“I Thank God through Jesus Christ”

[NetChaplain]

The lost need saved and the saved needs deliverance. He must increase in you, not you must increase in Him, for you must decrease (John 3:30)—that is, your old self or “old man” will continue to have less effect on you as the Spirit continues to increase His influence in you.

As the Spirit works God’s will in all believers (Phil 2:13) they will notice the continuous waning of Adamic influences and the waxing of the Spirit’s. The growth in “the image of Christ” is most notable in our encounters with the original nature (old man) in observing the Spirit’s work against it (Gal 5:17).

This results in the release of the believer, not from sin’s guilt which is already perpetuated, but from sin’s rule which is allowed continuous attempts with its influence, and this allows the Lord Jesus to increase His work in our “new man” thus the believer—through the Spirit—to decrease his work in the “old man”.
-NC

“I Thank God through Jesus Christ”

“O wretched man that I am! Who shall deliver me from the body of this death? I thank God through Jesus Christ, our Lord” (Rom 7:24, 25). Having finally learned to realize his wretchedness as a helpless captive to the power of indwelling sin, the believer turns away from himself to think of and enjoy fellowship with the risen Lord Jesus as his Life. Occupied now with Him, he sees himself as in Him—as belonging to Him, as being of Him. Convicted by the Spirit of needing a deliverer, he finds the need fully met in the One to whom he has turned; and he responds, “I thank God!” Through Jesus Christ he has been delivered from his captive.

“So then with the mind I myself serve the law of God; but with the flesh the law of sin” (Rom 7:25). Now as a delivered one he looks back with spiritual intelligence—the intelligence of the Spirit—upon the terrible struggles through which he has passed. He understands that, as serving the law of God with the mind, and the law of sin with the flesh, he had been entirely mistaken as to his real condition before God. He did not have the mind of the Spirit about it at all. He now understands that there is no condemnation to those who are in the Lord Jesus Christ: that the Father views them as being of the risen One, and thus as sharing in the favor and acceptability in which He stands before the Father.

If it is the truth that sets free, what truth is it which sets free from the struggle we have been considering? It is, as being of Christ, he is under the operation of the law of life, which operates by and in the Lord Jesus. Knowing, as he now does, that this is the law with which the Spirit identifies Himself, he understands that, according to the mind of the Spirit, He is no longer a subject of the law of sin and death (as it has been said, the believer is no longer on trial—NC). Furthermore, he now sees that sin in the flesh has already been fully condemned of God in the death of Christ (Rom 8:3); that God therefore is not requiring fruit from the flesh; that the righteous thing required by the law, instead of being produced by the flesh as he has hitherto supposed, is produced in him by Christ with whom he is now occupied. Walking according to the Spirit is holiness and fruitfulness.

Thus we see that all the victims of sin whose hearts have been laid hold of by the grace that comes in through Jesus Christ, belong to the risen Lord. They are of Him—are sharers in the nature and character of His risen life (2 Pet 1:4). They belong to the position into which He has entered as risen from among the dead. As being thus of Him they are entitled to be experientially free from the power of indwelling sin; but to actually enjoy that practical freedom from sin’s power, they need to learn the impossibility of doing so by trying to walk according to the law; that holiness and fruitfulness are found in the enjoyment of the mind of the Spirit. Walking thus according to the Spirit in fellowship with the risen and glorified Lord Jesus is practical liberty. "Walk in the Spirit, and ye shall not fulfill the lust of the flesh.” “But we all, with open face beholding as in a glass the glory of the Lord, are changed into the same image from glory to glory, even as by the Spirit of the Lord” (Gal 5:16; 2 Cor 3:18).

-C Crain

 

[spirit1st]

The difference is between our carnal thinking and our spirit man thinking?

The carnal thinking needs to be changed to accept GOD thinking . Which will never happen unless we read the Bible and are taught the correct understanding by the Holy Ghost .

 

[NetChaplain]

The carnal thinking needs to be changed to accept GOD thinking .

Hi S1 - Along your line of thought, I see it that the regenerate has two natures; carnal (old man) and spiritual (new man). The reason for having the new nature is because the old nature "is not subject to the law of God, neither indeed can be" (Rom 8:7).

