imajw4life
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You never answered the question...Who was Jesus talking to in the heavens.....Whose will was he doing but that of HIS Father.
Is Jesus "God"?
- Thread starter imajw4life
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B-A-C
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You didn't ask that question in this thread. You asked it in the "Who's will is Jesus referring to" thread. I answered it in post #2 in that thread.
imajw4life
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Not here to convince, but to enlighten. 2 Cor 4:4
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@imajw4life
Let's get a few things cleared up. Many of us who responded have provided ample proof that Jesus is GOD, He and the Father and the Holy Spirit are "one" as He stated and other verses in the Scripture state. You are indeed continuing your debate and you're clearly coming from a Jehovah's Witness doctrine. So, I'm left with one last resort to point out the many flaws of their false doctrine, which the Holy Bible warns about. You seem more adamant about defending their doctrine that Jesus is not the Son of GOD. I sure hope you have the humility it takes to learn, be teachable, as Scripture instructs.
Proverbs 12:1
2 Timothy 3:16
I like this article as it simply sums up the issues with the JW doctrine and false teachings. Written by the reputable Matt Slick from carm.org
**
As a Jehovah's Witness you have been taught from the Bible and the Watchtower organization. You’ve attended numerous meetings and are convinced that what you believe is the truth. You also believe the Trinity is a demonic doctrine and that Christendom is an apostate group preaching a false gospel. Additionally, you are taught the Watchtower organization is the true channel of God’s revelation to His church on earth. You are taught that you are in "The Truth," but believing it does not make it so. I am sure you agree with this and respond by saying that your beliefs are in agreement with the Bible. After all, you study it deeply and often and have validated your beliefs with the word of God. I don’t deny that you study; but when you study, you study under the Watchtower's guidance and allow it to shape your understanding and thinking of the Bible and its doctrines.
Please consider these quotes from the Watchtower Magazine that verify what I am saying:
Please don’t be offended by this; but when a group claims to be the prophet of God yet mistranslates the Bible, takes verses out of context, makes false prophecies, and misquotes authorities all to make its position valid, its credibility is lost. It cannot be from God.
But you will never know that unless you "examine ALL things." Unfortunately, as a Jehovah's Witness, you are only encouraged to study what the Watchtower and Awake magazines tell you to study. That means you can't really check up on its false prophecies on your own. Instead, you must trust what it tells you about its own false prophecies. In addition, you are instructed to not take any literature from "apostate Christendom." This way, you will have far less opportunity to be challenged, something the Watchtower organization doesn't want to happen.
The Watchtower Magazine teaches by asking the questions and giving the answers. Sometimes it even uses a Bible reference (often out of context) to back up what it says. It all looks good and sounds good from your perspective, but it is a false method of study. The Watchtower organization tells you what to think and what to do; if you say that isn't true and that the Watchtower Organization is God's organization on earth, then you are simply repeating what the Watchtower tells you.
The Bible alone is sufficient, but the Watchtower denies this:
"From time to time, there have arisen from among the ranks of Jehovah's people those who, like the original Satan, have adopted an independent, faultfinding attitude . . . They say that it is sufficient to read the Bible exclusively, either alone or in small groups at home. But, strangely, through such 'Bible reading,' they have reverted right back to the apostate doctrines that commentaries by Christendom's clergy were teaching 100 years ago..."3
What are the apostate doctrines: Trinity? Hell? Jesus is God? Funny thing is that, according to the Watchtower, if you study the Bible by itself, you will come to believe these things! Could it be that apart from the selected questions, answers, scripture quotes, and direction of the Watchtower teaching that the Bible actually does teach these "apostate doctrines"? If you don't check for yourself and only believe the Watchtower, you'll never know.
Do you want to trust your eternal soul to the teachings of several men headquartered in Brooklyn, New York, who claim to be the directors of God's organization on earth? Do you? Eternity is a long time to be wrong.
If you are a Jehovah's Witness, please read this first. | Christian Apologetics and Research Ministry
Let's get a few things cleared up. Many of us who responded have provided ample proof that Jesus is GOD, He and the Father and the Holy Spirit are "one" as He stated and other verses in the Scripture state. You are indeed continuing your debate and you're clearly coming from a Jehovah's Witness doctrine. So, I'm left with one last resort to point out the many flaws of their false doctrine, which the Holy Bible warns about. You seem more adamant about defending their doctrine that Jesus is not the Son of GOD. I sure hope you have the humility it takes to learn, be teachable, as Scripture instructs.
