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Covering of your head!!!

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what opinions do you have of women having to have their head covered in church?
I have just recently started attended my Dad's church because he goes alone but because it is Brethren belief they say the women must wear a hat or something on their head.
Personally I can't agree I know it does state it in the Bible but it is Old Testament belief, and I really don't like hats
Anyone got any comments on this?
 
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1 Corinthians 11

Follow my example, as I follow the example of Christ.

Propriety in Worship

2I praise you for remembering me in everything and for holding to the teachings,[1] just as I passed them on to you.
3Now I want you to realize that the head of every man is Christ, and the head of the woman is man, and the head of Christ is God. 4Every man who prays or prophesies with his head covered dishonors his head. 5And every woman who prays or prophesies with her head uncovered dishonors her head--it is just as though her head were shaved. 6If a woman does not cover her head, she should have her hair cut off; and if it is a disgrace for a woman to have her hair cut or shaved off, she should cover her head. 7A man ought not to cover his head,[2] since he is the image and glory of God; but the woman is the glory of man. 8For man did not come from woman, but woman from man; 9neither was man created for woman, but woman for man. 10For this reason, and because of the angels, the woman ought to have a sign of authority on her head.
11In the Lord, however, woman is not independent of man, nor is man independent of woman. 12For as woman came from man, so also man is born of woman. But everything comes from God. 13Judge for yourselves: Is it proper for a woman to pray to God with her head uncovered? 14Does not the very nature of things teach you that if a man has long hair, it is a disgrace to him, 15but that if a woman has long hair, it is her glory? For long hair is given to her as a covering. 16If anyone wants to be contentious about this, we have no other practice--nor do the churches of God.

Verses 2-16
Here begin particulars respecting the public assemblies, 1 corinthians the Corinthians, some abuses had crept in; but as Christ did the will, and sought the honour of God, so the Christian should avow his subjection to Christ, doing his will and seeking his glory. We should, even in our dress and habit, avoid every thing that may dishonour Christ. The woman was made subject to man, because made for his help and comfort. And she should do nothing, in Christian assemblies, which looked like a claim of being equal. She ought to have "power," that is, a veil, on her head, because of the angels. Their presence should keep Christians from all that is wrong while in the worship of God. Nevertheless, the man and the woman were made for one another. They were to be mutual comforts and blessings, not one a slave, and the other a tyrant. God has so settled matters, both in the kingdom of providence and that of grace, that the authority and subjection of each party should be for mutual help and benefit. It was the common usage of the churches, for women to appear in public assemblies, and join in public worship, veiled; and it was right that they should do so. The Christian religion sanctions national customs wherever these are not against the great principles of truth and holiness; affected singularities receive no countenance from any thing in the Bible.
 
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covering of your head

I'm new on this site and maybe I'm not reading Chad's response properly, but it left me a bit confussed. It reminds me of the old purtian beliefs which my ancestors grew up with. Not only was a womans head to be covered but they also had to walk behind the man and, in the house of worship, sit on the opposite sides of the sanctuary. These all stemmed from old Jewish laws - a woman's head was to be covered, she was to walk behind the man and, as for worship, she had her own court in the temple and was to go not further. If we are going to live by the law then we have to live by all of it.

I believe in the scriptures stated Paul was addressing a cultural issue - the customs that were, and are, prevalent in Eastern Culture. For a women to go uncovered and/or shorn in those days and in that culture was a sign that she was a prostitute. And being such she would distract from the worship of God.

Over the years there have been many cultural changes especially in the Western culture. And a lot of those changes are not good. I believe women (and men) should dress with modesty. Also the hair and makeup should reflect that modesty.

To me, Maureen, what it boils down to is your respect to and for your Father and his beliefs. If he desires you to wear a hat - what's the big deal? Its only for a few hours (maybe only one) out of your week and it will show your respect for him.


 
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Thank you

Chad and Jinks
I know were your coming from Jinks it has a lot of pointers, there have been a numerous amount of changes in modern worship, like for example I watch the God Channel now and then, and I watched in amazement the other night at a Rock Mission were all the congration were jumping up and down in song and I just wondered if Jesus were to look down on them just what would be his thoughts, perhaps I'm being old fashioned, but it just seemed very weird to me to praise the Lord in such a mannor.
I agree Jinks about it is only a hat on a head for 1 hour and it didn't do me a bit of harm, I just must buy my own though, as I felt a touch embarresed at having to be loaned one, but then I didn't know the traditions of the Brethern Church so I was ignorant to the fact, only thing is they don't mind the not wearing of hats in the evening service,
I guess it's a mark of respect at the 'Breaking of Bread' which is the more important one and that is their reason.
Isn't it quaint the differant ways of each church though?
 
