Repentance ( Must a person forsake his sins before he can come to Christ? )

[Jesus_is_LORD]

Hey brother, what do you think about this @God's Truth ?

And you can share also @GodB4Us .

I know you two have talked a lot about repentance.

Just asking a question on your thoughts on the video. Respond

to what is said in the video, not necessarily your talking points. Thanks.

 

[Jesus_is_LORD]

And this as wellm shares a different perspective than the first video.

 

[God's Truth]

Hey brother, what do you think about this @God's Truth ?

And you can share also @GodB4Us .

I know you two have talked a lot about repentance.

Just asking a question on your thoughts on the video. Respond

to what is said in the video, not necessarily your talking points. Thanks.

This is the false doctrine of faith alone taught by many to many people.

It is a sad thing in deed that many are hindered from getting saved and knowing God better.

The man said it would be a works salvation if a person repented of their sins to get saved.

He goes against the way to get saved.

He wasn't taught by Jesus in the Bible to believe like that, he was taught by Lutherans, and Calvinists, and sects from them.

Luther and Calvin misunderstood Paul when he says not of works.

Paul was speaking of the works of the law, which are the purification works, which circumcision is the sign.

People misunderstood Paul even in the New Testament times.

Peter says the people who misunderstand Paul are unstable and unlearned and they misunderstand other scriptures too, then he warns us to obey. See 2 Peter 3.

James heard of the false belief too, and he calls the people foolish and explains how faith alone is dead and can't save anyone, he even goes on to explain that even demons believe and do something, they shudder. He also teaches the right actions Abraham did and even Rahab.

 

[God's Truth]

And this as wellm shares a different perspective than the first video.

This is a terrible mixed up teaching.
They claim God makes a person have faith and makes them turn without their knowing or wanting.
They make people so confused and afraid to say they obey God to get saved.
Who but the devil would be behind this faith alone and do nothing God says doctrine?

 

[God's Truth]

@Jesus_is_LORD

I really love it that you wanted me to watch the videos and give my thoughts on it. You see that GodB4Us has the beliefs like the men in the videos, even though he denies it, which is weird to deny something so obvious. Those false teachings have been around for a long time.

 

[Godbehonored]

@Jesus_is_LORD

I really love it that you wanted me to watch the videos and give my thoughts on it. You see that GodB4Us has the beliefs like the men in the videos, even though he denies it, which is weird to deny something so obvious. Those false teachings have been around for a long time.

People deceived by Calvinism and faith only lies will never understand why Jesus said this:

Rev 22:12 "Behold, I am coming quickly, and My reward is with Me, to give to each as is his work.

 

[God's Truth]

People deceived by Calvinism and faith only lies will never understand why Jesus said this:

Rev 22:12 "Behold, I am coming quickly, and My reward is with Me, to give to each as is his work.

Glad to meet another who knows that Calvinism is false.

 

[Jesus_is_LORD]

People deceived by Calvinism and faith only lies will never understand why Jesus said this:

Rev 22:12 "Behold, I am coming quickly, and My reward is with Me, to give to each as is his work.

Do you agree that the rewards and salvation are different?

For example the parable of the talents, has to do with rewards (what you do after you are saved for Christ)
One had 5 talents, one had 10 etc.

Whereas the parable of the sheep and the goats has to do with salvation.
Totally binary, either saved or not, no gray area.

Whereas with the rewards, they is a gradient, some get little rewards some get lots.
Rewards really only pertain to those who are saved, because the DAMNED, get no rewards at all.

What are your thoughts?
Feel free to chime in @God's Truth .

 

[Godbehonored]

Do you agree that the rewards and salvation are different?

For example the parable of the talents, has to do with rewards (what you do after you are saved for Christ)
One had 5 talents, one had 10 etc.

Whereas the parable of the sheep and the goats has to do with salvation.
Totally binary, either saved or not, no gray area.

Whereas with the rewards, they is a gradient, some get little rewards some get lots.
Rewards really only pertain to those who are saved, because the DAMNED, get no rewards at all.

