• Hi Guest!

    Please share Talk Jesus community on every platform you have to give conservatives an outlet and safe community to be apart of.

    Support This Community

    Thank You

  • Welcome to Talk Jesus

    A true bible based, Jesus centered online community. Join over 11,000 members today

    Register Log In

About Love

Jas 5:9 . . Do not complain against one another, brethren, that you yourselves
may not be judged; behold, the Judge is standing right at the door.

If there’s a personality clash between you and a fellow believer; God forbid you
should drag other people into the middle of it! And keep in mind that God is an
eavesdropper. He hears and sees everything we do, think, or say. Don't let Him
catch you maliciously shredding a fellow believer's reputation, assassinating their
character and/or running them into the ground behind their back. (cf. Matt 18:15)
Jas 5:14 . . Is anyone among you sick? Let him call for the elders of the church,
and let them pray over him, anointing him with oil in the name of The Lord

Religious fanatics here and there are allowing their underage children to suffer and
even die from treatable medical conditions on the basis of that verse. Where do we
draw the line with the so-called "freedom of religion" guaranteed in the US
Constitution's first amendment? Answer: We draw the line at the child's inalienable
right to life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness; which, according to America's
Declaration of Independence; are not only God-given rights, but also a self evident
truth that men were created with those rights.

The DOI goes on to say that all men are created equal. It doesn't say grown-up
men; it says all men, which means that women and children have just as much
right to life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness as anybody else. Parents who
deny the truth of those rights are nothing in the world but wicked despots; and in
point of fact the very kinds of twisted monarchs the DOI targets.

Christ addressed this issue indirectly by means of his teachings on the seventh day
Sabbath; which, in a nutshell, says that the seventh day was made for man, not
the other way around. (Mark 2:27)

"And he said unto them, What man shall there be among you, that shall have one
sheep, and if it fall into a pit on the sabbath day, will he not lay hold on it, and lift it
out? How much then is a man better than a sheep? Wherefore it is lawful to do
good on the sabbath days." (Matt 12:11-12)

The sanctity of human life trumps the sanctity of the Sabbath. So then, hospitals,
doctors, nurses, firemen, law enforcement, soup kitchens, rescue missions, Red
Cross, Haiti emergency workers, etc. who are busy on the Sabbath do not sin. Do
they break the Sabbath? Yes; but the sanctity of the Sabbath is secondary to the
sanctity of human life.

So then, I would have to say, in accordance with Matt 12:11-12, that people who
deny their children adequate medical care in the name of religion regard the value
of their own flesh and blood as something less than that of a beast.

It's okay to have elders pray for your child, and it's okay to anoint them with oil as
per James 5:14. But after that, parents really should take their children to a doctor
because the sanctity of human life is far more important than strict observance of
one's religious rituals.

There used to be an old saying going around in Christian circles that went
something like this: When a farmer prays for a crop, he should say amen with a
hoe. In other words, don't just sit back and wait for a miracle when it's in your
power to take some action; and if you don't, then in my opinion, you deserve to be
prosecuted to the fullest extent of the law when a child in your care dies from a
treatable condition.

"If any provide not for his own, and specially for those of his own house, he has
denied the faith, and is worse than an infidel." (1Tim 5:8)
Jas 5:16 . . Confess your sins to one another

The word "sins" is an arbitrary editorial embellishment rather than a translation; viz: it isn't in the Greek manuscripts; somebody penciled it in. So we could safely re-translate that verse to read "Confess to one another".

There's quite a number of key words in the Bible that sometimes trigger a knee-jerk reflex in people's minds and "confess" is one of them. It would seem to me that James isn't commanding Christians to confess their sins to one another as Father Confessors for the purpose of absolution; but rather: to simply man-up and admit when they're wrong; and to do so without recriminations, without rejoinders, and without feigned indignity. (cf. Matt 18:15-17)
1Pet 1:22b . . See that ye love one another with a pure heart fervently

The Greek word translated "love" in that passage is agapao (ag-ap-ah'-o) which is
actually a very easy love to practice because it doesn't consist of sentiments like
affection and fondness; which are components of the other love in the New
Testament translated from the Greek word phileo (fil-eh'-o).

