Welcome!

By registering with us, you'll be able to discuss, share and private message with other members of our community.

SignUp Now!
  • Welcome to Talk Jesus Christian Forums

    Celebrating 20 Years!

    A bible based, Jesus Christ centered community.

    Register Log In

Can A Christian Lose Their Salvation?

I think all of you, are very smart in here!! So instead of arguing on either side,let me ask one question?? PLEASE!!! LOL

Howdy Brighthouse!

Well, Ask away!!

BH--Would you say,that those who believer we cannot lose our salvation,for any reason!! Does this mean we do not have the right to discard our salvation either??
Well, actually, Not only can a believer not lose their salvation, but, they cannot discard it either.

So, Let us ask this question. What in the world can a believer do in Jesus Christ if they do not want to walk in the Spirit with Power over the devil?

Well, Here is the powerful answer. They can choose to walk in the flesh. Isn't that exciting?

They do not have to go to Church, They do not have to walk in Faith, They do not have to walk in Power, They do not have to pray, they do not have to study their Bibles, and they do not have to walk in love and be forgiving.

So, What happens when a believer decides to walk in the flesh? Oh boy, This is so exciting.

They get to meet the devil. They get to see all of the bad points of deception. They get to lie all the time. Cheat all the time. Forget about being honest. Marriage fidelity? Who cares.

They can steal and be just like the grinch and not think twice. Isn't this exciting? They can curse their parents because the devil says you will not die. They can curse God and Jesus Christ.

Do you get this picture?

BH--I know I know!! why would we want to!! understand!
Oh, I understand completely.

BH--The only point though to this question is can't we? If you say we cannot,then would that also mean we cannot sin either? Not a smack now!! just a question! Because if we cannot sin because we are saved,then why have any fruit? what is the point? thanks!
No, We cannot lose our salvation and we cannot discard our salvation. Therefore, We cannot say that we do not sin. Because, While we live in a body of flesh, We will sin.

1 John 1:8 If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us.

Therefore, Thank God for the Forgiveness provided by Jesus Christ. When we call upon Him with a contrite heart full of repentance, Jesus Christ will forgive every failure to walk in the Spirit. 1 John 1:9.

Secondly, We bear fruit by Walking the Spirit so that when we stand before Jesus Christ on our judgment day, We will receive our rewards for the good works, or good fruit, we produced while walking in the Spirit. 1 Corinthians 3:11-15.

When we walk in the flesh, We will suffer great loss.

God Bless You!

Dr. Mike
 
Hahaha.

Dr. Mike,

You must have been one heck of a bad person before you met Jesus, if that's your idea of life without Him. Let me just say, from the outside looking in, you have a pretty shoddy perception of what humans are actually like.
 
Last edited:
Well, There is one Powerful Point in the Bible that is so refreshing to me when I think about this point. Jesus Christ was NEVER a Calvinist. Jesus Christ was, is, and shall ever be the Son of the Most High God.

Nobody was anything other than either a Christian or a pagan in the early Church. There were no distinctions or drawn lines to separate belief systems and thought processes.

Secondly, John Calvin was one of many Believers in Jesus Christ in his day. And, When He stands before Jesus Christ on his judgment day, He will have a lot of explaining to do.

This is why I am not a follower of John Calvin. This is the common misconception. Many people (non-Calvinists) take Calvinism to mean the individual follows, adores, defends, and nearly worships John Calvin. The truth couldn't be any further from this. Calvinism is simply the common name given to the thought process and interpretation of Scripture during the Reformation. Oddly enough, it did not begin with Calvin and most of the doctrines Calvinists believe were formulated well after his death after Theodore Beza sort of took up the mantle and continued the teaching. Calvin left many things up to the mysteries of God. Beza believed in using logic and Scripture to form conclusions to things. Again, it bears the name Calvinism but not everything stemmed from Calvin and many things Calvin taught were things that were taught in the early Church by Augustine.

An even more ironic nugget of knowledge is that if it weren't for the likes of John Calvin, Martin Luther, etc, we would all still be Roman Catholics. At one point, you were either Catholic or a "Calvinist" though it was not referred to as such. The common belief system of modern America did not form until years after Calvin's death and was even condemned as heresy before being embraced centuries later.

What would really be amazing on his judgment day is for John Calvin to find out from Jesus Christ that limited atonement did not apply to him.

This simply shows a lack of understanding of what Limited Atonement actually teaches but I won't go into that here. I have delivered a sermon on it in the past. I can direct you to that or we can discuss it more later.

Personally, I think it is too bad that he cannot come back and tell us what he learned. I have often wondered about the look on his face when Jesus told him everything.

For one, I bet he learned he was wrong regarding infant baptism. He believed in it as did Martin Luther. Again, I am not a follower of Calvin and all his teachings just because I am a Calvinist by name. To better describe myself, I would classify myself as a Modern Reformer. I hold to all the "solas" taught during the Reformation.

