Do we have to go to church?

[Hisalone]

I have been away from these boards for a little bit now and have just recently returned. I have been surrounded by other brothers and sisters in Christ, nevertheless, I have been alone. I have been severly convicted of the Holy Spirit for my religious ways. I have always been a tither since I became Christian, up until recently. I have always gone to church every Sunday and sometimes on Wednesdays. I have had all the appearances of a Christian in strong relationship with the Lord, and this is what I believed about myself.

I then began really studying the Word of God on my own, spending time in prayer for direction, etc. and recently I have felt the conviction of my own self satisfying actions where my life as a child of God is concerned. I feel now that I am going to church for the wrong reasons.

I will first say that the pastor is truly a man after God's own heart, and I do what I can to minister edification, comfort, and exhortation when in the presence of the other members. But understand that I have gained a strong foundation and I fail to see the necessity to remain going to church. I will confess right now in front of the congregation at talkjesus that I go now simply to keep up appearances. I have close brothers who attend. My parents now attend along with my sister and her family. The pastor is actually the husband of my late aunt, and the list of relationships goes on. But all these relationships pale in comparison to the relationship I should be having with Jesus Christ and my obedience to Him. I am being led to leave the church for many reasons, but the main reason being that I am held back from the Lord's will in my life by not taking this leap of faith.

I understand that it will be the opinion of many that one must attend regular services to fulfill part of one's duty as a Christian, but I have studied this subject in depth. Everytime I feel the leading of the Holy Spirit, I always check it against the Word of God. Upon studying whether I should be part of a "government recognized" church if you will, I have failed to find any scriptural evidence that I am being deceived by any seducing spirits or my own imaginations.

So I bring it to those of you here. Do we have to go to church? What does the evidence from scripture suggest to all of you?

Hisalone

 

[Laudite]

I have been away from these boards for a little bit now and have just recently returned. I have been surrounded by other brothers and sisters in Christ, nevertheless, I have been alone. I have been severly convicted of the Holy Spirit for my religious ways. I have always been a tither since I became Christian, up until recently. I have always gone to church every Sunday and sometimes on Wednesdays. I have had all the appearances of a Christian in strong relationship with the Lord, and this is what I believed about myself.

I then began really studying the Word of God on my own, spending time in prayer for direction, etc. and recently I have felt the conviction of my own self satisfying actions where my life as a child of God is concerned. I feel now that I am going to church for the wrong reasons.

I will first say that the pastor is truly a man after God's own heart, and I do what I can to minister edification, comfort, and exhortation when in the presence of the other members. But understand that I have gained a strong foundation and I fail to see the necessity to remain going to church. I will confess right now in front of the congregation at talkjesus that I go now simply to keep up appearances. I have close brothers who attend. My parents now attend along with my sister and her family. The pastor is actually the husband of my late aunt, and the list of relationships goes on. But all these relationships pale in comparison to the relationship I should be having with Jesus Christ and my obedience to Him. I am being led to leave the church for many reasons, but the main reason being that I am held back from the Lord's will in my life by not taking this leap of faith.

I understand that it will be the opinion of many that one must attend regular services to fulfill part of one's duty as a Christian, but I have studied this subject in depth. Everytime I feel the leading of the Holy Spirit, I always check it against the Word of God. Upon studying whether I should be part of a "government recognized" church if you will, I have failed to find any scriptural evidence that I am being deceived by any seducing spirits or my own imaginations.

So I bring it to those of you here. Do we have to go to church? What does the evidence from scripture suggest to all of you?

Hisalone

Happy friday, brother. I guess it's best to start with the scripture

"For where two or three are gathered in my name, I am there among them." (Matthew 18:20)

Matthew 26:

[26] And as they were eating, Jesus took bread, and blessed it, and brake it, and gave it to the disciples, and said, Take, eat; this is my body.
[27] And he took the cup, and gave thanks, and gave it to them, saying, Drink ye all of it;
[28] For this is my blood of the new testament, which is shed for many for the remission of sins.

There's more, but I'm afraid that I'm short on time. Consider how many examples there are of men alone in their faith- John the Baptist comes to mind, but these men were special, and lived apart from society alltogether. Now consider all the times that Paul emphasises the importance of harmonious christian community, or Christ refers to his flock.

