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Pre-trib Rapture only, anything else incriminates God

Refusal of his mark results in torment and for many, execution (Revelation 13:15).
this is what settles it for me, the tribulations will happen first and then christ will come and we get raptured after being judged

if believers are tormented and executed for denying the antichrist, then how can they have been raptured before the devil even getting the chance to violate them? he doesnt rule over heaven where those raptured will be found

forgive me for mentioning this, but one of 2 sources ive seen on 2032/2033 is an old book written by a christian monk condemned to death, its a 70kg heavy book that was written overnight, which is entirely impossible, it has devils on the pages staring at you and chaos followed it wherever it went, its currently stationed in sweden (which ... is a tragedy these days)
this book suggests 2033 as it reads it out loud on one page
i know we shouldnt revolve around satanic scripture- but the satanists are real, their witchcraft works, the devil is real, and there arent many things untrue in that book if any
the day and hour we may not know, but 2032/2033 is a safe bet, but for what exactly? its when the mark is pushed? its when christ returns? its when tribulations start? regardless we must be prepared for something no one can prepare for

sorry for the vast text, it is a sin to speak too much, we must be concise and not waste our precious time.
 
this is what settles it for me, the tribulations will happen first and then christ will come and we get raptured after being judged

if believers are tormented and executed for denying the antichrist, then how can they have been raptured before the devil even getting the chance to violate them? he doesnt rule over heaven where those raptured will be found

Scripture speaks of tribulation saints. Christians in the tribulation come to Jesus by following Rev 2:10 and Rev 14:9-11.

Rom 10:9, what Christians pre-trib follow is completely and utterly incompatable with Rev 14:9-11.

If you have the mark of the beast, no amount of faith in Jesus will save you.

forgive me for mentioning this, but one of 2 sources ive seen on 2032/2033 is an old book written by a christian monk condemned to death, its a 70kg heavy book that was written overnight, which is entirely impossible, it has devils on the pages staring at you and chaos followed it wherever it went, its currently stationed in sweden (which ... is a tragedy these days)
this book suggests 2033 as it reads it out loud on one page
i know we shouldnt revolve around satanic scripture- but the satanists are real, their witchcraft works, the devil is real, and there arent many things untrue in that book if any
the day and hour we may not know, but 2032/2033 is a safe bet, but for what exactly? its when the mark is pushed? its when christ returns? its when tribulations start? regardless we must be prepared for something no one can prepare for

sorry for the vast text, it is a sin to speak too much, we must be concise and not waste our precious time.

I agree with 2033. There was a discussion on this date here recently. It is the most logical date actually. If I recall correctly, if you count two biblical days from the covenant with the Jews being broken, you arrive at the start of the tribulation. As the tribulation is a restoration of the covenant.

Now if you take Jesus and His death / victory over sin as the event that ushers in a new covenant with mankind by God and ends the old (which is the most logical), that would mean 2 days after that = tribulation start date. Now the Jewish calendar does treat years differently to us. But every 17 years they perfectly align. Meaning 2000 Jewish years + 33 years = could well be very close to 2033, The most accurate end time bible based prediction.

Also, if you study the topic of the tribulation and rapture properly. As mentioned in my OP, you will see that the end of the tribulation is a knowable date. Seven years at the end of the sixth day. Matt 24:36 references a clearly separate rapture event date that nobody knows the day and hour of, except for God the Father.
 
If you have the mark of the beast, no amount of faith in Jesus will save you.
Rather, "if you have the mark of the beast," you have already evinced a faith in something other than Jesus.

Scripture speaks of tribulation saints. Christians in the tribulation come to Jesus by following Rev 2:10 and Rev 14:9-11.
Those verses you cited have nothing to do with "coming to Jesus."

In view of the many hundreds of such disjointed and egotistical posts you have made here and elsewhere in your pre-trib "rapture" theory crusade, it is obvious you have been deceived on this issue for a very long time. A deep breath and kneepads would be your best option at this juncture.

Rather than endeavoring to best others, you might consider God's requirements - while you may yet be teachable.

Godspeed.
 
Rather, "if you have the mark of the beast," you have already evinced a faith in something other than Jesus.


Those verses you cited have nothing to do with "coming to Jesus."

In view of the many hundreds of such disjointed and egotistical posts you have made here and elsewhere in your pre-trib "rapture" theory crusade, it is obvious you have been deceived on this issue for a very long time. A deep breath and kneepads would be your best option at this juncture.

Rather than endeavoring to best others, you might consider God's requirements - while you may yet be teachable.