# Sola scriptura ("by Scripture alone")
# Sola fide ("by faith alone")
# Sola gratia ("by grace alone")
# Solus Christus or Solo Christo ("Christ alone" or "through Christ alone")
# Soli Deo gloria ("glory to God alone")

Why would I say that? According to the Seed Covenant of Abraham spoken by God Himself, John Calvin is a member of the Seed of Abraham multiplied as the stars of the heaven.

And, According to the Seed Covenant of Abraham spoken by God Himself, Limited Atonement is only for the Seed of Jacob multiplied as the dust of the earth.

Also, Abraham and Jacob are not the same person.

If I was a gambling man, I would bet he would throw a temper tantrum right in front of Jesus Christ. I say again...If I was a gambling man.

This, once again, shows a lack of understanding regarding the Reformation teaching of Limited Atonement. In the end, you have opinions of something that doesn't exist. Because you don't understand Limited Atonement, you have yet to form an opinion on what does exist and have only belittled the idea you have concocted in your mind (or wherever your misunderstanding came from). I'll just leave it at that.
 
I think all of you, are very smart in here!! So instead of arguing on either side,let me ask one question?? PLEASE!!! LOL Would you say,that those who believer we cannot lose our salvation,for any reason!! Does this mean we do not have the right to discard our salvation either?? I know I know!! why would we want to!! understand! The only point though to this question is can't we? If you say we cannot,then would that also mean we cannot sin either? Not a smack now!! just a question! Because if we cannot sin because we are saved,then why have any fruit? what is the point? thanks!

I am sure you will get several responses to this excellent question and I am only another voice in the wilderness and believe me there is a large wilderness of answers out there.

I would like to take your sin and fruit statement first. My belief on this is that there is no such thing as "not sinning". I don't care who you are, saved or not we all sin and fall short of the glory of God.
The reason that God said that the Old Covenant Law was insufficient, is that it only covered over your sin and that you had to go through the process of the "Day of Atonement" over and over again, year after year. In fact, the High Priest of the Temple had instructions that there would be no seats available to him in the Temple because his job was NEVER done. As soon as the Atonement was complete for that year, the Priest had to get ready for a year long process to prepare for next year.

God said that he had a better and perfect covenant and that was the covenant Law of Love and Grace. With this contract from God, and when Jesus Christ had finished his work (please see the symbolism to the old covenant Priest), Christ sat down at the right hand of the Father for ever!
Christ's finished work did not cover over your sin, he took it away from the sight of God for ever. Now this is very important: to what ever degree we all still sin because we are not perfect yet; to say we don't sin is to say that we are perfect and that is impossible while we are still in the flesh. But, if you are "Born of the Spirit", when God looks at you, he does not see your sin but he sees his son's perfection in you. And, it is not and never will be your fruit because God said then you could boast of yourself, but it is the fruit of Jesus Christ working through you. Though you sin, God does not acknowledge that but looks at your faith by observing the works of Jesus through you. Remember, Jesus said that he is the vine and you are the branch........the branch only bears the fruit of the vine and does not create it.

Now your one question, do you have the right to discard your salvation? This is such a good question, I have never seen it put in quite that way and it is very thought provoking and, for the most part, it is one of those things that requires a large portion of faith on your part and what you have already answered in "Why Would You Want To". I personally feel that it is a contract that can only be broken by God and he says that he will never leave us and that we are signed sealed and delivered to Jesus Christ, forever!

First of all, yes you do have the right to throw it away, God has always maintain your right to choice, after that, you just have to have a finished or near finished understanding what God has given you and realize that by his design there is nothing you can do to deserve it because we are in fact still imperfect. And, because we don't deserve it or can earn it, it is a gift from him and if it is a gift, it is free. Now let's look at what is in this free gift:

FORGIVENESS

The is the "Finished Work Of The Cross", Jesus died one time for all and all sin; your sins yesterday, today and tomorrow! God said "And I will look at their sins no more"; he didn't say: And they will sin no more!

DEATH

The Bible in Hebrews, say that the New Covenant is like a will and where there is a will there must be a death of the one who made it. Jesus died to consummate and put his will in force. It is your inheritance you have no choice in it except to receive this free gift or not; God certainly will not be the one to take it away from you. The very instant that Jesus died God's new covenant started. Look at Mark 15: 37-38. The curtain tearing was the veil in the Temple that separated the "Holy of Holies" from the rest of the Temple. God resided there behind the veil and it separated God from man's sin and it also instantly tore when Jesus died. This signified that there was no more separation between man and God over sin and that God no longer resides in the Temple, hence forth, he resides in the hearts and minds of men. Brighthouse he resides is you.

