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Why people leave Christianity

God is God.
God in the Bible has told His people to kill women and infants and babies.
God had the first born sons of an entire city (country?) killed by the passover angel.
God rained down fire and brimstone from heaven and destroyed two entire cities.
God closed the Red sea over the Egyptians following the Jews and drowned them (they were just following orders)
God opened up the earth and let thousands of people who "alive" and screaming down in sheol (hades).
God caused a flood that drowned all the people on the entire earth (except 7).
God will send scorpions upon men which will sting them and hurt for 5 months.
God will send sores and boils upon men and cause the sun to "scorch" them.
God caused Ananias and Sapphira to fall down dead.
God caused Herod to die and be eaten by worms.
It is God who controls nature.... earthquakes, floods, tornados' hurricanes, volcano's... thousands of people die sometimes because of these things.
The fallen angels in Jude have been imprisoned "as an example" for at least 6,000 years. I suppose in the scheme of eternity, 6,000 years isn't that long.
(I had to wait in line at the DMV for 6,000 years one day!)
There have been dozens of wars and battles in the Bible caused by God. God TOLD the people to do these things.
People have been maimed, killed by bears who mocked a prophet, sen out into the wilderness to eat grass for seven years.
Let Satan kill Job's entire family, all his children and servants in one day.
Teenagers were stoned - simply for being rebellious.
There are dozens more example.
...and yet people think anyone who would do these things is evil. Many people say the God of the Bible is evil.

Satan told Eve... hey even if you do sin "you will not surely die". Satan is telling people that today. God won't punish anybody.
He'll just slap you on the wrist and say "it's OK".
The lake of Fire is not just separation from God.. Millions of people are already separated from God.

People have forgotten what passion means. They have forgotten what love means.
Up until about 50 years ago or so. In Italy if you caught you wife in bed with another man, and you shot one or both of them....
It was about a $50 ticket and a night in jail. People understood love and passion. They didn't think you were a dangerous wacko because you did this.
They thought it was normal. In fact, if you didn't do this... "well then, you must not have loved them very much" obviously they didn't break your heart.
How many people are breaking God's heart?
God isn't evil because gives people what they deserve. This is exactly what makes Him righteous. In fact if He didn't treat the righteous and the evil
differently, He would NOT be a righteous and fair God.

But we have become "cultured, civilized".. we are not barbarians. *snif snif.*
In the meantime relationships are disposable, marriage is meaningless and peoples love has grown cold (even for God).
 
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Sorry to here that Sue, we join you in prayer for him.

I avoided commenting on 'Once Saved Always Saved' because there are arguments both ways and it would sure set this discussion the wrong way.

There are many who leave the churches, we do not always know the reasons, but I feel there are a bigger percent leaving that were never born again, never saved.

But we have to accept also, there are many reasons a saved believer will leave a church/fellowship, but it doesn't mean they have fallen away from faith in Christ Jesus our Lord and saviour.

Blessings
I think that to say one was never saved or never born again when one leaves Christianity or the Church is flawed. We choose to accept Christ and we choose to abandon him. It's that simple. Over and over again I've heard the argument that one was never saved to begin with and THE TRUTH IS - WE DON'T KNOW!
 
I think that to say one was never saved or never born again when one leaves Christianity or the Church is flawed. We choose to accept Christ and we choose to abandon him. It's that simple. Over and over again I've heard the argument that one was never saved to begin with and THE TRUTH IS - WE DON'T KNOW!

I can't agree with you on this brother,

There are people in the world that think they are a Christian because
- the pope is the head of the RCC
- the Queen is the head of the Church of England
- because their parents have always gone to church
- because they were chrstened
- because they live in a Christian country, etc, etc

Going to a church doesn't make a person a Christian,
- there are many churches heavily laden with people who think they are Christians but are simply church goers.
- there are ministers who are not born again

Those who go to a church (Hekurion) can be
- saved (ekkesia)
- searching souls (not yet born again)
- misguided souls (lost souls thinking they are saved because they go to a church)

Going to church does not make you a Christian no more than going to a bakery makes you a loaf of bread.
- Not all are saved
- Not all are Christians

We can be followers of Christ and not be saved, there are lots of 'Head Christians', including some ministers.

I shared this earlier.