What are your thoughts?
Feel free to chime in @God's Truth .

No, that verse in Rev is clear that it refers to everyone, no matter what they profess to believe. You have believed in false doctrines taught by men as is many others who are in established religion.

Many other verses say the same about God repaying a soul by their deeds, God does not change:

Matthew 16:27 For the Son of Man will come in His Father's glory with His angels, and then He will repay each one according to what he has done.

Jesus never said He is going to repay the believers only.

Job 34:11 For according to a man's deeds He repays him; according to a man's ways He brings consequences.

Jeremiah 17:10 I, the LORD, search the heart; I examine the mind to reward a man according to his way, by what his deeds deserve.

 

[GodB4Us]

Hey brother, what do you think about this @God's Truth ?

And you can share also @GodB4Us .

I know you two have talked a lot about repentance.

Just asking a question on your thoughts on the video. Respond

to what is said in the video, not necessarily your talking points. Thanks.

I agree with the man in the video only because any one can say that they saved themselves by repenting from sin first. Any thing a person does before Jesus Christ saves them is a work they can claim which is not of grace because repenting from sins earned that grace by which they have been saved through faith in Jesus Christ which in turns makes grace not grace at all.

Jesus Christ came into the world to save sinners as they are sinners when they come to Him but He can destroy the work of the devil in our lives so sin will no longer have dominion over them for how they can follow Jesus by faith in living that life of repentance after salvation.

 

[Jesus_is_LORD]

Matthew 16:27 For the Son of Man will come in His Father's glory with His angels, and then He will repay each one according to what he has done.

Jesus never said He is going to repay the believers only.

Job 34:11 For according to a man's deeds He repays him; according to a man's ways He brings consequences.

Jeremiah 17:10 I, the LORD, search the heart; I examine the mind to reward a man according to his way, by what his deeds deserve.

Thanks for the reply,

Yes, everyone will be assessed in the judgment.

Help me better understand the position you are articulating.

Are you saying that people going to hell will get rewards? Is that what you believe?

And if they will not, then who is getting those rewards, those going to heaven?

 

[Godbehonored]

Thanks for the reply,

Yes, everyone will be assessed in the judgment.

Help me better understand the position you are articulating.

Are you saying that people going to hell will get rewards? Is that what you believe?

And if they will not, then who is getting those rewards, those going to heaven?

The verse I quoted in Rev is not a verse about rewarding believers to begin with. It is a repeat of what Jesus said in Matthew 16:27, it’s about everyone.

My position is the same as apostle James. James wrote clearly in James 2 that faith without works is dead. Faith without works is no different from the faith of demons who also believe in one God.

Those who believe that one simply needs to profess some belief in Jesus and don’t need to have works of repentance to prove that they truly believe (hearers but not doers of the word) are deceived. It’s no different from a person who says he believes in human rights but then his actions show that he violates human rights day in day out. Such a person is self deceived and his faith in human rights is a ruse - his deeds show that he never believed in human rights, no matter how many times he claims that he believes.

 

[God's Truth]

Do you agree that the rewards and salvation are different?

For example the parable of the talents, has to do with rewards (what you do after you are saved for Christ)
One had 5 talents, one had 10 etc.

Whereas the parable of the sheep and the goats has to do with salvation.
Totally binary, either saved or not, no gray area.

Whereas with the rewards, they is a gradient, some get little rewards some get lots.
Rewards really only pertain to those who are saved, because the DAMNED, get no rewards at all.

What are your thoughts?
Feel free to chime in @God's Truth .

I am so glad to talk about the reward.

The reward, the gift, the inheritance, the treasure, the crown, the promise…it is all eternal life in the kingdom of God.

 

[Jesus_is_LORD]

The verse I quoted in Rev is not a verse about rewarding believers to begin with. It is a repeat of what Jesus said in Matthew 16:27, it’s about everyone.

