Did Jesus Replace God?

[th1bill]

<style type="text/css"> <!-- @page { margin: 0.79in } P { margin-bottom: 0.08in } A:link { so-language: zxx } --> </style> Did Jesus Replace God?




Stupid question? Only if we lack the ability to reason a logical end. There are ?Christian? Movements today led by some well known and some not so well known teachers that have, in the near past called down fire and brimstone rain to exterminate the homosexual from our presence. Then we have, in recent history, teachers making poison kool-aid, and all sort of heresy being taught because we have lost our first love!


There is an uncanny movement with two, prominent, fingers. This movement ignores the words of Jesus in the Sermon on the Mount where we find a paragraph telling us that the Law and the words of the Prophets will not pass away until heaven and earth do. (Matt. 5:17-20) The two fingers are the New Testament Christian and the newer, New Covenant Christian. Both of these are misnomers at the very best because without the Bible Jesus taught from there can be no Christianity.


When I went into the Army I went through Basic Training where they laid a foundation to build a soldier on. When I owned my construction company we had to put a classic foundation down before we could begin to build the kitchen, bed-room or bath room. When I worked for Western Electric we placed the foundations on the floor before we could build the racks, bays and supports to hold the switch bays to operate the phones and switch-board. Nothing can stand without a foundation and the foundation of Christianity is the Bible Jesus and the first and second century saints taught from.


This is not a sermon, it's a conversation starter.

 

[faithfulservant]

The real question is what is the purpose of the "law and the prophets?"

The law points out our sin. The prophets declared the Salvation to redeem us from our sin: Jesus! If we love God, and love our neigbors as ourselves, and we trust what Jesus did on the cross, the law and the prophets have been fulfilled. Yes, it's really just that simple.

 

[th1bill]

The real question is what is the purpose of the "law and the prophets?"

The law points out our sin. The prophets declared the Salvation to redeem us from our sin: Jesus! If we love God, and love our neigbors as ourselves, and we trust what Jesus did on the cross, the law and the prophets have been fulfilled. Yes, it's really just that simple.

With a bit of study you'll find that this is not true. The Law was never given to be a means to salvation and nobody has ever been saved by any means other than Grace. The Law was given to Moses for the purpose of education and it's purpose is still to teach us. There is much of the prophecy, yet to be fulfilled and Jesus promised us that none of it will pass until all of it is fulfilled in the forst chapter of the Sermon on the Mount, chapter five of Matthew.

Now, please, as I said, this is not a Sermon and I'll add here that this is not a place to express opinions. My post is based on the scriptures and it will make no sense at all for you to answer me, as you did, without scriptureal backing.

May God bless.

 

[faithfulservant]

You thread title asserts something rather absurd. Jesus didn't "replace" God, Jesus is God!

As far as my previous post goes, allow me to point out the scriptures I spoke to you:

The real question is what is the purpose of the "law and the prophets?"

The law points out our sin.

Romans 3
19 Now we know that whatever the law says it speaks to those who are under the law, so that every mouth may be stopped, and the whole world may be held accountable to God.
20 For by works of the law no human being will be justified in his sight, since through the law comes knowledge of sin.

Galatians 4
24 So then, the law was our guardian until Christ came, in order that we might be justified by faith.


25 But now that faith has come, we are no longer under a guardian,



The prophets declared the Salvation to redeem us from our sin: Jesus!

Luke 24
25 And he said to them, "O foolish ones, and slow of heart to believe all that the prophets have spoken!
26 Was it not necessary that the Christ should suffer these things and enter into his glory?"

27 And beginning with Moses and all the Prophets, he interpreted to them in all the Scriptures the things concerning himself.


Matthew 2
23 And he went and lived in a city called Nazareth, that what was spoken by the prophets might be fulfilled: "He shall be called a Nazarene."

Matthew 5
17 "Do not think that I have come to abolish the Law or the Prophets; I have not come to abolish them but to fulfill them.

Matthew 26
56 But all this has taken place that the Scriptures of the prophets might be fulfilled." Then all the disciples left him and fled.

Luke 18
31 And taking the twelve, he said to them, "See, we are going up to Jerusalem, and everything that is written about the Son of Man by the prophets will be accomplished.

If we love God, and love our neigbors as ourselves, and we trust what Jesus did on the cross, the law and the prophets have been fulfilled. Yes, it's really just that simple.

Matthew 22
36 "Teacher, which is the great commandment in the Law?"
37 And he said to him, "You shall love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your mind.
38 This is the great and first commandment.
39 And a second is like it: You shall love your neighbor as yourself.
40 On these two commandments depend all the Law and the Prophets."

Additionally, God clearly stated that we are to follow Jesus. In fact, God gave two witnesses (one representing the law in Moses and one representing the prophets in Elijah) in order that no one may claim otherwise:

Matthew 17
1 And after six days Jesus took with him Peter and James, and John his brother, and led them up a high mountain by themselves.
2 And he was transfigured before them, and his face shone like the sun, and his clothes became white as light.
3 And behold, there appeared to them Moses and Elijah, talking with him.
4 And Peter said to Jesus, "Lord, it is good that we are here. If you wish, I will make three tents here, one for you and one for Moses and one for Elijah."
5 He was still speaking when, behold, a bright cloud overshadowed them, and a voice from the cloud said, "This is my beloved Son, with whom I am well pleased; listen to him."
6 When the disciples heard this, they fell on their faces and were terrified.
7 But Jesus came and touched them, saying, "Rise, and have no fear."

