Whomsoever claims that obedience to...

[Yeshua]

Whomsoever claims that obedience to God is the bondage that we should avoid is spreading lies from the Father of lies, Satan.

For this is the love of God, that we keep his commandments: and his commandments are not grievous. 1 John 5:3

We still are obedient to God but we do it now in the newness of the Spirit of LOVE and not the letter of what the law seems to say to those who are disobedient.

Beloved, let us love one another: for love is of God; and every one that loveth is born of God, and knoweth God. He that loveth not knoweth not God; for God is love.
1 John 4:7-8

But now we are delivered from the law, that being dead wherein we were held; that we should serve in newness of spirit, and not in the oldness of the letter. Romans 7:6

Do we have ears that do not hear?

 

[jiggyfly]

yeshua could you please clarify which commandments you are referring to? The commandments of the old agreement (covenant) or the commandments of the new and better agreement (covenant)?

 

[Yeshua]

Sure...

yeshua could you please clarify which commandments you are referring to? The commandments of the old agreement (covenant) or the commandments of the new and better agreement (covenant)?

I'm refering to the same commandments that the LORD is refering too in 1John 5:3

 

[califlower]

Obedience in Love, not Fear, isn't Legalism

We're supposed to obey God not because we are afraid of breaking some little rule (out of 613) and be sent to hell or something, but because WE LOVE GOD, and we know that HE IS EMBODIED IN HIS LAW. You can see His love of us is shown there, and we WANT TO OBEY to show our LOVE OF HIM in return. We should OBEY GOD OUT OF LOVE - NOT OUT OF FEAR! It is FEAR that drives people to want to disparage the Law, or try to say Jesus came here to "satisfy" the law, or "destroy" the law - when in actuality, he FULFILLED the Law, HE OBEYED THE LAW... He was AN INNOCENT LAMB... otherwise he wouldn't be FIT to be the exchange for our sins! That is so simple! There was NO BLEMISH on Christ whatsoever. And to say that we can merely ignore the Ten Commandments after the Messiah came to save us from our sins, is to go against further scripture, that would say, if you claim to have Jesus within you, but then sin - you are a liar. And in James, when it is said that without fruits - faith is dead. This is probably the most fundamental concept in all of Christianity - and yet the most disputed - it has now divided whole churches between "faith based" and "act based". I honestly feel the faith-based Church, the Calvinistic position, is one that yes - is founded in the seeds that the Enemy wishes to plant within the Christian community - especially in these End Days.
To dismiss the Commandments would extinguish the very first one: Love God. Does that make sense?

We still are obedient to God but we do it now in the newness of the Spirit of LOVE and not the letter of what the law seems to say to those who are disobient.

This was beautifully said, Yeshua...this takes to task every member here who wants to call the love and worship of "obedience" a form of "legalism" - I think the two are quite discernable. And this is why those of us who do obey one of the commandments of Jesus, in His teachings, at least for me, obey one very important one: JUDGE NOT.
God bless you, Yeshua, for such an excellent post.
In Christ
CaliFlower :rose:

 

[Yeshua]

I'm not sure but was this one...

I'm not sure but was this one of the scriptures you were refering too, Sister?

If we say that we have not sinned, we make him a liar, and his word is not in us.1 John 1:10

or was it this one:

He that saith, I know him, and keepeth not his commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him. 1 John 2:4


I love your Responses, Sister In Christ, califlower

 

[Toklatkate]

I'm not sure but was this one of the scriptures you were refering too, Sister?

If we say that we have not sinned, we make him a liar, and his word is not in us.1 John 1:10

or was it this one:

He that saith, I know him, and keepeth not his commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him. 1 John 2:4


I love your Responses, Sister In Christ, califlower

I am a friend of Califlower. I am sure this is the verse to which she was referring.

I agree with both of your comments (Yeshua & Califlower).

