Born Again, is this correct?

[Maureen]

David C Peck
writes from Kingdom of God made Plain.

'Speaking of Christ, Paul wrote, “Who is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn of every creature…And He is the head of the body, the church: who is the beginning, the firstborn from the dead; that in all things he might have the preeminence” (1:15, 18).

Christ is the firstborn “from the dead.” This is a big key to understanding when one is born again. Believe God, and fix this phrase in your mind. This verse states that one’s new birth occurs after death—and involves returning from the dead. Once again, accept what the Bible says, without adding to or subtracting from it.'

I came across this and would like to ask what you think on it, I've not heard this preached before or spoken this way before have any of you?

Surely our Born Again life begins when we get saved from our sin, I've always believed that's when we are Born Again.

 

[Richie]

Hello Sister Maureen,

Please don't mind, I just don't know what to say about you post, but:

David C Peck
writes from Kingdom of God made Plain.

'Speaking of Christ, Paul wrote, “Who is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn of every creature…And He is the head of the body, the church: who is the beginning, the firstborn from the dead; that in all things he might have the preeminence” (1:15, 18).

Could you please tell me which book is this verse from?

But I say that once we accept Jesus Christ into our heart, we become born again and we die to sin

God bless you.

 

[jiggyfly]

Hello Sister Maureen,

Please don't mind, I just don't know what to say about you post, but:



Could you please tell me which book is this verse from?

But I say that once we accept Jesus Christ into our heart, we become born again and we die to sin

God bless you.

Hey Richie, it's from the letter to the Colossians.

 

[rlowe]

This verse states that one’s new birth occurs after death—and involves returning from the dead. ... Surely our Born Again life begins when we get saved from our Sin, I've always believed that's when we are Born Again.

Both are true.
We each are Born Again when we let our sinful soul die & be resurrected with Christ, in His righteous, clean spirit.

Hope this helps clarify.

God Bless,
rlowe
-

 

[DeaconBob3]

The verse is from Collosians 1: 15, 18 from the NIV

 

[ThatGuy]

We were born wrong the first time, so yes we must be born again by the blood of Jesus.

 

[Chad]

Before Christ = Spiritually dead
After accepting Christ, becoming born again = Spiritual rebirth hence "born again"

 

[Maureen]

Just as I presumed.

yes it is Colossians 1 v 18

It just makes little ringing noises when you read stuff like this,
not that it disturbs me, not at all.

I know we are born again, when we receive His new life, boy did I sure experience it, I was there, as we all were.

It also makes sense that we 'Must be Born Again,' from the old live we lived, otherwise what would be the point of salvation.

We live this new life, so we therefore are Born Again. Hallelujah.
Thank you all for picking this up.

 

[DeaconBob3]

Often we encounter biblical truths that have two fold results that may actually occur at different times. This "Born again" experience is one of them.

We experience a spiritual re-birth when we accept Christ as our Lord and Saviour, however we do not experience a physical re-birth until our actual death.

At death our spirit, which is incorruption, is separated from our physical earthly body, which is corruption, so that we achieve "perfection" at death and may be in the presence of our Lord.

One biblical truth "Born again," that has two manifestations, Spiritual and Physical, that occur at different times in our lives.

I agree with the original post that we do not often hear this preached upon. I believe that if it were more clearly and thoroughly preached in our churches we might all come to see that being "Born again" is a process by which we are first saved by the blood of the Lamb and then are drawn closer and closer to our Lord until we are ultimately physically "Born agin" by spiritual ressurection at our death to be forever with our Lord.

Paul preached that we must not rest in our salvation, but "move on to perfection." In so preaching he was telling us that our spiritual re-birth is simply the beginning of a life long commitment to Christian living and fellowship.

 

[Maureen]

Yes DeaconBob3
I can see that, only it wasn't put across like that, David Peck did not make this clear in his writings.

I can understand a Spiritual then a Physical both being Born Again, and Hallelujah for them.

He would need to clarify it is his own thinking, before putting it on paper for all to read.

Tis true, man complicates the gospel, when it isn't.

Here is another paragragh from it:-

I have known many who believed this. While having no idea what the term actually meant, they had been told that “professing Jesus” was a kind of “new birth”—that they were in some mysterious way “born again.” It also became their Christian duty to bring others to this belief. I have been approached more than once and asked if I have been “born again.” I always answered no!