We should not be surprised, with false teaching in some churches/fellowships, with liberalisation of The Word, people will fall away, if they were ever saved.
The Word died in Three out of four soils in the parable.

I have mentioned it before, but feel it right to mention it again here, I knew of a vicar who retired and left the church, when asked why he said, 'I ran out of things to say'. He was never saved, but he was seen as another Christian leaving the church.
 
I can't agree with you on this brother,
And I disagree with you.
There are people in the world that think they are a Christian because
- the pope is the head of the RCC
- the Queen is the head of the Church of England
- because their parents have always gone to church
- because they were chrstened
- because they live in a Christian country, etc, etc
I think that's your opinion. I know a lot of Catholic's and JW'S and no one of them believe they are saved because of the Pope or their Church organization. I've never known anyone who thinks they're saved because their parents have always gone to Church, or anyone who believes that because they live in a Christian country - they're saved. I have no idea where you get that from.
Going to a church doesn't make a person a Christian, - there are many churches heavily laden with people who think they are Christians but are simply church goers.
I agree, but my point above was that when someone accepts Christ and then abandons Christ that doesn't mean they never knew Christ or were never saved!
- there are ministers who are not born again
Agreed. And there are ministers who were born again who abandoned Christ for several reasons. It's crazy to assume that YOU KNOW they never accepted him or were born again. It's like anything else - it's a choice we all make!
Going to church does not make you a Christian no more than going to a bakery makes you a loaf of bread.
- Not all are saved
- Not all are Christians
Isn't that a great analogy. That's NOT my point!
We can be followers of Christ and not be saved, there are lots of 'Head Christians', including some ministers.
If someone is FOLLOWING Christ they are saved! Where do you get that from? So many Protestants teach "saved by grace or saved by faith and faith alone." That in my view is an incorrect view of Salvation. A mental declaration of faith saves nobody. I always say that you can't separate faith, grace, and works. We have to work out our own salvation.
We should not be surprised, with false teaching in some churches/fellowships, with liberalisation of The Word, people will fall away, if they were ever saved.
The average Christian needs to realize that there are very few damnable false teachings, and that really has little to do with a persons salvation, or whether or not they ere saved in the first place.
The Word died in Three out of four soils in the parable.
That's right and again that doesn't mean that the one that HAS taken root cannot one day die from not being watered.
I have mentioned it before, but feel it right to mention it again here, I knew of a vicar who retired and left the church, when asked why he said, 'I ran out of things to say'. He was never saved, but he was seen as another Christian leaving the church.

How do you know he was never saved? That's the typical OSAS comeback! You're not God and you have no way of knowing! The story of the prodigal son proves you wrong.
 
I speak only of what I have found brother, if you do not accept it it is because you have not come across it, but it is as I have said.

I wasn't talking of ministers who were saved and fell away, I was talking of ministers who were not born again.

There are many 'Head Christians' they have studied and passed their exams, they are caring and they are good speakers but that does not make them saved.

It is true we cannot be sure a person is saved, but we can tell a tree by its fruits.

Being a minister is not what it used to be, certainly not like in Acts and the early church, the early church did what they did for the love of God, they didn't get good salaries, they didn't get houses provided, they didn't get pensions etc. They did it for the Love of God and Jesus Christ, even unto death.

So if we disagree here, it is because you haven't come across these things, I experienced a spiritual battel that torn my family apart and almost broke my marriage and cost me my kids, I spoke to another guy in the church he didn't believe in those things! He hadn't experienced them.

Bless you
 
He creates an environment where evil can take place. We cannot and must not cherry pick that verse.

Correct interpretation = God allows true free will to take place. He gives us hands that can do good or evil.
Wrong interpretation = God makes our hands do evil.

True free will is evidence of a good God. A God that is light with no darkness in Him at all 1 John 1:5. He is so good that He allows what He ''utterly hates'' to take place to uphold free will. As no free will is wicked.

From your two postings here, unless I am miss-reading you, you have it wrong. Do you believe God ''utterly hates'' what is wicked? Do you want to teach that God has a '''dark side''' to Him?

Psalm 145:17 God is righteous in all His ways.



maybe you should look up what the word create means instead of trying to fit the word of God into your thinking you should let the word of God guide your thinking,
and create evil: I the LORD do all these things.
 
