Misunderstanding the Words of James About Faith Without works

[GodB4Us]

In the context of the kind of faith James was talking about, he was rebuking the church for giving a blessing to the poor after church service that included the church's faith in God to provide without the church leading by example by meeting the immediate needs of the poor from the bounty collected at church service.

James 2:14 What doth it profit, my brethren, though a man say he hath faith, and have not works? can faith save him? 15 If a brother or sister be naked, and destitute of daily food, 16 And one of you say unto them, Depart in peace, be ye warmed and filled; notwithstanding ye give them not those things which are needful to the body; what doth it profit? 17 Even so faith, if it hath not works, is dead, being alone.

Verses 15-16 was the offense that James was rebuking when the church was sharing their faith in God to provide for the poor to the poor without leading by example. That is why he challendged that church to show their faith in God to provide by giving from the collection at church service to meet the immediate needs of the poor, trusting God that He has provided enough for the immediate needs of the poor & for the church to run on till next church service.

James 2:18 Yea, a man may say, Thou hast faith, and I have works: shew me thy faith without thy works, and I will shew thee my faith by my works. 19 Thou believest that there is one God; thou doest well: the devils also believe, and tremble. 20 But wilt thou know, O vain man, that faith without works is dead?

If you share your faith in God to provide to any one, you best lead by example as that is the only kind of faith that requires works for others to see your faith in God to provide.

Next, James referred to only that kind of faith he was talking about that requires works by his reference to Abraham & Isaac.

James 2:21 Was not Abraham our father justified by works, when he had offered Isaac his son upon the altar? 22 Seest thou how faith wrought with his works, and by works was faith made perfect?

Look at the point of the reference in the Old Testament by how Abraham named the place in regards to that kind of faith in God to provide that requires works.

Genesis 22:7 And Isaac spake unto Abraham his father, and said, My father: and he said, Here am I, my son. And he said, Behold the fire and the wood: but where is the lamb for a burnt offering? 8 And Abraham said, My son, God will provide himself a lamb for a burnt offering: so they went both of them together.

13 And Abraham lifted up his eyes, and looked, and behold behind him a ram caught in a thicket by his horns: and Abraham went and took the ram, and offered him up for a burnt offering in the stead of his son. 14 And Abraham called the name of that place Jehovahjireh: as it is said to this day, In the mount of the Lord it shall be seen.

James was never talking about the faith in Jesus Christ that requires works because that would void grace if grace was by works.

Romans 11:5 Even so then at this present time also there is a remnant according to the election of grace. 6 And if by grace, then is it no more of works: otherwise grace is no more grace. But if it be of works, then it is no more grace: otherwise work is no more work.

Here below is Paul talking about the faith in Jesus Christ for salvation which is without works by how he referred to Abraham's faith to believe God for why this was considered unto him for righteousness.

Romans 4:1 What shall we say then that Abraham our father, as pertaining to the flesh, hath found? 2 For if Abraham were justified by works, he hath whereof to glory; but not before God.

3 For what saith the scripture? Abraham believed God, and it was counted unto him for righteousness.

4 Now to him that worketh is the reward not reckoned of grace, but of debt.

5 But to him that worketh not, but believeth on him that justifieth the ungodly, his faith is counted for righteousness.

If you have any doubts, then read what Paul had just written prior to that reference in chapter 4.

Romans 3:26 To declare, I say, at this time his righteousness: that he might be just, and the justifier of him which believeth in Jesus. 27 Where is boasting then? It is excluded. By what law? of works? Nay: but by the law of faith. 28 Therefore we conclude that a man is justified by faith without the deeds of the law.

James shared the right hand of fellowship so that means you & others are reading the words of James wrong because by misapplying James words in that way, that runs contrary to the rest of scripture including the gospel of John.

John 6:37 All that the Father giveth me shall come to me; and him that cometh to me I will in no wise cast out. 38 For I came down from heaven, not to do mine own will, but the will of him that sent me. 39 And this is the Father's will which hath sent me, that of all which he hath given me I should lose nothing, but should raise it up again at the last day. 40 And this is the will of him that sent me, that every one which seeth the Son, and believeth on him, may have everlasting life: and I will raise him up at the last day.

Galatians 2:8 (For he that wrought effectually in Peter to the apostleship of the circumcision, the same was mighty in me toward the Gentiles 9 And when James, Cephas, and John, who seemed to be pillars, perceived the grace that was given unto me, they gave to me and Barnabas the right hands of fellowship; that we should go unto the heathen, and they unto the circumcision. 10 Only they would that we should remember the poor; the same which I also was forward to do.