My position is the same as apostle James. James wrote clearly in James 2 that faith without works is dead. Faith without works is no different from the faith of demons who also believe in one God.

Those who believe that one simply needs to profess some belief in Jesus and don’t need to have works of repentance to prove that they truly believe (hearers but not doers of the word) are deceived. It’s no different from a person who says he believes in human rights but then his actions show that he violates human rights day in day out. Such a person is self deceived and his faith in human rights is a ruse - his deeds show that he never believed in human rights, no matter how many times he claims that he believes.

Dear @Godbehonored , You did not answer my question. Just for a moment focus on the specific question.
Not faith or repentance, or where you think I'm going with the question.

So, Let me try again.

Do you believe, yes or no that people going to hell will get rewards?

Yes or No?

 

[Godbehonored]

Dear @Godbehonored , You did not answer my question. Just for a moment focus on the specific question.
Not faith or repentance, or where you think I'm going with the question.

So, Let me try again.

Do you believe, yes or no that people going to hell will get rewards?

Yes or No?

It depends on what you mean by rewards. But in the original sense of the word, no. They will recompensed for the evil they have done.

 

[Jesus_is_LORD]

It depends on what you mean by rewards. But in the original sense of the word, no. They will recompensed for the evil they have done.

Indeed they will not.

 

[God's Truth]

God rewards His children and repays all who do wrong.

Colossians 3:23 Whatever you do, work at it with all your heart, as working for the Lord, not for human masters, 24 since you know that you will receive an inheritance from the Lord as a reward. It is the Lord Christ you are serving. 25 Anyone who does wrong will be repaid for their wrongs, and there is no favoritism.

Romans 2:5 But because of your stubbornness and your unrepentant heart, you are storing up wrath against yourself for the day of God’s wrath, when his righteous judgment will be revealed. 6 God “will repay each person according to what they have done.” 7 To those who by persistence in doing good seek glory, honor and immortality, he will give eternal life. 8 But for those who are self-seeking and who reject the truth and follow evil, there will be wrath and anger. 9 There will be trouble and distress for every human being who does evil: first for the Jew, then for the Gentile; 10 but glory, honor and peace for everyone who does good: first for the Jew, then for the Gentile. 11 For God does not show favoritism.

 

[Jesus_is_LORD]

So this is slightly related but slightly off topic,

but since we are talking about rewards.

What do you think @Godbehonored , @GodB4Us , @God's Truth ,
that these rewards will consist of?

Obviously we don't now ( I think, we don't), but has the Holy Spirit revealed
to any of you, or do Bible verses give us a glimpse, or do you
have any thoughts on what these rewards will be in heaven?

Thanks, love and God bless. Hope you all get great rewards.

Slightly related ( I know some don't support Piper's Calvinistic views, but for this
just focus on this response as you look at the question above)

 

[GodB4Us]

So this is slightly related but slightly off topic,

but since we are talking about rewards.

What do you think @Godbehonored , @GodB4Us , @God's Truth ,
that these rewards will consist of?

Obviously we don't now ( I think, we don't), but has the Holy Spirit revealed
to any of you, or do Bible verses give us a glimpse, or do you
have any thoughts on what these rewards will be in heaven?

Thanks, love and God bless. Hope you all get great rewards.

Slightly related ( I know some don't support Piper's Calvinistic views, but for this
just focus on this response as you look at the question above)

Sounds a bit flowery. And overlooking some severe grief for being left behind.

I agree that there will be different rewards but it is not touching on how some unrepentant saints & former believers that will be left behind at the pre great tribulation rapture will get punishments too.

They will be damned as vessels unto dishonor in His House as they will not be like the vessels unto honor that are like the angels that never die and never marry and have a mansion in the House of God, but they will be marrying, and only the power of the second death will not be over them but is that inferring that the power of the first death still does? While the vessels of dishonor, the vessels of wood & earth, will be serving the King of kings on earth from all over the world and although they will be visiting the City of God on earth to partake of the tree of life for the healing of the nations, it is when death & hell is cast into the lake of fire is when they will never die any more.

