Can a sinful human be more merciful than 'Almighty God?

[Davy]

Many believe "Eternal Hell" is a place where wicked people go to suffer eternal torture in flames! If this is so, let me ask you a question:

"Can a sinful human be more merciful than 'Almighty God?'"
If you saw a weak animal suffering in pain and their was no hope for it, would you: (A) Allow it to continue to suffer, or (B) Would you mercifully put it out of its missery and kill it. If you stood back saying to the animal its your fault and just watched it suffer, you would quite rightly be punished by the law. Man, created in the image of God, would see how wrong this merciless behaviour is. Infact the animal would be put down out of its missery by the authorities, as a expression of compassion and mercy.

Yet, According to some, the almightly loving God does allow weak sinful humans to suffer in missery and pain, because its their fault! This either means God is (A) Merciless or (B) "Eternal Hell" is not a place of eternal punishment, but rather a place of "Eternal destruction!" No pain! No missery! Rather mercifully put to sleep for all eternaty.

Personally, I am beginning to believe the teaching of "Eternal torment" is a God "dishonouring" doctrine, I cannot believe, a loving God would do somethink like that!

 

[Boanerges]

Those who burn eternally have chosen to reject the love of God given in the sacrifice of His Son. Sadly humans tend to believe that their judgment is better than that of God. He gave all for them they rejected life and in doing so chose judgment.


Rev 14:9 And the third angel followed them, saying with a loud voice, If any man worship the beast and his image, and receive his mark in his forehead, or in his hand,
Rev 14:10 The same shall drink of the wine of the wrath of God, which is poured out without mixture into the cup of his indignation; and he shall be tormented with fire and brimstone in the presence of the holy angels, and in the presence of the Lamb:
Rev 14:11 And the smoke of their torment ascendeth up for ever and ever: and they have no rest day nor night, who worship the beast and his image, and whosoever receiveth the mark of his name.


If it is in the Word it is, but then that is just my view.

 

[Davy]

Just adding to my earlier statemente:

When Jesus spoke of "Hell" The word Jesus used for "Hell" in Matthew 10:28, was "Gehenna." The people he was speaking to would have known that was a place just out side Jerusalem, "the Valley of Hinnom." They would also have known it was a place for burning or destroying refuse, like dead bodies of criminals. They kept the fires going to destroy the refuse, so the smoke would keep assending, identifing it as a place of eternal destruction, (Rev 14:11) and a rememberance of their eternal destruction.

Surely, if "Hell" was a place of eternal torment, Jesus would have been very spacific when teaching his apostles. Making sure their was no doubt in their minds, if they failed to listen to him, he would have stated clearly, many, many, times in the bible they would burn in "Hell" for all eternaty, even reasoning on the matter.

"Look! Which would you prefer; a life of bliss and happiness with all your loved ones, or screaming in pain with flames constantly lashing you. Who in the right mind would deside not to follow me!!!"

Do you not find it interesting Jesus never said that? If I was there, I would have been very graphic, so their would have been no doubts in following Jesus! Because some did stop following Jesus back then!

 

[Giggles4God]

God made Hell for satan and his demons/angels. It was never meant for us.

God is both love and just. He gave us a choice. To either accept His gift of Jesus and His love or not to. God does not want to see His creation die twice...once physically and once spiritually.

Jesus talked more about Hell than of Heaven.

I highly doubt that if Jesus was so specific that there would have been crowds following him. Did Jesus come to have crowds following him or do the will of God? Jesus came not to be famous, but to die on a cross for all sin for all man...once.

There is a place called Hell. There is a place called Heaven.

In the Bible it says

Deuteronomy 30:19
I call heaven and earth to record this day against you, that I have set before you life and death, blessing and cursing: therefore choose life, that both thou and thy seed may live:

God has laid before you Davy...life and death. Choose life. I am not telling you what to do, but I am saying...if you choose life...choose Jesus...you will never be the same. I know that from experience.

 

[Boanerges]

God made Hell for satan and his demons/angels. It was never meant for us.

