Trump's top 100 victories for people of faith

[Rad]

I was not looking forward to more of your novel.
For the THIRD time you, nor anyone else, can realistically, possibly "love" everyone. Your incapable or are you trying to put yourself on God's level?
That's how this whole mess started.

But thats what Christ calls us to do, "Love your Neighbour as yourself" and "Treat others as you'd want to be treated", no ifs or buts, just a straight up statement of TOTAL inclusivity, and this was re-iterated in the parable of the "Good Samaritan", where Christ defined our "Neighbour" as those in need of our love and compassion, strangers deserving of the same Love we'd want for ourselves if in their situation, now you may disagree with that, but in so doing youre not disagreeing with me but with the very Saviour you profess to follow, unless you can show me something that Christ said that supports your view.

It is a GOAL to 'love your nieghbor' and it IS within the hiearchy.
You do NOT love yourself or spouse for some rando 3rd world dump.

You keep mentioning this "Hierarchy", which i believe you stated is one based on Nationality, race, colour or whatever, i would be interested to know why you believe this , for in my Bible Christ says in Luke 13:29, " They will come from the east and the west, from the north and the south, and sit down in the kingdom of God.", there is no exclusive nationality or race that will monopolise the Kingdom of God for it is open to ALL those that believe in his word and follow his commandments.
As for your "rando 3rd world dump" comment, you do realise that in Matthew 25 31-46, "The Sheep and the Goats" Christ proclaims that amongst the Hungry, the homeless, the thirsty, the sick, the outcast and the poor you will find him, these "rando 3rd world dumps" are the very places Christ is in this suffering world, not in the palaces of the rich or the Temples of those that profess his name but disregard his commandments, he is amongst us now in the places of poverty and suffering, and whether we acknowledge that and act to help him or turn away from him ,will determine our ultimate salvation or otherwise.

Fun fact, even as an Independent (by definition) you have to lean one way or the other.
By your own subjective statements you are Independent Far Left leaning.

You keep accusing me of being "Far left", so i'd be interested to know how you feel my stance on issues is more influenced by my political persuasion that by Christs teaching, i try to be "Christ centred" in all i do regardless of political allegiances, as i regard ALL of humanity as being fundamentally sinful as are the institutions they create, and i see ALL governments of this Evil world being under the control of the Devil, so if you could tell me where i'm going wrong and i agree, then i'd be only too willing to change. But i dont just want your opinion, i want your opinion backed up by the words of Christ, for if we truly "Christ centred" then that must be the basis for ALL of our thoughts and actions.

You are tied to it whether you like it or not.

I try to be "tied" to the teachings of the Saviour i profess to follow, its not always what i like to do, but as a Christian that must be the path i tread.

 

[MedicBravo]

you stated is one based on Nationality, race, colour or whatever, - How?
Why would a good, sane Christian IGNORE his own family for some rando? Are you or anyone here part of the 1%? Can you throw money at every sob story? NO.
Adam took care of his WIFE's needs before his children. He took care of theirs before their cousins and their families.
If you have a neighbor (in proximity) in need that you know, you help them before some rando online lying with a sob story.
Do you help the homeless in or near where you live or send money to Sarah McLaughlin and Sally Struthers?

Act like duck....

 

[NBTT]

Not my discussion but this verse does give some priority to who we should provide for first.

1TIM 5:8 But if any provide not for his own, and specially for those of his own house, he hath denied the faith, and is worse than an infidel.

 

[MedicBravo]

Not my discussion but this verse does give some priority to who we should provide for first.

1TIM 5:8 But if any provide not for his own, and specially for those of his own house, he hath denied the faith, and is worse than an infidel.

Breakdown:
First Epistle to Timothy 5:8 (ESV):
“But if anyone does not provide for his relatives, and especially for members of his household, he has denied the faith and is worse than an unbeliever.”

