Blasphemy of the Holy Spirit

[Lanolin]

Or grafting. God doesnt cast away his people. He made a convenant with them. We now enter this covenant through the blood of Jesus..both gentile and jew.

Paul sAys in romans 11 has God cast away his people? God forbid.

Read the whole of chapter 11 it just explains it all. Stop trying to argue against the bible, you will lose. Ask God to show you.

 

[amadeus2]

God indeed chose people to be a part of His plan, but for those who would abide with Him always, He chose a special group to which everyone was welcome to join [whosoever will]. God wanted people to be a part of this elite group according to their own choice... that is to say they had another choice. All of us did have another choice.

Adam and Eve were given the same two choices as everyone of us to go their own way or to go God's Way. There is room for everyone, but not everyone will choose to take a place.

When they hear about the blessings that God has for those who choose Him, nearly all people would react favorably. When they hear about the cost, many of them will not take it seriously. They want today for themselves and may consider Him for tomorrow. The problem, of course, is that too often THAT tomorrow simply never arrives.

God wants us to love Him and act accordingly even when it hurts us to do so.

Jesus, the man, was tempted in all points as we are [Heb 4:15]. He as a man of flesh did not want to suffer torture and pain and death. He had suffered long for a man with much pain as He witnessed people suffering for their own foolishness or the foolishness of others [such as parents for example]. He always spoke the truth, but how many of the thousands he fed from a few loaves and fishes were there when the people called out for Pilate to spare Barrabas and to crucify Jesus?

For these God was willing that they all be saved, but most of them apparently chose otherwise. Jesus in the pain of his own understanding of the sacrifice before him wanted to also avoid the worst, but he chose his Father's Way:

"...O my Father, if it be possible, let this cup pass from me: nevertheless not as I will, but as thou wilt." Matt 26:39

God chose all of the children of Israel [the natural children of the man born with name of Jacob] to come out of the bondage of Egypt [sin] and to enter into the Promised Land, but only two of the adults [age 20 and above] were willing to follow Him [via Moses and Joshua]
into the land flowing with milk and honey. Similarly it is to be with us:

Mat 7:13 Enter ye in at the strait gate: for wide is the gate, and broad is the way, that leadeth to destruction, and many there be which go in thereat:
Mat 7:14 Because strait is the gate, and narrow is the way, which leadeth unto life, and few there be that find it.

 

[Lanolin]

Many are called but few are chosen.

I hope people heed the choice Jesus offers them. Obedience is really hard for many people but its a choice we can make everyday.

 

[Dave M]

 

[B-A-C]

Dr Stanley has forgotten quite a few points.
Were the goats (separated from the sheep) forgiven? No
Was the lazy steward of the talent forgiven? No.
Was the unfaithful steward of the masters house forgiven? No.
Were the five virgins who ran out of oil forgiven? No.
Was Judas forgiven?
Were Ananias and Sapphira forgiven?
Does Jesus say we will be forgiven even if we don't forgive others? No. ( Matt 6:15; Mark 11:26; )

Some of these sin "could be" forgiven... if these people would have repented before it was too late.

Was the Holy Spirit even given to the church yet when Jesus gave this verse?
( John 16:7; John 7:39; ) The reason the Pharisees could commit this then was because they saw Jesus, and He was only person
with the Holy Spirit at that time. Every believer can have the Holy Spirit now. Every believer can do the things Jesus did.
... and we can still be accused of doing those things by the power of Satan.

 

[amadeus2]

If we sin and then repent and God then we think will always forgive us. This is so when it first happens, because our God is merciful, but if after sinning and repenting and being forgiven by God, we go back and repeat the thinking, "Well God forgave me the first time, I can go ahead and sin and He will forgive again."

Yes, God is merciful and He may accept our repentance a second time and a third and more but is there not limit to God's mercy when we repeatedly sin knowingly expecting that God will always be merciful and forgive again and again and again? Yes, there is a limit but you and I do not know what that limit is for us. If we knowingly sin in this manner and then before are able to repent again natural death takes us, is that not an indication that God's limit has been reached for us?

Consider these verses in the OT:

"Because all those men which have seen my glory, and my miracles, which I did in Egypt and in the wilderness, and have tempted me now these ten times, and have not hearkened to my voice;
Surely they shall not see the land which I sware unto their fathers, neither shall any of them that provoked me see it:" Num 14:22-23

These ten times refers to the times that children of Israel murmured and complained to Moses, [and thereby effectively to God]. Each time punishment was rendered and the people turned around and walked the line again until the next time they had a complaint against God. In the verse cited we see that they had reached God's limit. The guilty ones would die in the wilderness within the 40 year period and never be allowed to enter the Promised Land.

People may argue that that is the OT, not now when we have a better Covenant with God. There are problems with this way of thinking.

For one thing, God, Himself, never changes:

"For I am the LORD, I change not;.. " Mal 3:6
"Every good gift and every perfect gift is from above, and cometh down from the Father of lights, with whom is no variableness, neither shadow of turning." James 1:17

A second thing is that God is not and never has been a respecter of persons:

"These things also belong to the wise. It is not good to have respect of persons in judgment." Prov 24:23

"Then Peter opened his mouth, and said, Of a truth I perceive that God is no respecter of persons:" Acts 10:34

As to people having something better in the New Covenant, they do. They have, if they wish to acknowledge it and use it, the power of God to overcome their sinful ways. Jesus did not overcome our sinful ways. He overcame His [the world; John 16:33] and made it possible for us to overcome ours.