If we are to be ignoring God's law, then were are in disobedience.
God said in the first commandment to love Him, and Jesus backed that up as being the first.
If we were to assume that the law was only for the old Testament times and to now be ignored, then that would say that we do not have to love God.
I say that we must love God if we want to spend eternity with Him. That is a prerequisite.
As Cali said, we obey out of love.
The first commandment is the basis for the rest. When we love God with all of our being, then we want to keep the rest. This is not legalism, or difficult, even. When we truly love God, obeying Him is a joy. If a person has not yet found that joy, then he, she, or they need to get more in love with God, and then the joy in obedience will come.
In Christ our Lord,
Toklatkate

 

[califlower]

d'oh!! 1 John 2:4

I John 2:4! Yes! Awe thank you!! Sorry for the late reply, I'm juggling a few balls in the air. I meant the second verse quote, however - both apply here, don't they! We all have sinned, which is why we should not judge; yet, if we do sin NOW... we are liars if we continue to do so, with full knowledge we are going against God - and we have no right - we were bought for a very heavy price. Jesus's blood. "Go and sin no more..." these words seem to have no meaning to some, and the commandments is where it shows the most. People who truly love the Lord, in my opinion, understand both these concepts; a) we have all sinned and b) to go on sinning shows you haven't been "a changed man" and the argument can be that Jesus was never in you in the first place, and so, ergo, you're a liar. But as for these two scriptures, thank you for making that wonderful connection. You really can't discuss one without the other, which is one of the most strikingly awesome things about the Bible's construction. Testimony to its God-inspired veracity. Beautifully done, Yeshua.... and I humbly thank you for your compliment. I try. And, I'm learning.
Humbly Your Servant in Christ,
CaliFlower :rose:

 

[brokenman]

Hi Yeshua, how are you? I sure do appreciate your insites. I agree 100%!!! The Lord put it to me this way.... James 2:20But wilt thou know, O vain man, that faith without works is dead? Then the Holy Spirit spoke to my heart and said, "and Sean works without faith is vain". Then He brang me to this scripture.. Psalm 127:1Except the LORD build the house, they labour in vain that build it: except the LORD keep the city, the watchman waketh but in vain.

 

[Yeshua]

Thank you Brother....

Hi Yeshua, how are you? I sure do appreciate your insites. I agree 100%!!! The Lord put it to me this way.... James 2:20But wilt thou know, O vain man, that faith without works is dead? Then the Holy Spirit spoke to my heart and said, "and Sean works without faith is vain". Then He brang me to this scripture.. Psalm 127:1Except the LORD build the house, they labour in vain that build it: except the LORD keep the city, the watchman waketh but in vain.

Thank you Brother:boy: for Standing up for the Eternal Truth of Christ Jesus, Our Lord and Savior.

And why call ye me, Lord, Lord, and do not the things which I say? Luke 6:46

 

[evangeline]

Christ has set is free!!! But we can choose to use that freedom to become a slave to God. God never takes away our free will, but if we truly want to love God, serve God and please God, we will voluntarily consecrate our lives to Him and live in obedience to Him as His bondslave.

You have been set free from sin and become slaves to righteousness Romans 6:18

But now you have been set free from sin and have become slaves to God, the benefit you reap leads to holiness and the result is eternal life. Romans 6:22

And He died for all, that those who live should no longer live for themselves, but for Him who died for them and was raised again. 2 Corinthians 5:15

Act as free men, but do not use your freedom as a covering for evil; but use it as bondslaves to God. 1 Peter 2:16


evangeline

 

[Jonah2005bt]

Originally Posted byToklatkate;
I agree with both of your comments (Yeshua & Califlower).

If we are to be ignoring God's law, then were are in disobedience.
God said in the first commandment to love Him, and Jesus backed that up as being the first.
If we were to assume that the law was only for the old Testament times and to now be ignored, then that would say that we do not have to love God.
I say that we must love God if we want to spend eternity with Him. That is a prerequisite.

As Cali said, we obey out of love.

Here is a good scripture to help back that up;

John 14:15, 21, 23-24.

15 "If you love me, you will obey what I command.

21 Whoever has my commands and obeys them, he is the one who loves me. He who loves me will be loved by my Father, and I too will love him and show myself to him."

23 Jesus replied, "If anyone loves me, he will obey my teaching. My Father will love him, and we will come to him and make our home with him.
24 He who does not love me will not obey my teaching. These words you hear are not my own; they belong to the Father who sent me.

 

[Gideons 300]

I am new on here so bear with me....

