Conscious Thought Caused Sin

[ReapingSoul84]

Was the conscious thoughts of Adam the reason sin entered the world or was it already here? I think it was his thoughts rather than the actions he had that sin entered the world. Thus, the phrase evil thoughts! I’m probably overthinking this by a long way but he knew what loneliness was like and by the actions of Eve he knew that he was about to be alone again so I think that he’d rather disobey God and die than to ever be alone again. Thus the need for companionship throughout life. I know his decision messed up the world but we all make sacrifices for those we love so what makes us different than Adam? Our actions are what gets us in trouble but it’s our thoughts that lead our actions.

 

[Born Again 2004]

Interesting. I know the Bible refers to sin entering the world through man, It is probably more like the consequences of sin entered the world through the first Adam. Didn't sin already exist through Satin; the Serpent? Of course than is spiritually. For sure, all these questions will be answered soon! I think it is safe to say, that our perfect God devised a prefect plan to defeat Satin from the foundation....thank God for Jesus Christ

 

[Brad Huber]

1 Timothy 2:14King James Version (KJV)
14 And Adam was not deceived, but the woman being deceived was in the transgression.

He according to this was not deceived He chose to disobey to share in her sin and punishment. I have heard several explanations for this. The one I heard that seemed most right in my heart and mind is that Adam, knowing God loved him, would find a way to rescue them both because Adam did not want Eve to die, God could always have started over and made a new Eve, but Adam was afraid for Eve and shared her fate in trust of God finding a way to bring them back into fellowship eventually.

 

[Sue J Love]

I think we need to be careful that we don't read too much more into this than what the scriptures teach us. Adam appears to have been with Eve when she was deceived, so perhaps he watched the whole thing take place, and then he willingly participated with her in her sin, and thus he, too, sinned. Yet, it was because of his sin that we are all born into sin (See: Rom. 5:12-19; 1 Co. 15:21-22, 42-49). Did he first sin in his mind, and then with his actions? We don't know. He might have. Certainly he was tempted in his mind first, and then he gave into that temptation with his actions. Many people do first sin in their minds, and because they entertain sin in their minds, the actions often do follow. So, why did Adam sin? We don't know that, either. He was tempted and so he gave into the temptation. To suppose anything beyond that is conjecture. We don't really know his motivation. We just have to be careful that we don't put thoughts in his mind that, perhaps, were not there, and then to build a doctrine or a belief system around our own conclusions.

 

[Lanolin]

I dont know the answer to this question but...Adam who was meant to protect Eve didnt stop her. But we dont know if he was with her when she was with the serpent or if Eve wandered off by herself...?

I dont know about Brad's explanation which seems a roundabout way to justify adams disobedience..Adam could have just talked to God and said I'm sorry but Eve has made a mistake please save her...and He might have forgiven them and put it right right there and then. But no they both sinned and hid.

 

[Sue J Love]

I dont know the answer to this question but...Adam who was meant to protect Eve didnt stop her. But we dont know if he was with her when she was with the serpent or if Eve wandered off by herself...?

Genesis 3:6: "So when the woman saw that the tree was good for food, and that it was a delight to the eyes, and that the tree was to be desired to make one wise, she took of its fruit and ate, and she also gave some to her husband who was with her, and he ate."

The indication seems to be that he was with her when she was deceived and that she immediately gave him some of the fruit.

 

[Lanolin]

Oh yes right Sue, well then thats clear, Adam just didnt stop Eve or protect her he just stood by and let Eve sin, and didn't say anything like...that's a lie, you snake! Get lost!

Hmm so OP you think Adam had a death wish and chose to die with Eve instead of live forever with God. Out of fear of being alone...I dont know...bible doesnt say, it only shows what Eve thought...Adam's mind seemed like a blank.

Look he was just probably not thinking of anything but his own stomach. Man sees food, man eats it.