Agapao is impersonal; commonly expressed in things like charity, kindness,
sympathy, lenience, and tolerance; viz: agapao isn't expressed by liking people;
rather, it's expressed by being nice to people, i.e. civil; defined by Webster's as
adequate in courtesy and politeness: mannerly.

Phileo, on the other hand, is personal and not as common as agapao because phileo
is felt rather than expressed; viz: phileo refers to emotional attachments.

An excellent contrast between the two loves is seen by comparing John 3:16 and
John 16:27.

In the first; God is shown sympathetic.

"For God so loved the world that He gave His one and only son, that whoever
believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life."

In the latter, God is shown affectionate.

"The Father himself loves you because you have loved me and have believed that I
came from God."

Obtaining God's sympathy is very easy because that's on Him; whereas winning His
affections is not so easy because that's on us.

"If you obey my commands, you will abide in my love, just as I have obeyed my
Father's commands and abide in His love." (John 15:10)

Anyway; 1Pet 1:22b only requires Christians to be civil, which I'm convinced is
within every Christian's capabilities; even for Christians whose sensitivities are
those of a catcher's mitt or a wooden nickel.

A pure fervent heart refers to taking Peter's requirement seriously enough to make
a conscientious effort to comply with it; viz: every Christian, even the bi-polar
ones, really ought to be doing their level best to be good people not just some of
the time, nor even most of the time; but all the time-- at the very least among
themselves and with each other.
Staff Member
Have pity on others, just as your Father has pity on you.

Be compassionate just as your Father is compassionate.

be ye therefore merciful, as also your Father is merciful.
Luke 6:36

Put them in mind to be subject to principalities and powers, to obey magistrates, to be ready to every good work, to speak evil of no man, to be no brawlers, but gentle, shewing all meekness unto all men.
For we ourselves also were sometimes foolish, disobedient, deceived, serving divers lusts and pleasures, living in malice and envy, hateful, and hating one another.

but after that the kindness and love of God our Saviour toward man appeared,

not by works of righteousness which we have done, but according to His mercy He saved us,
by the washing of regeneration,
and renewing of the Holy Ghost;
Titus 3:1-5
1Pet 2:1a . . Lay aside all malice

The Greek word for "malice" is kakia (kak-ee'-ah) which basically refers to badness,
i.e. depravity, malignity, and trouble.

Malignity commonly describes aggressive cancers, which tend to spread and
produce death or deterioration, viz: malignant people are passionately and
relentlessly malevolent; defined by Webster's as having, showing, or arising from
intense often vicious ill will, spite, or hatred.

If malice can be lain aside, then I think it safe to conclude that there are some
people whose mean-spirited behavior is by choice, i.e. deliberate.
1Pet 2:1b . . Lay aside all deceit (a.k.a. guile, cunning, and duplicity)

The Greek word for "deceit" is dolos (dol'-os) which basically refers to a decoy;
defined by Webster's as someone or something used to lure or lead another into a

Decoys can also be used as diversions, e.g. red herrings.

Dolos also refers to trickery; defined by Webster's as the practice of crafty
underhanded ingenuity to deceive or cheat, for example Gen 3:1.

A very common form of deceit is something called dissembling; which basically
means to conceal one's true feelings with pretense. I think it's pretty safe to say
that everybody at one time or another practices dissembling; it's pretty much a
natural propensity.

Peter's instructions don't say to avoid deceit, they say to lay it aside; viz: stop it.
1Pet 2:1c . . Lay aside all hypocrisy

The Greek word translated "hypocrisy" is hupokrisis (hoop-ok'-ree-sis) which is a
mite ambiguous. It basically refers to acting under a feigned part.

Not all hypocrisy is bad; quite a few people earn an honest living by accepting parts
in movies and plays. That we can live with.