Godspeed.

Yet another lovely, very Christian post from you. : unamused:

For the readers sake, I am going to re-type my arguments to you in the hope that all understand that the points being made are as simple as 1 + 1 = 2.

1
. In Rev 2:10 scripture says that if you endure ten days of torment and are put to death you will receive a crown.

You state ''Those verses you cited have nothing to do with "coming to Jesus.'', tell me, if you get a crown does it mean A. You will be with Jesus in heaven or B. You will be with the devil in hell one day?

2. In Rev 14:9-11 the point is made that if you accept the mark of the beast, you will be damned forever.

You state ''Those verses you cited have nothing to do with "coming to Jesus.'', tell me, if you get the mark of the beast does it mean A. You will be with Jesus in heaven or B. You will be with the devil in hell one day?

Then, if you reject the mark of the beast and endure torment for not having it, go hungry for example and one day soon after die from hunger or something similar, will you A. Go to be with Jesus or B. Go to eternal hell?

3. In Rom 10: it teaches us that if we have the faith (gifted by the Holy Spirit per 1 Cor 12:3) to call Jesus Lord and believe He was raised from the dead, we will be saved.

You state ''Rather, "if you have the mark of the beast," you have already evinced a faith in something other than Jesus.''. This line is not dealing with the issue. You are dodging and creating a rabbit trail. Tell me, if I receive the mark of the beast on day one and continue to live for another 7 years, in those seven years, will any amount of repentance, going to church and believing in Jesus and His resurrection save me? Yes or No?.

Give me A or B / Yes or No answers please. Let's try keep things very clear and simple, in case one of us is unteachable....
 
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i really think there is nothing more to be said.

If I held your belief, I would take defending God’s goodness far more seriously than you or anyone else in this thread. So far, none of my points have been soundly rebutted.
 
Christians in the tribulation come to Jesus by following Rev 2:10 and Rev 14:9-11.
This is false and not true, hear is what it says, how anyone can claim a time frame when they came to Jesus by this scripture should put a red flag up for everyone reading. What it proves is that Christians are in the tribulation

Revelation 2:10
;Do not be afraid of what you are about to suffer. I tell you, the devil will put some of you in prison to test you, and you will suffer persecution for ten days. Be faithful, even to the point of death, and I will give you life as your victor’s crown.


Revelation 14:9-11

;A third angel followed them and said in a loud voice: “If anyone worships the beast and its image and receives its mark on their forehead or on their hand, 10 they, too, will drink the wine of God’s fury, which has been poured full strength into the cup of his wrath. They will be tormented with burning sulfur in the presence of the holy angels and of the Lamb. 11 And the smoke of their torment will rise for ever and ever. There will be no rest day or night for those who worship the beast and its image, or for anyone who receives the mark of its name.”​
 
If I held your belief, I would take defending God’s goodness far more seriously than you or anyone else in this thread. So far, none of my points have been soundly rebutted.
Other than the words of Jesus himself who said, "IMMEDIATELY AFTER THE TRIBULATION OF THOSE DAYS" ...

And THEN shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and THEN shall all the tribes of the earth mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory.

And he shall send his angels with



AND THEY SHALL GATHER TOGETHER HIS ELECT from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other.

And Paul who said, "
"For this we say unto you by the word of the Lord, that we which are alive and remain unto the coming/PAROUSIA of the Lord shall not prevent them which are asleep.

What is the parousia?
The future visible return from heaven of Jesus, to raise the dead, hold the last judgment, and set up formally and gloriously the kingdom of God.

For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first:

Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up/Harpazo together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord."

Behold, I shew you a mystery; We shall not all sleep, but we shall all be changed, in a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trump: for the trumpet shall sound, and the dead shall be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed.

You do know what the last trump is, Correct? Or are you also in denial of that! Let me help you with that anyway. According to Strong's the last trump is "ἐν τῇ ἐσχάτῃ σάλπιγγι, the trumpet which will sound at the last day - 1 Corinthians 15:52

The Harpazo is the rapture or removal of believers. So, put it all together.

The passage is saying that the rapture/harpazo happens 'at the Parousia' which is when Jesus returns to raise the dead, hold the last judgment, and set up formally and gloriously the kingdom of God. That can ONLY happen at the end of tribulation when Jesus returns to set up his kingdom.

Your arrogance is through the roof and shining through! However, changing the mind of a misled and deceived pre-tribber is like taking a sliver out of the back side of a wild cat.
 
The OP yet again has been debunked.