1) Immediate context (what’s going on in chapter 5)
In 1 Timothy 5:3–16, Paul the Apostle is giving Timothy instructions about how the church should care for widows. The key issue is responsibility:

- Families should care for their own widows first (vv. 4, 8, 16)
- The church should support “true widows”—those genuinely alone and in need (vv. 3, 5)

So verse 8 isn’t random—it’s part of a larger argument about not shifting personal responsibility onto the church.

2) What “provide for” means
The Greek idea behind “provide” implies ongoing care and foresight—not just emergency help. It includes:

- Food, shelter, clothing (basic needs)
- Likely emotional and social support in a household setting

It’s not about luxury; it’s about responsible, consistent care.

3) “Relatives” vs. “household”
Paul intensifies the point:

- Relatives → extended family
- Especially household → those under your direct care (immediate family)

This reflects the structure of ancient households, where multiple generations often lived together.

4) “Denied the faith” — why so strong?
Paul uses unusually harsh language:

- “Denied the faith” = living in contradiction to core Christian teaching
- Christianity emphasizes love, responsibility, and care (cf. Jesus’ teachings)

If someone refuses to care for their own family, they’re undermining the very ethic they claim to believe.

5) “Worse than an unbeliever”
Even in the Greco-Roman world, non-Christians commonly cared for family members. So Paul’s point is:

If Christians fail here, they fall below even basic societal moral standards.

This is a comparative moral statement, not saying they’re literally beyond redemption.

6) How the surrounding verses reinforce it

Verses 4–5
- Children and grandchildren should “repay” their parents
- A “true widow” is one who is alone and dependent on God

Verses 6–7
- A self-indulgent widow is “dead while she lives” (spiritually unproductive)
- The church must maintain integrity in who it supports

Verses 9–10
- Criteria for widows receiving church support:
- Faithful life
- Known for good works
- Hospitality, service, raising children

Verses 11–15
- Younger widows are encouraged to remarry and rebuild households
- This avoids idleness and potential social/spiritual issues

Verse 16 (ties directly back to v. 8)
- Family members must not let the church carry their responsibility

7) Big-picture meaning
1 Timothy 5:8 is about ordered responsibility:

1. Family first (primary duty)
2. Church second (support when no family exists)

It’s not just about money—it’s about faith lived out in practical care.

8) Modern application (carefully framed)
In today’s context, this principle can extend to:

- Supporting aging parents
- Caring for dependent family members
- Not neglecting responsibilities while expecting institutions (church/government) to replace them

But it should be applied with wisdom:

- It doesn’t require enabling harmful behavior
- It doesn’t ignore situations like abuse, estrangement, or incapacity
- It assumes the ability to provide, not condemning those who genuinely cannot

9) One-sentence summary
A genuine Christian life shows up in tangible responsibility—especially in caring for one’s own family before expecting the church to step in.

 

[MedicBravo]

Note how "some people" get quiet when God proves them wrong.

 

[Rad]

you stated is one based on Nationality, race, colour or whatever, - How?

It would be a lot easier if you could type your reply underneath the comment youre replying to, i was asking for Christs teachings to support your idea of their being a "Hierarchy" based on Nationality, colour, race or whatever and i quoted you Christs words where he said his followers will come from the North, South, East or West, of ALL nations, colours, races that accept him as their Saviour and follow his commandments, so wheres your evidence, based on Christs teachings of this hierarchy?.

Why would a good, sane Christian IGNORE his own family for some rando? Are you or anyone here part of the 1%? Can you throw money at every sob story? NO.
Adam took care of his WIFE's needs before his children. He took care of theirs before their cousins and their families.

I'm not talking about IGNORING those close to us, what i'm saying is that Christ taught that we must treat others as we would want to be treated and love our neighbour as ourselves, and when asked "who is my neighbour" he told the Parable of the Good Samaritan where someone from an outcast community, the Samaritans who Jews regarded as "tainted", helped a "Rando" stranger who was in need, while the good and religious people just walked by, make of it what you will, but i do wonder given your statements what you would have done in the same situation.

If you have a neighbor (in proximity) in need that you know, you help them before some rando online lying with a sob story.

