what about when a person walks away?

[byhisgrace]

Is it ever too late for someone as long as they have breath in their body for salvation, for repentance?
If someone has asked Jesus into their heart, asked them to be Lord of their life, has accepted the free gift of salvation, vowed to live for Him, began reading the word, grew very fast in the Lord..then the choice to continue to follow Christ or choose to follow the sin and trash of the world comes, and they choose to walk away from Christ, away from the promise, away from all the goodness: Can they come back to Him? Or is it like in Luke 9:62(putting your hand to the plough and turning back), Hebrews 6:4-6(it is impossible), 2 Peter 2:20-21...

Can a person come back? Give me some examples of any kings, leaders, people in the Bible who followed God, left knowingly and came back?
I look at David who was a man after God's own heart, and he did wrong, but he didn't deliberately turn away from God. And when the prophet brought to his attention what he did, he repented and knew it was very wrong.

I look at Peter who denied Him 3 times, but once he realized he repented.

I look at the prodigal son, but was he saved or lost before he left?

Are there any cases of people who COMPLETELY turned away from God and chose to live the way they wanted knowing it was against God and then came back.
Romans 8:38-39 pretty much covers everything...saying NOTHING could take a person from the love of God, but that doesn't really cover a person when they deliberately, knowingly walk away from God to follow their own lusts.
what do you think?

 

[stephen]

Are there any cases of people who COMPLETELY turned away from God and chose to live the way they wanted knowing it was against God and then came back.
Romans 8:38-39 pretty much covers everything...saying NOTHING could take a person from the love of God, but that doesn't really cover a person when they deliberately, knowingly walk away from God to follow their own lusts.
what do you think?

I am sure that there will be such cases, but as I reply I cannot recall. However I do recall that discouragement is common to all who desire to follow Jesus.

Even the great John the Baptist who baptised Jesus, who heard God's voice, who saw the Spirit descend upon Jesus.....sent a message from a prison cell "Are you the one, or should we look for another" LK 7.

Even the greatest can be discouraged, and need reassurance in the Lord

Reading your post I gather that you read the bible and have knowledge in these matters. As you point out some have gone away from the Father, and have come back, other have not.

God is merciful....Plentious in mercy...Surely we can trust him to save to deliver, to bless and strengthen....even when all seems lost

Yes we can.........Amen....in Jesus

God Bless You........Sincerely in Jesus

 

[Br. Bear]

Part 1

Greetings byhisgrace,

let us look at these Scriptures,

It is reported commonly that there is fornication among you, and such fornication as is not so much as named among the Gentiles, that one should have his father's wife.
And ye are puffed up, and have not rather mourned, that he that hath done this deed might be taken away from among you.
For I verily, as absent in body, but present in spirit, have judged already, as though I were present, concerning him that hath so done this deed,
In the name of our Lord Jesus Christ, when ye are gathered together, and my spirit, with the power of our Lord Jesus Christ,
To deliver such an one unto Satan for the destruction of the flesh, that the spirit may be saved in the day of the Lord Jesus. 1Corinthians 5:1-5

Paul, an apostle of Jesus Christ by the commandment of God our Saviour, and Lord Jesus Christ, which is our hope;
Unto Timothy, my own son in the faith: Grace, mercy, and peace, from God our Father and Jesus Christ our Lord.
As I besought thee to abide still at Ephesus, when I went into Macedonia, that thou mightest charge some that they teach no other doctrine,
Neither give heed to fables and endless genealogies, which minister questions, rather than godly edifying which is in faith: so do.
Now the end of the commandment is charity out of a pure heart, and of a good conscience, and of faith unfeigned:
From which some having swerved have turned aside unto vain jangling;
Desiring to be teachers of the law; understanding neither what they say, nor whereof they affirm.
But we know that the law is good, if a man use it lawfully;
Knowing this, that the law is not made for a righteous man, but for the lawless and disobedient, for the ungodly and for sinners, for unholy and profane, for murderers of fathers and murderers of mothers, for manslayers,
For whoremongers, for them that defile themselves with mankind, for menstealers, for liars, for perjured persons, and if there be any other thing that is contrary to sound doctrine;
According to the glorious gospel of the blessed God, which was committed to my trust.
And I thank Christ Jesus our Lord, who hath enabled me, for that he counted me faithful, putting me into the ministry;
Who was before a blasphemer, and a persecutor, and injurious: but I obtained mercy, because I did it ignorantly in unbelief.
And the grace of our Lord was exceeding abundant with faith and love which is in Christ Jesus.
This is a faithful saying, and worthy of all acceptation, that Christ Jesus came into the world to save sinners; of whom I am chief.
Howbeit for this cause I obtained mercy, that in me first Jesus Christ might shew forth all longsuffering, for a pattern to them which should hereafter believe on him to life everlasting.
Now unto the King eternal, immortal, invisible, the only wise God, be honour and glory for ever and ever. Amen.
This charge I commit unto thee, son Timothy, according to the prophecies which went before on thee, that thou by them mightest war a good warfare;
Holding faith, and a good conscience; which some having put away concerning faith have made shipwreck:
Of whom is Hymenaeus and Alexander; whom I have delivered unto Satan, that they may learn not to blaspheme. 1Timothy1