There is no other gospel.

Galatians 1:3 Grace be to you and peace from God the Father, and from our Lord Jesus Christ, 4 Who gave himself for our sins, that he might deliver us from this present evil world, according to the will of God and our Father: 5 To whom be glory for ever and ever. Amen.

6 I marvel that ye are so soon removed from him that called you into the grace of Christ unto another gospel: 7 Which is not another; but there be some that trouble you, and would pervert the gospel of Christ. 8 But though we, or an angel from heaven, preach any other gospel unto you than that which we have preached unto you, let him be accursed. 9 As we said before, so say I now again, if any man preach any other gospel unto you than that ye have received, let him be accursed.

Strong words for Paul to say and yet in that same Book of Galatians, testified to having been given the right hand of fellowship with James, Cephas ( Peter ) and John.

Believers are misreading and misapplying the words of James when he was never talking about faith in Jesus Christ for salvation which is without works when James was rebuking the church for getting out of showing their faith in God to provide to the poor by leading by example, that work, to the poor by meeting their immediate needs of those poor about to perish from the elements & starvation per the actual offense in James 2:15-16.

 

[B-A-C]

James was talking about, he was rebuking the church for giving a blessing to the poor

Not even close.

The dreaded "works" doctrine.

Eph 2:8; For by grace you have been saved through faith; and that not of yourselves, it is the gift of God; Eph 2:9; not as a result of works, so that no one may boast. Eph 2:10; For we are His workmanship, created in Christ Jesus for good works, which God prepared beforehand so that we...

www.talkjesus.com

 

[GodB4Us]

Not even close.

The dreaded "works" doctrine.

Eph 2:8; For by grace you have been saved through faith; and that not of yourselves, it is the gift of God; Eph 2:9; not as a result of works, so that no one may boast. Eph 2:10; For we are His workmanship, created in Christ Jesus for good works, which God prepared beforehand so that we...

www.talkjesus.com

When any one gloss over verses 15 & 16 for the actual faith James is referring to, many believers are far from understanding his words of rebuke towards the church disrespecting the poor.

James 2:14 What doth it profit, my brethren, though a man say he hath faith, and have not works? can faith save him?

15 If a brother or sister be naked, and destitute of daily food, 16 And one of you say unto them, Depart in peace, be ye warmed and filled; notwithstanding ye give them not those things which are needful to the body; what doth it profit?

17 Even so faith, if it hath not works, is dead, being alone.

 

[GodB4Us]

Eph 2:8; For by grace you have been saved through faith; and that not of yourselves, it is the gift of God;
Eph 2:9; not as a result of works, so that no one may boast.
Eph 2:10; For we are His workmanship, created in Christ Jesus for good works, which God prepared beforehand so that we would walk in them.

This is the core verse of Calvinism. It's not a bad verse. I actually agree 100% with what is said here. But even so, it is one of the most misunderstood and even misquoted verses in the Bible.
It's a shame that a core doctrine is built on a single verse.

I agree we can't do enough good works to get saved. There is nothing I can do to pay for my sins except to die. The wages of sin is death. I sinned so I have to die.
But Jesus took our place. He died for us. He paid the price for our sins. This is the core of the gospel.
If it wasn't for Jesus, all the good works in the world wouldn't help me.

But there is a slight transition in this passage. I don't get saved by works, but yet after I'm saved, we were created "for good works" which God prepared for us to do.
Well many churches believe good works is wrong. Some believe it to the point so far that if I do any good thing, I'm going to hell. (Talk about getting your doctrine twisted up)

Most people quote this verse with the word "alone" in it. I have 18 Bible and none of them have the word "alone" in them in this verse.
But you often hear we are saved by "grace alone" or by "faith alone". This verse doesn't say alone anywhere. It says not by works.
There are many other things involved in the Christian walk that aren't works. Obedience to God/Jesus/the commandments isn't a good work. But it's still one of the other things that's required.
So even if I never did a good work, it wouldn't be "faith alone".

James seems to oppose this. But is this really the case? Let us take a look.

Jas 2:14; What use is it, my brethren, if someone says he has faith but he has no works? Can that faith save him?
Jas 2:20; But are you willing to recognize, you foolish fellow, that faith without works is useless?
Jas 2:24; You see that a man is justified by works and not by faith alone.

When any one gloss over verses 15 & 16 for the actual faith James is referring to, many believers are far from understanding his words of rebuke towards the church disrespecting the poor.

James 2:14 What doth it profit, my brethren, though a man say he hath faith, and have not works? can faith save him?