I'm not saying that you shouldnt help your neighbour who lives close, we all do, but it comes down to respective needs, when there are tens of millions of people starving in this world, facing hardships and horrors we can barely imagine, and when we ALL have limits on the amount we're prepared to give then it comes down to a question of priorities, and as for "some rando online lying with a sob story", i dont doubt that some do lie, its human nature, but i also dont doubt that theres so much suffering and destruction in this world and that we are called as followers of Christ to try to alleviate that suffering, and that we are also told that in the "rando", the starving, the thirsty, the homeless, the stranger, the sick and imprisoned we see Christ, and when we help them we are helping him, but when we ignore them we are ignoring him and will be judged accordingly, then what will your response be?.

Do you help the homeless in or near where you live or send money to Sarah McLaughlin and Sally Struthers?

I give money to the homeless and campaign for decent housing for all , i campaign to create a society where Homes are not built for profit but for need, i also give to organisations working for the poor and homeless in other countries and support their efforts to build a more just and equitable world. I dont know who Sarah McLaughlin and Sally Struthers are, but they seem to be on your "hate list" for sure. Its not just Charity thats needed, its Justice, its an abomination in the sight of God that theres so much wealth in this world but because of human greed and selfishness so many live in poverty and suffering. What does the Lord require of us, but to act justly, to love kindness and to walk humbly with our God, perhaps you should try it sometimes.

Act like duck....

You mean, try to follow the teachings of Christ and acknowledge him as your Saviour and you might just be called a Christian, yeh i agree with that.

 

[Rad]

Not my discussion but this verse does give some priority to who we should provide for first.

No problem, the way i see it this is "everyones" discussion, its a discussion board, we should all feel able to say what we believe, so its good to have your contribution

1TIM 5:8 But if any provide not for his own, and specially for those of his own house, he hath denied the faith, and is worse than an infidel.

I suppose the first thing i'd say is what does it mean "to provide", because in all honesty we ALL provide for our own first, well nearly all of us, i think its the degree of provision that becomes an issue, most of us on these discussion boards will probably be leading very comfortable lives in World terms, probably have all we need, perhaps not all we want ,but our material needs are satisfied, but we also know that in Gods world there are hundreds of millions of men, women and children who struggle daily just to survive, with thousands of them dying each day from malnutrition and easily preventable disease. So what do we owe them, How far does our Compassion stretch, how much do we keep for ourselves and how much do we give to others. These are questions we must all answer, but as Christians we must do so on the basis of Christs teachings.

Christ said we Must "Love our neighbour as ourselves", do you think he meant to say "but only after youve provided for your family?, Christ said that we should treat others as we'd want them to treat us, Did he mean to add " But only after youve provided for your family and those close to you, Christ said to the rich man " Give ALL you have to the poor and follow me", did he forget to add, "But only after youve made provision for your family, Christ said that in the face of the hungry, the poor, the suffering and the outcast you will see him, and that when you help them you help him but when you turn away from them you turn away from him, did he miss the proviso, " But you must look after your family and loved ones first", when Christ said " deny yourself, take up your Cross and follow me" did he forget to add, "but Make sure your loved ones are OK first", and when the Disciples said " we have given up everything to follow you" , did Christ say " But i meant for you to provide for your loved ones first", it seems to me that Christ had plenty of opportunities to mention looking after family first, but never did, was that an oversight on his part or do you think he just forgot to add that

 

[Rad]

Note how "some people" get quiet when God proves them wrong.

I take it that jibe was directed at me, i'm not sure that God has indeed "proved me wrong", unless of course youre equating your beliefs on the same level as Gods, in effect youre speaking for him, thats a pretty high opinion of yourself, not exactly the "Humility" Christ expects of us, but i didnt go "quiet", i only have a limited time available, so it takes a couple of days for me to get round to replying, so be patient, i will reply.

 

[Rad]

Breakdown:
First Epistle to Timothy 5:8 (ESV):
“But if anyone does not provide for his relatives, and especially for members of his household, he has denied the faith and is worse than an unbeliever.”