 

[Chad]

I believe the main purpose of the church is to join together as a body in fellowship. To edify each other, teach each other, pray for and with each other and of course, to worship GOD in Jesus' name together.

 

[Hisalone]

Thank you both for your responses.

Laudite said:

There's more, but I'm afraid that I'm short on time. Consider how many examples there are of men alone in their faith- John the Baptist comes to mind, but these men were special, and lived apart from society alltogether. Now consider all the times that Paul emphasises the importance of harmonious christian community, or Christ refers to his flock.

I'd love to see some expansion to this idea if you ever have more time. These are good points. Even though I do attend church, I still feel as though I am a man alone in my faith. Do I have the ministry of a John the Baptist? No, obviously not.

Chad said:

I believe the main purpose of the church is to join together as a body in fellowship. To edify each other, teach each other, pray for and with each other and of course, to worship GOD in Jesus' name together.

I agree completely, but perhaps my question was a bit unclear. I am talking about the church referring to the building, the state recognized institution, the charitable programs that go along with it, etc. I am not referring to the church as the Body of Christ. The question is does scripture support the idea that I have to be a member of one of these organizations and attend regular services in order to edify each other, teach each other, pray for and with each other and of course, to worship GOD in Jesus' name together? In other words, if I have brothers and sisters in Christ I meet with outside the four walls of such an institution and we break bread and engage in this kind of fellowship, am I still following the New Testement principles of gathering and communion? I believe that I would be and that's what my convictions are.

Hisalone

 

[mounty]

I dont have a church to go to brother, but i see Talk Jesus as my church, i have all i need here, wonderful fellowship, amazing brothers and sisters, and wonderful posts and threads to study from.

God Bless and Much Love xoxoxoxoxoxoxx

 

[Hisalone]

mounty said:

I dont have a church to go to brother, but i see Talk Jesus as my church, i have all i need here, wonderful fellowship, amazing brothers and sisters, and wonderful posts and threads to study from.

God Bless and Much Love xoxoxoxoxoxoxx

Interesting you say this. I have heard a pastor throw out a statistic about how many people "go to church online." He voiced the fact in a rather demeaning tone. I questioned that tone. Where is the scripture to support the idea that one must be IN a church building to be in proper fellowship? After all, there is no distance in the spirit. I see no problem with this. The True Church of Jesus Christ has no earthly walls. On the same token, if your only face of Christianity is seen online and not by those you encounter physically on a daily basis, that would be a problem. Nevertheless, because your main source of fellowship is online does not make you any less of a Child of God, nor are you out of communion with the true Congregation of the Firstborn.

In Christ

Hisalone.

 

[cpinet]

I understand what you are saying Brother.

"For where two or three are gathered in my name, I am there among them." (Matthew 18:20)

This particular scripture also comes to mind, but I feel in a different way then it was stated above. I talk with several of my on line friends everyday and we are always Praising and worshiping the Lord during our conversations. The Lord said where there are two or three gathered together, but no where does He say "in a building,under one roof, at a specific time each week". My husband and I both study the Bible and Pray and Praise God together. But we don't go to a building to do it. If you and a friend are worshiping together you are having church. For the Lord is there.

God's church is NOT a building. When Peter or Paul gathered together to teach the Gospel they were in fields, town squares, peoples homes and many other places. The early church ( and some churchs in other nations) were held in secret places for fear of persecution and death. As the Apostles traveled they held church everyday as they walked. THE "Church" is the Body of Christ. We are to up hold one another, pray together, help each other. But isn't that what we are doing on here? Isn't that what we do every time someone calls and asks for prayer and help? Isn't that what we are doing when we listen to a Pastor on T.V. and pray with him?

For any man to truly be outside the "church" so to speak he would have to lock himself away from everyone. Never speak of Jesus to anyone, never pray for someone else. Even John the Baptist had followers who believed as he did. He was to me he was the First Preacher of the New Testament for he taught of the coming of Jesus, he baptized, he preached of sinning and repentance. He showed the way to God to many of the first Christians.

So I feel that NO we are not to shut ourselves away from other Christians. Or try to make it all on our own. But NO we don't have to attend a "building" or specific denomination every Sunday to be considered going to Church (except in Man's eyes). Go with your heart. If you are wrong the Lord will let you know, he is good at that.

 

[stephen]

Hisalone.