God is both love and just. He gave us a choice. To either accept His gift of Jesus and His love or not to. God does not want to see His creation die twice...once physically and once spiritually.

Jesus talked more about Hell than of Heaven.

I highly doubt that if Jesus was so specific that there would have been crowds following him. Did Jesus come to have crowds following him or do the will of God? Jesus came not to be famous, but to die on a cross for all sin for all man...once.

There is a place called Hell. There is a place called Heaven.

In the Bible it says

Deuteronomy 30:19
I call heaven and earth to record this day against you, that I have set before you life and death, blessing and cursing: therefore choose life, that both thou and thy seed may live:

God has laid before you Davy...life and death. Choose life. I am not telling you what to do, but I am saying...if you choose life...choose Jesus...you will never be the same. I know that from experience.

Amen G4G!
Eternal torment is just that eternal but it is a place reserved for those who do not want to be with God.

From Vines Expository Dictionary of the Bible:

Hell

1. geenna (G1067) represents the Hebrew Ge-Hinnom (the valley of Tophet) and a corresponding Aramaic word; it is found twelve times in the NT, eleven of which are in the Synoptists, in every instance as uttered by the Lord Himself. He who says to his brother, Thou fool (see under FOOL), will be in danger of "the hell of fire," Mat_5:22; it is better to pluck out (a metaphorical description of irrevocable law) an eye that causes its possessor to stumble, than that his "whole body be cast into hell," Mat_5:29; similarly with the hand, Mat_5:30; in Mat_18:8, Mat_18:9, the admonitions are repeated, with an additional mention of the foot; here, too, the warning concerns the person himself (for which obviously the "body" stands in chapter 5); in Mat_18:8, "the eternal fire" is mentioned as the doom, the character of the region standing for the region itself, the two being combined in the phrase "the hell of fire," Mat_18:9. To the passage in Matthew 18, that in Mar_9:43-47, is parallel; here to the word "hell" are applied the extended descriptions "the unquenchable fire" and "where their worm dieth not and the fire is not quenched."
That God, "after He hath killed, hath power to cast into hell," is assigned as a reason why He should be feared with the fear that keeps from evil doing, Luk_12:5; the parallel passage to this in Mat_10:28 declares, not the casting in, but the doom which follows, namely, the destruction (not the loss of being, but of wellbeing) of "both soul and body."
In Matthew 23 the Lord denounces the scribes and Pharisees, who in proselytizing a person "make him two-fold more a son of hell" than themselves (Mat_23:15), the phrase here being expressive of moral characteristics, and declares the impossibility of their escaping "the judgment of hell," Mat_23:33. In Jam_3:6 "hell" is described as the source of the evil done by misuse of the tongue; here the word stands for the powers of darkness, whose characteristics and destiny are those of "hell."
For terms descriptive of "hell," see e.g., Mat_13:42; Mat_25:46; Phi_3:19; 2Th_1:9; Heb_10:39; 2Pe_2:17; Jud_1:13; Rev_2:11; Rev_19:20; Rev_20:6, Rev_20:10, Rev_20:14; Rev_21:8.
Notes: (1) For the rendering "hell" as a translation of hades, corresponding to Sheol, wrongly rendered "the grave" and "hell," see HADES. (2) The verb tartaroo, translated "cast down to hell" in 2Pe_2:4, signifies to consign to Tartarus, which is neither Sheol nor hades nor hell, but the place where those angels whose special sin is referred to in that passage are confined "to be reserved unto judgment"; the region is described as "pits of darkness." RV

 

[NewManMikey]

God is absolute love which means as the Bible states; God created man in His image to spend eternity in His presence.

God is absolute justice which means after man turned from God he needed to be restored to the relationship God created initially. Those who reject the Christ cannot spend eternioty in His presence because Romans 3:23 says, "for all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God". So without the Christ none would enter into the kingdom.

Man is not more merciful than God for we would allow sin to enter into heaven because of our weakness thereby corrupting heaven as well as earth. No man confuses mercy and weakness. I don't believe I could trade my son for you, God could and did. Who of your loved ones or family could you trade for a stanger? So tell me who is more merciful?