But hypocrisy in religion is insufferable; for example Mark 12:13-15, which reads
like this:

"Later they sent some of the Pharisees and Herodians to Jesus to catch him in his
words. They came to him and said: Teacher, we know you are a man of integrity.
You aren't swayed by men, because you pay no attention to who they are; but you
teach the way of God in accordance with the truth. Is it right to pay taxes to Caesar
or not? Should we pay or shouldn't we? But Jesus knew their hypocrisy."

Their inquiry was reasonable; but it was based upon a hidden agenda. They didn't
care one whit about the taxes; they were only looking for a legitimate excuse to
have Jesus arrested and put away where he could no longer influence public

Hypocrisy is also exemplified in double standards, for example Luke 6:41-42 and
Matt 23:2-4

"And why do you look at the speck that is in your brother's eye, but do not notice
the log that is in your own eye? Or how can you say to your brother: Brother, let
me take out the speck that is in your eye, when you yourself do not see the log
that is in your own eye? You hypocrite, first take the log out of your own eye, and
then you will see clearly to take out the speck that is in your brother's eye."

"The scribes and the Pharisees have seated themselves in the chair of Moses;
therefore all that they tell you, do and observe, but do not do according to their
deeds; for they say things, and do not do them. And they tie up heavy loads, and
lay them on men's shoulders; but they themselves are unwilling to move them with
so much as a finger."
1Pet 2:1d. . Lay aside all envy

Webster's defines envy as painful or resentful awareness of an advantage enjoyed
by another, coupled with a desire to possess the same advantage

There are musicians that I greatly admire for their talent and their creativity. But I
don't hate them for it; no, I truly love their work, i.e. I'm a fan rather than a rival.
For example; famed sessions musician Carol Kaye can lay down smooth jazz lines
with an electric bass using nothing more than a flat guitar pick. I wish I could do
what Carol does; at the same time wish her all the best and would sincerely like for
her to continue playing and teaching forever.

But when admiration is mixed with pain and resentment, it can become ugly and
extremely dangerous.

For example, it was envy that motivated Cain to murder his kid brother, and it was
envy that motivated Joseph's brothers to sell him into slavery, and it was envy that
motivated Jesus' opponents to have him arrested and put to death.

People prone to envy share a very common denominator: they simply must be
either equal to, or better than, others. It's that simple. And if they cannot be equal
to, or better than others, then nothing would make them happier than to see those
others failed, maimed, silenced, disfigured, dishonored, disgraced, humiliated,
handicapped for life and/or deceased.
1Pet 2:1e . . Lay aside all evil speaking

The Greek word for "evil speaking" is katalalia (kat-al-al-ee'-ah) which basically
means defamation; defined by Webster's as the act of communicating false
statements about a person that injures their reputation.

Talking about someone behind their back counts as defamation only when the
statements are untrue; especially if the statements are deliberately untrue and
calculated to assassinate someone's character and/or question their good name.

"As newborn infants, desire the pure milk of the word, that you may grow thereby."
(1Pet 2:2)

When Christians neglect to study Peter's epistles to learn what is, and what is not,
appropriate behavior for Christ's followers, they are certain to end up stunting their
spiritual growth; and quite naturally retain and practice all five of the ugly
behaviors listed in 1Pet 2:1 --malice, deceit, hypocrisy, envy, and evil speaking.
1Pet 2:17a . . Honor all men.

The Greek word translated "honor" is timao (tim-ah'-o) which basically means to
prize, i.e. fix a valuation upon and/or to revere

The first place that timao shows up in the New Testament is Matt 15:4 which reads:

"God said: Honor your father and mother."

Right after the Flood, God outlawed murder; and the reason given for the ban was
not because murder is necessarily wrong, but because people are made in the
likeness of God. (Gen 9:5-6)

James criticizes the use of language that expresses a wish that someone be sent to
hell. The reason given is not because that sort of language is necessarily wrong, but
because people were made in the likeness of God. (Jas 3:8-9)

In other words; murder and cursing dishonors the likeness of God, and by
extension dishonors God too.

From that I gather that failure to treat everyone with dignity-- regardless of age,
race, or gender --not only dishonors men but by extension also dishonors God in
whose likeness all men were made.