Brethren, if a man be overtaken in a fault, ye which are spiritual, restore such an one in the spirit of meekness; considering thyself, lest thou also be tempted. Galatians 6:1


Again from a letter to Timothy, Paul writes,

Thou therefore, my son, be strong in the grace that is in Christ Jesus.
And the things that thou hast heard of me among many witnesses, the same commit thou to faithful men, who shall be able to teach others also.
Thou therefore endure hardness, as a good soldier of Jesus Christ.
No man that warreth entangleth himself with the affairs of this life; that he may please him who hath chosen him to be a soldier.
And if a man also strive for masteries, yet is he not crowned, except he strive lawfully.
The husbandman that laboureth must be first partaker of the fruits.
Consider what I say; and the Lord give thee understanding in all things.
Remember that Jesus Christ of the seed of David was raised from the dead according to my gospel:
Wherein I suffer trouble, as an evil doer, even unto bonds; but the word of God is not bound.
Therefore I endure all things for the elect's sakes, that they may also obtain the salvation which is in Christ Jesus with eternal glory.
It is a faithful saying: For if we be dead with him, we shall also live with him:
If we suffer, we shall also reign with him: if we deny him, he also will deny us:
If we believe not, yet he abideth faithful: he cannot deny himself.
Of these things put them in remembrance, charging them before the Lord that they strive not about words to no profit, but to the subverting of the hearers.
Study to shew thyself approved unto God, a workman that needeth not to be ashamed, rightly dividing the word of truth.
But shun profane and vain babblings: for they will increase unto more ungodliness.
And their word will eat as doth a canker: of whom is Hymenaeus and Philetus;
Who concerning the truth have erred, saying that the resurrection is past already; and overthrow the faith of some.
Nevertheless the foundation of God standeth sure, having this seal, The Lord knoweth them that are his. And, Let every one that nameth the name of Christ depart from iniquity.
But in a great house there are not only vessels of gold and of silver, but also of wood and of earth; and some to honour, and some to dishonour.
If a man therefore purge himself from these, he shall be a vessel unto honour, sanctified, and meet for the master's use, and prepared unto every good work.
Flee also youthful lusts: but follow righteousness, faith, charity, peace, with them that call on the Lord out of a pure heart.
But foolish and unlearned questions avoid, knowing that they do gender strifes.
And the servant of the Lord must not strive; but be gentle unto all men, apt to teach, patient,
In meekness instructing those that oppose themselves; if God peradventure will give them repentance to the acknowledging of the truth;
And that they may recover themselves out of the snare of the devil, who are taken captive by him at his will. 2Timothy2

All throughout the Old Testament we see Israel turning again and again away from the LORD and then returning to Him in repentance...

