Is gay marriage really that bad?

wayward_thought · Dec 28, 2012

It's no secret that Christians around the world are in opposition to gay marriage. A lot of them quote the line Lev 18:22 "Though shalt not lie with man-kind, as with womankind: it is abomination." However Lev 11:7-8 says "And the swine, though he divide the hoof, and be clovenfooted, yet he cheweth not the cud; he is unclean to you. Of their flesh shall ye not eat, and their carcase shall ye not touch; they are unclean to you." So finally my question is why do modern day Christians eat pork yet protest gay marriage?

SpiritLedEd · Dec 28, 2012

wayward_thought said:
So finally my question is why do modern day Christians eat pork yet protest gay marriage?

The phrase "a pig in slop" speaks to the health hazards of pork consumption for the ancient Israelites; pigs are ultra-dirty animals. Modern science has all but eliminated those dangers. As to marriage, God's way has a dual purpose - relationship AND procreation. Gay couples cannot procreate

Spirit Led Ed (SLE)

wayward_thought · Dec 28, 2012

A man gets his privates cut off in a car accident. Should he be allowed to get married?

wayward_thought · Dec 29, 2012

What about people who can't reproduce for other reasons?

DutchChristian · Dec 29, 2012

What a strange question you have there, as how does eating something relate to sexual sin?

And hold on now for a moment... there is no such thing as a gay marriage in the first place: as God does not accept it as a legit marriage covenant in the first place.

it is unholy and a very unnatural practice, it is in fact a separation of two men together with the devil himself, in which together they agreed upon signing for the immediate
DEATH penalty.

it is so sad! the devil has got them so deceived, thinking that gay supposedly would mean: "joy and happiness" and so turning that which is evil and bitter darkness to appear as if to be good and honest and so making the good appear to be evil.

And there is far more aids and HIV disease with homosexual men then any other sin, you may wonder why..

Also Sodom and Gomorrah was completely destroyed,

Unnatural and unholy, mocking the Creator of All things who is HOLY and Gave marriage as a good thing. but now instead: gay marriage has opposed that which is good and natural into an unnatural practice and habit which always leads to DEATH and being gay is not natural at all and gay people are not born that way, they are possessed with a demon of lust and wickedness they let themselves go and freely defile themselves between eachother.

But the good news is:

if they would only repent and believe the Gospel, they can be Saved and Healed completely by The Lord Jesus Christ!

wayward_thought · Dec 29, 2012

Ok then, how about homosexual marriage in legal terms, where a couple can earn the same legal benefits as other married couples without considering it a Christian marriage per say but a marriage more of their understanding. Is it wrong to allow this sort of thing to happen legally speaking in the land of the free?

DutchChristian · Dec 29, 2012

wayward_thought said:
Ok then, how about homosexual marriage in legal terms, where a couple can earn the same legal benefits as other married couples without considering it a Christian marriage per say but a marriage more of their understanding. Is it wrong to allow this sort of thing to happen legally speaking in the land of the free?

Yes its is wrong.

The world has gotten so polluted. All homosexual "marriage" is of the devil, it can never be good and also it can never be good spoken about.

This whole world lies in darkness, and governments have gotten corrupted with evil too.

If the government says it is now good and allowed to steal up to 10 dollars and murder, does this then mean it then still allowed?

No it is not allowed.

wayward_thought · Dec 29, 2012

What exactly is the basis for thinking gay marriage is bad? What wrong could possibly befall anyone not involved by simply letting people make their own decisions?

DutchChristian · Dec 29, 2012

wayward_thought said:
What exactly is the basis for thinking gay marriage is bad? What wrong could possibly befall anyone not involved by simply letting people make their own decisions?

mr. Wayward thought,

are you promoting wickedness?

Wayward =

1. Given to or marked by willful, often perverse deviation from what is desired, expected, or required in order to gratify one's own impulses or inclinations.