15 If a brother or sister be naked, and destitute of daily food, 16 And one of you say unto them, Depart in peace, be ye warmed and filled; notwithstanding ye give them not those things which are needful to the body; what doth it profit?

17 Even so faith, if it hath not works, is dead, being alone.

James says works are required. But Paul says we aren't saved by works... so now what? Lets put them both in the same room and let them fight it out and see who wins.
But maybe this isn't the case. If I was going to add the word "alone" to Ephesians 2:9; as many people do. I would add it in a different spot.

Eph 2:9 not as a result of works alone, so that no one may boast.

I deliberately misquoted this verse to prove a point. First that adding a word changes everything, but second works aren't required to initially get saved. But they are required after you are saved.
How can I say that? So many churches teach just the opposite. Yes, I know what some churches teach. But what does the Bible teach?

Because there are more verses about how we are saved by believing in Jesus Christ ( John 3:7-18 & John 6:28-40 & 1 Corinthians 1:21 & Romans 3:26-28 & Romans 4:1-5 & Romans 10:8-17 ) is why you should doubt your added word, especially since you are using references from James in misapplying his words to make your case as if for Paul's actual message.

Hebrews 11 is called the "faith" chapter of the Bible. 1Corinthians 13 is called the "love" chapter of the Bible. Matthew 25 should be called the "works" chapter.

Matt 25:31; "But when the Son of Man comes in His glory, and all the angels with Him, then He will sit on His glorious throne.
Matt 25:32; "All the nations will be gathered before Him; and He will separate them from one another, as the shepherd separates the sheep from the goats;
Matt 25:33; and He will put the sheep on His right, and the goats on the left.
Matt 25:34; "Then the King will say to those on His right, 'Come, you who are blessed of My Father, inherit the kingdom prepared for you from the foundation of the world.
Matt 25:35; 'For I was hungry, and you gave Me something to eat; I was thirsty, and you gave Me something to drink; I was a stranger, and you invited Me in;
Matt 25:36; naked, and you clothed Me; I was sick, and you visited Me; I was in prison, and you came to Me.'
Matt 25:37; "Then the righteous will answer Him, 'Lord, when did we see You hungry, and feed You, or thirsty, and give You something to drink?
Matt 25:38; 'And when did we see You a stranger, and invite You in, or naked, and clothe You?
Matt 25:39; 'When did we see You sick, or in prison, and come to You?'
Matt 25:40; "The King will answer and say to them, 'Truly I say to you, to the extent that you did it to one of these brothers of Mine, even the least of them, you did it to Me.'
Matt 25:41; "Then He will also say to those on His left, 'Depart from Me, accursed ones, into the eternal fire which has been prepared for the devil and his angels;
Matt 25:42; for I was hungry, and you gave Me nothing to eat; I was thirsty, and you gave Me nothing to drink;
Matt 25:43; I was a stranger, and you did not invite Me in; naked, and you did not clothe Me; sick, and in prison, and you did not visit Me.'
Matt 25:44; "Then they themselves also will answer, 'Lord, when did we see You hungry, or thirsty, or a stranger, or naked, or sick, or in prison, and did not take care of You?'
Matt 25:45; "Then He will answer them, 'Truly I say to you, to the extent that you did not do it to one of the least of these, you did not do it to Me.'
Matt 25:46; "These will go away into eternal punishment, but the righteous into eternal life."

Two groups of people. One group did no good works, the other group did. Which group is righteous, and which group goes away to eternal punishment?