Bless you chum and I thank you for sharing your thoughts.

The U.S.of A. was built upon the Judo/Christian basis, as was the U.K. As a result the 'West' we see today with its freedom ....etc. we enjoy. Other nations were not so fortunate.

There was a point in history when gospel preachers desired to go north, towards Russia, but were restrained by God. As a result the Christian message came West, yes where we are. THe 'West' prospered as a result of biblical teaching about the LOrd God Almighty.

Today other 'faiths' seem to be preferred to faith in Jesus, Jesus who died and rose again to save us.


"Do we have to go to church"?

Do you want to see the Western Nations succumb to 'other faiths' Ideologies which seek to destroy? Surely not

Go to a Church which lifts up Jesus, and know His blessing.....Nothing has changes,,,,,in Jesus

God Bless

 

[Hisalone]

cpinet said:

When Peter or Paul gathered together to teach the Gospel they were in fields, town squares, peoples homes and many other places. The early church ( and some churchs in other nations) were held in secret places for fear of persecution and death. As the Apostles traveled they held church everyday as they walked.

And this is the time when the Church turned the world upside down. It was during a time of publically accepted persecution, torture, and being put to death for professing Christ Jesus. The Gospel was taken to the streets, the fields, the homes, and it was put on display for the world to see. This is the ministry I feel I am being led towards. Outside the four walls of the building. I am not here to convince anyone they should do the same, especially if that is not their calling. God forbid me to lead someone away from His purposes in one's life. I am just interested in hearing what others have to say.


Stephen said:

"Do we have to go to church"?

Do you want to see the Western Nations succumb to 'other faiths' Ideologies which seek to destroy? Surely not

Thank you as well for your thoughts. My apologies if it sounds as if I am trying to "destroy" the church. I'd like to see some of the words I posted which give you this impression. What are some of these other faiths' ideologies that I seem to be promoting?

Go to a Church which lifts up Jesus, and know His blessing.....Nothing has changes,,,,,in Jesus

God Bless

I still agree completely with this instruction. My question is your context. When you say go to a Church (capital C), that to me says be a part of a congregation/assembly (ekklesia) that lifts up Jesus. One of His blessings is the relationships we have with one another here on earth. That, in my opinion, is truly prospering in the blessings God has to offer through His Son Jesus Christ.

Be blessed.

Hisalone

 

[SpiritLedEd]

I understand that it will be the opinion of many that one must attend regular services to fulfill part of one's duty as a Christian

I grew up in a denomination where it was preached that attendance at Sunday services was required; that failure to attend without a sufficient reason (personal illness or family emergency) was a sin. I am so grateful to God that He pulled me out of that denomination and put me in a church organization where I could freely worship and learn.

I no longer feel that I HAVE to go to church services. However, I find that sitting at the feet of a living, breathing preacher who loves God with all his heart and having face-to-face fellowship with other believers at weekly services, special events, and small group meetings is essential to my Christian growth. My life is enriched because I am challenged to become more Christlike through relationships with people that I can see and touch who are also moving in that direction.

Don't get me wrong. I'm not saying that participating in this forum has little or no value. On the contray, God is doing a work through this site and I'm proud to be part of it. I am, however, saying that my love for the Lord and for His church is fired primarily by face-to-face relationships in my church community in my town. Ninety percent of what I have been able to share with other believers on this site to edify them did not come from the internet, it came from the mouth of my pastor or one of my face-to-face mentors at my church.

SLE

 

[Mike Scott]

Hi HisAlone
I have been through a variety of situations which had me on both sides of the fence.

As far as my spiritual walk side, my growth usually came from the Holy Spirit revealing nuggets from scripture. Which is apart from the church body. Yet with those nuggets that were revealed to me I would then share them with others in the church and they would help me in the refining and fine tuning. Due to the fact I don't always interpret correctly what He was revealing. This protected me from the philosophy and bible of Mike being the only way.

I tried to stay away and found that through e-mail / facebook / etc... it was never the same as sharing your excitement / sorrows / anger etc.... With the fellowship of believers sharing your emotions and seeing their emotions visually is a whole different world than having a bunch of smiley faces showing your emotions for you.