We're supposed to obey God not because we are afraid of breaking some little rule (out of 613) and be sent to hell or something, but because WE LOVE GOD, and we know that HE IS EMBODIED IN HIS LAW. You can see His love of us is shown there, and we WANT TO OBEY to show our LOVE OF HIM in return. We should OBEY GOD OUT OF LOVE - NOT OUT OF FEAR! It is FEAR that drives people to want to disparage the Law, or try to say Jesus came here to "satisfy" the law, or "destroy" the law - when in actuality, he FULFILLED the Law, HE OBEYED THE LAW... He was AN INNOCENT LAMB... otherwise he wouldn't be FIT to be the exchange for our sins! That is so simple! There was NO BLEMISH on Christ whatsoever. And to say that we can merely ignore the Ten Commandments after the Messiah came to save us from our sins, is to go against further scripture, that would say, if you claim to have Jesus within you, but then sin - you are a liar. And in James, when it is said that without fruits - faith is dead. This is probably the most fundamental concept in all of Christianity - and yet the most disputed - it has now divided whole churches between "faith based" and "act based". I honestly feel the faith-based Church, the Calvinistic position, is one that yes - is founded in the seeds that the Enemy wishes to plant within the Christian community - especially in these End Days.
To dismiss the Commandments would extinguish the very first one: Love God. Does that make sense?
This was beautifully said, Yeshua...this takes to task every member here who wants to call the love and worship of "obedience" a form of "legalism" - I think the two are quite discernable. And this is why those of us who do obey one of the commandments of Jesus, in His teachings, at least for me, obey one very important one: JUDGE NOT.
God bless you, Yeshua, for such an excellent post.
In Christ
CaliFlower :rose:

Dear Califlower, I can understand youe insistance on the need for obedience to God, and you are correct, God IS looking for obedienmt children. The question then is HOW? Scripturally, it will not come from obeying the 10 commandments. If we read Romans 3-8, Paul tells us clearly that the purpose of the Law was to bring us to the feet of Jesus seeking His mercy and grace. The law and obedience of it cannot make one whole or perfect. It is only by the law of the spirit of life that a sould can get free of sin and the flesh. The law of commandments was sent to break us of our pride and self effort and to see that we must be cleaned from inside out, by God Himself.

Do we not hear the law and what it demands? It is a hard taskmaster, and fully taken, includes another 531 statutes that are inseperable from the 10 on the tablets of stone. It first demands PERFECT obedience and if you break one commandment one time, you are guilty of breaking all. Secondly, it requires that all of our obedience be done out of pure motives. This is why Jesus rebuked the pharisees who prided themselves on keeping the law. He said to them "You have heard it said "Thous shalt not commit adultery. But I say unto you "If you just look at a women with lust in your hearts, you have already committed adultery with her."

The law can point out God's character, but it makes no allowances for forgiveness or for empowerment. That is why the holy spirit is come, to cause us to will AND to do of God's good pleasure. Our "engine", our strength must be Christ Himself dwelling in us. Without Him doing it in us, it is all vanity.

The basic strength of the law is self-control, right> Do this, don't do that. In the new covenant, amazingly, when the fruits of the spirit are listed by Paul, what do we see? At the end of his list, there is is...self-control, praise God. He is willing to do for us what we cannot ever do. I hope I did not offend you in presenting this view. I am new on here and do not want to upset folks, but rather share what I have found to be true in my journey. Trust me, I was the chief of sinners.

 

[Jonah2005bt]

Awesome Thread!!!

Whomsoever claims that obedience to God is the bondage that we should avoid is spreading lies from the Father of lies, Satan.

For this is the love of God, that we keep his commandments: and his commandments are not grievous. 1 John 5:3

We still are obedient to God but we do it now in the newness of the Spirit of LOVE and not the letter of what the law seems to say to those who are disobedient.

Beloved, let us love one another: for love is of God; and every one that loveth is born of God, and knoweth God. He that loveth not knoweth not God; for God is love.
1 John 4:7-8

But now we are delivered from the law, that being dead wherein we were held; that we should serve in newness of spirit, and not in the oldness of the letter. Romans 7:6

Do we have ears that do not hear?

Yeshua that's an awesome THREAD, thank you for sharing it with us.

Youe Sister, in Christ Jesus, *genesis

 

[dchena]

God's law is freedom.
And Christ is the only way to fulfill the law and gain that freedom.

Matthew 5:17 (King James Version)


<SUP class=versenum id=en-KJV-23252 value="17">17</SUP>Think not that I am come to destroy the law, or the prophets: I am not come to destroy, but to fulfil.