Resurrection

[Hitch]

Rev 20:4-6 Quite long

4 And I saw thrones, and they sat upon them, and judgment was given unto them: and I saw the souls of them that were beheaded for the witness of Jesus, and for the word of God, and which had not worshipped the beast, neither his image, neither had received his mark upon their foreheads, or in their hands; and they lived and reigned with Christ a thousand years.
5 But the rest of the dead lived not again until the thousand years were finished. This is the first resurrection.
6 Blessed and holy is he that hath part in the first resurrection: on such the second death hath no power, but they shall be priests of God and of Christ, and shall reign with him a thousand years.
(KJV)

The purpose here is to show cause why the 'First Resurrection' is the regeneration (born-again) of the believer and not a resurrection of the body.

The believer today meets all the requirements of the definition.

He is 'blessed and made holy '(II Cor 5;21) because he is a partner in the Resurrection of Christ. This is how we become joint -heirs. The work of the cross ,the blood sacrifice, has no value unless Christ is raised (bodily) from the dead.



Pete refers to the Church as;

1 Pet 2:5
5 Ye also, as lively stones, are built up a spiritual house, an holy priesthood, to offer up spiritual sacrifices, acceptable to God by Jesus Christ.(KJV)

John of course concurs; (note the tense)

Rev 1:6
6 And hath made us kings and priests unto God and his Father; to him be glory and dominion for ever and ever. Amen.(KJV)

This 'priesthood' is entirely populated by those who 'overcome'. As Paul writes;

Rom 8:36-37
36 As it is written, For thy sake we are killed all the day long; we are accounted as sheep for the slaughter.
37 Nay, in all these things we are more than conquerors through him that loved us.(KJV)

Conquerors and overcomers are translated from the same original word. Every Christian is expected to be faithful even unto death, so being 'more than conquerors' is the status of all believers in Christ, whether events demonstrated this in life (martyrdom) or not. Every believer is passed from death unto life. And is securely covered under the Blood of Christ. This renders him free from the power of the 'second death' and allows him to' reign in life by one, Jesus Christ'. (Roms 5;17)

Thus each requirement as lineated in v6 is already accomplished in the believer.

It is as important as it is common to refer to the born-again believer as being 'raised up', formerly dead...

Eph 2:5-6
5 Even when we were dead in sins, hath quickened us together with Christ, (by grace ye are saved
6 And hath raised us up together, and made us sit together in heavenly places in Christ JesusKJV)
Eph 2:1
1 And you hath he quickened, who were dead in trespasses and sins;(KJV)

I Jn 3:14
14 We know that we have passed from death unto life, because we love the brethren. He that loveth not his brother abideth in death.(KJV)

The pattern here follows;
Num 19:11-12

11 He that toucheth the dead body of any man shall be unclean seven days.
12 He shall purify himself with it on the third day, and on the seventh day he shall be clean: but if he purify not himself the third day, then the seventh day he shall not be clean.(KJV)

With our 'partnership' in the 'First Resurrection', which came on the Third day. We gain newness of life through the righteousness of Christ imputed judicially. This is common to all believers and without it we cannot be seen as 'clean' on the seventh day (last day).

All must participate in the 'third day cleansing' or 'First Resurrection' . Every believer must have a part here. But not every believer will be raised bodily. By the same token every believer must be raised spiritually.

Of course Christ offered up His body as a Sacrifice and needed not be raised in the spiritual sense, as we do. So His Resurrection does not require the second step. Thus for the believer, the First Resurrection is first in order and importance.

 

[Beetow]

• John 11:25 . . I am the resurrection.

People who make the cut for a bodily Christian resurrection will be immortal. (1Cor
15:51-54)

However; at the time Jesus made that statement, he wasn't yet risen from the
dead, i.e. Jesus wasn't immortal. We can be sure of that because had he been, then
it would've been very difficult for the Romans to execute him on the cross. Jesus is
immortal now (Rom 6:9 and 1Tim 6:16) but he wasn't then.