As you get the jest, I am back into fellowship and loving the fact it is something you have to work at.
The only perfect church your ever going to find is one that has no people in it.
People ruin perfection. Go figure!!!!!
May the good Lord continue to guide you on your quest.
I do love the family of Talk Jesus. I know that there is guidance just beyond the post quick reply tab.
God Bless Ya
Mike
aka grizzly for Christ

 

[jiggyfly]

The problem is most think that in order to have fellowship you must attend some form of religious liturgy. This is however far from the truth. Hebrews 10:25 states that we need to assemble or come together but it does not state that it must be in a religious meeting and there must be a preacher or pastor there. It could be bowling night, a day at the park, in walmart's parking lot or in someone's living room. If it is two or three gathered in Jesus' name with Jesus in the midst than I know of some religious gatherings that don't qualify because they gather in the name of their group or denomination. Let's get real.

 

[cpinet]

Mar 16:15 And he said unto them, Go ye into all the world, and preach the gospel to every creature.

That is one of the last commands that Jesus gave to us. How do you do that sitting in a pew every Sunday? I have actually learned more About our Lord and Saviour by digging in my concordance and searching the Bible looking for the answer to a question I have or someone has asked me, then I have sitting a pew listening to a Pastor.

Don't get me wrong there is Nothing wrong with going to church. If that is what someone is comfortible doing and it's what they need that is Great. But no one has a right to tell anyone else that they aren't doing it right if they don't attend a church either.

The best part about gathering together in the park or parking lot some where or even in someone's home is the Church doctrine doesn't over shadow everything you talk about.
If you are the one doing the talking and YOU let the Holy Spirit guide you then you are doing what Jesus said to do.

We can all find scripture that says Yes you should gather together. But NO one can find scripture that says it has to be in a building, every Sunday. We should fellowship with other brothers and sisters Everyday. That is the rights that the world is trying to take away from us, by demanding bibles be taken out of work places and prayers be taken out of schools. With all the "churches" in this country NONE have stopped them from doing this. They will let toothless lions congregate all they want to because they know they can do no harm. But when one lion grows teeth and starts fighting back by spreading the word even in the work place they are put down. Because none of the other lions can/will stop the attack.

 

[ushalk]

i think a very strong point to make in this is not that we attend a "church". rather that we stay focused in christ and keep fellowship with other brothers and sisters in christ. we do not have to go to a church for this.

after all church buildings are not the church. rather the church is all those that have accepted jesus christ as lord and saviour, repented of their sins and have been baptized in his name.

not to mention that government recognized churches are no longer preaching the true gospel.

his alone i believe that the holy spirit has convicted you of going to these churches perhaps not only for your heart set but also because of the worldly role that many churches have taken up in order to become the popular guy and all the great busynesses that churches have become.

i believe that there are many reasons why the lord would not want you in theses churches today. however i also believe that you stick with the christian brothers and sisters that you have been around.the word of god states very clearly that we need brothers and sisters to help us stand strong and keep our heads above the water. plus many other reasons. you are not going to find one scripture that states for anyone to go to a church building, denomination, busyness etc....

just my 2 cents.

 

[Mirjam]

I don't think about church as something I have to go to now I'm a Christian.

But I really want to go !!! I really like it and look forward to Sunday morning now. So I can go to church and sing songs about GOD, Lord Jesus and the Holy Spirit. And hear about the Bible and talk to other Christians. Sunday morning is my favorite time of the week now. And it makes me happy when there's something to do in church on Sunday evening too, like a singing-service

 

[ushalk]

that is not wrong either mirjam. i believe that the real point here is how people tend o put it as alaw that as a christian you have to attend church or your not saved kind of garbage. when the fact of it all is that we are to obey the leading of the holy spirit.

 

[Hisalone]

Mike Scott said:

Yet with those nuggets that were revealed to me I would then share them with others in the church and they would help me in the refining and fine tuning. Due to the fact I don't always interpret correctly what He was revealing. This protected me from the philosophy and bible of Mike being the only way

I have to agree with you here. I just don't need to be in the church building to discuss what the Lord is revealing to me with other brethren in Christ. In fact, I find that a more inviting atmosphere for this is sitting at the bar with a close brother for all folks within earshot to hear. So I have a beer every now and then while discussing the things of God. My point is not that I am looking to be a segregated member of the Body of Christ, but rather a minister of the Gospel in a less traditional sort of way.