FAQ: Does that mean even serial killers, mass murderers, and monsters like Osama
Bin Laden, Robert Mugabe, Adolf Hitler, Joseph Stalin, Saddam Hussein, and crooks
like Al Capone and Bernie Madoff have to be treated humanely and with dignity the
same as everyone else?

A: Yes, absolutely because the honor that Peter is talking about doesn't have to be
earned, merited or otherwise deserved.

Take for example Lev 19:32 which reads like this:

"Rise in the presence of the aged, show respect for the elderly and revere your
God. I am The Lord"

The honor required for senior citizens doesn't have to be earned, merited or
otherwise deserved. The only requirement is age; and failure to dignify senior
citizens is all the same as failure to dignify God.

NOTE: You can tell a lot about people by the way they treat senior citizens. Now
that I myself am old and gray-haired, I'm sensitive to things like that.
1Pet 2:17b . . love the brotherhood

The Greek word translated "brotherhood" is adelphotes (ad-el-fot'-ace) which
appears in only two places in the entire New Testament; both are in the apostle
Peter's epistles: one here and the other in 1Pet 5:9.

It's a curious word because it doesn't specifically refer to "the church which is his
body". Adelphotes basically means a fraternity; defined by Webster's as a group of
people associated or formally organized for a common purpose, interest, or
pleasure; i.e. persons of the same class, profession, character, or tastes: for
example leagues, guilds, societies, and trade unions.

Just to be on the safe side, assume that Peter's instructions apply to anyone and
everyone calling themselves a Christian regardless of their denominational

One thing to our advantage is that the Greek word for "love" in 1Pet 2:17 is
impersonal, viz: it requires neither fondness nor affection; it only requires that we
be humane, e.g. civil, courteous, friendly, peaceable, hospitable, sympathetic,
tolerant, lenient, forgiving, charitable, and generous. In other words; we don't
especially have to like everyone identifying themselves as Christians; we just have
to be friendly.
1Pet 3:7a . . You husbands, dwell with your wives according to knowledge

The Greek word for "knowledge" is gnosis (gno'-sis) which means knowing (as
information) in other words: facts and/or ideas acquired by study, investigation,
observation, or experience.

Gnosis is different than "intuition" which Webster's defines as: the power, or
faculty, of attaining to direct knowledge or cognition without evident rational
thought and inference.

Gnosis is different than "instinct" too, which Webster's defines as: (1) a natural or
inherent aptitude, impulse, or capacity, (2) a largely inheritable and unalterable
tendency of an organism to make a complex and specific response to environmental
stimuli without involving reason, and (3) behavior that is mediated by reactions
below the conscious level; viz: a mental and/or emotional knee-jerk reflex.

So then, Peter is talking about husbands applying instructed knowledge of Christian
social skills to their marriages.

There are young boys being brought up by macho (a.k.a. toxic) fathers teaching
their sons to "control their women". Well, that might be an acceptable marriage
philosophy in the home of a Muslim fundamentalist and/or a club-toting
Neanderthal, but not in the home of a man passing himself off as one of Christ's
followers. In a pious home, Christian husbands are neither required nor expected to
tame their Christian wives seeing as how the onus is upon the wives themselves to
exercise self control.

NOTE: It's required of Christ's followers to love their enemies but it's not required
to like their enemies nor is it required to always have a good opinion about them.
However, though a Christian husband's love need not include the elements of
affection and/or fondness; his love does need to include the element of
benevolence, along with diplomacy; which Webster's defines as skill in handling
affairs without arousing hostility, viz: tact. Benevolence is defined as the disposition
to do good, i.e. kindness.
1Pet 3:7b . . Give honor unto the wife, as unto the weaker vessel,

The Greek word for "honor" is time (tee-may') which means: a value, i.e. money

The word for "weaker" is asthenes (as-then-ace') which means: having no strength,
i.e. fragile.

And the word for "vessel" is skeuos (skyoo'-os) which can indicate anything from a
soup bowl to a cardboard box; in other words: a container.

