Hello, I'm new here, so please forgive me if I don't know how things work in this forum. I read the entire thread, and frankly, if this thread is any indication of the type of "fellowship" I should expect from TalkJesus in the future, I don't see myself hanging around very long.
I'm not going to call out anyone by name, but I will say that with few exceptions, there does not seem to be a great amount of Christlike love being exhibited in this particular thread. And some of the things I've read in regards to praying in the Spirit, speaking in tongues etc, have left me questioning whether or not it is worth my time to even enter the discussion.
Please forgive me if I have misconstrued some of the assertions being made, and please correct me if that be the case. That being said. I will do my best, from scripture, to correct what I see as blatant error concerning the two topics I mentioned above.
First off. There is nothing in scripture that equates the new birth, or regeneration, with speaking in tongues. Some here are confusing the Gift of the Holy Spirit with the "gifts" of the Holy Spirit, they are not the same thing. As someone already correctly noted, Christ gave the gift of the Holy Spirit to His disciples before His ascension and before Pentecost.
"And when he had said this, he breathed on them, and saith unto them, Receive ye the Holy Ghost"
John 20:22
Speaking in tongues is not the evidence of having been born again, as some here have insisted, in fact, to suggest as much shows a very limited understanding of the new birth as well as spiritual gifts, and IMHO, borders on heresy.
"Now there are diversities of gifts, but the same Spirit. And there are differences of administrations, but the same Lord. And there are diversities of operations, but it is the same God which worketh all in all. But the manifestation of the Spirit is given to every man to profit withal. For to one is given by the Spirit the word of wisdom; to another the word of knowledge by the same Spirit; To another faith by the same Spirit; to another the gifts of healing by the same Spirit; To another the working of miracles; to another prophecy; to another discerning of spirits; to another divers kinds of tongues; to another the interpretation of tongues: But all these worketh that one and the selfsame Spirit, dividing to every man severally as he will."
1 Corinthians 12:4-11
"And God hath set some in the church, first apostles, secondarily prophets, thirdly teachers, after that miracles, then gifts of healings, helps, governments, diversities of tongues. Are all apostles? are all prophets? are all teachers? are all workers of miracles? Have all the gifts of healing? do all speak with tongues? do all interpret? But covet earnestly the best gifts: and yet shew I unto you a more excellent way."
1 Corinthians 12:28-31
Notice that Paul says that all the gifts are meant for the edification of all, and that not all have the same gifts. Not all have the gift of tongues, hence, the gift of tongues cannot be the evidence of having received the Holy Spirit.
So what is the evidence? The fruits of the Spirit are certainly evidence, as are the gifts of the Spirit, but the greatest evidence according to Jesus the Lord are as follows.
Love for God.
Love for our neighbor.
Love for the brethren.
"He that hath my commandments, and keepeth them, he it is that loveth me: and he that loveth me shall be loved of my Father, and I will love him, and will manifest myself to him"
John 14:21
"Master, which is the great commandment in the law? Jesus said unto him, Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind. This is the first and great commandment. And the second is like unto it, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself. On these two commandments hang all the law and the prophets."
Matthew 22:36-40
Here we see the greatest of Christ's commandments, to love God and to love our neighbor.
And in chapter 13, prior to telling the disciples that those who loved Him would keep His commandments, He gave them this additional "new" command.
"A new commandment I give unto you, That ye love one another; as I have loved you, that ye also love one another. By this shall all know that ye are my disciples, if ye have love one to another."
John 13:34,35
Love God.
Love your neighbor.
Love your brethren.
This is the "more excellent way" that Paul elaborated on in
1 Corinthians 13, following his lengthy discourse on spiritual gifts in chapter 12.
"Though I speak with the tongues of men and of angels, and have not charity (agape love), I am become as sounding brass, or a tinkling cymbal."
1 Corinthians 13:1
If you are truly born again, if you are truly Christ's disciple, you will love God, love your neighbor, and love your brethren.
This love that the Father, Christ, Paul, and the rest of the Prophets and Apostles speak of all throughout Holy Scripture is evidenced in many ways in the life of the believer; obedience, trust, good works, mercy, patience, kindness, hatred of sin, effectual prayer, fasting, study of His Word etc. And we express this love for one very simple reason, He loved us first, and sent His Son to take our sins upon Himself, to die that we might live.
"A wicked and adulterous generation seeketh after a sign
(or signs; emphasis mine); and there shall no sign be given unto it..."
Matthew 16:4
"Every way of a man is right in his own eyes: but the LORD pondereth the hearts."
Proverbs 21:2
Brothers and sisters,
"When all has been heard, the conclusion of the matter is this: Fear God and keep His commandments, because this is the whole duty of man. For God will bring every deed into judgment, along with every hidden thing, whether good or evil."
Ecclesiastes 12:13,14
His commandment is LOVE!!!
I see that I did not yet address praying in the Spirit. So briefly, praying in the Spirit is not praying in tongues, though I am not suggesting that one could not be praying in the Spirit as they pray in tongues.
Whether tongues is still a thing in these days I will not debate. I believe it is, but I've only done it once, it's not my gift and I have little use for it.
Praying in the Spirit however, is the only way that any of us should ever pray, and yet sadly, many who name the name of Christ have no idea what praying in the Spirit even means. Do your own diligent study and God will show you.
"Praying always with all prayer and supplication in the Spirit, and watching thereunto with all perseverance and supplication for all saints.."
Ephesians 6:18
If Paul was referring to speaking in tongues when exhorting us to pray always in the Spirit, he would be in direct contradiction to himself. He is not. Again do your own study, in the Spirit of course, I've said quite enough on the subject already.
The Holy Spirit always glorifies Christ, without exception. Love always puts others first, also without exception.
Mercy and grace and peace in His Most Holy Name.
Yah alone be praised!!!