So; there's apparently more to the resurrection that Jesus spoke of than
immortality because the grammatical tense of his statement is present tense rather
than future; indicating he was the resurrection right then.

When Jesus was here, he was not only a human being with human life, but he was
also a human being with eternal life.

• John 5:26-27 . . For as the Father has life in Himself, so He has granted the Son
to have life in himself.

That very same eternal life is available right now, no delay and no waiting period.

• John 5:24-25 . . I tell you the truth, whoever hears my word and believes Him
who sent me has eternal life and will not be condemned; he has crossed over from
death to life. I tell you the truth; a time is coming, and has now come, when the
dead will hear the voice of the Son of God and those who hear will live.

So: a rough-hewn description of a Christian is someone that's a human being with
human life while simultaneously a human being with eternal life: same as Jesus
was, and still is.

But there's a catch. People cannot have eternal life a la carte as it can only be had
by having Christ too seeing as he is, in some mysterious way, the very existence of
eternal life even as his Father is the very existence of eternal life.

• 1John 1:1-2 . . That which was from the beginning, which we have heard, which
we have seen with our eyes, which we have looked at and our hands have touched
this we proclaim concerning the Word of life. The life appeared; we have seen it
and testify to it, and we proclaim to you the eternal life, which was with the Father
and has appeared to us.

• 1John 5:11-12 . . God has given us eternal life, and this life is in His son. He who
has the Son has the life; he who does not have the Son of God does not have the
life.

NOTE: According to John 5:24-25 and 1John 5:11-2, people lacking eternal life are
not only dead on the hoof, but neither do they have God's son; which is a very
grave situation because according to Rom 8:9, folks lacking God's son are
outsiders, viz: they are not Christ's sheep.
_

 

[Hekuran]

Rev 20:4-6 Quite long

4 And I saw thrones, and they sat upon them, and judgment was given unto them: and I saw the souls of them that were beheaded for the witness of Jesus, and for the word of God, and which had not worshipped the beast, neither his image, neither had received his mark upon their foreheads, or in their hands; and they lived and reigned with Christ a thousand years.
5 But the rest of the dead lived not again until the thousand years were finished. This is the first resurrection.
6 Blessed and holy is he that hath part in the first resurrection: on such the second death hath no power, but they shall be priests of God and of Christ, and shall reign with him a thousand years.
(KJV)

The purpose here is to show cause why the 'First Resurrection' is the regeneration (born-again) of the believer and not a resurrection of the body.

The believer today meets all the requirements of the definition.

He is 'blessed and made holy '(II Cor 5;21) because he is a partner in the Resurrection of Christ. This is how we become joint -heirs. The work of the cross ,the blood sacrifice, has no value unless Christ is raised (bodily) from the dead.



Pete refers to the Church as;

1 Pet 2:5
5 Ye also, as lively stones, are built up a spiritual house, an holy priesthood, to offer up spiritual sacrifices, acceptable to God by Jesus Christ.(KJV)

John of course concurs; (note the tense)

Rev 1:6
6 And hath made us kings and priests unto God and his Father; to him be glory and dominion for ever and ever. Amen.(KJV)

This 'priesthood' is entirely populated by those who 'overcome'. As Paul writes;

Rom 8:36-37
36 As it is written, For thy sake we are killed all the day long; we are accounted as sheep for the slaughter.
37 Nay, in all these things we are more than conquerors through him that loved us.(KJV)

Conquerors and overcomers are translated from the same original word. Every Christian is expected to be faithful even unto death, so being 'more than conquerors' is the status of all believers in Christ, whether events demonstrated this in life (martyrdom) or not. Every believer is passed from death unto life. And is securely covered under the Blood of Christ. This renders him free from the power of the 'second death' and allows him to' reign in life by one, Jesus Christ'. (Roms 5;17)

Thus each requirement as lineated in v6 is already accomplished in the believer.

It is as important as it is common to refer to the born-again believer as being 'raised up', formerly dead...