The passage is saying that the rapture/harpazo happens 'at the Parousia' which is when Jesus returns to raise the dead, hold the last judgment, and set up formally and gloriously the kingdom of God. That can ONLY happen at the end of tribulation when Jesus returns to set up his kingdom.
Beautiful! And further to that truth,

Believers don’t do the hackneyed “go to heaven” thing; rather, Christ sets up his kingdom here, with us. We, being "caught up" with others, meet the Lord in the air and then return back to earth with him.

For example, if your friends fly in from another country to visit you, you might travel to your local airport to meet them when their plane lands and then escort them back to your place. If they’re VIP friends, you might have a delegation meet them at your country's main airport, and then escort them back to your place. In either case, you don’t go to your airport, meet your friends, get on your friend’s plane, and then travel back with your friends to their place of origin!

So, do we have a scriptural witness to this scenario? Yes.

...we came the next day to Puteoli: Where we found brethren, and were desired to tarry with them seven days: and so we went toward Rome. And from thence, when the brethren heard of us, they came to meet us as far as Appii forum, and The three taverns: whom when Paul saw, he thanked God, and took courage. And when we came to Rome... -- Acts 28:13-16

The brothers in Rome got word of their impending visitors, and so went out to meet them at Appii forum, and then escorted them back to Rome.

meet = same word in both Acts 28 and 1 Thes. 4.

Here are all four usages of the word meet:

Mat. 25:1 - Then shall the kingdom of heaven be likened unto ten virgins, which took their lamps, and went forth to meet the bridegroom.

Mat. 25:6 - And at midnight there was a cry made, Behold, the bridegroom cometh; go ye out to meet him.

Acts 28:15 - And from thence, when the brethren heard of us, they came to meet us as far as Appii forum, and The three taverns: whom when Paul saw, he thanked God, and took courage.

1 Thes. 4:17 - Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord.

All four are consistent with “meet and greet and return to base.“
 
We, being "caught up" with others, meet the Lord in the air and then return back to earth with him.

That is a common understanding among believers, and I agree with your reply but please consider this.

There are disagreements over who the "saints" are that Jesus comes back with at his return. Pre-trib believers say it includes resurrected people who were raptured before the tribulation. Some post-trib believers think the resurrection happens while Jesus returns in the clouds after the tribulation, AND the resurrected "saints" then come back down to earth with him as he comes to Armageddon. I believe that both of these theories are incorrect. This reply is to show that the saints whom Jesus comes back with are ONLY His holy angels.

Jesus returns with all his Saints
ZECHARIAH 14:3-5
3 Then shall the LORD go forth, and fight against those nations, as when he fought in the day of battle. And his feet shall stand in that day upon the mount of Olives, which is before Jerusalem on the east, and the mount of Olives...

5 And you shall flee to the valley of the mountains; for the valley of the mountains shall reach to Azal: yes, you shall flee, like you fled from before the earthquake in the days of Uzziah king of Judah: and the LORD my God shall come, and all the SAINTS with you.

1 THESSALONIANS 3:13 To the end he may establish your hearts blameless in holiness before God, even our Father, at the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ with all his saints.

JUDE 14-15 And Enoch also, the seventh from Adam, prophesied of these, saying, Behold, the Lord comes with ten thousands of his saints. To execute judgment upon all...

Here are a few issues - NOT ALL!

First, the righteous dead who will rise at the rapture are all raised on the LAST DAY! Not 7 YEARS BEFORE. (John 6:39-40; 6:44; 6:54; 11:24).

Second, to a pre-tribber, which you are not, it would mean that Jesus has to come at least three times in all, once to suffer and die, once to translate (or rapture) the church before the tribulation, and again on the last day for Armageddon.

Nowhere does scripture teach a third coming of Jesus. On the contrary. The Parousia is mentioned 4 times in Mathew 24 in V.3, 27, 37, and 39.

PAROUSIA is also 'singular' in 1 Corinthians 1:7; 1 Thessalonians 3:13; 4:1), 1 Corinthians 15:23; 1 Thessalonians 2:19; 1 John 2:28). Notice they are all in the singular!

These scriptures show Jesus is coming back with his "saints." The big question is, "who are the saints"?

 
There are disagreements over who the "saints" are that Jesus comes back with at his return.
and
These scriptures show Jesus is coming back with his "saints." The big question is, "who are the saints"?
The two types of people: sinners and saints. No mystery.

"we which are alive and remain unto the coming of the Lord shall not prevent them which are asleep."
"Then we which are alive and remain..."
alive AND remain = survive (one may ask, "survive" what?)