Without justice there could be no mercy. Sin carries the heartache you see in the world not a lack of mercy on God's part. God turned the earth over to man and man turned it over to Satan. God redeemed man but not the earth but offered man all authortiy again to take back what man gave away. It is your job to take back the world not God's. So don't get upset with God for not shouldering your responsibilities. God redeemed man because man could not redeem himself but man can redeem the earth except we don't believe the Bible in our authority over satan.

God said, "choose this day whom you will serve", yourself of God, it is really that simple.

Mikey

 

[Davy]

God is absolute love which means as the Bible states; God created man in His image to spend eternity in His presence.

God is absolute justice which means after man turned from God he needed to be restored to the relationship God created initially. Those who reject the Christ cannot spend eternioty in His presence because Romans 3:23 says, "for all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God". So without the Christ none would enter into the kingdom.

Man is not more merciful than God for we would allow sin to enter into heaven because of our weakness thereby corrupting heaven as well as earth. No man confuses mercy and weakness. I don't believe I could trade my son for you, God could and did. Who of your loved ones or family could you trade for a stanger? So tell me who is more merciful?

Without justice there could be no mercy. Sin carries the heartache you see in the world not a lack of mercy on God's part. God turned the earth over to man and man turned it over to Satan. God redeemed man but not the earth but offered man all authortiy again to take back what man gave away. It is your job to take back the world not God's. So don't get upset with God for not shouldering your responsibilities. God redeemed man because man could not redeem himself but man can redeem the earth except we don't believe the Bible in our authority over satan.

God said, "choose this day whom you will serve", yourself of God, it is really that simple.

Mikey

You speak about 'Justice and Mercy!' Let me ask you a question?

I am not talking about a naive children who does not know any better who dies young, because surely God would not torture them forever!
If a young man spends 5 years of his adult life living a life of sin ignorant of God, and His standards, and he dies; does me go to hell to be tormented for ever? What unbalanced scales of justice is that!
A few short ignorant years of sin and on the other side of the scales, eternal torment in hell??? Surely, a God of mercy who offered His son as a sacrifice to save mankind would not be so merciless!
To me it sounds more 'loving' 'just' and 'merciful' to put someone like that to eternal death not eternal torment?

I watched a 'Christian TV' program about hell and its torture, and I cannot believe a loving, merciful, and just God would do that to ignorant puny humans, let alone children! It just does not sound right to me! In fact I turned the channel over before it finished because I was so shocked at what I saw.

 

[cman77]

You speak about 'Justice and Mercy!' Let me ask you a question?

I am not talking about a naive children who does not know any better who dies young, because surely God would not torture them forever!
If a young man spends 5 years of his adult life living a life of sin ignorant of God, and His standards, and he dies; does me go to hell to be tormented for ever? What unbalanced scales of justice is that!
A few short ignorant years of sin and on the other side of the scales, eternal torment in hell??? Surely, a God of mercy who offered His son as a sacrifice to save mankind would not be so merciless!
To me it sounds more 'loving' 'just' and 'merciful' to put someone like that to eternal death not eternal torment?

I watched a 'Christian TV' program about hell and its torture, and I cannot believe a loving, merciful, and just God would do that to ignorant puny humans, let alone children! It just does not sound right to me! In fact I turned the channel over before it finished because I was so shocked at what I saw.

it doesn't sound to me like you are a Christian. so it is easy for me to understand your inability to see what a serious thing sin is. in Isaiah we see when he is standing in the presence of God's holiness. "woe is me for i am a man of unclean lips and i dwell amongst a people of unclean lips." I wonder, what do you think the penalty for one single sin should be?

 

[cman77]

Personally, I am beginning to believe the teaching of "Eternal torment" is a God "dishonouring" doctrine, I cannot believe, a loving God would do somethink like that! Last edited by Davy; 12-06-09 at 06:30 AM.

also, Jesus repeatedly speaks of a place where there is weeping and gnashing of teeth. so tell me what was Jesus speaking of if not torment. you are going down a path that leads to heresy.