1) Immediate context (what’s going on in chapter 5)
In 1 Timothy 5:3–16, Paul the Apostle is giving Timothy instructions about how the church should care for widows. The key issue is responsibility:

- Families should care for their own widows first (vv. 4, 8, 16)
- The church should support “true widows”—those genuinely alone and in need (vv. 3, 5)

So verse 8 isn’t random—it’s part of a larger argument about not shifting personal responsibility onto the church.

2) What “provide for” means
The Greek idea behind “provide” implies ongoing care and foresight—not just emergency help. It includes:

- Food, shelter, clothing (basic needs)
- Likely emotional and social support in a household setting

It’s not about luxury; it’s about responsible, consistent care.

3) “Relatives” vs. “household”
Paul intensifies the point:

- Relatives → extended family
- Especially household → those under your direct care (immediate family)

This reflects the structure of ancient households, where multiple generations often lived together.

4) “Denied the faith” — why so strong?
Paul uses unusually harsh language:

- “Denied the faith” = living in contradiction to core Christian teaching
- Christianity emphasizes love, responsibility, and care (cf. Jesus’ teachings)

If someone refuses to care for their own family, they’re undermining the very ethic they claim to believe.

5) “Worse than an unbeliever”
Even in the Greco-Roman world, non-Christians commonly cared for family members. So Paul’s point is:

If Christians fail here, they fall below even basic societal moral standards.

This is a comparative moral statement, not saying they’re literally beyond redemption.

6) How the surrounding verses reinforce it

Verses 4–5
- Children and grandchildren should “repay” their parents
- A “true widow” is one who is alone and dependent on God

Verses 6–7
- A self-indulgent widow is “dead while she lives” (spiritually unproductive)
- The church must maintain integrity in who it supports

Verses 9–10
- Criteria for widows receiving church support:
- Faithful life
- Known for good works
- Hospitality, service, raising children

Verses 11–15
- Younger widows are encouraged to remarry and rebuild households
- This avoids idleness and potential social/spiritual issues

Verse 16 (ties directly back to v. 8)
- Family members must not let the church carry their responsibility

7) Big-picture meaning
1 Timothy 5:8 is about ordered responsibility:

1. Family first (primary duty)
2. Church second (support when no family exists)

It’s not just about money—it’s about faith lived out in practical care.

8) Modern application (carefully framed)
In today’s context, this principle can extend to:

- Supporting aging parents
- Caring for dependent family members
- Not neglecting responsibilities while expecting institutions (church/government) to replace them

But it should be applied with wisdom:

- It doesn’t require enabling harmful behavior
- It doesn’t ignore situations like abuse, estrangement, or incapacity
- It assumes the ability to provide, not condemning those who genuinely cannot

9) One-sentence summary
A genuine Christian life shows up in tangible responsibility—especially in caring for one’s own family before expecting the church to step in.

And you accuse me of "writing a book" LOL!!,........ i'll get round to this in due course as i wouldnt want to be accused again of "going quiet when proved wrong by God".

 

[MedicBravo]

It would be a lot easier if you could type your reply underneath the comment youre replying to, i was asking for Christs teachings to support your idea of their being a "Hierarchy" based on Nationality, colour, race or whatever and i quoted you Christs words where he said his followers will come from the North, South, East or West, of ALL nations, colours, races that accept him as their Saviour and follow his commandments, so wheres your evidence, based on Christs teachings of this hierarchy?.

I'm not talking about IGNORING those close to us, what i'm saying is that Christ taught that we must treat others as we would want to be treated and love our neighbour as ourselves, and when asked "who is my neighbour" he told the Parable of the Good Samaritan where someone from an outcast community, the Samaritans who Jews regarded as "tainted", helped a "Rando" stranger who was in need, while the good and religious people just walked by, make of it what you will, but i do wonder given your statements what you would have done in the same situation.