In any case, the overriding problem is a basic misunderstanding of the resurrection.

If you want the answer to the "rapture" question, simply study the RESURRECTION.

The rapture doctrine requires students of the scriptures to approach each relevant verse with certain preconceived notions about prophecy. If you simply read the various prophetic verses about the return of Christ, the Bible clearly teaches that believers will be “gathered” at the second coming -- not some secret, invisible return that precedes his BIG second coming at the end of the tribulation. The problem isn’t in our understanding of the rapture, because the rapture as routinely taught today doesn’t even exist; the difficulty is in our understanding of the resurrection.

In John chapter five, Jesus tells us how God The Father has committed the power of resurrection to him. Jesus says “He that heareth my word and believeth on him that sent me, hath everlasting life...for the hour is coming, in the which all that are in the graves shall hear his voice. And shall come forth; they that have done good, unto the resurrection of life; and they that have done evil, unto the resurrection of damnation.” (John 6:24, 28, 29) According to these passages, apparently there are two resurrections: one for those “that have done good,” and a resurrection for those “that have done evil.”

In one of the parallel accounts, a verse in Luke has Christ himself saying that the believer shall “be recompensed at the resurrection of the just.” (Luke 14:14) Another proof text of this dual aspect of the resurrection is found in the book of Acts when the Apostle Paul was brought before the Roman governor Felix and charged with heresy by the Jews.

Paul stated that he believes, as the Jews did, “that there shall be a resurrection of the dead, both of the just and the unjust.” (Ezekiel 33:8, 4) A further example of this understanding of two resurrections is found in the Old Testament, when the prophet Daniel was instructed by the archangel Michael concerning the tribulation and the resurrection. In that instance, Michael said that in the time of the end, “many of them that sleep in the dust of the earth shall awake, some to everlasting life, and some to shame and everlasting contempt.” (Daniel 12:2)

Back in the New Testament book of Revelation, we find a reference to “the first resurrection.” (Rev. 20:5) This first resurrection clearly relates to believers in Jesus, for the text states that they “lived and reigned with Christ a thousand years.” (Rev. 20:4)

In the same chapter, John (the writer of Revelation) says “the rest of the dead live not again until the thousand years were finished.” (Rev. 20:5) Later in the chapter John says, “when the thousand years are expired...I saw the dead, small and great, stand before God...and the dead were judged...” (Rev. 20:7, 12) These verses plainly state that there are two resurrections -- one for believers and one for unbelievers.

The Revelation passages further clarify that these two resurrections are separated by one thousand years; this being the period we commonly call the millennium during which the resurrected believers shall “reign with him a thousand years.” (Rev. 20:6)

Nowhere does scripture teach a third coming of Jesus. On the contrary.
Indeed.
 
This is false and not true, hear is what it says, how anyone can claim a time frame when they came to Jesus by this scripture should put a red flag up for everyone reading. What it proves is that Christians are in the tribulation

Dave, I don't agree with you, please see post # 126 to BacknForth and quote which line therein you disagree with.
 
@farmerjoe @backNforth

You two really crack me up. I’ve laid out my arguments in clear, logical point form, yet your rebuttals don’t address them directly. Instead, you shift the discussion to what you believe and selectively quote scriptures that you think support your position.

It shows arrogance and laziness on your part, not to mention the ad hominem. I feel like this may be your first debate in a while?

A debate is supposed to go like this:

KingJ makes points A, B and C.
Farmer, replies in logical point form to A, B and C, then proceeds to add E, F and G.
KingJ addresses A - G. F and G fall off as they are soundly rebutted.

Instead we have this:

KingJ makes points A, B and C.
Farmer voices his personal hatred of the topic without any sound reasons and explains how X and Y matter, despite the fact that they are completely and utterly unrelated to A, B and C.

BacknForth likes Farmers post as they share the same pet belief and proceeds to discuss something equally unrelated to points made. Despite the fact that KingJ put in effort in post 126 to directly address his arguments raised.