 

[DeaconBob3]

It is unfortunate that David Peck seems to lack sensitivity to the sowing of confusion in the believer and the introspection to clearly present his thinking.

I knew it was not your presentation and I meant no disrespect in my response to this. I just felt a terrible sense of partial truth and confusion after reading and pondering what you presented. The preacher/pastor in me had the need to clarify and explain.

 

[Maureen]

I sent of an email response to his article, letting him know I was not pleased at his article.
It was only a half truth.

It's great when the Holy Spirit confirms these things to us, they strike a chord within, and we just must speak about them.

Thank you DeaconBob3 they sure were not my words. It does take us to be careful though at what we come across, even though they call it the 'right way,' to discern is to be wise.

He has told many new believers this though, and new believers are going to think it is full truth and tell others.
No wonder the gospel gets contorted, because it's people like this that add and take away.
He's the person quoting this very scripture and still doing it himself.

 

[pshun2404]

Born Again

Dear Sister Maureen,

Jesus being the first born from the dead does not refer to "the New Birth" (which is spiritual), or being "born again". Jesus is not the first "born again" person (though there are a whole slew of false teachers today teaching this). He does not need to be born again because He was without sin. This Scripture refers to Him being the first to be raised from the dead as we will be in the Resurrection. To be "born again" is a spiritual rebirth of our already "dead in tresspasses and sins" human spirit by the Holy Spirit.

Death in the Bible is not the cessation of life as we understand it...even the condemned live for ever, only in eternal death (eternal separation from God and His provision by rejecting Him). Physical death is also a separation (the spirit from the physical body). But we do not cease to be conscious of who we are. For the saved (those who are born again) to be absent from the body is to be present with the Lord. The unsaved (who are not born of God's Spirit) go to a place (utterly apart from God, where they always wanted to be) described as outer darkness where there is wailing and gnashing of teeth.

So if you are a Christian (Catholic, Baptist, Pentacostal, Orthodox, etc.,) you are born again and if you are born again you are a Christian and if you are not you are not a Christian. The idea of a "born again Christian" is a modern term which would be redundant to Christ and all the Apostles.

Hope this has not confused you even more.

Love in Christ,

Paul

 

[Maureen]

No confusion at all, but thanks.

So very true that Jesus was without sin, as we know, the pure sacrifice, only He could make that attonement for us sinners.

First raised from the dead, yes, completly differant now.

Sometimes it passes from view that we all will live after death, though some go into darkness, I like the way you worded that,
(utterly apart from God, where they always wanted to be)

they didn't want Him when alive on earth, so would make sense.

I think many people have no time for the Lord Jesus in their life today,
they have too much else going on, and they just couldn't fit Him in.
What a shame that is, but I do believe it's so true.
If all their 'material' things were taken away, especially the TV set, the drink, all the 'stuff' that fills their minds and their time, they'd soon want to know about Jesus.

But life just gets filled with more and more trash, which pushes them farther and farther away, of course satan plays a useful part too.
He helps them fill their life with it all.

My wee Unlce attended church for 54yrs and did not get saved until 4 months before he died just last Oct 07, he was 80yrs of age, I thank God he did eventually get saved, and His timing was just perfect as it always is.
But can you imagine going for all those many years without 'hearing' he listened, but never heard.
I had the honour of pointing him to the Lord Jesus, I don't know which one of us was the happiest.
Just thought I'd share this, it just came upon me to do so.

 

[pshun2404]

Born again

Sorry Maureen, I thought you were actually confirming this view. You are so right it is so sad the devil keeps people busy even if he cannot keep them sinning and as a result they have too little time for the only solution to all lifes problems, Jesus Christ.

Hallelujah! So glad to hear about your wee uncle! Sometimes we have to be persistent if we really want to get someone into the Kingdom. It may be years here but the Lord knows what He wants to bring them through first. I have a couple of people on my list too that my wife and I pray for all the time...I believe they will come to Christ eventually, only for their sake I hope it is sooner not later. Having not gotten saved until I was 32 at 56 now I cannot understand how I ever lived without Him.

Thanks for your understanding.