Him hath God exalted with his right hand to be a Prince and a Saviour, for to give repentance to Israel, and forgiveness of sins. Acts 5:31

 

[Br. Bear]

Part 2

Let us also look at sin.
It finds it's first root in the Garden, where Eve was deceived by unbelief, and Adam also partook of that sin.
It seperated them and unbelief is what still seperates people from the life that God has and is, eternal and full of His joy. That is why the Gospel was preached, and is preached that those who hear and believe that God gave His only begotten Son, would not perish but have eternal life, united again unto Him.
Those who believe are His, and live according to the life that is in Him, not in unbelief, but by believing that He has given them eternal life through the sacrifice of His life for them, and they no longer live being under the flesh, but after the Spirit which He gives to all who will receive Him in believing, to live for Him and by Him to His glory.
As believers, we are no longer under the law of sin and death, but under the law of liberty. While we can do all things, it is not beneficial to us to do many things that we once did, and we can seperate ourselves from a conscience made alive by the quickening of our spirit, by His grace and gift in Jesus Christ the Lord, who gave Himself for us while we were yet sinners, that we may live forever with Him.

Therefore, as God judges the heart of man, we walk according to the high calling we have been called unto, and glorify Him in our bodies, not giving ourselves over to the lust of the flesh, which bring us again into bondage. We have been set free, and while the Lord can and will keep us from evil, if we knowingly turn from Him and enter into bondage again, we heap upon ourselves and upon the grace He has blessed us with, a burden that can crush us, and being feeble, we can then turn from believing..... and this is the danger of the devil we need to guard against.

Cast not away therefore your confidence, which hath great recompence of reward.
For ye have need of patience, that, after ye have done the will of God, ye might receive the promise.
For yet a little while, and he that shall come will come, and will not tarry.
Now the just shall live by faith: but if any man draw back, my soul shall have no pleasure in him.
But we are not of them who draw back unto perdition; but of them that believe to the saving of the soul. Hebrews 10:35-39

But Christ as a son over his own house; whose house are we, if we hold fast the confidence and the rejoicing of the hope firm unto the end.
Wherefore (as the Holy Ghost saith, To day if ye will hear his voice,
Harden not your hearts, as in the provocation, in the day of temptation in the wilderness:
When your fathers tempted me, proved me, and saw my works forty years.
Wherefore I was grieved with that generation, and said, They do alway err in their heart; and they have not known my ways.
So I sware in my wrath, They shall not enter into my rest.)
Take heed, brethren, lest there be in any of you an evil heart of unbelief, in departing from the living God.
But exhort one another daily, while it is called To day; lest any of you be hardened through the deceitfulness of sin.
For we are made partakers of Christ, if we hold the beginning of our confidence stedfast unto the end;
While it is said, To day if ye will hear his voice, harden not your hearts, as in the provocation.
For some, when they had heard, did provoke: howbeit not all that came out of Egypt by Moses.
But with whom was he grieved forty years? was it not with them that had sinned, whose carcases fell in the wilderness?
And to whom sware he that they should not enter into his rest, but to them that believed not?
So we see that they could not enter in because of unbelief. Hebrews 3:6-19

Well; because of unbelief they were broken off, and thou standest by faith. Be not highminded, but fear:
For if God spared not the natural branches, take heed lest he also spare not thee.
Behold therefore the goodness and severity of God: on them which fell, severity; but toward thee, goodness, if thou continue in his goodness: otherwise thou also shalt be cut off.
And they also, if they abide not still in unbelief, shall be graffed in: for God is able to graff them in again.
For if thou wert cut out of the olive tree which is wild by nature, and wert graffed contrary to nature into a good olive tree: how much more shall these, which be the natural branches, be graffed into their own olive tree?
For I would not, brethren, that ye should be ignorant of this mystery, lest ye should be wise in your own conceits; that blindness in part is happened to Israel, until the fulness of the Gentiles be come in.
And so all Israel shall be saved: as it is written, There shall come out of Sion the Deliverer, and shall turn away ungodliness from Jacob:
For this is my covenant unto them, when I shall take away their sins.
As concerning the gospel, they are enemies for your sakes: but as touching the election, they are beloved for the fathers' sakes.
For the gifts and calling of God are without repentance.
For as ye in times past have not believed God, yet have now obtained mercy through their unbelief:
Even so have these also now not believed, that through your mercy they also may obtain mercy.
For God hath concluded them all in unbelief, that he might have mercy upon all.
O the depth of the riches both of the wisdom and knowledge of God! how unsearchable are his judgments, and his ways past finding out!
For who hath known the mind of the Lord? or who hath been his counsellor?
Or who hath first given to him, and it shall be recompensed unto him again?
For of him, and through him, and to him, are all things: to whom be glory for ever. Amen. Romans 11:20-36

So, the most important thing to consider is not the works of the flesh, but the believing of the heart....

for we are not saved by the works of our flesh, but by grace in believing...