Eph 2:5-6
5 Even when we were dead in sins, hath quickened us together with Christ, (by grace ye are saved
6 And hath raised us up together, and made us sit together in heavenly places in Christ JesusKJV)
Eph 2:1
1 And you hath he quickened, who were dead in trespasses and sins;(KJV)

I Jn 3:14
14 We know that we have passed from death unto life, because we love the brethren. He that loveth not his brother abideth in death.(KJV)

The pattern here follows;
Num 19:11-12

11 He that toucheth the dead body of any man shall be unclean seven days.
12 He shall purify himself with it on the third day, and on the seventh day he shall be clean: but if he purify not himself the third day, then the seventh day he shall not be clean.(KJV)

With our 'partnership' in the 'First Resurrection', which came on the Third day. We gain newness of life through the righteousness of Christ imputed judicially. This is common to all believers and without it we cannot be seen as 'clean' on the seventh day (last day).

All must participate in the 'third day cleansing' or 'First Resurrection' . Every believer must have a part here. But not every believer will be raised bodily. By the same token every believer must be raised spiritually.

Of course Christ offered up His body as a Sacrifice and needed not be raised in the spiritual sense, as we do. So His Resurrection does not require the second step. Thus for the believer, the First Resurrection is first in order and importance.

One of the features of those raised in the first resurrection is that they are 'beheaded for the witness of Jesus'. For now, none of us qualify.

 

[Hitch]

One of the features of those raised in the first resurrection is that they are 'beheaded for the witness of Jesus'. For now, none of us qualify.

Believers are persecuted every day, some to the point of death.
What you've missed John consoling his first century ,largely, formerly pagan audience. Explaining to them ,who lacked our 2,000 years of Christian history, that even those wrongfully executed by the state are NOT lost to the kingdom of god.

 

[Hitch]

Believers are persecuted every day, some to the point of death.
What you've missed John consoling his first century ,largely, formerly pagan audience. Explaining to them ,who lacked our 2,000 years of Christian history, that even those wrongfully executed by the state are NOT lost to the kingdom of God.

 

[Hitch]

• John 11:25 . . I am the resurrection.

People who make the cut for a bodily Christian resurrection will be immortal. (1Cor
15:51-54)

However; at the time Jesus made that statement, he wasn't yet risen from the
dead, i.e. Jesus wasn't immortal. We can be sure of that because had he been, then
it would've been very difficult for the Romans to execute him on the cross. Jesus is
immortal now (Rom 6:9 and 1Tim 6:16) but he wasn't then.

So; there's apparently more to the resurrection that Jesus spoke of than
immortality because the grammatical tense of his statement is present tense rather
than future; indicating he was the resurrection right then.

When Jesus was here, he was not only a human being with human life, but he was
also a human being with eternal life.

• John 5:26-27 . . For as the Father has life in Himself, so He has granted the Son
to have life in himself.

That very same eternal life is available right now, no delay and no waiting period.

• John 5:24-25 . . I tell you the truth, whoever hears my word and believes Him
who sent me has eternal life and will not be condemned; he has crossed over from
death to life. I tell you the truth; a time is coming, and has now come, when the
dead will hear the voice of the Son of God and those who hear will live.

So: a rough-hewn description of a Christian is someone that's a human being with
human life while simultaneously a human being with eternal life: same as Jesus
was, and still is.

But there's a catch. People cannot have eternal life a la carte as it can only be had
by having Christ too seeing as he is, in some mysterious way, the very existence of
eternal life even as his Father is the very existence of eternal life.

• 1John 1:1-2 . . That which was from the beginning, which we have heard, which
we have seen with our eyes, which we have looked at and our hands have touched
this we proclaim concerning the Word of life. The life appeared; we have seen it
and testify to it, and we proclaim to you the eternal life, which was with the Father
and has appeared to us.

• 1John 5:11-12 . . God has given us eternal life, and this life is in His son. He who
has the Son has the life; he who does not have the Son of God does not have the
life.