I'm not saying that you shouldnt help your neighbour who lives close, we all do, but it comes down to respective needs, when there are tens of millions of people starving in this world, facing hardships and horrors we can barely imagine, and when we ALL have limits on the amount we're prepared to give then it comes down to a question of priorities, and as for "some rando online lying with a sob story", i dont doubt that some do lie, its human nature, but i also dont doubt that theres so much suffering and destruction in this world and that we are called as followers of Christ to try to alleviate that suffering, and that we are also told that in the "rando", the starving, the thirsty, the homeless, the stranger, the sick and imprisoned we see Christ, and when we help them we are helping him, but when we ignore them we are ignoring him and will be judged accordingly, then what will your response be?.

I give money to the homeless and campaign for decent housing for all , i campaign to create a society where Homes are not built for profit but for need, i also give to organisations working for the poor and homeless in other countries and support their efforts to build a more just and equitable world. I dont know who Sarah McLaughlin and Sally Struthers are, but they seem to be on your "hate list" for sure. Its not just Charity thats needed, its Justice, its an abomination in the sight of God that theres so much wealth in this world but because of human greed and selfishness so many live in poverty and suffering. What does the Lord require of us, but to act justly, to love kindness and to walk humbly with our God, perhaps you should try it sometimes.

You mean, try to follow the teachings of Christ and acknowledge him as your Saviour and you might just be called a Christian, yeh i agree with that.

I posted plenty.
Such a broad statement of "help".
Where do you live?
Can you ensure your family is taken care of first and foremost in all things? No.
Do you ignore you church (if you have one) for illegals, and foreign countries who do nothing but leech off us and make our country worse?
God ALSO lists the types of people to NEVER help.

 

[Twistie]

 

[NBTT]

Christ had plenty of opportunities to mention looking after family first, but never did, was that an oversight on his part or do you think he just forgot to add that

The principle is to love all men since we are created in God's image. We have finite time, energy and resources so like it or not we are forced to prioritize. God gives us some general information in 1 TIM on how to prioritize. We as Christians should listen to the indwelling Holy Spirit and pray for guidance for our specific circumstances. Love will shine through in His answer.

 

[Rad]

The principle is to love all men since we are created in God's image. We have finite time, energy and resources so like it or not we are forced to prioritize. God gives us some general information in 1 TIM on how to prioritize. We as Christians should listen to the indwelling Holy Spirit and pray for guidance for our specific circumstances. Love will shine through in His answer.

Its true we do prioritise, but theres a question of how much we prioritise and whether or not that prioritising is in line with Christs teaching,, Christ says in Matthew 5 43-47 about "Loving your enemies, bless those that curse you and do good to those that hate you", and goes on to say "If you love them which love you then what reward have you,do not even the publicans the same", the parable of the "Good Samaritan" is all about helping a complete stranger in need, and theres no mention of "priorities" in any of Christs teachings, Love your neighbour as yourself and treat others as youd want to be treated has no conditions or priorities, so who do you follow, my position is that when theres an apparent contradiction or anomaly, which i put down to my ignorance, i always follow Christs teachings, he is our Saviour and the Son of God and deserving of all of our Love and obedience. But i guess its a choice we all have to make.

 

[Rad]

I posted plenty.

Its been such a long discussion, could you give me one or two so i can study them further. Thanks

Such a broad statement of "help".

Not my statement of "Help", but just quoting from what Christ said, Love your neighbour as yourself and treat others as you'd want to be treated is a statement of Universal Love and compassion for others, no boundaries, no conditions, no priorities.

Where do you live?

Why is that relevant?, does where i live change the teachings of Christ, but ill answer your question anyway, i live in the UK but fail to see what difference that makes.

Can you ensure your family is taken care of first and foremost in all things? No.

Do i believe that "ensuring my family is taken care of first and foremost in all things" to be Christs commandment to his followers, no i dont for the many reasons i've given, do i do that, yes, much too often and its something i ask forgiveness for, perhaps a little story will illustrate, many years ago around Christmastime i was talking to a Neighbour and i asked them" what does it say about me that while millions of children are dying of hunger and disease i'm spending money on presents my kids want when their needs are already met", their reply was " It makes you a good Father", what do you think?

Do you ignore you church (if you have one) for illegals, and foreign countries who do nothing but leech off us and make our country worse?