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Actually junks/maureen I took that piece of scripture from NIV and the commentaries from Bible Gateway. It all makes sense. I think its one of those pieces of Scripture that confuses many or many understand, but not in between. Maybe thats just me anyway lol.
 
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I think in the Scriptures you quoted, Chad, I like 1 Cor 11: 16 best:
"But if any man seem to be contentious, we have no such custom, neither the churches of God." (KJV)

The Pulpit Commentary (Electronic Database. Copyright (c) 2001 by Biblesoft) Says concerning this portion of Scripture:

If any of you wish to be disputatious and quarrelsome about this (these) minor
matter(s) of ritual, I must content myself with saying that he must take his own course (for a similar use of the euphemistic "seem," see Phil 3:4; Heb 4:1; James 1:26). We have no such custom. The emphatic "we" means the apostles and the leaders of the Church at Jerusalem and Antioch. Such custom. Not referring to "contentiousness," but to the women appearing with uncovered heads. Neither the Churches of God. If you Corinthians prefer these abnormal practices in spite of reason, common sense, and my arguments, you must stand alone in your innovations upon universal Christian practice. But catholic (universal) custom is against your "self opinionated particularism."

We wrangle about such minor differences in our Christian walk. Paul said some where that if his eating of meat offended a brother (sister) and caused him (her) to fall, he would never eat meat again.

As far as different manners of worship goes, I believe the 'church' has taken on too many of the ways of the world in order to draw people in. One thing we should rememer in this God knows the heart.

{PRAISE THE LORD! But remember, He can tell the difference between praise and flattery.}
 
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Headress

The 'Brethren' people are well known for being called 'strict' in their beliefs,and that doesn't suit a lot of people, I can usually adopt to many a differant way, as I attend a Mission Hall once a week then I used to attend Elim which is Evangelism and the two are in total opposite of each other, but so long as our heart and prayers are focused on Jesus I really don't think he would be so fussy as to hats, and clothes in fact I don't think the Lord would care if you went in a black plastic bag so long as you went would be his thought, well that's what I think anyway.
About those Rock Missions though now I do have serious doubts about them but then who am I to judge anyone, we should just take it to the Lord in prayer and he will provide the answers. Amen?
 
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I think women wearing hats in the church is another of many traditions that is fading. I really don't know what I think about this- to me it would be weird to wear a hat, but then again the tradition really didn't start fading until not too long ago. I guess when it comes down to it we need to focus on the Word. We are to accept all people whether they are wearing silk gowns or cotton rags. I don't think it would be right for a church to turn someone away because they couldn't afford a hat.

Any maybe this needs to go beyond hats. Maybe churchs in general need to relax their dress code so that people from all social classes are welcome there. I have a close friend who was made fun of a church when he was younger because his mother couldn't afford to buy him the nice pants and button ups that the other kids his age had. To this day he is aprehensive about going to 'fancy' churches.

We need to dress respectfully but we should not need to spend more than we can afford just to fit into others ideals about how people should dress at church. We are all God's children and He will accept us rags or riches- shouldn't we accept each other?

:ip:
 
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Hats!!!

I agree Strypes your long hair is your head covering, but mine's not that long, but I do intend to get a hat before attending my Dad's Brethern Church again for the Breaking of the Bread anyway, I wouldn't offend anyone, personally I don't think clothes has a lot of importance it's our worship and desire to be there, as I was used to going to a church were it was differant and I didn't need a hat, but then all churches do have differant wee ways and I suppose we can only go along with them, the Word is far more important than material things.
Megan the hats most of them were are berrets although some of the older ladies do were 'proper' hats, and I agree with you also it shouldn't matter, but unfortunatly in the Brethren Church it does.
 
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I know there is a God! I praise Him. I had this subject on my mind for the last week. I prayed on it and read 1 Cor 11. I was gong to ask my pastor about the subject. I was going to list it today on this web page. Now I see Maureen has ask the question for me.

What I received form research and asking question to the saints, I have found that this was a traditional thing. JPJINKS hit iton the head. "I believe in the scriptures stated Paul was addressing a cultural issue - the customs that were, and are, prevalent in Eastern Culture. For a women to go uncovered and/or shorn in those days and in that culture was a sign that she was a prostitute. And being such she would distract from the worship of God.
The problem I do have with my answer is that in the scripture it speaks about God, Jesus Christ, and the Angels.
1 Be imitators of me, as I am of Christ. 2 I commend you because you remember me in everything and maintain the traditions even as I have delivered them to you. 3 But I want you to understand that the head of every man is Christ, the head of a woman is her husband, and the head of Christ is God. 4 Any man who prays or prophesies with his head covered dishonors his head, 5 but any woman who prays or prophesies with her head unveiled dishonors her head--it is the same as if her head were shaven. 6 For if a woman will not veil herself, then she should cut off her hair; but if it is disgraceful for a woman to be shorn or shaven, let her wear a veil. 7 For a man ought not to cover his head, since he is the image and glory of God; but woman is the glory of man. 8 (For man was not made from woman, but woman from man. 9 Neither was man created for woman, but woman for man.) 10 That is why a woman ought to have a veil on her head, because of the angels. 11 (Nevertheless, in the Lord woman is not independent of man nor man of woman; 12 for as woman was made from man, so man is now born of woman. And all things are from God.) 13 Judge for yourselves; is it proper for a woman to pray to God with her head uncovered? 14 Does not nature itself teach you that for a man to wear long hair is degrading to him, 15 but if a woman has long hair, it is her pride? For her hair is given to her for a covering. 16 If any one is disposed to be contentious, we recognize no other practice, nor do the churches of God.