Even the righteousness of God which is by faith of Jesus Christ unto all and upon all them that believe: for there is no difference:
For all have sinned, and come short of the glory of God; Romans 3:22+23

And brought them out, and said, Sirs, what must I do to be saved?
And they said, Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ, and thou shalt be saved, and thy house. Acts 16:30+31

That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved.
For with the heart man believeth unto righteousness; and with the mouth confession is made unto salvation.
For the scripture saith, Whosoever believeth on him shall not be ashamed. Romans 10:9-11

But if our gospel be hid, it is hid to them that are lost:
In whom the god of this world hath blinded the minds of them which believe not, lest the light of the glorious gospel of Christ, who is the image of God, should shine unto them.
For we preach not ourselves, but Christ Jesus the Lord; and ourselves your servants for Jesus' sake.
For God, who commanded the light to shine out of darkness, hath shined in our hearts, to give the light of the knowledge of the glory of God in the face of Jesus Christ. 2Corinthians 4:3-6

And finally,

That the God of our Lord Jesus Christ, the Father of glory, may give unto you the spirit of wisdom and revelation in the knowledge of him:
The eyes of your understanding being enlightened; that ye may know what is the hope of his calling, and what the riches of the glory of his inheritance in the saints,
And what is the exceeding greatness of his power to us-ward who believe, according to the working of his mighty power,
Which he wrought in Christ, when he raised him from the dead, and set him at his own right hand in the heavenly places,
Far above all principality, and power, and might, and dominion, and every name that is named, not only in this world, but also in that which is to come:
And hath put all things under his feet, and gave him to be the head over all things to the church,
Which is his body, the fulness of him that filleth all in all. Ephesians1:17-23

Now our Lord Jesus Christ himself, and God, even our Father, which hath loved us, and hath given us everlasting consolation and good hope through grace,
Comfort your hearts, and stablish you in every good word and work. 2Thessalonians 2:16&17

He that believeth on the Son of God hath the witness in himself: he that believeth not God hath made him a liar; because he believeth not the record that God gave of his Son.
And this is the record, that God hath given to us eternal life, and this life is in his Son.
He that hath the Son hath life; and he that hath not the Son of God hath not life.
These things have I written unto you that believe on the name of the Son of God; that ye may know that ye have eternal life, and that ye may believe on the name of the Son of God. 1John5:10-13

Bless you ....><>

Br. Bear

 

[Fragrant Grace]

The Prodigals Return

I read this a few hours ago and have been thinking on these things. I do not believe that anyone who is truly saved can ever be lost. I have just a few simple thoughts... where I have likened the prodgal son to a backslidden Christian who has turned away.

These words are from my heart as I turned away from the Lord and then returned... (so please excuse me if I waffle at all)

The younger son gathered all together, and took his journey into a far country....Luke 15:13

The prodigal son took all his goods, gifts and energies into his own hands in order to try life his own way. Spiritually the "far country" is a dangerous costly place to be leading to ruin and sadness. It wasnt long before the prodigal son had lost everything.

But his father was still there watching and waiting.....

When he was yet a great way of , his father saw him....Luke 15:20

Glimpses and past thoughts of his beautiful blessed fathers home must have made him very homesick...in a spiritual sense perishing with hunger. When he returned home his father was waiting and watching for him. A long way off God sees the returning prodigal and runs to meet him.

No matter how far we have wandered God's arms are always open.

In my personal experience I was saved aged 11. In my late twenties I became backslidden for some 9 years engaging in all manner of sinful and wordly activities. Yet for every sin I got involved in there was no real pleasure. I constantly had a little voice in my head urging me to "come home"

Years of sin wore my body, my mind and my will to live...but still the Lord called me...verses used to sweep through my head
such as...

Then come thou for there is peace.....1 samuel 20:21
Without me ye are nothing.... John 15:5

Broken, weary and destroyed by the world in October 2004 I returned to the Lord...Like Jacob I had to cling to the Lord and stop wrestlilng.
God demonstrated His deity by putting Jacob's hip out of joint..Jacob was bought to nothing and emptied so that God could work with him.