If your referring to the individual "needs to be changed to accept GOD thinking" I agree, but it can only be done by adding a new nature, not by changing the old.

 

[spirit1st]

The old nature and old man is both talking about our New Creature . The old man was our old spirit with it evil nation. The new man is talking about our new spirit with it perfect ,God like nature.

The flesh still has a evil nation and the flesh mind has much evil thoughts to deal with ?
It must be taught to accept GOD living words above all else. Still it never going to be filled with prefect thoughts. It going to die a sinner and return too the dust of the earth which it came from and belongs too.


It a daily battle keeping it under control .

Paul understood this when He said body of death . Because the nature of our flesh is sin filled .But we can pretty much control it though our spirit if we walk and live though our Spirit man .


Rom_7:24 O wretched man that I am! who shall deliver me from the body of this death?
Paul hated He could not control His flesh 100%

Rom 7:18 For I know that in me (that is, in my flesh,) dwelleth no good thing:

Rom 7:19 For the good that I would I do not: but the evil which I would not, that I do.
Rom 7:20 Now if I do that I would not, it is no more I that do it, but sin that dwelleth in me.
Rom 7:21 I find then a law, that, when I would do good, evil is present with me.

Rom 7:22 For I delight in the law of God after the inward man

:Rom 7:23 But I see another law in my members, warring against the law of my mind, and bringing me into captivity to the law of sin which is in my members.

Rom 7:25 I thank God through Jesus Christ our Lord. So then with the mind I myself serve the law of God; but with the flesh the law of sin.


The child of God who more mature in the :LORD will always hate sin and be trying not to sin ever.

But I doubt any of us can live perfectly without ever sinning in our life time? Paul was a great powerful man of God and it appears He knew he could not ,and He tried very hard to never sin.

Our flesh has desires that are not evil until we let them get control of us even for a moment that can sin ?

We must always be aware of what we listen too and see and do. To try to Never let ourselves get anywhere where we might be tempted so?
Lots think they can see anything or hear anything or be around anyone ? but so many things can cause us to sin or fill our minds with evil stuff.

What ever we allow to be put in our minds can grow or come out when we least expect it? The mind is something we need to protect and fill with good things.

 

[NetChaplain]

The old man was our old spirit with it evil nation. The new man is talking about our new spirit

I see it that the "old man" and "new man" aren't actually men or spirit but rather natures of a spirit (person), because the nature of a spirit is the most significant determinate of the quality of a spirit, for it is what causes the person to do what he does.

Since the old nature (flesh) "is not subject to the law of God, neither indeed can be" (Rom 8:7), a new nature--which by the Spirit--makes the person (spirit) new, is added along side the old nature and the Spirit causes us to live in the new nature (Gal 5:17). The believer is with the old nature but not in it (Rom 8:9), because we are in or after the new nature--by the Spirit.

 

[spirit1st]

We are All a spirit being first above all else and that what GOD had to change to make us a New being [New Creature] But He did not die for our flesh man which has a defiled nature. He only died that we could become a New Spirit being. That has His type perfect nature. Our flesh nature has not changed .Nor will it ever be changed. It dies a sinner and returns back to the earth where it came from and is destroyed of course with the planet when God makes a New Heavens and Earth.

1Co_15:44 It is sown a natural body; it is raised a spiritual body. There is a natural body, and there is a spiritual body.

Act_7:59 And they stoned Stephen, calling upon God, and saying, Lord Jesus, receive my spirit.

Heb_12:23 To the general assembly and church of the firstborn, which are written in heaven, and to God the Judge of all, and to the spirits of just men made perfect,

 

[NetChaplain]

We are All a spirit being first above all else and that what GOD had to change to make us a New being [New Creature]

I agree, it is the spirit part of the person which is the essence of an individual's existence, in which spirit all who enter this life will be eternal.

Our flesh nature has not changed .Nor will it ever be changed. It dies a sinner and returns back to the earth where it came from and is destroyed of course with the planet when God makes a New Heavens and Earth.