Peter isn't saying women are physically weaker than men; but that Christian
husbands should exercise the same care with their wives as they would a fragile
antique worth thousands of dollars like, say, a Ming vase. Nobody in their right
mind handles a Ming vase like a farmer handles a 5-gallon bucket. Not that some
women couldn't take that kind of handling; it's just that its unbecoming for a
Christian man to lack sensitivity for his wife's feelings.

This particular assessed value isn't an intrinsic value, nor is it a deserved value
either; but rather, it's a gratuitous value. In other words: Christ commands
Christian husbands to categorize their wives up there with Dresden china even if
she's as tough as a female cop and/or a UFC mixed martial artist the likes of
Rhonda Rousey-- and this is not a choice; no, it's not a choice; it's an order.

Christian husbands who treat their Skil saws and their tomato plants with more
care and concern than they treat their wives can just forget about associating with
God on any meaningful level.

"as being heirs together of the grace of life; that your prayers be not hindered."
(1Pet 3:7c)

Note the word "together" which is quite the opposite of autonomy and/or

Couples sometimes assert themselves with words like "What I do is between me
and The Lord." No; not when you're married. Marriage changes everything between
one's self and The Lord because people become one flesh in marriage: no longer
1Pet 3:8a . . All of you be of one mind,

Peter’s not talking about the nerve center of a Borg-hive collective. The Greek word
for "one mind" is homophron (hom-of'-rone) which means: harmonious; and this is
the only place in the entire New Testament where that word appears.

Webster’s defines "harmonious" as: 1) musically concordant, 2) having the parts
agreeably related; viz: congruous, and 3) marked by accord in sentiment or action.

Peter's instructions emphasize the third element-- "marked by accord in sentiment
or action". Head-strong Christians, domineering Christians, those for whom every
disagreement is either an affront or an act of war to win at any cost-- those for
whom the word diplomacy has no meaning --of course have trouble complying with
1Pet 3:8a; that is: if they even consider it worthy of their notice.
1Pet 3:8b-9 . . Have compassion one of another, love as brethren, be pitiful, be
courteous; not rendering evil for evil, or railing for railing: but contrariwise

"compassion" is from the Greek word sumpathes (soom-path-ace') which means:
having a fellow-feeling; viz: sympathetic, i.e. (by implication) mutually
commiserative: empathetic.

One of the meanings of commiserate is condole: like when we share someone's
grief at the passing of a loved one, or their job has been outsourced to cheap labor
in a foreign country, or they've lost their entire retirement fund to an unscrupulous
corporation like ENRON, or their life savings to a crooked Ponzi schemer like Bernie
Madoff, or when there's news from their doctor they have to begin chemo-therapy
for a recently detected advanced cancer, or when the car of a single mom with
limited income needs expensive repairs.

People in those predicaments are in sore need of condolences, and they are in no
mood for philosophical platitudes.

The Greek word for "railing" is loidoria (loy-dor-ee'-ah) which means slander or
vituperation; which Webster's defines as 1) to abuse or censure severely or
abusively; viz: berate, and 2) to use harsh condemnatory language.

Rejoinders fall into that category; which are defined as a usually rude or angry
reply to something written or said; viz: insensitive retorts deliberately meant to
hurt people's feelings; viz: tit for tat. That kind of behavior doesn't go unnoticed.

"I say to you, that every careless word that men shall speak, they shall render
account for it in the day of judgment. For by your words you shall be justified, and
by your words you shall be condemned." (Matt 12:36-37)
1Pet 3:10-11 . . Let him who means to love life and see good days refrain his
tongue from evil and his lips from speaking guile. And let him turn away from evil
and do good; let him seek peace and pursue it.

Webster's defines "guile" as duplicity which is defined as: contradictory doubleness
of thought, speech, or action; especially in the belying of one's true intentions by
deceptive words or action; in other words, speaking with a forked tongue and/or
saying one thing while meaning another.

Quite a bit is said in the Bible about the words people speak, whereas little to
nothing is said about the words they write. That could be because so many people
back in the day were illiterate. But surely one's written words have just as much
voice as one's spoken words; else we couldn't justify calling the Bible the word of God.