 

[Brad Huber]

I think we need to be careful that we don't read too much more into this than what the scriptures teach us. Adam appears to have been with Eve when she was deceived, so perhaps he watched the whole thing take place, and then he willingly participated with her in her sin, and thus he, too, sinned. Yet, it was because of his sin that we are all born into sin (See: Rom. 5:12-19; 1 Co. 15:21-22, 42-49). Did he first sin in his mind, and then with his actions? We don't know. He might have. Certainly he was tempted in his mind first, and then he gave into that temptation with his actions. Many people do first sin in their minds, and because they entertain sin in their minds, the actions often do follow. So, why did Adam sin? We don't know that, either. He was tempted and so he gave into the temptation. To suppose anything beyond that is conjecture. We don't really know his motivation. We just have to be careful that we don't put thoughts in his mind that, perhaps, were not there, and then to build a doctrine or a belief system around our own conclusions.

I had to smile when after I read the warning of your first sentence, you went straight on to speculate a whole lot yourself. We dont know if Adam was with Eve at the time of the deception, we dont know what he was thinking, we only know what was written. But if I wasnt deceived and I was watching Eve being deceived, and I had the audacity to say I loved her, you can bet I would have stepped in before she ate of the fruit.

 

[Brad Huber]

Genesis 3:6: "So when the woman saw that the tree was good for food, and that it was a delight to the eyes, and that the tree was to be desired to make one wise, she took of its fruit and ate, and she also gave some to her husband who was with her, and he ate."

The indication seems to be that he was with her when she was deceived and that she immediately gave him some of the fruit.

Again, thats an assumption, she could well have been deceived alone, she could have thought about what the serpent said for days before she shared it with Adam. It doesnt say he was there at the deception.

 

[Sue J Love]

I had to smile when after I read the warning of your first sentence, you went straight on to speculate a whole lot yourself. We dont know if Adam was with Eve at the time of the deception, we dont know what he was thinking, we only know what was written. But if I wasnt deceived and I was watching Eve being deceived, and I had the audacity to say I loved her, you can bet I would have stepped in before she ate of the fruit.

The Bible says he was with her, and he did willingly participate with her in her sin. Those are known. They are not conjecture. I dont know if he was watching the whole thing go down, which is why I said perhaps. I drew no conclusions other than what were obvious from the scriptures. That is different from accepting any explanation as to why Adam sinned, which was created in someone's mind, as we don't know the answer to that other than he was tempted and he gave into the temptation.

 

[Sue J Love]

Again, thats an assumption, she could well have been deceived alone, she could have thought about what the serpent said for days before she shared it with Adam. It doesnt say he was there at the deception.

Per the sentence structure, it is implied that he was with her and that as soon as she ate she handed him the fruit and he ate. Then the eyes of both were opened and they knew that they were naked. This does not suggest a time span between her sin and his.

 

[amadeus2]

Was the conscious thoughts of Adam the reason sin entered the world or was it already here? I think it was his thoughts rather than the actions he had that sin entered the world. Thus, the phrase evil thoughts! I’m probably overthinking this by a long way but he knew what loneliness was like and by the actions of Eve he knew that he was about to be alone again so I think that he’d rather disobey God and die than to ever be alone again. Thus the need for companionship throughout life. I know his decision messed up the world but we all make sacrifices for those we love so what makes us different than Adam? Our actions are what gets us in trouble but it’s our thoughts that lead our actions.

While what you have said seems to be a good thought, it is still ultimately not an excuse. Consider what Jesus did:

"Let nothing be done through strife or vainglory; but in lowliness of mind let each esteem other better than themselves." Phil 2:3

Jesus also being a man of flesh with all of the desires and physical needs of a man of flesh, never took a wife and never had physical children. He did as the above verse from Apostle Paul suggests, by esteeming you and me and everyone else above himself. The first man Adam at best chose his wife over himself, but what kind of a choice is that when he condemned not only himself, but all of his offspring to death?

Can any of us ever come to the place that Jesus did? Can we ever love everyone else more than we love ourselves? Is that not what wants us to do? To make it a possibility, He sent His Son so that we could if we so chose, LIVE! In order to Live [receive the Life which Jesus brought] we must become like Him that means to approach that complete selflessness [as opposed to our selfishness] that He lived for 33½ years as a man...