It is confussing but Paul states: Be imitators of me, as I am of Christ. 2 I commend you because you remember me in everything and maintain the traditions even as I have delivered them to you. So this scripture is saying that Paul was the one who started this being inspired by Jesus Christ. Again was it due to the times?
 
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ricky954 said:
It is confussing but Paul states: Be imitators of me, as I am of Christ. 2 I commend you because you remember me in everything and maintain the traditions even as I have delivered them to you. So this scripture is saying that Paul was the one who started this being inspired by Jesus Christ. Again was it due to the times?
I think Paul was simply emphasizing his own way of life, imitating Jesus to express an example to his brothers/sisters around him (or the audience he spoke to in general). He's basically (from what I see) is saying "look, I imitate Christ [perfect GOD] so you do the same too".

If there is anything anyone would like to add please do so.
 
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Head Covering

Do we really believe that our Lord would be ashamed of us women if we do not wear a hat?
I personally do not believe that to be so, but that is my own personal opinion. I also have been reading that piece of scripture this week Ricky and this is what I have come to believe myself about it. I think if it were so in all churches a lot of young especially the young may think twice about going perhaps.
Imagine you thinking about this and me also at the same time, is the Lord trying to tell us something?
Godbless
 
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Hi Maureen, and everyone else interested in this interesting topic!

re: 1 Corinthians 11:3-16

One of the key phrases in this passage is found in verse 10, that is, that in those days the head covering was a sign of authority. We no longer have this as part of our culture, but we do have other symbols of "authority." For instance as a married women I wear a wedding ring and I use my husband's last name as my own. These are definite symbols of authority that are recognised by our society and therefore are valid. So the principle here is of submission to your husband if you are married. The covering of the husband provides spiritual protection.

(In those days the social structure was so that people rarely lived alone, so a women either belonged to her father's family or her husband's, when she was married.)

This passage is warning wives against usurping the position of her husband. She may pray and prophecy, but in a gracious manner, not in a dominating, bossy way, that demeans or humiliates her husband.

The Greek words in this passage usually translated as woman and man, are more correctly translated as husband and wife! This is also clearly understood from verse 3...it is my husband who is my head...not just any man.

The freedoms and improved status that the women had in the early Church were new and exciting (Acts 2:17-18;Galatians 3:28) and it seems that some women sometimes went overboard, so Paul is just reminding them of their position and encouraging them to be better behaved.

As Paul says in verse 13: "judge for youselves."

Also Ricky's point about prostitutes having a shaved head is very valid. They have no male covering and therefore no symbol of it.

The head covering was just a symbol, a symbol that is no longer recognised in our society and therefore no longer valid. The principle of submission however remains!

I hope this helps

love
evangeline
 
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strypes said:
i dont like to sit behind someone in a hat. i have long hair and once read that is my covering. i think these type of issues keep people out of the fellowship with other believers. i am blessed to attend "church" where most wear their best blues {jeans that is} some wear suits. some wear shorts. and some wear hats. it is not what is on the outside that matters...it is the intent of the heart that matters to God. He wants us to worship him and not be concerned with Sunday fashion dos and donts. i agree with the guy that said wear the hat to honor your fathers wishes. i have a friend who attends a southern baptist church where the women wear dresses exclusively {but no hats} and i will go to special services and yes i wear a dress. to honor my friend, and when she comes to my church she wears jeans.there is a passage of scripture in romans i think it is chapter 14 that talks about love... and not offending ....if your father's church likes hats....wear a hat....that act of love will honor God.
I agree the scripture says that woman where given their long hair as a covering So wearing of head coverings is not necessary.

All praise The Ancient Of Days
 
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Just wanted to give my personal testimony here about covering. Over the last few years, when I would pray, I would get the feeling that I was supposed to cover my head. I would grab a scarf or towel, or whatever was laying around at the time, and put it on my head.