 

[th1bill]

All of this is good stuff and when we are careful to observe and to maintain contenuity, one finds that what you have asserted is incorrect. Let's begin with the bare basics and go from there. In John 1:1-5 we learn that Jesus is God and always has been God. Not only that but there is nothing that has ever been created that is not created by Jesus. This conversation will, hopefully, attract a few of the two classes of religeous people mentioned in the OP.

You see, it is their assertion that the Old Testament, the Bible Jesus taught from is of no value to the Christian, today. The problem with that is that Goid, Jesus, had to make a mistake or to have changed His mind for that to be true and when we remember that He wrote or had the entire Bible written there must be context. In mal. 3:6a we find that God never changes. For that reason we must understand the most important rule of Hermaneutics, "No scripture nor any group of of scriptures can ever be understood without the light of all other scripture can ever be fully understood without the light of all other scripture shinnig on it." Thescripture you have presented must be viewed in that light and that bringds the word of Jesus to bear, quite heavily. In Matthew 5 we have the paragraph in verses 17 through 20 and it sheds a light that must be considered with what you have presented.

 

[faithfulservant]

I wouldn't suggest to anyone that the Old Testament shouldn't be studied. The whole counsel of God should be fed upon as we grow and mature in the Lord.

That being said, the entire Bible is about Jesus. Front to back, up and down, in and out: Jesus!

Additionally, the Mosaic covenant was replaced by a "better" one, according to God. A covenant foreshadowed when Melchizidek met Abraham:

Hebrews 7
11 Now if perfection had been attainable through the Levitical priesthood (for under it the people received the law), what further need would there have been for another priest to arise after the order of Melchizedek, rather than one named after the order of Aaron?
12 For when there is a change in the priesthood, there is necessarily a change in the law as well.
13 For the one of whom these things are spoken belonged to another tribe, from which no one has ever served at the altar.
14 For it is evident that our Lord was descended from Judah, and in connection with that tribe Moses said nothing about priests.
15 This becomes even more evident when another priest arises in the likeness of Melchizedek,
16 who has become a priest, not on the basis of a legal requirement concerning bodily descent, but by the power of an indestructible life.
17 For it is witnessed of him, "You are a priest forever, after the order of Melchizedek."
18 For on the one hand, a former commandment is set aside because of its weakness and uselessness
19 (for the law made nothing perfect); but on the other hand, a better hope is introduced, through which we draw near to God.
20 And it was not without an oath. For those who formerly became priests were made such without an oath,
21 but this one was made a priest with an oath by the one who said to him: "The Lord has sworn and will not change his mind, 'You are a priest forever.'"
22 This makes Jesus the guarantor of a better covenant.

 

[B-A-C]

Jesus doesn't replace God, he is God. However Jesus is our salvation and the way to the father. The ultimate goal here isn't to get to Jesus, but to get to the father.
John 14:6

 

[jiggyfly]

All of this is good stuff and when we are careful to observe and to maintain contenuity, one finds that what you have asserted is incorrect. Let's begin with the bare basics and go from there. In John 1:1-5 we learn that Jesus is God and always has been God. Not only that but there is nothing that has ever been created that is not created by Jesus. This conversation will, hopefully, attract a few of the two classes of religeous people mentioned in the OP.

You see, it is their assertion that the Old Testament, the Bible Jesus taught from is of no value to the Christian, today. The problem with that is that Goid, Jesus, had to make a mistake or to have changed His mind for that to be true and when we remember that He wrote or had the entire Bible written there must be context. In mal. 3:6a we find that God never changes. For that reason we must understand the most important rule of Hermaneutics, "No scripture nor any group of of scriptures can ever be understood without the light of all other scripture can ever be fully understood without the light of all other scripture shinnig on it." Thescripture you have presented must be viewed in that light and that bringds the word of Jesus to bear, quite heavily. In Matthew 5 we have the paragraph in verses 17 through 20 and it sheds a light that must be considered with what you have presented.

Do you employ hermeneutics when reading the scriptures Bill?

 

[th1bill]

Do you employ hermeneutics when reading the scriptures Bill?

I do my best and if I don I am chastised by the Holy Spirit.

 

[faithfulservant]

I do my best and if I don I am chastised by the Holy Spirit.

Amen and amen.

 

[jiggyfly]

I do my best and if I don I am chastised by the Holy Spirit.

Then why did you omit the "till all is fulfilled" in the scripture you (mis)quoted?

There is an uncanny movement with two, prominent, fingers. This movement ignores the words of Jesus in the Sermon on the Mount where we find a paragraph telling us that the Law and the words of the Prophets will not pass away until heaven and earth do. (Matt. 5:17-20) The two fingers are the New Testament Christian and the newer, New Covenant Christian. Both of these are misnomers at the very best because without the Bible Jesus taught from there can be no Christianity.

17 “Don’t misunderstand why I have come. I did not come to abolish the law of Moses or the writings of the prophets. No, I came to accomplish their purpose.18 I tell you the truth, until heaven and earth disappear, not even the smallest detail of God’s law will disappear until its purpose is achieved.
Matt 5:17-18 (NLT)

17 Think not that I am come to destroy the law, or the prophets: I am not come to destroy, but to fulfil. 18 For verily I say unto you, Till heaven and earth pass, one jot or one tittle shall in no wise pass from the law, till all be fulfilled.
Matt 5:17-18 (KJV)

Proper hermeneutics requires using the whole context in order to gain a correct understanding. One must also abandon their religious paradigm first.

Jesus the Son did not replace God the Father but to preach or teach adherence to the law is plain ignorance of God the Father's plan and the scriptures.

19 Why, then, was the law given? It was given alongside the promise to show people their sins. But the law was designed to last only until the coming of the child who was promised.
Gal 3:19 (NLT)

Prayin for ya Bill.