RESURRECTION

With your forgiveness and inheritance in hand, the resurrection offers you your acceptance of these. Because Jesus Christ was raised from the dead and when you accept God's free gift, Jesus Christ's resurrected life comes into you and you are born of the Spirit and you salvation is complete; you have it now, it is not something you get later. Jesus told Nicodemus that this is your second birth. Webster's says that birth is being born, parentage, origin.
Once you have this parentage or origin, there is no such thing has not having this origin, once you or born you can not be unborn!! I take this on faith, that it mean s "once saved" always saved.

Brighthouse,

We all are human, in the flesh and sinful and as a part of our sinning, we all have our periods of ups / downs, negative / positives and beliefs / doubts. But through it away, others will disagree but I say no, it is impossible to be unborn and turn to Apostasy, that is only for a person who was never born in the first place. For me and my house, we will always worship the lord and rest in his peace and know that his truth continues to set me free.
 
Last edited:
A Christian CANNOT lose his salvation IF he is a genuine believer.

Philippians 1:6
Romans 8:29-30

The evidence of a true believer is that he is looking upon Christ and growing in sanctification.
Also the sign of maturity in a christian's life is that he is more and more dependent upon God.

The devil cannot destroy the work of regeneration in a christian's life, but what he can do, is lying. So let us constantly renew our mind in the word of God because our minds are constantly being attacked.

Praise God!
Amen.
 
Last edited:
Very good R.J! and Tusk!Azured!, Rojo! and El! and Mighty! I respect all of your views!! As we have all seen,many different views,in the end,only Jesus, who carries the only Lambs Book of Life,will decide. I personally think there will be many gasps,and surprises at our result! But!! my hope!! is that we will all be togather with our Jesus,laughting with one another in heaven!! Thanks all!!
 
I was trying to get the message across that Jesus, being God, the Son of God, and filled with the Holy Spirit was/is able to speak simultaneously to all men for all time. Because He says, "...I will write my LAWS in their hearts and in their minds..." it seems to me he just may be talking about His LAWS being written in the heart and in the mind. He doesn't say, "I will write my SALVATION in their hearts and in their minds." or "I will write my eternal security in my sacrifice in their hearts and in their minds."

What else I'm saying is that just because somebody went forward for the Altar Call at the age of 7 doesn't guarantee them entry into heaven if they live on through the age of accountability and through adulthood. There's far, far more to it, and every single book of the Bible addresses some aspect of the 'more', old or new Testament.

Going along with that, it's my deep conviction in my heart that this whole thing of Jesus is not a matter of sitting up in the box seats with our binoculars viewing the contest occurring on the field below. I believe that this thing of Spiritual Warfare is deadly serious and we face a tremendous adversary, against whom we are entirely helpless without the guidance of the Holy Spirit, strengthening by often fellowhip with Christian brothers and sisters, and by their prayers, immersion in the Word as often as possible, and by putting on the whole armor of God, so that we may withstand.

Maybe for a lot of folks it's all just going along okay fine. For me it has been a life and death struggle, meaning loss of everything I had, as loss of so much I cannot even describe between tangible and intangible, plus continuous physical attack of every type 24/7/365 for the last 8 years, direct attempts to take my life as in 3 attempted murders on my person, and a constant daily battle to stay right before my Lord God Almighty within His Perfect Sacrifice for my immortal soul. Example: I chose total celibacy. Okay, how many of you guys have a drop-dead gorgeous total stranger female show up and start stripping down to buck naked right in front of you, saying, "Come on, honey, how about it, there's nobody else around....?"!!!!! Yep, fact!

For me, it's a battle, moment by moment 24 hours a day, but THANK GOD my side always wins, because Jesus won at the cross....

All books in Scripture address Christian conduct and action, not kicking back and coasting through the pearly gates. If there's so very much in there about our conduct that should be a real big hint that there may be a whole lot more to it than just claiming His precious name and trusting Him to do all the work to keep us out of sin and eternal death and saying, "I'm eternally secure, it's a done deal!" I believe Paul addresses it best, as I mentioned previously: "Therefore, work out your own salvation with fear and trembling...."

.I will write my LAWS in their hearts and in their minds..." it seems to me he just may be talking about His LAWS being written in the heart and in the mind. He doesn't say, "I will write my SALVATION in their hearts and in their minds." or "I will write my eternal security in my sacrifice in their hearts and in their minds."



No offense and I mean this with all respect and love, I really don't know what you mean above.
But, it does appear to me what it doesn't mean and that is the truth as I see it.
Our salvation is a result of " I will write my laws in their hearts and in their minds":

Jeremiah 31:31-34

31 “The days are coming,” declares the LORD,
“when I will make a new covenant
with the people of Israel
and with the people of Judah.
32 It will not be like the covenant
I made with their ancestors
when I took them by the hand
to lead them out of Egypt,
because they broke my covenant,
though I was a husband to[d] them,[e]”
declares the LORD.
33 “This is the covenant I will make with the people of Israel
after that time,” declares the LORD.
I will put my law in their minds
and write it on their hearts.