I studied 1 Corinthians 11, and I researched it.....the Greek word for covering is not hair-it means an actual veil. I laid in bed a couple of months ago, and prayed about it-I told God that if the covering was still for today, and He wanted me to do it, I would.

Immedietely, the Holy Spirit fell on me and I was filled with the most incredible peace and joy....it was the clearest "yes!" that I could have gotten! I threw a scarf on my head and have been covering full time ever since! For an entire week, I felt the Lord's presence and it was like I had just gotten saved-I had a strong joy and happiness in my salvation!

As for the thing about the covering being cultural....well, verse 10 says that the woman should have a symbol of authority on her head, because of the angels. The angels are always going to be there, no matter what century we are living in, and no matter what area of the world. Plus, God does not change-He is the same yesterday, today, and always....He gave us the commandments in the Bible to last always, yet man is the one who wants to change things and say it is because "times are changing".

God's word does not change.....a woman still should have a covering, at least when praying. I want to be ready to pray at any time, so I cover constantly.

I have read testimonies about a woman who was tormented by horrible blasphemous thoughts, constantly. She started covering, and the thoughts stopped. Another pastor who had a wife who covered during the day, started having nightmares every night. He told his wife to cover at night, just to see what would happen. Immedietely the nightmares stopped. The same thing happened to a friend of his, and he told him to tell his wife to cover at night, and when she did, his nightmares went away. A piece of cloth on a woman's head is not some magic thing, but it does show that a woman is obeying the spiritual order of God.

The order is that God is first, then Christ, then the man, then the woman. It does not matter about "women's rights" or "equality with men" or whatever....it is God's will that man was created first, and then woman.

But today, the roles have almost been reversed.....many woman want a man's job because they want to be "equal" with man on every level. Many men wear their hair long, and women cut their hair very short. Jeans are very popular for women, of course, even though God said that anyone who wears the clothing of the opposite sex is an abomination (Deuteronomy 22:5).....but it's so easy to say that "times are changing".

But God's word does not change....He wants a man to look and dress like a man, and a woman to look and dress like a woman. Women covered up until less than 100 years ago....and it was man who said it was "not for today"....God never said that at all. The covering is an outward symbol of submission and modesty....

I'm not that good at explaining it, but all I know is that because of how God answered my prayer, and my convictions of 1 Corinthians 11, as well as the same convictions of other Christian women all over the world, I believe that women should cover their hair. I have a lot of really good websites that explain the covering really well-a lot better than I can, if anyone is interested-or you can just google "Christian headcovering" and find lots of good sites as well-some really good videos on YouTube as well. Sorry-this was meant to be a simple testimony. :smile:
 
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Hey:

From the heart, what Paul is trying to teach.

I can go to just about any church and there is a young girl in a short skirt and a low cut blouse. Yep my eyes wander that way, and I have to say, Kit behave. Forget the ways of man, as you are in the house of God. But it is a temptation just the same.

It is about respect and honor and a way God has tried to teach all the very simplicity of his way. Honor me God says, and honor yourself. Show a bit of respect and show the submission of all to all that I have tried to show you.

So God simply wishes a show of respect. He also wishes us to respect each other in his way of life and how he designed us to be.

The modern church is very liberal. We as men have adopted many ways that are not the way of God. We have slowly actually drawn so far away from his simple teachings, that it in no way resembles what respect should be. Respect and honor are things long gone, and justified by us to be OK.

I wear a hat, but I certainly take it off and leave it in the car if going to church. I also honor other men at their ceremonies this way also. It is but a show of respect.

I still have lots of hair, I suppose one day I must ask God what about if I become bald, can I wear a hat........giggle.....God will say look you dummy you do try my patience with your humor.

Listen to what is said.....to simply show respect. That is all. And you girls need to dress modestly as we are men. We are sinful, and can be led astray very easily.

Kit
 
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This text has no applicability to us today. Paul is speaking about a ‘tradition’ that he has handed on. Hence, since this is not the tradition of the modern church, we hardly need to consider this text.
My God is a loving God and a fair and just God.
If someone were to ever tell me I were sinning
because I didn't wear a hat to church, then I would
think that were legalism. When we go to Heaven and
hear Jesus say "well done good and faithful servant",
will it be because I wore a hat? Or will it be because
I listened to His Word and obeyed?
 
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This is the correct answer...

This text has no applicability to us today
We, as Christians, are no longer under the Old Covenant Law.

"For Christ is the end of the law for righteousness to every one that believeth." (Romans 10:4)
 
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what opinions do you have of women having to have their head covered in church?
I have just recently started attended my Dad's church because he goes alone but because it is Brethren belief they say the women must wear a hat or something on their head.
Personally I can't agree I know it does state it in the Bible but it is Old Testament belief, and I really don't like hats
Anyone got any comments on this?
Where in the Old Testament is it stated ?
 

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