Proverbs 12:1
2 Timothy 3:16
I like this article as it simply sums up the issues with the JW doctrine and false teachings. Written by the reputable Matt Slick from carm.org
**
As a Jehovah's Witness you have been taught from the Bible and the Watchtower organization. You’ve attended numerous meetings and are convinced that what you believe is the truth. You also believe the Trinity is a demonic doctrine and that Christendom is an apostate group preaching a false gospel. Additionally, you are taught the Watchtower organization is the true channel of God’s revelation to His church on earth. You are taught that you are in "The Truth," but believing it does not make it so. I am sure you agree with this and respond by saying that your beliefs are in agreement with the Bible. After all, you study it deeply and often and have validated your beliefs with the word of God. I don’t deny that you study; but when you study, you study under the Watchtower's guidance and allow it to shape your understanding and thinking of the Bible and its doctrines.
Please consider these quotes from the Watchtower Magazine that verify what I am saying:
- "All who want to understand the Bible should appreciate that the "greatly diversified wisdom of God" can become known only through Jehovah's channel of communication, the faithful and discreet slave."1
- "Thus the Bible is an organizational book and belongs to the Christian congregation as an organization, not to individuals, regardless of how sincerely they may believe that they can interpret the Bible."2
- Why has it made false prophecies?
- Why has it altered the translation of the Bible?
- Why does the Watchtower say you will fall into apostasy if you read the Bible without the Watchtower? See their quotes
- Why are you not allowed to examine your own organization and its problems?
- Why does it tell you what to think and do?
Please don’t be offended by this; but when a group claims to be the prophet of God yet mistranslates the Bible, takes verses out of context, makes false prophecies, and misquotes authorities all to make its position valid, its credibility is lost. It cannot be from God.
But you will never know that unless you "examine ALL things." Unfortunately, as a Jehovah's Witness, you are only encouraged to study what the Watchtower and Awake magazines tell you to study. That means you can't really check up on its false prophecies on your own. Instead, you must trust what it tells you about its own false prophecies. In addition, you are instructed to not take any literature from "apostate Christendom." This way, you will have far less opportunity to be challenged, something the Watchtower organization doesn't want to happen.
The Watchtower Magazine teaches by asking the questions and giving the answers. Sometimes it even uses a Bible reference (often out of context) to back up what it says. It all looks good and sounds good from your perspective, but it is a false method of study. The Watchtower organization tells you what to think and what to do; if you say that isn't true and that the Watchtower Organization is God's organization on earth, then you are simply repeating what the Watchtower tells you.
The Bible alone is sufficient, but the Watchtower denies this:
"From time to time, there have arisen from among the ranks of Jehovah's people those who, like the original Satan, have adopted an independent, faultfinding attitude . . . They say that it is sufficient to read the Bible exclusively, either alone or in small groups at home. But, strangely, through such 'Bible reading,' they have reverted right back to the apostate doctrines that commentaries by Christendom's clergy were teaching 100 years ago..."3
What are the apostate doctrines: Trinity? Hell? Jesus is God? Funny thing is that, according to the Watchtower, if you study the Bible by itself, you will come to believe these things! Could it be that apart from the selected questions, answers, scripture quotes, and direction of the Watchtower teaching that the Bible actually does teach these "apostate doctrines"? If you don't check for yourself and only believe the Watchtower, you'll never know.
Do you want to trust your eternal soul to the teachings of several men headquartered in Brooklyn, New York, who claim to be the directors of God's organization on earth? Do you? Eternity is a long time to be wrong.
If you are a Jehovah's Witness, please read this first. | Christian Apologetics and Research Ministry
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DHC
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Hello ImaJW4life.
Please read the following information and get back to me with your explanation of how this all works.
We know that no one has seen the Father, please read the following verses which tell us this fact.
John 6:46 (NWT)
6 Not that any man has seen the Father, except the one who is from God; this one has seen the Father
1 John 4:12 (NWT)
12 No one has seen God at any time.
So God has never been seen by humanity, for God is invisible and lives in unapproachable light.
1 Timothy 6:16
who alone possesses immortality and dwells in unapproachable light, whom no man has seen or can see.
A simple truth that no one can argue with, anyone who says otherwise is breaking the scripture.