I will be their God,
and they will be my people.
34 No longer will they teach their neighbor,
or say to one another, ‘Know the LORD,’
because they will all know me,
from the least of them to the greatest,”
declares the LORD.
“For I will forgive their wickedness
and will remember their sins no more.”

About 750 years later this covenant came into being with the death of Jesus. The greater meaning of this passage“I will put my law in their minds and write it on their hearts. is that God promised to live inside us. When Jesus died, instantaneously, the veil of the Levitical Temple was torn from top to bottom, signifying that sin no longer separated us from God. Also the "holy of Holies" behind the veil and God were no longer there. We now all share God inside us, he has indwelt himself inside us and the "Holy of Holies" is now inside of all Christians where he has put his laws in our hearts and minds...make no mistake about it, the biggest difference between then and now, we share God together because he lives inside us!
 
Last edited:
My Laws

Hebrews 10:16 (King James Version)


<sup class="versenum" id="en-KJV-30150">16</sup>This is the covenant that I will make with them after those days, saith the Lord, I will put my Words into their hearts, and in their minds will I write them;


In this verse, in fact in most of the bible you can safely translate the words 'law or laws' into the word 'Word' Read it that way. It goes with this verse...Romans 10:8
But what saith it? The word is nigh thee, even in thy mouth, and in thy heart: that is, the word of faith, which we preach;
 
Hebrews 10:16 (King James Version)


<sup class="versenum" id="en-KJV-30150">16</sup>This is the covenant that I will make with them after those days, saith the Lord, I will put my Words into their hearts, and in their minds will I write them;


In this verse, in fact in most of the bible you can safely translate the words 'law or laws' into the word 'Word' Read it that way. It goes with this verse...Romans 10:8
But what saith it? The word is nigh thee, even in thy mouth, and in thy heart: that is, the word of faith, which we preach;

Of course, it is ALL based on the word and all about the word:

John 1
The Word Became Flesh
1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. 2 He was with God in the beginning. 3 Through him all things were made; without him nothing was made that has been made. 4 In him was life, and that life was the light of all mankind. 5 The light shines in the darkness, and the darkness has not overcome[a] it.

The word was and is Jesus Christ. And the main point of "in their hearts and minds" is that this is possible by the New Covenant because Jesus Christ now lives inside us! He has written, not just through the Prophets, not just through the Apostles that we read in the Bible but, He is personally writing them on our hearts and minds as he lives in us and produces his fruits through us. And:

Jeremiah 31:34
No longer will they teach their neighbor,
or say to one another, ‘Know the LORD,’


Because we will know him ourselves as he continues to teach us!!!!!
 
Of course, it is ALL based on the word and all about the word:

John 1
The Word Became Flesh
1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. 2 He was with God in the beginning. 3 Through him all things were made; without him nothing was made that has been made. 4 In him was life, and that life was the light of all mankind. 5 The light shines in the darkness, and the darkness has not overcome[a] it.

The word was and is Jesus Christ. And the main point of "in their hearts and minds" is that this is possible by the New Covenant because Jesus Christ now lives inside us! He has written, not just through the Prophets, not just through the Apostles that we read in the Bible but, He is personally writing them on our hearts and minds as he lives in us and produces his fruits through us. And:

Jeremiah 31:34
No longer will they teach their neighbor,
or say to one another, ‘Know the LORD,’


Because we will know him ourselves as he continues to teach us!!!!!

I expected someone to sqauwk about that one. Thanks RJ
 
Apologies for a VERY long post which I tried to avoid: Some do not consider this question as a major part of their belief; others do and I’m of the latter opinion. To me it can’t get much more serious than possibly losing your way to eternal joy forever!

Every man is blessed with a Free Will to choose and decide in every moment of life what course they take. These are decisions in the heart of hearts regarding moral & spiritual conduct. Man's basic nature is one of selfishness from the time the baby first fills his lungs and bellows out at delivery, and then for its first meal. "Make my discomfort go away now! I want it, and I want it now!" For some people that demanding of the easy & quick way out never changes until the grave yawns wide.

The first sin in the Bible in the Garden of Eden, and every single other sin described in the Bible, is ALWAYS the same sin: SELFISHNESS! It may be manifested in a trillion different ways but the SELF as the focus of our actions, mental and physical, is never separated from our sin and is the root cause every single time. Satan's and all of the fallen angels sin is described in Isaiah 14:12, "I WILL!", fully in contradiction to the Word of God who says, "I AM". We see SELF manifested and ruling God’s created beings.

On the other hand, the hand of God, John the Baptist explains the substance of the entire Bible and all of its teachings in 6 words, found in John 3:31, "He must increase; I must decrease.", the diametrical opposite of the demand of Satan and SELF! As God has revealed himself, and then all the more calls out to sinners for repentance to turn to His Love, He is asking man to turn his focus to GOD, instead of SELF.