NOTE: According to John 5:24-25 and 1John 5:11-2, people lacking eternal life are
not only dead on the hoof, but neither do they have God's son; which is a very
grave situation because according to Rom 8:9, folks lacking God's son are
outsiders, viz: they are not Christ's sheep.
_

Jesus was born of flesh ,just like ours, fully human, AND fully God.

 

[Hekuran]

Believers are persecuted every day, some to the point of death.
What you've missed John consoling his first century ,largely, formerly pagan audience. Explaining to them ,who lacked our 2,000 years of Christian history, that even those wrongfully executed by the state are NOT lost to the kingdom of god.

I didn't miss it, but that wasn't my point. People who have been beheaded are dead. Resurrection conquers death.

 

[Hitch]

I didn't miss it, but that wasn't my point. People who have been beheaded are dead. Resurrection conquers death.

Then it follows that spiritual death is conquered through spiritual resurrection. This one is shared by all believers whether in the body or not.

 

[Hekuran]

I'm not sure what you mean by "spiritual death". I don't think it a biblical term?

Very simply: one day I will die. My body will be put in a grave. Then on the last day, when Jesus returns in glory, I hope to rise from the grave, live again and reign with him in a restored and renewed creation.

I don't see how the concepts of spiritual death and spiritual resurrection add much to this hope. It feels more confusing than clarifying.

 

[Hitch]

I'm not sure what you mean by "spiritual death". I don't think it a biblical term?

Very simply: one day I will die. My body will be put in a grave. Then on the last day, when Jesus returns in glory, I hope to rise from the grave, live again and reign with him in a restored and renewed creation.

I don't see how the concepts of spiritual death and spiritual resurrection add much to this hope. It feels more confusing than clarifying.

Were you ever 'dead in sin' ? If NOT then you cannot be raised up in Christ and much of what Paul wrote does not apply to you.

I don't see how the concepts of spiritual death and spiritual resurrection add much to this hope. It feels more confusing than clarifying.

This question is addressed in the OP with several NT references but i'll ask you to consider what Jesus actually said:


24 Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that heareth my word, and believeth on him that sent me, hath everlasting life, and shall not come into condemnation; but is passed from death unto life.

25 Verily, verily, I say unto you, The hour is coming, and now is, when the dead shall hear the voice of the Son of God: and they that hear shall live.


You will have a hard time fitting bodily resurrection into this passage.

 

[Beetow]

I'm not sure what [is meant] by "spiritual death"

You've no doubt heard someone express their feelings about an individual
they detest by saying: "I hate that guy! He's dead to me."

When someone is dead to you, then you're saying that they are someone with
whom you do not care to associate; and as far as you're concerned they don't even
exist. For example:

• Rev 20:14 . . Death was cast into the lake of fire.

Seeing as how death can't be picked up and thrown like a baseball or a javelin,
then I suggest that death is likely a category consisting of everything and anything
one can possibly imagine that God considers dead to Himself; both visible and
invisible.
_

 

[Hitch]

Were you ever 'dead in sin' ? If NOT then you cannot be raised up in Christ.

Were you ever 'dead in sin' ? If NOT then you cannot be raised up in Christ.

 

[Hekuran]

You've no doubt heard someone express their feelings about an individual
they detest by saying: "I hate that guy! He's dead to me."

When someone is dead to you, then you're saying that they are someone with
whom you do not care to associate; and as far as you're concerned they don't even
exist. For example:

• Rev 20:14 . . Death was cast into the lake of fire.

Seeing as how death can't be picked up and thrown like a baseball or a javelin,
then I suggest that death is likely a category consisting of everything and anything
one can possibly imagine that God considers dead to Himself; both visible and
invisible.
_

Revelation 20:14 is a vision of death and the grave being cast into the lake of fire. It's highly symbolic use of language -- nevertheless, it's clearly saying that at Christ's final victory, death and the power of the grave are destroyed.

 

[Hekuran]

Were you ever 'dead in sin' ? If NOT then you cannot be raised up in Christ and much of what Paul wrote does not apply to you.