Matt 25:14; "For it is just like a man about to go on a journey, who called his own slaves and entrusted his possessions to them.
Matt 25:15; "To one he gave five talents, to another, two, and to another, one, each according to his own ability; and he went on his journey.
Matt 25:16; "Immediately the one who had received the five talents went and traded with them, and gained five more talents.
Matt 25:17; "In the same manner the one who had received the two talents gained two more.
Matt 25:18; "But he who received the one talent went away, and dug a hole in the ground and hid his master's money.
Matt 25:19; "Now after a long time the master of those slaves *came and *settled accounts with them.
Matt 25:20; "The one who had received the five talents came up and brought five more talents, saying, 'Master, you entrusted five talents to me. See, I have gained five more talents.'
Matt 25:21; "His master said to him, 'Well done, good and faithful slave. You were faithful with a few things, I will put you in charge of many things; enter into the joy of your master.'
Matt 25:22; "Also the one who had received the two talents came up and said, 'Master, you entrusted two talents to me. See, I have gained two more talents.'
Matt 25:23; "His master said to him, 'Well done, good and faithful slave. You were faithful with a few things, I will put you in charge of many things; enter into the joy of your master.'
Matt 25:24; "And the one also who had received the one talent came up and said, 'Master, I knew you to be a hard man, reaping where you did not sow and gathering where you scattered no seed.
Matt 25:25; 'And I was afraid, and went away and hid your talent in the ground. See, you have what is yours.'
Matt 25:26; "But his master answered and said to him, 'You wicked, lazy slave, you knew that I reap where I did not sow and gather where I scattered no seed.
Matt 25:27; 'Then you ought to have put my money in the bank, and on my arrival I would have received my money back with interest.
Matt 25:28; 'Therefore take away the talent from him, and give it to the one who has the ten talents.'
Matt 25:29; "For to everyone who has, more shall be given, and he will have an abundance; but from the one who does not have, even what he does have shall be taken away.
Matt 25:30; "Throw out the worthless slave into the outer darkness; in that place there will be weeping and gnashing of teeth.

Three servants in the Master's house here. Two of them did things with with what the Master (Jesus) gave to them. They invested what He gave them, increased it,
and He says well done... good and faithful.
The third one, he didn't do anything with what Jesus gave him. He buried it in the ground. He didn't work to increase it in anyway.
Jesus calls Him "wicked and lazy". Jesus says throw him out.

So what is the difference between a good and faithful servant, and a wicked and lazy servant?

... to be continued ...

I submit to you, brother, this solemn truth that scriptures still addresses the ones that did bad as His servants/slaves as these servants/slaves did address Him as their Master.

If you go back to the parable of the ten virgins in how they are the kingdom of heaven in Matthew 25:1 of Matthew 25:1-13, you will see that all ten are the kingdom of heaven as being in it, but five missed out on the Marriage Supper when the Bridegroom had come but still in that kingdom of heaven. Note that?

If you say "What?!!" Look at Matthew 5:19 where the least are in the kingdom of heaven but they are to be called least for breaking even the least of His commandments and teaching others so. Breaking any of His commandments is committing an iniquity, correct? And so any unrepentant iniquity that is on that foundation wen the Bridegroom comes is what denies Him per Titus 1:16 & defiles the temple of God 1 Corinthians 3:16-17 but they are saved 1 Corinthians 3:15 in that day 1 Corinthians 3:13 even though castaways as left behind into the coming great tribulation for not departing from iniquity ( Revelation 2:18-25 ) for why there will be weeping and gnashing of teeth over the loss of being partakers of the first fruits of the resurrection, but even though they will die ( 1 Corinthians 5:4-5 ) their spirits will be with the Lord in Heaven ( 2 Corinthians 5:7-11 & Revelation 6:9-11 ) for why God will wipe the tears from their eyes after they are resurrected after the great tribulation ( Revelation 7:9-17 & Revelation 20:1-6 ) to be damned as vessels into dishonor in His House for not departing from iniquity before the Bridegroom had come ( 2 Timothy 2:18-21 ) whereby even former believers are still His even after being denied by Him for He is faith because He still abides in them and all those saints left behind ( 2 Timothy 2:11-13 ) for He shall lose none of all the Father has given Him ( John 6:37-40 ).

That is how and why there are "least" in the kingdom of heaven and why there are vessels unto dishonor in His House that did not depart from iniquity before the Bridegroom had come for how they winded up that way forever, not that they will continue to break His commandments & teach others so nor live in unrepentant iniquity of any kind, including as a former believer, because they will all be restored to the path of righteousness for His name's sake but as the last in the kingdom of heaven and as vessels unto dishonor in His House, testifying to the power of God in salvation for all who believe in Jesus Christ, even in His name ( John 1:12-13 ) .

So do not confuse salvation without works for discipleship which we shall be judged by what was built on that foundation by our works because if one runs that race to obtain salvation by works, then by that work, you deny Him as Savior for having saved you since having believed in Him to be saved. Him having saved you since believing in Him is how you are in that race in the first place for the high prize of our calling to be that vessel unto honor in His House at the pre great tribulation rapture event when God judges His House first before He comes back with the pre raptured saints to judge the world as the King of kings per Zechariah 14:1-5 in establishing His kingdom on earth for His 1000 years reign.

 

[Brother Paul]

In the context of the kind of faith James was talking about, he was rebuking the church for giving a blessing to the poor after church service that included the church's faith in God to provide without the church leading by example by meeting the immediate needs of the poor from the bounty collected at church service.