I speak only of what I have found brother, if you do not accept it it is because you have not come across it, but it is as I have said.

How do you know what I have or have not come across? You seem to be very presumptuous.
I wasn't talking of ministers who were saved and fell away, I was talking of ministers who were not born again.
How do you know if a minister is saved or not saved or born again or not born again?
There are many 'Head Christians' they have studied and passed their exams, they are caring and they are good speakers but that does not make them saved.
How do you know whether they're saved or not? That's my point! You come across like you KNOW when in truth God is the only one who knows! There's a lot of speakers I don't care for one bit, but I'm not going to be the one who determines whether they're saved or not.
It is true we cannot be sure a person is saved, but we can tell a tree by its fruits.
If you really look at that passage it's referring to false prophets that come from OUTSIDE the church. Everybody thinks that false Christ and false prophets come from INSIDE the church. Jesus is referring to false prophets that "come to them" in sheep's clothing, but inwardly they are ravening wolves." Many of the apostles had problems with false prophets "outside of the fold" trying sheep steal AND teaching damnable heresies - usually for profit.
Being a minister is not what it used to be, certainly not like in Acts and the early church, the early church did what they did for the love of God, they didn't get good salaries, they didn't get houses provided, they didn't get pensions etc. They did it for the Love of God and Jesus Christ, even unto death.
Yes I agree, but what does that have to do with you saying that a person who abandons Christ was never saved in the first place?
So if we disagree here, it is because you haven't come across these things, I experienced a spiritual battel that torn my family apart and almost broke my marriage and cost me my kids, I spoke to another guy in the church he didn't believe in those things! He hadn't experienced them.
You'd be surprised what I've been through with Churches and Christians. You seem to think you know what I have and haven't been through just like you seem to think you know someone was never saved in the first place after abandoning Christ. All I can tell you is we don't know how God is going to judge anyone.
 
@saginon

You are very confrontational, this is clear from the replies you have given to others and myself.

For me I think it better if we avoid replying to each others posts. It is always best, I believe, to avoid any form of conflict no matter who with. I say this in love as sad as it sounds, but I avoid people I feel are confrontational.

Peace be with you.
 
@saginon

You are very confrontational, this is clear from the replies you have given to others and myself.

For me I think it better if we avoid replying to each others posts. It is always best, I believe, to avoid any form of conflict no matter who with. I say this in love as sad as it sounds, but I avoid people I feel are confrontational.

Peace be with you.
You take it any way you like. I know Christians don't like to admit it when their lousy method of witnessing drives people away. You just have to face the truth and change your manners and approach. You came on strong and drove her away. I came on strong to you for messing up and now you're driving a wedge between us.

I'm also confrontational because I find your replies very presumptuous about the salvation of others.
 
You take it any way you like. I know Christians don't like to admit it when their lousy method of witnessing drives people away. You just have to face the truth and change your manners and approach. You came on strong and drove her away. I came on strong to you for messing up and now you're driving a wedge between us.

I'm also confrontational because I find your replies very presumptuous about the salvation of others.


you are one rude fellow and not a good witness at all
 
maybe you should look up what the word create means instead of trying to fit the word of God into your thinking you should let the word of God guide your thinking,

You want me to look up ''create'' and apply that to ''evil''?

If we take that verse in isolation to all other scripture, it literally means God is evil.

What we need to do is to ''FIRST'' properly meditate on scripture that defines God. Scripture like 1 John 1:5 God has NO darkness in Him AT ALL or He is RIGHTEOUS in ALL His ways Psalm 145:17. Then when and only when we apply this to a cherry picked verse does ''create evil'' make more sense. He creates the potential for evil to exist. He does not create something evil.

No baby is born evil. You are pushing a Calvinistic belief. Do you also read Rom 9:13 as God showing partiality?
 