 

[Brad Huber]

Per the sentence structure, it is implied that he was with her and that as soon as she ate she handed him the fruit and he ate. Then the eyes of both were opened and they knew that they were naked. This does not suggest a time span between her sin and his.

You are reaching with this. Not sure why.

 

[Sue J Love]

You are reaching with this. Not sure why.

Brad, I am not reaching with this. The scriptures say she was deceived, she ate, she handed the fruit to her husband, who was with her, and he ate, and then they both had their eyes opened and realized they were naked. I don't believe we should try to infer his motivation for sinning or his thinking or reasoning behind his sin, because the scriptures do not imply any motivation. That's all I'm saying.

 

[KingJ]

Was the conscious thoughts of Adam the reason sin entered the world or was it already here? I think it was his thoughts rather than the actions he had that sin entered the world. Thus, the phrase evil thoughts! I’m probably overthinking this by a long way but he knew what loneliness was like and by the actions of Eve he knew that he was about to be alone again so I think that he’d rather disobey God and die than to ever be alone again. Thus the need for companionship throughout life. I know his decision messed up the world but we all make sacrifices for those we love so what makes us different than Adam? Our actions are what gets us in trouble but it’s our thoughts that lead our actions.

Good argument raised.

There is a world of difference between thoughts and actions. Yes, Adam's thoughts was a sin he committed prior to eating the fruit. Jesus makes that crystal clear in Matt 5:28. However what is also crystal clear is that it is only when he actually ate the fruit, was he removed. Jesus ensured He qualified His statement in Matt 5:28 (Thought of adultery = sin), four verses later with with Matt 5:32 (only actual adultery = grounds for divorce).

There is a theme throughout scripture of God removing the wicked when their sin is full measure (example in Gen 15:16). Jesus is clear that only God is good / perfect / sinless Mark 10:18. Humans and the angels will never be perfect. We are sanctified by the blood of Jesus, not ever sinless. If we were we would lose our free will.

 

[Lanolin]

...just revisiting this it doesnt seem to me that Adam had any idea he would be alone again. They were BOTH banished from the garden of Eden after eating of the fruit. They started a family.

I just think Adam was a bit clueless and disobedient, its more like someone who looks in the mirror and then straightaway forgets who he is.

Since Adam and Eve were already husband and wife, and there were no other people on earth at the time, it cant be said they commited adultery. God cursed Adam for listening to Eve, instead of Him. Certainly looking at things with lust is sinful, but it all starts with listening to a lie.

You can choose what thoughts to think though, and you can choose to stop listening to lies, and only listen to the truth. Remind yourself of the truth, by paying attention to what God says, not what Satan says, cos Satan is a liar!

Men...you are not alone if you dont have a woman. Certainly the physical need for a wife is in your bones, just as Eve was created out Adam's rib not vice versa..but that should not cause you to sin...you just need to ask God first and go about it His way.

 

[B-A-C]

Men...you are not alone if you dont have a woman. Certainly the physical need for a wife is in your bones, just as Eve was created out Adam's rib not vice versa..but that should not cause you to sin...you just need to ask God first and go about it His way.

Gen 2:18; Then the Lord God said, “It is not good for the man to be alone; I will make him a helper suitable for him.”

This is the first time God says that something in creation is "not good".

You are right we are not "alone", God is with us. But even God recognizes the need for physical affection. I believe He created us this way.

1 Cor 7:2; But because of immoralities, each man is to have his own wife, and each woman is to have her own husband.
1 Cor 7:3; The husband must fulfill his duty to his wife, and likewise also the wife to her husband.
1 Cor 7:4; The wife does not have authority over her own body, but the husband does; and likewise also the husband does not have authority over his own body, but the wife does.
1 Cor 7:5; Stop depriving one another, except by agreement for a time, so that you may devote yourselves to prayer, and come together again so that Satan will not tempt you because of your lack of self-control.