Here is where the problems arises for us ImaJW4life.
Exodus 24 (NWT)
9 Moses and Aaron, Na′dab and A·bi′hu, and 70 of the elders of Israel went up, 10 and they saw
the God of Israel. Under his feet was what seemed like a sapphire pavement, and it was as pure as
the heavens themselves. 11 He did not harm the distinguished men of Israel, and they saw a vision
of the true God and ate and drank.
So Moses actually saw the God of Israel, 'and they saw the God of Israel ', but the scripture states that
no one has seen God! So the obvious question is, who did Moses see? Remember that we cannot break
the scripture. Please also note that God allowed them to see Him and He did not destroy them.
Please get back to me on this, for I am fascinated by how you deal with this problem.
Please read the following information and get back to me with your explanation of how this all works.
You asked, 'Who exactly is the Father who is in heavens'.
We know that no one has seen the Father, please read the following verses which tell us this fact.
John 6:46 (NWT)
6 Not that any man has seen the Father, except the one who is from God; this one has seen the Father
1 John 4:12 (NWT)
12 No one has seen God at any time.
So God has never been seen by humanity, for God is invisible and lives in unapproachable light.
1 Timothy 6:16
who alone possesses immortality and dwells in unapproachable light, whom no man has seen or can see.
A simple truth that no one can argue with, anyone who says otherwise is breaking the scripture.
Here is where the problems arises for us ImaJW4life.
Exodus 24 (NWT)
9 Moses and Aaron, Na′dab and A·bi′hu, and 70 of the elders of Israel went up, 10 and they saw
the God of Israel. Under his feet was what seemed like a sapphire pavement, and it was as pure as
the heavens themselves. 11 He did not harm the distinguished men of Israel, and they saw a vision
of the true God and ate and drank.
So Moses actually saw the God of Israel, 'and they saw the God of Israel ', but the scripture states that
no one has seen God! So the obvious question is, who did Moses see? Remember that we cannot break
the scripture. Please also note that God allowed them to see Him and He did not destroy them.
Please get back to me on this, for I am fascinated by how you deal with this problem.
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I'll throw Zechariah 12:10 in the mix too...
◄New American Standard Bible
"I will pour out on the house of David and on the inhabitants of Jerusalem, the Spirit of grace and of supplication, so that they will look on Me whom they have pierced; and they will mourn for Him, as one mourns for an only son, and they will weep bitterly over Him like the bitter weeping over a firstborn."
I don't know what the New World Translation does with this verse, but here the Father is talking to Israel about events in the future. When was God pierced, if not on the cross? And the Hebrew word used there has no other connotation besides "thrust through"...In a physical sense, not in an emotional sense. And I know of no other besides the Father who can pour out a Spirit of grace and supplication on the inhabitants of a nation. That same God was pierced on the cross.
Also, Titus 1:3-4 says, "3 but at the proper time manifested, even His word, in the proclamation with which I was entrusted according to the commandment of God our Savior, 4To Titus, my true child in a common faith: Grace and peace from God the Father and Christ Jesus our Savior."
So, either Paul is confused, or he just equated God the Father with Christ Jesus by calling both of them our Savior.
Just my $0.02.
◄New American Standard Bible
"I will pour out on the house of David and on the inhabitants of Jerusalem, the Spirit of grace and of supplication, so that they will look on Me whom they have pierced; and they will mourn for Him, as one mourns for an only son, and they will weep bitterly over Him like the bitter weeping over a firstborn."
I don't know what the New World Translation does with this verse, but here the Father is talking to Israel about events in the future. When was God pierced, if not on the cross? And the Hebrew word used there has no other connotation besides "thrust through"...In a physical sense, not in an emotional sense. And I know of no other besides the Father who can pour out a Spirit of grace and supplication on the inhabitants of a nation. That same God was pierced on the cross.
Also, Titus 1:3-4 says, "3 but at the proper time manifested, even His word, in the proclamation with which I was entrusted according to the commandment of God our Savior, 4To Titus, my true child in a common faith: Grace and peace from God the Father and Christ Jesus our Savior."
So, either Paul is confused, or he just equated God the Father with Christ Jesus by calling both of them our Savior.
Just my $0.02.
DHC
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Hello Gismapper.
There is a subtle alteration in the text of the New World Translation which I highlighted in red.