2. Swayed or prompted by caprice; unpredictable.

1. wanting to have one's own way regardless of the wishes or good of others

2. capricious, erratic, or unpredictable

resistant to guidance or discipline; self-willed and rebellious.

mr. Wayward thought, listen repent today! and believe the Gospel. lest you alltogether die in your own wayward thought !

John 14:
6 Jesus saith unto him, I am the Way, the Truth, and the Life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by Me.

rizen1 · Dec 29, 2012

Wayward why do people from your camp of thought always ( you can search the Internet or this site) when it comes to the topic of homosexuality eating pork is used comparatively?
Surely with some bible study your question would have more essence. I would suggest you study the bible because nothing anyone says here will make sense. You're asking a biblical question with no biblical foundation. If I'm wrong and you do have a solid hold on the scriptures, I would suggest taking some time out to read.You will understand why the questions you ask makes no sense. It comes off as a weak argument in hope to validate something instead of search for truth. Cherry picking 2 verses from a book Makes me not take your question serious. Not to cause you any shock but there are Christians who don't eat pork. Generalizing all Christians show you did not do your homework. To answer your simple question, I'll give a simple answer.

The old testament condemns both.
New testament still Condems sexual behavior outside marriage, the topic of marriage man and woman is used, it's described as having unnatural desires. Concerning food you'll find, everything God created is good, and nothing is to be rejected if it is received with thanksgiving. I would give you the verses but I want you to search the scriptures yourself.

In summary old testament says no to both
New testament contains verses that opens up the " choice" when it comes to food, as for gay marriage I did not find any verses that went against the old testament, or contradicts leaving room for question.

Cherry picking is never good when it comes to the word of God. I would suggest using a new age " holy book" to answer your true questions of validations. The Holy Bible is never going to give you the answer you seek.

DutchChristian · Dec 29, 2012

The HOLY BIBLE is the True and Living Word of GOD and Has all the answers for anyone that would seek.

John 17:
17 Sanctify them through Thy truth: Thy word is truth.

O Praise Him!

Hallelujah Glory be to GOD Jesus Christ is Lord AMEN

Hebrews 4:
12 For the word of God is quick, and powerful, and sharper than any twoedged sword, piercing even to the dividing asunder of soul and spirit, and of the joints and marrow, and is a discerner of the thoughts and intents of the heart.

wayward_thought · Dec 29, 2012

The only point I mean to make by cherry-picking scriptures is to bring to light the fact that in today's society many Christians are quick to judge others in how they should act in their lives by quoting a well known scripture and then ignoring the many others that they themselves commit. I believe Jesus made a parable one time about taking the plank out of your own eye so that you may see clearly to remove the spec from your brothers. I see so many Christians and politicians alike slamming gay marriage and it is honest one thing I really do not understand about being a good Christian. Is there something in the new testament that allows one to eat what they will with acknowledgement of the old scriptures yet holds true to the sins of homosexuality? If I did a little quick research I can find that yes, Corinthians and also Romans dable in this area, yet it is more vague and not as straightforward as the old testament.

Furthermore, I oppose not exactly your own opinions that this behavior is bad (you have all certainly raised many good points, I appreciate the courtesy and I will not forget things such as HIV statistics) but I rather propose that in the case of American laws, I see no reason why they should be involved in other peoples lives based on the opinions posted here by yourselves and many others whom share your opinions. I believe in a country where people can live under the bill of rights as they were originally written, including such things as freedom of religion. Until such time as homosexuality is shown to endanger the well being of others whom are not involved I see any attempt to outlaw practices based solely on Christian teachings to be not only in opposition to those whom are not Christian but also a way of giving good hearted folks like yourselves a bad reputation.

Finally a reply to Mr. Dutch: I thank you for your concern of my rebellious behavior. I would like you and everyone else to know that I do not come here to spread wickedness but instead to question the manor with which Christians in hopes that we can all learn more about each other, morals, philosophy, and even scripture. I chose my username as a way to say "open minded" and to remind myself that thoughts lead to actions and that in order for our actions to be just we must often stop and question the thoughts that provoke them. I do not intend to die altogether with my wickedness but rather achieve a greater understanding through polite question asking and rational debate.