The Lord bless,

Paul S.

 

[Maureen]

Paul
persistant, yes we must be.

I persistantly brought him along with me, every Thursday night to a City Mission were at least I knew he was hearing the pure gospel being preached.
He went on Sunday to his own church, I can't say what they preached there, as I never went, but I knew once a week he heard the gospel faithfully preached, and the blood of Calvary.

I have just recently heard (second-hand, not directly) from a cousin that he only went with me to please me, that he never really wanted to go, but I know Jesus planned it, He orchestrated it in His will, as it was only after one of these Thursday night meetings when Eternity was preached that it struck home to him, and he then wanted saved, it's a shame that cousin can't see the reward, rather than criticize.

So yes, perserverance is called for, I'm still perservering with my husband, lets keep holding them up before the throne of Grace, though our arms may weary under the weight, our hearts won't give up.

 

[SpiritLedEd]

Maureen,

You and I both know that your husband's salvation is God's will. So, my suggestion for you is to hold on tight to Mark 11:23, which says "If anyone says to this mountain, 'Go throw yourself into the sea,' and does not doubt in his heart but believes that what he says will nhappen, it will be done for him."

That's what I did in my son's case - I prayed for his salvation for ten years and refused to let doubt take control. He received Christ about half an hour before he died. Hallelujah!

SLE

 

[Word of Life]

Dear Sister Maureen,

Jesus is not the first "born again" person (though there are a whole slew of false teachers today teaching this).

I am sorry Paul, but you're in error and you are going against God's Word:

Rom 8:29 For whom he did foreknow, he also did predestinate to be conformed to the image of his Son, that he might be the firstborn among many brethren.

Col 1:15 Who is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn of every creature:

Col 1:18 And he is the head of the body, the church: who is the beginning, the firstborn from the dead; that in all things he might have the preeminence.

Who is the head of the body "The Church"

Heb 3:1 Wherefore, holy brethren, partakers of the heavenly calling, consider the Apostle and High Priest of our profession, Christ Jesus;
Mat 16:18 And I say also unto thee, That thou art Peter, and upon this rock I will build my church; and the gates of hell shall not prevail against it.

Jesus is the firstborn, and I will beleive God's Word and not man.

I appreciate it Paul, if you can please give me scriptures telling me otherwise.

Edit: I have just found another scripture, clearly telling us the truth about Jesus being the firstborn.

Rev 1:5 and from Jesus Christ, the faithful witness, the firstborn from the dead, and the prince of the kings of the earth. To him who loves us, and has washed us from our sins in his blood

 

[pshun2404]

confused

Dear Word of Life...sorry but if you are saying Jesus had to be "born again" which means to be re-birthed from being dead in His sins by the Spirit of God, I respectfully must agree to disagree senior member or not! These refer to the resurrection. Jesus was fully God since birth. Was this what you were referring to? If so I prefer we agree to disagree not dividing the unity of the Spirit. If not please explain more specifically.

In addition, I will make every attempt to quote Scripture when a direct Scriptural reference is made.

Thanks and may the Lord continue to bless this venue.

in Christ,

Paul

 

[CrossBow]

Being "Born again" literally translated means being born from above. It is indeed a spiritual birth, not a carnal rebirth. Rom 8;10 "And if Christ be in you, the body is dead because of sin; but the Spirit is life because of righteousness." This is the mystery Paul speaks of: Col 1:25-27 Whereof I am made a minister, according to the dispensation of God which is given to me for you, to fulfil the word of God; Even the mystery which hath been hid from ages and from generations, but now is made manifest to his saints: To whom God would make known what is the riches of the glory of this mystery among the Gentiles; which is Christ in you, the hope of glory: This new "birth" we received is 1 Peter 1:23 Being born again, not of corruptible seed, but of incorruptible, by the word of God, which liveth and abideth for ever. The vessel is still carnal but the "Born again" life we received is righteous. Because of our fellowship with Jesus and His activity in us the righteous life is made manifest. The more we fellowship with Jesus and with those who love His appearing, this "Christ in us" "overcomes" the death in our flesh. The end result is Eph 5:27 That he might present it to himself a glorious church, not having spot, or wrinkle, or any such thing; but that it should be holy and without blemish.