To me theyre not "illegals", theyre people, made in the image of God, and deserving of my Love and compassion just as much as those around me, and why does it matter if someone lives in a "Foreign country", if theyre in need and you can help, then you should do, race, religion ,nationality or colour should have NO place in determining who we help, surely the parable of the Good Samaritan showed you that, if our Neighbours in need, wherever in Gods world they may be, then we are called on to help them, and in the face of the hungry, the poor , the marginalised , the "leeches" as you call them, we see Christ, would you turn away from him because you figure hes "making your country worse"?.

God ALSO lists the types of people to NEVER help.

But Christ never does, and as Christians our Love and obedience is to him as our Savour and the Son of God. We live under a New Covenant, one established by Christ and paid for by his blood and suffering and we are called on to help All those in need of our love and compassion

 

[MedicBravo]

But Christ never does - There you go twisting things.
His family were adults at that point.

Matthew 12:38–39: When asked for a sign, Jesus calls them an "evil and adulterous generation" and refuses to provide any sign other than the "sign of the prophet Jonah."
Mark 8:11–13: After they began to argue with him, the text explicitly states that he "left them, got back into the boat and crossed to the other side."

Luke 23:8–9: Herod plied Jesus with many questions, but Jesus gave him no answer. He refused to engage with someone who viewed him merely as a curiosity or a performer.
In his own hometown, Jesus found that the people viewed him only as "the carpenter’s son." Their lack of faith created a barrier to his work.

• Matthew 13:58: "And he did not do many miracles there because of their lack of faith."
• Luke 4:28–30: After he preached in the synagogue, the people were furious and tried to throw him off a cliff. The text says he "walked right through the crowd and went on his way."

After the feeding of the 5,000, the crowd followed Jesus across the lake. However, Jesus realized they weren't following him for his message, but because they wanted free food.

• John 6:26–66: Jesus gave a difficult sermon about "eating his flesh and drinking his blood." When the crowd found this teaching too hard, many of his disciples turned back and no longer followed him. Jesus did not soften the message to win them back; he simply turned to the Twelve and asked, "You do not want to leave too, do you?"

The Parable of the Talents (Matthew 25:24–30): Jesus tells a story of a servant who did nothing with what he was given. He calls the man "wicked and lazy." Instead of offering a second chance or "helping" the man do the work, the master in the story (representing God/Jesus) takes away what he has and casts him out.

Care to try again?

 

[NBTT]

my position is that when there's an apparent contradiction or anomaly, which i put down to my ignorance, i always follow Christs teachings

The bible is inspired by the Holy Spirit so is all God/Jesus' word. Jesus came for the Jew first and they were given free will to accept Him. They chose to have Him crucified. Paul received God's word from the resurrected Christ. God's truth never changes.

For specific details on how people should behave during His first coming (ie believe and accept their messiah) the synoptic Gospels are the best source. For specific details on how people should behave after His resurrection, (ie believe and become part of the body of Christ and resurrect with Him) the bible books inspired post-resurrection are the best source.

Where the apparent contradiction or anomaly appears to our simple minds is that the rejection and crucifixion of the messiah was written centuries before it happened so how could the Jews have had free will? Did the Jews have the free will to accept Jesus? Was it written that they would reject and and crucifiy Him. Yes to both!?!?!?

In God's creation, reality is not what it seems as shown in this simple experiment of repeatedly firing a single electron at a screen with two slits. Normally the electron could go through one slit or the other or hit the screen and go through neither. What we observe is that all contradictory possibilities (the single electron goes though slit 1, goes though slit 2, goes through neither, goes through both) happen simultaneously!?!?!? If we detect what happens, the behavior changes and then only one of the behaviors happens.

If we can't even understand such a tiny part of God's creation, how can we possibly understand the creator Himself? Bow down in awe to Him and trust and obey Him like a child.

 

[Rad]

But Christ never does - There you go twisting things.
His family were adults at that point.

You said "God ALSO lists the types of people to NEVER help.", but i see nothing in your reply to support this. i see a list of events in Christs life where he took certain actions but NO listing of the types of people we should never help.