I believe that a backslidden Christian's is wothless to the Lord but the person is never eternally lost if they were truly saved.
I believe that the unsaved who have heard the way of salvation and blatantly scoffed and ignored it to the point that their hearts are hardened are in a sense those who turn their backs to the plough.

Praise the Lord that He forgives all sins and has open welcoming arms to those who return. How dear we are to Christ.

Julia

 

[Br. Bear]

Surely as a wife treacherously departeth from her husband, so have ye dealt treacherously with me, O house of Israel, saith the LORD.
A voice was heard upon the high places, weeping and supplications of the children of Israel: for they have perverted their way, and they have forgotten the LORD their God.
Return, ye backsliding children, and I will heal your backslidings. Behold, we come unto thee; for thou art the LORD our God. Jeremiah 3:20-22

Julia, you said,
I believe that a backslidden Christian's is wothless to the Lord but the person is never eternally lost if they were truly saved.
I would like to point out to you and everyone, that not one of God's children is ever worthless.

And regarding backsliding, the Lord says this:

O Israel, return unto the LORD thy God; for thou hast fallen by thine iniquity.
Take with you words, and turn to the LORD: say unto him, Take away all iniquity, and receive us graciously: so will we render the calves of our lips.
Asshur shall not save us; we will not ride upon horses: neither will we say any more to the work of our hands, Ye are our gods: for in thee the fatherless findeth mercy.
I will heal their backsliding, I will love them freely: for mine anger is turned away from him.
I will be as the dew unto Israel: he shall grow as the lily, and cast forth his roots as Lebanon.
His branches shall spread, and his beauty shall be as the olive tree, and his smell as Lebanon.
They that dwell under his shadow shall return; they shall revive as the corn, and grow as the vine: the scent thereof shall be as the wine of Lebanon.
Ephraim shall say, What have I to do any more with idols? I have heard him, and observed him: I am like a green fir tree. From me is thy fruit found.
Who is wise, and he shall understand these things? prudent, and he shall know them? for the ways of the LORD are right, and the just shall walk in them: but the transgressors shall fall therein. Hosea 14

and,

Thine own wickedness shall correct thee, and thy backslidings shall reprove thee: know therefore and see that it is an evil thing and bitter, that thou hast forsaken the LORD thy God, and that my fear is not in thee, saith the Lord GOD of hosts. Jeremiah 2:19

And, again...

Return, ye backsliding children, and I will heal your backslidings. Behold, we come unto thee; for thou art the LORD our God. Jeremiah 3:22

Julia, you also said,
Yet for every sin I got involved in there was no real pleasure. I constantly had a little voice in my head urging me to "come home"

Years of sin wore my body, my mind and my will to live...but still the Lord called me...verses used to sweep through my head
such as...

Then come thou for there is peace.....1 samuel 20:21
Without me ye are nothing.... John 15:5

which is proof of God's unending love to His own.

And again, belief is the key point.... while we yet believe, we have hope, and we have His promise.
There are many who do not believe because they have never heard, but it is those who have believed, and then hardened their hearts in unbelief, that have dug for themselves a pit. It is an actual decision to no longer believe having tasted and seen that the Lord is good, that puts one in danger. A person who has never believed can not be guilty of unbelief.

Be careful when mixing unbelief and what many call 'backsliding' in their ways. They are two different things.
Deliberate unbelief will cause a grevious fall away from grace.
Walking according to the flesh for a season brings calamity and unrest to the soul, for it is foreign to Godliness, but while a heart still believes, there remains grace, and it is grace that will call us home, and grace that will heal our backsliding.....

Bless you ....><>

Br. Bear

 

[jiggyfly]

I have posted this in another thread but see that it fits here also. An excerpt from Manfred Haller's book "God's Purpose, Christ All And In All".