Because every man has Free Will to choose, God NEVER FORCES ANYONE TO REPENTANCE, because it wouldn’t be true repentance. God, as God, has total and complete power over all things for all time. He has chosen to relinquish part of that power as a Gift to man, in allowing all men by free will to control their own intellect. God never takes back this blessed gift of the power to choose our own course for our lives, even our eternal destination. Because it is a Spiritual Gift it cannot be effected by events in the physical world. Even a man imprisoned in chains in a dark, stinking dungeon chooses at every ticking instant whether he LETS God increase, or LETS himself increase, in his spiritual being’s free will.

Once a man makes a decision to turn his WILL and life over to God he may partake in the salvation of Jesus Christ into eternal life. The men of old, before the sacrifice of Jesus the Son of God on the cross, could also inherit eternal life. If they, without Christ’s sacrifice, turned themselves entirely to the Will of God confessing Him as Lord then were they saved. Enoch in the book of Genesis is a good example, taken up in rapture from the earth to be with God in His presence, millenia before the events of the cross. Elijah is another, taken up dramatically in a fiery chariot appearing out of a whirlwind!

All men receive the desires of their heart of hearts, beyond the things of this world. In this world after Christ’s Gift we are given that same choice to choose our eternal destiny at the foot of the cross: we can walk on by or fall on our face, the choice is ours! We may choose in our heart of hearts to turn to God and give our life and TOTAL SELF to Him for eternal life; or cling fast to SELF and inherit eternal suffering. In between those two extremes are all manner of men trying desperately in self to grab hold of the best of both worlds.

Some maintain that once we have chosen God we are forever in His mighty hand; that nothing in creation can pry us out. This is true, but with one very important exception. The act of turning to God from self is not an act of total surrender: He never takes back our Free Will to choose! Following our Justification in Christ, Justified as washed clean in the Blood of the Lamb of sacrifice, our life in Him is a continual process of ongoing Sanctification, leading to the perfection of His Righteousness as we are Glorified in God the Father with Christ. We are immediately Sanctified but it’s also an ongoing moment by moment process of further Sacntification into His Image of Perfection. The Justification of His sacrifice removes our sin, but not our mind and heart of hearts in their free will. Throughout our life thereafter we maintain Free Will to choose in our every thought, decision and deed.

Therefore throughout Scripture we are cautioned to choose wisely, and to continuously choose God, to relinquish self. If we take God's salvation and for whatever reason decide instead to throw it back in His face, to deny Him as Lord of our lives, to instead turn to self as our god, we choose to deny His eternal life. God in His salvation doen not turn us into robots with no choice of Free Will. No, the choice is always ours: God or self? God never removes our Free Will because it was His Gift. If we later choose to reject His Gift and live in sin of self as our substance of life He allows it; but there is an indescribable penalty at the end of it. Some, even most of these are led astray by others as men and devils, not of their own heart, but no matter, the result & destination are the same.

Belief in Eternal Security is correct doctrine, because God alone is God and has chosen us in His Will as His children since before the foundations of the earth were laid out! That still blows what’s left of my mind! But the concept of Eternal Security may be taken far too far, thanks to our Free Will. A man may even be carried away to the position of Antinomianism, where a man calculates oh, so cleverly that he can choose God and His salvation then do whatever, whenever and however he wants morally, and God can't do anything about it! "I'm saved and have Eternal Security and ‘I will’ have a ball down here until you take me home to be in your heaven of heavens forever!" Anti-nomian means anti-Name, as anti-Name of Jesus; rejecting Him in His Righteousness.

Thoughts of Eternal Security lead in 2 directions. One is that we have continual encouragement in our heart in the worst of times that regardless of the attacks coming we cannot be stolen away from His Eternal Life; that we may fully trust in Him forever as our God. This is true and good, feeding energy into our Hope. It’s spelled out in Scripture by our blessed friend Paul, "For I am persuaded that neither death, nor life, nor angels, nor principalities, nor powers, nor things to come, nor height, nor depth, nor any other created creature, shall be able to separate us from the love of God, which is in Christ Jesus our Lord." Romans 8:38-39

Worthy of note within that quote: Paul never implies that WE cannot separate OURSELVES from God’s love! So, the other potential in thoughts of Eternal Security is to harden our hearts; that regardless of our actions we are still guaranteed Eternal Life. This is not true, or good and Paul himself and several other apostles say so!

In between those two there are all levels of ‘freedom’ given to ourselves, by ourselves, allowing far more leeway in sin than we are entitled to if we truly Love God in our heart of hearts. It’s fudging a little here and there and not worrying about it. Obviously, this too is not good and is offensive to God, insulting & denigrating His Perfect Sacrifice.

