Baptism in Water

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jiggyfly said:
So can I be correct in assuming that you are saying that you must be water baptized in order to recieve the Holy Spirit, Bruce?
What if you are in a dry desert when you believe in Jesus and you die of dehydration before you can get some where to be baptized? What if you live in the artic and the water freezes up and you die before spring thaw? Can you use a subsitute for water, like maybe tomato soup?
i am not saying anything. i print what i read in the Bible. read what the Bible says about Baptism, and go by that. as far as your hypotheticals. that would be a judgment call. i am not worthy to make that.
 
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jiggyfly said:
Was Stephen water baptized? How about the one hundred twenty that were in the upper room at Pentecost?
i wasent there so i don't know. but keeping in mind what the Scriptures and Jesus Christ said about Baptism i would think they did it as soon as possible, i know i did.
 
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sunshine307 said:
Very well put Tonyb. :thumbs_up This must be the least confusing post in the whole thread. :shade:
then leave it out of Gods plan of Salvation if you don't think it is necessary. its up to you. but i think He put in in for a reason.
 
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CliffS said:
bruce bunnell said:
While this is on my mind ,Bruce. I want to commend you for using a real name instead of some alteritive screen name. It is much easier to take a real name serously in discussion.
Baptism is the acceptance of the gift of salvation. Like ones signiture on a contract with God. To think that God will bestow on just anyone the gift of eternal life with out a show of faith is not in the word of God. Baptism is that showing of commitment and faith. It is not to be taken lightly. The one who desides to delay or not be baptized is posponing or refusing the gift of salvation. To that extent baptism is essential ,just as essential as your signiture on a contract before the terms of that contract will be implimented.
God may accept your word as in a deathbed confession, but you know what???? We on this side have no way of knowing that for sure. To those who wonder if those who who are on their way to be baptized and are taken by God are saved? God can read the human heart, He knows what they had on their mind and in their hearts. He and He alone can and will make that decission.
Baptism for any other reason than a commitment to sacrifice ones will to the will of God is a lie. Don't be deceived. baptism that is not accominied with commitment and living faith saves no one!!!!
Just as important as being baptized is being baptized in truth and sincerity.
AMEN. it is just as essential as the other parts of the plan. why not do them all?
 
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bruce bunnell said:
then leave it out of Gods plan of Salvation if you don't think it is necessary. its up to you. but i think He put in in for a reason.
Tonyb said:
So is baptism really part of salvation? If you are talking about being baptised into Jesus' death and resurrection then it is very much a part of salvation. Being regenerated by the Holy Spirit is also part of the salvation process. But salvation in the sense of you dying and going to heaven does not require the element of water to make it effectual.
There are, and have been many, many people who have received Jesus Christ into their lives when they have been close to physical death. They did not recover enough to be baptised in water, but rather, died soon afterwards. Does that then mean they went on into a Godless eternity in hell?
Water baptism is important and Christians should be baptised in water. But only as a affirmation to what has already happened to them spiritually. It does not in and of it's self produce salvation.
Blessings,
Tonyb
Bruce, where in Tony's thread does it say it is not necessary? There are those who will not have a chance to be baptised as has already been stated, this does not make their salvation ineffectual. What you are saying is the thief who died on the cross will not be in heaven, and that's not what Jesus said.
 
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There is only one way to be saved and it was the same way for an old testament saint as it is for a new testament saint.

For it is by grace you have been saved, through faith -and this is not of yourselves, it is the gift of God - not by works, so no one can boast. Eph 2:8-9.

Salvation has always been by grace through faith, and always will be by grace through faith. So the thief on the cross was saved by grace through faith just like everyone else in this world that has ever been saved.

Blessings,
Tonyb
 
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Tonyb said:
There is only one way to be saved and it was the same way for an old testament saint as it is for a new testament saint.

For it is by grace you have been saved, through faith -and this is not of yourselves, it is the gift of God - not by works, so no one can boast. Eph 2:8-9.

Salvation has always been by grace through faith, and always will be by grace through faith. So the thief on the cross was saved by grace through faith just like everyone else in this world that has ever been saved.

Blessings,
Tonyb

Perfectly said, amen brother Tony!

Scripture says this clearly. It couldn't possibly be made more straightforward and simple than the Scripture Tony quoted.
 
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What About!

bruce bunnell said:
from what i read in the bible there is a plan to salvation. believe, repent, confess before others and baptism by immersion to receive the gift of The Holy Spirit and a good conscience toward God. i don't know what would happen if a person left one of the steps out.
Water baptism is an example that we are to follow
set forth by our Lord Jesus Christ. Matt.3:13-16.

It has been said that 'water' baptism is the outward
sign of the inward 'working' of the Holy Spirit.

It tells the world we are buried [the old man] with
Christ and then raised [out of the water] in the
'newness' of life as we are 'born-again'!

What about the people who are 'never' baptized' in
water due to 'no'fault of their own!!

My Dad about a month or so ago received Christ in His
heart on his 'death' bed and my sister led him to our
wonderful Jesus!

I had the honor and privledge of leading my Mom to
Christ over the phone about 7 years ago on her death
bed also!

They 'could' not be baptized in total immersion of water
obviously!

Soldiers in fox holes who get saved and then their life
is 'snuffed' out suddenly are not 'baptized' in water!

Baptism, though very important 'is' not the deciding
factor to a person's salvation.

Who ever calls on the name of the Lord shall be saved!

Rom.10:8: But what saith it? The word is nigh thee,
even in thy mouth, and in thy heart: that is, the word
of faith, which we preach;

Rom.10:9: That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the
Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath
raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved.