Zechariah 12 (New World Translation)
10 I will pour out on the house of David and on the inhabitants of Jerusalem the spirit of favor and supplication, and they will look to the one whom
they pierced, and they will wail over him as they would wail over an only son; and they will grieve bitterly over him as they would grieve over a firstborn son
The Hebrew does not say 'the one' it actually says 'to me'. I checked the Hebrew word used in Zechariah 12:10 against other instances and the NWT
is definitely a faulty translation. They should have changed all the occurrences throughout the Old Testament, not just in this one line of Zechariah.
happyharold4
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When a conversation comes up about the Deity of Christ, the first verse that always pops up in my mine is Col 2:9. " For in him dwelleth all the fullness of the Godhead bodily".
Happy
Happy
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Amen and perfect verse to back up His deity!
Wow! This kinna' Thread has run around so many tired an' weary blocks over the years. It's one of the most favored Christian bait questions.
I've learned to keep my own counsel about discussions such as this. It most always ends up hardening hearts and minds.
The same thing can be said about those who invite an' bait with questions concerning the Trinity, Universal Reconciliation, Post/Pre-Rapture, and whether the Jews are reserved for a special blessing.
All these kinna' questions which are posed in Forums have run out of credible steam over the years.
Nevertheless, this Forum saw fit to send me a headz-up multi-colored E-mail Alert to hopefully encourage me to participate with this damned-if-you-do an' damned-if-you-don't question..
Rev T.S.Perkins
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Seems to me according to the word When Christ wandered off as a child Mary and Joseph found him teaching in the temple but as they scolded him for wandering away he told. Them ,DID YOU NOT KNOW I Would be about my Fathers business ? He also while taking to God in prayer called Him Father as well .. It's obvious there is only oneGod in heaven and only one savior to man kind ! We should reverance Jesus but worship God almighty . At the baptism of Christ a dove descended from heaven and God said this is my Son in whom I am well pleased ! It's pretty clear I think ! ...Rev
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Marcus01
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- 9
You know is God a liar? Even you cant deny that God is not capable oftelling a lie.
Consider these scriptures.
<tt>John 1:18</tt> No man hath seen God at any time; the only begotten Son,which is in the bosom of the Father, he(God) hath declared him.
<tt>1 John 4:12</tt> No man hath seen God at any time. If we love one another,God dwelleth in us, and his love is perfected in us.
<tt>John 5:37</tt> And the Father himself, which hathsent me, hath borne witness of me. Ye have neither heard his voice at any time, nor seenhis shape. So as you can see no one has seen God at anytime, orheard his voice, nor seen his shape. (JESUS IS NOT GOD. If it is god you haveseen god.) Jesus isanother being. He’s is of the exact same mind as his father, thus they are one.Same essence.
But letskeep going. Lets get even more witnesses.
LK 2:40 And the child grew, and waxed strong in spirit, filled withwisdom: and the grace of God was upon him.
LK 2:52 And Jesus increased in wisdom and stature, and infavour with God and man.
God increase in wisdom and stature with himself and man? I mean that isso ridiculous it doesn’t even merit a response.
<o
> </o>
JN 5:30 I can of mine own self donothing: as I hear, I judge: and my judgmentis just; because I seek not mine own will, but the will of the Fatherwhich hath sent me. A blantant lie if this is God Almighty.
<o> </o>
JN 7:16 Jesus answered them, and said, My doctrine is not mine, buthis that sent me. If God says this he is a blantant liar. Not truethough. Jesus is his son.
<o> </o>
JN 8:17 It is also written in your law, that the testimony of twomen is true.
JN 8:18 I am onethat bear witness of myself, and theFather that sent me beareth witness of me. There are two. God andhis son. Two witnesses. Couldn’t get any plainer.
<o> </o>
JN 12:49 For I have not spoken ofmyself; but the Father which sent me, hegave me a commandment, what I should say, and what I should speak.God does not give himself commandments.
<o> </o>
JN 14:24 He that loveth me not keepethnot my sayings: and the word which ye hear is not mine, but theFather's which sent me. Uh oh another lie God says that the wordsyou hear are not his. OOPS.
<o> </o>
Sorry you folks have been deceived by the master deceiver, the god of this world,Satan the Devil. You are just following the doctrines of your church and men andare willing to believe anything they say because you are brain washed intothinking that they cant have it wrong. Sry DO!!! have it wrong. Youare following the doctrines of men plain and simple. The Trinity is a blantant lie.