Some men are not "strong enough" to live alone. (in the context of sexual sin).

 

[Born Again 2004]

Was the conscious thoughts of Adam the reason sin entered the world or was it already here? I think it was his thoughts rather than the actions he had that sin entered the world. Thus, the phrase evil thoughts! I’m probably overthinking this by a long way but he knew what loneliness was like and by the actions of Eve he knew that he was about to be alone again so I think that he’d rather disobey God and die than to ever be alone again. Thus the n eed for companionship throughout life. I know his decision messed up the world but we all make sacrifices for those we love so what makes us different than Adam? Our actions are what gets us in trouble but it’s our thoughts that lead our actions.

You make a good point and Jesus explain that sin went beyond the law and included thoughts, that in some cases thoughts might even be as bad as the actual act:

• Matthew 5: 28 But I tell you that anyone who looks at a woman lustfully has already committed adultery with her in his heart.
• Just when we thought we had this sin thing under control!

 

[Lanolin]

Gen 2:18; Then the Lord God said, “It is not good for the man to be alone; I will make him a helper suitable for him.”

This is the first time God says that something in creation is "not good".

You are right we are not "alone", God is with us. But even God recognizes the need for physical affection. I believe He created us this way.

1 Cor 7:2; But because of immoralities, each man is to have his own wife, and each woman is to have her own husband.
1 Cor 7:3; The husband must fulfill his duty to his wife, and likewise also the wife to her husband.
1 Cor 7:4; The wife does not have authority over her own body, but the husband does; and likewise also the husband does not have authority over his own body, but the wife does.
1 Cor 7:5; Stop depriving one another, except by agreement for a time, so that you may devote yourselves to prayer, and come together again so that Satan will not tempt you because of your lack of self-control.

Some men are not "strong enough" to live alone. (in the context of sexual sin).

That is because men are made weak and need a woman to help them. But then they complain women are not strong enough. Sigh. Women werent created solely for mans physical affection...God created Eve to help adam to dress the garden and name the animals. He said I will make a helper for him. Not a lover. A helper!!!

However if we are christians we do have self control. It is a fruit of the holy spirit. And we are part of Christs body...to please the Lord. If you are married, unfortunately you have to please your spouse. And some are hard to please.

Way back in the beginning, I think things were more equal between men and women, but nowadays, many populations have more women the men, so it might be every man has his own wife, but not all women can have their own husband. And some cultures its ok to have more than one wife. But you hardly hear of wives having more than one husband. At the same time.

Besides, adam was the only man on earth at the time lol. He had absolutely nobody like him to talk to. We are not like that now with billions of people. We have brothers and sisters everywhere now.

When men complain of being alone..inevitably its because they just dont have any friends, or brothers and sisters. I had one complain to me, he hated his sister, had no friends, had no brothers, no dad, and only got on with his elderly mum. Despite having 400 'friends' on facebook. I asked him if he knew Jesus and he goes oh you religious. Of course he then tried to hit on me...ugh!

Fellas it is not attractive to complain how single you are. No ladies want to be with a complainer, cos if you complain when you are single you will complain if you are married.

Bac you missed 1 corinthians 7:1

Now concerning the things whereof ye wrote unto me..It is good for a man not to touch a woman.

And you also miss what Paul wrote after talking about husbands and wives...it a permission, not a commandment to have a husband or wife.

 

[B-A-C]

1 Tim 4:1; But the Spirit explicitly says that in later times some will fall away from the faith, paying attention to deceitful spirits and doctrines of demons,
1 Tim 4:2; by means of the hypocrisy of liars seared in their own conscience as with a branding iron,
1 Tim 4:3; men who forbid marriage and advocate abstaining from foods which God has created to be gratefully shared in by those who believe and know the truth.

1 Tim 2:15; But women will be preserved through the bearing of children if they continue in faith and love and sanctity with self-restraint.

Gen 2:24; For this reason a man shall leave his father and his mother, and be joined to his wife; and they shall become one flesh.