Mirjam said:

But I really want to go !!! I really like it and look forward to Sunday morning now. So I can go to church and sing songs about GOD, Lord Jesus and the Holy Spirit. And hear about the Bible and talk to other Christians. Sunday morning is my favorite time of the week now. And it makes me happy when there's something to do in church on Sunday evening too, like a singing-service

This is exactly where I was at one time as well, so I truly understand and find no fault with this attitude. We are all on our own walks, we all work out our own salvation. When I started getting the convictions I am currently having, I tried to hold on because I liked things the way they were. However, if God is taking you in a different direction, I find that He makes things very tough to remain on our own track.

ushalk said:

i believe that there are many reasons why the lord would not want you in theses churches today. however i also believe that you stick with the christian brothers and sisters that you have been around

Thank you for the encouragement. This is exactly where I am right now. This is where one of my concerns is as well. I do not want to break fellowship with those people I have grown close to in this particular church. The problem is that there has been a breakoff of communication with the people who have left in the past. Now I don't know their stories, nor do I want to know, but my intent is not to "leave" these brethren. Quite the opposite. I want them included in what the Lord has planned for me (whatever that may be), and I do not want to sever ties. Am I being unrealistic, though, and harboring an unlikely expectation? The Lord's will be done.

Thanks for the comments and encouragement to all of you.

In Christ Jesus

Hisalone

 

[SpiritLedEd]

Since he didn't have the Internet, or a TV set, or a radio, and no concept of those things in his mind, it seems to me that the writer of Hebrews was thinking only of organized group meetings when he penned Hebrews 10:25. Liturgies, as I understand them and have experienced them, are highly structured, formal, ceremonial forms of worship, most of which were developed in the Middle Ages, and I would certainly agree that far too many people nowadays think of group worship only in those terms.

However, I've watched many church services and listened to many preachers on television and radio over the years since I came to Christ. As a matter of fact, there's one church I found on the Internet a few months ago that is similar in style to my church here in Kentucky. Ocassionally, I log onto their site and watch a video of one of their sermons - excellent worship and teaching. But, watching a video or listening on radio does not have the same impact on me as being there in person.

When I'm in the congregation during a service, its as though my worship is merging with that of the other people in attendance and rising to heaven as a sweet savour unto God. And during the sermon its as though I am in personal contact with the preacher. I don't get that from radio, TV, or Internet programs.

I'm certain that my growth as a Christian would be seriously impeded if I didn't have my hometown church family.

SLE

 

[Janette]

Being Christian

Being Christian is a change of heart - not a change of address!

I know one rather famous minister who is very fond of saying "being in church doesn't make you Christian anymore than being in the garage makes you a car."

So if being in a church can't make you Christian, not being in one cannot take your Christian-ness away either.

You know, Paul was given by God to write 70% of the New Testament.
He described the places of men and women.
He described the gifts of the Holy Spirit.
He described the new Priesthood (or rather the glaring lack of one).
He described the divisions of leadership and the need for elders.
He described a lot of things about the structure of the church.

You'd think that if a specific building was required, he'd have mentioned it.

God spent an entire chapter in Exodus just on the clothing that the high priest was supposed to wear. His instructions for the temple at that time were exacting down to the shape and metallic composition of the nails used and the insence burnt.

I *do* think it is important for Christians to spend "face to face" time with other Christians. When I first became Christian I tried to spend a lot of time with my unsaved friends - I wanted to share my joy...but most of them were NOT interested and in the end it just became a drain on me to be around them and their unchristian ways. I had to leave most of them behind for my peace of mind.

Still most of us are not called to be hermits - we have work to do for the Lord in the world, and most of us "sicken" emotionally and spiritually without human companionship. So if you're not spending face to face time with *Christians* then the question becomes with whom *are* you spending time? If the *only* spiritually uplifting thing you are doing is online, then you should probably get out more.

But beyond that I just don't see a difference between church online or church in a building. If you are "gathering" with the people here in the TJ Chat and you're all praying and agreeing, are you not "together"? Are your prayers somehow less sincere?

God is everywhere. As nasty as humanity has made much of the Internet, God is there too. He hears us, even online.

 

[ushalk]

excellent post janette. i believe that you are correct. paul did also describe to us the importance of being around our brothers and sisters in christ. thank you for your post.