Some would say that those who might lose their salvation after claiming Christ as Lord were never saved in the first place. Problem: it’s impossible to state that as fact, because only God could know! Having said that: is it then possible that even this person who fell didn’t know if they were truly saved? Seems pretty obvious that when one claims that a former Christian in word, thought and deed who announced Jesus Christ as their Lord and savior then turns away into darkness of perdition never even knew themselves that they weren’t saved is a bit hard to swallow.

Overall the entire concept sounds suspect, because as far as the believer in question goes he apparently thought he was saved, and so did those who would view his actions. Paul was surely one the greatest minds that ever lived within things of God & Christ. He knew full well that we could not possibly know if a person loses salvation by misdeeds and foolishness, or whether they’re never saved in the first place. He stongly urges Corinthian believers with all his heart, "Therefore, work out your own salvation with fear and trembling!" The point is, if that person is us, we must surely do everything within our power, by the true Power of the Holy Spirit of God, to insure our own salvation by staying as much as possible in the center of God throughout our lives.

Do I suggest then that there are actually things we must do, as within our heart, mind, spirit and its actions, to maintain our Eternal Security? Do I say we should do more than bask in the Sonlight of God on the shores of forgiveness? Yes, and who could think otherwise? Do I say we must labor daily in our lives to guarantee that we enter in at the strait gate, where narrow is the way that leads to eternal life, to achieve our eternal reward? Yes! Does Scripture, the Word of God, in the written words of Jesus and every other writer in the Bible suggest the same thing for Christians, in every book found there? Yes! Is there a single book in the Bible that suggests that we do not have to labor in our lives towards righteousness, eschewing sin and self, to be one with God? NO, not one!

What is the problem with a concept of falling wholly upon Eternal Security as our chief doctrine of salvation? It opens the door to abuse of the Gift of God; and man in this world is first selfish, commonly desiring to choose self first, then working God into it if possible. Therefore I say labor under that Good Thing of God's Righteousness. Jesus says, "My yoke is easy, and my burden is Light!" as the yoke of oneness with Him where the two shall become one flesh, as His bride: yoked together to carry the Light of the Truth of His Love in our hearts to freely give to every fellow man without measure.
We are to offer up all of our self as a burnt offering on the altar of Jesus Christ; with our life’s deeds laid out as showbreads in the tabernacle of our hearts, and our thoughts as a smoke of incense, as a gift of sacrifice of our will with sweet odors rising back to God.
JDFree
 
I’d be the last to try to put any man back under the law, which is impossible to keep! Following are books of of New Testament Scripture that say to constantly relinquish SELF and perform the actions of turning our lives over to the care of God in His Will, resting in His finished work, and walking in His way as our work. Each also cautions us about potentially losing our salvation.<?xml:namespace prefix = o ns = "urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" />

Adam & Eve in Genesis were the first 2 humans to give up the gift of eternal life for sins of self. They were created as eternal, life without end beings in the direct presence of God by His Will. They turned away to self and lost it all, introducing sin and death to the world. After their fall their eternal lives were restored by their submission to God as Lord under His Will.

New Testament guidance: it appears that every single book except Philemon warns that a Christian may fall from Grace and inherit damnation!

Matthew 5:20, 7:13-27 Jesus speaks to Christians & Jews of losing eternal life by turning away.
Mark 2:22, Christ’s language describes the bride and Bridegroom, so analgous to Christians about losing eternal life. 4:3-20 to multitudes, Christian and non-Christian, about losing eternal life.
Luke 12:22-48, Jesus to Christian disciples about losing eternal life, 13:23-30 general audience about losing eternal life.
John 15:1-17 Jesus speaks to His disciples about losing eternal life.
Acts title & 8:13-23 Peter speaks about possibly losing eternal life, 10:34-35 works of righteousness, 15 all & 15:20 conditions & requirements of conduct to not lose salvation, commanding works of abstinence as a condition of salvation, 20:29-31 Paul warns of being drawn away from salvation’s reward, 21:25 works of abstinence required for maintaining salvation
Romans is Grace, Grace, Grace yet Paul cautions in 2:1-21 to live in goodness & righteousness lest you lose your salvation, 14:10-12 that we shall be judged, finally 16:17-20 warning against evil ones in the congregation who would deceive believers away. Throughout are works of right living before God.
1Corinthians 3:12-20 though saved, that through sins of self we may suffer great loss eternally or lose our lives, 5:5 that one who sins may be destroyed in the flesh before his time, yet live in Christ after, 6:9-10 details conduct among supposed Christians or non-Christians resulting in damnation, 9:27 ominous warning by Paul of even losing his own salvation, 10:5-21 '...lest he fall..." and lose salvation, with orders of conduct for salvation.
2Corinthians 5:10 for we shall ALL be judged! 7:1 holiness in the FEAR of God.
Galatians, 3:13ved by [continual] Faith in Grace, redeemed from the law, 3:26 children of God by faith, 5:13-21 liberty in Christ not an occasion in the flesh, and by abominations may lose salvation 15:21.
Ephesians 2:8-10 saved by Grace, not by works, yet walk in good works, 4:21-24 and put on the new man, 4:25-32 doing the deeds of righteousness, 5:3-7 but do not fall into old sins lest ye fall into damnation; 6:10-18 and stand in the full armor of God, standing strong against the wiles & attacks of devils!
Philippians, 2:1-11 labor to be like Christ, 2:12-16 but seriously cautioned that we labor not in vain! 3:14 pressing towards the mark, and 3:18-19 regarding 'Christians' who are doomed to destruction by their deeds in the flesh.
Colossians 2: be steadfast in the faith, careful of those who would lead astray, 3:5-6 sins leading to loss of salvation, 3:25 but he that does wrong will receive punishment regardless of person.
Thessalonians 2:11-13 walk worthy, 3:5 Paul’s labor in vain that they might be lost, 4:2-8 command against fornication & fraud and becoming a despiser of God, 5:14-22 walk in the Lord.
2Thessalonians stand fast in the Word and Christian traditions, 3:10-12-15 be not deceived into loss of salvation.