James 2:14 What doth it profit, my brethren, though a man say he hath faith, and have not works? can faith save him? 15 If a brother or sister be naked, and destitute of daily food, 16 And one of you say unto them, Depart in peace, be ye warmed and filled; notwithstanding ye give them not those things which are needful to the body; what doth it profit? 17 Even so faith, if it hath not works, is dead, being alone.

Verses 15-16 was the offense that James was rebuking when the church was sharing their faith in God to provide for the poor to the poor without leading by example. That is why he challendged that church to show their faith in God to provide by giving from the collection at church service to meet the immediate needs of the poor, trusting God that He has provided enough for the immediate needs of the poor & for the church to run on till next church service.

James 2:18 Yea, a man may say, Thou hast faith, and I have works: shew me thy faith without thy works, and I will shew thee my faith by my works. 19 Thou believest that there is one God; thou doest well: the devils also believe, and tremble. 20 But wilt thou know, O vain man, that faith without works is dead?

If you share your faith in God to provide to any one, you best lead by example as that is the only kind of faith that requires works for others to see your faith in God to provide.

Next, James referred to only that kind of faith he was talking about that requires works by his reference to Abraham & Isaac.

James 2:21 Was not Abraham our father justified by works, when he had offered Isaac his son upon the altar? 22 Seest thou how faith wrought with his works, and by works was faith made perfect?

Look at the point of the reference in the Old Testament by how Abraham named the place in regards to that kind of faith in God to provide that requires works.

Genesis 22:7 And Isaac spake unto Abraham his father, and said, My father: and he said, Here am I, my son. And he said, Behold the fire and the wood: but where is the lamb for a burnt offering? 8 And Abraham said, My son, God will provide himself a lamb for a burnt offering: so they went both of them together.

13 And Abraham lifted up his eyes, and looked, and behold behind him a ram caught in a thicket by his horns: and Abraham went and took the ram, and offered him up for a burnt offering in the stead of his son. 14 And Abraham called the name of that place Jehovahjireh: as it is said to this day, In the mount of the Lord it shall be seen.

James was never talking about the faith in Jesus Christ that requires works because that would void grace if grace was by works.

Romans 11:5 Even so then at this present time also there is a remnant according to the election of grace. 6 And if by grace, then is it no more of works: otherwise grace is no more grace. But if it be of works, then it is no more grace: otherwise work is no more work.

Here below is Paul talking about the faith in Jesus Christ for salvation which is without works by how he referred to Abraham's faith to believe God for why this was considered unto him for righteousness.

Romans 4:1 What shall we say then that Abraham our father, as pertaining to the flesh, hath found? 2 For if Abraham were justified by works, he hath whereof to glory; but not before God.

3 For what saith the scripture? Abraham believed God, and it was counted unto him for righteousness.

4 Now to him that worketh is the reward not reckoned of grace, but of debt.

5 But to him that worketh not, but believeth on him that justifieth the ungodly, his faith is counted for righteousness.

If you have any doubts, then read what Paul had just written prior to that reference in chapter 4.

Romans 3:26 To declare, I say, at this time his righteousness: that he might be just, and the justifier of him which believeth in Jesus. 27 Where is boasting then? It is excluded. By what law? of works? Nay: but by the law of faith. 28 Therefore we conclude that a man is justified by faith without the deeds of the law.

James shared the right hand of fellowship so that means you & others are reading the words of James wrong because by misapplying James words in that way, that runs contrary to the rest of scripture including the gospel of John.

John 6:37 All that the Father giveth me shall come to me; and him that cometh to me I will in no wise cast out. 38 For I came down from heaven, not to do mine own will, but the will of him that sent me. 39 And this is the Father's will which hath sent me, that of all which he hath given me I should lose nothing, but should raise it up again at the last day. 40 And this is the will of him that sent me, that every one which seeth the Son, and believeth on him, may have everlasting life: and I will raise him up at the last day.

Galatians 2:8 (For he that wrought effectually in Peter to the apostleship of the circumcision, the same was mighty in me toward the Gentiles 9 And when James, Cephas, and John, who seemed to be pillars, perceived the grace that was given unto me, they gave to me and Barnabas the right hands of fellowship; that we should go unto the heathen, and they unto the circumcision. 10 Only they would that we should remember the poor; the same which I also was forward to do.

There is no other gospel.

Galatians 1:3 Grace be to you and peace from God the Father, and from our Lord Jesus Christ, 4 Who gave himself for our sins, that he might deliver us from this present evil world, according to the will of God and our Father: 5 To whom be glory for ever and ever. Amen.