DutchChristian · Dec 29, 2012

Hello,

There is no time for debate on non-debatable issue's;

simply what is wrong is wrong and what is good is good.

Let your focus rather be on this:

Mark 1
15 And saying, The time is fulfilled, and the Kingdom of God is at hand: repent ye, and believe the Gospel.

wayward_thought · Dec 29, 2012

DutchChristian said:
Hello,

There is no time for debate on non-debatable issue's;

simply what is wrong is wrong and what is good is good.

Let your focus rather be on this:

Mark 1
15 And saying, The time is fulfilled, and the Kingdom of God is at hand: repent ye, and believe the Gospel.

Without debate, how do you know what is right and wrong?

DutchChristian · Dec 29, 2012

wayward_thought said:
Without debate, how do you know what is right and wrong?

By the Spirit of Truth, by the WORD of GOD.

Hallelujah it is True GOD is True and He is Risen and ALIVE

Hallelujah!

Matthew 26:
64 Jesus saith unto him, Thou hast said: nevertheless I say unto you, Hereafter shall ye see the Son of man sitting on the right hand of power, and coming in the clouds of heaven.

amanda123 · Dec 29, 2012

Wayward

Why?

Are you gay?

Are you saved with sexuality problems?

Are you justt a troubel stirrer?

You are demading honest answers frlom people here and keep questioning

What about you?

Brad Huber · Dec 29, 2012

wayward_thought said:
Without debate, how do you know what is right and wrong?

The true answer of an aethist proffessional debator. How many of your type infiltrates the christian world, and why is it you fear us so, that you would be filled with the deception that you accuse us of?

wayward_thought · Dec 29, 2012

Amanda: I am not homosexual. According to your doctrines I am not saved from my sexual sins because I choose to have protected sex with girlfriends whom I am not married to. I come here not to stir trouble but to promote a more free nation for my future children, my friends, and even my gay friends to live in.

Brad: Slight correction, I'm agnostic not atheist. I don't know how many infiltrate your world but I can tell you what it is we fear. We fear a world where religious values of any sort become the only means or approaching moral dilemmas To all of you that world probably sounds like paradise because Christian values overtake all the evil in the world you see. Allow me to demonstrate what parts of that I do not like: People who become so engrossed in their beliefs that it becomes less about God, love and spirituality and becomes more about control. See there are a lot of people in this world who have different views than you. I do not see those who disagree with my evil by nature, but I do see some of them who would allow their fears of God push them to tell other people how to live their lives, hence I fear the Christian who would infiltrate my free open minded world.

I hope I have not said anything to offend anyone. I do my best to speak with the utmost level of respect.

wayward_thought · Dec 29, 2012

Perhaps what I do is make a proposal that would agree with Christian values 100% (or 99 if I err) We all know that God wants us to love another and homosexuals always remind you that its not fair to judge, so how about do those things. From your point of view are homosexuals the enemy to your belief, or people in need. Do you think it is more important to fear sin or to love one another? My proposal is to take a brake from ridiculing homosexuals and maybe get to know one. Tell them up front that you are a follower of the holy trinity and that you have not come to judge them but rather to bond with them. Get to know them a little and see what their motivations are. Perhaps they are addicted to physical pleasure, perhaps there is a significant other they do not want to lose. Try to understand the way they see things. After that is done, let them know you are concerned, and ask if they would like to know more about Jesus (whom personally never said anything about gays) My point is, isn't Christianity about helping those who are in your views in need and not hating them?

Christ4Ever · Dec 29, 2012

wayward_thought said:
It's no secret that Christians around the world are in opposition to gay marriage. A lot of them quote the line Lev 18:22 "Though shalt not lie with man-kind, as with womankind: it is abomination." However Lev 11:7-8 says "And the swine, though he divide the hoof, and be clovenfooted, yet he cheweth not the cud; he is unclean to you. Of their flesh shall ye not eat, and their carcase shall ye not touch; they are unclean to you." So finally my question is why do modern day Christians eat pork yet protest gay marriage?