Good and evil are here juxtaposed as benevolence vs malevolence, i.e. good will vs
ill will.

To "seek peace and pursue it" is blessing-worthy.

"Blessed are the peacemakers: for they shall be called the children of God." (Matt 5:9)

If it's true that only peaceable kinds of people qualify to wear the label "children of
God" then the opposite is just as true: difficult Christians are unworthy of the
1Pet 4:8 . . Above all, keep fervent in your love for one another, because love
hides a large number of sins.

A person easily provoked is not a loving person.

One Saturday morning I and another man at church were moving some furniture
from one place to another inside the main building where, completely unknown to
us, a wedding rehearsal was being conducted.

The woman in charge of organizing the wedding came out into the hall and began
scolding us for talking and making noise. When I pointed out that there were no
posted signs in the hallway indicating a function in progress on the other side of the
door, she became sullen, and tightened her lips and narrowed her eyes in anger.

Had that lady exemplified the love about which Peter wrote, she would have
handled her inconvenience with a little more tact and sensitivity, i.e. diplomacy.

BTW: That same lady was also in the choir, and sang doxologies in front of about
2,000 people every Sunday morning. She was good at musical harmony, but
obviously in sore need of some training in the civil kind.
1Pet 5:5b . . and all of you, clothe yourselves with humility toward one another, for God is opposed to the proud, but gives grace to the humble.

The Greek word for "humble" is tapeinophrosune (tap-i-nof-ros-oo'-nay) which means lowliness of mind; viz: modesty, which Webster's defines as freedom from conceit or vanity. Lowliness of mind is to be greatly desired for its blessing.

"Blessed are the poor in spirit: for theirs is the kingdom of heaven." (Matt 5:3)

Humility is very rare on internet forums. Active members are typically easily insulted and infected with vanity; plus imperious, domineering, despotic, assertive, confrontational, arrogant, conceited, reactive, thin-skinned, self-righteous, emotional, critical, and defensive. Those are not what I would call good Christian attributes. They also have a propensity to jump to conclusions, get the wrong impression, and fly off the handle. Those aren't good Christian attributes either; in point of fact; none of those attributes are blessing-worthy.

"Grace" is one of those ambiguous abstract nouns that nobody seems to agree upon. Noah found grace in God's eyes (Gen 6:8) which in his case, regarded providence; which can be defined as kindly patronage. It was by God's providence that Noah and his family survived the Flood while the sons of God and their harems didn't. Let that sink in. Just because people label themselves a Christian, and profess a belief in Christ, is no guarantee they'll escape the horrors of the book of Revelation. Noah was a righteous man, and perfect in his generation; too many of today's card-carrying Christians are neither.

The Greek word for "proud" is huperephanos (hoop-er-ay'-fan-os) which means appearing above others, viz: haughty. Those kinds of people typically regard others with contempt, i.e. undeserving of respect or even so much as common courtesy. Haughty people are typically cruel, thoughtless, insensitive, and badly infected with a superiority complex, which goes hand in hand with arrogance: defined as an exaggerated sense of one's importance, sometimes manifested in an overbearing manner.

Arrogant people can be intolerably pushy and assertive at times; standing up to them usually always provokes an indignant reaction and a call to arms, so to speak, because these folk regard any and all disagreements with their way of thinking as demeaning attacks upon their core values and their distorted sense of self worth. These people have very little interest in harmony; they're stand-up fighters whose primary interest is winning and/or suppressing the opposition.

Seeing as how Heaven is reputed a place of peace, then the arrogant, the haughty, and the proud cannot be allowed to go there with their unholy personalities. For sure they'd just end up making things very uncomfortable for Heaven's normally mild-mannered, affable society
2Pet 3:14 . .Therefore, beloved, looking forward to these things, be diligent to be
found by Him in peace, without spot and blameless

Christians involved in political activism and civil disobedience really need to stop
what they're doing because those pursuits are not conducive to peace, rather, they
foment conflict.

"The meek shall inherit the earth; and shall delight themselves in the abundance of
peace." (Ps 37:11)