:sweat:

Stepping back a bit, I don't really blame you two for not directly addressing my arguments raised. Imagine disagreeing with 1 + 1 = 2. :D :D
 
If you have the mark of the beast, no amount of faith in Jesus will save you.
yes there are very few things that cannot be forgiven.

kneepads would be your best option
well indeed if we are misled god might not be so happy about that, either you humble yourself or get ready to get it full force.

i think this whole talk is very silly, because - if we are sucked up into heaven before it all starts, the rulership of the antichrist - those of us who came to christ prior tribulations, then thats just how it is.
if that doesnt happen and we have to endure the ruling of the antichrist, well thats gonna be where you realize you guessed wrong on the scripture

AND THATS IT. let us not argue one another, let us at most, state our belief and accept that we all want the truth.
truth doesnt argue, it doesnt fight anyone, it knows that its permanent and rigid and fixated, the opponents of truth simply die out. either by converting after seeing their own truth ringing false, or simply perishing with those who refuse to be corrected when the evidence occurs in their own world as would it be when the antichrist .. well some would say he will sit in throne in our bodies since our body is temple, i do believe they will rebuild the temple in jerusalem- awaiting this temple could be a red herring however to make us forget our bodies are our temple, they may be fortifying their position in our bodies as we speak.

just quit arguing, say your view, try not to correct anyone, accept we disagree and certainly dont allow yourself to become negative with others, especially not those who also seek the truth and christ
 
Among the false teachings, I think the pre-trib rapture theory is probably the worst as it leads to false hope and leads people away from God. I've been to a few of those churches were there so caught up with the concept of the pre-trib rapture that if you even try to talk to them you're cursed. They will spend hours talking about the pre-trib rapture and if you ask him we'll let's do the scripture let's actually read some scripture you know for your service they will say well we are. LOL

The pre-trib Rapture theory is just Theory. It is a false teaching along with once saved always saved and a number of others
 
Among the false teachings, I think the pre-trib rapture theory is probably the worst as it leads to false hope and leads people away from God. I've been to a few of those churches were there so caught up with the concept of the pre-trib rapture that if you even try to talk to them you're cursed. They will spend hours talking about the pre-trib rapture and if you ask him we'll let's do the scripture let's actually read some scripture you know for your service they will say well we are. LOL

The pre-trib Rapture theory is just Theory. It is a false teaching along with once saved always saved and a number of others

The problem is that many don't study the topic well enough. Much like the topic of OSAS.

High level, with little study, sure a pre-trib, post-trib or no rapture until the end of the tribulation seems like a case of ''Whatever Will Be, Will Be, Que Sera, Sera.''

No pre-trib rapture = good God
Pre-trib rapture = good God

People aggressively pushing a rapture theory when there is a potential of there not being one = pushing false hope. Bad Christians.

----------------

The problem is, (like I have tried to explain in many posts to many here to little avail as ears and brains seem mostly switched off), that when you look properly at those passages speaking to the tribulation, salvation and rapture it becomes crystal clear that God would be incriminated if there is no pre-trib rapture and that a number of verses seem to be included in scripture by mistake.

I very clearly explained this to you in posts # 114, 115, 116 and 117. Clearly wasted my time. You read all that and type a reply like the above...

I am not sure why so many here cannot read and respond to points made. Is reading conflicting opinions and responding in point form to arguments raised too hard?

This is supposed to be a discussion forum not X.
 
The OP yet again has been debunked.

:D Not a single point in the OP was addressed....

Beautiful! And further to that truth,

Believers don’t do the hackneyed “go to heaven” thing; rather, Christ sets up his kingdom here, with us. We, being "caught up" with others, meet the Lord in the air and then return back to earth with him.

For example, if your friends fly in from another country to visit you, you might travel to your local airport to meet them when their plane lands and then escort them back to your place. If they’re VIP friends, you might have a delegation meet them at your country's main airport, and then escort them back to your place. In either case, you don’t go to your airport, meet your friends, get on your friend’s plane, and then travel back with your friends to their place of origin!

So, do we have a scriptural witness to this scenario? Yes.

...we came the next day to Puteoli: Where we found brethren, and were desired to tarry with them seven days: and so we went toward Rome. And from thence, when the brethren heard of us, they came to meet us as far as Appii forum, and The three taverns: whom when Paul saw, he thanked God, and took courage. And when we came to Rome... -- Acts 28:13-16

The brothers in Rome got word of their impending visitors, and so went out to meet them at Appii forum, and then escorted them back to Rome.

meet = same word in both Acts 28 and 1 Thes. 4.

Here are all four usages of the word meet:

Mat. 25:1 - Then shall the kingdom of heaven be likened unto ten virgins, which took their lamps, and went forth to meet the bridegroom.

Mat. 25:6 - And at midnight there was a cry made, Behold, the bridegroom cometh; go ye out to meet him.

Acts 28:15 - And from thence, when the brethren heard of us, they came to meet us as far as Appii forum, and The three taverns: whom when Paul saw, he thanked God, and took courage.