I read Christ saying, "Treat others as you'd want them to treat you", "Love your neighbour as yourself", and when asked "Who is my neighbour" gave the Parable of the "Good Samaritan", where a member of an outcast community helped a "Rando stranger" as you'd put it while the "good, Religious" people walked on by, i read Christ saying "Love your enemies, do good to those that hate you and pray for those that Spitefully use you", so i ask again, where are Christs words to support your assertion that there are people we should never help, because it seems to me that Christs commandments include ALL, no ifs, no buts, no exclusions on the basis of race, colour, nationality ,sexual orientation or whatever, and in fact he goes further and says that in the form of the Poor and outcast, the hungry and homeless, the sick and imprisoned, the stranger, you shall see him, this is not a Saviour of exclusivity but one whose Love and compassion encompasses ALL of his children and he commands us to do the same.

Matthew 12:38–39: When asked for a sign, Jesus calls them an "evil and adulterous generation" and refuses to provide any sign other than the "sign of the prophet Jonah."
Mark 8:11–13: After they began to argue with him, the text explicitly states that he "left them, got back into the boat and crossed to the other side."

Luke 23:8–9: Herod plied Jesus with many questions, but Jesus gave him no answer. He refused to engage with someone who viewed him merely as a curiosity or a performer.
In his own hometown, Jesus found that the people viewed him only as "the carpenter’s son." Their lack of faith created a barrier to his work.

• Matthew 13:58: "And he did not do many miracles there because of their lack of faith."
• Luke 4:28–30: After he preached in the synagogue, the people were furious and tried to throw him off a cliff. The text says he "walked right through the crowd and went on his way."

After the feeding of the 5,000, the crowd followed Jesus across the lake. However, Jesus realized they weren't following him for his message, but because they wanted free food.

• John 6:26–66: Jesus gave a difficult sermon about "eating his flesh and drinking his blood." When the crowd found this teaching too hard, many of his disciples turned back and no longer followed him. Jesus did not soften the message to win them back; he simply turned to the Twelve and asked, "You do not want to leave too, do you?"

The Parable of the Talents (Matthew 25:24–30): Jesus tells a story of a servant who did nothing with what he was given. He calls the man "wicked and lazy." Instead of offering a second chance or "helping" the man do the work, the master in the story (representing God/Jesus) takes away what he has and casts him out.

Care to try again?

This is not a contest, this is not a trial to see who can win,this should be a search for the truth, of what it means to be a follower of Christ, we are here to discuss, to listen and to learn, and we should ALL be prepared to change our views of what it means to be a follower of Christ if we encounter a different view that we find reveals his Truth.

 

[Rad]

The bible is inspired by the Holy Spirit so is all God/Jesus' word. Jesus came for the Jew first and they were given free will to accept Him. They chose to have Him crucified. Paul received God's word from the resurrected Christ. God's truth never changes.

I totally agree, but in this specific example of whether or not theres "priorities" in who we should help, i still find a conflict between Christs teaching and the passage in Timothy that seems to prioritise family.

As ive said we all do it, well probably all of us, we all prioritise our own and our families needs before others, but is that in line with Christs teaching, thats what i question, and if its not, then do we need to try to change and ask forgiveness for our actions.

Let me offer this, in Matthew 25 vs 31-46 "The Sheep and the Goats" Christ says that in the face of the poor and outcast you shall see him and that when we help them we help him, and when we ignore them we ignore him, he also says in Matthew 10: 37-39 ";He who loves father or mother more than Me is not worthy of Me. And he who loves son or daughter more than Me is not worthy of Me. ;And he who does not take his cross and follow after Me is not worthy of Me.He who finds his life will lose it, and he who loses his life for My sake will find it.". So if we prioritise our Son, daughter, wife, mother or those close to us over the needs of the Hungry, homeless, sick, Stranger Christ, are we not contravening Christs teaching in putting those we love in front of him?.

For specific details on how people should behave during His first coming (ie believe and accept their messiah) the synoptic Gospels are the best source. For specific details on how people should behave after His resurrection, (ie believe and become part of the body of Christ and resurrect with Him) the bible books inspired post-resurrection are the best source.