<o> </o>
ACTS 2:22 Ye men of Israel, hear these words; Jesus of Nazareth, aman approved of God among you by miracles and wonders and signs,which God did by(Through,(Check Greek-theword in greek “dia” which means through.) him in the midst of you, as yeyourselves also know(God did all the works throughJesus) His Son!! Makes perfect sense when Christ says he can do nothing of himself. VeryPlain!!!
ACTS 2:23 Him(Jesus),being delivered by the determinate counsel and foreknowledge of God, yehave taken, and by wicked hands have crucified and slain:
ACTS 2:24 Whom God hath raised up,having loosed the pains of death: because it was not possible that he(Jesus) should be holden of it. (Sorry God cannot die. That would make Jesus’sresurrection false and a lie with no meaning at all.
<o> </o>
ACTS 3:6 Then Peter said, Silver and gold have I none; but suchas I have give I thee: In the name of Jesus Christ of Nazareth rise up andwalk.
ACTS 3:7 And he took him by the right hand,and lifted him up: and immediately his feet and ankle bones received strength.
ACTS 3:8 And he leaping up stood, andwalked, and entered with them into the temple, walking, and leaping, andpraising God.
ACTS 3:9 And all the people saw him walking and praising God:
<o> </o>
ACTS 3:12 And when Peter saw it, he answered unto the people, Yemen of Israel, why marvel ye at this? or why look ye so earnestly on us, asthough by our own power or holiness we had made this man to walk?
ACTS 3:13 The God of Abraham, and ofIsaac, and of Jacob, the God of our fathers, hath glorified hisSon Jesus; whom ye delivered up, and denied him in the presence ofPilate, when he was determined to let him go.
<o> </o>
Exodus 3:14 And God said unto Moses, I AM THAT I AM:and he said, Thus shalt thou say unto the children of Israel, I AM hathsent me unto you.
Exodus 3:15 And God said moreover untoMoses, Thus shalt thou say unto the children of Israel, the LORD God of yourfathers, the God of Abraham, the God of Isaac, and the God of Jacob,hath sent me unto you: this is my name for ever, and this is mymemorial unto all generations.
<o> </o>
Hisname is not I am his name is the God of Abraham, the God of Isaac, and the Godof Jacob. The Lord God of our fathers. Forever means FOREVER!! You know its sosimple, Open your eyes and smell the coffee folks. NEW TESTAMENT GOD HAS SAME NAME!!!!!!!!!!!!
<o> </o>
ACTS 7:32 Saying, I am the God of thy fathers, the Godof Abraham, and the God of Isaac, and the God of Jacob. Then Mosestrembled, and durst not behold. (Once againconfirms who the God of the old testament is Jesus is never refered to in thisname. In fact Jesus himself refers to his fathers name the same way. Matt22:31&32 )
<o> </o>
ACTS 9:18 And immediately there fell from his eyes as it had beenscales: and he received sight forthwith, and arose, and was baptized.
ACTS 9:19 And when he had received meat, hewas strengthened. Then was Saul certain days with the disciples which were atDamascus.
ACTS 9:20 And straightway he preachedChrist in the synagogues, that he is the Son of God. (What was the first thing Paul taught? That’s Right!!!)
Hetaught that Jesus was the Son of God, Not God.
You see Satan by the trinity doctrine which is a doctrine of men and not god. Trinity is isnt in the bible anywhere nor any reference in any form to it. If you dont have Christ you dont have a mediator between you and God because you think Jesus was God which by the scriptures I showd before show clearly that is impossible. Look and consider these.
1st John 2:22 Who is a liar but he that denieth that Jesus is the Christ? He is antichrist, that denieth the Father and the Son.
1st John 2:23 Whosoever denieth the Son, the same hath not the Father: he that acknowledgeth the Son hath the Father also.
<o>
1st John 4:15 Whosoever shall confess that Jesus is the Son of God, God dwelleth in him, and he in God. Your not confessing this your confessing that he is God. Not Good.
1st John 5:10 He that believeth on the Son of God hath the witness in himself: he that believeth not God hath made him a liar; because he believeth not the record that God gave of his Son. Do you really want to call God a liar. NOT GOOD!!!