Because God has given us more than He gave those in the OT, He requires not less, but more, from us:

"But he that knew not, and did commit things worthy of stripes, shall be beaten with few stripes. For unto whomsoever much is given, of him shall be much required: and to whom men have committed much, of him they will ask the more" Luke 12:48

 

[Born Again 2004]

I would say that Jesus died once and for all. But if we keep on sinning willfully there are no further sacrifices left, Jesus finished his work on the cross There will be no more sacrifices for you to keep on sinning as you please. A true "Born Again" Christian does not desire to sin willfully or with out regard!
On the other hand, we are human and sinners but there is no condemnation for those who sin (unwillingly) if they are in Christ!

 

[B-A-C]

Could be but the more exact definition of blasphemy of the Holy Spirit, is simply put the rejection of Jesus Christ , resulting subsequently in unbelief and loss of salvation.

Matt 12:32; "Whoever speaks a word against the Son of Man, it shall be forgiven him; but whoever speaks against the Holy Spirit, it shall not be forgiven him, either in this age or in the age to com

If rejecting Jesus is unforgivable (I agree if they reject Him they aren't saved) then why would Jesus say whatever is spoken against Him can be forgiven?

The other problem with this is... If rejecting Jesus can never be forgiven, then all the people who didn't immediately come to Jesus the first time they
were invited to be saved, are never forgiven. They might accept Him later... but it's too late.. they've already committed the "unforgivable" sin, and can
never be forgiven.

Finally, the Holy Spirit is not Jesus, and Jesus is not the Holy Spirit. They are both God to be sure, but they are separate and distinct personalities.

 

[Born Again 2004]

If rejecting Jesus is unforgivable (I agree if they reject Him they aren't saved) then why would Jesus say whatever is spoken against Him can be forgiven?

• Simple
• Speaking against the Son of Man or (Blasphemy) is not the same in this situation as "Blasphemy of the Holy Spirit".
• Blasphemy of Jesus, as long as you live long enough, can be forgiven.
• This is the same as rejecting Jesus as your Savior. Many do this but, before they die their physical death, some do turn to Jesus, are "Born Again", receiving the Holy Spirit inside them and thus forgiven and saved.
• You can speak against Jesus or God and ultimately be forgiven.
• For me it is a play on words.....If you die your physical death and "Blasphemy The Holy Spirit", you have died a non-believer...which is NEVER forgiven!

 

[Born Again 2004]

The other problem with this is... If rejecting Jesus can never be forgiven, then all the people who didn't immediately come to Jesus the first time they
were invited to be saved, are never forgiven. They might accept Him later... but it's too late.. they've already committed the "unforgivable" sin, and can
never be forgiven.

No, no. no. First you believe, repent and then you receive Jesus, in the form of the Holy Spirit, to live in you...i.e.,...Born of the Spirit. If you blasphemy Jesus and before you die, you still have a chance to be saved. If you Blasphemy the Holy Spirit, means you have rejected Jesus's finished work, do not receive the Holy Spirit in you as a promised gift from God. If you die in this condition you have committed the unforgivable sin or unbelief, the sin that can not be forgiven!
the mystery that has been kept hidden for ages and generations, but is now disclosed to the Lord’s people.
27 To them God has chosen to make known among the Gentiles the glorious riches of this mystery, which is Christ in you, the hope of glory. Colossians 1: 26-27

Finally, the Holy Spirit is not Jesus, and Jesus is not the Holy Spirit. They are both God to be sure, but they are separate and distinct personalities.

Now the Lord is the Spirit, and where the Spirit of the Lord is, there is freedom. 2 Corinthians 3:17

 

[Lanolin]

@Born Again 2004 you on the right track.

I will try to explain it in my words...

JEsus when he was on earth referred to himself as Son of Man, meaning he was human, if we reject him as son of man, that can be forgiven, but Holy spirit in Jesus was son of God, if we reject that, and we die in that condition, this wont be forgiven.

Many people reject Jesus as they only think of him as a man. This can be forgiven. But if they reject He is the Christ, the son of God, they can miss out on salvation.

 

[Born Again 2004]

@Born Again 2004 you on the right track.

I believe the Bible and God have me on the right track!

Many people reject Jesus as they only think of him as a man. This can be forgiven. But if they reject He is the Christ, the son of God, they can miss out on salvation.

Rejection is the key, whether the man then, or the now spirit today! You can reject Jesus or speak against ( blasphemy) him today and still be forgiven, as long as you don't die in this condition. If you do die rejecting Jesus, you die as an unforgivable sinner because you die without the Holy Spirit in you. Jesus and the Holy Spirit are the same.

• 2 Corinthians 3:17 Now the Lord is the Spirit, and where the Spirit of the Lord is, there is freedom.
  
• Romans 10:9 If you declare with your mouth, "Jesus is Lord," and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead, you will be saved.

 

[Lanolin]

Example..to make it clear...Judas and Peter. Judas died rejecting (and betraying) Jesus..he never saw the risen Christ. JUdas never believed. Peter also rejected Jesus but was forgiven as he repented. Peter believed and He saw Jesus risen from the dead.