The gospel has to do with Christ and my relationship to Him. We shouldn't preach repentance alone.The gospel is Christ. When Christ is proclaimed by the annointing of the HolySpirit, people will repnt, even if the word repentance is never mentioned. The emphasis must be on Jesus Christ. The one accepting Christ will see what state he is in; he will regret his sins and turn from them. He will receive forgiveness and be freed from things which enslaved him; the Son makes him free. Repentance, forgiveness and freedom are consequences of submitting to Christ, the Lord. We should be careful not to turn the consequences into conditions for receiving Him.

 

[byhisgrace]

thank you to all who has replied to this. it is hard knowing how to uplift when such discouragement is put into a question. I can now answer that question. I am writing all these scriptures down for when it is posed again. Looking at those scriptures in the beginning thread post from the point of not "turning away as in backsliding" but turning away as in disbelieving makes a world of difference.

 

[Fragrant Grace]

To Br. Bear

Thanks for some added comments to the message I posted

Regarding my comment about backsliders being worthless...which when I read it back sounds awful (Never have been much good at putting things in writing!)

Just read through this and agree with your statement that a backslidden Christian is never worthless to the Lord. I perhaps would have been better to say the backslidden Chrtistian wastes his "substance" and becomes fruitless when he invests in the world rather than in the Lord.

Julia

 

[lettheredeemed]

To Br. Bear

Thanks for some added comments to the message I posted

Regarding my comment about backsliders being worthless...which when I read it back sounds awful (Never have been much good at putting things in writing!)

Just read through this and agree with your statement that a backslidden Christian is never worthless to the Lord. I perhaps would have been better to say the backslidden Chrtistian wastes his "substance" and becomes fruitless when he invests in the world rather than in the Lord.

Julia

Amen Julia

Just like the wayward Israel God chastises his childen but He never disowns them. Praise God for that!!!

 

[ushalk]

by his grace, there is a verse in the bible that the lord states i will have mercy on who i have mercy or choose to have mercy. i dont think that anyone can truly answer this. we do not have the same love, mercy, compassion or understanding that god has. god ways out everything. i dont know that anyone ever truly walks completely away from god.

 

[lettheredeemed]

by his grace, there is a verse in the bible that the lord states i will have mercy on who i have mercy or choose to have mercy. i dont think that anyone can truly answer this. we do not have the same love, mercy, compassion or understanding that god has. god ways out everything. i dont know that anyone ever truly walks completely away from god.

Yes, God looks on the heart whereas man cannot.

 

[Maureen]

I too was going to quote from Jeremiah 3
but no need to know it's been well covered.

The children of Israel did some turning back, grumbling moaning, but sure we can all do our share of that in our walk, I trust the 'turning back' would not be present.

I too believe if your truly saved, iy would be nearly impossible to walk away from Jesus, He will never leave us, so although we may try to abandon Him, He will always be waiting on our return, as our Father.

We are such a priveledged people, that such a Saviour died for us, demonstrates His majestic love.

 

[rlowe]

These refer to saved, left, & redeemed

-
Daniel ch. 4 regarding Nebuchadnezzar the king

Matt. 18:12-14a 12 "What do you think? Suppose a man owns 100 sheep and one of them wanders away. Won't he leave the 99 sheep on the hills? Won't he go and look for the one that wandered off? 13 What I'm about to tell you is true. If he finds that sheep, he is happier about the one than about the 99 that didn't wander off. 14 It is the same with your Father in heaven.
(/\ is also in Luke 15:4)

Luke 15:11-24 (NKJV) 11 Then He said: "A certain man had two sons. 12 And the younger of them said to his father, 'Father, give me the portion of goods that falls to me.' So he divided to them his livelihood. 13 And not many days after, the younger son gathered all together, journeyed to a far country, and there wasted his possessions with prodigal living. 14 But when he had spent all, there arose a severe famine in that land, and he began to be in want. 15 Then he went and joined himself to a citizen of that country, and he sent him into his fields to feed swine. 16 And he would gladly have filled his stomach with the pods that the swine ate, and no one gave him anything. 17 But when he came to himself, he said, 'How many of my father's hired servants have bread enough and to spare, and I perish with hunger! 18 I will arise and go to my father, and will say to him, "Father, I have sinned against heaven and before you, 19 and I am no longer worthy to be called your son.
Make me like one of your hired servants." ' 20 And he arose and came to his father. But when he was still a great way off, his father saw him and had compassion, and ran and fell on his neck and kissed him. 21 And the son said to him, 'Father, I have sinned against heaven and in your sight, and am no longer worthy to be called your son.' 22 But the father said to his servants, 'Bring F108 out the best robe and put it on him, and put a ring on his hand and sandals on his feet. 23 And bring the fatted calf here and kill it, and let us eat and be merry; 24 for this my son was dead and is alive again; he was lost and is found.' And they began to be merry.