1st John 5:12 He that hath the Son hath life; and he that hath not the Son of God hath not life. IF you dont believe that Jesus is Gods son you dont have life. Said here very plainly. Whos side are you on SAtans Trinity lie or on the side of the God of Abraham and Isaac and Jacob. Your choice.
</o>
Consider these scriptures.
<tt>John 1:18</tt> No man hath seen God at any time; the only begotten Son,which is in the bosom of the Father, he(God) hath declared him.
<tt>1 John 4:12</tt> No man hath seen God at any time. If we love one another,God dwelleth in us, and his love is perfected in us.
<tt>John 5:37</tt> And the Father himself, which hathsent me, hath borne witness of me. Ye have neither heard his voice at any time, nor seenhis shape. So as you can see no one has seen God at anytime, orheard his voice, nor seen his shape. (JESUS IS NOT GOD. If it is god you haveseen god.) Jesus isanother being. He’s is of the exact same mind as his father, thus they are one.Same essence.
But letskeep going. Lets get even more witnesses.
LK 2:40 And the child grew, and waxed strong in spirit, filled withwisdom: and the grace of God was upon him.
LK 2:52 And Jesus increased in wisdom and stature, and infavour with God and man.
God increase in wisdom and stature with himself and man? I mean that isso ridiculous it doesn’t even merit a response.
<o
> </o>JN 5:30 I can of mine own self donothing: as I hear, I judge: and my judgmentis just; because I seek not mine own will, but the will of the Fatherwhich hath sent me. A blantant lie if this is God Almighty.
<o
> </o>JN 7:16 Jesus answered them, and said, My doctrine is not mine, buthis that sent me. If God says this he is a blantant liar. Not truethough. Jesus is his son.
<o
> </o>JN 8:17 It is also written in your law, that the testimony of twomen is true.
JN 8:18 I am onethat bear witness of myself, and theFather that sent me beareth witness of me. There are two. God andhis son. Two witnesses. Couldn’t get any plainer.
<o
> </o>JN 12:49 For I have not spoken ofmyself; but the Father which sent me, hegave me a commandment, what I should say, and what I should speak.God does not give himself commandments.
<o
> </o>JN 14:24 He that loveth me not keepethnot my sayings: and the word which ye hear is not mine, but theFather's which sent me. Uh oh another lie God says that the wordsyou hear are not his. OOPS.
<o
> </o>Sorry you folks have been deceived by the master deceiver, the god of this world,Satan the Devil. You are just following the doctrines of your church and men andare willing to believe anything they say because you are brain washed intothinking that they cant have it wrong. Sry DO!!! have it wrong. Youare following the doctrines of men plain and simple. The Trinity is a blantant lie.
<o
> </o>ACTS 2:22 Ye men of Israel, hear these words; Jesus of Nazareth, aman approved of God among you by miracles and wonders and signs,which God did by(Through,(Check Greek-theword in greek “dia” which means through.) him in the midst of you, as yeyourselves also know(God did all the works throughJesus) His Son!! Makes perfect sense when Christ says he can do nothing of himself. VeryPlain!!!
ACTS 2:23 Him(Jesus),being delivered by the determinate counsel and foreknowledge of God, yehave taken, and by wicked hands have crucified and slain:
ACTS 2:24 Whom God hath raised up,having loosed the pains of death: because it was not possible that he(Jesus) should be holden of it. (Sorry God cannot die. That would make Jesus’sresurrection false and a lie with no meaning at all.
<o
> </o>ACTS 3:6 Then Peter said, Silver and gold have I none; but suchas I have give I thee: In the name of Jesus Christ of Nazareth rise up andwalk.
ACTS 3:7 And he took him by the right hand,and lifted him up: and immediately his feet and ankle bones received strength.
ACTS 3:8 And he leaping up stood, andwalked, and entered with them into the temple, walking, and leaping, andpraising God.
ACTS 3:9 And all the people saw him walking and praising God:
<o
> </o>ACTS 3:12 And when Peter saw it, he answered unto the people, Yemen of Israel, why marvel ye at this? or why look ye so earnestly on us, asthough by our own power or holiness we had made this man to walk?
ACTS 3:13 The God of Abraham, and ofIsaac, and of Jacob, the God of our fathers, hath glorified hisSon Jesus; whom ye delivered up, and denied him in the presence ofPilate, when he was determined to let him go.