6 I marvel that ye are so soon removed from him that called you into the grace of Christ unto another gospel: 7 Which is not another; but there be some that trouble you, and would pervert the gospel of Christ. 8 But though we, or an angel from heaven, preach any other gospel unto you than that which we have preached unto you, let him be accursed. 9 As we said before, so say I now again, if any man preach any other gospel unto you than that ye have received, let him be accursed.

Strong words for Paul to say and yet in that same Book of Galatians, testified to having been given the right hand of fellowship with James, Cephas ( Peter ) and John.

Believers are misreading and misapplying the words of James when he was never talking about faith in Jesus Christ for salvation which is without works when James was rebuking the church for getting out of showing their faith in God to provide to the poor by leading by example, that work, to the poor by meeting their immediate needs of those poor about to perish from the elements & starvation per the actual offense in James 2:15-16.

Ephesians 2:10: Works do not save or justify before God but if one is saved or justified works (which God foreordained that we should do) will result.

 

[GodB4Us]

Ephesians 2:10: Works do not save or justify before God but if one is saved or justified works (which God foreordained that we should do) will result.

For saved believers seeking to be His disciples, by looking to the author & finisher of our faith to help us lay aside every weight & sin daily ( Hebrews 12:1-2 ) in walking in the light in fellowship with the Father & the Son ( 1 John 1:3-9 ), we should engage in good works, see verse 8 in Titus 3:4-8 , but not every saved believers will 2 Peter 2:18-22. Some can go astray by a lie and have their faith overthrown 2 Timothy 2:18 but He still abides in former believers 2 Timothy 2:13 for why they are still to be called to depart from iniquity as any other professing believers that are in iniquity also if they wish to be received by Him as that vessel unto honor in His House 2 Timothy 2:19-21 and not risk being in iniquity that denies Him ( Titus 1:16 ) for why He is denying them ( 2 Timothy 2:12 & Matthew 7:21-23 ) in leaving them behind ( Revelation 2:18-25 ) from attending the Marriage Supper in Heaven ( Luke 12:40-49 & Luke 13:24-30 ).

Discipleship as in, running that race for the high prize of our calling to be that vessel unto honor in His House is to be done by faith in Jesus Christ to finish His work in us ( Philippians 1:6 ) to His glory ( Philippians 1:11 ) is why any crowns we receive in Heaven are really His crowning achievements in us.

As long as saved believers know they are saved for simply believing in Jesus Christ, even in His name, then they can run that race by faith in Jessus Christ as their Good Shepherd that He will help & enable them to follow Him Home.

 

[Brother Paul]

True but sadly many think believing in his name means believing in the guttural utterance and do not comprehend what a Shem is to the ancient Hebrew speaker or writer and take the name Christian then live evil regularly

 

[GodB4Us]

True but sadly many think believing in his name means believing in the guttural utterance and do not comprehend what a Shem is to the ancient Hebrew speaker or writer and take the name Christian then live evil regularly

That is why His disciples are to teach newly saved believers in training them to be His disciples by believing Jesus Christ to be their personal Good Shepherd & Friend to help them understand His words & to abide in Him & His words so they can bear fruit and their joy may be full so as to avoid verse 6 in John 15:1-8 of being cut off and left behind at the rapture event ( Luke 12:40-49 ) when God judges His House first ( 1 Peter 4:17 & 2 Corinthians 5:7-11 ), but though left behind for not departing from iniquity, they shall be damned as vessels unto dishonor, vessels of wood & earth ( see verse 20 in 2 Timothy 2:19-21 ), but still in His House. This is why there are "least" in the kingdom of heaven Matthew 5:19 as they, as the least, the vessels unto dishonor, shall testify to the power of God in salvation for all those who believe in Him ( 1 Corinthians 1:21 ) , even in His name ( John 1:12-13 ).

 

[Brother Paul]

That is why His disciples are to teach newly saved believers in training them to be His disciples by believing Jesus Christ to be their personal Good Shepherd & Friend to help them understand His words & to abide in Him & His words so they can bear fruit and their joy may be full so as to avoid verse 6 in John 15:1-8 of being cut off and left behind at the rapture event ( Luke 12:40-49 ) when God judges His House first ( 1 Peter 4:17 & 2 Corinthians 5:7-11 ), but though left behind for not departing from iniquity, they shall be damned as vessels unto dishonor, vessels of wood & earth ( see verse 20 in 2 Timothy 2:19-21 ), but still in His House. This is why there are "least" in the kingdom of heaven Matthew 5:19 as they, as the least, the vessels unto dishonor, shall testify to the power of God in salvation for all those who believe in Him ( 1 Corinthians 1:21 ) , even in His name ( John 1:12-13 ).