Matt. 21:28-31b (NIRV) 28 "What do you think about this? A man had two sons. He went to the first and said, 'Son, go and work today in the vineyard.' 29 "'I will not,' the son answered. But later he changed his mind and went. 30 "Then the father went to the other son. He said the same thing. The son answered, 'I will, sir.' But he did not go. 31 "Which of the two sons did what his father wanted?" "The first," they answered.
-

 

[Coconut]

What I'm about to tell you is true. If HE finds that sheep, he is happier about the one than about the 99 that didn't wander off. It is the same with your Father in heaven.

That statement begins with:
"The Son of man is come to save that which was lost."

edited to add a notation: ' The KJV reads Mat 18:13 "And if so be that he find it..."
'so be' translating ["to cause to be"] ~ I see the "if" of the translation you used to be completely negated there!



Christ`s mission never changes. His is one mission that cannot fail.


"The shepherd went out to search for His sheep, and all through the night on the rocky steep, He searched until He found me, and with loving arms He bound me, I was that one lost sheep!"

The straying sheep does`nt 'wander back' on its own. The Shepherd knows how to find His sheep, and how to bring them back to the fold...once ...twice...as many times as it takes.

John 6:44 No one can come to me unless the Father who sent me draws him. And I will raise him up on the last day.

John 6:63 It is the Spirit who gives life; the flesh is no help at all. [the sheep cant save themselves] The words that I have spoken to you are spirit and life. But there are some of you who do not believe." And he said, "This is why I told you that no one can come to me unless it is granted him by the Father."

John 10:11 "I am the good shepherd, who is willing to die for the sheep. When the hired man, who is not a shepherd and does not own the sheep, sees a wolf coming, he leaves the sheep and runs away; so the wolf snatches the sheep and scatters them. The hired man runs away because he is only a hired man and does not care about the sheep.
I am the good shepherd. As the Father knows me and I know the Father, in the same way I know my sheep and they know me. And I am willing to die for them.There are other sheep which belong to me that are not in this sheep pen. I must bring them, too; they will listen to my voice, and they will become one flock with one shepherd.

Isa 53:6 All we like sheep have gone astray; we have turned--every one--to his own way; and the LORD has laid on him the iniquity of us all.


Isa 53:10 The LORD says, "It was my will that he should suffer; his death was a sacrifice to bring forgiveness. And so he will see his descendants; he will live a long life, and through him my purpose will succeed.
Isa 53:11 After a life of suffering, he will again have joy; he will know that he did not suffer in vain. My devoted servant, with whom I am pleased, will bear the punishment of many and for his sake I will forgive them.
Isa 53:12 And so I will give him a place of honor, a place among the great and powerful. He willingly gave his life and shared the fate of evil men. He took the place of many sinners and prayed that they might be forgiven."

Tit 3:3 For we ourselves were once foolish, disobedient, led astray, slaves to various passions and pleasures, passing our days in malice and envy, hated by others and hating one another. But when the goodness and loving kindness of God our Savior appeared, he saved us, not because of works done by us in righteousness, but according to his own mercy, by the washing of regeneration and renewal of the Holy Spirit, whom he poured out on us richly through Jesus Christ our Savior, so that being justified by his grace we might become heirs according to the hope of eternal life.

