not wisdom but
counsel and
guidance.
So please tell me: How do you define wisdom? You have told me what it is not. For you said it is not guidance. You have told me its source. For you said I may receive it only from the Holy Spirit. You have told me what it does. For you said it causes me to comprehend, rather than merely apprehend the truth. But I'm not sure you have explained exactly what wisdom is. You said Jesus is our wisdom, citing this passage:
But to those whom God has called, both Jews and Greeks, Christ is the power of God and the wisdom of God.
(*1 Corinthians *1:*24)
But what exactly does that mean? Is my comprehension Jesus? Are my thoughts really him? Or is wisdom something else?
I have already stated in one of my previous posts what wisdom is, that you probably missed, post #154 "
Wisdom is the ability to understand (spiritual things, in context of God's wisdom)".
Merely sharing knowledge of how to do something or telling someone what they should do, does not give them the ability to understand, what they are doing or why they are doing it. Wisdom is not the ability to merely apply knowledge, nor the ability to follow directions, not the ability to receive knowledge. Wisdom, is the ability to understand the knowledge that you apply, the ability to understand the directions you are given, the ability to understand, the knowledge you receive.
"For you said I may receive it only from the Holy Spirit. "
I thought we already established in a previous post, to which you agreed, that a person cannot receive wisdom from another person, just as you cannot receive another person's physical strength. So how can you say you may receive it from the Holy Spirit? Instead, you receive the Holy Spirit who is your wisdom (not, your wisdom is the Holy Spirit). "Is my comprehension Jesus?" - no, that is
your comprehension. "Are my thoughts really him?" - no, they are
your thoughts. But when His comprehension, is your comprehension, and his thoughts, are your thoughts, then you have the mind of Christ (1 Cor 2:16).
Everything I am saying is really a paraphrase of 1 Corinthians 2, it might be worthwhile for you to read it.
In the first few verses the apostle says that he only knew one thing - Jesus Christ. he did not have any wisdom, power or excellency of speech of his own.
You too, as a Christian, should not know Socrates, you should only know Jesus Christ.
This rules out anything of the natural man, including the wisdom of Socrates that comes by the way of teaching and learning.
This also rules out the idea that the Holy Spirit gives us wisdom and knowledge, rather than the Holy Spirit being our wisdom and knowledge. We become no wiser after receiving the Holy Spirit than we are before receiving the Holy Spirit. To become as wise as the Holy Spirit in ourselves, would constitute our spirit becoming the Holy Spirit, and thus a man becoming God, which cannot be. However, God knows all the things about human beings, because God became a human being.
Then Paul says that only the Spirit knows the things of God - the natural man can not achieve knowledge of such things. The human spirit knows human things, the Spirit of God knows God things, but the human spirit cannot know God things, only the Holy Spirit knows.
The Spirit is given so that we may have the knowledge of God and the discernment/understanding of God (i.e. wisdom).
Then he says that he has the mind of Christ. Not that Paul's mind is Christ, but that within Paul lives Christ's mind. What this is, theologically, is a type of hypostatic union. Origen said "
"This substance of a soul, then, being intermediate between God and the flesh – it being impossible for the nature of God to intermingle with a body without an intermediate instrument – the God-man is born." ( Origen, De Principiis, Book II, Chapter VI. On the Incarnation of the Christ, 203-250 A.D.)
To explain a little - the soul is intermediate between God (Spirit) and flesh (our physical body).
It is to our soul that the Spirit of God can spread, giving us the "mind of Christ".
It is not that God gives us His mind, or that we become God's mind, but that God's mind and our mind are joined as one.
This is otherwise known as transformation (2 Cor 3:18, Rom 12:2).
This is one reason why God gives believers the Spirit to dwell in them, rather than merely to teach them in an outward way.
But having the indwelling Spirit is not enough, a person must also abide in the Spirit. A consequence of this, is not having a need for anyone to teach us, as we have the mind of Christ by abiding in Him (1 John 2:27).
Some relevant passages below:
1 Cor 2
11 For what man knoweth the things of a man, save the spirit of man which is in him? even so the things of God knoweth no man, but the Spirit of God.
12 Now we have received, not the spirit of the world, but the spirit which is of God; that we might know the things that are freely given to us of God.
13 Which things also we speak, not in the words which man's wisdom teacheth, but which the Holy Ghost teacheth; comparing spiritual things with spiritual.
14 But the natural man receiveth not the things of the Spirit of God: for they are foolishness unto him: neither can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned.
15 But he that is spiritual judgeth all things, yet he himself is judged of no man.
16 For who hath known the mind of the Lord, that he may instruct him? but we have the mind of Christ.