This question is addressed in the OP with several NT references but i'll ask you to consider what Jesus actually said:


24 Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that heareth my word, and believeth on him that sent me, hath everlasting life, and shall not come into condemnation; but is passed from death unto life.

25 Verily, verily, I say unto you, The hour is coming, and now is, when the dead shall hear the voice of the Son of God: and they that hear shall live.




You will have a hard time fitting bodily resurrection into this passage.

The passage is John 5. Here's a little more of it.

“Very truly, I tell you, the hour is coming, and is now here, when the dead will hear the voice of the Son of God, and those who hear will live. For just as the Father has life in himself, so he has granted the Son also to have life in himself; and he has given him authority to execute judgment, because he is the Son of Man. Do not be astonished at this; for the hour is coming when all who are in their graves will hear his voice and will come out—those who have done good, to the resurrection of life, and those who have done evil, to the resurrection of condemnation.

Jesus is very clearly talking of death and the grave in the natural sense, then resurrection and judgement.

Is "dead in your sins" what you mean by spiritual death? Its still not clear to me what you are getting at.

 

[Hitch]

Revelation 20:14 is a vision of death and the grave being cast into the lake of fire. It's highly symbolic use of language -- nevertheless, it's clearly saying that at Christ's final victory, death and the power of the grave are destroyed.

The passage is John 5. Here's a little more of it.

“Very truly, I tell you, the hour is coming, and is now here, when the dead will hear the voice of the Son of God, and those who hear will live. For just as the Father has life in himself, so he has granted the Son also to have life in himself; and he has given him authority to execute judgment, because he is the Son of Man. Do not be astonished at this; for the hour is coming when all who are in their graves will hear his voice and will come out—those who have done good, to the resurrection of life, and those who have done evil, to the resurrection of condemnation.

Jesus is very clearly talking of death and the grave in the natural sense, then resurrection and judgement.

Is "dead in your sins" what you mean by spiritual death? Its still not clear to me what you are getting at.

Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that heareth my word, and believeth on him that sent me, hath everlasting life, and shall not come into condemnation; but is passed from death unto life.

Ephesians 2:1

And you were dead in your trespasses and sins,

Ephesians 2:5

even when we were dead in our transgressions, made us alive together with Christ (by grace you have been saved),

Colossians 2:13

When you were dead in your transgressions and the uncircumcision of your flesh, He made you alive together with Him, having forgiven us all our transgressions,

Romans 8:6

For the mind set on the flesh is death, but the mind set on the Spirit is life and peace,

1 John 3:14

We know that we have passed out of death into life, because we love the brethren. He who does not love abides in death.

This is a primary NT concept,
Matthew 8:22

But Jesus *said to him, “Follow Me, and allow the dead to bury their own dead.”

It would be plain silly to ascribe this to the physically dead. Obviously.

Jesus is very clearly talking of death and the grave in the natural sense, then resurrection and judgement.

Note in 24 He speaks of an event that is contemporary and coming, and as you correctly pointed out the later part of your quote speaks of general (bodily) resurrection.

4Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that heareth my word, and believeth on him that sent me, hath everlasting life, and shall not come into condemnation; but is passed from death unto life.

25Verily, verily, I say unto you, The hour is coming, and now is, when the dead shall hear the voice of the Son of God: and they that hear shall live.

26For as the Father hath life in himself; so hath he given to the Son to have life in himself;

27And hath given him authority to execute judgment also, because he is the Son of man.

28Marvel not at this: for the hour is coming, in the which all that are in the graves shall hear his voice,

29And shall come forth; they that have done good, unto the resurrection of life; and they that have done evil, unto the resurrection of damnation.



It doesnt take much to understand 4 is NOT speaking of the physical. By the same token it shouldnt take much to see the 'ALL' is perfectly defined ,by Christ Himself, as the good and the evil.

 

[Butch5]

Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that heareth my word, and believeth on him that sent me, hath everlasting life, and shall not come into condemnation; but is passed from death unto life.