 

[jiggyfly]

Romans 11:25-36
25 I want you to understand this mystery, dear brothers and sisters,* so that you will not feel proud and start bragging. Some of the Jews have hard hearts, but this will last only until the complete number of Gentiles comes to Christ. 26 And so all Israel will be saved. Do you remember what the prophets said about this?
“A Deliverer will come from Jerusalem,*
and he will turn Israel* from all ungodliness.
27 And then I will keep my covenant with them
and take away their sins.”*
28 Many of the Jews are now enemies of the Good News. But this has been to your benefit, for God has given his gifts to you Gentiles. Yet the Jews are still his chosen people because of his promises to Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob. 29 For God’s gifts and his call can never be withdrawn. 30 Once, you Gentiles were rebels against God, but when the Jews refused his mercy, God was merciful to you instead. 31 And now, in the same way, the Jews are the rebels, and God’s mercy has come to you. But someday they,* too, will share in God’s mercy. 32 For God has imprisoned all people in their own disobedience so he could have mercy on everyone.
33 Oh, what a wonderful God we have! How great are his riches and wisdom and knowledge! How impossible it is for us to understand his decisions and his methods! 34 For who can know what the Lord is thinking? Who knows enough to be his counselor?* 35 And who could ever give him so much that he would have to pay it back? 36 For everything comes from him; everything exists by his power and is intended for his glory. To him be glory evermore. Amen.

 

[aaroncam85]

a good case of what your saying can be found in the book of kings, if you read about king mannaseh

 

[SpiritLedEd]

In the USA, we have a saying regarding what people appear to be when they are putting forth a political candidate image while remaining officially uncommitted : "If it walks like a duck. talks like a duck, acts like a duck - It's probably a duck."

This can apply to many situations in addition to politics. But,it is not a good rule of thumb for judging whether or not another person is truly saved. It is well nigh impossible for me to know with certainty the spiritual status of another person because I only see how they look and sound. I can't see what's going on in their deepest heart (see 1 Sam 16:7).

I believe that Judas Iscariot functioned under the radar of the other disciples. It was only after Jesus' resurrection that the truth about him came out: "'What you are about to do, do quickly' Jesus told him, but no one at the meal understood why Jesus said this to him. Since Judas had charge of the money, some thought Jesus was telling him to buy what was needed for the Feast, or to give something to the poor."
(Jn 13:27b-29)

SLE

 

[LindenLady]

In the USA, we have a saying regarding what people appear to be when they are putting forth a political candidate image while remaining officially uncommitted : "If it walks like a duck. talks like a duck, acts like a duck - It's probably a duck."

This can apply to many situations in addition to politics. But,it is not a good rule of thumb for judging whether or not another person is truly saved. It is well nigh impossible for me to know with certainty the spiritual status of another person because I only see how they look and sound. I can't see what's going on in their deepest heart (see 1 Sam 16:7).

Only God truly knows what is in each individual heart. We will all have to answer for our actions in the end... or should I say beginning... EAch one of us sins... and we sin with alarming regularity. But to God... sin is sin.. and none is greater than any other sin... So in essence we all turn from God when we sin .... and we all do on a daily basis.. so we need to look inwardly at our own selves, and let God tend to the rest. And He will. We can gently lead, but we cannot draw them to the Lord. That's God's job. And He does it amazingly well.

 

[jiggyfly]

Colossians 1:18-20
18 Christ is the head of the church, which is his body. He is the first of all who will rise from the dead,* so he is first in everything. 19 For God in all his fullness was pleased to live in Christ, 20 and by him God reconciled everything to himself. He made peace with everything in heaven and on earth by means of his blood on the cross.

I see only past tense here concerning reconciliation. I don't see He will reconcile or He will make peace but rather He has already. "While we were yet sinners" does not imply that we must do anything fro this redemption.

Colossians 1:21-23
21 This includes you who were once so far away from God. You were his enemies, separated from him by your evil thoughts and actions, 22 yet now he has brought you back as his friends. He has done this through his death on the cross in his own human body. As a result, he has brought you into the very presence of God, and you are holy and blameless as you stand before him without a single fault. 23 But you must continue to believe this truth and stand in it firmly. Don’t drift away from the assurance you received when you heard the Good News. The Good News has been preached all over the world, and I, Paul, have been appointed by God to proclaim it.

According to Paul all we must do is agree with it. To think that you have to do something concerning redemption is to disagree with God which is not submitting to His will. This is where God is dealing with mankind now (after the Cross), is the submission to His (Father's) will. It's not even about changing our will to line up with His, it is simply denying our will and submitting to His just as Jesus did. All sin has been dealt with completely at the Cross of Christ. We must accept this and move on to yielding to Fathers will.