Those left behind will get stripes for the knowledge they had for not being ready and lesser stripes per the lack of knowledge they had for not being ready. Luke 12:37-39 The Father will scourge them for not resisting sin Hebrews 12:3-11. The stripes is something I see as given so they will never commit those sins ever again. It is scourged out of them in the same way that the iniquity as wood, stubble, and hay is burned out of them to be partakers of His holiness.

That is why there are vessels unto dishonor in His House, vessels of wood and earth, as those who did not depart from iniquity ( 2 Timothy 2:18-21 ) will become castaways 1 Corinthians 9:24-27 & John 15:1-8.

Those vessels unto dishonor are also shall be known as the least in the kingdom of heaven for breaking even the least of His commandment and teaching others so per Matthew 5:19

In the address of the 7 churches in Revelation, five were warned to repent or else while two were exhorted to hold fast or else, but when it says at the end of each address, beginning with "11 He that hath an ear, let him hear what the Spirit saith unto the churches; He that overcometh...." I believe that is referring to those saints who get left behind for not repenting or holding fast as Jesus is the One that will overcome for them and so you can see some of the rewards for those saints left behind there.

There will be a loss and it will be felt keen as there will be weeping and gnashing of teeth as the prodigal son cannot get his first inheritance back after having spent it on wild living but he is still son and a robe and ring was placed on him as a celebration will come about hence God will perform a miracle by wiping the tears from their eyes to get past that loss thus the rewards & celebration coming will help the get passed that loss.

So in that sense, they will be happy for the Lord will make them happy in spite of being damned as vessels unto dishonor in His House, vessels of wood & earth to serve the King of kings on earth in raising up the generations following.

Regardless, I do not care to get left behind as I do hope in Him to perfect that which concerns me so I will have more reasons to praise Him in Heaven for.

 

[GodB4Us]

So this is slightly related but slightly off topic,

but since we are talking about rewards.

What do you think @Godbehonored , @GodB4Us , @God's Truth ,
that these rewards will consist of?

Obviously we don't now ( I think, we don't), but has the Holy Spirit revealed
to any of you, or do Bible verses give us a glimpse, or do you
have any thoughts on what these rewards will be in heaven?

Thanks, love and God bless. Hope you all get great rewards.

Slightly related ( I know some don't support Piper's Calvinistic views, but for this
just focus on this response as you look at the question above)

See post # 19.

Hebrews 's willfully sinning is about a specific sin.

Hebrews 10:12 But this man, after he had offered one sacrifice for sins for ever, sat down on the right hand of God;
13 From henceforth expecting till his enemies be made his footstool.
14 For by one offering he hath perfected for ever them that are sanctified.
15 Whereof the Holy Ghost also is a witness to us: for after that he had said before,
16 This is the covenant that I will make with them after those days, saith the Lord, I will put my laws into their hearts, and in their minds will I write them;
17 And their sins and iniquities will I remember no more.
18 Now where remission of these is, there is no more offering for sin.

The willful sin is after having knowledge that there is no more offering for sin and yet still believe there is more offering for sin thus willfully sinning in that way by treating His blood on the level of blood of goats & bulls that it bears repeating.

26 For if we sin wilfully after that we have received the knowledge of the truth, there remaineth no more sacrifice for sins,
27 But a certain fearful looking for of judgment and fiery indignation, which shall devour the adversaries.
28 He that despised Moses' law died without mercy under two or three witnesses:
29 Of how much sorer punishment, suppose ye, shall he be thought worthy, who hath trodden under foot the Son of God, and hath counted the blood of the covenant, wherewith he was sanctified, an unholy thing, and hath done despite unto the Spirit of grace?
30 For we know him that hath said, Vengeance belongeth unto me, I will recompense, saith the Lord. And again, The Lord shall judge his people.
31 It is a fearful thing to fall into the hands of the living God.

Do note verse 30 in how they that do this are still considered His people but they will be judged, even though still His people.