 

[Johan]

I believe that Hell is 'total absence from God'. That has got to burn a lot. A lot more than fire. But somehow it seems more reasonable. But I don't know, God is just, I trust his judgement even if Hell is an actual eternal fire.

 

[jiggyfly]

I believe that Hell is 'total absence from God'. That has got to burn a lot. A lot more than fire. But somehow it seems more reasonable. But I don't know, God is just, I trust his judgement even if Hell is an actual eternal fire.

So I guess you don't believe that God is omnipresent.

 

[Johan]

So I guess you don't believe that God is omnipresent.

I do.

What I meant is that even if he's present everywhere, we can't feel his presence all the time. Hell is (I believe) total absence from that feeling; no light, no love, only the feeling that you missed out an eternal life in the paradise, with Jesus.


But another possible alternative (still speculations), which would be total absence from God, is 'eternal death'.

John 3:16
"For God so loved the world, that He gave His only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in Him should not perish, but have everlasting life."

So, if you don't believe in him, you will perish. It doesn't say:

"For God so loved the world, that He gave His only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in Him should not have everlasting life in Hell, but have everlasting life in Heaven."

In fact, it sounds strange to me that you'd have everlasting life in any case, because why would He then say "that whosoever believeth in Him should not perish, but have everlasting life"?

And also, Matthew 3:12:

"Whose fan is in his hand, and he will throughly purge his floor, and gather his wheat into the garner; but he will burn up the chaff with unquenchable fire."

Why would he burn up the chaff? To get rid of it. If you harvest fruit, you get rid of the bad fruit and keep the good fruit.


I have no idea about Hell, but these are my thoughts. Anyway, I don't believe that God would give them new undestroyable bodies just so they could be tortured with physical pain in an actual (eternal) lake of fire.

As I said before, if that is what God will do, then I won't question it.

 

[SpiritLedEd]

Can a sinful human be more merciful than Almighty God?

Personally, I am beginning to believe the teaching of "Eternal torment" is a God "dishonouring" doctrine, I cannot believe, a loving God would do somethink like that!

Davy,

We believe that love is the very nature of God. Every thing he does arises from that love. He created man out of a desire to share that love and He wanted that love to be shared by man, both with Him and with each other. For this to happen, man had to be given free will. With free will, man gets the power of choice and the consequences or blessings that flow from it.

We believe that the essentials of salvation are set forth in the New Testament - that God himself made salvation available to all through the ministry of His Son Jesus. John 3:16 says "whoever believes in Him (Jesus) shall not perish, but will have eternal life." The Kingdom of God is defined as being wherever God rules. The opposing domain is the devil's kingdom - wherever evil rules; wherever people intentionally turn away from God.

Those who hear the gospel message, understand it, and choose to reject it, are refusing God's Kingdom and its blessings, which automatically separates them from God and puts them under the control of the devil and his allies, whether they realize it or not. If they have not repented of that decision by the time of their death, their doom is sealed. They will suffer eternal separation from God and all His blessings, they will suffer for eternity in Hell.

Spirit Led Ed (SLE)

 

[cman77]

those who hear the gospel message, understand it, and choose to reject it, are refusing God's Kingdom and its blessings, which automatically separates them from God and puts them under the control of the devil and his allies

what of those who do not understand? are they not punished likewise?

 

[SpiritLedEd]

Can a sinful human be more merciful than Almight God?

what of those who do not understand? are they not punished likewise?

No one who comes to full maturity mentally has the excuse of having absolutely no understanding of God's law, for it is written on everyone's heart (conscience).

"Indeed, when Gentiles, who do not have the law, do by nature the things required by the law, they are a law for themselves, since they show that the requirements of the law are written on their hearts, their consciences also bearing witness, and their thoughts now accusing, now even defending them. This will take place on the day when God will judge men's secrets through Jesus Christ, as my gospel declares." (Ro 2:14-16 NIV)

SLE

 

[cman77]

No one who comes to full maturity mentally has the excuse of having absolutely no understanding of God's law, for it is written on everyone's heart (conscience).

excuse me but we are not speaking of God's Law. we are speaking of the gospel message.