1 Thes. 4:17 - Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord.

All four are consistent with “meet and greet and return to base.“

I understand the analogy you’re making, but the comparison assumes something the text itself does not state.

Yes, the word “meet” can be used in a welcoming sense, but the context still determines what happens after the meeting. The passage in First Epistle to the Thessalonians 4:17 does not say we immediately return to earth. It simply says we meet the Lord in the air and “so shall we ever be with the Lord.” The emphasis is on being with Him, not on escorting Him back.

Also, your analogy only works if the destination is explicitly stated afterward. In Acts 28, the destination (Rome) is clearly specified. In Thessalonians, it is not. You are inserting an assumption.

Additionally, the passage describes:
  • the dead in Christ rising first
  • the living being caught up
  • both groups together in the clouds
  • meeting the Lord in the air
If the purpose was simply escorting Him to earth immediately, the “caught up in the clouds” detail becomes unnecessary. Why not just say “He comes and we gather to Him”?

The text simply does not say we return immediately. You are building doctrine on an assumption.
 
and

The two types of people: sinners and saints. No mystery.

"we which are alive and remain unto the coming of the Lord shall not prevent them which are asleep."
"Then we which are alive and remain..."
alive AND remain = survive (one may ask, "survive" what?)

In any case, the overriding problem is a basic misunderstanding of the resurrection.

If you want the answer to the "rapture" question, simply study the RESURRECTION.

The rapture doctrine requires students of the scriptures to approach each relevant verse with certain preconceived notions about prophecy. If you simply read the various prophetic verses about the return of Christ, the Bible clearly teaches that believers will be “gathered” at the second coming -- not some secret, invisible return that precedes his BIG second coming at the end of the tribulation. The problem isn’t in our understanding of the rapture, because the rapture as routinely taught today doesn’t even exist; the difficulty is in our understanding of the resurrection.

In John chapter five, Jesus tells us how God The Father has committed the power of resurrection to him. Jesus says “He that heareth my word and believeth on him that sent me, hath everlasting life...for the hour is coming, in the which all that are in the graves shall hear his voice. And shall come forth; they that have done good, unto the resurrection of life; and they that have done evil, unto the resurrection of damnation.” (John 6:24, 28, 29) According to these passages, apparently there are two resurrections: one for those “that have done good,” and a resurrection for those “that have done evil.”

In one of the parallel accounts, a verse in Luke has Christ himself saying that the believer shall “be recompensed at the resurrection of the just.” (Luke 14:14) Another proof text of this dual aspect of the resurrection is found in the book of Acts when the Apostle Paul was brought before the Roman governor Felix and charged with heresy by the Jews.

Paul stated that he believes, as the Jews did, “that there shall be a resurrection of the dead, both of the just and the unjust.” (Ezekiel 33:8, 4) A further example of this understanding of two resurrections is found in the Old Testament, when the prophet Daniel was instructed by the archangel Michael concerning the tribulation and the resurrection. In that instance, Michael said that in the time of the end, “many of them that sleep in the dust of the earth shall awake, some to everlasting life, and some to shame and everlasting contempt.” (Daniel 12:2)

Back in the New Testament book of Revelation, we find a reference to “the first resurrection.” (Rev. 20:5) This first resurrection clearly relates to believers in Jesus, for the text states that they “lived and reigned with Christ a thousand years.” (Rev. 20:4)

In the same chapter, John (the writer of Revelation) says “the rest of the dead live not again until the thousand years were finished.” (Rev. 20:5) Later in the chapter John says, “when the thousand years are expired...I saw the dead, small and great, stand before God...and the dead were judged...” (Rev. 20:7, 12) These verses plainly state that there are two resurrections -- one for believers and one for unbelievers.

The Revelation passages further clarify that these two resurrections are separated by one thousand years; this being the period we commonly call the millennium during which the resurrected believers shall “reign with him a thousand years.” (Rev. 20:6)


Indeed.

You’re assuming two resurrections must mean two single moments. But scripture presents the first resurrection in phases.

Christ first, then those who are His, each in their own order (Cor 15:23). That already implies sequence.

In 1 Thesss 4, only believers are raised, the dead in Christ. Then in Rev 20, tribulation martyrs are raised and this is still called the first resurrection.

So the first resurrection is not one instant, it is a category covering all believers. The second resurrection is the unbelievers after the thousand years.

A pre-trib rapture simply places the church at the beginning of the first resurrection, not as a separate third one.
 
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