<o
> </o>Exodus 3:14 And God said unto Moses, I AM THAT I AM:and he said, Thus shalt thou say unto the children of Israel, I AM hathsent me unto you.
Exodus 3:15 And God said moreover untoMoses, Thus shalt thou say unto the children of Israel, the LORD God of yourfathers, the God of Abraham, the God of Isaac, and the God of Jacob,hath sent me unto you: this is my name for ever, and this is mymemorial unto all generations.
<o
> </o>Hisname is not I am his name is the God of Abraham, the God of Isaac, and the Godof Jacob. The Lord God of our fathers. Forever means FOREVER!! You know its sosimple, Open your eyes and smell the coffee folks. NEW TESTAMENT GOD HAS SAME NAME!!!!!!!!!!!!
<o
> </o>ACTS 7:32 Saying, I am the God of thy fathers, the Godof Abraham, and the God of Isaac, and the God of Jacob. Then Mosestrembled, and durst not behold. (Once againconfirms who the God of the old testament is Jesus is never refered to in thisname. In fact Jesus himself refers to his fathers name the same way. Matt22:31&32 )
<o
> </o>ACTS 9:18 And immediately there fell from his eyes as it had beenscales: and he received sight forthwith, and arose, and was baptized.
ACTS 9:19 And when he had received meat, hewas strengthened. Then was Saul certain days with the disciples which were atDamascus.
ACTS 9:20 And straightway he preachedChrist in the synagogues, that he is the Son of God. (What was the first thing Paul taught? That’s Right!!!)
Hetaught that Jesus was the Son of God, Not God.
You see Satan by the trinity doctrine which is a doctrine of men and not god. Trinity is isnt in the bible anywhere nor any reference in any form to it. If you dont have Christ you dont have a mediator between you and God because you think Jesus was God which by the scriptures I showd before show clearly that is impossible. Look and consider these.
1st John 2:22 Who is a liar but he that denieth that Jesus is the Christ? He is antichrist, that denieth the Father and the Son.
1st John 2:23 Whosoever denieth the Son, the same hath not the Father: he that acknowledgeth the Son hath the Father also.
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> 1st John 4:15 Whosoever shall confess that Jesus is the Son of God, God dwelleth in him, and he in God. Your not confessing this your confessing that he is God. Not Good.
1st John 5:10 He that believeth on the Son of God hath the witness in himself: he that believeth not God hath made him a liar; because he believeth not the record that God gave of his Son. Do you really want to call God a liar. NOT GOOD!!!
1st John 5:12 He that hath the Son hath life; and he that hath not the Son of God hath not life. IF you dont believe that Jesus is Gods son you dont have life. Said here very plainly. Whos side are you on SAtans Trinity lie or on the side of the God of Abraham and Isaac and Jacob. Your choice.
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>@marcus. I think you are mixing the office of Jesus up and Jesus as God. Mathew 4:7 clearly states jesus calling Himself God. Also, John 3:16.........Those who believe "in Him" may not perish. So, what is "In Him"? This takes us to col 2:9 The fullness of the deity lies in Jesus Christ in bodily form.
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Rev T.S.Perkins
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I was alaways taught to read the verse before and after to get the full context , if you look at verse 6 of mathew 4 you find that satan Adresses and confirms Christ as the SON of God not God himself , in verse 7 Christ takes a third party answer to satans challenge that even the SON OF GOD Is not above the written word of His Father ...it was not spoken as dont tempt me as suggested .....Rev
Rev T.S.Perkins
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In John 1:18 it speaks of no one seeing God but Christ has declared His Heavenly Father to men ! ....Christ didnt come in His own athouity but in that of His Heavnly Father God almighty above ...he ascended to heaven and sets on the right hand of His father awaiting God to tell Him when to collect his children ....Rev
Rev. Who says I didn't read the verse before or after? I am not cherry picking here and Jesus IS the Son of God but is God also. Jesus isn't above the writen word of the Father Jesus is the written word of the Father when the word became flesh. I think we will always disagree here as Jesus isn't sticking upfor His dad here He is telling the tempter that He is Godvery clearly. The Father initiates, the Son complies and the Holy Spirit executes.
@Rev John 1:18............Yes, even Jesus doesn't know the appointed time and this looks hierarchical and is but not in a sense as that of in a business environment. It is compliance. Jesus is begotten which means "Of the same cell". Jesus Christ is God also and col 2:9 shows us this to.
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