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Don't know if you're searching, trying to reconnect, or just trolling. Regardless of the reason, I pray that you may find love, peace, and understanding that can only be found by believing and accepting the Lord Jesus Christ as your Savior.

Interesting subject to tackle, from an agnostic yet understandable. You well know that attempting to figure out what makes something tick from outside looking in is pretty much valueless, when inspiration, revelation (A believers tools to truly understanding.), are needed to see the truth of a particular subject, especially difficult when the very same things you need for comprehension are not self generated.

Understand this subject is not the first time that an agnostic, or atheist, or professing believer, has brought up the subject on TJ. Whenever the subject of "morality" is brought up, it can't help to go in this direction, even if the intent was to engage for the purpose of receiving further clarification on some scriptural point. This has always been the case when Christianity comes against the hedonism of the world, which is of the mind that "If its pleasurable, doesn't hurt anyone else, then why not accept it or at the very least ignore it?" Then the inscrutable mind of the Christian steps in!

The concept of sin or perfection is foreign to the World. This would require a basis of right and wrong to be formulated, which then means someone has to be right or someone has to be wrong. Not too bad when dealing with laws instituted by man, but quite the issue when they are of God. Man's law which can be adapted, changed to allow for the evolving mores of the society, yet impossible when dealing with God's law which is immutable, and Rock solid and not governed by the whims of man.

This is frustrating for a self-realized individual to deal with. Normally makes no sense at all, and winds up making the enlightened person frown upon those zealots who would believe otherwise, especially since the foundation of this belief is questionable at best and of a specific religion which speaks of "my way or the highway" to boot!

Scripture is well governed that homosexuality or lesbianism is a sin. Believe it or not, so is stealing, murder, suicide etc. Here in is the problem that you are faced with. The bible is pretty straight forward when it comes to these things, as the world is well aware of. This then requires it to be handled differently. Lying is wrong, but a white lie? No so much so. Stealing is wrong, but if it's done to help a starving family? Murder is wrong, but if it's to save untold number of people? What you are seeing wayward, is man justifying sinful acts as defined by God, to accommodate a behavior that benefits the person, regardless if it is inherently corruptible to the person doing them. If a crack can be made where these sinful actions are now sanctioned, then any stigma attached to this behavior must go the way of the square wheel. Just a foot note in history. This of cause does not include God, His People, or His Word. The World will say, just give me a little more time, and that too will change. That will fail, unless they too become outlawed, persecuted to change (Give it time.), but hey, who said man in general had any sense?

The point to all this is, if you don't believe in the Bible, or in Christ Jesus as your savior, then the question is truly irrelevant to you. It becomes more of proving the fallacy of a belief system that is untenable by man, because it is governed by nonsense/irrational set of laws that hold no validity to me as a person, even though something deep inside of me still begs to ask the question.

What if they're right? What if God truly wants to know me personally, and not as some abstract creation? Then when these questions come around you start with....Why would God want to know me? How could I ever be worthy of His attention? I've done so many wrong things in my life, why, why, why?

You might know the why, but for whatever reason, you've come to a conclusion that it's lacking something. Still looking from the outside in.

Faith is not about knowing everything first (Which you won't.) then taking the step. It's really about taking the step in faith first, then coming to that understanding and knowing afterwards!!!!!!! That first step is a doozy, but you'll never be the same for having taken it!

The testimonies of my brothers & sisters in Christ here at TJ, are perfect examples of the variety ways they've come to know Christ Jesus as their Savior. They have come from different walks of life, physically, mentally, financial, educationally, but all have that One in common, with everyone else. They've taken that step. Praying that one day you too, will share that commonality that is not common at all, the testimony to of that step, with others here at TJ, and those you come across in your walk about Christ Jesus my Lord, my Savior, my God. In Jesus name I pray for you wayward. Amen

C4E
Mark 8:36 For what shall it profit a man, if he shall gain the whole world, and lose his own soul?

Is gay marriage really that bad?

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