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God is God.
God in the Bible has told His people to kill women and infants and babies.
God had the first born sons of an entire city (country?) killed by the passover angel.
God rained down fire and brimstone from heaven and destroyed two entire cities.
God closed the Red sea over the Egyptians following the Jews and drowned them (they were just following orders)
God opened up the earth and let thousands of people who "alive" and screaming down in sheol (hades).
God caused a flood that drowned all the people on the entire earth (except 7).
God will send scorpions upon men which will sting them and hurt for 5 months.
God will send sores and boils upon men and cause the sun to "scorch" them.
God caused Ananias and Sapphira to fall down dead.
God caused Herod to die and be eaten by worms.
It is God who controls nature.... earthquakes, floods, tornados' hurricanes, volcano's... thousands of people die sometimes because of these things.
The fallen angels in Jude have been imprisoned "as an example" for at least 6,000 years. I suppose in the scheme of eternity, 6,000 years isn't that long.
(I had to wait in line at the DMV for 6,000 years one day!)
There have been dozens of wars and battles in the Bible caused by God. God TOLD the people to do these things.
People have been maimed, killed by bears who mocked a prophet, sen out into the wilderness to eat grass for seven years.
Let Satan kill Job's entire family, all his children and servants in one day.
Teenagers were stoned - simply for being rebellious.
There are dozens more example.
...and yet people think anyone who would do these things is evil. Many people say the God of the Bible is evil.

Satan told Eve... hey even if you do sin "you will not surely die". Satan is telling people that today. God won't punish anybody.
He'll just slap you on the wrist and say "it's OK".
The lake of Fire is not just separation from God.. Millions of people are already separated from God.

People have forgotten what passion means. They have forgotten what love means.
Up until about 50 years ago or so. In Italy if you caught you wife in bed with another man, and you shot one or both of them....
It was about a $50 ticket and a night in jail. People understood love and passion. They didn't think you were a dangerous wacko because you did this.
They thought it was normal. In fact, if you didn't do this... "well then, you must not have loved them very much" obviously they didn't break your heart.
How many people are breaking God's heart?
God isn't evil because gives people what they deserve. This is exactly what makes Him righteous. In fact if He didn't treat the righteous and the evil
differently, He would NOT be a righteous and fair God.

But we have become "cultured, civilized".. we are not barbarians. *snif snif.*
In the meantime relationships are disposable, marriage is meaningless and peoples love has grown cold (even for God).
I genuinely believe people leave because of the high expectation, people dont want to feel guilty for doing wrong. So they come up with excuses like "the bible is man made" or "the bible contradicts itself". I have heard it all. Sin is promoted in everything on earth it is the easiest thing to do. While a true close relationship with God takes alot when coming out of sin. So majority of people takes the easy route.
 
actually my two posting I say little and post scripture, perhaps it is you have it wrong, as you seem to disagree with scripture not me.
The devil said little and gave Jesus scripture in Matt 4. Jesus replied in every instance with ''it is also written''.

We need to deal with all scripture. Especially when the interpretation of a cherry picked scripture opposes scriptures that define God.

When we miss-represent God we are failing at our one Christian job. Which is to correctly represent Him to the lost.
 
I think that to say one was never saved or never born again when one leaves Christianity or the Church is flawed. We choose to accept Christ and we choose to abandon him. It's that simple. Over and over again I've heard the argument that one was never saved to begin with and THE TRUTH IS - WE DON'T KNOW!
True, we don't know.

We can see fruits of others and we can judge ourselves 2 Cor 13:5. But this does not mean we are 100% certain. Only God truly knows. We need to bear a verse like 1 Cor 10:12 in mind always and as Paul says ''continue'' in working out our salvation in fear and trembling Phil 2:12.
 
The devil said little and gave Jesus scripture in Matt 4. Jesus replied in every instance with ''it is also written''.

We need to deal with all scripture. Especially when the interpretation of a cherry picked scripture opposes scriptures that define God.

When we miss-represent God we are failing at our one Christian job. Which is to correctly represent Him to the lost.
The devil said little and gave Jesus scripture in Matt 4. Jesus replied in every instance with ''it is also written''.

We need to deal with all scripture. Especially when the interpretation of a cherry picked scripture opposes scriptures that define God.

When we miss-represent God we are failing at our one Christian job. Which is to correctly represent Him to the lost.
Is the topic about why people turn away from Christianity or am i missing something?
 
you are one rude fellow and not a good witness at all
I find that rude Dave. New members need to a merciful induction period. It is so easy to get emotional and let feelings affect what we type when we start with internet chatter. Especially on a site like this where we discuss a sensitive topic and have many that disagree with us.
 
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