Rom.10:10: For with the heart man believeth unto
righteousness; and with the mouth confession is made
unto salvation.

Rom.0:11: For the scripture saith, Whosoever believeth
on him shall not be ashamed.

God Bless,
Joe
 
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Chad said:
Perfectly said, amen brother Tony!

Scripture says this clearly. It couldn't possibly be made more straightforward and simple than the Scripture Tony quoted.
what about the rest of the scriptures that clearly make baptism a part of the salvation hem.? mark 16;16 Jesus says " he who has believed and has been baptized shall be saved; but he who has disbelieved shall be condemned."
 
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Set Free! said:
Water baptism is an example that we are to follow
set forth by our Lord Jesus Christ. Matt.3:13-16.

It has been said that 'water' baptism is the outward
sign of the inward 'working' of the Holy Spirit.

It tells the world we are buried [the old man] with
Christ and then raised [out of the water] in the
'newness' of life as we are 'born-again'!

What about the people who are 'never' baptized' in
water due to 'no'fault of their own!!

My Dad about a month or so ago received Christ in His
heart on his 'death' bed and my sister led him to our
wonderful Jesus!

I had the honor and privledge of leading my Mom to
Christ over the phone about 7 years ago on her death
bed also!

They 'could' not be baptized in total immersion of water
obviously!

Soldiers in fox holes who get saved and then their life
is 'snuffed' out suddenly are not 'baptized' in water!

Baptism, though very important 'is' not the deciding
factor to a person's salvation.

Who ever calls on the name of the Lord shall be saved!

Rom.10:8: But what saith it? The word is nigh thee,
even in thy mouth, and in thy heart: that is, the word
of faith, which we preach;

Rom.10:9: That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the
Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath
raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved.

Rom.10:10: For with the heart man believeth unto
righteousness; and with the mouth confession is made
unto salvation.

Rom.0:11: For the scripture saith, Whosoever believeth
on him shall not be ashamed.

God Bless,
Joe
i am not a good typer. if you would do me a favor and list also all the verses that connect baptism to being saved and salvation.
 
bruce bunnell said:
what about the rest of the scriptures that clearly make baptism a part of the salvation hem.? mark 16;16 Jesus says " he who has believed and has been baptized shall be saved; but he who has disbelieved shall be condemned."
Where in this scripture (Mark 16:16) does it say water baptized? The greek word used here baptizo which can mean submerged or to be completely overcome. so Jesus could be referring to the baptism of the Holy Spirit. Just look at what Jesus says next.
Mark 16:17&18
17 These signs will accompany those who believe: They will cast out demons in my name, and they will speak new languages.* 18 They will be able to handle snakes with safety, and if they drink anything poisonous, it won’t hurt them. They will be able to place their hands on the sick and heal them.”

Sounds to me like someone who has experienced the baptism of the Holy Spirit.
 
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jiggyfly said:
Where in this scripture (Mark 16:16) does it say water baptized? The greek word used here baptizo which can mean submerged or to be completely overcome. so Jesus could be referring to the baptism of the Holy Spirit. Just look at what Jesus says next.
Mark 16:17&18
17 These signs will accompany those who believe: They will cast out demons in my name, and they will speak new languages.* 18 They will be able to handle snakes with safety, and if they drink anything poisonous, it won’t hurt them. They will be able to place their hands on the sick and heal them.”
Sounds to me like someone who has experienced the baptism of the Holy Spirit.
acts 2;38 " and peter said to them " repent, and let each one of you be baptized the name of Jesus Christ for the forgiveness of your sins and you shall receive the gift of the Holy Spirit." is this a water baptism.?
 
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Staff member
The Holy Spirit is THE baptism that matters ultimately for salvation, in the name of Jesus Christ. I do not know why your so concerned about water. Jesus said He is the true water of life.

John 4:14
but whoever drinks the water I give him will never thirst. Indeed, the water I give him will become in him a spring of water welling up to eternal life."
 
bruce bunnell said:
acts 2;38 " and peter said to them " repent, and let each one of you be baptized the name of Jesus Christ for the forgiveness of your sins and you shall receive the gift of the Holy Spirit." is this a water baptism.?
Yes, to be baptized in the name of Jesus, but this does not mean you will be baptized in the Holy Spirit it means He will indwell you. Bruce I want to ask you a question, do you agree with the baptism of the Holy Spirit as a seperate experience apart from new birth or becoming born-again. And that it is vital as much today as in the first century church?
 
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Well Bruce I know of some scriptures that seem to suggest that water baptism is not as important as you have been making it out to be.

These scriptures are found in 1 Corinthians 1. Verse 14 reads, I Thank my God that I Baptised none of your except Crispus and Gaius, Verse 16 Now I did baptise also the household of Stephannas; beyond that, I don't know whether I baptised any other. Verse 17 For Christ did not send me to baptise, but to preach the gospel ...

It would seem from the above verses that the Apostle Paul thought preaching the gospel was more important than baptising believers.

I don't think you see the difference between being baptised into Christ and being baptised in water. Being baptised into Christ comes first, then you are batised in water as a confirmation or testimony to the fact.
 
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jiggyfly said:
Yes, to be baptized in the name of Jesus, but this does not mean you will be baptized in the Holy Spirit it means He will indwell you. Bruce I want to ask you a question, do you agree with the baptism of the Holy Spirit as a separate experience apart from new birth or becoming born-again. And that it is vital as much today as in the first century church?
i ain't for sure on this but didn't the baptism of the Holy Spirit happen to a select few so they could speak in other languages to help spread the Gospel.? i know i received it during water baptism.
 
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