Amen

 

[Daniel L.]

Paul

We are saved by the works. Faith without works is dead.

Exodus 23:7 [...] I will not justify the wicked.

Proverbs 17:15 He that justifieth the wicked, and he that condemneth the just, even they both are abomination to the Lord.

Proverbs 24:24 He that saith unto the wicked, Thou are righteous; him shall the people curse, nations shall abhor him:

Psalm 119:21 Thou hast rebuked the proud that are cursed, which do err from thy commandments.

53 Horror hath taken hold upon me because of the wicked that forsake thy law.

85 The proud have digged pits for me, which are not after thy law.

118 Thou hast trodden down all them that err from thy statutes: for their deceit is falsehood.

150 They draw nigh that follow after mischief: they are far from thy law.

155 Salvation is far from the wicked: for they seek not thy statutes.

Proverbs 1:7 The fear of the Lord is the beginning of knowledge: but fools despise wisdom and instruction.

Proverbs 4:4 He taught me also, and said unto me, Let thine heart retain my words: keep my commandments, and live.

Proverbs 5:12 And say, How have I hated instruction, and my heart despised reproof;
13 And have not obeyed the voice of my teachers, nor inclined mine ear to them that instructed me!
23 He shall die without instruction; and in the greatness of his folly he shall go astray.

Proverbs 7:2 Keep my commandments, and live; and my law as the apple of thine eye.

Proverbs 13:1 A wise son heareth his father's instruction: but a scorner heareth not rebuke.

Proverbs 15:5 A fool despiseth his father's instruction: but he that regardeth reproof is prudent.

18 Poverty and shame shall be to him that refuseth instruction: but he that regardeth reproof shall be honoured.

32 He that refuseth instruction despiseth his own soul: but he that heareth reproof getteth understanding.

Proverbs 28:9 He that turneth away his ear from hearing the law, even his prayer shall be abomination.

Job 21:14 Therefore they say unto God, Depart from us; for we desire not the knowledge of thy ways.

15 What is the Almighty, that we should serve him? and what profit should we have, if we pray unto him?

John 15:14 Ye are my friends, if ye do whatsoever I command you.

1 John 2:3 And hereby we do know that we know him, if we keep his commandments.

Revelation 12:17 And the dragon was wroth with the woman, and went to make war with the remnant of her seed, which keep the commandments of God, and have the testimony of Jesus Christ.

Revelation 14:12 Here is the patience of the saints: here are they that keep the commandments of God, and the faith of Jesus.

Revelation 22:14 Blessed are they that do his commandments, that they may have right to the tree of life, and may enter in through the gates into the city.

Ecclesiastes 12:13 Let us hear the conclusion of the whole matter: Fear God, and keep his commandments: for this is the whole duty of man.

 

[GodB4Us]

We are saved by the works. Faith without works is dead.

I disagree. I believe I have shared enough scriptures why.

God will justify the wicked when they believe in Jesus Christ to be saved as well as believe in Him to deliver them from their wickedness to live that abundant life with Christ in abiding in Him & His words to bear fruit so their joy may be full.

 

[Daniel L.]

I disagree. I believe I have shared enough scriptures why.

All you have is one witness, Paul.

God will justify the wicked

Exodus 23:7 [...] I will not justify the wicked.

Proverbs 17:15 He that justifieth the wicked, and he that condemneth the just, even they both are abomination to the Lord.

Proverbs 24:24 He that saith unto the wicked, Thou are righteous; him shall the people curse, nations shall abhor him:

Psalm 119:155 Salvation is far from the wicked: for they seek not thy statutes.

Proverbs 4:4 He taught me also, and said unto me, Let thine heart retain my words: keep my commandments, and live.

 

[GodB4Us]

All you have is one witness, Paul.

Paul, along with Jesus, Luke, Peter, & John.

You are forgetting that Peter had endorsed Paul by referring Paul's epistles as being scripture also. That means Paul's epistles as the word of God as true.

2 Peter 3:15 And account that the longsuffering of our Lord is salvation; even as our beloved brother Paul also according to the wisdom given unto him hath written unto you; 16 As also in all his epistles, speaking in them of these things; in which are some things hard to be understood, which they that are unlearned and unstable wrest, as they do also the other scriptures, unto their own destruction.

Luke, as led by the Holy Spirit, had written the Book of Acts and therefore adds his witness to Paul as an apostle.