1 Timothy 1:5 some Christians had strayed from Christ’s message of Truth for salvation and are damned by their deeds.
2 Timothy 1:15 mentions two who have turned themselves away from Paul, possibly losing their salvation? 2:12 if a Christian denies Christ so shall Christ deny him, 2:18 describes Christians who were deceived and had their faith overthrown into unbelief and damnation, 2:26 describes christians taken in the snare of the devil to loss, 4:1 Christ will judge both the quick [Christians] and the dead [non-Christians].
Titus 1:14 fables & commandments of men turning Christians away from Truth, 3:10-11 condemned ‘Christian’ heretic.
Philemon private letter requesting forgiveness for a runaway slave, not much about Christian doctrine except forgiveness.
Hebrews, teaches that now in Christ no other priest needs stand between a man and his God, but able ministers may refresh and refine others in the Word; 2:1-4 exhortation to carefulness for our salvation lest we lose it, 3:14 conditions required to not lose salvation, 4:1 fear the loss of promise of salvation, 4:11-13 strive to enter into His rest lest you fall, 5:9 salvation also dependent upon obeying God, beyond mere belief, 6:4-8 clearly describes one who was indeed saved by every measure but falls away to eternal death, 6:10-12 the work of God’s Love alive, 8:10 God’s Law written into our hearts and minds, 10:26-30 second strong warning against willful sin that there is no more sacrifice available to those who have believed, but rather a judgment to come, 12:3 faint not in your endurance toward the goal of heaven and endure chastening without turning away from God, 12:12-29 third serious warning to remain steadfast and not lose our eternal reward.
James 1-19 to be doers of the Word, not hearers only, 2:14-26 faith without works is dead, 4:1-10 the sinner is the enemy of God.
1Peter 1:13-17 exhorting holiness in fear of the Lord, 3:11-12 the face of the Lord is sagainst any of those who do evil, 3:17 that you not suffer for your evil doing, 4:1-5 wickedness and Christ willl judge both the quick & the dead, 4:17-19 judgment begins with the members of house of God, so keep yourself holy that you would be saved,
2Peter 2:1-22 resist heresy and live the Word of Truth, [20-22] lest you who were saved fall into the darkness of damnation forever!
1John 5:16-17 there is a sin unto death.
2John 1:7-11 be not partakers of deceiver’s dark reward.
3John do not follow evil lest you fall.
Jude 1:3-13 of the destination of the ungodly.

So, every single book and author in the New Testament warns us against turning away and losing our salvation!
 
I’d be the last to try to put any man back under the law, which is impossible to keep! Following are books of of New Testament Scripture that say to constantly relinquish SELF and perform the actions of turning our lives over to the care of God in His Will, resting in His finished work, and walking in His way as our work. Each also cautions us about potentially losing our salvation.<?xml:namespace prefix = o ns = "urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" />

Adam & Eve in Genesis were the first 2 humans to give up the gift of eternal life for sins of self. They were created as eternal, life without end beings in the direct presence of God by His Will. They turned away to self and lost it all, introducing sin and death to the world. After their fall their eternal lives were restored by their submission to God as Lord under His Will.

New Testament guidance: it appears that every single book except Philemon warns that a Christian may fall from Grace and inherit damnation!