Where the apparent contradiction or anomaly appears to our simple minds is that the rejection and crucifixion of the messiah was written centuries before it happened so how could the Jews have had free will? Did the Jews have the free will to accept Jesus? Was it written that they would reject and and crucifiy Him. Yes to both!?!?!?

In God's creation, reality is not what it seems as shown in this simple experiment of repeatedly firing a single electron at a screen with two slits. Normally the electron could go through one slit or the other or hit the screen and go through neither. What we observe is that all contradictory possibilities (the single electron goes though slit 1, goes though slit 2, goes through neither, goes through both) happen simultaneously!?!?!? If we detect what happens, the behavior changes and then only one of the behaviors happens.

If we can't even understand such a tiny part of God's creation, how can we possibly understand the creator Himself? Bow down in awe to Him and trust and obey Him like a child.

I gave up trying to understand God and his creation a long time ago, alls i try to do now, in my own very ignorant way, is to follow his teachings , and do so in the humility that i may be wrong in what i believe, and if i am, that i have the humility to change and build my life upon the solid rock of Christs truth.

 

[MedicBravo]

You're taking cherry picked verses to support your false beliefs.

1. Habitually Lazy or Idle People Who Refuse to Work

2 Thessalonians 3:10
“For even when we were with you, this we commanded you, that if any would not work, neither should he eat.”

2 Thessalonians 3:11
“For we hear that there are some which walk among you disorderly, working not at all, but are busybodies.”


2. False Teachers and Deceivers

2 John 1:10–11
“If there come any unto you, and bring not this doctrine, receive him not into your house, neither bid him God speed:
For he that biddeth him God speed is partaker of his evil deeds.”


3. People Persisting in Serious Sin While Claiming to Be Christians

1 Corinthians 5:11
“But now I have written unto you not to keep company, if any man that is called a brother be a fornicator, or covetous, or an idolater, or a railer, or a drunkard, or an extortioner; with such an one no not to eat.”


4. Divisive Troublemakers After Repeated Warnings

Titus 3:10
“A man that is an heretick after the first and second admonition reject.”

Romans 16:17
“Now I beseech you, brethren, mark them which cause divisions and offences contrary to the doctrine which ye have learned; and avoid them.”


5. Criminals, Thieves, and Violent Evil-Doers

Proverbs 29:24
“He that is partner with a thief hateth his own soul.”

Proverbs 1:15
“My son, walk not thou in the way with them; refrain thy foot from their path.”


6. People Who Exploit Others Financially or Morally

2 Timothy 3:2–5
“For men shall be lovers of their own selves, covetous, boasters, proud, blasphemers, disobedient to parents, unthankful, unholy,
Without natural affection, trucebreakers, false accusers, incontinent, fierce, despisers of those that are good,
Traitors, heady, highminded, lovers of pleasures more than lovers of God;
Having a form of godliness, but denying the power thereof: from such turn away.”

Proverbs 22:24
“Make no friendship with an angry man; and with a furious man thou shalt not go.”


7. People Who Encourage Sin or Lead Others Away From God

Ephesians 5:11
“And have no fellowship with the unfruitful works of darkness, but rather reprove them.”

Psalm 1:1
“Blessed is the man that walketh not in the counsel of the ungodly, nor standeth in the way of sinners, nor sitteth in the seat of the scornful.”

 

[NBTT]

This is not a contest, this is not a trial to see who can win,this should be a search for the truth

Absolutely agree. We only learn when our established views are challenged biblically.

Satan always wants to destroy order and replace it by chaos. Destroying the family and stable nations are satan's work and quite visible in today's world. All big decisions need to be made in prayer. Jesus didn't bring down the roman empire in his first coming. He did break up some families with His "follow me" but that doesn't mean He's anti-family. The bible gives us general principles but a relationship with Christ and the indwelling Holy Spirit guides us through the specific situations' daily decisions we make. There's no easy "the left is always right"/"the right is always right".