Acts 14:14 Which when the apostles, Barnabas and Paul, heard of, they rent their clothes, and ran in among the people, crying out,

That's 2 witnesses to Paul being an apostle as Paul's epistles are scripture.

John 8:17 It is also written in your law, that the testimony of two men is true.

You need to repent of that false teaching about Paul being a false apostle now also.

Then you have Jesus's words as reported by John on how we are born again of the Spirit in how believing in Him is how we are saved & having eternal life.

John 3:7 Marvel not that I said unto thee, Ye must be born again. 8 The wind bloweth where it listeth, and thou hearest the sound thereof, but canst not tell whence it cometh, and whither it goeth: so is every one that is born of the Spirit. 9 Nicodemus answered and said unto him, How can these things be? 10 Jesus answered and said unto him, Art thou a master of Israel, and knowest not these things? 11 Verily, verily, I say unto thee, We speak that we do know, and testify that we have seen; and ye receive not our witness. 12 If I have told you earthly things, and ye believe not, how shall ye believe, if I tell you of heavenly things?

13 And no man hath ascended up to heaven, but he that came down from heaven, even the Son of man which is in heaven. 14 And as Moses lifted up the serpent in the wilderness, even so must the Son of man be lifted up:

15 That whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have eternal life. 16 For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life. 17 For God sent not his Son into the world to condemn the world; but that the world through him might be saved. 18 He that believeth on him is not condemned: but he that believeth not is condemned already, because he hath not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God.

1 John 5:1Whosoever believeth that Jesus is the Christ is born of God: and every one that loveth him that begat loveth him also that is begotten of him...... 11 And this is the record, that God hath given to us eternal life, and this life is in his Son. 12 He that hath the Son hath life; and he that hath not the Son of God hath not life. 13 These things have I written unto you that believe on the name of the Son of God; that ye may know that ye have eternal life, and that ye may believe on the name of the Son of God.

So the words of Jesus does match up with Paul in how we are saved.

Romans 3:26 To declare, I say, at this time his righteousness: that he might be just, and the justifier of him which believeth in Jesus. 27 Where is boasting then? It is excluded. By what law? of works? Nay: but by the law of faith. 28 Therefore we conclude that a man is justified by faith without the deeds of the law.

Romans 10:8 But what saith it? The word is nigh thee, even in thy mouth, and in thy heart: that is, the word of faith, which we preach; 9 That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved. 10 For with the heart man believeth unto righteousness; and with the mouth confession is made unto salvation. 11 For the scripture saith, Whosoever believeth on him shall not be ashamed. 12 For there is no difference between the Jew and the Greek: for the same Lord over all is rich unto all that call upon him. 13 For whosoever shall call upon the name of the Lord shall be saved.

Are you reading all of that?

Yes, we are to do good works but not for salvation, but for abiding in Him as His disciples so we do not get left behind.

That is why His disciples are to teach newly saved believers in training them to be His disciples by believing Jesus Christ to be their personal Good Shepherd & Friend to help them understand His words & to abide in Him & His words so they can bear fruit and their joy may be full so as to avoid verse 6 in John 15:1-8 of being cut off and left behind at the rapture event ( Luke 12:40-49 ) when God judges His House first ( 1 Peter 4:17 & 2 Corinthians 5:7-11 ), but though left behind for not departing from iniquity, they shall be damned as vessels unto dishonor, vessels of wood & earth ( see verse 20 in 2 Timothy 2:19-21 ), but still in His House. This is why there are "least" in the kingdom of heaven Matthew 5:19 as they, as the least, the vessels unto dishonor, shall testify to the power of God in salvation for all those who believe in Him ( 1 Corinthians 1:21 ) , even in His name ( John 1:12-13 ).

 

[Daniel L.]

Acts 14:14 Which when the apostles, Barnabas and Paul, heard of, they rent their clothes, and ran in among the people, crying out,

Is Barnabas also an Apostle?? Or did Luke meant disciples. Which leaves you with only one witness in Peter.

believing in Him is how we are saved

James 2:20 But wilt thou know, O vain man, that faith without works is dead?

9 That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved.

Matthew 7:21 Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven.

26 And every one that heareth these sayings of mine, and doeth them not, shall be likened unto a foolish man, which built his house upon the sand:

James 1:22 But be ye doers of the word, and not hearers only, deceiving your own selves.

we are to do good works but not for salvation, but for abiding in Him

1 John 3:6 Whosoever abideth in him sinneth not: whosoever sinneth hath not seen him, neither known him.