Matthew 5:20, 7:13-27 Jesus speaks to Christians & Jews of losing eternal life by turning away.
Mark 2:22, Christ’s language describes the bride and Bridegroom, so analgous to Christians about losing eternal life. 4:3-20 to multitudes, Christian and non-Christian, about losing eternal life.
Luke 12:22-48, Jesus to Christian disciples about losing eternal life, 13:23-30 general audience about losing eternal life.
John 15:1-17 Jesus speaks to His disciples about losing eternal life.
Acts title & 8:13-23 Peter speaks about possibly losing eternal life, 10:34-35 works of righteousness, 15 all & 15:20 conditions & requirements of conduct to not lose salvation, commanding works of abstinence as a condition of salvation, 20:29-31 Paul warns of being drawn away from salvation’s reward, 21:25 works of abstinence required for maintaining salvation
Romans is Grace, Grace, Grace yet Paul cautions in 2:1-21 to live in goodness & righteousness lest you lose your salvation, 14:10-12 that we shall be judged, finally 16:17-20 warning against evil ones in the congregation who would deceive believers away. Throughout are works of right living before God.
1Corinthians 3:12-20 though saved, that through sins of self we may suffer great loss eternally or lose our lives, 5:5 that one who sins may be destroyed in the flesh before his time, yet live in Christ after, 6:9-10 details conduct among supposed Christians or non-Christians resulting in damnation, 9:27 ominous warning by Paul of even losing his own salvation, 10:5-21 '...lest he fall..." and lose salvation, with orders of conduct for salvation.
2Corinthians 5:10 for we shall ALL be judged! 7:1 holiness in the FEAR of God.
Galatians, 3:13ved by [continual] Faith in Grace, redeemed from the law, 3:26 children of God by faith, 5:13-21 liberty in Christ not an occasion in the flesh, and by abominations may lose salvation 15:21.
Ephesians 2:8-10 saved by Grace, not by works, yet walk in good works, 4:21-24 and put on the new man, 4:25-32 doing the deeds of righteousness, 5:3-7 but do not fall into old sins lest ye fall into damnation; 6:10-18 and stand in the full armor of God, standing strong against the wiles & attacks of devils!
Philippians, 2:1-11 labor to be like Christ, 2:12-16 but seriously cautioned that we labor not in vain! 3:14 pressing towards the mark, and 3:18-19 regarding 'Christians' who are doomed to destruction by their deeds in the flesh.
Colossians 2: be steadfast in the faith, careful of those who would lead astray, 3:5-6 sins leading to loss of salvation, 3:25 but he that does wrong will receive punishment regardless of person.
Thessalonians 2:11-13 walk worthy, 3:5 Paul’s labor in vain that they might be lost, 4:2-8 command against fornication & fraud and becoming a despiser of God, 5:14-22 walk in the Lord.
2Thessalonians stand fast in the Word and Christian traditions, 3:10-12-15 be not deceived into loss of salvation.

1 Timothy 1:5 some Christians had strayed from Christ’s message of Truth for salvation and are damned by their deeds.
2 Timothy 1:15 mentions two who have turned themselves away from Paul, possibly losing their salvation? 2:12 if a Christian denies Christ so shall Christ deny him, 2:18 describes Christians who were deceived and had their faith overthrown into unbelief and damnation, 2:26 describes christians taken in the snare of the devil to loss, 4:1 Christ will judge both the quick [Christians] and the dead [non-Christians].
Titus 1:14 fables & commandments of men turning Christians away from Truth, 3:10-11 condemned ‘Christian’ heretic.
Philemon private letter requesting forgiveness for a runaway slave, not much about Christian doctrine except forgiveness.
Hebrews, teaches that now in Christ no other priest needs stand between a man and his God, but able ministers may refresh and refine others in the Word; 2:1-4 exhortation to carefulness for our salvation lest we lose it, 3:14 conditions required to not lose salvation, 4:1 fear the loss of promise of salvation, 4:11-13 strive to enter into His rest lest you fall, 5:9 salvation also dependent upon obeying God, beyond mere belief, 6:4-8 clearly describes one who was indeed saved by every measure but falls away to eternal death, 6:10-12 the work of God’s Love alive, 8:10 God’s Law written into our hearts and minds, 10:26-30 second strong warning against willful sin that there is no more sacrifice available to those who have believed, but rather a judgment to come, 12:3 faint not in your endurance toward the goal of heaven and endure chastening without turning away from God, 12:12-29 third serious warning to remain steadfast and not lose our eternal reward.
James 1-19 to be doers of the Word, not hearers only, 2:14-26 faith without works is dead, 4:1-10 the sinner is the enemy of God.
1Peter 1:13-17 exhorting holiness in fear of the Lord, 3:11-12 the face of the Lord is sagainst any of those who do evil, 3:17 that you not suffer for your evil doing, 4:1-5 wickedness and Christ willl judge both the quick & the dead, 4:17-19 judgment begins with the members of house of God, so keep yourself holy that you would be saved,
2Peter 2:1-22 resist heresy and live the Word of Truth, [20-22] lest you who were saved fall into the darkness of damnation forever!
1John 5:16-17 there is a sin unto death.
2John 1:7-11 be not partakers of deceiver’s dark reward.
3John do not follow evil lest you fall.
Jude 1:3-13 of the destination of the ungodly.

So, every single book and author in the New Testament warns us against turning away and losing our salvation!

That's a very arminian view regarding salvation.
 
Back
Top