I like that you've indicated that the old nature (old man) will never be changed but done away with. Yes, the old nature will be gone and concerning our present physical bodies (mortal body), they will be used to bring about our new body, which the Spirit will "quicken" (Rom 8:11) and it will finally be "changed" (1 Cor 15:51; 1 Thess 4:16-18), like the Lord's new human/spiritual body (Phil 3:21).

 

[james1523]

I believe the individual part of us is not our spirit, but our soul with the spirit. It is in our soul, our mind, emotions, will, that makes us who we are. Our spirit is not really who we are, it is what we have. I have a leg and an arm, but I am not a leg and not an arm. Likewise, I have a spirit, but I am not a spirit. I am a "spirit, soul and body", I am a human being.
I do not eat or sleep or walk with my spirit. I use my body for that. Likewise, I do not think with my spirit, I use my mind. The spirit is what we use for intuition, conscience, and prayer with God and fellowship with other believers. But the spirit is not who I am, who I am is who I am as a complete person, body, soul and spirit.

There are only 3 types of spirit: God, human and satan or evil. Unbelievers have a human spirit because they have life (Adam and Eve didn't drop dead after sinning , they still had the human spirit, from God's breath), but this spirit is dead. Dead does not mean the spirit is not there, it means the spirit is not working. Unbelievers cannot know the things of God, because they are spiritually discerned. They live only in their soul, mind, emotions or will. Once a person believes in Christ, God's Spirit joins to their spirit and makes it alive, (or working). Then this unified God and human spirit (or new spirit) becomes the foundation for the soul. The new man, or new nature, is the aspects of this new spirit that enters our soul, and makes us a new person. This new person is none other than Christ. You have Christ, I have Christ, we all have Christ, so our new person's, our new "spirit beings" are identical. This is what makes us brethren - we all share the same "DNA". Where we differ on the individual level is in our soul, we all have different experiences, opinions, learning, thoughts, backgrounds etc.

I believe that the spiritual body after resurrection is a body like Jesus's after resurrection: of flesh and bones, physical and tangible yet also spiritual. As scripture says, Jesus's resurrected spiritual body was not a ghost. Yet He could walk through walls?
I do not believe the Bible indicates that we are 'spirit beings' per se. If I search that term in google I get lots of links to sites that seem to be of the new age realm, which makes me think its a borrowed term from new age mythology. Rather, as the bible teaches , we have a spirit, a soul and a body: 1 Thess 5:23 May God himself, the God of peace, sanctify you through and through. May your whole spirit, soul and body be kept blameless at the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ.
God is interested in not just in our spirits but also in our souls and our bodies. To say "spirit, soul and body" is another way to say "your whole being". God will save our whole being. Our spirit, soul and body is to be preserved complete by God.

Any concept that unbelievers go to hell in spirit form is not really scriptural. The resurrection of the dead occurs first, and unbelievers are thrown into hell in their physical bodies, not just their spirits. This is why hell is called the 'second death'. Because they die once, are resurrected, then are killed again in hell. That is their whole being, not just their spirit.

 

[NetChaplain]

I believe the individual part of us is not our spirit, but our soul with the spirit. It is in our soul, our mind, emotions, will, that makes us who we are. Our spirit is not really who we are, it is what we have.

Hi James - I like and agree with most of your comment. I believe the spirit is the essence of the life (life force) of an individual, like "God is a Spirit" (John 4:24), and that it's the soul that gives thinking to the spirit. The soul and spirit are inseparable and eternal and will always dwell in an indestructible body after the two resurrections. It seems to me that this is about the same as what you're saying.

 

[james1523]

Hi James - I like and agree with most of your comment. I believe the spirit is the essence of the life (life force) of an individual, like "God is a Spirit" (John 4:24), and that it's the soul that gives thinking to the spirit. The soul and spirit are inseparable and eternal and will always dwell in an indestructible body after the two resurrections. It seems to me that this is about the same as what you're saying.

Yes I believe the same. The Word of God can divide them. According to Heb 4:12 the soul and spirit is as close as joint and marrow.