This is a primary NT concept,
Matthew 8:22

But Jesus *said to him, “Follow Me, and allow the dead to bury their own dead.”

It would be plain silly to ascribe this to the physically dead. Obviously.

Note in 24 He speaks of an event that is contemporary and coming, and as you correctly pointed out the later part of your quote speaks of general (bodily) resurrection.

It's a metaphor. There is no such thing as spiritual death. It's not found anywhere in Scripture. It's just something people made up to try to make their beliefs fit the Scriptures. When Jesus said , 'let the dead bury their dead', He was using a figure of speech. It's the same with Paul. When he said, dead in sin he was using a figure of speech.

 

[Hitch]

It's a metaphor. There is no such thing as spiritual death. It's not found anywhere in Scripture. It's just something people made up to try to make their beliefs fit the Scriptures. When Jesus said , 'let the dead bury their dead', He was using a figure of speech. It's the same with Paul. When he said, dead in sin he was using a figure of speech.

Tell me then what is the Second Death ?

 

[complete]

Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that heareth my word, and believeth on him that sent me, hath everlasting life, and shall not come into condemnation; but is passed from death unto life.
This is a primary NT concept,
Matthew 8:22

But Jesus *said to him, “Follow Me, and allow the dead to bury their own dead.”

It would be plain silly to ascribe this to the physically dead. Obviously.

Note in 24 He speaks of an event that is contemporary and coming, and as you correctly pointed out the later part of your quote speaks of general (bodily) resurrection.

'Verily, verily, I say unto you,
He that heareth My word,
and believeth on Him that sent Me,
hath everlasting life,
and shall not come into condemnation;
but is passed from death unto life.
Verily, verily, I say unto you,
The hour is coming, and now is,
when the dead shall hear the voice of the Son of God:
and they that hear shall live.'
(John 5:24-25)

Hello @Hitch,

As @Butch5 says of Matthew 8:22, ' ... let the dead bury their dead ... ': it is a figure of speech (but not a metaphor), in which the former word, 'dead' refers to the spiritually dead, and the latter refers to those who have departed this mortal life.

* Matthew 5:25 (above) is also a figure of speech, in which the second part of the verse affirms the first part:-

'Verily, verily, I say unto you,
He that heareth My word,
and believeth on Him that sent Me,
hath everlasting life,'

'and shall not come into condemnation;
but is passed from death unto life.'

* The believer has received the promise of everlasting life which is in Christ Jesus (Titus 1:1), so he will not come into condemnation in the judgment of the last day, but is passed from death unto life, at the resurrection from the dead.

In Christ Jesus
Chris

 

[Hitch]

'Verily, verily, I say unto you,
He that heareth My word,
and believeth on Him that sent Me,
hath everlasting life,
and shall not come into condemnation;
but is passed from death unto life.
Verily, verily, I say unto you,
The hour is coming, and now is,
when the dead shall hear the voice of the Son of God:
and they that hear shall live.'
(John 5:24-25)

Hello @Hitch,

As @Butch5 says of Matthew 8:22, ' ... let the dead bury their dead ... ': it is a figure of speech, in which the former word, 'dead' refers to the spiritually dead, and the latter refers to those who have departed this mortal life.

The words of Matthew 5:25 (above) is also a figure of speech, in which the second part of the verse affirms the first part:-

'Verily, verily, I say unto you,
He that heareth My word,
and believeth on Him that sent Me,
hath everlasting life,'

'and shall not come into condemnation;
but is passed from death unto life.'

The believer has already passed from 'death unto life' (spiritually), and has 'everlasting life' promised to him (Titus 1:1) in the life to come. With no prospect of condemnation.

In Christ Jesus
Chris

The believer has already passed from 'death unto life' (spiritually), and has 'everlasting life' promised to him (Titus 1:1) in the life to come. With no prospect of condemnation./quote]

Yup.

 

[Butch5]

Tell me then what is the Second Death ?

Dying a second time.